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(LA Times)   New poll finds that six in ten Americans are in favor of a tax hike for income over $250,000. The other four didn't respond because they've forgotten the actual meaning of the word income   (latimes.com) divider line 564
    More: Followup, Americans, Bob Corker, incomes  
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3410 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Nov 2012 at 12:18 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-30 09:11:16 AM
Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes. In fact, 5 out of 10 households receive some form of government assistance. It's easy to be in favor of taking money away from someone else. Why don't each of you farklibs send me a dollar.
 
2012-11-30 09:16:20 AM

BillCo: 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Kind of hard to pay income tax when the Glorious Job CreatorsTM won't actually create a job for you. But I guess you guys are workin' so hard you deserve yet another bonus for increasing profits by a tiny fraction merely by stealing pensions and firing any worker who wants to be paid more than a Mexican migrant worker.
 
2012-11-30 09:18:43 AM

BillCo: It's easy to be in favor of taking money away from someone else.


Yes, it certainly is. I'm in favor or taking money away from other people. But I don't want it. I want it to go to people who need it, which isn't me. I don't mind that some of my taxes pay to meet the basic human needs of those who can not meet them on their own.

But then I have compassion and empathy.
 
2012-11-30 09:21:40 AM
i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?
 
2012-11-30 09:23:21 AM
I'm in favor of whatever allows poor folks to steal BillCo's precious bodily fluids.
 
2012-11-30 09:27:05 AM

some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?


Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.
 
2012-11-30 09:29:03 AM

Diogenes: I'm in favor of whatever allows poor folks to steal BillCo's precious bodily fluids.


I too support Turkey Basters.
 
2012-11-30 09:32:34 AM

BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.



Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

www.hamiltonproject.org
 
2012-11-30 09:33:23 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?

Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.


Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy.

I don't want to steal from the rich and give to the poor. I want a system that allows those without wealth to create their own.
 
2012-11-30 09:37:24 AM

Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]


And most of the ones who no longer pay taxes, vote Republican. So they are the very "takers" that they complain about.
 
2012-11-30 09:44:55 AM

Diogenes: The Stealth Hippopotamus: some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?

Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.

Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy.

I don't want to steal from the rich and give to the poor. I want a system that allows those without wealth to create their own.


You mean some kind of system where the rich don't control the means of production?
 
2012-11-30 09:51:30 AM

rumpelstiltskin: Diogenes: The Stealth Hippopotamus: some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?

Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.

Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy.

I don't want to steal from the rich and give to the poor. I want a system that allows those without wealth to create their own.

You mean some kind of system where the rich don't control the means of production?


Oh, you got me pegged! Really hit the Marx on that one!
 
2012-11-30 09:53:54 AM

Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]


He has an estranged relationship with facts. he's heard of them, but hasn't actually seen or interacted with them in a while.
 
2012-11-30 09:55:19 AM

rumpelstiltskin: You mean some kind of system where the rich don't control the means of production?


or perhaps simply a tax structure that encourages the wealthy to reinvest their wealth instead of hording it, and reduces multigenerational dynastic wealth from having as much of impact

like we had in the 50s and 60s
 
2012-11-30 10:05:43 AM
We need to return to the economically crippling rates we experienced during the period of massive economic growth under President Clinton.
 
2012-11-30 10:14:27 AM
I think that "rich" should be set to anyone who makes more than me.

/You know who you are, with your hot tubs and late-model Hondas.
 
2012-11-30 10:23:24 AM

Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]


www.majhost.com
 
2012-11-30 10:45:41 AM

nekom: BillCo: It's easy to be in favor of taking money away from someone else.

Yes, it certainly is. I'm in favor or taking money away from other people. But I don't want it. I want it to go to people who need it, which isn't me. I don't mind that some of my taxes pay to meet the basic human needs of those who can not meet them on their own.

But then I have compassion and empathy.


Right? If I didn't pay taxes I could afford a car to replace my '98 acura (which was new when I was 10), and a nicer apartment. But I'm really pretty happy if that money lets people who couldn't otherwise afford to eat keep living. Even if it goes to some people who COULD afford to eat, if they spent smarter. Even if none of those people pay taxes.

I wouldn't even mind paying a little more to make sure that those people can go to the hospital when they need to. You know, so that when I need to go, it doesn't cost a few hundred thousand dollars to cover their avoidable ER visits.
 
2012-11-30 10:51:41 AM

BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]



You clearly have no idea of the difference between "taxes" and "income taxes" but here's your ribbon for trying.
 
2012-11-30 11:02:04 AM

Sybarite: BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]


You clearly have no idea of the difference between "taxes" and "income taxes" but here's your ribbon for trying.



And I'm willing to bet my 2-year old falls into that 46.4%.
 
2012-11-30 11:23:36 AM

UberDave: Sybarite: BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]


You clearly have no idea of the difference between "taxes" and "income taxes" but here's your ribbon for trying.


And I'm willing to bet my 2-year old falls into that 46.4%.


I am curious. My wife is a stay at home mom, does she fall into the pays no income tax category? Or does she count as paying taxes because we file jointly?
 
2012-11-30 11:35:03 AM

Diogenes: Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy


Well it's hard to tax wealth. It's that whole double taxation thing. We taxed it on the way in and that's the only bite at the apple we get, until they die and then we get one more bite unless they are smart and take steps to protect it. There is no way Congress would even try to tax wealth anyway, most of them have made theirs and arn't going to open themselves up to that.

And we shouldn't tax wealth.

As far as everyone getting their shoot at making it, I think we are one of the best places in the world for someone to get ahead. That is changing but right now you can still do it.
 
2012-11-30 11:53:53 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Diogenes: Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy

Well it's hard to tax wealth. It's that whole double taxation thing. We taxed it on the way in and that's the only bite at the apple we get, until they die and then we get one more bite unless they are smart and take steps to protect it. There is no way Congress would even try to tax wealth anyway, most of them have made theirs and arn't going to open themselves up to that.

And we shouldn't tax wealth.

As far as everyone getting their shoot at making it, I think we are one of the best places in the world for someone to get ahead. That is changing but right now you can still do it.


Careful. That kind of bootstrappy thinking will get you called out as a 1% er.

Because the important thing to know is there's only two kinds of interests:

Whats best for me, and that crap everyone else wants.
 
2012-11-30 12:02:52 PM

Generation_D: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Diogenes: Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy

Well it's hard to tax wealth. It's that whole double taxation thing. We taxed it on the way in and that's the only bite at the apple we get, until they die and then we get one more bite unless they are smart and take steps to protect it. There is no way Congress would even try to tax wealth anyway, most of them have made theirs and arn't going to open themselves up to that.

And we shouldn't tax wealth.

As far as everyone getting their shoot at making it, I think we are one of the best places in the world for someone to get ahead. That is changing but right now you can still do it.

Careful. That kind of bootstrappy thinking will get you called out as a 1% er.

Because the important thing to know is there's only two kinds of interests:

Whats best for me, and that crap everyone else wants.


Capital gains taxation is not taxing wealth. It's taxing capital gains.

BS double taxation argument is BS.
 
2012-11-30 12:09:52 PM
To put a finer point on it: Do I think kids of today are getting a raw deal on things like tuition, or on job opportunity right out of college sometimes, or on various other things like income growth last ten years for 90% of the population? Yes, absolutely.

The thing is though: 30 years ago I was a pissed off 21 year old saying the same thing. Mortgages were over 10% and never coming down. Gas was at $2.25 a gallon after having been 40 cents just a few years before. Inflation had been clipping along at over 10% for almost a decade. Unemployment was over 10% and not headed down any time soon, economists were talking about the new normal of 15% or more unemployment. Cities were rotting out at the core, every urban area was completely effed and anyone that thought America still had a future was an idiot Reagan Youth yuppie / buffy whose parents were paying their way. Bret Easton Ellis, in a word.

And then weird things happened. New opportunities came up. I grew up by a few years and quit just biatching about the raw deal I got growing up and started going for it anyway, despite the crap the baby boomers handed us. Some things never change. But....

I can't help but wonder how much sh*t talked on line now is mainly kids who haven't launched yet who still are focusing on what they don't have, rather than on focusing on what they themselves can make.

It took me 10 years to pull my head out of my a**, quit complaining, and just get to work.

You all will think I'm one of them now. Just like I would have thought some idiot telling me to get bootstrappy 30 years ago was full of it too.

Some things are eternal.
 
2012-11-30 12:13:33 PM

doyner: Generation_D: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Diogenes: Not going to happen when our current state makes it easier to concentrate existing wealth instead of creating new wealth. All the goodies go to those already wealthy

Well it's hard to tax wealth. It's that whole double taxation thing. We taxed it on the way in and that's the only bite at the apple we get, until they die and then we get one more bite unless they are smart and take steps to protect it. There is no way Congress would even try to tax wealth anyway, most of them have made theirs and arn't going to open themselves up to that.

And we shouldn't tax wealth.

As far as everyone getting their shoot at making it, I think we are one of the best places in the world for someone to get ahead. That is changing but right now you can still do it.

Careful. That kind of bootstrappy thinking will get you called out as a 1% er.

Because the important thing to know is there's only two kinds of interests:

Whats best for me, and that crap everyone else wants.

Capital gains taxation is not taxing wealth. It's taxing capital gains.

BS double taxation argument is BS.


And the whole argument for reducing the capital gains tax in the first place was so that job creators could reinvest. It's kinda bullshiat now since it's at the lowest level ever and we still have high unemployment, eh?

Capitalists should understand better than anyone that when an idea fails, you scrap it and try something else. Our historically low taxes have failed.
 
2012-11-30 12:17:34 PM

Generation_D: Careful. That kind of bootstrappy thinking will get you called out as a 1% er.

Because the important thing to know is there's only two kinds of interests:

Whats best for me, and that crap everyone else wants.



I'm in the top 15%. And I live in Oklahoma so I feel a hell of a lot richer than I really am.

Check it out: What percent are you?
 
2012-11-30 12:19:38 PM
ULTRA-MEGA-FARK
"Where Drew pays *US* $5 a month to visit this site.
 
2012-11-30 12:19:51 PM
100% of Americans approve a tax hike if it doesn't affect them.
 
2012-11-30 12:20:34 PM

Generation_D: To put a finer point on it: Do I think kids of today are getting a raw deal on things like tuition, or on job opportunity right out of college sometimes, or on various other things like income growth last ten years for 90% of the population? Yes, absolutely.

The thing is though: 30 years ago I was a pissed off 21 year old saying the same thing. Mortgages were over 10% and never coming down. Gas was at $2.25 a gallon after having been 40 cents just a few years before. Inflation had been clipping along at over 10% for almost a decade. Unemployment was over 10% and not headed down any time soon, economists were talking about the new normal of 15% or more unemployment. Cities were rotting out at the core, every urban area was completely effed and anyone that thought America still had a future was an idiot Reagan Youth yuppie / buffy whose parents were paying their way. Bret Easton Ellis, in a word.

And then weird things happened. New opportunities came up. I grew up by a few years and quit just biatching about the raw deal I got growing up and started going for it anyway, despite the crap the baby boomers handed us. Some things never change. But....

I can't help but wonder how much sh*t talked on line now is mainly kids who haven't launched yet who still are focusing on what they don't have, rather than on focusing on what they themselves can make.

It took me 10 years to pull my head out of my a**, quit complaining, and just get to work.

You all will think I'm one of them now. Just like I would have thought some idiot telling me to get bootstrappy 30 years ago was full of it too.

Some things are eternal.


Finding success in a country with a shabby government and a crumbling infrastructure isn't an argument against improving those things.
 
2012-11-30 12:20:49 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?

Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.


Those poor, temporarily embarrassed millionaires.
 
2012-11-30 12:21:13 PM

Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]


Share by age? is that really your argument?
 
2012-11-30 12:21:25 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: some_beer_drinker: i am surprised it's only six in 10. where did they do the poll? the country club?

Some still have hope that one day they will be the ones making over 250k.


And that's the day you start fighting for that tax bracket not before like a chump.
 
2012-11-30 12:21:49 PM
You can raise taxes all you want, on everybody. I haven't had enough income in the last three years to worry about it.

I bet you're all jealous too. I don't pay income tax! I bet you wish you could be like me, don't you, BillCo?
 
2012-11-30 12:22:20 PM

BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]


Don't attempt to use statisticals if you can't wrap your noodle around the population spike of the Baby Boomers and the effect on our economy as they age.
 
2012-11-30 12:22:53 PM
Maybe if the consumer would start spending again then demand would rise, requiring more supply. That means more jobs, more money, more stuff to buy. But people are hoarding money like never before. Savings accounts are more popular than ever, even though their returns are ridiculously nothing. Until Joe Consumer gets off his ass, we're going to be stuck in this ribbon wearing depression.

If you don't have a job, then blame the guy contributing to his 401k and not buying the new Erikson 4D plasma.
 
2012-11-30 12:23:43 PM
So most Americans and the government are broke, and cretins act like that money just up and vanished. There is no mystery here.
 
2012-11-30 12:24:40 PM

Lumpmoose: And the whole argument for reducing the capital gains tax in the first place was so that job creators could reinvest. It's kinda bullshiat now since it's at the lowest level ever and we still have high unemployment, eh?

Capitalists should understand better than anyone that when an idea fails, you scrap it and try something else. Our historically low taxes have failed.



And a massive increase in government spending has failed too.

"We are spending more money than we have ever spent before and it does not work. I want to see this country prosperous. I want to see people get a job. We have never made good on our promises. I say after eight years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started and an enormous debt to boot."

-Henry Morgenthau Secretary of the Treasury under FDR on the topic of the New Deal testifying before the House Ways and Means Committee in May of 1939.

So what do you think we should do?
 
2012-11-30 12:25:07 PM

BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Please provide reference to data showing that 50% of United States citizens pay no sales tax, no payroll tax, nor any other tax of any kind.

Also identify the percentage of the non-taxpaying United States citizens who are under the age of eighteen and who are under the age of sixteen.
 
2012-11-30 12:25:52 PM

Dimensio: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.

Please provide reference to data showing that 50% of United States citizens pay no sales tax, no payroll tax, nor any other tax of any kind.

Also identify the percentage of the non-taxpaying United States citizens who are under the age of eighteen and who are under the age of sixteen.


You're attempting to rationalize with a paid cretin. Best to put'em on ignore.
 
2012-11-30 12:25:58 PM

BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


50% of all Americans don't pay sales tax?!?

Surrrrrrrrrrrrrre they don't.

www.rudebadmood.com
"Smells like Boolsheet!"
 
2012-11-30 12:26:42 PM

Kazan: rumpelstiltskin: You mean some kind of system where the rich don't control the means of production?

or perhaps simply a tax structure that encourages the wealthy to reinvest their wealth instead of hording it, and reduces multigenerational dynastic wealth from having as much of impact

like we had in the 50s and 60s


The wealthy either consume their wealth or invest it. Why do you think government security interest rates are so low? Because they refuse to buy bonds? LOL!
 
2012-11-30 12:27:18 PM
This "tax the rich" BS is such a stupid distraction and you're an ass if you think it matters towards the long-term fiscal situation of our country. Tax them at 100% plus remove all of the Bush tax cuts from everyone, and you still DO NOT cover the deficit, let alone pay down any debt.

But please continue as if this is a real solution, it makes it easier to spot the stupid people that way.
 
2012-11-30 12:27:21 PM

BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]


You said "any taxes", not "income tax" -- and I'm willing to bet the chart only shows federal income tax, since state and local taxes tend to be less progressive.
 
2012-11-30 12:27:48 PM

spentmiles: Maybe if the consumer would start spending again then demand would rise, requiring more supply. That means more jobs, more money, more stuff to buy. But people are hoarding money like never before. Savings accounts are more popular than ever, even though their returns are ridiculously nothing. Until Joe Consumer gets off his ass, we're going to be stuck in this ribbon wearing depression.

If you don't have a job, then blame the guy contributing to his 401k and not buying the new Erikson 4D plasma.


There's another trend that may explain that:

So even as America worries about the rising level of student loan debt, here's some good news: the level of credit-card debt is going nowhere, and is actually falling in real terms. Let's keep that up. It will mean lower profits for the big banks, who issue the lion's share of all credit cards, and it will mean lower interest payments for consumers.

Considering how worried we've been about rising personal debt, that's very good news.
 
2012-11-30 12:28:26 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Lumpmoose: And the whole argument for reducing the capital gains tax in the first place was so that job creators could reinvest. It's kinda bullshiat now since it's at the lowest level ever and we still have high unemployment, eh?

Capitalists should understand better than anyone that when an idea fails, you scrap it and try something else. Our historically low taxes have failed.


And a massive increase in government spending has failed too.

"We are spending more money than we have ever spent before and it does not work. I want to see this country prosperous. I want to see people get a job. We have never made good on our promises. I say after eight years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started and an enormous debt to boot."

-Henry Morgenthau Secretary of the Treasury under FDR on the topic of the New Deal testifying before the House Ways and Means Committee in May of 1939.

So what do you think we should do?


I say you provide evidence rather than a quote.
 
2012-11-30 12:28:53 PM

BillCo: Sybarite: BillCo: Yes, and 5 out of 10 Americans don't pay any taxes.


Absolute, unadulterated bullshiat.

[www.hamiltonproject.org image 562x426]

[www.majhost.com image 506x323]


From the same people: Five myths about the 47%. They say you're full of shiat.
 
2012-11-30 12:29:03 PM
So......two years from now, when the budget is another 10-15% larger, we're going to make the top earners pay more of "their fair share" and raise taxes again on them. Two years after that, the same thing. Ad infinitum...

Does this look like a recipe for economic growth?
 
2012-11-30 12:30:24 PM
Honestly, no one needs to earn over $250k. Anything above $250k should be taxed @ 100% and go into socialized medicine.
 
2012-11-30 12:31:00 PM

Inyego: This "tax the rich" BS is such a stupid distraction and you're an ass if you think it matters towards the long-term fiscal situation of our country. Tax them at 100% plus remove all of the Bush tax cuts from everyone, and you still DO NOT cover the deficit, let alone pay down any debt.

But please continue as if this is a real solution, it makes it easier to spot the stupid people that way.


Revenues + entitlement cuts. Pointing at one side and saying "that alone won't work!" isn't useful. Simpson-Bowles is useful. Compromise is useful.
 
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