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(CBS Sports)   NHL cancels the All-Star Game and the regular season through December 14th. Broadcast networks brace for another $300 lost in commercial revenue   (cbssports.com) divider line 39
    More: Followup, MLB All-Star Game, NHL, regular season, NHL All-Star, broadcast networks, Donald Fehr, NHLPA, games back  
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332 clicks; posted to Sports » on 26 Nov 2012 at 10:50 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-26 10:57:20 AM  
3 votes:
The silver lining in this lockout is that the teams Bettman ripped from the North and put in the South will lose their fan base and be forced back into the Canada and the Northeast.
2012-11-26 01:45:45 PM  
2 votes:

dletter: ElwoodCuse: awesome let's shrink the league to 12 teams while we're at it so it can completely disappear from the sports landscape on this continent

And 8 of them in Canada... NY, Boston, Chicago, Philly, Pittsburgh, Buffalo left in the U.S. (so, at least 14 teams)


You forgot St. Louis. While we've never won a cup, the Blues have always been a top franchise for 40+ years except for the rough stretch after the last lockout and ownership drama.
2012-11-26 01:37:45 PM  
2 votes:
I can't believe i'm saying this, but I am very happy to see there are actually people posting on Fark who seem to have educated themselves on what is happening. Go to some of the Canadian sites and it is full of derp. Seriously...check out the comment section on tsn.ca articles about the lockout. It's ridiculous.

Fark you Bettman! You and a handful of owners have no one to blame but yourselves for this mess. I'm not a Fehr fan either...but the only reason he is where he is right now is because Bettman has shown to be such a douchebag the past 20 years and the PA needed someone to fight back.
2012-11-26 11:56:03 AM  
2 votes:

DasBeast: [www.lacrosse-information.com image 197x337]

Bye, NHL.


Just like last time though, the NLL won't do anything meaningful to take advantage though.... you think the NHL is run poorly....
2012-11-26 11:14:16 AM  
2 votes:

LineNoise: S.A.S.Q.U.A.T.C.H.: Either way they have only a week or so to make things happen. But I can bet you a lot of guys aren't happy with Fehr's drag-your-feet approach. Piss on both these parties for putting us in the middle of the posturing game.

As much as I'd like to rag on betman, the owners have very valid points, and for christ sake, the players hired Fehr.


Like not wanting to pay the contracts they signed willingly?

Like not wanting to prop up bettmans penis expansion into the south anymore?

Like not wanting to split profits with teams and owners that simply just dont give a fark at improving their product ?

Like the owners who have taken a "our way or the highway" approach to negotiations in good faith?
2012-11-26 11:11:57 AM  
2 votes:

WTF Indeed: The silver lining in this lockout is that the teams Bettman ripped from the North and put in the South will lose their fan base and be forced back into the Canada and the Northeast.


Or could just place a couple of them in the Northwest!? I would love to see the NHL come to Portland and Seattle.

/How the fark does Phoenix have a NHL team?
2012-11-26 11:05:39 AM  
2 votes:
I play men's league with an ex-NHLer who went through the last 2 lockouts. His point to make last night? "It takes about 4 paychecks. That's where they are now. About 4 paychecks missed then guys start sweating and calling up, Just farking sign it. These guys aren't rich."

Lo and behold, how were the players last week? Can't remember the last time I heard so much bickering, complaining and retweeted death threats. People be gettin' cranky.

Either way they have only a week or so to make things happen. But I can bet you a lot of guys aren't happy with Fehr's drag-your-feet approach. Piss on both these parties for putting us in the middle of the posturing game.
2012-11-26 10:29:17 AM  
2 votes:
Fark you, Jeremy Jacobs.
2012-11-26 05:23:33 PM  
1 votes:

mjohnson71: dletter: ElwoodCuse: awesome let's shrink the league to 12 teams while we're at it so it can completely disappear from the sports landscape on this continent

And 8 of them in Canada... NY, Boston, Chicago, Philly, Pittsburgh, Buffalo left in the U.S. (so, at least 14 teams)

You forgot St. Louis. While we've never won a cup, the Blues have always been a top franchise for 40+ years except for the rough stretch after the last lockout and ownership drama.


The Kings aren't going anywhere either. They could have a "Canadians with SAG cards only" game in LA and still sell out the arena.
2012-11-26 03:54:52 PM  
1 votes:

mjohnson71: Galloping Galoshes: Martonio: There was a time the players had to get jobs in the off season since their NHL salary didn't adequately support their families.

Yeah, and the owners coined money. Are you suggesting that's the way things ought to be? The lifeblood of a multi-billion dollar industry should have to scramble to make a living, and then, what? They spent their whole lives preparing to play pro hockey, and now what do they do? Oh, they should be honored they were allowed to entertain you for a few years, now go sell windows.

They should get what they can while they can. Screw the owners. The NHL has and always has had the most backward ownership of all the major pro sports. Everyone pines for the "original six," well, maybe that's what will survive.

Serious question: is there a group of owners that are using this lockout as a way to "bleed off" other teams they don't want?


Serious answer: No idea. But based on what the NHL is asking from the NHLPA, I would say no.
2012-11-26 03:46:44 PM  
1 votes:

dletter: keylock71: Pathetic....

fark you, Jeremy Jacobs, indeed.

Can still go to AHL games, at least. Though I won't be buying any beer or food as Jacobs also owns all the concessions at the Dunk, as well, I believe.

Speaking of that... has the NHL Network announced that they would show some AHL and/or ECHL games with the NHL locked out. If not... is there a reason why not... I mean, it isn't like they see them as "competition", they are effectively the leagues AAA & AA system.


Wish I knew... Only thing I've heard is there was a possibility NESN would be showing P-Bruins games if the Lock Out ended up negating the NHL season.

I would love it.
2012-11-26 03:38:08 PM  
1 votes:
The Original six? fark em. They're not original, nor are they the founding teams.
2012-11-26 03:18:40 PM  
1 votes:

keylock71: Pathetic....

fark you, Jeremy Jacobs, indeed.

Can still go to AHL games, at least. Though I won't be buying any beer or food as Jacobs also owns all the concessions at the Dunk, as well, I believe.


Speaking of that... has the NHL Network announced that they would show some AHL and/or ECHL games with the NHL locked out. If not... is there a reason why not... I mean, it isn't like they see them as "competition", they are effectively the leagues AAA & AA system.
2012-11-26 03:13:20 PM  
1 votes:
Pathetic....

fark you, Jeremy Jacobs, indeed.

Can still go to AHL games, at least. Though I won't be buying any beer or food as Jacobs also owns all the concessions at the Dunk, as well, I believe.
2012-11-26 03:13:03 PM  
1 votes:

desertgeek: Pierre LeBrun just tweeted that a federal mediator is now involved in the labor talks.


I read that as "feral". That'd be more fun.

You get a rabies shot! And you get a rabies shot! And you get a rabies shot!
2012-11-26 03:06:35 PM  
1 votes:

DasBeast: A pretty good fan site pushing the NLL over NHL argument.


It is nice, and sad that someone has to do that FOR the NLL.
2012-11-26 03:01:36 PM  
1 votes:

Martonio: There was a time the players had to get jobs in the off season since their NHL salary didn't adequately support their families.


Yeah, and the owners coined money. Are you suggesting that's the way things ought to be? The lifeblood of a multi-billion dollar industry should have to scramble to make a living, and then, what? They spent their whole lives preparing to play pro hockey, and now what do they do? Oh, they should be honored they were allowed to entertain you for a few years, now go sell windows.

They should get what they can while they can. Screw the owners. The NHL has and always has had the most backward ownership of all the major pro sports. Everyone pines for the "original six," well, maybe that's what will survive.
2012-11-26 02:59:17 PM  
1 votes:
It's probably good to point out that Comcast/NBC is part owners of the Philadelphia Flyers, and is paying the NHL under the terms of their contract at present for the NBC Sports Network, despite generating no revenue.
2012-11-26 02:46:35 PM  
1 votes:
A pretty good fan site pushing the NLL over NHL argument.
2012-11-26 02:02:58 PM  
1 votes:

JohnnyCanuck: I can't believe i'm saying this, but I am very happy to see there are actually people posting on Fark who seem to have educated themselves on what is happening. Go to some of the Canadian sites and it is full of derp. Seriously...check out the comment section on tsn.ca articles about the lockout. It's ridiculous.

Fark you Bettman! You and a handful of owners have no one to blame but yourselves for this mess. I'm not a Fehr fan either...but the only reason he is where he is right now is because Bettman has shown to be such a douchebag the past 20 years and the PA needed someone to fight back.


For reals. The tsn.ca comment section is nuts. Nary one thought given to the fact that the owners might, _might_, have some responsibility for the lockout. Nope, it's just "You players need to do what you're told by your owners and get back to entertaining me."

And I thought that Canadians were the savvy hockey fans.
2012-11-26 01:39:43 PM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: desertgeek: But we've been saying that for what? 4 months now?

And this is why I am growing more and more anti NHLPA. So far the league has shown restraint in cancelling games, making it so a season could get up and running fast if a deal is had.

The talk now of decertification is the union saying they don't give a shiat about the season. It will take 2 months or so just to decertify, let alone the lawsuits that will then come out of it.


When I saw the rumors of decertification last week, I thought "don't do it Fehr because everyone who's backing you now will turn on you if you go there." Bettman might as well announce the cancellation of the season if the union does that.

LineNoise: desertgeek: Fehr and the union gave in on going to a 50/50 split right away

They didn't though with the insistance on the make whole. the split they proposed would only affect new contracts, which total exactly 0 right now.


I think by "new contacts," they meant those signed this year. And that is totally fair because I think it's clear that some of those deals were done by owners who thought that there was no way in Hell they'd pay all of that out.
2012-11-26 01:35:15 PM  
1 votes:
Galloping Galoshes:

Go Maryland Arrows! (OK, I'm old, I admit it.)

i.ebayimg.com

Crunch Crosscheck approves your comment.
2012-11-26 01:21:38 PM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: The pronger thing is an annoyance at best.


Pronger's cap hit is 5 million, on the books till 2017. He alone takes up 7% of the cap, and he's not playing another minute in his career. While it comes off the books during the season, during the off-season, when contracts are signed and free agents acquired, it counts. His cap needs to go.

Weber wasn't a pipe dream. You don't tie up a hundred million dollars on a pipe dream. Nashville couldn't afford him, but signed him anyway. They'll be trying to get rid of him soon.

There are no loopholes the Flyers exploited. Pronger was a 35+ contract. The closest to a cheat was lappy sitting on the IR for a year instead of retiring right away.
2012-11-26 01:14:52 PM  
1 votes:

dletter: DasBeast: dletter: DasBeast: [www.lacrosse-information.com image 197x337]

Bye, NHL.

Just like last time though, the NLL won't do anything meaningful to take advantage though.... you think the NHL is run poorly....

Part of the problem is several teams are owned (full or partially) by their NHL counterparts in that city. (Calgary, Buffalo, etc). Convincing owners to promote the small sport at the expense of the larger sport...that's a tough sell. Here's hoping some of the better owners in the NLL, like Dawick, Urban, and Cline put some pressure on the league to step up.

True... it is a bit of a conundrum to expect the NHL owned teams to work hard to take advantage of their larger teams follies to help their smaller (NLL) team.

I guess the other thing I meant though was from the league perspective... this NHL lockout was not a surprise, and the fact that they might pull a 2004 again was not coming as a shock... the NLL should have really pushed a lot harder to get teams established in some new, needed markets again this year (NY/Brooklyn, Florida/Tampa, other larger markets they need to get into). The NLL unfortunately doesn't seem to have a real growth plan to get Indoor Lacrosse truly more popular as a nationwide sport, which is sad because honestly I think it is a sport that more fans would warm up to if they saw it, especially in person... honestly as a person who isn't a hockey nut, I tend to enjoy it in person more than most hockey games I've watched... and I think the appeal of more scores in a game would endeer it to more US sports fans than hockey & soccer currently do.


Go Maryland Arrows! (OK, I'm old, I admit it.)
2012-11-26 01:09:16 PM  
1 votes:

ElwoodCuse: awesome let's shrink the league to 12 teams while we're at it so it can completely disappear from the sports landscape on this continent


And 8 of them in Canada... NY, Boston, Chicago, Philly, Pittsburgh, Buffalo left in the U.S. (so, at least 14 teams)
2012-11-26 12:46:43 PM  
1 votes:

dletter: DasBeast: [www.lacrosse-information.com image 197x337]

Bye, NHL.

Just like last time though, the NLL won't do anything meaningful to take advantage though.... you think the NHL is run poorly....


Part of the problem is several teams are owned (full or partially) by their NHL counterparts in that city. (Calgary, Buffalo, etc). Convincing owners to promote the small sport at the expense of the larger sport...that's a tough sell. Here's hoping some of the better owners in the NLL, like Dawick, Urban, and Cline put some pressure on the league to step up.
2012-11-26 12:44:49 PM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: VERYONE knew those contracts were a load of crap, and part of this is to close the loopholes that lead to them. I'm a flyers fan, and closing the loopholes will hurt us, but needs to be done


Then you also know a lockout and a new CBA was probably the best thing that could happen.

Our off season was horrible. We lost a first pair d-man in carle and got bruno farking gervais back. We lost Weber.

With a year off, we can trade for Weber (Nashville sure as shiat can't afford him now), or sign *someone*. With a CBA Amnesty buyout we can finally get Pronger off the books and get back the millions we're out in the off-season.

Of all teams, the lockout is best for Philly.
2012-11-26 12:37:34 PM  
1 votes:

Tryfan: Fark the nhlpa. Hockey players are simpletons who would willingly follow Peter Piper over a cliff if he framed it as " being a part of the team".

Also, fark retards who blame Bettman for everything. Commissioner does not equal dictator. ALL of the league's expansion was approved before he was hired, including the last round of it even though he was in by the time it was implemented. Nor does the league have total control of where teams move when leases run out - they have to have good legal cause to block them.

All of this is public knowledge but you have to actually educate yourself to it, something most neanderthal "blame Bettman" drones are incapable of.


Meh. 2/10. Not your strongest effort.
2012-11-26 12:08:05 PM  
1 votes:

desertgeek: But we've been saying that for what? 4 months now?


And this is why I am growing more and more anti NHLPA. So far the league has shown restraint in cancelling games, making it so a season could get up and running fast if a deal is had.

The talk now of decertification is the union saying they don't give a shiat about the season. It will take 2 months or so just to decertify, let alone the lawsuits that will then come out of it.
2012-11-26 12:07:11 PM  
1 votes:
Hey, NHL

www.lobshots.com
2012-11-26 11:45:16 AM  
1 votes:

DasBeast: [www.lacrosse-information.com image 197x337]

Bye, NHL.


I'll have to go dig through the attic to see if I have any old Washington Wave stuff.
2012-11-26 11:38:58 AM  
1 votes:
www.lacrosse-information.com

Bye, NHL.
2012-11-26 11:34:42 AM  
1 votes:

Mrtraveler01: LineNoise: You have plenty of unprofitable teams in great markets *coughISLANDERScough* that have nothing to do with how the owners or league operates.

That might change with the move to Brooklyn...maybe.


Nobody goes to see a bad team. But who owns the building? Who gets the concessions? Parking? (If any.) What about the other revenue streams besides tickets?
2012-11-26 11:32:05 AM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: You have plenty of unprofitable teams in great markets *coughISLANDERScough* that have nothing to do with how the owners or league operates.


That might change with the move to Brooklyn...maybe.
2012-11-26 11:30:12 AM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: Like the owners who have taken a "our way or the highway" approach to negotiations in good faith?And the NHLPA isn't guilty of this as well? Notice, I say the NHLPA, and not the players. Their union leadership is running them into disaster. If they decertify, that is it for any hope of a season, as this thing will then sit in courts for 6 months.


Wrong. One of Fehr's tactics, and one that worked very well for him with the MLBPA, is to keep the players looped in completely. Players are free to join in negotiating sessions, including rank and file, and are involved in every way. You have completely mischaracterized what Fehr does (and fallen for the owners line of BS as they try to divide the union).

LineNoise: As a hockey fan I want the brand to grow. that means moving into non-traditional markets. People biatch and moan that hockey doesn't get the attention it deserves, and part of fixing that means making it a national game, and not restricted to niche markets.


That's fine, but the NHL expanded way too far, way too fast. And for their managerial arrogance, the league wants the players to pay for it.

LineNoise: EVERYONE knew those contracts were a load of crap


Last I heard, a contract is a contract. A signed agreement enforceable in the courts. If the owners didn't intend to live up to the terms, that's fraud. If you believe that no one expected the contracts to be valid, you have bought the owners' BS again.
2012-11-26 11:26:41 AM  
1 votes:

Galloping Galoshes: Like wanting the players to pay for the NHL's overexpansion into unprofitable markets (when the owners pocketed the franchise fee)?


For the most part, this argument centers around phoenix, and we all know that phoenix isn't long for this world, nor do they cost anyone a boatload of money, other than the city of glendale. You have plenty of unprofitable teams in great markets *coughISLANDERScough* that have nothing to do with how the owners or league operates.

Look at teams like the sharks, or carolina, as examples of non-traditional markets that are working. I'm confident phoenix would come around as well given enough time. You just need to give time for the kids who go to their first game to work their way through the pipeline to turn into kids who now play, and then ultimately paying fans.
2012-11-26 11:17:01 AM  
1 votes:
Dammit.

This really hurts for Columbus. They spent a boatlaod of money they didn't really have expecting the ASG to balance it out.

Not too upset about losing the season, because it was going to be dreadful with the bag of beans that Howson got for Nash, but the All Star Game was going to be a bright spot.

There is a lot of support for the team here. I mean, they will always be second fiddle to the other pro sport in town, OSU football, but hockey is huge here and if this farking mess causes us to lose a team...
2012-11-26 11:10:37 AM  
1 votes:

LineNoise: S.A.S.Q.U.A.T.C.H.: Either way they have only a week or so to make things happen. But I can bet you a lot of guys aren't happy with Fehr's drag-your-feet approach. Piss on both these parties for putting us in the middle of the posturing game.

As much as I'd like to rag on betman, the owners have very valid points, and for christ sake, the players hired Fehr.


Of course the players hired Fehr. They got rolled last time, and Fehr did great things for the MLBPA (and MLB, if they would admit it).
I'm curious about the valid points the owners make. Such as?
2012-11-26 11:05:04 AM  
1 votes:
Saw an interesting article on the number of games the NHL has lost since Bettman became Commissioner:

# of games lost under Bettman

If this season is lost, the NHL will have lost almost 13% of scheduled games since Bettman started, as compared with no NFL games lost under Goodell, and 2% of NBA games under Stern and 2% of MLB games under Selig.

It's not that Bettman is particularly evil, he's just a small man, not big enough for the job, not big enough to protect the owners from themselves.
 
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