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(Yahoo)   So apparently the only reason Tel Aviv isn't littered with smoking craters is because the Israel-hating, secret Muslim president of the US made sure they hade the "Iron Dome" rocket intercept system   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 386
    More: Interesting, Iron Dome, Tel Aviv, Carl Levin, missile defense systems, domes, Senate Armed Services Committee, rockets, God Only Knows  
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17476 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Nov 2012 at 2:18 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-19 10:35:14 AM
Most ANTI ISRAEL president EVAR.
 
2012-11-19 10:38:04 AM
Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim
 
2012-11-19 10:39:46 AM
This is just more evidence that not only is Obama a muslim loving communist, he's also incompetent. Imagine the hell we would be living in if he weren't so stupid.
 
2012-11-19 10:41:11 AM

Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim


No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.
 
2012-11-19 10:41:18 AM
Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.  I'm pretty sure that Israel is justified in Iron Dome, Dome Kun and anyother thing they want to do right now.
 
2012-11-19 10:43:42 AM

doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.


Easy there, Thor.
 
2012-11-19 10:45:43 AM

doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.


Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)
 
2012-11-19 10:47:04 AM

Diogenes: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Easy there, Thor.


What, me worry?

images.wikia.com
 
2012-11-19 10:47:08 AM

doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.


With all the quakes lately, Loki's getting a bit restless down there*

/* Assuming you accept the flyting of Loki as canon in the Eddas, and not a tale written to contort Loki into a Satan figure by later Christians recording the Eddaic stories...
 
2012-11-19 10:47:51 AM
The article i read before this was an interview with a woman who lost four children all under eight in a strike against [whothefarkcares.jpg]. As a person who's lost a child and knows that pain well, a giant mother-farking fark-you-up-the-ass for every person involved in the death of an innocent child, whatever side.

You're both as bad as each other. Enjoy your hells. Especially you, Israel. Evil assholes.

/rage
//drunk
 
2012-11-19 10:48:21 AM

I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.  I'm pretty sure that Israel is justified in Iron Dome, Dome Kun and anyother thing they want to do right now.


Look the Iron Dome is a great idea, but releasing this guy civilian populations in Gaza?:

www.iphone-blog.me

That's just going too far.
 
2012-11-19 10:50:18 AM
i1079.photobucket.com
 
2012-11-19 10:53:13 AM
images.wikia.com
 
2012-11-19 10:56:09 AM

Magorn: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)


Kind of like in Terry Pratchett's "Pyramids" when ALL the mythology starts coming true.
 
2012-11-19 10:57:37 AM

Magorn: Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...


American Gods called, Neil Gaiman would like to remind you he's already written this book.
 
2012-11-19 10:58:23 AM
Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president
 
2012-11-19 10:59:37 AM
So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.
Giving money to Israel is now a good thing.


You do know that Israel buys the vast majority of their arms and tech from the US? So basically every dollar that we send over there for that purpose is just dressed up corporate warfare for the military industrial complex.


/personally have no problem with any of this.
//just wanting the Obama-manics to try to justify this
///Obama was right to do that, still losing to the broken clock.
 
2012-11-19 11:01:17 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.
Giving money to Israel is now a good thing.




Soooo...Obama...is...Reagan? 
 
 
2012-11-19 11:07:17 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: You do know that Israel buys the vast majority of their arms and tech from the US? So basically every dollar that we send over there for that purpose is just dressed up corporate warfare for the military industrial complex.


The money doesn't even get there. It goes directly from appropriation for "aid" to the companies.
 
2012-11-19 11:19:04 AM

GAT_00: The money doesn't even get there. It goes directly from appropriation for "aid" to the companies.


Do they at least have to sign the back of the check?
 
2012-11-19 11:26:40 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: GAT_00: The money doesn't even get there. It goes directly from appropriation for "aid" to the companies.

Do they at least have to sign the back of the check?


Heh. But you're right, it's corporate welfare. It's exactly the kind of cuts that need to happen in our government. There should be no selective tax breaks for companies. It is not the government's job to see that a company succeeds with a tax break. They can be across the board breaks that companies can meet the requirements of, but there should never be one on one breaks. The government should never directly commission a business.
 
2012-11-19 11:39:54 AM

GAT_00: Heh. But you're right, it's corporate welfare. It's exactly the kind of cuts that need to happen in our government. There should be no selective tax breaks for companies. It is not the government's job to see that a company succeeds with a tax break. They can be across the board breaks that companies can meet the requirements of, but there should never be one on one breaks. The government should never directly commission a business.


You're absolutely right. There shouldn't be selective tax breaks for companies, there shouldn't be any taxes at all. End corporate taxes make federal sales taxes skyrocket and only have income tax on the top 10% and only make that around 10-15% percent. That way you cant dodge taxes and everyone gets to help out. Perfect really.

I'm not sure how you got on the topic of taxes, but I like to respond if I'm able.
 
2012-11-19 11:46:45 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: I'm not sure how you got on the topic of taxes, but I like to respond if I'm able.


Well, I was talking about the role of government and corporate welfare, so selective tax benefits are related. But ending all corporate taxes is where you've gone completely off the path and I'm getting the hell out now.
 
2012-11-19 11:55:33 AM
farm6.staticflickr.com
 
2012-11-19 12:00:57 PM

GAT_00: The Stealth Hippopotamus: I'm not sure how you got on the topic of taxes, but I like to respond if I'm able.

Well, I was talking about the role of government and corporate welfare, so selective tax benefits are related. But ending all corporate taxes is where you've gone completely off the path and I'm getting the hell out now.


Dammit this is a thread about Obama and his supposed hipocracy about being Muslim. And that some how not liking Israel overstepping their power is the same as Iaraels right to defend themselves.
 
2012-11-19 12:14:14 PM
Taqiyya!
 
2012-11-19 12:14:49 PM

cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president


Nobody is going to get in an uproar over supplying defense weapons to a solid ally.
 
2012-11-19 12:28:06 PM

cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president


You're not paying attention. We had this same conversation earlier this morning.
 
2012-11-19 12:43:19 PM
People, people, people: let's focus on what really matters: subby wrote "hade" instead of "had".

/unless the admins correct it and make me look like a fool for bringing it up.
 
2012-11-19 12:48:04 PM

CommieTaoist: People, people, people: let's focus on what really matters: subby wrote "hade" instead of "had".

/unless the admins correct it and make me look like a fool for bringing it up.


I appreciate you bringing this up, because my brain auto-corrected it out of my visual sphere.
 
2012-11-19 01:07:47 PM
Ever heard of a "false flag" operation, subby? Obama's support of Israel has several benefits:
1) Rallies his allies in Palestine behind a common enemy.
2) Tricks gullible Americans like you into thinking he's a regular Peace Loving American (because gullible folks like you also think that's not an oxymoron).
3) Helps get him cred with the jewish-controlled librul media, without whom he wouldn't have gotten elected.

Basically he needs this thing to escalate in such a way that Israel deals the first big strike and comes out looking like the bad guys.
Also, I heard he plans to arm the Israelis with potato cannons next.
 
2012-11-19 01:10:59 PM

Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim


You're weird.

I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.  I'm pretty sure that Israel is justified in Iron Dome, Dome Kun and anyother thing they want to do right now.


They're board-certified and bonded, too.
 
2012-11-19 01:22:32 PM

serial_crusher: Also, I heard he plans to arm the Israelis with potato cannons next.


Potato cannons are awesome. I took out a Hamas firing position with one when I was a lifeguard back in high school. As I recall.
 
2012-11-19 01:45:06 PM

I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years


Huh?

(2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540
 
2012-11-19 01:48:26 PM

Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years

Huh?

(2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540


I was told there would be no math.
 
2012-11-19 01:48:46 PM
Looks like theres a more indepth article on this. Someone ran the numbers, and there are inflated figures going around.

Dissecting IDF propaganda: The numbers behind the rocket attacks .
 
2012-11-19 01:52:22 PM

tallguywithglasseson: I was told there would be no math.


i.imgur.com

Meth. You were told there would be no meth.
 
2012-11-19 01:53:44 PM

Party Boy: (2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540


So only 3300? So we cool right? Under 5k and it's not a problem? No reason to get all uptight about only a few high explosives being chucked toward ya
 
2012-11-19 01:54:01 PM

Magorn: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.  I'm pretty sure that Israel is justified in Iron Dome, Dome Kun and anyother thing they want to do right now.

Look the Iron Dome is a great idea, but releasing this guy civilian populations in Gaza?:

[www.iphone-blog.me image 640x960]

That's just going too far.


Every time you masturbatem God kills a Palestinian.
 
2012-11-19 02:00:46 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So only 3300?


Look, just like thread 3131460 when you were very angry when I (correctly, I'll add) was pointing out how it was incorrect that the Palestinians weren't making talks for all of Jerusalem, this is a figure that is wrong by more than half.

I've pointed it out, and you have the nerve to jump down my throat, again?
 
2012-11-19 02:03:08 PM

Tell Me How My Blog Tastes: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

You're weird.


I was traveling 100% for my job, and they were very popular at the time, and easy to pick up in airport bookstores. I was thinking maybe I could appreciate them on the level of like The Omen and such. Turned out to be an interesting social experiment. You wouldn't believe the True Believers who struck up conversations with me. It gave me alot of insight, actually.

Which was good because the books really sucked. Poorly written regardless of the subject matter. Luckily I could ingest a volume in about 3 hours.
 
2012-11-19 02:03:29 PM
Also, I'm sure you'll express a similar outrage over the expressed intentions of Likud to make Jerusalem entirely under Israeli control. You know, since you were so angry when you incorrectly perceived the Palestinians for doing so.
 
2012-11-19 02:12:30 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.
Giving money to Israel is now a good thing.


The US has always been in favor of theater missile defense. I don't know of any major organization or prominent politician who's argued against it.

What some people oppose is strategic missile defense.
 
2012-11-19 02:15:36 PM

snuff3r: The article i read before this was an interview with a woman who lost four children all under eight in a strike against [whothefarkcares.jpg]. As a person who's lost a child and knows that pain well, a giant mother-farking fark-you-up-the-ass for every person involved in the death of an innocent child, whatever side.

You're both as bad as each other. Enjoy your hells. Especially you, Israel. Evil assholes.

/rage
//drunk


Sorry for your loss, snuff3r, as I know exactly how you feel.

That's why war should be avoided at all costs because innocents die on both sides. I cannot hold Israel totally responsible for these children's deaths as Hamas has recklessly attacked Israel with rockets, bombs, and human Kamikazes. Children have died past from these attacks. More could have died if not for this missile defense system. Israel's response is simply self-defense. How we keep getting to this point of conflict is explained by a quote from a well-known Israeli.

"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." ~ Golda Meir
 
2012-11-19 02:19:38 PM
Yeah but what about the Thunderdome?
 
2012-11-19 02:20:23 PM

I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.


Wow is that number ever a moving target. Another week of this and the common wisdom will be 1 trillion rockets per hour for the last 100 years.
 
2012-11-19 02:20:31 PM
He helped them with the Iron Dome and has unequivocally given his support for self-defense, so naturally my facebook wall is filled with allegations of Obama being an Israel hating anti-Semite and not supporting the Israeli regime's right of self-defense. Because, of course.
 
2012-11-19 02:21:25 PM
"hade" ?
 
2012-11-19 02:21:32 PM
Funny how war breaks out there just before each Israeli election...
 
2012-11-19 02:21:38 PM
And also because Hamas rockets are like glorified bottle rockets...
 
2012-11-19 02:22:08 PM
Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!
 
2012-11-19 02:23:28 PM
So when the "Iron Dome" fails to intercept a nasty missile, is the President and Congress going to take the credit for too much faith being placed into that technology?
 
2012-11-19 02:23:37 PM

unlikely: Most ANTI ISRAEL president EVAR.


Well it is kind of strange that Obama didn't make phone calls to anyone over the current conflict while Hamas was lobbing rockets into Israel daily. He waited until Israel finally responded and then he got on the phone with leadership from both sides to stop the violence.
 
2012-11-19 02:23:44 PM

Party Boy: Look, just like thread 3131460 when you were very angry when I (correctly, I'll add) was pointing out how it was incorrect that the Palestinians weren't making talks for all of Jerusalem, this is a figure that is wrong by more than half.

I've pointed it out, and you have the nerve to jump down my throat, again?



1) That was in 07! Wow you need a life
2) I never got really angry! I didn't even get anywhere near angry. I was talking about using Bono as a human projectile, and asking if I could start posting IDF girls
3) You "pointing out how I was incorrect" was saying "well Abbas never said it himself so it doesn't count" Then you got huffy and took your ball and went home

And 07?! So are you saying I was right about everything we discussed since then? Is that why you had to go back to 07 it find one single example where you think you could make an argument you where right?! oh that's rich.

And thanks for the trip down memory lane!

I forgot this joke, so I going to start using it again

/why did it [the war] only last 7 days?
// cause the Jews only had the equipment leased for a week.
 
2012-11-19 02:23:55 PM

Carn: Yeah but what about the Thunderdome?



matamala.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-11-19 02:23:56 PM
img.photobucket.com
 
2012-11-19 02:24:13 PM

cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president


OK, fark Obama for his unconditional support of Israel. I'm not slaven to any party politic. I go on the issues. I happen to vote Democrat because they represent more of my issues than the GOP, but they are both way off on this one. Support for Israel is nothing more than institutionalized Christianity.
 
2012-11-19 02:24:30 PM

Apos: "hade" ?


A typo in fark headline? Unpossible!
 
2012-11-19 02:25:25 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!


3/10

need more redbull
 
2012-11-19 02:25:32 PM

Carn: Yeah but what about the Thunderdome?


Can't We Get BEYOND Thunderdome?
 
2012-11-19 02:25:56 PM

CokeBear: Funny how war breaks out there just before each Israeli election...


Yeah we get off easy here with our election campaigns. Just have to suffer through commercials, really.
 
2012-11-19 02:26:35 PM
www.rootsweb.ancestry.com
 
2012-11-19 02:26:43 PM
wow. That's pretty cool. So do we or don't we have the "star wars" defense system?
 
2012-11-19 02:27:01 PM
So when all the Israel hater come out in threads from now on Obama will be the bad guy, too, right?
You guys love being on both sides of the fence.
 
2012-11-19 02:27:33 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!


What, you a Nazi or something?
 
2012-11-19 02:27:49 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority.


That whole area is full of despots and royal douchebags at least the Israelis are socially liberal and democratic by comparison.
 
2012-11-19 02:28:45 PM

vygramul: Magorn: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.  I'm pretty sure that Israel is justified in Iron Dome, Dome Kun and anyother thing they want to do right now.

Look the Iron Dome is a great idea, but releasing this guy civilian populations in Gaza?:

[www.iphone-blog.me image 640x960]

That's just going too far.

Every time you masturbatem God kills a Palestinian.


You mean, all this time I've been committing mass genocide?

Also, the guy on the left here must be AIPAC

i.imgur.com
 
2012-11-19 02:29:10 PM

doglover: Magorn: Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...

American Gods called, Neil Gaiman would like to remind you he's already written this book.


I am now $4 poorer. (Kindle store.) Screw you. :-D
 
2012-11-19 02:29:54 PM

I_C_Weener: [images.wikia.com image 800x600]


Why Rooski fighter plane shoot Domo? Whar U.S. fighter? Whar?
 
2012-11-19 02:30:21 PM

dv-ous: I am now $4 poorer. (Kindle store.) Screw you. :-D


so worth the 4 bucks
 
2012-11-19 02:30:32 PM
doubled99

So when all the Israel hater come out in threads from now on Obama will be the bad guy, too, right?
You guys love being on both sides of the fence.


Like the Arabs in Jerusalem.
 
2012-11-19 02:31:16 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!


Uh...no.

WTF kind of kool-aid are you drinking anyway?

/yeah, I need to stop feeding trolls.
 
2012-11-19 02:31:30 PM

dv-ous: doglover: Magorn: Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...

American Gods called, Neil Gaiman would like to remind you he's already written this book.

I am now $4 poorer. (Kindle store.) Screw you. :-D


May as well get 'Anansi Boys' to read when you're finished.
 
2012-11-19 02:31:36 PM

Dirtybird971: wow. That's pretty cool. So do we or don't we have the "star wars" defense system?


We don't. We spent a trillion dollars building the Israelis a "Goatherd Wars" defense system.
 
2012-11-19 02:31:43 PM

Party Boy: Looks like theres a more indepth article on this. Someone ran the numbers, and there are inflated figures going around.

Dissecting IDF propaganda: The numbers behind the rocket attacks .


The IDF is openly making up shiat? Shocking. When was the last time the IDF told the truth?
 
2012-11-19 02:32:08 PM

cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president


Selling anti-ballistic missiles != helping them bomb another country
 
2012-11-19 02:32:36 PM
Is there anything Obama can't do?!

He is completely without flaw. Its possible that he actually is a god who has taken human form.

Join me in pledging my life to dear leader!!
 
2012-11-19 02:33:27 PM

HotWingConspiracy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.

Wow is that number ever a moving target. Another week of this and the common wisdom will be 1 trillion rockets per hour for the last 100 years.


Still less impactful than the hate spewed around here on Fark on a daily basis, amirite?
 
2012-11-19 02:33:43 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.?


www.lead-times.com

pansonfire.com

4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-11-19 02:33:46 PM

GAT_00: Party Boy: Looks like theres a more indepth article on this. Someone ran the numbers, and there are inflated figures going around.

Dissecting IDF propaganda: The numbers behind the rocket attacks .

The IDF is openly making up shiat? Shocking. When was the last time the IDF told the truth?


Why do you hate Israel so much?
 
2012-11-19 02:34:09 PM

Minus 1 Charisma: Is there anything Obama can't do?!

He is completely without flaw. Its possible that he actually is a god who has taken human form.

Join me in pledging my life to dear leader!!


I hear he beefs and heels it down the drain.
 
2012-11-19 02:34:11 PM

doubled99: So when all the Israel hater come out in threads from now on Obama will be the bad guy, too, right?
You guys love being on both sides of the fence.


Well this is the fringe left we're talking about. The same ones that hate groups like the Westboro cult here because they talk about hating gays but support fanatical Muslims who kill gays.
 
2012-11-19 02:34:43 PM

jso2897

Dirtybird971: wow. That's pretty cool. So do we or don't we have the "star wars" defense system?

We don't. We spent a trillion dollars building the Israelis a "Goatherd Wars" defense system.


I know you are joking because I know goats can handle themselves.
 
2012-11-19 02:35:09 PM

Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim


Nope. In the book Israel is being bombed from jet fighters. Suddenly God intervenes and the planes explode and go down. They land in the streets and fields, but Israel's population makes it out unscathed.
 
2012-11-19 02:37:45 PM

HotWingConspiracy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years.

Wow is that number ever a moving target. Another week of this and the common wisdom will be 1 trillion rockets per hour for the last 100 years.


Cop math.
 
2012-11-19 02:37:45 PM
so we gave them this awesome missile defense but the rockets are the main justification for bombing the crap out of gaza ?

This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza.

if this article is to be believed it is suggesting that the rocket attacks aren't that big of an issue as they have the "Iron Dome" so that would mean the Israeli response is yet again disproportionate and it really isn't a direct result of said rocket attacks.
 
2012-11-19 02:38:02 PM

abhorrent1: Apos: "hade" ?

A typo in fark headline? Unpossible!


A more interesting one than most.
 
2012-11-19 02:38:45 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!


You're forgetting about good old WWII guilt. On the whole though, I actually agree. Israel is the most worthless 'ally' have. Sure, we have some who do us no good, but Israel actually does us negative. It's a morass that we will never escape out of.

Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.
 
2012-11-19 02:39:10 PM

Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture?


I simply can't read or hear that word without thinking of the Blondie song. :)
 
2012-11-19 02:40:28 PM
I think it is important to remember that while such a missile shield might work over a small geographical area against less than sophisticated missiles and mortars, deploying such a system over the vast length and breadth of America would be infeasible, to say the least.

Even having it over our major population centers would be a monumental task.

Oh, and call me if they GOP gives Obama credit for that or pulls he's just doing what Bush had laid the groundwork for.
 
2012-11-19 02:40:42 PM
An iron dome sounds brittle. Should have used an alloy.
 
2012-11-19 02:40:55 PM
okay .. i know i am not getting a pay raise.. i guess that is pretty clear.
 
2012-11-19 02:43:18 PM
I hade headline typos. :(
 
2012-11-19 02:44:40 PM
Wasn't Iron Dome developed and built by the Israelis? I thought the big deal in the last few years was trying to get US contracts for resupply and parts.
 
2012-11-19 02:45:56 PM

meat0918: I think it is important to remember that while such a missile shield might work over a small geographical area against less than sophisticated missiles and mortars, deploying such a system over the vast length and breadth of America would be infeasible, to say the least.

Even having it over our major population centers would be a monumental task.

Oh, and call me if they GOP gives Obama credit for that or pulls he's just doing what Bush had laid the groundwork for.


Whoever gets to manufacture those units and the intercept rockets is thanking the shiat out of him, I'm sure.
 
2012-11-19 02:46:21 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: 1) That was in 07!



Those were back in the days when it was cool to link "disconnected" Nazi pictures to posts. You know, like your reply to mine.

At any rate, are you up to giving your outrage to the guy giving wrong figures? Are you going to keep trying to keep trying to jump down my throat?

Are you going to similarly show outrage to the Israeli government for claim to all of Jerusalem - and working towards that goal with settlement expansion?

Well see.
 
2012-11-19 02:47:49 PM

Decados: Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!

You're forgetting about good old WWII guilt. On the whole though, I actually agree. Israel is the most worthless 'ally' have. Sure, we have some who do us no good, but Israel actually does us negative. It's a morass that we will never escape out of.

Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.


You could just as easily say that about Muslims, too, you know.
 
2012-11-19 02:48:38 PM

kindms: so we gave them this awesome missile defense but the rockets are the main justification for bombing the crap out of gaza ?

This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza.

if this article is to be believed it is suggesting that the rocket attacks aren't that big of an issue as they have the "Iron Dome" so that would mean the Israeli response is yet again disproportionate and it really isn't a direct result of said rocket attacks.


It works about half the time, so there are still plenty getting through.

Besides, I'm not really sure that's the issue. If some guy shot you but it didn't get through your bulletproof vest, does that mean you're not going to press charges and he can keep doing it?
 
2012-11-19 02:49:21 PM
rt.com
Iron Dome Defensive battery


www.aerospaceweb.org

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.
 
2012-11-19 02:50:47 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


On the plus side, if Hamas keeps firing more rockets, economy of scale insists that the price of the intercepting missiles will go down!
/ human life does not have a dollar value, no matter what the courts say
 
2012-11-19 02:50:51 PM
There should be a nationwide sound system that plays a loud gong sound every time a rocket is intercepted by the dome.


/Or at least the taco bell sound
//Stop being haders god dome it!
 
2012-11-19 02:51:18 PM
d1w7nqlfxfj094.cloudfront.net
 
2012-11-19 02:51:32 PM

SuperNinjaToad: ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.


heh, you might end up with more debris falling on people like that than actually letting the rockets find their mark.
 
2012-11-19 02:51:46 PM

Arkanaut: cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president

Selling anti-ballistic missiles != helping them bomb another country


Not really inequal. We're giving Israel the ability to shoot down rockets, which allows them to attack Gaza with minimum fear of retaliation. It would be like if MAD had no meaning with such a system if we or the Soviets had such an effective ABM system. If either us or the Soviets could have destroyed the other without fear of an effective attack, then what would prevent that side from thinking about and acting upon that "no risk to us" strategy?
 
2012-11-19 02:51:48 PM

SuperNinjaToad: Israel will be bleed to financial ruins


Someone is going to hemorrhage money, and it ain't going to be Israel.
 
2012-11-19 02:54:27 PM
sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2012-11-19 02:55:31 PM

kindms: This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza


So if some guy is shooting at your house, but you have bullet proof glass, and reinforced walls so nothing gets through, there is no reason to respond?

Decados: Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex


Ok, Amos.
 
2012-11-19 02:55:37 PM

kindms: so we gave them this awesome missile defense but the rockets are the main justification for bombing the crap out of gaza ?

This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza.

if this article is to be believed it is suggesting that the rocket attacks aren't that big of an issue as they have the "Iron Dome" so that would mean the Israeli response is yet again disproportionate and it really isn't a direct result of said rocket attacks.


It's not really like this in real life...
www.otithelis.com
 
2012-11-19 02:56:44 PM
Wasn't Iron Dome developed and built by the Israelis? I thought the big deal in the last few years was trying to get US contracts for resupply and parts.

YES. But apparently the current MSM horseshiat is that the Obamessiah "gave" it to the Israelis.

I've been following Iron Dome development for a couple of years now. The Israelis came up with it, and bought *some* technology from the US for it (mainly radar components), with the US insisting that the Israelis "share" their complete system technology with us as payback.

The key innovation is the Israelis map the target area, and when the Iron Dome radar picks up an incoming rocket, it predicts where the rocket is going to land. If it's landing in an uninhabited area, Iron Dome does nothing. If it's heading for an inhabited area, it launches an interceptor.

The interceptors cost $100,000 each. They don't use them to shoot down $1000 rockets unless the rocket is a threat to Israelis.
 
2012-11-19 02:58:32 PM

Decados: Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.


Today. New York, Florida, etc. You know, places where they're stopped from farking around with other peoples lives on a massively meddlesome scale.

We're not talking about Jews. We're talking about Israelis (and Palestinians). Maybe you don't see the difference?
 
2012-11-19 02:58:37 PM

Decados:
Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.


Persia under Cyrus and Darius
Al-Andalus prior to the Granada massacre
Ottoman Empire from 1300 to 1800


What do all three of those have in common? The Jews were left alone and neither persecuted for religious beliefs nor exalted for being different. A shocking revelation: not treating a minority as a minority created stability and tolerance.
 
2012-11-19 02:59:25 PM
I hade when that happens.
 
2012-11-19 03:00:25 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


unlikely, as Israel has unlimited coffers thanks to being the recipient of the largest US foreign aid funds!!
 
2012-11-19 03:00:28 PM
It's pretty cool they have this system.
 
2012-11-19 03:00:56 PM

free_waffles: Decados:
Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.

Persia under Cyrus and Darius
Al-Andalus prior to the Granada massacre
Ottoman Empire from 1300 to 1800


What do all three of those have in common? The Jews were left alone and neither persecuted for religious beliefs nor exalted for being different. A shocking revelation: not treating a minority as a minority created stability and tolerance.


Time to break out the rare farky of "understands history." Its a dusty old color with little use.
 
2012-11-19 03:02:30 PM
IDF, meh Hamas, phoey.

This is the real military threat to the region.

www.deviantart.com

/This thread needs more Domo Kun! 
//GIF is hot
 
2012-11-19 03:03:18 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


While the rockets might cost a measly $900, the damage they do can be more than $1000.
 
2012-11-19 03:04:00 PM

aedude01: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

Nope. In the book Israel is being bombed from jet fighters. Suddenly God intervenes and the planes explode and go down. They land in the streets and fields, but Israel's population makes it out unscathed.


Right. But I can't recall if the authors had any Scriptural support for that. I don't believe there is, but it's been a while since I've read Revelation.
 
2012-11-19 03:04:43 PM

kindms: This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza.



Really!?!?! You think if the missle system "works" (meaning it stops MOST missiles) then Israel has no reason to respond.

So let's say some guy is punching you. Your defense is good and he only hits you one out of ten times. Would you escalate your defense? Or simply defend indefinetely until he eventually beats you to death?

Remember, we know what it means if you don't answer....
 
2012-11-19 03:04:48 PM
All I've seen them do is send up a few fireworks. Has anyone seen the iron dome in action taking out a large missile? ie. big explosion?
 
2012-11-19 03:05:26 PM

Diogenes: aedude01: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

Nope. In the book Israel is being bombed from jet fighters. Suddenly God intervenes and the planes explode and go down. They land in the streets and fields, but Israel's population makes it out unscathed.

Right. But I can't recall if the authors had any Scriptural support for that. I don't believe there is, but it's been a while since I've read Revelation.


I believe Jesus left Tomahawk missiles out of the scripture.
 
2012-11-19 03:06:26 PM

Magorn: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)


If you're not a fan of Supernatural, this post leads me to believe you might enjoy it. At one point in the Christian apocalypse plot line, a few key players are kidnapped by all the pagan Gods who are all like 'No. Nuh-uh. Underworld to the NO. Screw you guys and the commandments you Abrahamics road in on.'
 
2012-11-19 03:08:07 PM

cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president


It's internally consistent to both support supplying Israel with defensive weaponry to protect civilian populations and landmarks that are part of the world cultural heritage, and also oppose Israel's racist colonization policy and its policy toward the Palestinians that reinforces the cycle of terrorism and retribution. "I don't like what you're doing, but I don't want you to die either."

If anything, Iron Dome is ultimately good for peace in the region. Rocket attacks are pretty much the only weapon Hamas has left in its arsenal that has a reasonable chance of being effective against Israel. Taking away that capability is eventually going to disabuse Hamas of the notion that it can get anywhere through continued violence, and will help force it to the negotiation table.
 
2012-11-19 03:09:06 PM
So liberals now hate Obama?
 
2012-11-19 03:09:22 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


We've probably paid for the entire system, so they're actually bleeding us to financial ruin.
 
2012-11-19 03:09:24 PM
This is the kind of stuff a pastor in my area is posting on his facebook:
i.imgur.com
 
2012-11-19 03:09:51 PM

Party Boy: Those were back in the days when it was cool to link "disconnected" Nazi pictures to posts. You know, like your reply to mine.

At any rate, are you up to giving your outrage to the guy giving wrong figures? Are you going to keep trying to keep trying to jump down my throat?

Are you going to similarly show outrage to the Israeli government for claim to all of Jerusalem - and working towards that goal with settlement expansion?

Well see.


Ok so you're admitting you got nuthin.

And brother I'm not "jumping down your throat". Not a single personal attack and no name calling. I'm civil even when others are not civil towards me. Not always, I'm not perfect. Not saying you were uncivil! Just pointing out how I do things.

I just want to know how many rounds of high explosive need to be launched at a group of people before they get to say enough is enough. The other guy didn't back up his number with a link, and neither did you. But lets just use your numbers. Lets take your numbers as total and irrefutable! I don't trust any number that is that round but lets let it go. 3300 in 4 years. Is that enough to warrant Israel to use force to stop it? If not how many must there be?


/I really would like to know what nazi picture I used! Not saying it didnt happen, just unlikely. I try not to joke about the holocaust
// do you keep a list of threads where you think you're right so you can use them later, or do you remember this stuff?
 
2012-11-19 03:11:01 PM
did anyone mention that Obama is black yet
 
2012-11-19 03:11:09 PM
Well they were ugly guys
In an ugly place
Some also-rans in the human race
And even God got tired - just looking at them
 
2012-11-19 03:12:13 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.
Giving money to Israel is now a good thing.


You do know that Israel buys the vast majority of their arms and tech from the US? So basically every dollar that we send over there for that purpose is just dressed up corporate warfare for the military industrial complex.


/personally have no problem with any of this.
//just wanting the Obama-manics to try to justify this
///Obama was right to do that, still losing to the broken clock.


I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not going to justify it at all. My only 'beef' in relation to Israel is the completely illogical ranting against Obama from the right on his supposedly anti-Israel policies. It is just another example of their completely fabricated narrative about him. I might be inclined to engage in some discussion about something like this, but if all you are looking for is some sort of complaints from the left about Obama's support of Israel, then maybe the right should actually acknowledge (and not just this one time) Obama's solid support of Israel since day 1. It would be pretty stupid for the left to rant against Obama's support of Israel while the right is ranting against him for his supposed LACK of support for Israel. It makes far more sense to point and laugh at how stupid the right is and make as many people aware of it as possible.
 
2012-11-19 03:12:14 PM
Obama stated on the news 2 days ago that, "Israel has the right to defend itself from threats OUTSIDE its borders" (read, The Gaza Strip). So, the Gaza Strip is now not part of Israel? The US vehemently denied Palestine's request to be recognized as a sovereign nation last year, making it still a part of Israel, but now Obama says they are a separate country outside of Israel's borders and are attacking Israel??!!

F*ck US foreign policy. F*ck Israeli domestic policy. How many innocent people have to die - especially Palestinians - before this atrocity is finally stopped?!
 
2012-11-19 03:12:20 PM
Hail Obama! Savior of Israel!
 
2012-11-19 03:15:29 PM

Minus 1 Charisma: Join me in pledging my life to dear leader!!


...because the only two choices are hate him like Stalin or love him like Jesus.
 
2012-11-19 03:16:38 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: just unlikely.


read the thread. You don't attach Nazi pictures to peoples posts in a Israel thread. Its ugly. I can complain about more, but thats all the argument I need.

Party Boy: At any rate, are you up to giving your outrage to the guy giving wrong figures? Are you going to keep trying to keep trying to jump down my throat?

Are you going to similarly show outrage to the Israeli government for claim to all of Jerusalem - and working towards that goal with settlement expansion?

Well see.


Nope on these counts. Look, address that, and we can continue. Otherwise, this is a tilted discussion. Direct your problems to the guy who was wrong. Address the outrage you had for one to the other.
 
2012-11-19 03:17:27 PM

LazerFish: This is the kind of stuff a pastor in my area is posting on his facebook:
[i.imgur.com image 630x1026]


The best part about that retarded tug-of-war picture?

It implies that Obama has the same amount of influence as God.

Also, I like how the giant hand from the sky has to be labeled "God". As though we couldn't tell.
 
2012-11-19 03:18:50 PM
How can anyone regard Obama as a liberal? I think he is best described as an amoral opportunist.
 
2012-11-19 03:18:52 PM
So apparently the only reason Tel Aviv GAZA isn't littered with smoking craters is because the Israel-hating, secret Muslim president of the US made sure they had the "Iron Dome" rocket intercept system that kept Israel from going all Dresden on them.
 
2012-11-19 03:19:26 PM
 
2012-11-19 03:20:14 PM

Party Boy: free_waffles: Decados:
Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.

Persia under Cyrus and Darius
Al-Andalus prior to the Granada massacre
Ottoman Empire from 1300 to 1800


What do all three of those have in common? The Jews were left alone and neither persecuted for religious beliefs nor exalted for being different. A shocking revelation: not treating a minority as a minority created stability and tolerance.

Time to break out the rare farky of "understands history." Its a dusty old color with little use.


Also, Denmark.

/mutherfarking Copenhagen Sewing Circle for the mutherfarking win
 
2012-11-19 03:20:36 PM

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy:
Also, I like how the giant hand from the sky has to be labeled "God". As though we couldn't tell.


The intended audience does prefer literal interpretations of its fairy tales, so there you go.
 
2012-11-19 03:20:37 PM
Iron Dome, Iron Dome
Friendly neihborhood Iron Dome
Stops Qassams, more-or-less
Where they'll land? Have a guess.

I'm safe - thanks to the Iron Dome!

In the cool desert air
There's a flash in the night
Iron Dome's taking care
That we all can sleep tight
 
2012-11-19 03:21:50 PM

K.B.O. Winston: /mutherfarking Copenhagen Sewing Circle for the mutherfarking win


I wonder if rule 34 applies?
 
2012-11-19 03:22:12 PM

Decados: Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!

You're forgetting about good old WWII guilt. On the whole though, I actually agree. Israel is the most worthless 'ally' have. Sure, we have some who do us no good, but Israel actually does us negative. It's a morass that we will never escape out of.

Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.


Just reposting in case you missed it in my other post: DENMARK.
 
2012-11-19 03:23:47 PM

signaljammer: How can anyone regard Obama as a liberal?


He's black.
 
2012-11-19 03:23:51 PM
Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.
 
2012-11-19 03:24:53 PM

signaljammer: How can anyone regard Obama as a liberal? I think he is best described as an amoral opportunist.


Maybe he should go into politics?
 
2012-11-19 03:24:57 PM

Gdalescrboz: So liberals now hate Obama?


Aren't you adorable.
 
2012-11-19 03:25:59 PM
My son in law is from the West Bank. After hearing his stories, and doing my own non-governmental research (Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, and others) I have come to these conclusions:

1. Israel is an aggressive nation. Having the right to defend yourself is one thing, trying to occupy and kill your way into an adjoining country, is another.
2. Almost every Palestinian is raised to have feelings about the Israelis ranging from "dislike" to "extreme hatred".
3. Palestinians are so used to having the IDF in their territory they are numb to their existence. Until, of course, the IDF utilizes its hundreds of fixed and flying roadblocks or plows down houses and shoots rock throwing children. Israeli occupiers have built modern, multi-laned highways in the West Bank that only Israeli settlers are allowed to use. Israeli settlers are encouraged to aggressively take land, with the aid of the IDF.
4. Hamas does NOT represent the political views of the average Palestinian.
5. The Gaza Palestinians had little recourse in accepting the leadership of Hamas, although the Palestinian Authority still has influence there. Hamas is a dangerous entity, and Gaza Palestinians are trapped in their territory.
6. The Palestinian Authority, however small in size and power, are trying to legitimize the right of the Palestinian people to become a Nation.

As a Canadian, I am ashamed that my government, along with the USA and others, have refused to recognize the Palestinians to become a Nation at the U.N. Absolute cowards that cow-tow to a bully nation.

Someone posted above asking what has Israel done for the U.S. other than take financial support?
Israel, in return for US assistance offers intelligence, multi-level clandestine operations, intimidation and elimination of those pesky Arabs on behalf of those unwilling to risk political futures for a sense of comfort in knowing there is "someone else" to do their dirty work. 

No, I can't back up every one of my comments with specific document, page or reference.
Yes, I am upset with the present situation and how it will affect us in the west.
 
2012-11-19 03:26:02 PM

spiderpaz: Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.


Poe's Law, ladies and gents.
 
2012-11-19 03:26:09 PM

spiderpaz: Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.


If that's your metric there's gotta be data to be gleaned from it actually functioning ..or not... it's like a beta test for the system.
 
2012-11-19 03:26:11 PM
"Our missiles will blot out the un!"

"Then we will fight in the hade!"
 
2012-11-19 03:26:40 PM

spiderpaz: Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.


Doesn't that go both ways though? Helps us test the thing against Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles.
 
2012-11-19 03:27:05 PM
"Boi, don go down thar farkin' did dem Jooz widout no money!"
 
2012-11-19 03:27:09 PM

SpectroBoy: kindms: This doesn't compute. Either it works and is awesome so no need for Israel to launch attacks in to gaza or it doesn't work and there should be no praise for the US giving the Israelis junk defense weapons and they have a reason to go in to gaza.


Really!?!?! You think if the missle system "works" (meaning it stops MOST missiles) then Israel has no reason to respond.

So let's say some guy is punching you. Your defense is good and he only hits you one out of ten times. Would you escalate your defense? Or simply defend indefinetely until he eventually beats you to death?

Remember, we know what it means if you don't answer....


So is it so awesome that Obama deserves credit for it ? I mean if 50% of these POS rockets get through then it isn't an "IRON DOME" and isn't praise worthy. Actually it would be mock worthy if several hundred million dollars only nets you maybe 50% of the most unsophisticated rockets. I would imagine that if they were using actual semi-advanced weapons its effectiveness would be even more pathetic

Or is it more likely that these "rocket attacks" are simply the justification for Israel to enact group punishment on Gaza and the people living there ?

Either the rockets are a huge deal and it is anyones guess why Israel doesn't respond to them when they occur EVERYTIME or they are simply using it as the justification in the latest rounds of oppressive behavior with the folks in Gaza.

Israel has the capacity and personnel to deal with these "situations" in a much more reserved, tactical response. Ramping up the fighter jets and dropping bombs on civilians doesn't do anyone any good and it certainly doesn't help Israel.

Israels days are numbered anyway. All those folks have to do is keep on having babies and they will outnumber Israelis soon enough. There is only one way that Israel could fight that and I am not sure even they would go down that road.
 
2012-11-19 03:27:10 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.
Giving money to Israel is now a good thing.


You do know that Israel buys the vast majority of their arms and tech from the US? So basically every dollar that we send over there for that purpose is just dressed up corporate warfare for the military industrial complex.


/personally have no problem with any of this.
//just wanting the Obama-manics to try to justify this
///Obama was right to do that, still losing to the broken clock.


Even if it didn't come back to us this is useful R&D spending. We get Israel to pay much of the cost and we get real-world experience with it shooting down inbounds. I'm sure the investment was with the condition that they share what they learn if not the plans themselves.

DarkSoulNoHope: Not really inequal. We're giving Israel the ability to shoot down rockets, which allows them to attack Gaza with minimum fear of retaliation. It would be like if MAD had no meaning with such a system if we or the Soviets had such an effective ABM system. If either us or the Soviets could have destroyed the other without fear of an effective attack, then what would prevent that side from thinking about and acting upon that "no risk to us" strategy?


Reality check: Hamas started this as usual.

free_waffles: Decados:
Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.

Persia under Cyrus and Darius
Al-Andalus prior to the Granada massacre
Ottoman Empire from 1300 to 1800


What do all three of those have in common? The Jews were left alone and neither persecuted for religious beliefs nor exalted for being different. A shocking revelation: not treating a minority as a minority created stability and tolerance.


So long as they accepted second-class status.
 
2012-11-19 03:27:12 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.? They are an arrogant little shiat of a country, full of hubris on the grant that we will give them unconditional financial support and moral authority. It is literally true that Israel could announce tomorrow that they are intentionally targeting schools with the purpose of killing as many Palestinian children as possible, and not one prominent American politician would criticize them. So let me say it then: fark Israel. You exist because Christians in this country want you in place to bring about Apocalypse as described in the Book of Revelations. It's a macabre absurdity!


Hurr Durr.....
 
2012-11-19 03:27:54 PM
"Boi, don go down thar farkin' wid dem Jooz widout no money!"
 
2012-11-19 03:28:44 PM
Dammit Obonghit! Enough of your satanic Wizardry!
Patriotic Republicans are ready to open the public coffers to supply all the Horses and Bayonets our Allies need!
 
2012-11-19 03:32:46 PM

kindms:

So is it so awesome that Obama deserves credit for it ? I mean if 50% of these POS rockets get through then it isn't an "IRON DOME" and isn't praise worthy. Actually it would be mock worthy if several hundred million dollars only nets you maybe 50% of the most unsophisticated rockets. I would imagine that if they were using actual semi-advanced weapons its effectiveness would be even more pathetic


Do you have any idea how hard it is to shoot down one rocket with another? Even ballistic rocket with no guidance system at all is an incredibly difficult target to hit midflight. Add in that you don't know where they'll be launched from and the very short flight time, and you have a real problem to solve.

The fact that it gets as many as it does makes it an unparalled feat.
 
2012-11-19 03:33:22 PM

Tax Boy: Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.?

[www.lead-times.com image 555x865]

[pansonfire.com image 480x480]

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 440x513]


Natalie Portman was born in

free_waffles: Decados:
Name me one point in history that the Jewish people have actually been able to live at peace with their neighbors, no matter who those neighbors might be. Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.

Persia under Cyrus and Darius
Al-Andalus prior to the Granada massacre
Ottoman Empire from 1300 to 1800


What do all three of those have in common? The Jews were left alone and neither persecuted for religious beliefs nor exalted for being different. A shocking revelation: not treating a minority as a minority created stability and tolerance.


The first step towards not being treated like a minority is for said minority to stop playing the minority card. Unfortunately, Israel as a nation was established on that very concept. They might as well have called it "European Jewish Minority Land".

A cluster, all around. If there is a God then he's pissed at everybody.
 
2012-11-19 03:33:32 PM

Party Boy: K.B.O. Winston: /mutherfarking Copenhagen Sewing Circle for the mutherfarking win

I wonder if rule 34 applies?


I would read that.
 
2012-11-19 03:34:14 PM

Tax Boy: Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.?

[www.lead-times.com image 555x865]

[pansonfire.com image 480x480]

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 440x513]


images2.wikia.nocookie.net

JAFA! KREE!

/Totally found a picture of Teal'c shopped onto that Jaffa Juice picture.
//Damn hotlinks disabled
 
2012-11-19 03:34:31 PM

Party Boy: read the thread. You don't attach Nazi pictures to peoples posts in a Israel thread. Its ugly. I can complain about more, but thats all the argument I need.


He was a neo nazi and a joke of one at that. Big difference. One actually killed people and destroyed lives. The other posts in blogs and listens to bad speed metal. Either way you transitioned from "I total showed you up in a thread from 07 you better back off or I'll do it again" to "you did something I found distasteful" in a thread from 07. 07

Party Boy: Nope on these counts. Look, address that, and we can continue. Otherwise, this is a tilted discussion. Direct your problems to the guy who was wrong. Address the outrage you had for one to the other.


I did address that! Neither one of you linked to a story for support. But cause I love you so much I'm going to completely trust your numbers. Now please answer the question.


How many rounds of high explosive need to be launched at a group of people before they get to say enough is enough?

/now remember you dont have to defend where you got your number, I dont care.
 
2012-11-19 03:34:43 PM

LazerFish: This is the kind of stuff a pastor in my area is posting on his facebook:
[i.imgur.com image 630x1026]


I love the second picture for many reasons.

1. Overly labeled (Israel, Israel Enemies, God)
2. Enemies include Ahmadinejad, Obama (who gave them their defense system), a Chinese guy, and who is that other guy?
 
2012-11-19 03:35:02 PM

Headso: spiderpaz: Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.

If that's your metric there's gotta be data to be gleaned from it actually functioning ..or not... it's like a beta test for the system.


That data would better serve us if it were collected from our own testing so that we knew the vulnerabilities but our adversaries didn't.
 
2012-11-19 03:35:12 PM
I'm glad they switched to the Iron Dome.

The previous plan of Chrome Dome didn't work as well.

images3.wikia.nocookie.net

Particularly the plan where they shrink IDF soldiers down and hide them inside Christmas presents. Nobody told him they don't celebrate Christmas.
 
2012-11-19 03:36:42 PM

Loren: So long as they accepted second-class status.


So the answer is for the Israelis to impose said second class status on the Palestinians? It really seems Israel has gone down the Nietzchean Abyss and become what they sought to destroy if that is the case.
 
2012-11-19 03:37:41 PM
So ... who is the aggressor in this fight? The group of people that barged into Jerusalem and annexed a new state from a group of people living there already? Or the group of people that had their land stolen from them in 1948 to make way for 'war reparations' because in 6000 years, somehow the Jews cannot stop themselves from being blown up, burned, or crucified?

Fark it, let the whole region burn in some nuclear fiery event. The US and UN should clear every person out of Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, tell them if they can't peacefully find a way to share the land in three months, the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.
 
2012-11-19 03:38:07 PM

LazerFish: This is the kind of stuff a pastor in my area is posting on his facebook:
[i.imgur.com image 630x1026]


That must be a batsh*t congregation to put up with a sick freak like that as a pastor.
 
2012-11-19 03:39:09 PM
Obama didn't build that Iron Dome. Someone else built it............
 
2012-11-19 03:39:33 PM

spiderpaz: Headso: spiderpaz: Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.

If that's your metric there's gotta be data to be gleaned from it actually functioning ..or not... it's like a beta test for the system.

That data would better serve us if it were collected from our own testing so that we knew the vulnerabilities but our adversaries didn't.


What data? they have videos of rockets flying through the night sky and then an explosion but the actual reports that the system spits out would be real numbers you could actually use to make it better.
 
2012-11-19 03:39:56 PM
\

seadoo2006: So ... who is the aggressor in this fight? The group of people that barged into Jerusalem and annexed a new state from a group of people living there already? Or the group of people that had their land stolen from them in 1948 to make way for 'war reparations' because in 6000 years, somehow the Jews cannot stop themselves from being blown up, burned, or crucified?

Fark it, let the whole region burn in some nuclear fiery event. The US and UN should clear every person out of Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, tell them if they can't peacefully find a way to share the land in three months, the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.


Pretty sure that site is only particularly meaningful to Christians. Could be wrong.
 
2012-11-19 03:40:07 PM
Weapon test we need to do it some where and no GAA wanting an environmental impact study that a win win is it not.
 
2012-11-19 03:40:12 PM

Gdalescrboz: So liberals now hate Obama?


fatassbastard: ...because the only two choices are hate him like Stalin or love him like Jesus.

 
2012-11-19 03:42:35 PM

mark12A: The interceptors cost $100,000 each. They don't use them to shoot down $1000 rockets unless the rocket is a threat to Israelis.


So Hamas aims at developed areas. With luck someone will post some kind of data, but they should be aim them at, say, a sub development with some kind of accuracy. And once we're talking about money being the issue, I'm not sure that if I were Hamas they would all even have explosives in them. They wouldn't cost as much to fire, but cost the same amount to shoot down.
 
2012-11-19 03:44:48 PM

fireclown: Wasn't Iron Dome developed and built by the Israelis? I thought the big deal in the last few years was trying to get US contracts for resupply and parts.


I was. But pointing that out flies in the face of giving our dear leader the praise he deserves.
 
2012-11-19 03:45:00 PM

K.B.O. Winston: Party Boy: K.B.O. Winston: /mutherfarking Copenhagen Sewing Circle for the mutherfarking win

I wonder if rule 34 applies?

I would read that.


or watch it?

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Either way you transitioned from


Groan.

Party Boy: you were very angry when I (correctly, I'll add) was pointing out how it was incorrect that the Palestinians weren't making talks for all of Jerusalem,


You might have a problem with the word angry and want to get into semantics. You were wrong in it. Thats it. You were very angry at the Palestinians for making claims to all of Jerusalem. You were wrong. i pointed it out.

The Stealth Hippopotamus: I did address that!


I don't see where you are similarly irritated at the israeli govt for claiming all of jerusalem. I don't see you talking to the other guy at all. Me, well, you cant leave alone. There was no reason for that.

The Stealth Hippopotamus: neo nazi


It is ugly to post nazi pictures to peoples posts in the Israel threads. That context is not acceptable.

I'm not going to go off on how much explosives and whatever. We're not shifting the discussion any more than it has.
 
2012-11-19 03:45:04 PM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: \seadoo2006: So ... who is the aggressor in this fight? The group of people that barged into Jerusalem and annexed a new state from a group of people living there already? Or the group of people that had their land stolen from them in 1948 to make way for 'war reparations' because in 6000 years, somehow the Jews cannot stop themselves from being blown up, burned, or crucified?

Fark it, let the whole region burn in some nuclear fiery event. The US and UN should clear every person out of Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, tell them if they can't peacefully find a way to share the land in three months, the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

Pretty sure that site is only particularly meaningful to Christians. Could be wrong.


A 50MT warhead on a site within a mile of the three holiest sites in Abrahamic religious would permanently wipe them all off the map. Gethsemane, the Wailing Wall, and the Dome of the Rock ... literally, a 500kg bunker buster would theoretically take them all out, but the symbolism of a thermonuclear device which leaves Jerusalem as a smoldering radioactive crater for the next 100 years seems more appropriate.
 
2012-11-19 03:45:13 PM

gelovani: Obama stated on the news 2 days ago that, "Israel has the right to defend itself from threats OUTSIDE its borders" (read, The Gaza Strip). So, the Gaza Strip is now not part of Israel? The US vehemently denied Palestine's request to be recognized as a sovereign nation last year, making it still a part of Israel, but now Obama says they are a separate country outside of Israel's borders and are attacking Israel??!!

F*ck US foreign policy. F*ck Israeli domestic policy. How many innocent people have to die - especially Palestinians - before this atrocity is finally stopped?!


The US generally recognizes the 1967 borders, right?

Under that position, Gaza is part of Egypt.
 
2012-11-19 03:45:40 PM
Just wait until those Iron Dome batteries start luring unsuspecting Israeli children close with candy, then falling over on top of them. Obama will be laughing all the way to the bank Jannah Mecca Kenya Hawaii.
 
2012-11-19 03:46:00 PM

Cyclometh: The fact that it gets as many as it does makes it an unparalled feat.


Especially considering I read last night that they only shoot at the ones pointed at populated centers. I can understand why they don't want to shoot an expensive missile at something that isn't going to hit anything important.

Did I miss the point on why this is Obama's fault/idea. I was under the impression that most, if not all, of this "Iron Dome" system was designed and built by the Israeli military for use by the Israeli military. If it works, and saves some peoples lives then Good for Them.
 
2012-11-19 03:48:17 PM

seadoo2006: SacriliciousBeerSwiller: \seadoo2006: So ... who is the aggressor in this fight? The group of people that barged into Jerusalem and annexed a new state from a group of people living there already? Or the group of people that had their land stolen from them in 1948 to make way for 'war reparations' because in 6000 years, somehow the Jews cannot stop themselves from being blown up, burned, or crucified?

Fark it, let the whole region burn in some nuclear fiery event. The US and UN should clear every person out of Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, tell them if they can't peacefully find a way to share the land in three months, the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

Pretty sure that site is only particularly meaningful to Christians. Could be wrong.

A 50MT warhead on a site within a mile of the three holiest sites in Abrahamic religious would permanently wipe them all off the map. Gethsemane, the Wailing Wall, and the Dome of the Rock ... literally, a 500kg bunker buster would theoretically take them all out, but the symbolism of a thermonuclear device which leaves Jerusalem as a smoldering radioactive crater for the next 100 years seems more appropriate.


That is true.
 
2012-11-19 03:48:28 PM
Before we go all free-range on Marshall Stalin, I urge you all to go to snagfilms and search on the term 'Nanking' so that you may explore for yourselves what happens when one doesn't behave in a Stalinistic manner when it is situationally appropriate.
 
2012-11-19 03:51:43 PM
Domo arigato, Mr. Obama.

Domo, Domo.
 
2012-11-19 03:53:04 PM

Party Boy: seadoo2006: SacriliciousBeerSwiller: \seadoo2006: So ... who is the aggressor in this fight? The group of people that barged into Jerusalem and annexed a new state from a group of people living there already? Or the group of people that had their land stolen from them in 1948 to make way for 'war reparations' because in 6000 years, somehow the Jews cannot stop themselves from being blown up, burned, or crucified?

Fark it, let the whole region burn in some nuclear fiery event. The US and UN should clear every person out of Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, tell them if they can't peacefully find a way to share the land in three months, the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

Pretty sure that site is only particularly meaningful to Christians. Could be wrong.

A 50MT warhead on a site within a mile of the three holiest sites in Abrahamic religious would permanently wipe them all off the map. Gethsemane, the Wailing Wall, and the Dome of the Rock ... literally, a 500kg bunker buster would theoretically take them all out, but the symbolism of a thermonuclear device which leaves Jerusalem as a smoldering radioactive crater for the next 100 years seems more appropriate.

That is true.


Haha, I love that site ... drop a 50MT anywhere in the world and you're talking about monumental amounts of destruction. Using Gethsemane as ground zero, you'd pretty much erase the region off the map.

i50.tinypic.com

And the fallout would make the whole area uninhabitable for a very long time.

i49.tinypic.com
 
2012-11-19 03:53:11 PM

Magorn: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)


Rapture weather is local.
 
2012-11-19 03:54:33 PM

Headso: spiderpaz: Headso: spiderpaz: Great ... we develop a missile defense system costing us billions, then we sell it to Israel for $70 million, and Iran/Russia/China get to collect data and test how to beat it without suffering the consequences by letting Hamas fire Iranian/Soviet/Chinese missiles through it.

As always, the ones benefiting from US foreign policy are the Israelis not the Americans.

If that's your metric there's gotta be data to be gleaned from it actually functioning ..or not... it's like a beta test for the system.

That data would better serve us if it were collected from our own testing so that we knew the vulnerabilities but our adversaries didn't.

What data? they have videos of rockets flying through the night sky and then an explosion but the actual reports that the system spits out would be real numbers you could actually use to make it better.


Granted, NATO and Israel are the ones with the direct hands on access, so they are the ones getting the best data back, but the US has already tested all this crap on short, mid, and long range weapons over the last 8 years, so there's less for them to learn. The Iranians/Russians/Chinese however have basically no data to go on how the US missile system responds to certain types of rockets/angles/clusters of projectiles, so every piece of information they can pick up from satellites, video or radars within range from their allies/ships in the Mediterranean is information they didn't have before.

We'd be better off if they were blind so that any calculations they had to do as to what the NATO capability was would have to assume the worst case. The Iranians couldn't have "tested" their missiles by firing it at a US ship in the Gulf because they'd get annihilated. Under these circumstances though, their surrogate, Hamas, is firing the Iranian missiles for them at the US system, and Iran avoids a US response. So now they have results for tests against the US system so that they can now try to adapt to beat it in ways their current missiles are failing.

The next logical conclusion is that the US will have to improve its system to beat those new adaptations. And so on and so forth, in circles, and every time the US spends a couple billion on new missile defense projects, the Iranians can force them to do it again with a few million dollars worth of missiles smuggled into Gaza.

Obviously this isn't sustainable. It's why the Star Wars idea was scrutinized originally.
 
2012-11-19 03:55:46 PM

seadoo2006: Haha, I love that site ... drop a 50MT anywhere in the world and you're talking about monumental amounts of destruction.


USSЯ: shiatty targeting? No pЯoblem, comrade, we add more deuteЯium.
 
2012-11-19 03:57:40 PM

This text is now purple: gelovani: Obama stated on the news 2 days ago that, "Israel has the right to defend itself from threats OUTSIDE its borders" (read, The Gaza Strip). So, the Gaza Strip is now not part of Israel? The US vehemently denied Palestine's request to be recognized as a sovereign nation last year, making it still a part of Israel, but now Obama says they are a separate country outside of Israel's borders and are attacking Israel??!!

F*ck US foreign policy. F*ck Israeli domestic policy. How many innocent people have to die - especially Palestinians - before this atrocity is finally stopped?!

The US generally recognizes the 1967 borders, right?

Under that position, Gaza is part of Egypt.


Psh, it's been for millenia. I mean, hell, the phaoroahs buried their own and built the pyramids in Gaza!
 
2012-11-19 03:59:54 PM

seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.


I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.
 
2012-11-19 04:00:49 PM
In the spirit of equality, shouldn't we give Palestine the same technology to prevent them from being bombed as well?
 
2012-11-19 04:03:16 PM

Party Boy: seadoo2006: Haha, I love that site ... drop a 50MT anywhere in the world and you're talking about monumental amounts of destruction.

USSЯ: shiatty targeting? No pЯoblem, comrade, we add more deuteЯium.


LOL

MonoChango: seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.


True, but point remains ... I think anything above a 100kT yield would make at least the city of Jerusalem no more ... we'd need something a bit more powerful or a couple more if our intent was to remove all claims anywhere near that area of the world. 4 or 5 100kT warheads or a 9MT from the 1980s would do the trick though.
 
2012-11-19 04:03:36 PM

MonoChango: seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.


You are correct. It would probably take us more than three months to design and assemble a device of that size, and it would have to be trucked to the delivery point and assembled there.
 
2012-11-19 04:03:44 PM

MonoChango: I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big.


We don't. US missiles were/are more accurate and didn't need all that margin of error.
 
2012-11-19 04:04:10 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


THAT's the "Rocket" the IDF is getting so worked up about? I've seen the amatuer hobbyists of the L&DRA launch bigger rockets than that
 
2012-11-19 04:05:06 PM
cman
The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president

Partisans have infinite tolerance for cognitive dissonence.


The Stealth Hippopotamus
So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.

It seems to let Israel think they can do anything with impunity.


AirForceVet
That's why war should be avoided at all costs because innocents die on both sides. I cannot hold Israel totally responsible for these children's deaths as Hamas has recklessly attacked Israel with rockets, bombs, and human Kamikazes. Children have died past from these attacks. More could have died if not for this missile defense system. Israel's response is simply self-defense.

You twisted, shameless, sick fark.


SuperNinjaToad
ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

Furthermore it's only a matter of time until Qassams include simple GPS and countermeasures for whatever Iron Dome uses to track them.


SpectroBoy
So let's say some guy is punching you. Your defense is good and he only hits you one out of ten times. Would you escalate your defense? Or simply defend indefinetely until he eventually beats you to death?

Unless you're a complete farking moron, you'll find out why he's punching you.


Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy
Taking away that capability is eventually going to disabuse Hamas of the notion that it can get anywhere through continued violence, and will help force it to the negotiation table.

And what will bring Israel to the table? What incentive will they ever have to give up the West Bank and end the blockade of Gaza?

Do you seriously think it's possible to impose 100% perfect peace through force? Without making the survivors' #1 goal getting revenge? What happens when someone just bides their time for ten or twenty years and blows something up then? Are we back to square one?

Israel's demand for absolute guaranteed safety is an unrealistic expectation and the key problem. If they would be willing to deescalate (evidence suggests that it's even OK to retaliate, as long as they go out of their way to avoid civilian casualties as opposed to the current "Sorry we killed a family but there was a militant in the building" policy and the target is the actual attackers rather than tit-for-tat) then this would have been over years ago. But deescalation does nothing to help create the excuse to take the West Bank, and would be responded


signaljammer
How can anyone regard Obama as a liberal? I think he is best described as an amoral opportunist.

Are you saying that's a contradiction?
 
2012-11-19 04:06:05 PM
These comments.. I'm sure Einstein would be proud to know we march on proudly... to oblivion.

Do try to keep a bright side, eh? At the bottom we are all humans, not jews and arabs - and I, being neither of either, see just a small pool of futility at the bottom of an emptied well whether it comes hi-tech, or low.

It's fantastic we can make systems that defend from rocket attack - as foreseen for quite some time - now use that precious time of advantage to make overtures of peace, from a position of strength, directly to people. Its hard to ignore someone who offers aid when they could put a boot on your neck.

The opportunity exists here, for a moment, to speak in the very face of irrationality (rocket attack) and here's the question: is it a chance to laugh off attackers or to bypass them and broker directly to the palestinian peoples. I pray (and i am not religious) we can cap the advanced weaponry genie before it's too late, but this is all like a freaking ad for it.. what country won't have this soon, reduced to useless with some simple trick, starting the cycle over again but more ruthlessly? Use this chance.
 
2012-11-19 04:06:31 PM

SuperNinjaToad: ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.


All of that cost combined are worth it if it stops the spread of a greater war.
 
2012-11-19 04:07:32 PM

SpaceBison: sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net


Come on now! Get ahead of the game!

Photoshop this with the BIMBO DOUGH BOY.
 
2012-11-19 04:08:42 PM

LookForTheArrow: These comments.. I'm sure Einstein would be proud to know we march on proudly... to oblivion.

Do try to keep a bright side, eh? At the bottom we are all humans, not jews and arabs - and I, being neither of either, see just a small pool of futility at the bottom of an emptied well whether it comes hi-tech, or low.

It's fantastic we can make systems that defend from rocket attack - as foreseen for quite some time - now use that precious time of advantage to make overtures of peace, from a position of strength, directly to people. Its hard to ignore someone who offers aid when they could put a boot on your neck.

The opportunity exists here, for a moment, to speak in the very face of irrationality (rocket attack) and here's the question: is it a chance to laugh off attackers or to bypass them and broker directly to the palestinian peoples. I pray (and i am not religious) we can cap the advanced weaponry genie before it's too late, but this is all like a freaking ad for it.. what country won't have this soon, reduced to useless with some simple trick, starting the cycle over again but more ruthlessly? Use this chance.


Again, the answer is obvious. Erase it from the map. Permanently. Have the UN put a time table on it. Either they both agree to LASTING peace or the place gets wiped out. The world would be a better place if these sand monkeys lost everything they care about because Mr. Jew can't get along with Mr. Muslim and Mr. Christian hates them both.
 
2012-11-19 04:09:44 PM
Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you.
 
2012-11-19 04:09:56 PM

Party Boy: Groan.


So is that your way of saying I was right?

Party Boy: You might have a problem with the word angry and want to get into semantics. You were wrong in it. Thats it. You were very angry at the Palestinians for making claims to all of Jerusalem. You were wrong. i pointed it out.


So you admit that you were wrong and I didn't get angry? Cause you dont have a single ounce of proof. Did I resort to name calling? No. Did I go with personal attacks? no. Semantics? Try flat out wrong! oops, I just used an exclamation mark. I must be ready to explode. If the last distasteful (in our eyes) I did was 5 years ago then I'm doing all right. You fire slander at me, of course I have to respond. If I don't 5 years from now you'll be saying that I was calling for the destruction of an entire race or some other nonsense.

Party Boy: I'm not going to go off on how much explosives and whatever. We're not shifting the discussion any more than it has


You started this. You countered the other guy stating that said there were 8k of missiles. I didn't. I took your numbers. I said that you were right. Why respond to him? He is dis proven! But I have to ask if the number doesn't matter why counter? There was a reason you felt the need to show that it was a wrong number, why was that? If it doesn't matter, why correct it? Does 3300 make it alright? Does 8k make Israel justified so you have to disprove it? This is directly on topic! People are saying that Israel isn't justified and I'm asking what number of attacks would it take to make them justified.

/Really wish you'd answer one other little question I've already asked. Do you make a list of all the thread you think you "won" or got offended in?
 
2012-11-19 04:10:24 PM

Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years

Huh?

(2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540



Corrected it in the other thread.  About 4500 sicne 2006, over 8000 sicne 2001.  Not counting mortars which are equal or in excess of the rockets.
 
2012-11-19 04:10:51 PM
imageshack.us

Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">
 
2012-11-19 04:11:40 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


No they won't. We will. If they need more money, they'll ask.
 
2012-11-19 04:12:17 PM

Kit Fister: This text is now purple: gelovani: Obama stated on the news 2 days ago that, "Israel has the right to defend itself from threats OUTSIDE its borders" (read, The Gaza Strip). So, the Gaza Strip is now not part of Israel? The US vehemently denied Palestine's request to be recognized as a sovereign nation last year, making it still a part of Israel, but now Obama says they are a separate country outside of Israel's borders and are attacking Israel??!!

F*ck US foreign policy. F*ck Israeli domestic policy. How many innocent people have to die - especially Palestinians - before this atrocity is finally stopped?!

The US generally recognizes the 1967 borders, right?

Under that position, Gaza is part of Egypt.

Psh, it's been for millenia. I mean, hell, the phaoroahs buried their own and built the pyramids in Gaza!


I think you're thinking of the Geezer Pyramids
 
2012-11-19 04:12:30 PM

I_C_Weener: Corrected it in the other thread.


Great. From all the attention I'm getting, Stealth Hippopotamus must really want to give you an earful.
 
2012-11-19 04:12:40 PM
img17.imageshack.us

/not hot like a 200 megaton airburst over LA
 
2012-11-19 04:12:54 PM
Yes. After he took out Osama, our Prez stopped by Israel and did some quick ciphering on some o dat aerospace engineering, designed, built and implemented that system in short order cuz he done seen this was a commin!
 
2012-11-19 04:13:27 PM
I don't look at this as "dumping foreign aid money into israel via the military-industrial complex", but more "israel beta testing our new tech, sparing american lives".
 
2012-11-19 04:13:51 PM

ocschwar: [imageshack.us image 400x600]

Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">


No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.

You don't see me moving to inner city Cleveland because my family has some "claim" to the land down in Collinwood Nope, I removed myself from the problem and avoided getting shot at every other day. It's a wonder these people are so god damn stubborn about living their lives in a war zone and then getting pissy when someone's leg gets blown off.
 
2012-11-19 04:15:00 PM
Headso

That whole area is full of despots and royal douchebags at least the Israelis are socially liberal and democratic by comparison.

My head is spinning: I cannot determine if this is more ignorant or more racist.
 
2012-11-19 04:17:15 PM
The Israeli policy of "Seven eyes for an eye, seven teeth for a tooth" is immoral and the United States is complicit with it.
 
2012-11-19 04:17:54 PM
No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.


Actually, this boy was born there, and his family moved from farking Morocco as refugees.

Oh, right, you don't know that half of Israel's Jews are refugees from Arab countries?
 
2012-11-19 04:18:33 PM

Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Corrected it in the other thread.

Great. From all the attention I'm getting, Stealth Hippopotamus must really want to give you an earful.


why not! Lets see if he can answer a direct question: Is Israel justified in trying to stop these attacks, if not how many missile need be fired before they are?
 
2012-11-19 04:18:42 PM
 
2012-11-19 04:19:39 PM

Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Corrected it in the other thread.

Great. From all the attention I'm getting, Stealth Hippopotamus must really want to give you an earful.



For some reason the subject of Israel and Palestine gets people all up in each other's grills...even if you don't live there. :)
 
2012-11-19 04:19:58 PM

MonoChango: seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.


The Russian 58MT Tsar Bomba was a deliverable weapon and was air-dropped from an operational bomber when it was tested. The only reason it was 58MT instead of 100MT is they use lead instead of Uranium in certain parts of the design.
 
2012-11-19 04:20:18 PM
$100,000 a rocket?!?! Damn isnt metal storm ready yet?
 
2012-11-19 04:21:46 PM

ocschwar: No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.


Actually, this boy was born there, and his family moved from farking Morocco as refugees.

Oh, right, you don't know that half of Israel's Jews are refugees from Arab countries?


How dare they! They should have stayed in Morocco and taken their beatings.
 
2012-11-19 04:21:51 PM

hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]


Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.
 
2012-11-19 04:21:57 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Corrected it in the other thread.

Great. From all the attention I'm getting, Stealth Hippopotamus must really want to give you an earful.

why not! Lets see if he can answer a direct question: Is Israel justified in trying to stop these attacks, if not how many missile need be fired before they are?



Yes.  1.
 
2012-11-19 04:22:30 PM

seadoo2006: ocschwar: [imageshack.us image 400x600]

Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">

No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.

You don't see me moving to inner city Cleveland because my family has some "claim" to the land down in Collinwood Nope, I removed myself from the problem and avoided getting shot at every other day. It's a wonder these people are so god damn stubborn about living their lives in a war zone and then getting pissy when someone's leg gets blown off.


Its sure getting Stormfronty in this thread.
 
2012-11-19 04:23:48 PM

ocschwar: No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.


Actually, this boy was born there, and his family moved from farking Morocco as refugees.

Oh, right, you don't know that half of Israel's Jews are refugees from Arab countries?


They moved from Morocco as refugees? Really? Was it a result of the pogroms BORN of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict. So, wait, let me get this straight ... They moved as refugees to a country that started the same war that resulted in their persecution in another country. Ah, got it.

My point still remains, they moved TO A WARZONE ... you get what you get. If you're a refugee, you might think long and hard about moving to one of the other 190+ countries in this world that isn't actively trying to kill Jews rather than moving to a country that has been in a perpetual war for the last 65 years ...
 
2012-11-19 04:23:58 PM

Party Boy: seadoo2006: Haha, I love that site ... drop a 50MT anywhere in the world and you're talking about monumental amounts of destruction.

USSЯ: shiatty targeting? No pЯoblem, comrade, we add more deuteЯium.



Giving credit where credit is due: I laughed.
 
2012-11-19 04:24:26 PM

hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 


All true Patriots knew long ago that missile defense wasn't a pile of Scud.
 
2012-11-19 04:25:17 PM
"They moved from Morocco as refugees? Really? Was it a result of the pogroms BORN of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict. So, wait, let me get this straight ... They moved as refugees to a country that started the same war that resulted in their persecution in another country. Ah, got it.
"

Pogroms in Morrocco started in 1892. The option of getting the fark out of there only opened in 1948.

But do parade your ignorance some more.
 
2012-11-19 04:25:46 PM

RanDomino: cman
The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president

Partisans have infinite tolerance for cognitive dissonence.


It's almost like you're saying Obama isn't what the GOP said he was.


The Stealth Hippopotamus
So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.

It seems to let Israel think they can do anything with impunity.


Israel has done what it's wanted almost since before missiles existed, much less missile defense.

SuperNinjaToad
ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

Furthermore it's only a matter of time until Qassams include simple GPS and countermeasures for whatever Iron Dome uses to track them.


Not anytime soon.
 
2012-11-19 04:26:34 PM
ocschwar
Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">

If you want to play Duelling Casualties Porn, you'll lose.


seadoo2006
You don't see me moving to inner city Cleveland because my family has some "claim" to the land down in Collinwood Nope, I removed myself from the problem and avoided getting shot at every other day. It's a wonder these people are so god damn stubborn about living their lives in a war zone and then getting pissy when someone's leg gets blown off.

Since no one's posted it in this thread yet


signaljammer
My head is spinning: I cannot determine if this is more ignorant or more racist.

What a socially liberal democracy might look like
 
2012-11-19 04:28:03 PM

RanDomino: ocschwar
Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">

If you want to play Duelling Casualties Porn, you'll lose.


This would be a bad idea.
 
2012-11-19 04:28:47 PM

seadoo2006: ocschwar: No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.


Actually, this boy was born there, and his family moved from farking Morocco as refugees.

Oh, right, you don't know that half of Israel's Jews are refugees from Arab countries?

They moved from Morocco as refugees? Really? Was it a result of the pogroms BORN of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict. So, wait, let me get this straight ... They moved as refugees to a country that started the same war that resulted in their persecution in another country. Ah, got it.

My point still remains, they moved TO A WARZONE ... you get what you get. If you're a refugee, you might think long and hard about moving to one of the other 190+ countries in this world that isn't actively trying to kill Jews rather than moving to a country that has been in a perpetual war for the last 65 years ...



The old "she was asking for it" rape excuse...
 
2012-11-19 04:29:11 PM

Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.


I remember hearing about the "patriot missiles" from the first gulf war... weak sauce from one of the usual purveyors of weak sauce.
 
2012-11-19 04:29:44 PM

seadoo2006: ocschwar: [imageshack.us image 400x600]

Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">

No, that's what happens when your parents are a bunch of blithering eejits and move your whole dumb ass family to a warzone because you have a "historical claim" to the land.

You don't see me moving to inner city Cleveland because my family has some "claim" to the land down in Collinwood Nope, I removed myself from the problem and avoided getting shot at every other day. It's a wonder these people are so god damn stubborn about living their lives in a war zone and then getting pissy when someone's leg gets blown off.


Why do you hate jews?

I kid i kid, we both know we could honestly give a flying fark one way or the other but yea....somebody is bound to say it.

We pretty much need a media and financial blackout for that entire region with nary a whisper unless one side or the other gets completely wiped out. "Is it completely and permanently over finally? no? then we dont wanna hear about it."

Been listening to this same bullshiat for 40 farking years now. Is it over? No? then who gives a fark, stop sending them my money please.
Them? Yea ALL of them, egypt too, and those farking house of saud rich farkers who dont even need my money as well. If the entire region slid into the ocean I think we could finally just applaud the silence.
 
2012-11-19 04:30:18 PM
I_C_Weener
Yes. 1.

One rocket is one rocket. One rocket followed by an aerial and naval bombardment that kills dozens of civilians means endless rockets.


vygramul
Israel has done what it's wanted almost since before missiles existed, much less missile defense.

True but this campaign is especially egregious.

Not anytime soon.

I give it two years on the outside.
 
2012-11-19 04:30:35 PM

signaljammer: Headso

That whole area is full of despots and royal douchebags at least the Israelis are socially liberal and democratic by comparison.

My head is spinning: I cannot determine if this is more ignorant or more racist.


Israel can be large, democratic, and Jewish - pick two. So far, they seem to be much more interested in large and Jewish. But the locals are not exactly more tolerant. Syria? Saudis? Egypt just underwent a democratic revolution, but the jury is still out on whether it will be the stable, tolerant society it has every potential of maintaining. The Jordanians treat the Palestinians only marginally better than Israelis.
 
2012-11-19 04:30:44 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So you admit that you were wrong and I didn't get angry?


This is going to be it for me.

You were (incorrectly) angry at the Palestinians in that thread for claiming all of Jerusalem. You keep dodging an effort to show similar anger at the israelis for it. I corrected you. Didn't matter, i got this.
Party Boy: Have you noticed that there isnt even a questionable source to present such wild claims?

The Stealth Hippopotamus:
Let me help you. First one is free.

1)Go to www.google.com (cut and paste you lazy farker)
2)type in "Palestinian Authority control over jerusalem"
3) read.

For your first lesson. I will give you a tip. It's the second story down.


Youre welcome. Normal research fees will apply on all future inquiries.


Party Boy: Palestinian Authority control over jerusalem

not seeing it


The Stealth Hippopotamus:

After following my own easy to follow instructions:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1191257255317&pagename=JPo s t%2FJPAr ti cle%2FShowFull (pops)

Now here comes the advanced part:

Compare that article to the ACTUAL headline

Headline Palestinian Authority: "With our ponies and roads made of solid gold, any settlement will have to include giving us complete control over Jerusalem and Jewish holy sites. Yes, including the Western Wall" What's arabic for Chutzpah?

I highlighted to make it easier.


That was all wrong. You can call it what you like, but its right there.

Now, considering your position was the following...

CHAZZZ: The religions of peace, pick your side.

The Stealth Hippopotamus:
I think it has come down to this. Time to pick your side. We can go on all day on how this started but in the end that will solve nothing. There can not be peace when one side (pick the side) will not rest until the other side is completely dead. Both point the finger at the other and start screaming "baby-killer" and "blood thirsty warmonger" and both have a list of things they say "prove" they have been wronged. I personally believe that the choice is obvious.


Lets see if you can provide equal treatment for the other side. You can think this isn't angry. Pick your euphemism.

Attaching a Nazi pic, even in that context, well that was just a douchebag thing to do.  That particular thread was the wrong place for it.

Frankly, I find you unbalanced in your positions. You have a problem the guy who corrected the figures? Take it up with the other guy who was wrong. You have a problem with the palestinians for wanting all of Jerusalem? Lets see your dislike when its Likud doing that.

You aren;t going to do that. You are going to pivot to another point. if so, I'm done and it can be the last word on this.
 
2012-11-19 04:31:30 PM
Been listening to this same bullshiat for 40 farking years now. Is it over? No? then who gives a fark, stop sending them my money please.


Think Israelis are going apeshiat now?

WIthout the aid keeping them on the leash, they will farking go Arab on Gaza.
 
2012-11-19 04:32:02 PM

signaljammer: Headso

That whole area is full of despots and royal douchebags at least the Israelis are socially liberal and democratic by comparison.

My head is spinning: I cannot determine if this is more ignorant or more racist.


Hey man, just because a stone-age social conservative douchebag is in another country doesn't mean we need to suddenly respect his views/culture, fark em just like fark the teabaggers in this one.
 
2012-11-19 04:32:09 PM
Moderator
This would be a bad idea.

Don't worry, unlike some people I prefer deescalation over MAD.
 
2012-11-19 04:32:42 PM

I_C_Weener: Yes. 1.


congratulations. you pass simple reading and comprehension.
 
2012-11-19 04:33:46 PM

Magorn: THAT's the "Rocket" the IDF is getting so worked up about?


Not exactly.

Fajr-5
 
2012-11-19 04:33:50 PM

Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.


"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)
 
2012-11-19 04:34:34 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: I_C_Weener: Yes. 1.

congratulations. you pass simple reading and comprehension.



I'm so proud you approve.  WTF?
 
2012-11-19 04:34:48 PM

RanDomino: ocschwar
Remember, this is what happens if one of those Hamas "glorified bottlerockets" lands too close to you. ">

If you want to play Duelling Casualties Porn, you'll lose.


if you are only post pictures of living children missing limbs, those seem ok for the thread.
 
2012-11-19 04:35:16 PM

hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]


We had that thread last week. You lost. Badly.
 
2012-11-19 04:35:53 PM

Turbo6inKY: MonoChango: seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.

The Russian 58MT Tsar Bomba was a deliverable weapon and was air-dropped from an operational bomber when it was tested. The only reason it was 58MT instead of 100MT is they use lead instead of Uranium in certain parts of the design.


The tamper in the test drop was lead instead of common U-238. The fast neutrons from the fusion reaction causes a fission reaction in U-238, greatly increasing the power. The fact they used a lead tamper meant the yield was mostly by fusion, keeping fall out to a minimum for a bomb of that yield.

There's really no need for a bomb that big. A MIRV design with 200KT warheads can take out a large area by detonating the bombs around the perimeter engulfing the interior in a firestorm.
 
2012-11-19 04:37:39 PM

RanDomino: Since no one's posted it in this thread yet


And that's what kills me about "it's Palestinian land" arguments. It's arbitrary to pick whether it was "originally" Israel's, Palestine's, etc. And tends to be indicative of whose bias the arguer is adopting.
 
2012-11-19 04:38:21 PM

vygramul: RanDomino: Since no one's posted it in this thread yet

And that's what kills me about "it's Palestinian land" arguments. It's arbitrary to pick whether it was "originally" Israel's, Palestine's, etc. And tends to be indicative of whose bias the arguer is adopting.



I'm in favor of giving it back to Rome.  They won it fair and square.
 
2012-11-19 04:38:26 PM

hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)


No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.
 
2012-11-19 04:38:52 PM

RanDomino: I_C_Weener
Yes. 1.

One rocket is one rocket. One rocket followed by an aerial and naval bombardment that kills dozens of civilians means endless rockets.


vygramul
Israel has done what it's wanted almost since before missiles existed, much less missile defense.

True but this campaign is especially egregious.

Not anytime soon.

I give it two years on the outside.


I'd take that bet. In a heartbeat. And give you odds.
 
2012-11-19 04:42:17 PM

I_C_Weener: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Corrected it in the other thread.

Great. From all the attention I'm getting, Stealth Hippopotamus must really want to give you an earful.

why not! Lets see if he can answer a direct question: Is Israel justified in trying to stop these attacks, if not how many missile need be fired before they are?


Yes.  1.


I agree- Israel would be perfectly justified in trying to stop these attacks.

However, is Israel justified in retaliating against attacks?
No.
Are Palestinians, for that matter?
Equally, no.
Is Israel attacking and then justifying retaliatory action as defence against Palestinian retaliatory action?
Yes.
 
2012-11-19 04:42:39 PM
The rule of law is alive and well in Hamas run Gaza

Link
 
2012-11-19 04:42:58 PM

ocschwar: Pogroms in Morrocco started in 1892. The option of getting the fark out of there only opened in 1948.

But do parade your ignorance some more.


The real violence towards Moroccan Jews didn't start until the Arab-Israel conflict. That's when the Oujda and Jerada pogroms became very violent and catalyzed the Zionist emigration movement back to Israel. Until then, most Jews that fled the country came the the USA, so, as I said, really, up until the start of WW2, there were many countries that were Jew-friendly they could've left to. After WW2 ended, there were also many countries that they could've moved to.

So, sorry, I don't buy that Israel was the ONLY post-1948 place Jews could've gone to avoid conflict. That simply is not true. Hell, half of western Europe became very friendly after 1945 as a "we're sorry for the Nazis" effort. Granted, that half of Europe was blown to smitherines, but still, it's not an active warzone anymore.
 
2012-11-19 04:43:18 PM
Is Israel attacking and then justifying retaliatory action as defence against Palestinian retaliatory action?


According to Hamas's own statements, their rockets are retaliating against Israel's existence, nothing more.
 
2012-11-19 04:44:16 PM

vygramul: I'd take that bet. In a heartbeat. And give you odds.


i645.photobucket.com
daaaaaaaaaaaaamn
 
2012-11-19 04:44:28 PM

hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)


Yeah - no. It's an outgrowth of SDI in the same way that the F-16 is an outgrowth of the Model-T.
 
2012-11-19 04:45:26 PM
The real violence towards Moroccan Jewsdidn't start until the Arab-Israel conflict.

Bullshiat. Jews in the Arab World were subject to casual violence continually, for centuries.

That's when the Oujda and Jerada pogroms became very violent

Those pogroms pale in comparison to the pogroms of 1892.

THe difference is that after Oujda and Jerada, Moroccon Jews had a way to get the fark out of that Godforsaken shiathole.
 
2012-11-19 04:45:56 PM

badaboom: My point still remains, they moved TO A WARZONE ... you get what you get. If you're a refugee, you might think long and hard about moving to one of the other 190+ countries in this world that isn't actively trying to kill Jews rather than moving to a country that has been in a perpetual war for the last 65 years ...


The old "she was asking for it" rape excuse...



Except in this case, it would be like that same girl moving into a half-way house for registered sex offenders, who were there after lengthy stints in prison for rape.
 
2012-11-19 04:46:04 PM

I_C_Weener: vygramul: RanDomino: Since no one's posted it in this thread yet

And that's what kills me about "it's Palestinian land" arguments. It's arbitrary to pick whether it was "originally" Israel's, Palestine's, etc. And tends to be indicative of whose bias the arguer is adopting.


I'm in favor of giving it back to Rome.  They won it fair and square.


The funny thing is that Italians like to think of themselves as Romans, when they're as Roman as much as the French are Gauls.
 
2012-11-19 04:47:29 PM
Until then, most Jews that fled the country came the the USA,

In case you didn't notice, the USA had no duty to offer Jews entry.

And has no duty.

And for a significant period of time, the USA did not, in fact, offer entry.

The main destination for Moroccan Jews besides Israel, by the way, was France. Heard the news there, lately?
The French Jewish community is also packing their suitcases.
 
2012-11-19 04:48:00 PM
Meanwhile, the US is making great progress on the drugwar.
 
2012-11-19 04:48:59 PM

Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)

No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.


Some SDI technology was used by Patriot missile systems in the 1991 Persian Gulf war to defend against Iraqi Scud missile attack
 
2012-11-19 04:53:07 PM

ocschwar: The real violence towards Moroccan Jewsdidn't start until the Arab-Israel conflict.

Bullshiat. Jews in the Arab World were subject to casual violence continually, for centuries.

That's when the Oujda and Jerada pogroms became very violent

Those pogroms pale in comparison to the pogroms of 1892.

THe difference is that after Oujda and Jerada, Moroccon Jews had a way to get the fark out of that Godforsaken shiathole.


Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly happened in 1892 in Morocco since my world history knowledge and even Googling has come up with nothing?
 
2012-11-19 04:55:16 PM

Party Boy: This is going to be it for me.


So this is you're best shot? Lets see what you got....


Party Boy: You were (incorrectly) angry at the Palestinians in that thread for claiming all of Jerusalem. You keep dodging an effort to show similar anger at the israelis for it. I corrected you. Didn't matter, i got this.


No one no where will ever try to debate that angry is a synonym for incorrect. Well, I am on Fark so there may be someone. But they should be laughed at.

Not even a single exclamation mark was used. I would demand an apology for your slander (calling me angry) but I really isn't that big of a deal to me. With my luck you would turn this into another fresh debate for you to dodge. Let's just go ahead and admit you mixed me up with someone else, it happens. I forgive you.

Party Boy: Frankly, I find you unbalanced in your positions. You have a problem the guy who corrected the figures? Take it up with the other guy who was wrong. You have a problem with the palestinians for wanting all of Jerusalem? Lets see your dislike when its Likud doing that.


I am unbalanced in my position. Never said otherwise. I think Israel is in the right here. I don't give equal weight to anyone that would fire hundreds and thousands of rockets on a continuous basis. I think that a peace deal could be worked out with Israel. If everyone would leave them alone I bet they would leave everyone else alone. I'm not happy I'm right. I wish I was wrong but the fact that we are having the exact same discussion 5 years later just adds to the evidence of just how right I was. It's like Ground Hog Day. Thank you for provide that link. I was right then, I much to may sadness I am right again.

Party Boy: You aren;t going to do that. You are going to pivot to another point.


HAHAHA it's like you're auditioning for Dancing with the Stars! I'm pivoting! I've asked you one simple question over and over again. And you've yet to even try to answer it.

Party Boy: I'm done and it can be the last word on this.


Good night my friend. Put this one on your spreadsheet as a complete and total loss. Take care
 
2012-11-19 04:56:15 PM

hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)

No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.

Some SDI technology was used by Patriot missile systems in the 1991 Persian Gulf war to defend against Iraqi Scud missile attack


They intercepted two things during the Gulf War: Jack and Squat.

This connection to SDI is circular. SDI took advantage of some tests that were conducted by other systems, like Aegis (as early as 1965), and to credit SDI is a complete canard. BMD pre-dates SDI, SDI did little to improve the technology outside those development tracks, and to credit SDI for something someone else was working on anyway is just the height of ignorance.
 
2012-11-19 04:58:55 PM

hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)

No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.

Some SDI technology was used by Patriot missile systems in the 1991 Persian Gulf war to defend against Iraqi Scud missile attack


Got anything more precise then that? That's like saying some JDAM technology is used in my car's navigation.
 
2012-11-19 04:59:19 PM
Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly happened in 1892 in Morocco since my world history knowledge and even Googling has come up with nothing?


You're right. It was the Fez massacre of 1912. 1892 was when Iran got its Jew hate on in Shiraz. There were a lot of these, and it's hard to keep them straight.

And this was the day to day environment when there weren't massacres going on:

"This edict of emancipation was confirmed by Mohammed IV's son and successor, Moulay Hasan I, on his accession to the throne 1873 and again on September 18, 1880, after the Conference of Madrid. Such edicts and promises of a similar nature made from time to time to the Alliance Israélite Universelle, even if they are seriously intended, are, however, absolutely meaningless, since they are not executed by local magistrates, and if they were they would reignite old, deeply rooted hatreds of the Jewish population. Thus, for example, the sultan Sulaiman (1795-1822) decreed that the Jews of Fez might wear shoes; but so many Jews were killed in the streets of that city as a result of the edict that they themselves asked the sultan to repeal it. According to a statistical report of the Alliance Israélite Universelle, for the years 1864-80 no less than 307 Jews were murdered in the city and district of Morocco, which crimes, although brought to the attention of the magistracy upon every occasion, remained unpunished.[33]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Morocco#Modern_ti m es
 
2012-11-19 05:00:24 PM
I heard Rick Blaine's grandpa stole a cafe and bar establishment from a Morrocan jew in 1903. 
 
2012-11-19 05:01:44 PM
ocschwar
According to Hamas's own statements, their rockets are retaliating against Israel's existence, nothing more.

Wait, I think I've figured it out. Israel-supporters are people who lack the ability to doubt what anyone says. Therefore they believe Hamas when they say they want to destroy Israel, regardless of plausibility or human nature, and they believe IDF spokesmen when they say Israel doesn't target civilians, regardless of the fact that if you target a building where there are civilians (regardless of whoever else is in it) then you have in fact targeted civilians.

How can we help these people understand that sometimes people intentionally say things that aren't true?


vygramul
I'd take that bet. In a heartbeat. And give you odds.

Sounds good. Should there be more stringent criteria than "Within two years Palestinian rockets will feature GPS and some kind of anti-anti-missile countermeasures"? That would technically let me claim victory if even a single one does. But I don't think the majority ever will (it would take more skill and more parts to smuggle), just enough to be significant. Maybe 25%? Or maybe a different criterion, like exposé articles in mainstream news sites like Wired or the New York Times?
 
2012-11-19 05:03:54 PM

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: dv-ous: doglover: Magorn: Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...

American Gods called, Neil Gaiman would like to remind you he's already written this book.

I am now $4 poorer. (Kindle store.) Screw you. :-D

May as well get 'Anansi Boys' to read when you're finished.


I love Fark threads. I get to write up a list of books to eventually download on my Kindle.. that I don't own...yet. *sigh*
 
2012-11-19 05:04:34 PM

I_C_Weener: I heard Rick Blaine's grandpa stole a cafe and bar establishment from a Morrocan jew in 1903.


He won it in a bet doing street magic
 
2012-11-19 05:04:46 PM
Therefore they believe Hamas when they say they want to destroy Israel,

Therefore when Hamas says that, a reasonable person will conclude that Hamas will continue to fire rockets whenever they can, regardless of Israel's policies.
 
2012-11-19 05:06:39 PM
People do realize the election was over a couple weeks ago, right?
 
2012-11-19 05:09:36 PM

Party Boy: This is going to be it for me.


You are outstandingly pathetic with your derpflections today. "here here! look at this five year old thread and I'll pretend my case file on you and what you said half a decade ago somehow supersedes the questions I refuse to answer."
 
2012-11-19 05:10:03 PM

ocschwar: Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly happened in 1892 in Morocco since my world history knowledge and even Googling has come up with nothing?


You're right. It was the Fez massacre of 1912. 1892 was when Iran got its Jew hate on in Shiraz. There were a lot of these, and it's hard to keep them straight.

And this was the day to day environment when there weren't massacres going on:

"This edict of emancipation was confirmed by Mohammed IV's son and successor, Moulay Hasan I, on his accession to the throne 1873 and again on September 18, 1880, after the Conference of Madrid. Such edicts and promises of a similar nature made from time to time to the Alliance Israélite Universelle, even if they are seriously intended, are, however, absolutely meaningless, since they are not executed by local magistrates, and if they were they would reignite old, deeply rooted hatreds of the Jewish population. Thus, for example, the sultan Sulaiman (1795-1822) decreed that the Jews of Fez might wear shoes; but so many Jews were killed in the streets of that city as a result of the edict that they themselves asked the sultan to repeal it. According to a statistical report of the Alliance Israélite Universelle, for the years 1864-80 no less than 307 Jews were murdered in the city and district of Morocco, which crimes, although brought to the attention of the magistracy upon every occasion, remained unpunished.[33]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Morocco#Modern_ti m es


Well, admittedly by pre-WW2 history is weak, but all I was trying to say is that that boy's parents emigrated from Morocco in a post-Arab-Israeli-War world. The 1948 Arab-Israeli war did nothing but take all the Islamic nations, turn their hatred of Jews up to 11 and start the ball rolling for a massive cluster fark in the Middle East.

While it's sad and tragic that young people, old people, and everyone is involved in this stupid 65-year battle, I can't help but feel that the Israelis share a large burden on the reason the conflict still exists. You cannot say to one religious people that it's okay for them to lay claim to a land that has been entrenched in war for millennia ... the UN and Britain picked a winner in 1948, for better or worse, and the last 65 years have been the fall out from that decision.

As I was joking up the thread, there's a serious part of me that says we should threaten to remove ALL claims on the land by turning it into a smoldering pile of radioactive rubble if these three groups cannot get along, but I'm also not that ignorant to know that the second after the bomb is dropped, you'll have everyone fighting over who's glowing green rock is who's.

Serious point: I don't give a flying fark. I'm Catholic, and my religion lays claim to a significant portion of the 'holy land', but honestly, the reason why a multi-ethnic, multi-religious form of government couldn't effectively govern that region is beyond me. I'll never understand it. It seems so easy to me not to care one god damned bit what religion someone else is. But, expecting religious tolerance from a group of people that have been fighting for 6000 years? Yeah, fuggitabout it. Blow it up. If you can't get along, nobody gets it.
 
2012-11-19 05:11:25 PM

ocschwar: Is Israel attacking and then justifying retaliatory action as defence against Palestinian retaliatory action?


According to Hamas's own statements, their rockets are retaliating against Israel's existence, nothing more.


I remember the Northern Irish Republican militants used to use similar logic to defend 'anti-British' action.
The British authorities, had enough sense not to send air-strikes against entire communities though. Instead, the British increasingly relied on intelligence-work rather than military action, and- though it took a couple of decades- ultimately, it worked.

Israel needs to stop providing examples for Hamas to use in justifying their own actions to the Palestinian people. Essentially, if Israel is genuine about defence and ultimately peace, then it needs to take the higher moral ground and cease provocation/retaliation. Otherwise its actions can only be seen as serving a strategy of dominance if not long-term conquest.
 
2012-11-19 05:15:34 PM

snuff3r: The article i read before this was an interview with a woman who lost four children all under eight in a strike against [whothefarkcares.jpg]. As a person who's lost a child and knows that pain well, a giant mother-farking fark-you-up-the-ass for every person involved in the death of an innocent child, whatever side.

You're both as bad as each other. Enjoy your hells. Especially you, Israel. Evil assholes.

/rage
//drunk


i'm sorry for your loss, and sympathy to all who have suffered loss due to the evil that men do. XXXOOO
 
2012-11-19 05:15:49 PM

Well, admittedly by pre-WW2 history is weak, but all I was trying to say is that that boy's parents emigrated from Morocco in a post-Arab-Israeli-War world. The 1948 Arab-Israeli war did nothing but take all the Islamic nations, turn their hatred of Jews up to 11 and start the ball rolling for a massive cluster fark in the Middle East.


Dude, these were people who used to have to walk barefoot in Morocco's alleys, right by the open sewers, becuase only Muslims could wear shoes.

It sucks to be hated, but it's so much worse to be despised.

Serious point: I don't give a flying fark. I'm Catholic

Oh, are you? Then look at your own church's role in all this. You're yammering on and on about why Sderot's Moroccan refugees didn't go elsewhere, well, guess what: your church had a major role in keeping the doors to Jewish emigration firmly shut throughout the 20th Century. Emigration to the US was not an option until 1965, for example.
 
2012-11-19 05:23:05 PM
"Developed in 2007 as part of a $30 billion 10-year military-aid agreement signed by the Bush administration ..."



So I guess they stop blaming Bush when it fits their narrative. Priceless.
 
2012-11-19 05:23:29 PM

RanDomino: Unless you're a complete farking moron, you'll find out why he's punching you.


Ok, he's punching you because you took his land, ruined his farm, and opressed his people and you have no intention of stopping. When he asks you to stop you say "I'm not going to stop because you are punching me"
 
2012-11-19 05:28:34 PM

RanDomino: vygramul
I'd take that bet. In a heartbeat. And give you odds.

Sounds good. Should there be more stringent criteria than "Within two years Palestinian rockets will feature GPS and some kind of anti-anti-missile countermeasures"? That would technically let me claim victory if even a single one does. But I don't think the majority ever will (it would take more skill and more parts to smuggle), just enough to be significant. Maybe 25%? Or maybe a different criterion, like exposé articles in mainstream news sites like Wired or the New York Times?


This isn't about whether their capabilities will improve, it's about whether they will matter as far as Iron Dome is considered. Iron Dome is not going to be defeated by GPS-guidance or anything the Palestinians are going to be able to deploy. Making their missiles more accurate won't matter to Iron Dome. (And they probably, generally, don't want accuracy. But that's another discussion.)
 
2012-11-19 05:30:32 PM

ocschwar: Oh, are you? Then look at your own church's role in all this. You're yammering on and on about why Sderot's Moroccan refugees didn't go elsewhere, well, guess what: your church had a major role in keeping the doors to Jewish emigration firmly shut throughout the 20th Century. Emigration to the US was not an option until 1965, for example.


I have no problem admitting that, hell, the WASP-yness of this country has only elected one Catholic President ... and then prompty shot him.

But see, that's where I differ ... I don't give one flying iota what religion you are. My uncle married a Jew back in the 1970s when they secretly wed because it was such a faux pas to do so. My SO comes from a pretty Protestant family. But that's the thing ... who the fark cares? I don't. I live my life without thinking of religion save for one hour every Sunday because that's the religion I was born into.

I'm an Irish Catholic ... 100+ years ago, there were NINA signs in many business windows ... Northern Irish Protestants had been trying to press their religion onto southern Irish Catholics. Hell, the IRA was blowing up most of Ireland for the better part of the last 40 years.

Religion is the basis of conflict and in that regard, fark religion. Thus, why I said, blow the whole of Israeli to smitherines ... if you cannot get along, you don't get to be there. Go somewhere else or live to fight another day on your radioactive wasteland. Hell, 30 years ago, I would've said the same thing about Dublin and Belfast ... wipe them both clean off the map, then wipe out the countryside. If you can't get along, don't expect to live there for very long.

Religious conflict is retarded ...
 
2012-11-19 05:30:43 PM

groovykindahate: I agree- Israel would be perfectly justified in trying to stop these attacks.

However, is Israel justified in retaliating against attacks?
No.
Are Palestinians, for that matter?
Equally, no.
Is Israel attacking and then justifying retaliatory action as defence against Palestinian retaliatory action?
Yes.



That's a fine hair you are splitting. Israel says they are targeting the locations where the missiles are coming from. If you trust Israel you believe them, if you dont you dont. Given the fact these locations are easy to move and are in public places it is hard to prove definitely. And yes they targeted Hamas leaders, what good is it to take out missile locations if the people having them built keep on? It's been mentioned earlier, Israel can't win that kind of fight. It takes far less to make a low rent missile launcher than it does to train a fighter pilot, buy him a plane, fuel it up and load it with a weapon. And when you fire a cruse missile into an apartment building you're going to kill a few people you didn't need to. But what is the alternative? Just sit there and take it?
It would be nice for the people to rise up and end the missile themselves. But that would mean death or worse if they get caught. It really sucks to be a Palestinian. I wish Egypt or Syria would take them in. I doubt that anyone would give up the chance to live in peace somewhere else than live there. I love my home as I'm sure they do to but I have to think they would jump at the chance to get the hell out of there. Yeah yeah I know some believe that Egypt, Syria and Iran are using the people but we dont know that. And I would like to think that isn't true

It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.

And as I've said before, I hope I'm wrong.
 
2012-11-19 05:32:55 PM

Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)

No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.

Some SDI technology was used by Patriot missile systems in the 1991 Persian Gulf war to defend against Iraqi Scud missile attack

Got anything more precise then that? That's like saying some JDAM technology is used in my car's navigation.



The Patriot PAC-3 uses the Extended Range Interceptor (ERINT) technology from the SDIs
TMD system.
 
2012-11-19 05:33:19 PM
Thread is tl;dr so...

I assume that it's been pointed out already that Iron Dome got it start during the George Bush administration, not Obama's:

In February 2007, Defense Minister Amir Peretz selected Iron Dome as Israel's defensive solution to this short-range rocket threat. Since then, the US$210 million system has been developed by Rafael Advanced Defense Systems working jointly with the Israel Defense Forces.

Subsequent US investment of course had ulterior motives...

With the United States on track to greatly increase funding for Iron Dome, there have been calls for technology transfer and co-production of Iron Dome in the United States. Just as the US and Israel share co-production of the Arrow missile system, with Boeing manufacturing 40-50 percent of the production content, there has been support in the U.S. Congress, media and think tanks in favor of co-production. The U.S. House of Representatives included report language in its FY-2013 Defense Authorization Act supporting Iron Dome with $680 million but also instructing that the Director of the U.S. Missile Defense Agency, Lt. Gen. Patrick O'Reilly, "should explore any opportunity to enter into co-production of the Iron Dome system with Israel, in light of the significant U.S. investment in this system." There are media reports that the Pentagon is requesting similar language in the Senate Defense Authorization Act as well as the respective House and Senate defense appropriations bills for 2013.
 
2012-11-19 05:33:40 PM

Magorn: Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)


I would read this. It would necessarily require copious amounts of humor and snark. Do it.
 
2012-11-19 05:33:43 PM

But see, that's where I differ ... I don't give one flying iota what religion you are


Well, for once you should give an iota. Because it's ridiculous for you to ask why Jewish refugees fled to Israel when your own Catholic Church worked damn hard to make that the only option.
 
2012-11-19 05:34:21 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.


I nuclear bomb strategically places is the ultimate peacemaker. You have three months to figure it out and if you fail, ka-boom. No wailing wall for the Jews. No Gethsemane for the Christians, and no Dome of the Rock for the Muslims. You all ruined your chances. Level it all and make it uninhabitable with a Co-60 laced bomb.
 
2012-11-19 05:36:34 PM

ocschwar: But see, that's where I differ ... I don't give one flying iota what religion you are


Well, for once you should give an iota. Because it's ridiculous for you to ask why Jewish refugees fled to Israel when your own Catholic Church worked damn hard to make that the only option.


You're right, drop a Fat Man on the Vatican as well. And no, I don't have to care. If the higher ups of my religion are actively working against another religion, blow them up. The Vatican doesn't listen to American Catholics anyways and even less-so the Jesuits ... we're the bastard child of the bastard child of the Holy Roman Catholic Church.
 
2012-11-19 05:38:52 PM

hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: Antimatter: hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]

Wake me when IDF shoots down a ICBM traveling a few times the speed of sound.

Because that's what Reagan was promoting. Iron dome is a local areas rocket protection for non ICBMs. It's very effective, and no one ever said such things wouldn't work.

"Iron Dome" missile defense system is an outgrowth of the U.S. Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI)

No it's not, it's an outgrowth of the patriot missile system, which was not covered by SDI, thankfully.

Some SDI technology was used by Patriot missile systems in the 1991 Persian Gulf war to defend against Iraqi Scud missile attack

Got anything more precise then that? That's like saying some JDAM technology is used in my car's navigation.


The Patriot PAC-3 uses the Extended Range Interceptor (ERINT) technology from the SDIs
TMD system.


So you're back-peddling off your claim about the Gulf War Patriot being related to SDI?
 
2012-11-19 05:40:58 PM

seadoo2006: The Stealth Hippopotamus: It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.

I nuclear bomb strategically places is the ultimate peacemaker. You have three months to figure it out and if you fail, ka-boom. No wailing wall for the Jews. No Gethsemane for the Christians, and no Dome of the Rock for the Muslims. You all ruined your chances. Level it all and make it uninhabitable with a Co-60 laced bomb.


If you think a few dozen Palestinian dead is bad, how is millions dead better?
 
2012-11-19 05:43:37 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So missile defense doesn't escalate tensions.


Not necessarily. Just in the world we actually live in.

But remember, this is rocket defense. Palestinian rockets are slower than (say) Soviet ICBMs by a factor of approximately one squintillion (which is why this kind of thing can actually work). More to your point, anti-rocket rockets do not require giant weapon-like "defenses" to be hung in space over the head of the people you're defending yourself against.

Also, an anti-rocket system that knocks down 50% of the rockets is a success. An anti-rocket system that knocks down 80% of the rockets is a resounding success. A missile defense system that knocks down 99.98% of nuclear missiles is a catastrophic failure (especially if its existence caused missiles to be launched in the first place).
 
2012-11-19 05:44:47 PM

I_C_Weener: seadoo2006: The Stealth Hippopotamus: It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.

I nuclear bomb strategically places is the ultimate peacemaker. You have three months to figure it out and if you fail, ka-boom. No wailing wall for the Jews. No Gethsemane for the Christians, and no Dome of the Rock for the Muslims. You all ruined your chances. Level it all and make it uninhabitable with a Co-60 laced bomb.

If you think a few dozen Palestinian dead is bad, how is millions dead better?


As I said, give them three months to work it out. You'd think with a Co-60 laced weapon planted firmly at their heads, they'd figure out a way to save their countries, if not, fark them. We don't need people who can't form a lasting peace on this planet anymore. I have no sympathy anymore for people who either have no desire or have no capability to have peace. Make Israel open their borders. Make the Israel and Palestine a merged state with equal representation. Make it work. I don't care how, but do it. Because after 90 days, BOOM, you all lost.
 
2012-11-19 05:48:26 PM

Magorn: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Gawd almighty, do you realize what you've just done? Now someday I'm going have to write a humor novel about the end of the world where ALL the competing doomsday scenarios from all the worlds's religions and myths come true setting off an absolute logistical nightmare...(and it will of course have to feature Thor and St MIchael going toe to toe at some point)


DO IT! And then post the link on farkus
 
2012-11-19 05:49:33 PM

ocschwar: Oh, are you? Then look at your own church's role in all this. You're yammering on and on about why Sderot's Moroccan refugees didn't go elsewhere, well, guess what: your church had a major role in keeping the doors to Jewish emigration firmly shut throughout the 20th Century. Emigration to the US was not an option until 1965, for example.




Yes, keep arguing about why the blood you spill is justified while perverting the world around and perpetrating evil on an entire people - that has always worked out for Jews, historically.
 
2012-11-19 05:52:24 PM
"Yes, keep arguing about why the blood you spill is justified while perverting the world around"

Seedoo had a specific question: why did Sderot's residents emigrate from Morocco to Israel and not elsewhere.

I gave him specific answers: because Morocco's treatment of Jews was horrific, and there were no other options.

And as for "keep arguing about why the blood you spill", we would not be spilling a single drop if not for Hamas's rocketry hobby.
 
2012-11-19 05:55:12 PM

semiotix: But remember, this is rocket defense. Palestinian rockets are slower than (say) Soviet ICBMs by a factor of approximately one squintillion (which is why this kind of thing can actually work). More to your point, anti-rocket rockets do not require giant weapon-like "defenses" to be hung in space over the head of the people you're defending yourself against.

Also, an anti-rocket system that knocks down 50% of the rockets is a success. An anti-rocket system that knocks down 80% of the rockets is a resounding success. A missile defense system that knocks down 99.98% of nuclear missiles is a catastrophic failure (especially if its existence caused missiles to be launched in the first place).



So it's just a matter of scale? Remember if you stop a Palestinian missile you save maybe (high side) 4-5 lives and some property damage. If you stop an ICBM you save millions of lives and billions in property damage. And just cause we currently cant do it doesnt me we stop trying.

Now here is a question for those who know how the defense works. Are they shooting them down over Israel? I'm just thinking that two falling rockets would lead to more damage. What happens when one misses?
 
2012-11-19 05:57:05 PM

Now here is a question for those who know how the defense works. Are they shooting them down over Israel? I'm just thinking that two falling rockets would lead to more damage. What happens when one misses?


The Iron Dome missiles cause the explosives in the Qassam rocket to detonate. After that, what comes down is about as harmful as gravel.

When one misses, it detonates itself, to avoid making things even worse, but the Qassam rocket continues, and someone might get killed.
 
2012-11-19 05:57:25 PM

ocschwar: "Yes, keep arguing about why the blood you spill is justified while perverting the world around"

Seedoo had a specific question: why did Sderot's residents emigrate from Morocco to Israel and not elsewhere.

I gave him specific answers: because Morocco's treatment of Jews was horrific, and there were no other options.

And as for "keep arguing about why the blood you spill", we would not be spilling a single drop if not for Hamas's rocketry hobby.


Again, there was all of Western Europe available to them after 1945. So the US was closed off, that's not unheard of even today. But the hundreds of thousands that emigrated to Brazil had no problems.

But you cannot honestly make the argument that it's all Hamas's fault when you know, you stole the land from the 800,000 Palestinians that were forced off their land and expelled from the newly formed Israeli state in 1948 and guess what, Israel started that war ...

Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there, form a new country for the Jews and then expect the Arab world to be all hunky-dorie with that, do you? Oh, and then go to war with the Arab World within a year of forming your new state. Yeah, mhmm, sounds like it's all "other people's" fault ... sounds to me like the Jews were just pissed off that their 'holy land' was only a territory and decided to enact some Hitler-style annexation in return for WW2 ... but in this case, the UN and Britain gave the Israelis the firepower to do what they've been incapable of doing for the last 6000 years.
 
2012-11-19 06:03:02 PM

ocschwar: Now here is a question for those who know how the defense works. Are they shooting them down over Israel? I'm just thinking that two falling rockets would lead to more damage. What happens when one misses?

The Iron Dome missiles cause the explosives in the Qassam rocket to detonate. After that, what comes down is about as harmful as gravel.

When one misses, it detonates itself, to avoid making things even worse, but the Qassam rocket continues, and someone might get killed.


thanks
 
2012-11-19 06:03:51 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: semiotix: But remember, this is rocket defense. Palestinian rockets are slower than (say) Soviet ICBMs by a factor of approximately one squintillion (which is why this kind of thing can actually work). More to your point, anti-rocket rockets do not require giant weapon-like "defenses" to be hung in space over the head of the people you're defending yourself against.

Also, an anti-rocket system that knocks down 50% of the rockets is a success. An anti-rocket system that knocks down 80% of the rockets is a resounding success. A missile defense system that knocks down 99.98% of nuclear missiles is a catastrophic failure (especially if its existence caused missiles to be launched in the first place).


So it's just a matter of scale? Remember if you stop a Palestinian missile you save maybe (high side) 4-5 lives and some property damage. If you stop an ICBM you save millions of lives and billions in property damage. And just cause we currently cant do it doesnt me we stop trying.

Now here is a question for those who know how the defense works. Are they shooting them down over Israel? I'm just thinking that two falling rockets would lead to more damage. What happens when one misses?



Well, apparently the system tries to take that into account when plotting it's intercept. For example, if a rocket is going to fall in an uninhabited area, the rocket is not intercepted. Then they also try to take into account where the debris from a successful interception or a miss will fall and change the interception point to minimize damage on the ground. Obviously you can't plan for everything and the computer does not always make a good decision, but they do try to minimize damage and expenditure of interceptor missiles.
 
2012-11-19 06:03:57 PM
Again, there was all of Western Europe available to them after 1945.

You're so wrong it's hard to know where to start. The Western European countries were pushing
Jewish DP's into Poland.

So the US was closed off, that's not unheard of even today

And the entire English speaking world. Google voyage of the St. Louis and the Evian Conference for the gory details.

Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there,

That's what the Czechs did to the Sudetenland Germans at the same time.
That's what Greeks did to Turks. That's what Turks did to Greeks.
And that's what Arabs did to Jews all over the Arab World: massacres, property confiscations. 800,000 Jews fleeing INTO Israel from Arab countries.
Not to mention India and Pakistan.
 
2012-11-19 06:05:18 PM

seadoo2006: But you cannot honestly make the argument that it's all Hamas's fault when you know, you stole the land from the 800,000 Palestinians that were forced off their land and expelled from the newly formed Israeli state in 1948 and guess what, Israel started that war ...


The preemptive argument in 3...2...
 
2012-11-19 06:07:49 PM

doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.


I

doglover: Diogenes: doglover: Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim

No. Israel plays no part in the Ragnarok.

The good news is, with global warming, the Fimbulwinter is highly unlikely.

Easy there, Thor.

What, me worry?

[images.wikia.com image 430x422]


I find these comments relevant to my interests.
 
2012-11-19 06:08:43 PM

ocschwar: Again, there was all of Western Europe available to them after 1945.

You're so wrong it's hard to know where to start. The Western European countries were pushing
Jewish DP's into Poland.

So the US was closed off, that's not unheard of even today

And the entire English speaking world. Google voyage of the St. Louis and the Evian Conference for the gory details.

Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there,

That's what the Czechs did to the Sudetenland Germans at the same time.
That's what Greeks did to Turks. That's what Turks did to Greeks.
And that's what Arabs did to Jews all over the Arab World: massacres, property confiscations. 800,000 Jews fleeing INTO Israel from Arab countries.
Not to mention India and Pakistan.


Okay, so you get the war you asked for. Now when the Islamic bomb is finally finalized and they nuke Tel-Aviv, don't come crying to the rest of the world. Deal with the bed you made yourself and stop trying to drag the US into some pissing match with Iran because they want to wipe you off the map.

Again, try turning the other cheek and going all Jesus H. Christ on your detractors ... I heard opening your borders and tearing down walls would be a good idea. Oh, and maybe letting the thousands in the Gaza Strip back into Israel to be land owners and productive members of society.

I don't particularly care is Israel wants to have their own shiat fit, but stop begging the US and the UN for aid against the rocket attacks from Hamas. Sounds like you're just begging them to rain horror down on your streets for the way you so non-chalantly say that's the way the world works when it comes to taking land from others.
 
2012-11-19 06:11:25 PM
I just had to check out what the Freepers thought of this. Of course, there's no mention of Obama insuring that Israel had this system. Instead it's "Yay Reagan! He was right about Star wars, it works. YAAAAY REAGAN. Soopid libruls must be so pissed that Saint Ronnie has been vindicated and proven right. Reagan."
 
2012-11-19 06:11:39 PM
vygramul
Iron Dome is not going to be defeated by GPS-guidance or anything the Palestinians are going to be able to deploy. Making their missiles more accurate won't matter to Iron Dome.

No, but if more rockets have a trajectory that Iron Dome responds to, then more will hit. If Hamas etc shoot 1000 but only 200 are actually heading towards anything, Iron Dome will take out 100 missiles and 100 will hit. If 800 are heading toward something, 400 will hit.

Also, I'm sure Iran is working on figuring out exactly how Iron Dome targets. I suppose it's a combination of radar and thermal signature. Possibly magnetic as well. Beat those and that intercept rate gets less impressive.

I doubt if Iron Dome will be beat but it's clear there's a lot of room for an arms race. I will note that the insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan won the technological arms race in IEDs vs IED countermeasures.


The Stealth Hippopotamus
It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.

At this point I'm half-serious about thinking a UN task force to disarm both sides might be the best solution. It could be staffed with troops from Argentina, Japan, Scandinavia, other places where nobody gives a fark about Jews or Muslims.
 
2012-11-19 06:14:55 PM

Okay, so you get the war you asked for.


So tell me: should the "Arab Jews" have just stayed in Morocco, SYria, et cetera, and continued to get massacred?

A simple yes or no would suffice here.

What we have here is a terrible ethnic war that forced some Arabs to leave the region as refugees, and forced some Jews to enter the region as refugees.

There were many such wars going on at the time.

You may not knwo this, but today's Greece once had many Turks living there.
And today's Turkey once had many Greeks living there.
You don't see Greeks and Turks rocketing each other.

You don't see Germans sending rockets into the Czech Republic.

You don't see Jews sending rockets into their former home towns in Morocco.

Yes, the Palestinians were driven out of their homes.
And Jews were driven out of their homes into Israel.

shiat happened. They have no right to send rockets over it.
 
2012-11-19 06:16:06 PM

Again, try turning the other cheek and going all Jesus H. Christ on your detractors ... I heard opening your borders and tearing down walls would be a good idea.


And be a minority among Muslims once again ? fark that. It seems you completely ignore the fact that we were meek as lambs for centuries in the face of pogroms. Didn't work well at all.
 
2012-11-19 06:17:39 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: So it's just a matter of scale? Remember if you stop a Palestinian missile you save maybe (high side) 4-5 lives and some property damage. If you stop an ICBM you save millions of lives and billions in property damage. And just cause we currently cant do it doesnt me we stop trying.


It's also worth noting that just because our publicly-known systems have an iffy hit rate, it's not inconceivable that the classified sector has already deployed something far better and far more efficacious in the meantime. By it's nature, missile shield technology is pretty damn sensitive unless it's being used as propaganda, and it could be up to 20 years ahead of the civilian sector
 
2012-11-19 06:19:50 PM

ocschwar: Yes, the Palestinians were driven out of their homes.
And Jews were driven out of their homes into Israel.

shiat happened. They have no right to send rockets over it.


I'm not sure why this argument is so popular.

The "they" here shifts from Jews-Palestinians | to | Jews-Arabs in North Africa and Middle East | and then back to | Jews-Palestinians
 
2012-11-19 06:20:02 PM

doglover: What, me worry?


cdn.motinetwork.net
 
2012-11-19 06:26:21 PM

seadoo2006: ocschwar: Again, there was all of Western Europe available to them after 1945.

You're so wrong it's hard to know where to start. The Western European countries were pushing
Jewish DP's into Poland.

So the US was closed off, that's not unheard of even today

And the entire English speaking world. Google voyage of the St. Louis and the Evian Conference for the gory details.

Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there,

That's what the Czechs did to the Sudetenland Germans at the same time.
That's what Greeks did to Turks. That's what Turks did to Greeks.
And that's what Arabs did to Jews all over the Arab World: massacres, property confiscations. 800,000 Jews fleeing INTO Israel from Arab countries.
Not to mention India and Pakistan.

Okay, so you get the war you asked for. Now when the Islamic bomb is finally finalized and they nuke Tel-Aviv, don't come crying to the rest of the world. Deal with the bed you made yourself and stop trying to drag the US into some pissing match with Iran because they want to wipe you off the map.

Again, try turning the other cheek and going all Jesus H. Christ on your detractors ... I heard opening your borders and tearing down walls would be a good idea. Oh, and maybe letting the thousands in the Gaza Strip back into Israel to be land owners and productive members of society.

I don't particularly care is Israel wants to have their own shiat fit, but stop begging the US and the UN for aid against the rocket attacks from Hamas. Sounds like you're just begging them to rain horror down on your streets for the way you so non-chalantly say that's the way the world works when it comes to taking land from others.


How will they come crying when they will be dead?
 
2012-11-19 06:29:03 PM
A jewish friend of mine claims the Jews now have their promised land. Its now called Manhattan.
 
2012-11-19 06:30:55 PM

ocschwar: Again, try turning the other cheek and going all Jesus H. Christ on your detractors ... I heard opening your borders and tearing down walls would be a good idea.

And be a minority among Muslims once again ? fark that. It seems you completely ignore the fact that we were meek as lambs for centuries in the face of pogroms. Didn't work well at all.


Deal with it. The blacks of America and the Native Americans went through a similar ordeal and you don't see them getting all uppity over starting a new nation in Guam or Puerto Rico or the Pacific atolls ... I mean, guess what, a little religious tolerance goes a long way. If you want to have a country, born of conflicted lands, and then say, "this is for Jews only go away Arabs!", well, eat the words you say and accept that people are going to be pretty pissed that you took them.

And, if you're meek as lambs, get the bigger gun. You've done just that and now you have to deal with getting pelted by rockets from Hamas. You can't just expect to peacefully steal lands from thousands of people and shove them into a containment zone in Gaza and expect everything to just be "fine". If that's the case, go back to your original borders, give the Golan Heights back to Syria and Gaza back to Egypt ... seems to me like you want to start your own country, then steal more land, then expect people to not want to kill you for it.
 
2012-11-19 06:31:49 PM
What I am confused about is, when did the GOP/RIghtwing/Christians become so fond of Israel?

Oh, yeah, when they figured they could use it as a dig against our "muslim" president.


The thing about Israel is, it's absolutely TEEMING with Jews!

You know, they people that the 1%/WASP contingency tried so very hard to keep out of their universities, country clubs, business world etc.

Also given the fact that most slajawed right wing fundie christians believe your average Jew resembles something of a carcature with a giant hook nose, and is a money grubbing, christ killing, horned devil.
 
2012-11-19 06:33:35 PM
That's gotta be a joke. The Iron Dome system has been in development since at least 2007 by Rafael Defense Systems. And it uses offshoot technology from SDI. Obama? I think not.
 
2012-11-19 06:34:10 PM

seadoo2006: Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there, form a new country


Uh . . . yeah. . .

About THAT.

seadoo2006: We don't need people who can't form a lasting peace on this planet anymore. I have no sympathy anymore for people who either have no desire or have no capability to have peace.


And um . . . THIS.

I know there's farkers living in other countries. So, maybe that's it.
But, if you're living in the U.S. then . . . ????
 
2012-11-19 06:35:19 PM
You can't just expect to peacefully steal lands from thousands of people and shove them into a containment zone in Gaza and expect everything to just be "fine".

The ethnic displacement in this war was two directional.

For every single Arab family that lost their home, there was a Jewish family that lost their home.

Yes, we have every right to demand that the Palestinians take notice of that little fact there.

Just as if any Turk gets into high dudgeon about how his family was driven out of suburban Athens, the Greeks have every right to remind him of Greek families driven west out of the mainland.
 
2012-11-19 06:36:46 PM

Tommy Moo: Can anyone name one thing this "ally" has ever done for the U.S.?


It's my understanding that they do all kinds of wetwork for us globally. Allows us to maintain plausible deniability.
 
2012-11-19 06:38:03 PM

Phins: I just had to check out what the Freepers thought of this. Of course, there's no mention of Obama insuring that Israel had this system. Instead it's "Yay Reagan! He was right about Star wars, it works. YAAAAY REAGAN. Soopid libruls must be so pissed that Saint Ronnie has been vindicated and proven right. Reagan."


I've heard and read of him being called a socialist, a communist, a fascist, a Kenyan, a turd, and a secret mooslim. But, this is the first time anyone has accused him of being an insurance man, and it happened right here on Fark.
 
2012-11-19 06:42:02 PM

WorthNoting: seadoo2006: Sorry, you can't just take inhabited territories, expel all the people living there, form a new country

Uh . . . yeah. . .

About THAT.

seadoo2006: We don't need people who can't form a lasting peace on this planet anymore. I have no sympathy anymore for people who either have no desire or have no capability to have peace.

And um . . . THIS.

I know there's farkers living in other countries. So, maybe that's it.
But, if you're living in the U.S. then . . . ????


I wholly agree with you and I live in the US ... the Native Americans should run the place. Our nation was also born of stolen lands, built with slave labor, and it makes me have a sad. But, I'm also in favor of open borders without immigration caps, I'm in favor of easily the requirements to become a US citizen, and I'm in favor of whatever needs to be done to make the Native Americans and ex-slave crowd happy. WHATEVER they want, they get, but once we do that, we're even and we can move on. The more the merrier here in the USA ... anyone that wants to become a US citizen should be allowed. Open borders for everyone. Maybe we could get our economy moving again with an influx of new and eager people ready to build their own American dream.

This whole notion that open borders would water down America is preposterous anyways.

I also think that US-born citizens should be required to take the same civic schooling and tests that immigrants are required to take.
 
2012-11-19 06:46:16 PM

Turbo6inKY: MonoChango: seadoo2006: the US drops a 50MT thermonuclear warhead on Gethsemane.

I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big. The Soviets tested one that size, but I don't think it wasn't a deployable bomb (more like three semi tractors pushed together). Besides the fact that Bush jr cut nearly half our arsenal, we haven't built any new ones in 20 years. I think the biggest we ever built was the W53 9 MT warhead used on the Titan II. All of which have been decommissioned.

The Russian 58MT Tsar Bomba was a deliverable weapon and was air-dropped from an operational bomber when it was tested. The only reason it was 58MT instead of 100MT is they use lead instead of Uranium in certain parts of the design.


And even the Russians wanted the test plane to survive.
 
2012-11-19 06:53:09 PM

hasty ambush: I blame Reagan and others for failing to listen to progressives who said missile diefense would never work 

[www.mom4freedom.com image 640x572]


get back to me when we can successfully shoot down an ICBM they're moving a few orders of magnitude faster
 
2012-11-19 06:59:28 PM

BigNumber12: Magorn: THAT's the "Rocket" the IDF is getting so worked up about?

Not exactly.

Fajr-5


a horse of an entirely different color then:
varifrank.com

carry on
 
2012-11-19 07:00:17 PM
Why can't Israel protect itself?

/Isolationist.
 
2012-11-19 07:07:57 PM

Decados: Might be time for them to realize that a good bit of the problem is them, and get over the martyr/victim complex.


Also, claiming that you are God's chosen people and making it difficult/impossible for other people to convert to your religion isn't a great way to make friends and influence people. When your entire cultural philosophy is built around telling everybody else in the world that they're inferior to you, you might just make some enemies.
 
2012-11-19 07:17:15 PM

seadoo2006: drivel


I seriously hope that you're trolling. If not, and you're that much of a hopeless idealist...

seadoo2006: But, I'm also in favor of open borders without immigration caps, I'm in favor of easily the requirements to become a US citizen


Because it works everywhere else in the world, right?

Social Security System depending on recipients' paying in over their entire lives + required ER treatment for all + increasingly expensive treatment and medication + unregulated immigration of adults = just fine, right?

You really have no idea how precarious the state of our entitlements system is, do you? Do you have any comprehension of how strictly other Social States control their immigration? Our "we'll take everyone" approach to immigration was created when our government's financial obligation to its citizens was precisely jack shiat. If you change one side of that equation, you either change the other side, or you find your state failing.


seadoo2006: and I'm in favor of whatever needs to be done to make the Native Americans and ex-slave crowd happy. WHATEVER they want


Oh, how many ex-slaves do we have running around these days? Would you rather just say "black people," or is that not politically correct enough for your tastes?

What exactly do you believe members of "that crowd" would accept as "compensation" that would cause them to instantly and permanently drop all complaints based on past wrongs?

Not too familiar with humanity, are you?
 
2012-11-19 07:19:38 PM

RanDomino: vygramul
Iron Dome is not going to be defeated by GPS-guidance or anything the Palestinians are going to be able to deploy. Making their missiles more accurate won't matter to Iron Dome.

No, but if more rockets have a trajectory that Iron Dome responds to, then more will hit. If Hamas etc shoot 1000 but only 200 are actually heading towards anything, Iron Dome will take out 100 missiles and 100 will hit. If 800 are heading toward something, 400 will hit.

Also, I'm sure Iran is working on figuring out exactly how Iron Dome targets. I suppose it's a combination of radar and thermal signature. Possibly magnetic as well. Beat those and that intercept rate gets less impressive.

I doubt if Iron Dome will be beat but it's clear there's a lot of room for an arms race. I will note that the insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan won the technological arms race in IEDs vs IED countermeasures.


Iron Dome probably simply uses multiple radars. Unless someone invents stealth missiles, that's going to be hard to defeat without some kind of airborne jammer.

The Palestinians are already changing their tactics, choosing their targets more carefully and firing volleys of greater numbers of rockets.
 
2012-11-19 07:25:58 PM

falcon176: did anyone mention that Obama is black yet


His mother is as white as the driven snow. I love things like t-shirts that say " USA's first african-american president" ,he is .5, half , 50%
 
2012-11-19 07:31:45 PM

Dumski: My son in law is from the West Bank. After hearing his stories, and doing my own non-governmental research (Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, and others) I have come to these conclusions:


Neither Human Rights Watch nor Amnesty International is anything like honest about Israel.

kindms: Either the rockets are a huge deal and it is anyones guess why Israel doesn't respond to them when they occur EVERYTIME or they are simply using it as the justification in the latest rounds of oppressive behavior with the folks in Gaza.


When it's a few Israel lives with it. When Hamas launches a barrage Israel pounds them to stop it.

Israel has the capacity and personnel to deal with these "situations" in a much more reserved, tactical response. Ramping up the fighter jets and dropping bombs on civilians doesn't do anyone any good and it certainly doesn't help Israel.

I repeatedly hear assertions of this nature--never with any reasonable explanation of what the reserved response should be.

CheatCommando: Loren: So long as they accepted second-class status.

So the answer is for the Israelis to impose said second class status on the Palestinians? It really seems Israel has gone down the Nietzchean Abyss and become what they sought to destroy if that is the case.


The Arabs impose second class status on the Palestinians.

seadoo2006: They moved from Morocco as refugees? Really? Was it a result of the pogroms BORN of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict. So, wait, let me get this straight ... They moved as refugees to a country that started the same war that resulted in their persecution in another country. Ah, got it.

My point still remains, they moved TO A WARZONE ... you get what you get. If you're a refugee, you might think long and hard about moving to one of the other 190+ countries in this world that isn't actively trying to kill Jews rather than moving to a country that has been in a perpetual war for the last 65 years ...


You've got it backwards. The *ARABS* launched the war in response to the existence of a Jewish nation on land they considered conquered. The Jews weren't accepting being second-class citizens anymore, they had to be killed.

seadoo2006: The Stealth Hippopotamus: It's exactly as I said before we've come to a point that we need to pick sides. Sometimes you cant broker a peace.

I nuclear bomb strategically places is the ultimate peacemaker. You have three months to figure it out and if you fail, ka-boom. No wailing wall for the Jews. No Gethsemane for the Christians, and no Dome of the Rock for the Muslims. You all ruined your chances. Level it all and make it uninhabitable with a Co-60 laced bomb.


The Palestinians would be happy. The Jews would lose the land and that's what they really want.
 
2012-11-19 07:32:02 PM

BigRightRear: His mother is as white as the driven snow. I love things like t-shirts that say " USA's first african-american president"



It would seem that they subscribe to the "One-drop Rule" so popular during the Slavery era.
 
2012-11-19 07:41:01 PM

Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years

Huh?

(2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540


Damn it!
You know the rules
No MATH!!!!
 
2012-11-19 07:47:59 PM

BigNumber12: BigRightRear: His mother is as white as the driven snow. I love things like t-shirts that say " USA's first african-american president"


It would seem that they subscribe to the "One-drop Rule" so popular during the Slavery era.


weknowmemes.com
 
2012-11-19 07:53:31 PM

cyberspacedout: "Our missiles will blot out the un!"

"Then we will fight in the hade!"


Ha! Hahaha love it.
 
2012-11-19 07:54:31 PM

ocschwar: You can't just expect to peacefully steal lands from thousands of people and shove them into a containment zone in Gaza and expect everything to just be "fine".

The ethnic displacement in this war was two directional.

For every single Arab family that lost their home, there was a Jewish family that lost their home.



Is that so?

Which homes? Where?


ocschwar: Yes, we have every right to demand that the Palestinians take notice of that little fact there.



Would you mind explaining and validating "that little fact there"?

Thanks.


ocschwar: Just as if any Turk gets into high dudgeon about how his family was driven out of suburban Athens, the Greeks have every right to remind him of Greek families driven west out of the mainland.



It almost sounds like you might be alluding to "displacement" that took place elsewhere.

Is that right?
 
2012-11-19 08:04:59 PM
Wow. Look at all the deluded Americans who think they should care what two tribes of filthy, stinking, ugly biblical savages on the other side of the planet do to each other.
Let's give the palis a few 60kt nukes, and let the scum finish each other. Pass the f**king popcorn.
 
2012-11-19 08:08:34 PM
Loren:


Wow, you're a trip.
 
2012-11-19 08:14:06 PM
Please.
 
2012-11-19 08:15:06 PM

Indubitably: Please.


Peas, Thank you. 

Please make peace,

people are dying.

Porridge even.
 
2012-11-19 08:19:14 PM

MonoChango: I could be wrong but I don't think the US has anything that big.


Largest US bomb ever was the Castle Bravo shot at 15MT. The

The B-53 (the last one of which was disassembled in 2011) had a yield of 9MT.

The reason they weren't made any larger was more practical than technical. Bigger bombs are also less effective - you get more bang for your buck by splitting your plutonium up into a bunch of smaller cores than putting it all in one big core.
 
2012-11-19 08:21:24 PM

Loren: The Jews would lose the land and that's what they really want.


It never ceases to amaze me how much blood has been spilled over what is some of the shiattiest real estate on the planet.
 
2012-11-19 08:27:45 PM

unlikely: Most ANTI ISRAEL president EVAR.


and Liberals actually want to believe this, because this would be good for their world aspirations, you know, because liberals want Allah to be able to make a better bean pie..
 
2012-11-19 08:33:30 PM

clyph: Loren: The Jews would lose the land and that's what they really want.

It never ceases to amaze me how much blood has been spilled over what is some of the shiattiest real estate on the planet.



God loves a good cock-fight.
 
2012-11-19 08:38:54 PM

Diogenes: Isn't the idea of rockets not being able to strike Israel one of the events leading up to the Rapture? I seem to remember that from the first book of Left Behind.

/read the series on a whim


Yeah, read the series on a whim, eh? Hey Fark Libbies!! One of your own is a closet evangelical!

Oh, and good cover with saying, "Left Behind". Is that Barney Frank's rear?

/Gawd, I'm soooooo funny.
 
2012-11-19 08:41:34 PM
I'm for deweaponizing everybody.

*)
 
2012-11-19 08:42:24 PM

snuff3r: The article i read before this was an interview with a woman who lost four children all under eight in a strike against [whothefarkcares.jpg]. As a person who's lost a child and knows that pain well, a giant mother-farking fark-you-up-the-ass for every person involved in the death of an innocent child, whatever side.

You're both as bad as each other. Enjoy your hells. Especially you, Israel. Evil assholes.

/rage
//drunk


I wish I could sound like you when I'm Fark-drinking.

All I manage to do is get 7-day time outs.
 
2012-11-19 08:43:24 PM

Indubitably: I'm for deweaponizing everybody.

*)


And by weapon I mean people hurtin' outside of yourself and your aim, and ultimately, your game...

Word.
 
2012-11-19 08:53:29 PM

seadoo2006: Deal with it. The blacks of America and the Native Americans went through a similar ordeal and you don't see them getting all uppity over starting a new nation in Guam or Puerto Rico or the Pacific atolls ... I mean, guess what, a little religious tolerance goes a long way. If you want to have a country, born of conflicted lands, and then say, "this is for Jews only go away Arabs!", well, eat the words you say and accept that people are going to be pretty pissed that you took them.


You need to look up the history of the African country of Liberia: Link
 
2012-11-19 08:53:46 PM

DON.MAC: A jewish friend of mine claims the Jews now have their promised land. Its now called Manhattan Long Island.


FTFY
 
2012-11-19 08:55:26 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Party Boy: I_C_Weener: Over 8000 rockets had been fired into Israel over the last 4 years

Huh?

(2008) 361 + (2009) 569 + (2010) 150 + (2011) 680 (rockets+mortars) + (2012) 1,540

I was told there would be no math.


That's not math, that's the Devil's Cypherin'
 
2012-11-19 08:56:55 PM
Fark dumbwads. Funding and development was done by Israel. Obama had absolutely nothing to do with this system. Another example of liberal stupidity and their groveling on behalf of their annointed one.
 
2012-11-19 09:01:31 PM

SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.


Will Israel be bankrupt before, or after, they level all of Gaza?
 
2012-11-19 09:08:39 PM

Dirtybird971: wow. That's pretty cool. So do we or don't we have the "star wars" defense system?


We don't. Star Wars was ballistic missile defense from SPACE. Anti-ballistic missiles have been around nearly as long as surface-to-air missiles. They're a lot more effective now, mainly because of better software, but they're nothing new.
 
2012-11-19 09:18:36 PM

legalgus: Fark dumbwads. Funding and development was done by Israel. Obama had absolutely nothing to do with this system. Another example of liberal stupidity and their groveling on behalf of their annointed one.


(。々°)
 
2012-11-19 09:34:07 PM

GAT_00: SuperNinjaToad: [rt.com image 370x277]
Iron Dome Defensive battery


[www.aerospaceweb.org image 550x400]

Quassam rockets


ID may kickbutt but it's not cost effective. You're using a $100 million integrated air defense network with $100,000 missile to intercept a $900 unguided rocket that a group of guys make in the back of a garage.

All Hezbollah/Hamas etc needs to do is keep firing these rockets and Israel will be bleed to financial ruins.

We've probably paid for the entire system, so they're actually bleeding us to financial ruin.


$3.1 billion in the most recent year. While that's not nothing, it's @ 0.1 percent of the U.S. federal budget. Gonna take a long time to bleed to death at that rate.
 
2012-11-19 09:40:05 PM

vygramul: BigNumber12: BigRightRear: His mother is as white as the driven snow. I love things like t-shirts that say " USA's first african-american president"


It would seem that they subscribe to the "One-drop Rule" so popular during the Slavery era.

[weknowmemes.com image 465x446]



Eh, I suppose it's how he self-identifies. Retracted.
 
2012-11-19 09:52:42 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Now here is a question for those who know how the defense works. Are they shooting them down over Israel? I'm just thinking that two falling rockets would lead to more damage. What happens when one misses?


I had the same question. From what I can tell, the idea is that two hunks of flaming metal >> one hunk of explodey metal, regardless of who it lands on.

As for the rest, I can speak more confidently to the physics/engineering argument than to the geopolitical argument. You're right, it's a matter of scale. There is nothing physically impossible about an absolutely flawless missile defense system that works the first time, the last time, and every time, and is always one generation ahead of the latest missiles. There's also nothing physically impossible about a Dyson sphere, which in some ways is different from putting a satellite in orbit only in terms of the scale. But I don't like our chances of doing it any time soon, and in the meantime there might be better ways to deal with the underlying problem of nukes.
 
2012-11-19 09:57:26 PM

legalgus: Fark dumbwads. Funding and development was done by Israel. Obama had absolutely nothing to do with this system. Another example of liberal stupidity and their groveling on behalf of their annointed one.


I'm relieved to hear that. The headline sounded like BS to begin with, and knowing Obama wasn't instrumental in wasting any of my money on this stupid P.O.S. for those assholes makes me feel better about having voted for him - something I feel just great about already! :D
 
2012-11-19 10:02:22 PM

sammyk: cman: Finally an article about Obama and Israel gets greened (unless I have missed one)

The left wing has herped and derped for days now about the evil right and their support of Israel while not saying a damn thing about Obama and his support of their actions. It will finally be nice to see the fark left take up the cause and bash the president

Nobody is going to get in an uproar over supplying defense weapons to a solid ally.


You have to keep in mind that when you go that far Right, you no longer have any idea what the Left is actually saying or doing anymore. You just have some sort of notion of everything you believe in turned upside down. It's sorta like Freudian projection bounced off a funhouse mirror.

Case in point: You hear people like Limbaugh and Coulter call the Left "evil", so you imagine that Left thinks the Right is "evil", too.
 
2012-11-19 10:12:19 PM

ciberido: Case in point: You hear people like Limbaugh and Coulter call the Left "evil", so you imagine that Left thinks the Right is "evil", too.



I see that you joined in 2004, yet this statement leads me to believe that you don't spend much time here on Fark.
 
2012-11-19 10:22:38 PM

Brubold: doubled99: So when all the Israel hater come out in threads from now on Obama will be the bad guy, too, right?
You guys love being on both sides of the fence.

Well this is the fringe left we're talking about. The same ones that hate groups like the Westboro cult here because they talk about hating gays but support fanatical Muslims who kill gays.


Another example of fantasizing about the imaginary Left.
 
2012-11-19 11:02:33 PM

legalgus: Fark dumbwads. Funding and development was done by Israel. Obama had absolutely nothing to do with this system. Another example of liberal stupidity and their groveling on behalf of their annointed one.



AHEM:

"The initial funding and development of the Iron Dome system was provided and undertaken by Israel.[20] This allowed for the deployment of the first two Iron Dome systems.[21] Subsequently, funding for an additional eight Iron Dome systems-along with funding for a supply of interception missiles-is currently being provided by the United States, with two of these additional systems having been delivered by 2012.[21] Funding for the production and deployment of these additional Iron Dome batteries and interceptor missiles was approved by the United States Congress, after being requested by President Obama in 2010.[22] In May 2010, the White House announced that U.S. President Barack Obama would seek $205 million from U.S. Congress in his 2011 budget, to spur the production and deployment of additional Iron Dome batteries.


So much for that, eh?

www.hackolog.com

Some of your rockets are belong to Iron Dome! 


/Suck it Gauza!
 
2012-11-20 12:30:52 AM
Something I really like about Fark is that left wing and right wing nuts can come together when it matters most. Thank you Fark.
 
2012-11-20 12:33:28 AM
AQ, you put so much work into your posts.
It's like watching a retard scrapbooking.
 
2012-11-20 12:34:10 AM
Boy, there sure is a lot of suction on Obama the Mulatto's manhood going on around here.

Butt then, what can reasonable people expect? Carl Levin as an honest, unbiased source capable of speaking facts? Guess he, and you never heard of Rafael Defense Systems, you know, based in israel? Radars by Israel based ELTA, software by mPrest Systems (Israel), ordnance by Rafael.

Plus, I don't suppose this short article caused you to read up on Iron Dome and Congressional funding and what Congressional funding means.

Hooks. Cumshaw. We'll offer you this in exchange for that.

Yeah, Obama ... he a real nice guy.
 
2012-11-20 12:34:53 AM
Wait, this can't be right, before the election Romney and the Conservative media were all about how Obama didn't care about Israel, was putting "daylight between the US and them, didn't meet with BiBi and went on The view instead... but-but-but.......
 
2012-11-20 12:41:55 AM

BigNumber12: ciberido: Case in point: You hear people like Limbaugh and Coulter call the Left "evil", so you imagine that Left thinks the Right is "evil", too.


I see that you joined in 2004, yet this statement leads me to believe that you don't spend much time here on Fark.


Well-played.  I'm not entirely sure that Fark really counts, however. It's hard to tell when people here are serious and when they're either trolling or deliberately exaggerating for the lulz.
 
2012-11-20 12:50:27 AM

Party Boy: Looks like theres a more indepth article on this. Someone ran the numbers, and there are inflated figures going around.

Dissecting IDF propaganda: The numbers behind the rocket attacks .


I don't believe the IDF claims for a minute, just like I don't believe much of what our own government spouts. But this guy? I'm not sure I believe that his numbers are real or that he is the disinterested third party he implies that he is.

FTFA "Phan Nguyen is a Palestine solidarity activist based in New York. "
 
2012-11-20 12:53:08 AM

eraser8: The US has always been in favor of theater missile defense. I don't know of any major organization or prominent politician who's argued against it.

What some people oppose is strategic missile defense.


I'm afraid I'm not clear on the difference, even after reading the Wikipedia article.  I gather the idea is that one is purely defensive while the other is not?
 
2012-11-20 01:08:00 AM

starsrift: On the plus side, if Hamas keeps firing more rockets, economy of scale insists that the price of the intercepting missiles will go down!
/ human life does not have a dollar value, no matter what the courts say


That's a noble sentiment, but as a practical matter, one MUST put some sort of value on human life. If you say "human life does not have a dollar value" you are effectively saying that one human life is worth an INFINITE amount of money.

And that, in turn, means that a medical treatment that would, say, cure diabetes were found, but cost a trillion dollars per person, "human life does not have a dollar value" would mean that we would be obligated to cure every diabetic at a trillion dollars per. Pretty soon we'd have beggared ourselves, and then when we get around to the patient who isn't diabetic but who has a heart condition, we won't have the $100 needed to buy him the medicine he needs to stay alive.

It's like triage on the battlefield. When you can't possibly save everybody, you're forced to pick and choose who gets saved and who dies. Even if you "refuse to decide" and either pick people at random or adopt a "first come, first served" policy, you've STILL chosen a selection process --- just not a very efficient one. An efficient selection process to determine who gets care and who is allowed to die may seem cold-blooded or heartless, but it saves lives.
 
2012-11-20 01:11:35 AM

Gdalescrboz: So liberals now hate Obama?


Yes. Because all liberals either love someone or hate him. There's never any in-between, and all liberals change their positions in synch like a school of fish.
 
2012-11-20 02:15:48 AM
Hamas firing rockets and demanding peace with Israel. If Hamas wants peace it would stop firing rockets. Hamas is taking a page from Syria. Saying one thing and doing something counter productive.

Read Israel cabinet member wanting to wipe Hamas out of Gaza. Mmmm -- not so much.

Missiles, mortars, ...etc, all cost money. Why don't Hamas use that money to help Gaza? Then, today I read Ireland supports Hamas peace. Ready to surrender Irish card.

Hoping for the best. Expecting the worst.
 
2012-11-20 07:32:19 AM

ciberido: eraser8: The US has always been in favor of theater missile defense. I don't know of any major organization or prominent politician who's argued against it.

What some people oppose is strategic missile defense.

I'm afraid I'm not clear on the difference, even after reading the Wikipedia article.  I gather the idea is that one is purely defensive while the other is not?


One shoots down short-range, conventional missiles. The other one shoots down intercontinental, nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles. Having the ability to shoot down ICBMs would give a nuclear power a first-strike capability, which is considered destabilizing.
 
2012-11-20 07:45:22 AM
Jerusalem is Islam's third holiestest site!

let's fire rockets at it!
 
2012-11-20 08:50:14 AM
You'd think the Israelis would see the irony in their actions. Walling ethnic groups into ghettos, blaming them for all of their problems, advocating their annihilation, using chemical weapons on civilians, claiming that the Israelis have some special world destiny....
 
2012-11-20 09:26:16 AM

Tell Me How My Blog Tastes: seadoo2006: Deal with it. The blacks of America and the Native Americans went through a similar ordeal and you don't see them getting all uppity over starting a new nation in Guam or Puerto Rico or the Pacific atolls ... I mean, guess what, a little religious tolerance goes a long way. If you want to have a country, born of conflicted lands, and then say, "this is for Jews only go away Arabs!", well, eat the words you say and accept that people are going to be pretty pissed that you took them.

You need to look up the history of the African country of Liberia: Link


Ah, the good ol' Liberia argument. Yes, so a bunch of white men, after conquering and dividing Africa, decided to set aside a small piece of shiatty land so they could send all the slaves that were freed back to Africa.

As if saying to a bunch of ex-slaves, sorry guys, we know we kidnapped all of you and brought you 2000 miles from your homes and then systematically destroyed the very nations you once had, well, now that we can't own your asses, we're kicking you out of America and sending you back to a "country" we founded, just for you black people.

We're even now, right? Please? Oh, please don't be angry with us ...
 
2012-11-20 11:08:51 AM
You mean a system developed and advocated by Reagan that liberals spent decades screaming against?
 
2012-11-20 11:09:24 AM

ciberido: BigNumber12: ciberido: Case in point: You hear people like Limbaugh and Coulter call the Left "evil", so you imagine that Left thinks the Right is "evil", too.


I see that you joined in 2004, yet this statement leads me to believe that you don't spend much time here on Fark.

Well-played.  I'm not entirely sure that Fark really counts, however. It's hard to tell when people here are serious and when they're either trolling or deliberately exaggerating for the lulz.



I struggle with it. I'm a serious, engineery sort of guy, so I usually look for people to be sincere first and foremost, actually wanting to debate ideas. But my detector is getting better.

I do think that's one of the more common criticisms of the current Republican party, though - the women's-rights-denying, Grandma's-Medicare-snatching, factory-shuttering, job-outsourcing, Immigrant-frightening, minority-hating evil Republican. And I'll even admit that there are a fair number of people on the right whose rhetoric and actions could justly be described as evil.

A reasonable person, however, recognizes that the Republican Party certainly does not have a monopoly on hate, ignorance, bigotry, and evil - and that the people who most loudly proclaim that it does are fantastic, if depressing, case studies in confirmation bias and politics-as-a-team-sport.
 
2012-11-20 12:21:53 PM

Tommy Moo: The Israeli policy of "Seven eyes for an eye, seven teeth for a tooth" is immoral and the United States is complicit with it.



The strategy of modern war is subject to fads and trends just like anything else. In all the newest textbooks, say everything this side of Sun Tzu, you do not strike back with proportionate force. That just creates a protracted battle.

If anything, Israel is doing it wrong. Go in there and level about a quarter of Gaza, then say "this is horrible, this should never happen again, let's talk peace now, ok?"
 
2012-11-20 04:40:28 PM

lordaction: You mean a system developed and advocated by Reagan that liberals spent decades screaming against?


No. We're talking about Israel's Iron Dome system.
 
2012-11-20 04:52:56 PM

vygramul: lordaction: You mean a system developed and advocated by Reagan that liberals spent decades screaming against?

No. We're talking about Israel's Iron Dome system.


Which was developed from the Star Wars system that Reagan pushed. It is a direct result of his effort.
 
2012-11-20 05:13:09 PM

lordaction: vygramul: lordaction: You mean a system developed and advocated by Reagan that liberals spent decades screaming against?

No. We're talking about Israel's Iron Dome system.

Which was developed from the Star Wars system that Reagan pushed. It is a direct result of his effort.


False. Iron Dome was developed separately. It's a nice talking point I'm sure you're eager to believe, but it's simply an unsupported assertion. Even Patriot isn't the direct result of SDI, and it even uses some of the same interceptor technology. The US was intercepting missiles with missiles in the '60s, and any link of a tactical system to the goals and entirely different problems than the strategic threat posed by ICBMs is either ignorant or disingenuous.
 
2012-11-20 07:43:28 PM

mbillips: ciberido: eraser8: The US has always been in favor of theater missile defense. I don't know of any major organization or prominent politician who's argued against it.

What some people oppose is strategic missile defense.

I'm afraid I'm not clear on the difference, even after reading the Wikipedia article.  I gather the idea is that one is purely defensive while the other is not?

One shoots down short-range, conventional missiles. The other one shoots down intercontinental, nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles. Having the ability to shoot down ICBMs would give a nuclear power a first-strike capability, which is considered destabilizing.


Thanks.
 
2012-11-20 08:00:18 PM
In all fairness, Israel DID pay for it....think of it more as flipping a house. Obama got 70 mil approved for the purchase, and then re-sold it for a profit. A communist did a business deal? Now THAT is impressive.
 
2012-11-20 08:14:37 PM

ciberido: mbillips: ciberido: eraser8: The US has always been in favor of theater missile defense. I don't know of any major organization or prominent politician who's argued against it.

What some people oppose is strategic missile defense.

I'm afraid I'm not clear on the difference, even after reading the Wikipedia article.  I gather the idea is that one is purely defensive while the other is not?

One shoots down short-range, conventional missiles. The other one shoots down intercontinental, nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles. Having the ability to shoot down ICBMs would give a nuclear power a first-strike capability, which is considered destabilizing.

Thanks.


Unfortunately, he's wrong about the first-strike capability. But the real problem with crediting it to Reagan is that the development programs pre-existed him. SDI initiated some programs but it also subsumed a lot of existing programs, including terminal ballistic missile defense - the feature for which Patriot PAC-3 is most notable. But Iron Dome followed a different development track and is effectively completely unrelated.
 
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