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(Red Bull)   How Steam's archrival took on the pirates--and won   (redbull.co.uk) divider line 103
    More: Interesting, steam, Good Old Games, indie games, copy protections, Collapse of the Soviet Union, pirated games, Square Enix  
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6897 clicks; posted to Geek » on 27 Nov 2012 at 1:17 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-27 12:16:47 PM
GOG's business platform:

User: "It sucks trying to get SimCity 2000 to work in Windows 7."

GOG: "I'll do it for $5."
 
2012-11-27 12:26:09 PM

HulkHands: GOG's business platform:

User: "It sucks trying to get SimCity 2000 to work in Windows 7."

GOG: "I'll do it for $5."


Do they have Tie Fighter or XWing? I've pulled Descent from them for a friend. I had no complaints and neither did he (short of his top hat on his joystick not letting him rotate as he remembered doing in the past).
 
2012-11-27 12:27:46 PM
I just rebuilt an old Windows 98 machine and replaced the 10GB hard drive with an old IDE 80GB one I had laying around. Maxed the ram out, replaced the power supply, and did a full wipe/reinstall of Windows (so glad my parents kept all those stupid discs from their original machine).

It's an exclusive retro gaming rig that never gets connected to the internet.

/Loves me some "X-wing vs TIE Fighter"
 
2012-11-27 12:42:49 PM

Nadie_AZ: HulkHands: GOG's business platform:

User: "It sucks trying to get SimCity 2000 to work in Windows 7."

GOG: "I'll do it for $5."

Do they have Tie Fighter or XWing? I've pulled Descent from them for a friend. I had no complaints and neither did he (short of his top hat on his joystick not letting him rotate as he remembered doing in the past).


Doubtful, as LucasArts clings hard to their shiat. I got Silent Storm Gold from them recently, which is a great and incredibly rare (physically) game.
 
2012-11-27 01:23:06 PM
I hate the whole "we're selling you a license and not the actual product" legal gymnastics.

i47.tinypic.com
 
2012-11-27 01:25:56 PM

DoomPaul: I hate the whole "we're selling you a license and not the actual product" legal gymnastics.

[i47.tinypic.com image 482x508]


This argument is so very tired. Video games in particular is one place where a license to run the game on your home machine has ALWAYS been part of the fine print. It's been that way for 25 years. Get over it.
 
2012-11-27 01:25:59 PM

Nadie_AZ: HulkHands: GOG's business platform:

User: "It sucks trying to get SimCity 2000 to work in Windows 7."

GOG: "I'll do it for $5."

Do they have Tie Fighter or XWing? I've pulled Descent from them for a friend. I had no complaints and neither did he (short of his top hat on his joystick not letting him rotate as he remembered doing in the past).


I found a copy of Tie Fighter Collectors CD-ROM in a Half Price Books a few years ago for $0.50. Have to use DOSBox but it works.

/also found Baulders Gate 2 Collection, box and all, for $2.00 at the same store (different location though)
 
2012-11-27 01:28:05 PM

drewsclues: DoomPaul: I hate the whole "we're selling you a license and not the actual product" legal gymnastics.

[i47.tinypic.com image 482x508]

This argument is so very tired. Video games in particular is one place where a license to run the game on your home machine has ALWAYS been part of the fine print. It's been that way for 25 years. Get over it.


The difference is, I can still install and run my copy of DOOM after 25 years.
 
2012-11-27 01:29:10 PM

DoomPaul: I hate the whole "we're selling you a license and not the actual product" legal gymnastics.

[i47.tinypic.com image 482x508]


Me too and the EU agrees with both of us. It's still going through the courts and I'm sure some major players will be bouncing up and down about it but; the EU looks set to legally call bullshiat on this... well... bullshiat.
 
2012-11-27 01:31:50 PM
GOG and Steam aren't really archrivals. Steam is more about newer releases, where Good Old Games, well hell, it's in the name.
 
2012-11-27 01:32:32 PM
The model has become make it easier to buy than to pirate, and in the case of old warez easier to buy again for $5-$10 than to find your old original CDs. This makes the Long-Tail argument work.
 
2012-11-27 01:33:28 PM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: /Loves me some "X-wing vs TIE Fighter"


If you aquire the collectors edition, which is the one that needs a joystick and Windows... there are fan patches made to get it working on XP and I believe Windows 7.

Works pretty well with a 360 pad to boot.

Now sure you can't get this from GOG... but well there is ebay, 2nd hand stores and other... more salubrious methods.
 
2012-11-27 01:36:40 PM
love me some GOG. Fallout series especially
 
2012-11-27 01:37:21 PM

drewsclues: Video games in particular is one place where a license to run the game on your home machine has ALWAYS been part of the fine print. It's been that way for 25 years. Get over it.


That license hasn't always been revocable, though.
 
2012-11-27 01:38:19 PM

wildcardjack: The model has become make it easier to buy than to pirate, and in the case of old warez easier to buy again for $5-$10 than to find your old original CDs. This makes the Long-Tail argument work.


The day GoG manages to beat the various license holders in to submission and things like Magic Fly, Xenon and all the Atari ST/Amiga games appear wrapped in an emulator... I will probably celebrate hard enough to get charged with 'drunk & disorderly' behaviour.

Because yeah, I'd buy a pack of classic Atari ST games for £5 a throw. Saves the faff with Hatari and Pompey Pirates disk images.
 
2012-11-27 01:38:31 PM
GOG has been wonderful to me, in much the same way that Steam has been. I can find all these old games, and know that they will 'just work'. Most of the time. I've been fighting with Space Colony HD, but that's more likely just bad code than it is any fault of GOG. I was able to pick up copies of Master of Orion and Sim City for pennies compared to what I paid when they were new, and can use them as I want.

I will say that I would kill for GOG to implement a client that works like Steam; yes I know, "DRM BAD", but there's something to be said for the convenience of browsing my collection at my desktop, downloading one on a whim, playing for a bit, then switching to another one. I know I can add them to Steam, but Steam has a nasty habit of forgetting custom-added games.
 
2012-11-27 01:41:04 PM
I'm a huge fan of GOG, especially when they got the full Quest for Glory collection. I never had an easier time saying "shut up and take my money!"
 
2012-11-27 01:41:04 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: GOG has been wonderful to me, in much the same way that Steam has been. I can find all these old games, and know that they will 'just work'. Most of the time. I've been fighting with Space Colony HD, but that's more likely just bad code than it is any fault of GOG. I was able to pick up copies of Master of Orion and Sim City for pennies compared to what I paid when they were new, and can use them as I want.

I will say that I would kill for GOG to implement a client that works like Steam; yes I know, "DRM BAD", but there's something to be said for the convenience of browsing my collection at my desktop, downloading one on a whim, playing for a bit, then switching to another one. I know I can add them to Steam, but Steam has a nasty habit of forgetting custom-added games.


not sure exactly what you're asking. On any of my PCs I just log in to the site and pull down what ever I want to play on the machine, including the ones they've ported to Mac.
 
2012-11-27 01:46:10 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: yes I know, "DRM BAD",


No DRM would be the perfect solution. However, for the convenience and services that Steam provides (multiplayer, etc.) along with the deep seasonal discounts on AAA titles... I find it's DRM mechanism acceptable.

I think publishers who wrap their own DRM in the SteamWorks DRM are so retarded they can't even count to potato though.
 
2012-11-27 01:48:08 PM
Dungeon Keeper!

Those little bunnies will pay!
 
2012-11-27 01:51:09 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: GOG has been wonderful to me, in much the same way that Steam has been. I can find all these old games, and know that they will 'just work'.


THIS.

I recently bought pretty much all of the old Bioware games; Baldur's Gate II, Icewind Dale I & II, Planescape Torment, Neverwinter Nights, ect. on the cheap.

/ one of my 4 old BGII install CDs was broken, so I was happy to repurchase the game....
 
2012-11-27 01:52:14 PM

olapbill: not sure exactly what you're asking. On any of my PCs I just log in to the site and pull down what ever I want to play on the machine, including the ones they've ported to Mac.


Basically, I'm lazy as hell and don't like to use my web browser. I want a client like Steam, where I look at my list of games, pick one to download/play, double click on it, and it handles all of the installation and set up without any further prompting on my part.

Vaneshi: No DRM would be the perfect solution. However, for the convenience and services that Steam provides (multiplayer, etc.) along with the deep seasonal discounts on AAA titles... I find it's DRM mechanism acceptable.

I think publishers who wrap their own DRM in the SteamWorks DRM are so retarded they can't even count to potato though.


The argument that I've seen from folks about GOG is that even a simple, 100% optional client would be an unacceptable breach of the no-DRM policy. When all I really want is a program I can use to manage my games, track playtime, that sort of thing.

I will say that I was pleasantly surprised by Dragon Age Origins. I had purchased the fancy collector's edition when it first came out, but got so frustrated by the DRM and logging into the servers bit that I just stopped playing it for several years. This Thanksgiving I couldn't resist picking it and all the DLC up for $8, and was pleasantly surprised to find the logging in was 100% optional. I almost didn't believe it--I had to check and doublecheck that all the DLC installed correctly and was available to make sure.
 
2012-11-27 01:53:46 PM

HulkHands: GOG's business platform:

User: "It sucks trying to get SimCity 2000 to work in Windows 7."

GOG: "I'll do it for $5."


Funny you mention SC2000. I hadn't even heard of GOG until I had the itch to play SC2000 just a few weeks ago.

*HEAVENLY ANGELS SINGING*
 
2012-11-27 01:56:45 PM
I farking hate Steam and I farking love GoG, to the point that I've re-purchased many titles I still own and am fully capable of setting up on modern hardware without their help, just to support their service.

I can keep my downloads, don't have to play mother-may-I with authentication or DRM and redownload whenever I want. That's how an online distribution system should work, people. Steam is just piling bullshiat on top of bullshiat and calling it a sundae.
 
2012-11-27 01:58:32 PM
Arch-rival? I thought that was Origin
 
2012-11-27 01:58:43 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: The argument that I've seen from folks about GOG is that even a simple, 100% optional client would be an unacceptable breach of the no-DRM policy. When all I really want is a program I can use to manage my games, track playtime, that sort of thing.


Fair play, if they're that serious about sticking to their principals about these things I can get behind that.
 
2012-11-27 02:00:29 PM
I just wish the demo versions would stay up. I wasn't sure if my video card could handle Skyrim at full everything, so I downloaded a pirated version just to see if I could run it.

/ Bought the game and the addons a few days ago. Yay me.
 
2012-11-27 02:02:00 PM
Let me know when they get Full Throttle and Homeworld.
 
2012-11-27 02:02:52 PM

netweavr: Arch-rival? I thought that was Origin


Only in the hallucinations EA gets once it's finished fapping itself in to a dessicated husk for the weekend.
Steam has 40+ million customers; Origin isn't even close to being a competitor to it. Not yet at any rate, who knows what the future will bring but I don't think it'll be any time soon.

I suspect it's: Steam, Amazon, GoG as the big three with GamersGate, Origin and co fighting over the left overs.
 
2012-11-27 02:06:04 PM

Vaneshi: Fair play, if they're that serious about sticking to their principals about these things I can get behind that.


Which is why I'm not terribly upset; just gives me more motivation to write my own program to do that. Some day. Along with my other projects. Kudos to them for sticking to their principles!
 
2012-11-27 02:13:54 PM
Stardock games were pretty much going down this same route, I think they have been fairly successful with it as well.
 
rpm
2012-11-27 02:16:06 PM

AgentPothead: GOG and Steam aren't really archrivals. Steam is more about newer releases, where Good Old Games, well hell, it's in the name.


Yeah, all about those old games like Alan Wake, Costume Quest, FTL, Botanicula, Assasin's Creed, Deponia 2, Hotline Miami, ancient games, all of 'em.
 
rpm
2012-11-27 02:17:14 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: Vaneshi: Fair play, if they're that serious about sticking to their principals about these things I can get behind that.

Which is why I'm not terribly upset; just gives me more motivation to write my own program to do that. Some day. Along with my other projects. Kudos to them for sticking to their principles!


Problem is, they haven't completely stuck to their principles. You do need to request a key for some of the multiplayer games. They lost a chunk of my good will towards them with that.
 
2012-11-27 02:18:25 PM

likefunbutnot: I farking hate Steam and I farking love GoG, to the point that I've re-purchased many titles I still own and am fully capable of setting up on modern hardware without their help, just to support their service.

I can keep my downloads, don't have to play mother-may-I with authentication or DRM and redownload whenever I want. That's how an online distribution system should work, people. Steam is just piling bullshiat on top of bullshiat and calling it a sundae.


This is why I not only support GOG but also the Humble Bundle. Granted, you have to get the bundles before they vanish, but from then on you can access them whenever you want and they are also DRM-free. It can be a small hassle trying to install the games, but once I figure out if I need to either install or exract the files, I'm good to go.
 
2012-11-27 02:19:43 PM

rpm: Problem is, they haven't completely stuck to their principles. You do need to request a key for some of the multiplayer games. They lost a chunk of my good will towards them with that.


Which ones? I'm curious because I've only stuck to the super old games that didn't have anything more sophisticated than LAN multiplayer.
 
rpm
2012-11-27 02:25:41 PM

BrynnMacFlynn: rpm: Problem is, they haven't completely stuck to their principles. You do need to request a key for some of the multiplayer games. They lost a chunk of my good will towards them with that.

Which ones? I'm curious because I've only stuck to the super old games that didn't have anything more sophisticated than LAN multiplayer.



American Conquest and Cossacks at the very least. Not sure if it's just that publisher or not.
 
2012-11-27 02:37:22 PM

olapbill: love me some GOG. Fallout series especially


This is what hooked me. I get at least a game from GOG a month, if for no other reason than to reward them for letting me play my favorite games again.
 
2012-11-27 02:41:53 PM

Vaneshi: If you aquire the collectors edition, which is the one that needs a joystick and Windows... there are fan patches made to get it working on XP and I believe Windows 7.


Yeah, I have it running nicely on my XP box hooked up to my 40" TV. It's sweeeeet. The patch is basically just a new installer, and then there's a compatibility layer to allow 3D acceleration under XP (previously limited to 95/98/ME), and you're golden.

TIE Fighter is pretty much the best game ever.

EVER.
 
2012-11-27 02:45:07 PM

likefunbutnot: I farking hate Steam and I farking love GoG, to the point that I've re-purchased many titles I still own and am fully capable of setting up on modern hardware without their help, just to support their service.

I can keep my downloads

Steam allows archiving games and it creates self-installers that restore directly back to a fresh installation of Steam. Or, just do what I do: Install a 1TB HD to hold your Steam installation. Now I don't have to store the installer files AND the installed game. And if my OS craps out, I don't have to re-download everything, just re-install Windows/Steam and then run the installer. Usually takes a minute to detect the existing files and I'm good to go.

, don't have to play mother-may-I with authentication or DRM
Steam has an offline mode.

and redownload whenever I want
...Which you can do with Steam whenever you want.

GOG is great for older stuff, but I love me Steam. Yes, it's DRM, but it doesn't bother me or prevent me from playing my games, it just leaves me alone and let's me play. But both are great services and should be taken advantage of.

/Grabbed I'76 from GOG awhile back, so good.
 
2012-11-27 02:48:42 PM
See, that's the thing about it. There's all this hue and cry about the piracy problem, and there shouldn't be. It's solved. Services like Steam and GOG have cracked the code, and it's what I've always said it was -- give people what they want, at a fair price, and they'll buy in droves. Does that mean there's no piracy anymore? No, of course not. Some people won't pay anything, and hell, some people actually enjoy the challenge of cracking this stuff. But those people aren't your customers, and the vast majority of them probably wouldn't be your customers anyway.
 
2012-11-27 02:53:54 PM

HeartBurnKid: But those people aren't your customers, and the vast majority of them probably wouldn't be your customers anyway.


yeah, i would bet that most pirates wouldn't buy a fraction of the games that they otherwise steal if pirated versions didn't exist.
 
2012-11-27 02:55:23 PM
Arch-rival? Both GOG and Steam are farking awesome.

Ironically, neither service has this:

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-11-27 02:55:38 PM

Vaneshi: wildcardjack: The model has become make it easier to buy than to pirate, and in the case of old warez easier to buy again for $5-$10 than to find your old original CDs. This makes the Long-Tail argument work.

The day GoG manages to beat the various license holders in to submission and things like Magic Fly, Xenon and all the Atari ST/Amiga games appear wrapped in an emulator... I will probably celebrate hard enough to get charged with 'drunk & disorderly' behaviour.

Because yeah, I'd buy a pack of classic Atari ST games for £5 a throw. Saves the faff with Hatari and Pompey Pirates disk images.


The closest thing to that I know of is the Amiga Forever package, with the emulator, system ROMs, disk images of games and demos and a frontend to tie it all together.

I don't know of anything on the ST side. There is the Gamebase database but that's just the frontend. I'm in the process of grabbing ST Demobase now, which looks like it has potential.

For games however, I still have Steem Engine in my emulators folder and various unlabelled Automation/Pompey Pirates/Medway Boys/D-Bug/etc disks mixed in with my demo disks with no useful way of telling what is where until loading each one individually. I'd pay a fiver as well to have it all cleaned up in one place.
 
2012-11-27 03:02:36 PM
I love both GOG and steam and prefer them over other services. GOG does get significant points for putting effort into attempting to make sure older games run. Also steam allows publishers to use 3rd party DRM, which is especially crappy since steam is DRM and with GOG you really don't have to worry about that. So before I buy on steam I have to do research even for indies cause you can't tell what the publishers will try to slip in there. I do continue to buy from both and they both work well.
 
2012-11-27 03:10:45 PM

likefunbutnot: I farking hate Steam and I farking love GoG, to the point that I've re-purchased many titles I still own and am fully capable of setting up on modern hardware without their help, just to support their service.

I can keep my downloads, don't have to play mother-may-I with authentication or DRM and redownload whenever I want.That's how an online distribution system should work, people. Steam is just piling bullshiat on top of bullshiat and calling it a sundae.


I agree, it's so much work to hit "purchase" then "download and install" then walk away for a few minutes while Steam seamlessly downloads at max speed like a boss and installs my new game with zero fuss. I hate that.

It is far too tedious to wait those 20 minutes or so that it takes Steam to download and install the new AAA title I just bought at 50% off. I don't know how I manage to deal with this frustration. I sometimes wonder why I even keep using Steam. Who could possibly put up with such bullshiat on top of bullshiat just to play video games. 20 minutes of my time and 2 or 3 clicks of the mouse is far too much effort to play A+ quality video games that were bought at a deep discount with another 2 or 3 clicks of the mouse. I find this shiat unacceptable and plan to let everyone on the internet know about it.

It's also WAY too hard to reinstall games I've previously bought. I actually have to find the title in an alphabetical library list and hit an install button. Pushing that single install button is like jumping through 8 burning rings of DRM all at once. fark THAT. I'm not getting ass raped just to play a game I already bought. Reinstalling old games doesn't need to be so challenging.
 
2012-11-27 03:10:56 PM

YodaBlues: Steam has an offline mode.


Only partially true, it can't remain in offline mode indefinitely and publishers can veto their product being able to work in offline mode.

So whilst you are correct that it does there is zero guarantee that any given game will actually work in this mode. Which makes 'offline mode' rather pointless on the whole.
 
2012-11-27 03:12:51 PM
Wasn't even aware that Steam had a rival, much less an archrival. Subby needs a reality check.

AgentPothead: GOG and Steam aren't really archrivals. Steam is more about newer releases, where Good Old Games, well hell, it's in the name.


Says you; I bought my entire Steam friend's list Ecco the Dolphin last Christmas!

Note: I actually did this. It was on sale.
 
2012-11-27 03:14:32 PM
DoomPaul: I hate the whole "we're selling you a license and not the actual product" legal gymnastics.

I would be fine with it if they actually threw in some consumer service in there. IE, I would want the ability to.

1) Replace broken install media for a nominal fee (since you sold me a license, I shouldn't have to repay for that part).

2) Allow me to transfer my license (even if there's a nominal fee involved), IE, when I'm done with a title, I want to transfer it over to a sibling.

3) Keep track of, or give me a better way to keep track of the licenses I own (so if my install media is destroyed in a fire, I can replace it for a nominal fee).
 
2012-11-27 03:15:49 PM
I actually installed Tie Fighter this weekend. I found a site that had a really nice dosboxed package all set up. Runs fine on Win7 64. I can't remember the site offhand, but I'll post it if I find it.

That being said, I love GoG for the Ultima Series and Ceasar 3.
 
2012-11-27 03:15:49 PM

Vaneshi: netweavr: Arch-rival? I thought that was Origin

Only in the hallucinations EA gets once it's finished fapping itself in to a dessicated husk for the weekend.
Steam has 40+ million customers; Origin isn't even close to being a competitor to it. Not yet at any rate, who knows what the future will bring but I don't think it'll be any time soon.

I suspect it's: Steam, Amazon, GoG as the big three with GamersGate, Origin and co fighting over the left overs.


Don't forget Desura for all the indie releases. Desura has essential shown up and become what all the assorted shareware distributors tried to be years ago. A one stop shop for little games made by small teams (or individuals).
 
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