If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Patheos)   That awkward moment when a creationist gets outwitted by a sixth grader   (patheos.com) divider line 628
    More: Amusing, Hemant Mehtas, Portland State University, existence of God, ancient Greeks, innovations  
•       •       •

35976 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Nov 2012 at 1:38 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



628 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | » | Last | Show all
 
2012-11-22 02:07:28 AM

Mike_LowELL: I guess I must be watching a different video than you guys. I just saw an intelligent, mature adult destroy a whiny kid in a debate. In other words, a Republican exchanged ideas with a Democrat. Lol.


As long as you're talking about maturity and not chronological age, sure.
 
2012-11-22 02:07:38 AM

Arthur Jumbles: The creationist's premise is that unless you know everything you can't be sure that anything is true unless someone who knows everything tells you so.

As such, since I don't know everything I can't be sure that God exists unless It tells me so Itself. I assume the creationist believes that God communicates with people through the Bible. However, given the creationist's premise that we can't be sure of anything without knowing everything there is no way for us to know whether the Bible is actually the Word of God.


It can't be unless God is senile. There are too many contradictions and inconsistencies in that book.
 
2012-11-22 02:07:46 AM

gremlin1: I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.


Why?

Serious question, by the way.

I asked a similar question earlier in the day...and, just as I said then, I'm not asking to argue with you or demean your beliefs. I just want to understand.
 
2012-11-22 02:09:12 AM
Look as crazy wrong as I think the creationists are, at least that guy showed up and answered questions.
 
2012-11-22 02:09:16 AM

Mike_LowELL: I guess I must be watching a different video than you guys. I just saw an intelligent, mature adult destroy a whiny kid in a debate. In other words, a Republican exchanged ideas with a Democrat. Lol.


You are seriously funny. You aren't Larry David are you?
 
2012-11-22 02:09:45 AM

nmrsnr: Benevolent Misanthrope: What the god-pushing f*ckwit was trying to express is a fundamentally held belief among Christians who have examined their faith: You cannot prove god, but you cannot know anything unless it is revealed to you by god. Even if you don't acknowledge god's existence, god exists because if he didn't you wouldn't be sentient.

Circular reasoning at its best. And this guy can't even express his own flawed reasoning. Probably because he's perfectly content living an unexamined life.

I heard it a little differently, but that may be because of an actual conversation I had with my uber-religious freshman year roommate. His argument (and the one I think that was attempted here) is this:

1) You admit that you may be wrong about what you perceive (any scientist worth their salt will admit as much, like the child's father).
2) Since you admit that you cannot, with 100% certainty, claim absolute knowledge of the Universe, you admit that it is possible that god exists.
3) On the other hand, were there a perfect being with perfect knowledge, and he revealed it to you, you wouldn't have any uncertainty about the universe, since the perfect being revealed knowledge to you. (This is the guy in the video's 2+2=4 analogy)
4) Since the Bible is the revealed word of the perfect being that is god, I have no uncertainty about god's existence.


When he reached #4, you should have referred him back to #1, and then went and got some White Castle while he tried to figure it out.
 
2012-11-22 02:10:17 AM
everybody's gotta believe something

I believe I'll have another beer.

and then another, just to make sure.
 
2012-11-22 02:10:33 AM

eraser8: gremlin1: I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.

Why?

Serious question, by the way.

I asked a similar question earlier in the day...and, just as I said then, I'm not asking to argue with you or demean your beliefs. I just want to understand.


For science!
 
2012-11-22 02:10:38 AM
My reaction to creationist douchebag logic:
www.startrek.com
 
2012-11-22 02:12:01 AM
to gear duality to impose the will of greater on the creation of one...


wait i forgot .. what about my pay raise?
 
2012-11-22 02:13:21 AM

Ambivalence: How come agnostics are never represented in these debates. I have some pretty good arguments why the entire question of whether God exists or doesn't farking matter.


Agnosticism isn't the subject of the debate, so we don't know whether the kid is also an agnostic.

Keep in mind that a theist can be an agnostic and so can an atheist.

There's also a term for those who think the whole argument is pointless and isn't worth discussing...but, it eludes me at the moment (too many beers).
 
2012-11-22 02:13:57 AM

Begoggle: [i3.photobucket.com image 288x401]


I haven't seen Bevets is a looooong time. I am starting to think he is gone for good.

/It's just not a religious wacko thread without Bevets
 
2012-11-22 02:14:01 AM

This About That: I don't think creationist guy knows enough to state the question, but he seems to be saying that one can't prove God does not exist, which requires proving a negative, without knowing "everything", which would allow one to know that "everything" doesn't include God. Mr. Creationist conflates evasion and stopping the debate with with "winning". In his halting, unsophisticated nattering, he is, indeed, completely outflanked by Atheist Kid. The whole mess proves only that Mr. Creationist is full of sh*t, and that Atheist Kid is smarter and more articulate than he.


Which proves a very important thing, which I just recently learned:

If you have faith, then you WILL be compared to the most ignorant, unwisest people that anyone on the web knows.

If you have religous beliefs, you're automatically a terrorist.

So sayeth Fark.

That is all (that college freshmen have to say)
 
2012-11-22 02:14:04 AM

Yogimus: strobe: Time is cubed

would be awesome if he was right.


You worship Satanic impostor guised by educators as 1 god.

Opposite Creation dooms human singularity. There's no human entity, only corner Cubics,
rotating life's 4 corner stage metamorphosis.
 
2012-11-22 02:14:10 AM

eraser8: gremlin1: I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.

Why?

Serious question, by the way.

I asked a similar question earlier in the day...and, just as I said then, I'm not asking to argue with you or demean your beliefs. I just want to understand.


Because reasoning minds generated from an ancient, massive universe capable of producing self replicating chemical compounds are much better geared to explore the creation, and by doing such, seek out the Creator.

Unthinking automatons created from mud by magic will more than likely be lost looking for an invisible sky wizard.
 
2012-11-22 02:14:36 AM

Lionel Mandrake: So, basically:


Yeah, but change "believe" to "know" and assert admission of fallibility is a weakness.

Decados: Pocket Ninja: Mike_LowELL: I guess I must be watching a different video than you guys. I just saw an intelligent, mature adult destroy a whiny kid in a debate. In other words, a Republican exchanged ideas with a Democrat. Lol.


See, vocalized pauses are like a clinch in boxing...it's what a defeated opponent does to buy himself time. I've often thought about studying linguistics, and that's a fact of the science.
.

Can't even begin to tell you how wrong you are about that. I would I mean, but you wouldn't buy it. Please though... quote a few 'sources' which back up your 'fact'.


You must be new here. Pocket Ninja is one of the greatest among us, we are all better when he deigns to post.
 
2012-11-22 02:15:32 AM

HortusMatris: My reaction to creationist douchebag logic:
[www.startrek.com image 320x320]

 
2012-11-22 02:16:17 AM
indeed. pocket ninja is our god. go find your own!
 
2012-11-22 02:16:17 AM
Even more awkward will be when the little shiat descends to hell to burn in agony for all eternity.
 
2012-11-22 02:17:20 AM

eraser8: There's also a term for those who think the whole argument is pointless and isn't worth discussing...but, it eludes me at the moment (too many beers).


Apatheism. It's called apatheism.
 
2012-11-22 02:17:36 AM

SevenizGud: Even more awkward will be when the little shiat descends to hell to burn in agony for all eternity.


But enough about the creationist.
 
2012-11-22 02:19:22 AM
www.global-air.com

Deeply religious individuals may find this material offensive or disturbing. (new window)
 
2012-11-22 02:19:41 AM
Yawn
Humans will be humans
 
2012-11-22 02:19:46 AM

gremlin1: These things drive me crazy. I am not an atheist but I agree with their right to not believe in God.
However I believe in God (not organized religion)and have no trouble believing in science. I find the idea of a 9000 year old Earth ridiculous and I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.


No offense intended, but when you just make up your own god you should have no problem making it fit with scientific evidence.

All you've done is find that you can't figure out an answer to how something could come from nothing or how something could have always been around (the universe, and you've picked the former- something from nothing via a big bang) and said 'aha, must be magic' and then personified that magic.

I think I understand your form of god less than I do the followers of any particular religion. They believe what they were told and accept it: they even have stories that, when believed, provide evidence and history of a god of one type or another. You just magicked up your own personal sky wizard.
 
2012-11-22 02:20:21 AM

Rent Party: When he reached #4, you should have referred him back to #1, and then went and got some White Castle while he tried to figure it out.


No no no, you misunderstand. I admitted that I might be mistaken about what I perceive, he admits no such thing, since he knows that god exists, so there is no such failing for him. Since he knows god exists, and he can't be wrong about that (since he won't admit it), then it proves that god must exist.

/my screams of frustration and the sound of my brain grinding to a halt was heard throughout the dorm.
//with that, sleep. I'll try and catch up in the morning.
 
2012-11-22 02:21:07 AM

Rent Party: eraser8: gremlin1: I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.

Why?

Serious question, by the way.

I asked a similar question earlier in the day...and, just as I said then, I'm not asking to argue with you or demean your beliefs. I just want to understand.

Because reasoning minds generated from an ancient, massive universe capable of producing self replicating chemical compounds are much better geared to explore the creation, and by doing such, seek out the Creator.

Unthinking automatons created from mud by magic will more than likely be lost looking for an invisible sky wizard.


Thanks for the response, but it doesn't really answer my question.

Perhaps I should have fleshed it out a little more. So, here goes:

If the big bang occurred and life emerged and persisted and evolved in the way science has revealed to us, why is there a need for a god at all? Isn't the addition of a god needlessly complicating the explanation of our existence? In other words, science has shown that a god is unnecessary for our existence...so, why insert a superfluous agent into the mix?
 
2012-11-22 02:21:21 AM

nmrsnr: Rent Party: When he reached #4, you should have referred him back to #1, and then went and got some White Castle while he tried to figure it out.

No no no, you misunderstand. I admitted that I might be mistaken about what I perceive, he admits no such thing, since he knows that god exists, so there is no such failing for him. Since he knows god exists, and he can't be wrong about that (since he won't admit it), then it proves that god must exist.

/my screams of frustration and the sound of my brain grinding to a halt was heard throughout the dorm.
//with that, sleep. I'll try and catch up in the morning.


Ah I see.

Why do you even talk to people like that?

/ 0 Tolerance for morons...
 
2012-11-22 02:21:40 AM
Oh, and a two year old repeating "why" could have beaten this schmuck.
 
2012-11-22 02:21:53 AM

SevenizGud: Even more awkward will be when the little shiat descends to hell to burn in agony for all eternity.


That's what always made God so unappealing to me... only a total penis would give mankind the gift of free will, then punish us for all eternity for not using it exactly how he wants us to. That's just a cruel joke and it makes me think that the Christian god is a total shiathead for setting us all up for failure.

/Also, I'm pretty sure its cheating if your rule book is totally unclear
//Slashies
 
2012-11-22 02:21:56 AM
gremlin1: These things drive me crazy. I am not an atheist but I agree with their right to not believe in God.
However I believe in God (not organized religion)and have no trouble believing in science. I find the idea of a 9000 year old Earth ridiculous and I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.


One common argument I always see is that the universe is too complicated to have occurred via chance, so something must have created it.

Why does the Big Bang need someone to "set it off", why couldn't the universe exist on its own without requiring a creator?

If complexity is the reason, then wouldn't that same complexity apply to a deity? (IE, God is too complicated to have occurred via chance, so something must have created it.).

And that just results in a logical loop (if God is complicated, then whatever created god must also be complicated, and thus must also require a creator, and so on and so on).

Whereas, the universe just existing, without requiring any sort of creator, is much more logical to me.

// in short, it's turtles all the way down
 
2012-11-22 02:21:58 AM

nmrsnr: my brain grinding to a halt


I'm glad I'm not the only one this happens to.
 
2012-11-22 02:22:59 AM

gremlin1: These things drive me crazy. I am not an atheist but I agree with their right to not believe in God.
However I believe in God (not organized religion)and have no trouble believing in science. I find the idea of a 9000 year old Earth ridiculous and I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.


The universe is complicated enough to begin with, why complicate it further with having not only to create everything in it, but first creating an omnipotent being to create everything else? Having a god makes the universe much more complicated, not less.
 
2012-11-22 02:23:06 AM

Ed Finnerty: If God doesn't exist, who is making me type this?


Not a soul except you.

But of course, I'm crazy enough to believe that God created us because He got sick of being surrounded by yes-men that He created and imbued with conscience but no free will, so....

....

Us.
 
2012-11-22 02:23:13 AM

propasaurus: That creationist guy = Eric Hovind.

Eric Hovind is the son of convicted tax-dodger and creationist wingnut Kent Hovind. Since his father's imprisonment, Eric has taken over the running of his ministries. Despite having a slightly less annoying voice he's every bit as insane. He also shares his father's penchant for money-grabbing, but apparently not his stamina. Instead of Kent's rambling seminars, Eric treats you to 60-second-spots adorned with lavish CGI effects at the low, low price of only $9.95 per episode. [2] Hey, someone's got to pay off all those tax debts. Recently Hovind has decided to spread the Word to the atheistic liberal masses on YouTube, dispensing free nuggets of wisdom through his Creation Today series.


Mr. Eric Hovind is also the winner of the 2012 Golden Crocoduck award, following his father's win of the first incarnation of the award in 2008.
 
2012-11-22 02:23:36 AM
Dude could have handled it much better that is for sure... "chad, you ask a very good question...thank you for asking it in this forum. How do I know God exists, well that is easy, you and I are both here tonight to debate, how do you think we got here?" btw Chad, I am a Catholic, so I do not believe creationism and evolution are mutually exclusive, so can you explain to me how things began? Are we to believe that two pieces of dust were farking when lightning struck?

Basically Chad, I could be wrong, but creationism got things going and evolution took over..

btw Chad, before you dismiss my first argument, maybe you could think about why it is that almost every society known to man has given homage to a higher being.. Could the appreciation of "GOD" be built into our DNA much like survival and procreation?
 
2012-11-22 02:24:01 AM

eraser8: gremlin1: I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.

Why?

Serious question, by the way.

I asked a similar question earlier in the day...and, just as I said then, I'm not asking to argue with you or demean your beliefs. I just want to understand.


Because God is a drunken hillbilly. What everyone fails to realize is that God got drunk one day and said to Cthulhu "Hold my beer and watch this!" as he proceeded to ignite a fart causing the big bang.
 
2012-11-22 02:24:21 AM
mamoru
nmrsnr:
I leave it as an exercise for the reader to find the logical flaws in that argument.

Yay, fun. :D
These are the two most obvious ones.


Actually, the most obvious flaw besides my brain shutting down while trying to follow that argument:
3) On the other hand, were there a perfect being..
"Assuming what I want to prove is already proven.."
 
2012-11-22 02:25:24 AM

eraser8: In other words, science has shown that a god is unnecessary for our existence


Science hasn't though (and correct me if I'm wrong on that one). We don't have an explanation for how something could come from nothing, nor can we fathom how something could have always been.
 
2012-11-22 02:25:36 AM

gremlin1: These things drive me crazy. I am not an atheist but I agree with their right to not believe in God.
However I believe in God (not organized religion)and have no trouble believing in science. I find the idea of a 9000 year old Earth ridiculous and I believe God set off the Big Bang and then sat back to see how it goes.


This is kinda where I am. I believe that "god" is like me setting off a batch of sea monkeys and just treating our existence like a trivial almost pet.
 
2012-11-22 02:25:51 AM

Dimensio: Golden Crocoduck award


I just discovered those videos recently and am now a huge fan.
 
2012-11-22 02:25:56 AM

nmrsnr: Benevolent Misanthrope: What the god-pushing f*ckwit was trying to express is a fundamentally held belief among Christians who have examined their faith: You cannot prove god, but you cannot know anything unless it is revealed to you by god. Even if you
don't acknowledge god's existence, god exists because if he didn't you wouldn't be sentient.

Circular reasoning at its best. And this guy can't even express his own flawed reasoning. Probably because he's perfectly content living an unexamined life.

I heard it a little differently, but that may be because of an actual conversation I had with my uber-religious freshman year roommate. His argument (and the one I think that was attempted here) is this:

1) You admit that you may be wrong about what you perceive (any scientist worth their salt will admit as much, like the child's father).
2) Since you admit that you cannot, with 100% certainty, claim absolute knowledge of the Universe, you admit that it is possible that god exists.
3) On the other hand, were there a perfect being with perfect knowledge, and he revealed it to you, you wouldn't have any uncertainty about the universe, since the perfect being revealed knowledge to you. (This is the guy in the video's 2+2=4 analogy)
4) Since the Bible is the revealed word of the perfect being that is god, I have no uncertainty about god's existence.
5) Since I have no uncertainty, that proves that the revelation came from god. While your uncertainty allows for god to exist, my certainty does not allow for god to not exist, therefore god must exist, because I am certain of his existence. QED

I leave it as an exercise for the reader to find the logical flaws in that argument (I couldn't get my roommate to see them, though).


Your roommate is not the only arrogant theist who confuses certainty of an unsubstantiated claim with correctness. Sye Ten Bruggencate believes that he has invented this particular method of apologetics.
 
2012-11-22 02:26:14 AM

Pocket Ninja: Mike_LowELL: I guess I must be watching a different video than you guys. I just saw an intelligent, mature adult destroy a whiny kid in a debate. In other words, a Republican exchanged ideas with a Democrat. Lol.

I'll say. And since we all know how much of a fan the Left is now that "math" (since Saint Clinton invoked it at their convention) and "statistics" (since the Mainstream Media has annointed Saint Nate Silver as the Holy Crusader of Liberalism), here's a test they can do to see it for themselves.

1) Watch the video with pen and paper in hand.
2) Mark each time the little boy says "um" or "uh" or some other vocalized pause and each time the man does.
3) Tally up the scores and weep.

See, vocalized pauses are like a clinch in boxing...it's what a defeated opponent does to buy himself time. I've often thought about studying linguistics, and that's a fact of the science. And here's another fact: the higher pitched someone's voice gets in an argument, they more they know they're losing. Listen the video again, and now listen to their voice tones. Tell me who sounds like the frantic, defeated loser.

This is how criminals are caught, people.


The Mike LowELL/ Pocket Ninja singularity.
 
2012-11-22 02:26:18 AM

reklamfox: only a total penis would give mankind the gift of free will, then punish us for all eternity for not using it exactly how he wants us to


Freewill? What's that? There is no free will.
 
2012-11-22 02:26:48 AM

eraser8:
Perhaps I should have fleshed it out a little more. So, here goes:

If the big bang occurred and life emerged and persisted and evolved in the way science has revealed to us, why is there a need for a god at all?


To tell why it's so awe inspiringly (is that a word?) beautiful. To tell us why we love our mothers and remember fondly grandma even though she's been dead for 30 years.


Isn't the addition of a god needlessly complicating the explanation of our existence? In other words, science has shown that a god is unnecessary for our existence...so, why insert a superfluous agent into the mix?


That depends. If you consider your existence to be a grand extension of a complex chemical reaction, then God is an unnecessary complication. You are will return your mass and energy to the system and thermodynamics works. If you believe that we are greater than the sum of our parts, then God is a necessary factor in the equation.

I believe the latter. It does not make the former untrue.
 
2012-11-22 02:26:54 AM
I guess I'm agnostic because the realistic side of me sees no evidence of a god (at least in the sense that a mainstream religion would like me to). Still, I'd be willing to accept a higher power, should one poke its head into reality in an indisputible fashion. Unlikely.

Anyway, as much as I prefer logic over faith, it's still obvious to me that these people will not change their minds under any circumstances. Religious belief has the home-field advantage of not having to rely upon logic, which is why it's not even worth trying to have a logical debate to convince them otherwise. Not that I'd even want to. It's only an issue for me when it's shoved down my throat.

I could easily segue this into politics now, but I'll just leave it at that.
 
2012-11-22 02:27:04 AM

strobe: Time is cubed


When the Sun shines upon Earth, 2 - major Time points are created on opposite sides of Earth - known as Midday and Midnight. Where the 2 major Time forces join, synergy creates 2 new minor Time points we recognize as Sunup and Sundown. The 4-equidistant Time points can be considered as Time Square imprinted upon the circle of Earth. In a single rotation of the Earth sphere, each Time corner point rotates through the other 3-corner Time points, thus creating 16 corners, 96 hours and 4-simultaneous 24 hour Days within a single rotation of Earth - equated to a Higher Order of Life Time Cube.
 
2012-11-22 02:27:32 AM

log_jammin: Ambivalence: How come agnostics are never represented in these debates. I have some pretty good arguments why the entire question of whether God exists or doesn't farking matter.

because the atheists would spend all of their time telling the agnostic that he's really an atheist and he's just afraid to admit it.

The creationist would spend all of their time telling the agnostic that he's really a christian and he's just afraid to admit it.

the agnostic would spend all of their time rolling their eyes.


No, an atheist would spend all of their time telling the agnostic that he's really an atheist because the "agnostic" doesn't understand the meaning of words. Being agnostic means believing one cannot have knowledge of something. Just about all atheists are agnostic, including someone who says it doesn't matter whether a god exists. One CAN be a gnostic atheist, which means they KNOW god doesn't exist, but I have never run into someone who says they know for a fact a god does not exist.

In short, people who consider being agnostic a separate "faction" really only want to feel superior to others while looking foolish for not understanding things on both a semantic or philosophical level.
 
2012-11-22 02:28:07 AM
The kid should have pointed out that he believes that '2+2=4' because it can be proven ... not because some delusional douch-bag says it is so.

/but he's just a kid ... adapting to an opponent's argument is a bit advanced for an 11 year old.
 
2012-11-22 02:28:16 AM
I am shocked nobody has brought up Descartes. This Hovind guy seems to have read Descartes, and then promptly forgotten what he meant, but remembered certain terms (God, certainty, mathematics), and tried to string them together by waving his arms.

Painful viewing.
 
2012-11-22 02:28:45 AM

MisterLoki: The Mike LowELL/ Pocket Ninja singularity.


Well, that does it, the universe just reversed directions and is now pulling inwards. I WAS right,
oscillating universe 1, big bang 0.
 
Displayed 50 of 628 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report