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(Politico)   Online shopping: It's cheap, reliable, and there is a great selection of fantastic gifts out there. Except the cheap thing may not be true anymore as states start realizing this and are gonna start taxing your ass   (politico.com) divider line 118
    More: Sad, online retailers, state sales tax, artificial Christmas trees, gifts  
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3635 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Nov 2012 at 9:53 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-23 09:55:13 AM
If this is a huge problem for you, maybe you need to stop shopping already.
 
2012-11-23 09:57:16 AM
I'm in Texas so i'm already paying taxes on Amazon. But it begs the question, exactly where are we doing business technically?
 
2012-11-23 09:57:44 AM
Taxes aren't going to make me want to suddenly get dressed, get in the car, drive through some traffic lights, hunt for a parking spot, shoulder my way into a store through the cold air, and then hope that they have it in stock, and in a location that makes sense.

Internet wins
 
2012-11-23 09:59:42 AM
But is my ass really touching the taxes?
 
2012-11-23 10:00:08 AM

cryinoutloud: If this is a huge problem for you, maybe you need to stop shopping already.


49 percent of Americans are on public assistance, but let's start judging people for whom this could present a problem, because obviously it stems from a spiritual defect or an allergy to shopping....

/she knows what I mean
 
2012-11-23 10:01:01 AM

Girion47: Taxes aren't going to make me want to suddenly get dressed, get in the car, drive through some traffic lights, hunt for a parking spot, shoulder my way into a store through the cold air, and then hope that they have it in stock, and in a location that makes sense.

Internet wins


I predict a scheme to tax you for that convenience on top of sales tax. I'm serious.
 
2012-11-23 10:01:57 AM
Speaking from the small retailer side of things, I don't have a problem with this except that they want US to collect tax, track the tax rates for every single municipality we ship to, and I guess file some kind of tax form with each of those. I sell 50-100 items a month and it would be a huge pain in the ass. I can't even imagine being one of the higher volume sellers and having to do that.

Depending on how involved it was, I'd probably lose at least two days a month to just doing the paperwork. This is assuming ebay didn't implement some tool to help us, because frankly I'd be shocked if they did. They won't even store sales data past 90 days.
 
2012-11-23 10:02:05 AM
Even if my state starts applying the same 6% sales tax to my Amazon purchases that I get at the mall, online is STILL better because the base price is so much lower, meaning 6% of it is lower too. Throw in the cost of gas and the fact that Prime means free shipping, and I fail to see the downside.
 
2012-11-23 10:02:20 AM
Oh goody, another tax thread on Fark.

These always bring out the idiots in masses
 
2012-11-23 10:03:11 AM
Sales Tax? What is that? Is that that thing that Massholes complain about as they waste gas to avoid the $0.10 that they'd pay to the Commonwealth?

/Someday I'm going to point out that 6.25% isn't that bad compared to some of the other states in the US.
//Hell, my Ohio sales tax was higher thanks to what the counties add on.
 
2012-11-23 10:03:18 AM

NannyStatePark: I'm in Texas so i'm already paying taxes on Amazon. But it begs the question, exactly where are we doing business technically?



I just tried to get around Lowe's sales tax online by buying form a store in Concord NH (no sales tax) but they charged me for sales tax according to my delivery address. NY! $11 diff on $150 purchase. 

/so, same as if I went to the local store and picked it up.
 
2012-11-23 10:05:09 AM

Just another Heartland Weirdass: Girion47: Taxes aren't going to make me want to suddenly get dressed, get in the car, drive through some traffic lights, hunt for a parking spot, shoulder my way into a store through the cold air, and then hope that they have it in stock, and in a location that makes sense.

Internet wins

I predict a scheme to tax you for that convenience on top of sales tax. I'm serious.


I remember one year I was renewing my car's registration and I was about to write the check when I noticed that $1 of the total was a check-cashing fee. Then I noticed you could pay it online. I got online and the total was the same. I looked at the breakdown- a $1 Internet convenience fee instead. Oh well, I saved the cost of the stamp. They will get their money somehow.
 
2012-11-23 10:05:14 AM
Not a problem. The site I buy from has been paying the taxes for the states people live in when they buy a product, since before the U.S. started slapping tax regulations on the internet. Any good business would get their heads out of their asses and plan ahead of time.
 
2012-11-23 10:05:26 AM

Just another Heartland Weirdass: Girion47: Taxes aren't going to make me want to suddenly get dressed, get in the car, drive through some traffic lights, hunt for a parking spot, shoulder my way into a store through the cold air, and then hope that they have it in stock, and in a location that makes sense.

Internet wins

I predict a scheme to tax you for that convenience on top of sales tax. I'm serious.


Tax? Are you kidding? It's the companies that will wise up and start with the convenience charge, Think of all the profit they are missing!

NannyStatePark: cryinoutloud: If this is a huge problem for you, maybe you need to stop shopping already.

49 percent of Americans are on public assistance, but let's start judging people for whom this could present a problem, because obviously it stems from a spiritual defect or an allergy to shopping....

/she knows what I mean


If they are on public assistance then how many of them are buying big ticket items over the computer that they would have to worry about taxes?
 
2012-11-23 10:05:51 AM
The state needs more, damn it.
 
2012-11-23 10:06:11 AM
Oh goody, another tax thread on Fark.

These always bring out the idiots in masses

/you
 
2012-11-23 10:07:37 AM

Aar1012: Sales Tax? What is that? Is that that thing that Massholes complain about as they waste gas to avoid the $0.10 that they'd pay to the Commonwealth?

/Someday I'm going to point out that 6.25% isn't that bad compared to some of the other states in the US.
//Hell, my Ohio sales tax was higher thanks to what the counties add on.


NH? You don't specify what state in your profile so I'm guessing, unless you mean you have 6.25.

If it is NH, I have to say I wasn't really impressed with public facilities in that state; NY might have higher taxes but we have fairly decent public services too in most areas (excepting of course the one I live in darn it all).
 
2012-11-23 10:08:23 AM
They have to be kidding me. My state requires that local sales tax be collected during an on-line purchase if the company has any facilities in the state. If they don't the tax doesn't need to be collected, but the consumer is required to remit the sales tax to the state (no one does this). How long has it been this way? Oh for about 20 years now. Almost all stated do this.
 
2012-11-23 10:11:10 AM
NannyStatePark: I'm in Texas so i'm already paying taxes on Amazon. But it begs the question, exactly where are we doing business technically?

China.
 
2012-11-23 10:11:17 AM
The thing that makes online shopping so cheap is I can instantly compare it to any number of other places, and get the best price. Not because I'm saving 7-8% on sales tax.
 
2012-11-23 10:11:59 AM
I find it amazing that the internet is so gung-ho about taxing the rich and hating people who tax evade etc.. But then it's something terrible that states are trying to tax online sales.
 
2012-11-23 10:12:33 AM

ladyfortuna: Speaking from the small retailer side of things, I don't have a problem with this except that they want US to collect tax, track the tax rates for every single municipality we ship to, and I guess file some kind of tax form with each of those. I sell 50-100 items a month and it would be a huge pain in the ass. I can't even imagine being one of the higher volume sellers and having to do that.

Depending on how involved it was, I'd probably lose at least two days a month to just doing the paperwork. This is assuming ebay didn't implement some tool to help us, because frankly I'd be shocked if they did. They won't even store sales data past 90 days.


I suspect that it will be offered as a feature for merchant accounts (via the credit card processor, not eBay itself). After all, if the billing info goes through there already it's not much more effort to keep a running tally of individual municipalities and submit a payment every month or quarter for each one.
 
2012-11-23 10:12:45 AM

ladyfortuna: Aar1012: Sales Tax? What is that? Is that that thing that Massholes complain about as they waste gas to avoid the $0.10 that they'd pay to the Commonwealth?

/Someday I'm going to point out that 6.25% isn't that bad compared to some of the other states in the US.
//Hell, my Ohio sales tax was higher thanks to what the counties add on.

NH? You don't specify what state in your profile so I'm guessing, unless you mean you have 6.25.

If it is NH, I have to say I wasn't really impressed with public facilities in that state; NY might have higher taxes but we have fairly decent public services too in most areas (excepting of course the one I live in darn it all).


It is New Hampshire. I've actually been more impressed with our services compared to Mass. Our construction seems shorter and to hold up better.

The tax dodgers just piss me off...especially since they do get tax free of food and a certain amount of clothes.
 
2012-11-23 10:13:07 AM
Maybe taxes wouldn't be such a horrid thing if we were all paid a living wage and those wages actually went up, allowing everybody to buy more stuff. Seems we're just splitting hairs when it comes to sales tax when the real issue is that stores are paying their employees less yet expecting those same employees to spend more each and every year.
 
2012-11-23 10:13:30 AM
FTFA: "Scott Mason, vice president of government affairs for Lowe's, the home improvement chain, "Lowes.com collects sales tax from shoppers in every state that has a sales tax and where the company operates stores and warehouses. "It's absolutely a position of disadvantage.""

So does Amazon, asshole, and they always have.

I shop at Amazon for the price, selection and convenience, irrespective of having to pay sales tax. When I want to buy two by fours, I go to Homer. Lowes is too expensive... ;^)
 
2012-11-23 10:14:11 AM
I don't have a big problem with this, but let the states iron it out.

If I go to my local brick and mortar I don't have to save my receipts, then figure my sales tax at the end of the year. I shouldn't have to with interweb purchases.

Look, you guys figure it out. Calculate the taxes, who they should go to, then give me a number. I'll decide if I want to go with that.

Maybe I'm weird, but I don't shop online because I'll save on sales tax. I do it because I can find a better price than I can locally, better selection than I can locally, and they send it to my door, often free of shipping charges.

I save more than the, in my case 7%, sales tax. I get what I want, and can get it delivered to my office.

You have computers... hell, you sell them... use 'em, dammit.
 
2012-11-23 10:14:17 AM

Wade_Wilson: Even if my state starts applying the same 6% sales tax to my Amazon purchases that I get at the mall, online is STILL better because the base price is so much lower, meaning 6% of it is lower too. Throw in the cost of gas and the fact that Prime means free shipping, and I fail to see the downside.


This.

This just brings in more money for the state. It doesn't 'level the playing field' for brick and mortar stores. A cheaper item online, even with sales tax is still cheaper.

Prime is the best money I have EVAR spent.
 
2012-11-23 10:14:19 AM
The people biatching about paying sales tax on online purchases are the same folks that will complain about how schools don't get enough funding or the museum down town is closing due to lack of funding or program blah-blah-blah is ending due to lack of funding.

Pay up or shut up.
 
2012-11-23 10:14:32 AM
Oh NOes! I'll never buy from Amazon again if it means I hafta pay TAXES!!!1!
 
2012-11-23 10:16:43 AM

NannyStatePark: cryinoutloud: If this is a huge problem for you, maybe you need to stop shopping already.

49 percent of Americans are on public assistance, but let's start judging people for whom this could present a problem, because obviously it stems from a spiritual defect or an allergy to shopping....

/she knows what I mean


49% of Americans are on public assistance? WTF? Citation Needed.

Oh, I'm sure that's your FOX News/AM Talk Radio talking point, with some incredibly vague, or incredibly loose definition of what counts as "public assistance".

It's worded to make it sound like half of America is on welfare and living on the dole, just leeching off the good hardworking Real Americans, but in reality it's more like some people might get some tiny perk that's a drop in the bucket compared to their actual wages and salaries, you know, things they pay for in taxes on their jobs?

Seriously, I'd like to see the math on this "49% of Americans are on public assistance" claim, because I'm calling Bullshiat on this.  Sounds distorted or misleading.
 
2012-11-23 10:18:15 AM
Tuba City, AZ
13.725% sales tax rate

/how are smaller internets business owners going to track sales tax rates for over 6,000 jurisdictions they could possibly ship to?
 
2012-11-23 10:18:41 AM
The best part is the old brick and mortar stores REALLY believe that the sales tax is why I shop online. No, it's because I needed a flash drive the other day, and the local store had 16 GB stick for $40. Amazon had the same thing for $10. I'd have paid $15 at the local store to have it immediately, but not a 400% markup.
 
2012-11-23 10:19:02 AM

NannyStatePark: I'm in Texas so i'm already paying taxes on Amazon. But it begs the question, exactly where are we doing business technically?


The land of the free, you gullible chumps.
 
2012-11-23 10:19:23 AM
Of course, if you buy things on the Internet and pay no sales taxes, technically you're liable for use taxes. But that's impossible for states to enforce. I think it's possible, and Constitutional, for the federal government to address the old Supreme Court cases (e.g. Quill) with federal legislation to protect state tax bases (effectively providing that every vendor has nexus in every state), but there is currently a substantial element in Congress who think tax avoidance is a god-given American right.
 
2012-11-23 10:21:01 AM
can we just move to a national sales tax and be done with it?
 
2012-11-23 10:21:26 AM

debug: The people biatching about paying sales tax on online purchases are the same folks that will complain about how schools don't get enough funding or the museum down town is closing due to lack of funding or program blah-blah-blah is ending due to lack of funding.

Pay up or shut up.


I normally find the folks who biatch about taxes, particularly ones that give megacorp advantages over smaller brick and mortar businesses are more the ones who are left looking all confused when suddenly all the stores in their town are shuttered, their property taxes are jacked up to replace lost revenue and suddenly an entire industry of jobs is gone from their town for good. Then as they tend to be older they decide to retire and go live in a college town that still has a viable main street and focus their biatching on how the town would be so much better without all the college students.
 
2012-11-23 10:21:48 AM

SisterMaryElephant: Tuba City, AZ
13.725% sales tax rate

/how are smaller internets business owners going to track sales tax rates for over 6,000 jurisdictions they could possibly ship to?


I think they call them "databases"... but I could be wrong.

If they can ship to 6,000 jurisdictions, they can calculate taxes to 6,000 jurisdictions.
 
2012-11-23 10:22:49 AM
I live in New Hampshire so of course I'm getting a kick. I've lived on the Mass, Maine and now VT state lines so I've seen the desire people have to avoid a little tax all over. I've often had friends in other states ask me to pick things up for them and ship them or bring them to them when I visit so they can avoid taxes. I wonder at what point it would become profitable to set up a site like shippingfirendinNH.com where you hire a middle man to freight you all your holiday stuff to avoid the taxes.
 
2012-11-23 10:24:28 AM
Oh goody, another tax thread on Fark.

These always bring out the idiots in masses
 
2012-11-23 10:26:04 AM
amazon is opening up shippIng depots all over the country, to provide next day shipping for less and to increase Prime memberships. Get used to taxes.
 
2012-11-23 10:27:26 AM
If only there was a virtual harbour that virtual boxes of tea could be virtually thrown into.
 
2012-11-23 10:27:46 AM

SuperT: can we just move to a national sales tax and be done with it?


No. Because I enjoy paying 0% state income taxes, and the only national sales tax plan I know of is the Fair Tax, which is exceptionally regressive.

I don't mind paying my fair share of sales tax. It's not like taxes are a form of theft. Taxes are the dues we pay to live in a decent society.
 
2012-11-23 10:28:37 AM

Just another Heartland Weirdass: Girion47: Taxes aren't going to make me want to suddenly get dressed, get in the car, drive through some traffic lights, hunt for a parking spot, shoulder my way into a store through the cold air, and then hope that they have it in stock, and in a location that makes sense.

Internet wins

I predict a scheme to tax you for that convenience on top of sales tax. I'm serious.


LOL. Next thing you'll predict is a convenience fee for sports and concert tickets.
 
2012-11-23 10:29:08 AM
If I buy online, I have to pay shipping and handling, plus I have to wait a few days or maybe a week or two to get it. And I don't get to see it before I spend my money. Serious disadvantages to THIS customer! On the other hand, I don't get the "We're sold out or we don't carry that size/model, and we don't know when the next shipment will come in. That's up to the Warehouse that knows you really don't want to buy that after all." Bricks-and-morter vs. internet is not an "even playing field", but the advantages are not all on one side, and a lot of the lumps in the field were created by the clowns who are complaining that the internet gives an unfair advantage.

I just had a thought -- if the internet is so much better (profitable), why don't retailers like Lowes give more than lip service to internet sales?
 
2012-11-23 10:31:25 AM
I kinda understand why states are doing this, and sorry Wal Mart and Target, I'll still buy from Amazon sales tax or not because I really hate going to your stores.

This really sucks for the small online merchant though. Having to track ever-changing state, county, township and municipality (and even sometimes district level) sales taxes would be way more than anything but the big boys could handle.
 
2012-11-23 10:33:33 AM
What needs to happen is something along the lines of a central broker that small and large retailers alike can use to manage sales and use taxes. I'm not against states wanting to get their fair share, but when almost every state has a sales tax, and you have states like Tennessee and Ohio where local counties, cities, and towns can add their own tax on top of that, I can definitely understand how it can get overwhelming to small and medium sized businesses. I imagine a somewhat simple program could be developed (if it doesn't already exist) to make this possible. The more difficult part of it is the distribution aspect for them.
 
2012-11-23 10:34:59 AM

Silverstaff: NannyStatePark: cryinoutloud: If this is a huge problem for you, maybe you need to stop shopping already.

49 percent of Americans are on public assistance, but let's start judging people for whom this could present a problem, because obviously it stems from a spiritual defect or an allergy to shopping....

/she knows what I mean

49% of Americans are on public assistance? WTF? Citation Needed.

Oh, I'm sure that's your FOX News/AM Talk Radio talking point, with some incredibly vague, or incredibly loose definition of what counts as "public assistance".

It's worded to make it sound like half of America is on welfare and living on the dole, just leeching off the good hardworking Real Americans, but in reality it's more like some people might get some tiny perk that's a drop in the bucket compared to their actual wages and salaries, you know, things they pay for in taxes on their jobs?

Seriously, I'd like to see the math on this "49% of Americans are on public assistance" claim, because I'm calling Bullshiat on this.  Sounds distorted or misleading.


Here's an article about it by Mercatus, they're pretty reliable for good content.

Link

Looks to me like if you cut SS and Medicare you'd save 31% of that. Old people, not poor people, are the ones that all these old people are voting against.
 
2012-11-23 10:36:21 AM

zamboni: SisterMaryElephant: Tuba City, AZ
13.725% sales tax rate

/how are smaller internets business owners going to track sales tax rates for over 6,000 jurisdictions they could possibly ship to?

I think they call them "databases"... but I could be wrong.

If they can ship to 6,000 jurisdictions, they can calculate taxes to 6,000 jurisdictions.


Yes, because putting an address an ZIP code and paying the postage to send it there is exactly the same as knowing the exact tax rate by neighborhood, any changes that have happened recently, the proper forms for each (city, county and state) and where to send those at the end of the year.
Moran.
 
2012-11-23 10:36:42 AM
This happens in states that have distribution centers. There is one currently in the works in Richmond, VA so the whole state has to pay taxes since they are buying stuff from another vendor in the state. Other states will follow suit, although Tennessee has already requested I pay taxes on some stuff I had delivered there...
 
2012-11-23 10:38:12 AM

slackux: hop online. No, it's because I needed a flash drive the other day, and the local store had 16 GB stick for $40. Amazon had the same thing for $10. I'd have paid $15 at the local store to have it immediately, but not a 400% markup.


Right. If something costs $50 + 5% sales tax in the store but costs $30 on Amazon, then I'm going to buy it off of Amazon. The sales tax doesn't matter when the base price is much less. $30 + 5% sales tax is still cheaper than $50.
 
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