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(BBC)   Olam responds to Muddy Waters claims about debt levels, being a mannish boy   (bbc.co.uk) divider line 14
    More: Obvious, Muddy Waters, Olam International, accounting practice, debt levels  
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627 clicks; posted to Business » on 20 Nov 2012 at 12:16 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-20 12:31:51 PM
In a statement, Muddy Waters said he can't be satisfied with the company's financials and urged investors to stay away from the stock reminding them they can't lose what they never had
 
2012-11-20 01:10:22 PM
Why is this not illegal? The firm just announces that they are shorting a company, and without any basis everyone runs from the stock, fulfilling the aims of the short-sellers? Shouldn't there be a wall between firms that publicly evaluate businesses and those that short their stocks?
 
2012-11-20 01:48:41 PM

Magorn: In a statement, Muddy Waters said he can't be satisfied with the company's financials and urged investors to stay away from the stock reminding them they can't lose what they never had


Oh, sure, they'll be Standing Around Crying as their stock goes Rollin' And Tumblin' down in value. I'd love to have listened on that Long Distance Call where he explained that they are Still A Fool.
 
2012-11-20 02:19:55 PM

deadsanta: Why is this not illegal? The firm just announces that they are shorting a company, and without any basis everyone runs from the stock, fulfilling the aims of the short-sellers? Shouldn't there be a wall between firms that publicly evaluate businesses and those that short their stocks?


muddy waters has a reputation of being accurate, that's why their calls are taken seriously.

as long as they disclose their long/short position of the company they're evaluting, it's legal. it allows the people that read their report take into consideration the research company's bias.
 
2012-11-20 03:09:08 PM
Asked if another mule was kicking in his stall, Muddy Waters had no comment.
 
2012-11-20 04:16:52 PM

dittybopper: Magorn: In a statement, Muddy Waters said he can't be satisfied with the company's financials and urged investors to stay away from the stock reminding them they can't lose what they never had

Oh, sure, they'll be Standing Around Crying as their stock goes Rollin' And Tumblin' down in value. I'd love to have listened on that Long Distance Call where he explained that they are Still A Fool.


(applause.gif)
 
2012-11-20 04:55:27 PM

not5am: deadsanta: Why is this not illegal? The firm just announces that they are shorting a company, and without any basis everyone runs from the stock, fulfilling the aims of the short-sellers? Shouldn't there be a wall between firms that publicly evaluate businesses and those that short their stocks?

muddy waters has a reputation of being accurate, that's why their calls are taken seriously.

as long as they disclose their long/short position of the company they're evaluting, it's legal. it allows the people that read their report take into consideration the research company's bias.


Yet it still has the effect of creating an outcome. Isn't this why The Motley Fool got shut down? They were pretty accurate as well. The problem is that even if most folks think the report is baseless it will still devalue the stock due to the herd effect.
 
2012-11-20 05:59:32 PM

caddisfly:
Yet it still has the effect of creating an outcome. Isn't this why The Motley Fool got shut down? They were pretty accurate as well. The problem is that even if most folks think the report is baseless it will still devalue the stock due to the herd effect.


are you referring to this?

unfortunately, as long as they disclose their financial interest in the company on the research report, they're not doing anything illegal. the idea/intention is that people reading the report are informed/experienced investors and would be able to weigh the research company's financial interests to their report.

in the case of Olam, i wouldn't be surprised if there are issues with their numbers. there's a number of cases of southeast asia companies cooking their books to increase their evaluation. here's an article about chinese companies getting listing on the nyse by a reverse merger with an already listed us company and by-passing the listing requirements. alot of research companies rarely go the extra step of double checking a company's financial reports and just accept what's released.
 
2012-11-20 07:26:45 PM

not5am: caddisfly:
Yet it still has the effect of creating an outcome. Isn't this why The Motley Fool got shut down? They were pretty accurate as well. The problem is that even if most folks think the report is baseless it will still devalue the stock due to the herd effect.

are you referring to this?

unfortunately, as long as they disclose their financial interest in the company on the research report, they're not doing anything illegal. the idea/intention is that people reading the report are informed/experienced investors and would be able to weigh the research company's financial interests to their report.

in the case of Olam, i wouldn't be surprised if there are issues with their numbers. there's a number of cases of southeast asia companies cooking their books to increase their evaluation. here's an article about chinese companies getting listing on the nyse by a reverse merger with an already listed us company and by-passing the listing requirements. alot of research companies rarely go the extra step of double checking a company's financial reports and just accept what's released.


No shiat. If they are going to emerge from this intact, they'd better get their mojo working.
 
2012-11-20 09:10:27 PM

deadsanta: Why is this not illegal? The firm just announces that they are shorting a company, and without any basis everyone runs from the stock, fulfilling the aims of the short-sellers? Shouldn't there be a wall between firms that publicly evaluate businesses and those that short their stocks?


Why not just do away with short sales all together? It's not like any of this crap has anything to do with the well being of business in general and the company in particular.
 
2012-11-21 02:30:19 AM

dofus: deadsanta: Why is this not illegal? The firm just announces that they are shorting a company, and without any basis everyone runs from the stock, fulfilling the aims of the short-sellers? Shouldn't there be a wall between firms that publicly evaluate businesses and those that short their stocks?

Why not just do away with short sales all together? It's not like any of this crap has anything to do with the well being of business in general and the company in particular.


^Heresy!! Stone them both!
 
2012-11-21 07:20:49 AM

MadMonk: Asked if another mule was kicking in his stall, Muddy Waters had no comment.


That was Otis Spann, not Muddy. And this company should be blown up for using MM's name - it's farking criminal. And I may be getting old, but I got young fashioned ways and if a good woman kills me man, come on and dig my grave.
 
2012-11-21 07:47:40 AM

MartinD-35: MadMonk: Asked if another mule was kicking in his stall, Muddy Waters had no comment.

That was Otis Spann, not Muddy. And this company should be blown up for using MM's name - it's farking criminal. And I may be getting old, but I got young fashioned ways and if a good woman kills me man, come on and dig my grave.


All blues singers, have used "another mule is kicking in you stall". Howlin' Wolf says it in the song Evil which was actually written by Willie Dixon. I wouldn't be surprised if Robert Johnson himself first coined the phrase.

I have a Muddy Waters album at the end of it there's a pretty funny part about him not wanting to go out side because every time he does he hears.

Hey Muddy Waters.
I said, Hey Muddy Waters.
I hear you got another mule kicking in your stall.
 
2012-11-21 04:44:18 PM
Muddy Waters is working FCMN as well.
 
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