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(Topless Robot)   The five most depressing issues of Marvel Comic's speculative series "What If...?"   (toplessrobot.com) divider line 114
    More: Sad, Mayor of New York, tranquilizer gun, abducted by aliens, Matt Murdock, World Series, Punisher, Frank Castle  
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12384 clicks; posted to Geek » on 19 Nov 2012 at 1:29 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-19 10:24:28 AM
I had a lot of those in the 70s.

Then the main Marvel continuity just went ahead and made them mainstream stories.

"What if Phoenix had Lived?"

ha.
 
2012-11-19 10:28:51 AM
Is 'What if the Invisible Woman Had Died' included?
 
2012-11-19 11:09:02 AM
atlanticjaxx.files.wordpress.com

/Depressing that it never happened in real life.
 
2012-11-19 01:20:16 PM
I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.
 
2012-11-19 01:21:05 PM
Came here for Rick James as The Hulk.

Super-freaky, ow!
 
2012-11-19 01:28:56 PM

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


What If (second series) #105... the first appearance of Spider-Girl.

No one died (even though Normie Osborne went crazy and was locked up), and it served as the springboard for the extremely positive and fun MC2 Universe.
 
2012-11-19 01:32:03 PM
Was not one of the more "depressing" stories of the "What-if" series the story that featured Peter Parker entirely abandoning his creed of "with great power comes great responsibility" by rejecting any responsibility for a fatal injury caused to his Aunt may that was a consequence of him revealing his secret identity, and instead making a deal with Mephisto to erase his entire marital history with Mary Jane?
 
2012-11-19 01:34:48 PM

Dimensio: Was not one of the more "depressing" stories of the "What-if" series the story that featured Peter Parker entirely abandoning his creed of "with great power comes great responsibility" by rejecting any responsibility for a fatal injury caused to his Aunt may that was a consequence of him revealing his secret identity, and instead making a deal with Mephisto to erase his entire marital history with Mary Jane?


No, that was Joe Quesada dropping trou and taking a massive, steaming shiat on Spider-Man.

/for an encore, he flung his steaming feces at Spider-Girl, canceling the long-running, lower-selling, yet profitable fan favorite book so his pet sassy Latina character could have the name. Naturally, the new Spider-Girl's book lasted all of 8 issues.
 
2012-11-19 01:35:01 PM
Sorry, but THIS was the most depressing Marvel what if story of all time:

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-11-19 01:35:14 PM
So... The Punisher can kill spider-man now?

I know it's just a "what if", but if you're going to make it ridiculous, then what's the point?
 
2012-11-19 01:38:32 PM
Why didn't Franklin help his father? Like, at all? Franklin is basically God of the Marvel Universe...
 
2012-11-19 01:39:30 PM

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


I always joked that the full title was "What if the worse possible out come happened"
 
2012-11-19 01:43:11 PM
The place where Logan kills Weapon X in the "What if...Wolverine fought Weapon X?" is by my house.
 
2012-11-19 01:43:21 PM
Nope. It's this one.


4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-11-19 01:44:04 PM

sure haven't: So... The Punisher can kill spider-man now?

I know it's just a "what if", but if you're going to make it ridiculous, then what's the point?


Spider-Man may have a lot of powers, but he's not invulnerable. A gunshot can take him out, just like anybody else; you just have to be a lot luckier to actually hit him.
 
2012-11-19 01:50:11 PM

Mad_Radhu: Sorry, but THIS was the most depressing Marvel what if story of all time:

[upload.wikimedia.org image 250x388]


Jesus, that's a depressing read. Then there's this, where Peter has his entire life pretty much destroyed and finds nothing to fight for:

images1.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2012-11-19 02:00:01 PM
Glad to see What If The Punisher Killed Daredevil on there. I used to have What If on my pull list, and that was, by far, the bleakest one they had made (losing Atlantis Attacks was pretty bad, too). I still remember the panel when an enraged Spider-Man beats the living shiat out of Punisher, while Punisher was thinking to himself "he's been holding back this entire time."

/that alone made Spidey pretty cool for a month or two
 
2012-11-19 02:01:16 PM
What If the X-Men Lost Inferno (volume 2, #6)

Wolverine eats a baby.

/nuff said
 
2012-11-19 02:12:24 PM
Although, really, "What If ...?" has nothing on the festering pile of sh*t known as "Ultimatum," in the "brutally killing off well liked characters" department.
 
2012-11-19 02:16:20 PM
The Avengers respond to the situation and things go badly. With very little effort, Galactus subdues each team member without taking a scratch. When Iron Man is teleported to the World Ship to steal the Ultimate Nullifier, he sets off a metal-sensitive alarm (which the Human Torch didn't trigger)...

Damn, son, you best wipe that off after pulling it out of your ass.
 
2012-11-19 02:19:25 PM
Got nothin' on Tangled Web, which tells the tale of Crusher Hogan, the time Rhino got smart, what happened to a bully that knew how spidey got his powers and tried to emulate him, Norman chatting with other villains and seeing how pitiful the Vulture is, what happens to loyal minions of Kingpin every time Spidey succeeds.
 
2012-11-19 02:28:22 PM

The Martian Manhandler: Nope. It's this one.


[4.bp.blogspot.com image 400x302]


I agree. The Beast/Thing continued transformation issue was the most depressing. Who doesn't like Beast? The other ones were over the top tragic in their "what ifs". That issue is heart wrenching.

/comicbooknerd
 
2012-11-19 02:28:29 PM
Always loved the What If's.

I think my favorite one is a Punisher book, even though I really dislike him as a character. Punisher inherits the symbiote suit and goes on a massive criminal killing spree. Turns out, Frank is one of the few people whose own hate and drive can keep the symbiote in check. It's a pretty cool issue.
 
2012-11-19 02:29:00 PM
WHAT IF PUNISHER WIPED OUT THE MARVEL UNIVERSE!?!

I think this was a "What If" comic and is easily the most depressing "what if". Frank Castle is NY Police Officer whose family gets killed during a fight between the Xmen, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and the Skrulls. Frank flips and kills Cyclops, Jubilee, and a bunch of other heroes. Frank is captured and sent to prison to be executed only he doesn't arrive. A rich guy paid off the guards to deliver Frank to him. The rich guy explains to Frank that he and bunch of other innocents were hurt or lost someone due to superheroes and they want vengeance. They agree to outfit and finance Frank if he becomes the Punisher.

Frank becomes the Punisher and kills Spiderman first, then hits Hulk with a tracking dart and finds an unconscious Banner and kills him. He then takes on Doc Doom and kills him with a sledgehammer. Punisher then uses Doom's weapons to go after other heroes. He convinces the Xmen, Avengers, various other superheroes, Magneto, Apocalpyse, and the Mutant Brotherhood to meet on the moon to fight only to find out that the Punisher had rigged some nukes to kill them. The Punisher kills Wolverine by pushing him into some electrical power boxes and kills Capt. America in single combat. Punisher kills almost everyone but still his vengeance is not sated.

I thought it was a great comic and kind of depressing. With all the superhero/villian fights that there have been surely some innocents were killed accidently by the heroes. And some people would get upset about this...then I read Garth Ennis's "The Boys" and....yeah...brutal but good!
 
2012-11-19 02:31:14 PM
(Movie version, X-Men 4:) What If...Cyclops wasn't such a raging pussy?

Also, they never did a "What if Speedball never got duped into causing the explosion that set off the Civil War? He never becomes Penance (in what is the saddest page of a comic book I've ever read), and...?

// thinly-read on my comics
// pretty good grasp of characters/origins, though
 
2012-11-19 02:31:19 PM
media.comicvine.com

/bleak
//"Hulk will kill you ALL!"
 
2012-11-19 02:32:49 PM

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


It always smacked a LITTLE bit of ego as they were basically saying "Unless things turned out EXACTLY like they actually did, EVERYthing would go COMPLETELY to shiat!!"

Fano: Got nothin' on Tangled Web, which tells the tale of Crusher Hogan, the time Rhino got smart, what happened to a bully that knew how spidey got his powers and tried to emulate him, Norman chatting with other villains and seeing how pitiful the Vulture is, what happens to loyal minions of Kingpin every time Spidey succeeds.


Hogan and Rhino's stories started out depressing, but found a nice middle-ground for a happy ending. And that Osborn one remains my absolute favorite from the series.
 
2012-11-19 02:36:31 PM
I liked "What if Hulk had Killed Wolverine?"
 
2012-11-19 02:37:34 PM

The Martian Manhandler: Nope. It's this one.


[4.bp.blogspot.com image 400x302]


OMG, which one is that?

As depressing as some of the What If...? issues were, some of the Elseworlds were goddamn soul-shattering. I remember one w/The Flash when some psycho scientist was trying to clone him but kept getting it wrong. He leads Flash to a corridor of glass rooms, each containing a boy--young Flash clones. One clone was completely paralyzed but had a mind thousands of times sharper and faster than Stephen Hawking but no way to move or communicate. Another couldn't stop vibrating and was slowly killing himself because his internal organs were liquefying. One looked like a manta ray. Can't remember the issue or much about the plot but I remember how these poor kids were just trapped in these horrible lives.
 
2012-11-19 02:39:52 PM

Dr Dreidel: (Movie version, X-Men 4:) What If...Cyclops wasn't such a raging pussy?

Also, they never did a "What if Speedball never got duped into causing the explosion that set off the Civil War? He never becomes Penance (in what is the saddest page of a comic book I've ever read), and...?

// thinly-read on my comics
// pretty good grasp of characters/origins, though


Pretty sure they did a couple Civil War issues. Can't remember that one specifically though.
 
2012-11-19 02:40:51 PM

Empty Matchbook: kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.

It always smacked a LITTLE bit of ego as they were basically saying "Unless things turned out EXACTLY like they actually did, EVERYthing would go COMPLETELY to shiat!!"

Fano: Got nothin' on Tangled Web, which tells the tale of Crusher Hogan, the time Rhino got smart, what happened to a bully that knew how spidey got his powers and tried to emulate him, Norman chatting with other villains and seeing how pitiful the Vulture is, what happens to loyal minions of Kingpin every time Spidey succeeds.

Hogan and Rhino's stories started out depressing, but found a nice middle-ground for a happy ending. And that Osborn one remains my absolute favorite from the series.


Osborne's expression as he delivers the line "it was a BLAST!" is magnificent. Tangled Web was an excellent series. The Last Shoot was a marvelous addition to Spider-man mythology.
 
2012-11-19 02:41:20 PM
where are :

FANO
MUGATO
BRONIES

THIS IS YOUR THREAD!
 
2012-11-19 02:42:26 PM
My favorite was "What if the Marvel Super Heroes had lost Atlantis Attacks?" Vol.2 #25 (May, 1991)

From the wiki: The issue is a very downbeat tale, where all of Earth's heroes are massacred by Set and his brainwashed brides, who Set impregnates with his evil spawn. Only Silver Surfer and Quasar survive, and with the help of Thor (who is horribly burned and placed in stasis to keep him alive), destroy two of Set's heads before Quasar, backed by the power of Captain Universe, sacrifices his life to exile himself and Set inside Doctor Strange's Eye of Agamotto. Silver Surfer gives the Eye to the Watcher for safe keeping, as Set's children are born; they then consume their brainwashed mothers and countless mindless serpent men and women before leaving to terrorize alternate universes in the name of their evil father..... 

Another one is What if Wolverine was lord of the vampires?, Vol.2 #24
 
2012-11-19 02:43:18 PM

texdent: Is 'What if the Invisible Woman Had Died' included?


No, it isn't. It really should be on there though. I enjoyed that one quite a bit. The ending was very well executed.
 
2012-11-19 02:44:05 PM

Haliburton Cummings: where are :

FANO
MUGATO
BRONIES

THIS IS YOUR THREAD!


Already posted multiple times, Mr. Scameron.
 
2012-11-19 02:44:49 PM

Mad_Radhu: Sorry, but THIS was the most depressing Marvel what if story of all time:

[upload.wikimedia.org image 250x388]


I loved that story, especially as a companion to Marvels. But my favorite actual "What If.." is:

clzimages.com

Particularly because Professor X was the new Iron Man and the Venom suit had devoured all but Peter's skeleton.

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


www.samruby.com
 
2012-11-19 02:51:35 PM
Best What The--?!:

images.wikia.com
 
2012-11-19 03:01:19 PM
This was better than the cracked article I expected. It's interesting to see how tragic the what if series was.
 
2012-11-19 03:01:35 PM
I liked this one...scary stuff for a 12-year old during the Cold War. Funny how its one of those things that is applicable all over again today.

2.bp.blogspot.com
 
JRB
2012-11-19 03:03:17 PM

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


[Can't visit the list because it's blocked. So I can't tell if this one is on there...]

Frank Miller wrote a twist on the worst alternative world perspective, too, way back in the day. It had the Watcher visiting Matt Murdock after Elektra died, when he was visiting her grave. He then narrates an alt universe where Elektra lived, and they actually live happily ever after because they just head off to a tropical paradise together. At the end of the narrative, Murdock is wordlessly crushed by this happiness he'll never know, and Watcher "consoles" him by saying, "...but in this universe, the city never lost its savior..."

Pretty brutal in a purely "Well, THANKS for that..." kinda way.
 
2012-11-19 03:07:02 PM
Spoiler Alert: Everybody dies.

That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.
 
2012-11-19 03:07:49 PM

Fano: Got nothin' on Tangled Web, which tells the tale of Crusher Hogan, the time Rhino got smart, what happened to a bully that knew how spidey got his powers and tried to emulate him, Norman chatting with other villains and seeing how pitiful the Vulture is, what happens to loyal minions of Kingpin every time Spidey succeeds.


Fun fact: The Crusher Hogan story was written by former ECW champion Raven.
 
2012-11-19 03:14:00 PM
Stupid article references Elseworlds from DC like it's the progenitor comic. What-If predates it by over a decade. And has had more issues, and prints
 
2012-11-19 03:21:56 PM

Max Awesome: That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.


That's true of pretty much everyone, not just "heroes".
No one is a killer until they are.
And what does it take to make you one? A "slight change in events", that's all.
 
2012-11-19 03:23:34 PM

ds615: Max Awesome: That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.

That's true of pretty much everyone, not just "heroes".
No one is a killer until they are.
And what does it take to make you one? A "slight change in events", that's all.


Jim Gordon says no.
 
2012-11-19 03:23:35 PM

ds615: Max Awesome: That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.

That's true of pretty much everyone, not just "heroes".
No one is a killer until they are.
And what does it take to make you one? A "slight change in events", that's all.


All it takes is "one bad day."

All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day.
 
2012-11-19 03:43:14 PM
24.media.tumblr.com

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.
 
2012-11-19 03:57:02 PM

Kangaroo_Ralph: [24.media.tumblr.com image 455x700]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.



Makes Wolverine his biatch too, if it's the one I'm thinking of.
 
2012-11-19 04:04:09 PM
It's a complete and utter FAIL without that "What if Phoenix had Lived" book. Wow, that one was Dark.
 
2012-11-19 04:08:31 PM
www.littlestuffedbull.com
www.littlestuffedbull.com
www.littlestuffedbull.com

/hot
 
2012-11-19 04:11:16 PM
there was a really cool What if...wolverine lived in the age of conan. first thing ol' snikt bub does when he arrives is kick red sonja's ass till she begs to be his cumdumpster. conan is transported to the 616 right at the climax of the dark phoenix saga.

badass
 
2012-11-19 04:12:28 PM
"The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-11-19 04:14:28 PM
being an old fart what always struck me about the what if series is that it was always the worst drawn comic on the rack.

/awful just awful
 
2012-11-19 04:21:37 PM

ds615: Max Awesome: That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.

That's true of pretty much everyone, not just "heroes".
No one is a killer until they are.
And what does it take to make you one? A "slight change in events", that's all.


I don't believe that. I have more faith in human nature and that a person's essential humanity can't be degraded by a few negative experiences.

I was always seriously disturbed by 'What If' - that the writers and editors at Marvel Comics had utterly no faith in the essential stability and decency of their superheroes. 

Isn't the whole point of being heroic the ability to wheather a storm and do the right thing even in the most trying of circumstances?
 
2012-11-19 04:25:19 PM

farbekrieg: being an old fart what always struck me about the what if series is that it was always the worst drawn comic on the rack.

/awful just awful


Probably had the worst regular sales as it played off the storylines of all the other marvel comics. It featured a different set of heroes every month, so maybe an x-men reader picked it up in march, a fantastic four reader in april. Dunno if it had a regular writer at any point, but I doubt it.
 
2012-11-19 04:39:15 PM

farbekrieg: being an old fart what always struck me about the what if series is that it was always the worst drawn comic on the rack.

/awful just awful


Well, you've got to let the hacks in the pit practice on something. But, almost every Marvel title goes to complete shiat starting with issue 13.
 
2012-11-19 04:47:15 PM
WHAT IF...

Comic books weren't so lame?
BA-ZING!


...Nah, come on. I'm just kiddin'!
 
2012-11-19 04:49:05 PM
My favorite, simply due to the irony, is 'what if Frank Castle's family doesn't die'. The answer? They die anyway, just not due to Mafia retaliation, and he becomes the Punisher regardless. Really stupid, but I got a kick out of reading it.

Also, there's a few 'what ifs' done to the Star Wars universe that're completely awesome... one involves Yoda hitting the Emperor with the entire farking Death Star.

/coming to see you, I am...
 
2012-11-19 04:52:18 PM

brigid_fitch: The Martian Manhandler: Nope. It's this one.


[4.bp.blogspot.com image 400x302]

OMG, which one is that?

As depressing as some of the What If...? issues were, some of the Elseworlds were goddamn soul-shattering. I remember one w/The Flash when some psycho scientist was trying to clone him but kept getting it wrong. He leads Flash to a corridor of glass rooms, each containing a boy--young Flash clones. One clone was completely paralyzed but had a mind thousands of times sharper and faster than Stephen Hawking but no way to move or communicate. Another couldn't stop vibrating and was slowly killing himself because his internal organs were liquefying. One looked like a manta ray. Can't remember the issue or much about the plot but I remember how these poor kids were just trapped in these horrible lives.


The most depressing Elseworlds was the one where Superman lands in Medieval England. Lord Luther rapes Lois to death on her wedding night. It ends with Luther and Superman killing each other.
 
2012-11-19 04:56:48 PM

23FPB23: I liked this one...scary stuff for a 12-year old during the Cold War. Funny how its one of those things that is applicable all over again today.

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 263x400]


Yeah... This is how he'd travel around Europe.

media.comicbookmovie.com
 
2012-11-19 05:05:52 PM
What If - the writer of this article was even aware of the original run of this title?
 
2012-11-19 05:25:48 PM

cefm: "The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 450x687]


See it on YouTube Link 
 
2012-11-19 05:31:43 PM

Kangaroo_Ralph: [24.media.tumblr.com image 455x700]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.


Become? I take it you didn't read the actual old-school pulps (the ones without pictures). That was a pretty big part of his character. Along with laziness, dirty fighting, general greed and, weirdly, superior intelligence on the level of Batman.

//Really fun character, sort of Superman but with no blatantly supernatural powers and more uncomfortable racial and nationalist themes.
 
2012-11-19 05:39:05 PM

Fano: Got nothin' on Tangled Web, which tells the tale of Crusher Hogan, the time Rhino got smart, what happened to a bully that knew how spidey got his powers and tried to emulate him, Norman chatting with other villains and seeing how pitiful the Vulture is, what happens to loyal minions of Kingpin every time Spidey succeeds.


That minion story ("Severance Package" was a fabulous piece of work; I forget who did the story but the art was by the great Eduardo Risso, who worked on 100 Bullets with Brian Azzarello and draws crime like almost no one else. (Checking Wiki, of COURSE the story was by Greg Rucka.)
 
2012-11-19 05:41:49 PM

23FPB23: I liked this one...scary stuff for a 12-year old during the Cold War. Funny how its one of those things that is applicable all over again today.

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 263x400]


that issue was f*cking outstanding. My personal favorite What If ever.
 
2012-11-19 05:46:27 PM

Drunken_Polar_Bear: What If the X-Men Lost Inferno (volume 2, #6)

Wolverine eats a baby.


Did he call it a "California burger" with all the trimmings?
 
2012-11-19 05:50:35 PM
What if Drew never started Fark?
 
2012-11-19 06:52:20 PM

brigid_fitch: The Martian Manhandler: Nope. It's this one.


[4.bp.blogspot.com image 400x302]

OMG, which one is that?

 

ecx.images-amazon.com
 
2012-11-19 06:56:13 PM

Raug the Dwarf: Always loved the What If's.

I think my favorite one is a Punisher book, even though I really dislike him as a character. Punisher inherits the symbiote suit and goes on a massive criminal killing spree. Turns out, Frank is one of the few people whose own hate and drive can keep the symbiote in check. It's a pretty cool issue.


me too. i consider What If? among the most under rated series of good books. they are for true fans that enjoy possibilities. on the plus side, since greedy collectors don't appreciate the excellence of the series one can put together the first run very economically. newer issues - all newer title issues - are just too expensive.
 
2012-11-19 07:04:19 PM

quiotu: My favorite, simply due to the irony, is 'what if Frank Castle's family doesn't die'. The answer? They die anyway, just not due to Mafia retaliation, and he becomes the Punisher regardless. Really stupid, but I got a kick out of reading it.


Now see that could be good if taken literally. Castle's family discover they're immortals and use their longevity to fight evil over the course of centuries until they're stuck with white-haired hulk from "the end." Frank dies a happy man, but centuries later, the Castles grow tired of each other's shiat and destroy the earth, floating around in space forever.
 
2012-11-19 07:20:50 PM

Kangaroo_Ralph: [What If? #43: ‶What If Conan the Barbarian were Stranded in the 20th Century?"]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.


That one had two stories, and was the only issue of the first run which consisted of sequels to previous What-If?s. The cover story was a sequel to What If? #13, ‶What If Conan the Barbarian Walked the Earth Today?". That one was a What If? of a What If?, because at the end of #13, Conan gets returned to his own time. The cover story of #43 shows What If he didn′t get back to his own time, by barely missing his chance to do so.

The second story has no title, and is a true continuation of its original story (What If? #23, ‶What If the Avengers had Become the Pawns of Korvac?"), not a What If? of a What If?. Both the original and this untitled sequel were written by the sadly late, great Mark Gruenwald.

It′s also a story that could′ve changed the entire future of the Marvel Comics Universe, had something happened in the real world. That something would be a sequel to this sequel, in a sense: ‶What If Kurt Busiek had Glanced at the Untitled Backup Story in What If? #32 (and, in Particular, the Bottom Middle Panel of the Second-to-Last Page Thereof) Before Telling John Byrne how Jean Grey could be made Available for X-Factor (as Byrne revealed in Fantastic Four #286) Despite her Sacrifice as Phœnix?"

How wildly different the Marvel Universe may be today if only Busiek had read that story! In those two issues (the first story seemingly having little to do with Jean/Phœnix, who only appears in one panel), Gruenwald had set up a vastly superior way to bring Jean Grey back, without undoing her heroic sacrifice in the classic Uncanny X-Men #137, and without claiming that Phœnix was never really Jean Grey in the first place (yeah, the Phœnix Entity not only managed to fool Professor X′s telepathy on multiple occasions, and Wolverine′s enhanced senses throughout the duration of her presence on the team despite not even being a real carbon-based biological lifeform, but she even fooled Uatu the Watcher himself [whose senses were supposed to be at least on the level of the Norse god Heimdall!] ― in the aforementioned UXM#137, the Watcher opens by saying [to the Recorder, but we don′t find that out until the end], ‶I beheld the birth of Jean Grey, watched her grow from child to woman, saw her take her place as one of the X-Men. I saw her die, and I saw her reborn as Phœnix."! And, at the end, he says to the Recorder, ‶Jean Grey could′ve lived to become a god, but it was more important to her that she die a human.").

If you actually have that comic, read that backup story. Reading #32 would be nice backstory, but not absolutely required.

Even for quite some time afterwards (about a decade or so), though, it would still have been possible to use this to explain what was shown in the aforementioned FF#286 and X-Factor. Not now, though. Way too much water under the bridge.


Choo-Choo Bear: [www.littlestuffedbull.com image 300x335]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 375x387]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 400x310]

/hot

At least one panel of that is missing. In my recollection, to the right of the top row, there was a third panel in which Jean/Phœnix looks towards Kitty Pryde who had just placed her hand on Jean′s shoulder, and says, in the Phœnix word balloon (but still wearing the green Phœnix costume), ‶You won′t let!?" (shudder!)
 
2012-11-19 07:25:07 PM

Ecobuckeye: Best What The--?!:

[images.wikia.com image 420x636]


Looks more like What if the X-Men farked themselves silly.
 
2012-11-19 07:26:23 PM

sure haven't: So... The Punisher can kill spider-man now?

I know it's just a "what if", but if you're going to make it ridiculous, then what's the point?


That seemed like a huge WTF to me too. The Punisher killed Daredevil, Spiderman (with Aunt May as collateral damage), Kingpin and the Mayor of New York just for good measure on the end?

This is after Secret Wars had already shown Spider Man basically being able to take on the whole X-Men and at least fight them to a draw (until Professor X stepped in, since Spidey has no resistance/immunity to telepathy)

Also, apparently if Franklin Richards sister had lived, instead of being a mostly benign godlike reality warper like her brother that basically exists to be a cosmic reset button when the Marvel Universe gets too wacky, she would have essentially grown up to be Cthuhlu?
 
2012-11-19 07:27:15 PM
New ‶Add Comment" and separate ‶Preview" button make COMALite mad!
COMALite smash puny new FARK comment submission buttons!!


(Trying again):


Kangaroo_Ralph: [What If? #43: ‶What If Conan the Barbarian were Stranded in the 20th Century?"]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.


That one had two stories, and was the only issue of the first run which consisted of sequels to previous What-If?s. The cover story was a sequel to What If? #13, ‶What If Conan the Barbarian Walked the Earth Today?". That one was a What If? of a What If?, because at the end of #13, Conan gets returned to his own time. The cover story of #43 shows What If he didn′t get back to his own time, by barely missing his chance to do so.

The second story has no title, and is a true continuation of its original story (What If? #23, ‶What If the Avengers had Become the Pawns of Korvac?"), not a What If? of a What If?. Both the original and this untitled sequel were written by the sadly late, great Mark Gruenwald.

It′s also a story that could′ve changed the entire future of the Marvel Comics Universe, had something happened in the real world. That something would be a sequel to this sequel, in a sense: ‶What If Kurt Busiek had Glanced at the Untitled Backup Story in What If? #32 (and, in Particular, the Bottom Middle Panel of the Second-to-Last Page Thereof) Before Telling John Byrne how Jean Grey could be made Available for X-Factor (as Byrne revealed in Fantastic Four #286) Despite her Sacrifice as Phœnix?"

How wildly different the Marvel Universe may be today if only Busiek had read that story! In those two issues (the first story seemingly having little to do with Jean/Phœnix, who only appears in one panel), Gruenwald had set up a vastly superior way to bring Jean Grey back, without undoing her heroic sacrifice in the classic Uncanny X-Men #137, and without claiming that Phœnix was never really Jean Grey in the first place (yeah, the Phœnix Entity not only managed to fool Professor X′s telepathy on multiple occasions, and Wolverine′s enhanced senses throughout the duration of her presence on the team despite not even being a real carbon-based biological lifeform, but she even fooled Uatu the Watcher himself [whose senses were supposed to be at least on the level of the Norse god Heimdall!] ― in the aforementioned UXM#137, the Watcher opens by saying [to the Recorder, but we don′t find that out until the end], ‶I beheld the birth of Jean Grey, watched her grow from child to woman, saw her take her place as one of the X-Men. I saw her die, and I saw her reborn as Phœnix."! And, at the end, he says to the Recorder, ‶Jean Grey could′ve lived to become a god, but it was more important to her that she die a human.").

If you actually have that comic, read that backup story. Reading #32 would be nice backstory, but not absolutely required.

Even for quite some time afterwards (about a decade or so), though, it would still have been possible to use this to explain what was shown in the aforementioned FF#286 and X-Factor. Not now, though. Way too much water under the bridge.


Choo-Choo Bear: [www.littlestuffedbull.com image 300x335]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 375x387]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 400x310]

/hot

At least one panel of that is missing. In my recollection, to the right of the top row, there was a third panel in which Jean/Phœnix looks towards Kitty Pryde who had just placed her hand on Jean′s shoulder, and says, in the Phœnix word balloon (but still wearing the green Phœnix costume), ‶You won′t let!?" (shudder!)
 
2012-11-19 07:29:34 PM

23FPB23: I liked this one...scary stuff for a 12-year old during the Cold War. Funny how its one of those things that is applicable all over again today.

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 263x400]


So, "What if Captain America were revived in the modern day instead of the early 1960's"?

Didn't they just do a movie or two based on that concept lately?
 
2012-11-19 07:56:35 PM

The Loaf: [atlanticjaxx.files.wordpress.com image 441x700]

/Depressing that it never happened in real life.


www.figurerealm.com

It kinda did. They killed off the Emil Blonsky Abomination and replaced him with Rick.
 
2012-11-19 08:09:33 PM

cefm: "The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 450x687]


Add Old Man Logan to that list.
 
2012-11-19 08:16:45 PM
OTOH heres the least depressing Marvel: What if?

www2.picturepush.com
 
2012-11-19 08:21:29 PM

sure haven't: So... The Punisher can kill spider-man now?

I know it's just a "what if", but if you're going to make it ridiculous, then what's the point?



Yeah but what if he did? I'm not saying he could but WHAT IF HE DID, ya know?


I've never found the Punisher entertaining in any way, personally.
 
2012-11-19 08:22:28 PM

Choo-Choo Bear: [www.littlestuffedbull.com image 300x335]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 375x387]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 400x310]

/hot


I don't think that one's depressing--those first two panels are almost laughable.

"Jean, you ate another star!"
"Kitty, I don't want to discuss this right now."

Like Kitty's a daughter admonishing her mother for going back to smoking or having too many drinks after dinner.
 
2012-11-19 08:24:12 PM

cefm: "The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 450x687]


OMG, THAT one was depressing.

"Hulk finally rid of Banner! Now Hulk can be alone!"
"Hulk cold..."
 
2012-11-19 09:16:49 PM

kmmontandon: I don't recall there being any upbeat "What If...?"s.

Usually, lots of people died.


Yeah, 98% of the "What If's" just took the original story, then gave it the most morbid, depressing ending possible.

"What if the X-Men lost Inferno?": Wolverine eats a live baby

"What if the heroes lost Atlantis Attacks?": She Hulk gives birth to a giant snake god, then gets swallowed whole by her offspring.
 
2012-11-19 09:20:14 PM

Ecobuckeye: Best What The--?!:

[images.wikia.com image 420x636]


Agreed. I had that issue. The X-Men argue whether they are dead or in Australia, Forbush-Man meets Agent Furry and the Agents of Brooke Shields, and the Marvel Balls make their debut!
 
2012-11-19 09:23:53 PM
images1.wikia.nocookie.net

Spoiler: Everyone died or was crippled and Earth totally sucks now.
 
2012-11-19 09:40:50 PM

ZeroCorpse: [images1.wikia.nocookie.net image 519x798]

Spoiler: Everyone died or was crippled and Earth totally sucks now.


I really enjoyed it but the defeat of the heros was just a re-hash of 'Wanted', down to the Skull's/Lex Luthor Expy's bit about "I knew the heros couldn't beat us if I got all the baddies together!". That part bugged me. Maybe DC didn't have the guts to let Millar screw with the 'real' heros of the DC universe so they made him run with the expys? I think it was done better here, anyways.
 
2012-11-19 09:41:19 PM

cefm: "The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 450x687]


I came here to say "What If" "The End" of the The Hulk was even more depressing, but I see you beat me to the tragic, infinitely repeating punch.
 
2012-11-19 09:45:14 PM
Also, Marvel's 1 Month 2 Live was a laugh-a-minute, thigh-slapping yuckfest from cover to cover.
 
2012-11-19 10:08:05 PM

cefm: "The End" series for Marvel was also one big huge depressing death-fest. The Hulk "The End" was one of the saddest stories ever written.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 450x687]


Sure made up for the utter suckfest that was Wolverine The End. Thank God they did Old Man Logan years later.
 
2012-11-19 10:41:11 PM
I also found old man logan terribly depressing. And though a number of my friends enjoyed it I just did not.

Anyone else find the giant skeleton of Loki strangely depressing?
 
2012-11-19 10:41:26 PM

Wulfman: sure haven't: So... The Punisher can kill spider-man now?

I know it's just a "what if", but if you're going to make it ridiculous, then what's the point?


Yeah but what if he did? I'm not saying he could but WHAT IF HE DID, ya know?


I've never found the Punisher entertaining in any way, personally.


Punisher is definitely okay ... in small doses. He's not the sort of character that can exist comfortably within the Marvel Universe as we know it. He can barely sustain one "real world" title, and Marvel just keeps wanting to overexpose him.
 
2012-11-19 11:11:22 PM

Chakan: ZeroCorpse: [images1.wikia.nocookie.net image 519x798]

Spoiler: Everyone died or was crippled and Earth totally sucks now.

I really enjoyed it but the defeat of the heros was just a re-hash of 'Wanted', down to the Skull's/Lex Luthor Expy's bit about "I knew the heros couldn't beat us if I got all the baddies together!". That part bugged me. Maybe DC didn't have the guts to let Millar screw with the 'real' heros of the DC universe so they made him run with the expys? I think it was done better here, anyways.


I liked how they defeated Logan. It made sense given his abilities.
 
2012-11-19 11:27:18 PM

Cyno01: OTOH heres the least depressing Marvel: What if?

[www2.picturepush.com image 667x1024]


Also; the single greatest item/weapon ever in any comics universe:

THE RETCON EXPUNGIFIER!

/Laughed at every page for minutes. Selling Tony "The Drunk" Stark to A.I.M.? The "big battle" is a showdown on the Hairy Spranger Show. His archnemesis is the "Carnage Curl" - a vengeful ex-girlfriend who's pregnant with his baby, The Beyonder and Galactus? Spider-Man getting shot out of The Beyonder's Space-Limo by the driver Billy Oceanic? Doc Samson tell him, "There's nothing mentally wrong with you, you're just an asshole?" It's one of the few times in the past ten years I've anxiously waited for another issue to find out just how FAR they were going to take it... the whole thing has a stink-o'-AWESOME of Joe Kelly/Gail Simone-era DP all over it. 

Super-Heroes take themselves too seriously. The world needs more Deadpool.
 
2012-11-19 11:30:10 PM
What if...

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-11-19 11:32:22 PM

Max Awesome: ds615: Max Awesome: That series was always so ridiculously bleak. Everytime I read an issue I was struck by the realization that these Marvel 'heroes' were all complete psychopaths and all it took was a single slight change in events for them to freak out and start murdering everybody in sight.

That's true of pretty much everyone, not just "heroes".
No one is a killer until they are.
And what does it take to make you one? A "slight change in events", that's all.

I don't believe that. I have more faith in human nature and that a person's essential humanity can't be degraded by a few negative experiences.

I was always seriously disturbed by 'What If' - that the writers and editors at Marvel Comics had utterly no faith in the essential stability and decency of their superheroes. 

Isn't the whole point of being heroic the ability to wheather a storm and do the right thing even in the most trying of circumstances?


Well, ole sad sack Parker and the dysfunctional Fantastic Four and X-man pretty much do that in regular continuity, so What If was finally a chance to cut loose and show you just how farked up the characters could be

/you can take it, big man
//also, I'm thinking you might read Marvel only
 
2012-11-20 12:03:09 AM

brigid_fitch: Choo-Choo Bear: [www.littlestuffedbull.com image 300x335]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 375x387]
[www.littlestuffedbull.com image 400x310]

/hot

I don't think that one's depressing ― those first two panels are almost laughable.

‶Jean, you ate another star!"
‶Kitty, I don′t want to discuss this right now."

Like Kitty′s a daughter admonishing her mother for going back to smoking or having too many drinks after dinner.


Well, in the end... Dark Phœnix kills Professor Xavier in psychic battle, then the rest of the X-Men, and Scott last of all. The Jean part of her is shocked by that last, the killing of her one true love, that instead of evil rage she now become self-destructive so that the Phœnix force utterly consumes her, then NYC, then the Earth, then spreads outwards from there. The Watcher could not bear to watch to see if it completely consumed that Universe or not.

That was the worst body count of any What If? that I know of until the #32 that I mentioned in my previous post, about the Avengers becoming pawns of Korvac. At the end of that one...

Korvac had the Avengers slay and he absorb the powers of cosmic beings such as In-Betweener (destroying the Moon in the process, creating a ring around Earth), the Stranger, etc., and Galactus had been slain by Captain America wielding the Ultimate Nullifier (which it′s revealed in this issue completely nullifies the existence of both target and wielder, but requires the wielder to be able to focus his mind completely on the target, encompassing everything about it ― that aspect was later used in the mainstream Marvel Universe comics, an early sign that the non-parody What If?s really were in-continuity, albeit in diverged timestreams). With a thought he ejected Dr. Strange, the Silver Surfer, and Phœnix from that universe entirely, establishing a barrier preventing them from returning. He created a force-field around the Earth blocking it from any further extra-terrestrial, extra-temporal, or extra-dimensional interference, and prepared to bring order to the Universe. Even the Living Tribunal can do no more against him than flee that Universe himself lest Korvac absorb him too, and in the process the L.T. seals off that Universe from all others to prevent its imminent destruction from destabilizing them.

But in the end, an armada of all other sapient species in the Universe assembled to invade Earth territory to challenge him, so he slew every remaining living being on Earth from the Celestials (who were doing their fifty-year judgment of Earth at the time) down to the microbes, absorbing their power and life force, and growing so large and powerful as a result that he sat on the planet as if it were a beach ball. But even so, he said that though he was now easily mightier than any being in the Universe, he was not mightier than every being in the Universe, and took their rejection of him and his plans rather personally, so he used the Ultimate Nullifier on the entire Universe (being now capable of visualizing the whole thing in his mind), utterly erasing it and himself. As soon as he pulled the trigger, ‶All becomes Nothing!" ― on a full page panel showing Eternity (the living incarnation of the Universe itself in Marvel comics) himself being wiped out.

The Watcher says that this one disturbed him more than any other, for from now on the total number of alternate timelines and universes in existence would ever be one less than ∞. The End ― until the sequel that was the untitled backup story in What If? #43 as I discussed in my previous post. (How could there possibly be a sequel to that!? Read it and find out!)
 
2012-11-20 12:13:37 AM
i486.photobucket.com
i486.photobucket.com
Hulk dies, not his wife. She's pissed, sucks up ALL the energy left from her planet (killing it), goes to earth, kills Iron Man, Dr Strange, Sentry, the Fantastic Four and most all the other heroes. Those that survive are used as slave labor for the next 21 years building a giant statue of the Hulk in Central park among the (still) ruins of New York. When the statue is complete, she climbs to the top and becomes stone, dying in the process.
 
2012-11-20 12:22:08 AM

limboslam: [i486.photobucket.com image 600x935]
[i486.photobucket.com image 659x1023]
Hulk dies, not his wife. She's pissed, sucks up ALL the energy left from her planet (killing it), goes to earth, kills Iron Man, Dr Strange, Sentry, the Fantastic Four and most all the other heroes. Those that survive are used as slave labor for the next 21 years building a giant statue of the Hulk in Central park among the (still) ruins of New York. When the statue is complete, she climbs to the top and becomes stone, dying in the process.


And leaving their son in charge, who's in full Hulk mode 24/7. It's heavily implied that all of humanity is ruled by him and the survivors of the old planet.
 
2012-11-20 12:42:17 AM

Ecobuckeye: Best What The--?!:

[images.wikia.com image 420x636]


Yes, yes, yes.

/So where do dead Muties go?
//Canada!
 
2012-11-20 01:23:29 AM
Wow, it's amazing what you can find with just a few simple search terms.
Not necessarily the best, but I loved the last panel.
What if II #100: What if . . . Sinister Learned the Greatest Secrets of the Marvel Universe.
 
2012-11-20 02:00:14 AM
What if FARK didn't greenlight 100 comic book headlines a day? Maybe the average age of readership would move up from it's present average of 6 years old?
 
2012-11-20 02:42:15 AM

SevenizGud: What if FARK didn't greenlight 100 comic book headlines a day? Maybe the average age of readership would move up from it's present average of 6 years old?


Account creation date: 11-21-2010

Wow, you really are NEW here. Back in 2007/2008 it was up around ten a day, and you're biatching about three?
 
2012-11-20 03:16:28 AM

Mad_Radhu: Sorry, but THIS was the most depressing Marvel what if story of all time:

[upload.wikimedia.org image 250x388]


Came expecting to see Ruins, glad I'm not leaving disappointed. "Old Man Logan" is also another interesting little story in a somewhat similar vein if you've never read it.

I'd also like to read "Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe," but some of the issues are selling for stupid amounts of money online, and I don't think they have a collected edition yet.
 
2012-11-20 07:06:33 AM

Raug the Dwarf: Always loved the What If's.

I think my favorite one is a Punisher book, even though I really dislike him as a character. Punisher inherits the symbiote suit and goes on a massive criminal killing spree. Turns out, Frank is one of the few people whose own hate and drive can keep the symbiote in check. It's a pretty cool issue.


Damn. I was not aware of this. Time to go hunting.
 
2012-11-20 08:48:54 AM

Kangaroo_Ralph: [24.media.tumblr.com image 455x700]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.


This is my favorite What If by far, just for the freaking EPIC beatdown Conan delivers unto Captain America.
 
2012-11-20 09:11:53 AM

whizbangthedirtfarmer: Glad to see What If The Punisher Killed Daredevil on there. I used to have What If on my pull list, and that was, by far, the bleakest one they had made (losing Atlantis Attacks was pretty bad, too). I still remember the panel when an enraged Spider-Man beats the living shiat out of Punisher, while Punisher was thinking to himself "he's been holding back this entire time."

/that alone made Spidey pretty cool for a month or two


I liked the spider-man where he dared to insult Firelord (ex herald of galactus) and firelord tears apart the city trying to kill spidey and finally spidey runs out of anywhere to go, and proceeds to beat the ever lovin tar out of firelord until the avengers show up and stop him.
 
2012-11-20 11:24:18 AM

Jedekai: SevenizGud: What if FARK didn't greenlight 100 comic book headlines a day? Maybe the average age of readership would move up from it's present average of 6 years old?

Account creation date: 11-21-2010

Wow, you really are NEW here. Back in 2007/2008 it was up around ten a day, and you're biatching about three?


I like to imagine jerk-offs like him screaming COMICS R 4 KIDZ UR A RETARDUD POOPYHED 4 REEDING DEM then going off to watch their "grown-up" shows like Survivor or Honey Boo Boo.
 
2012-11-20 12:26:33 PM

skepticultist: Kangaroo_Ralph: [24.media.tumblr.com image 455x700]

Spoiler: Conan became a pimp.

This is my favorite What If by far, just for the freaking EPIC beatdown Conan delivers unto Captain America.


This is from decades-old memory, but I think I have it reasonably close: ‶And then he does the last thing Conan ever expected to see anyone do with a shield ― he throws it. Conan barely has time to deflect it, in a stunning reversal of sword vs. shield. He thinks to himself: This is no ordinary warrior!"

The members of the gang who he took over the leadership of (by defeating a black gang boss much taller and larger than himself, who brags about how much weightlifting he does and how much he can press, and has told Conan that his grip was the strength of Africa and that he could not break it. Conan pushes against his grip and says, ߴI don′t have to break your grip ― [his hand now grabs the guy′s throat] Not when I can break your neck!" ― After the now-former leader of the gang concedes defeat, Conan says, ‶Gaining strength by lifting iron lumps is nothing compared to gaining it by fighting for your life!"), who saw this battle (and had earlier urged Conan to run when Cap showed up), said in amazement, ‶He― he beat Captain America!!"

And before that, Conan tries to ask a man for money, but not speaking English well yet, is misunderstood (‶Pardnmesurcanusparemeaquarr?" ― he′d just seen a beggar get money saying something like that). The man panics (‶Oh my God! Here! Take it! Take it all!!") and throws all the cash he has on him at Conan, then runs away screaming, ‶Help!! I′ve been mugged by the Hulk!!" Conan retrieves the coins, and briefly wonders about the strange flimsy rectangles. Wrappings of some sort? He walks off with maybe a few dollars in coins, leaving hundreds of dollars in paper money on the sidewalk.

If you still have that issue (Vol. 1 #43), check out the untitled backup story after the Conan story. One panel in that story, had Kurt Busiek seen it, could′ve substantially changed the future of Marvel Comics (particularly the mutant titles, but could′ve had ramifications extending beyond those) for the better. See my previous posts for more details.
 
2012-11-20 12:31:18 PM

FirstNationalBastard: Jedekai: SevenizGud: What if FARK didn't greenlight 100 comic book headlines a day? Maybe the average age of readership would move up from it's present average of 6 years old?

Account creation date: 11-21-2010

Wow, you really are NEW here. Back in 2007/2008 it was up around ten a day, and you're biatching about three?

I like to imagine jerk-offs like him screaming COMICS R 4 KIDZ UR A RETARDUD POOPYHED 4 REEDING DEM then going off to watch their "grown-up" shows like Survivor or Honey Boo Boo.


Or WWE. You know, with heavily built men dressed in colorful Spandex® and being called by code-names, aligning on the sides of heroes and villains, shouting threats at each other, and engaging in ludicrous parodies of hand-to-hand combat? So much more mature entertainment than superhero comics.
 
2012-11-20 12:33:41 PM

COMALite J: FirstNationalBastard: Jedekai: SevenizGud: What if FARK didn't greenlight 100 comic book headlines a day? Maybe the average age of readership would move up from it's present average of 6 years old?

Account creation date: 11-21-2010

Wow, you really are NEW here. Back in 2007/2008 it was up around ten a day, and you're biatching about three?

I like to imagine jerk-offs like him screaming COMICS R 4 KIDZ UR A RETARDUD POOPYHED 4 REEDING DEM then going off to watch their "grown-up" shows like Survivor or Honey Boo Boo.

Or WWE. You know, with heavily built men dressed in colorful Spandex® and being called by code-names, aligning on the sides of heroes and villains, shouting threats at each other, and engaging in ludicrous parodies of hand-to-hand combat? So much more mature entertainment than superhero comics.


Yes, yes, they're roughly the same thing. That's why there's a decent crossover between the two audiences.
 
2012-11-20 01:21:01 PM

Fano: Haliburton Cummings: where are :

FANO
MUGATO
BRONIES

THIS IS YOUR THREAD!

Already posted multiple times, Mr. Scameron.


yeah i guess only one person could find your romantic fanfiction posts hilarious.

mountain dew is on me...
the fail is on you...
 
2012-11-20 01:45:51 PM
More creepy than depressing, but this was a good standout "out of nowhere" issue.
 
2012-11-20 01:47:12 PM
shiatsnacks.

images3.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2012-11-20 03:30:24 PM

COMALite J:

If you still have that issue (Vol. 1 #43), check out the untitled backup story after the Conan story. One panel in that story, had Kurt Busiek seen is, could′ve substantially changed the future of Marvel Comics (particularly the mutant titles, but could′ve had ramifications extending beyond those) for the better. See my previous posts for more details.



Can someone post a pic of this panel that is being talked about? I am really curious now.
 
2012-11-20 04:31:11 PM

DSF6969: COMALite J:

If you still have that issue (Vol. 1 #43), check out the untitled backup story after the Conan story. One panel in that story, had Kurt Busiek seen is, could′ve substantially changed the future of Marvel Comics (particularly the mutant titles, but could′ve had ramifications extending beyond those) for the better. See my previous posts for more details.

Can someone post a pic of this panel that is being talked about? I am really curious now.


I couldn't find one with GIS, and if I still have the comic in question, I can't put my hands on it right now, nor would I likely be able to until after the Thanksgiving holidays, and by then this thread will close.

So, I'll just describe the story (which as it turns out is titled, simply, ‶Behold...").

In the story that this is a sequel above (What If? Vol. 1 #32, ‶What If the Avengers were Made Pawns of Korvac?"), in my spoiler-hidden text above, I described how:

Korvac, when in the process of consolidating his power on Earth, with a gesture ejected from that entire Universe one Earth-bound humanoid alien and two humans (one a mutant) whose own powers were a potential hindrance to his goals: the Silver Surfer, Dr. Strange, and ― Phœnix!) He created a barrier blocking them from returning while he (and that Universe) still existed.

And now, the sequel ‶Behold..." in the backup of What If? Vol. 1 #43:

Dr. Strange has been fruitlessly trying to get through the barrier blocking him from his home universe, when suddenly the barrier vanishes ― but so has the Universe! There′s nothing but blank whiteness in all directions to ∞ ― a totally empty void. He reaches out with his mystical senses and encounters the Silver Surfer who was in similar straits, and together they reach out with their powers and encounter Phœnix.

The three of them search for other survivors but find none. They then try to see if any object survived, and reach out with their combined powers and find the Ultimate Nullifier. Strange scans its recent history and learns of Korvac and what he did. He then proposes a desperate gamble: the Ultimate Nullifier can nullify anything that its wielder(s) can conceive of, but nullifies them in the process. So, if they concentrated on the nothingness, the void around them that was all that remained of the universe, they should be able to Nullify the nothingness itself and thus restore the Universe, at the cost of their own existences (body and soul). It would be a desperate gamble of a sacrifice with no way that they could know if they even succeeded, since they would not exist to see the Universe restored, if it was. But all three are willing, so they′re about to try.

Just then, the ghost of Eternity manifests, and begs them not to resurrect the Universe and itself. It informs them that there are other universes and timelines, and that this one should remain dead and empty as a warning to all others in the multiverse. Reluctantly, the heroes agree, and decide not to sacrifice themselves, and to leave their Universe and everyone they knew and loved dead forever. Each then decides what s/he will do. The Silver Surfer declares that he would be content exploring the wonders of infinity. Phœnix says something in the key panel that I will reveal in the next paragraph. The last page has Dr. Strange, after the other two have departed, deciding that since he was the Sorcerer Supreme of this Universe, it is his responsibility and jurisdiction, and anywhere else he would be an intruder. So, he remains, and eventually becomes one with the nothingness Universe. The End.

And now, what Phœnix said in that key panel. I′ve not read it in decades, but I still remember it nigh-verbatim, because even then, years before X-Factor and FF#286, I realized its implications.

The bottom middle panel of the second-to-last page, the second-to-last panel of that page, shows Phœnix saying:

‶As for me, I will seek out some other Universe: someplace where it was I who died, and not the Universe. Some place that needs me." She then flies off, presumably to do just that.


I never submitted this idea to Marvel, because I thought it so obvious that I figured that I′d just anticipated what they already had planned. When X-Factor was announced as a revival of the original X-Men with a mystery female member whom we′d seen before, it seemed so obvious to me. I knew that the mystery woman was Jean Grey. I thought that her return would be based on what Mark Gruenwald had established in this story.

And then I read FF#286 just as soon as it came out. I don′t think that a comic book had ever flown from my hand into a nearby wall quite that forcefully before.

Even though, as I said above, I did figure out a way that they could still have done this, even with what was ‶revealed" in FF#286. It would′ve helped lead to a nifty crossover involving the Fantastic Four and West Coast Avengers, due to a specific member of each of those two teams.

Keep in mind that What If? timelines are divergent universes, not parallel universes like DC′s multiple Earths.
 
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