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(Guardian)   Empowered by the Hostess strike, the Black Friday Walmart strike begins early   (guardian.co.uk) divider line 176
    More: Followup, flight attendants  
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18436 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Nov 2012 at 4:16 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
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Archived thread
2012-11-18 03:22:00 PM
15 votes:

tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...


Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown? Where do you think the folks that worked in those businesses went? Where else would they go?

Wal-Mart is flat-out exploitative, and if you think otherwise, you're dreaming.
2012-11-18 03:17:07 PM
14 votes:

tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...


As someone who studies labor markets, I can say that there really aren't that many options for "unskilled" or "low-skilled" jobs in this economy. Retailers have largely followed Wal-mart's lead and have increasingly relied on low-wage, part-time work that offers next to zero benefits. Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.
2012-11-18 03:44:08 PM
8 votes:
So, corporations upper management can stand united when it comes to deciding employee benefits, but employees can't stand united to decide employee benefits?
2012-11-18 04:32:08 PM
7 votes:
The central story of the United States is the idea that if you work hard, sacrifice, delay gratification, save and live frugally, in the end you will get ahead and your children will have an opportunity at a better life. Wal Mart, and other stores of their ilk, make a mockery of that ideal by having full-time employees still on public assistance. What is popularly railed-against as lazy people taking advantage of the system is often more a form of corporate welfare than one that benefits the individuals collecting the checks/food stamps/WIC vouchers, etc.
2012-11-18 03:54:17 PM
6 votes:

whistleridge: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown? Where do you think the folks that worked in those businesses went? Where else would they go?

Wal-Mart is flat-out exploitative, and if you think otherwise, you're dreaming.


We had a huge debate here in New Orleans regarding Wal-Mart. The point of contention was that it would put the mom 'n pops up and down Magazine St. out of business. Thing is, that didn't actually happen. However, the level of service is far higher, which is why we all still shop at those places. I don't care that my trip will cost an extra $5 or so. The peace of mind is worth paying for. No, I am not even close to wealthy.

I love my local ACE store, even though they're a chain. It doesn't matter if a hammer is $2 more than the Chinese one at Wal-Mart...they take the time to help me, and all the elderly black ladies call me "dawlin.'" Always leave the store with a smile on my face, as opposed to risking a homicide charge whenever I go to Wal-Mart. You can't put a price on an intangible like that.
2012-11-18 02:53:24 PM
6 votes:

basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.


wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.
2012-11-18 12:39:27 PM
6 votes:
Good for you employees.
/Will not be doing any Christmas shopping at Walmart anyway
2012-11-18 04:31:03 PM
5 votes:

hbk72777: Not everyone celebrates Thanksgiving. Maybe the Jews, Muslims, Jehovahs, etc WANT THE WORK


Its not a religious holiday, you know.

There's nothing in the Bible that says "And verily did Jesus feast upon the turkeys and stuffing and mashed potatoes and pie, then get drunk and watch football. So sayeth The Lord. Amen".
2012-11-18 05:13:29 PM
4 votes:

clowncar on fire: coco ebert: Awesome. Go for it, workers!

Remember- wages go up, the increase is passed onto the consumer. Win!


arch.413chan.net


If it means that those workers have a better life and perhaps even make enough to afford things at places other than WAL*MART, I'm all for it.

Remember, just because you fap to Ayn Rand doesn't mean that everyone does.
2012-11-18 05:03:07 PM
4 votes:

FarkerSnow: Strikers deserve the hero tag.


imageshack.us


Indeed.
2012-11-18 04:49:51 PM
4 votes:
Link Article from a Federal Way, WA, newspaper.

"Between 20 and 30" Walmart employees "from six Western Washington Walmart stores" gathered at one store for this rally.

Gonna have to step it up, people.

As for you free-marketers who say, "Well, the worker CHOSE Walmart," that's like saying a starving beggar chooses the guy who flips him just a penny. Fark you all.
2012-11-18 04:47:56 PM
4 votes:

p51d007: Fine....go on strike...worked well for Hostess, Eastern Airlines, the auto manufacturers and countless other UNION shops. Yes, Wally world isn't union, but there are a lot of unions that want a piece of the walmart pie. In this Obama economy, I wouldn't be so quick to go on a strike. With 9+% unemployment, there are a LOT of people that would be willing to have that "low wage" job, even without benefits.
Yes, there have been downsizing due to the economy, but, you have to stop and ask yourself something.
Unless you are in high school, college, or are retired, you have to ask yourself something. Why are you only qualified to work a minimum wage job, (even if the economy was good)?
No one forces you to work at a particular job, quit, go somewhere else.


You see, these two statements are directly at odds with each other.
2012-11-18 04:09:29 PM
4 votes:

basemetal: Weaver95: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.

Working for WalMart, other than management (and even them sometimes), is not rocket science, and it doesn't take that long to get an employee up to speed.


it costs more than most people realize. not merely in terms of training but in terms of lost revenue, lost consumer confidence and time.
2012-11-18 03:37:13 PM
4 votes:

Bontesla: Good for you employees.
/Will not be doing any Christmas shopping at Walmart anyway


I had to go there recently because it was the only store open that late, and I desperately needed something.

I'm not trying to pull a hipster dislike of the store; I genuinely despise going there and feel like I'm at the cusp of a heart attack each minute I'm there. Crotchfruit everywhere, muffin-tops, women beating their children...

Anyway, I'm proud of the workers for even planning a walk-out, but at the same time, they have to work or starve. Wal-Mart knows they have this leverage, unless all the employees planning to walk out have spouses that can support them.
2012-11-18 12:46:44 PM
4 votes:
People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...
2012-11-18 05:13:32 PM
3 votes:

jshine: hbk72777: Not everyone celebrates Thanksgiving. Maybe the Jews, Muslims, Jehovahs, etc WANT THE WORK

Its not a religious holiday, you know.

There's nothing in the Bible that says "And verily did Jesus feast upon the turkeys and stuffing and mashed potatoes and pie, then get drunk and watch football. So sayeth The Lord. Amen".


Psst...it actually kind of is, just pushed back a tad. See: Feast of Tabernacles


Hate to think I'm living up to the old saw that atheists know biblical versus better than religious nuts.
2012-11-18 04:55:46 PM
3 votes:

Mael99: Friskya: Jon iz teh kewl: i turned down a job at Best Buy cause unemployment pays more.

You sound Democrat.

Because if you continued to collect unemployment, you were in violation of unemployment regulations and lied on your weekly statement by turning down work.


Know how I know you've never read the details about unemployment?

/You aren't required to take a job that would net you less money than your unemployment checks.
2012-11-18 04:52:33 PM
3 votes:

BarkingUnicorn: Link Article from a Federal Way, WA, newspaper.

"Between 20 and 30" Walmart employees "from six Western Washington Walmart stores" gathered at one store for this rally.

Gonna have to step it up, people.

As for you free-marketers who say, "Well, the worker CHOSE Walmart," that's like saying a starving beggar chooses the guy who flips him just a penny. Fark you all.


They simultaneously believe that you can just up and get another job on a whim while there are hundreds of others waiting to fill that position for you. There's no way these can both be true.
2012-11-18 04:48:18 PM
3 votes:
jshine
Maybe its the labor market saying "there are too many workers"?

Well let's just get rid of a few million of them, right?

Or maybe the problem isn't the number of workers, but the fact that most of the gains in productivity over the past several decades have been taken as profit by the business-owning class, rather than used to actually benefit humanity.

Capitalism- what other system can actually have a "crisis of overproduction"? That's right! Everyone's homeless and starving because we're TOO PRODUCTIVE! (and so the market is saturated and it's hard for investors/owners/managers to get returns by increasing sales, so they start cutting costs- wages and employment- to keep quarterly profits going up) Who still thinks this is a good idea, ffs??
2012-11-18 04:42:51 PM
3 votes:
One of the guys from the Merita bakery picket line came in the shop yesterday and asked if we were hiring, my apprentice asked him if he knew how to make kerfing (the one apprentice job she truly loathes) he looked at her blankly so she sighed and shooed him out the door, by the end of the day 3 more came in, all (unfortunately for my poor abused underling) had no idea what kerfing was.

/128 people lost their jobs when that plant closed
//The local Wally worlds won't have much problem replacing any who walk off
//my apprentice is grumbling about how I am making her work thanksgiving, she has to help cook the turkey then play fiddle in the after dinner jam session
2012-11-18 04:41:56 PM
3 votes:
Good. As an actual libertarian (note the small L), labor has just as much of a right to organize as capital. Free market and all that.
2012-11-18 04:40:59 PM
3 votes:
tbhouston
People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

except for the police who will throw them out of their house and board it up if they don't, and places with plenty of food that demand these strange green slips of paper before they'll give any of it
2012-11-18 04:31:02 PM
3 votes:
Fark WalMart. Welcome to your first day on the job, here's a packet telling you how to apply for TANF and WIC because the Walton heirs need more Gulfstreams.
2012-11-18 02:46:41 PM
3 votes:
And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.
2012-11-18 06:06:19 PM
2 votes:

Silly Jesus: Ditch diggers work "harder" than neurosurgeons. WTF is the point in this line of argument?


That the "hard work" fetish is a smokescreen... compensation in this country is about skill sets, education, and personal relationship (connections). "Hard work" is a rhetorical device used on credulous people to keep them from realizing that you are screwing them over.
2012-11-18 06:02:59 PM
2 votes:
i182.photobucket.com

i182.photobucket.com

i182.photobucket.com

i182.photobucket.com
2012-11-18 05:58:41 PM
2 votes:

Silly Jesus: Most people can't work hard!!!


Among the hardest working people around are people who make very little.
2012-11-18 05:49:07 PM
2 votes:
Those of you folks who don't care to hear about anecdotal stories about how WM has badly treated local economies, well, those stories nonetheless represent REAL situations for REAL people. I won't go into detail but I've seen first-hand how local mom-n-pop stores in small towns have been eradicated by the arrival of a WM. And it's not like the people who live in small towns have a choice when it comes to what they are forced to deal with. WM takes advantage of small economies to the detriment of those local populations and that's a fact.
2012-11-18 05:42:49 PM
2 votes:

DrPainMD: PS. Retail has ALWAYS been a minimum wage job.


no it hasn't and even today there are retailers that don't play min wage or very close to it. Costco doesn't pay min wage.

ronaprhys: Not even close.


yeah actually it is.
2012-11-18 05:31:21 PM
2 votes:

cig-mkr: Why is it that the WalMarts are being singled out? Maybe because of their massive profits vs. pay scale and benefits?
Other companies are really just as bad as WalMart. Look at McDonalds, Starbucks, Target, actually most retail places. They don't have benefits or pay very well either.

.

Because when Sam was alive, the employees did have good benefits. As soon as the dirt hit his coffin, Walmart has chipped away at everything he made respectable. I worked for walmart for six years. In those six years, I saw the 90 day raise go away, the sunday pay difference go away, the "extra" raise where if you were completely excellent, you got a second raise within your year raises, benefits get worse for those that were full time.

/Once had a Corporate manager ask me why I wasn't stocking eggs through a wall.
2012-11-18 05:22:11 PM
2 votes:

dickfreckle: Anyway, I'm proud of the workers for even planning a walk-out, but at the same time, they have to work or starve. Wal-Mart knows they have this leverage, unless all the employees planning to walk out have spouses that can support them.


...when it gets to the point that you'd rather starve than work at Wal-Mart, they lose the leverage.
2012-11-18 05:19:19 PM
2 votes:

Great Janitor:
Because the only employer is Walmart? No temp services, no restaurants or dry cleaners. No options at even self employment? Either work at Walmart or become homeless?


A lot of small towns don't have many employment options once manufacturing shuts down and Walmart drives off the Mom n Pops. In southern Illinois, where my mom (and the rest of my family) lives, the self-employment market is over-saturated with people doing freelance handyman work, lawn care, auto detailing, selling puppies and/or meth, etc. They're not making enough to pay the bills, much less save up enough cash to move where the jobs are.
2012-11-18 05:15:12 PM
2 votes:

A Day Older than Yesterday: whistleridge:
Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown? Where do you think the folks that worked in those businesses went? Where else would they go?

I believe you're thinking of the Ames stores in the 1950's and 1960's that put a significant number of mom & pops out of business. Please study some business history before you post the well worn cliche. You may also want to read about hows malls really destroyed Main Streets in the 1960's and 1970's.

/shops at Walmart and has shopped at Toys-r-us, Barnes & Noble and Target.
//Sam Walton gave the max to Obama's Victory Fund two cycles in a row.


Sam Walton died in 1992, so I'm going to need a citation.
2012-11-18 05:10:04 PM
2 votes:

UsikFark: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

Pssh. They're going to bring in strike-busters from a correctional facility in AR.


Or maybe call Pinkerton to help with some historical reenactment.
2012-11-18 05:03:30 PM
2 votes:

whatshisname: What happens when ALL the companies treat their employees badly?

Should a company merely be a profit centre at any cost or should profits be secondary to providing a good living to employees and excellent products and services to consumers?


Two thoughts:

1) If all the loyal, capable employees left abusive employer relationships or at least worked hard in their off time to find a way to make themselves sufficiently desirable to the workforce to do so, there would certainly be fewer bad companies turning a profit. I'm not saying you're going to free every prisoner and topple the Wal-Marts of the world, but Great Janitor is right. You're sure not going to change it from the inside. The only thing you can do it take whatever value you actually bring to the company out the door with you.

2) A good living is important, but being underpaid is not the same thing as being abused by your employer. I've definitely worked a couple of companies where I was very happy being paid less than stellar wages because they were just plain decent people who treated me fairly. (Granted, I quit to join a company that literally doubled my salary, but still. The owner is still my friend and I still contract for him in my free time because he's just the best to deal with and he made it possible for me to leave in a way that we both respect each other a lot and want each other to succeed.)

In any case, my statement was not intended for the macro level. It's individual advice. I've been there. I gave two years of my life to a company that got off on psychologically abusing their employees while demanding 20-30 hours of overtime weekly. Despite already being underpaid, I would have been better off spending that time making 20% less somewhere moderately pleasant for a mere 40 hours a week.

/ POW/MIA. My former coworkers are not forgotten.
2012-11-18 04:58:08 PM
2 votes:

The_Gallant_Gallstone: p51d007: No one forces you to work at a particular job, quit, go somewhere else

Why do you hate it when people innovate to better their lot?

mbillips: Farmers and factory workers between 1870 and 1940 had it WAY worse than Wal-Mart employees today.

People in 1870 had it bad, so let's cut everyone's pay to what people made in 1880!


I don't want to go back to 1870s economics. I want to go back to post-WWII consensus economics (strong unions, and lots of government investment in people and infrastructure). Basically, get a time machine and tell Hinckley to buy something more powerful than a .22 (I keed, assassins suck, except maybe for Czolgosz).
2012-11-18 04:56:55 PM
2 votes:
Most of the "big box" stores keep their employees down to 20 hours a week, so as not to pay full time benefits.

That also means I have to pay food stamps for people who would not need them otherwise, and every time I see a line at every register and 12--18 registers closed, I walk out, leaving the merchandise in the cart.

Doesn't do a damn bit of good but it makes me feel better.
2012-11-18 04:54:28 PM
2 votes:
Great Janitor
Honestly, if you don't like the way your company treats you, find another job.

You sound "robotics graduate from Texas"y.

Because the only employer is Walmart? No temp services, no restaurants or dry cleaners. No options at even self employment? Either work at Walmart or become homeless?

Precarious workers have a wide selection of low-paying and dehumanizing jobs.


GranoblasticMan
You see, these two statements are directly at odds with each other.

The secret code is "Shut up and work harder, serf!"


deanayer
The unions drove the company into bankruptcy

The managers gave themselves 80% pay raises last year.
2012-11-18 04:52:23 PM
2 votes:

freewill: ^^^ This.

If you're at a company that treats you badly, do whatever you need to do to get out. Life is too short, and if the pay was good enough to justify it, you wouldn't feel like you needed to justify it anymore.



What happens when ALL the companies treat their employees badly?

Should a company merely be a profit centre at any cost or should profits be secondary to providing a good living to employees and excellent products and services to consumers?
2012-11-18 04:43:03 PM
2 votes:
I predict that it will soon be even harder to spot a helpful employee in a WalMart store.

In my experience, in addition to occupying the locations of old K-mart stores, WalMart stores have this in common with the aged chain: if you look at an employee, they disappear.

They will happly stock shelves or stand around or whatever it is that employees do when they are not working, but the moment you have a question or have made a decision and need help getting something down from twenty feet over your head, they are nowhere to be found.

Soon they will not be waiting for you to decide to buy something. They will be gone.

There is something seriously quantum mechanical going on in the giant box retail trade. Is that an employee? Look and they will either disappear or turn out to be an employee who is serving somebody else and won't be free until they are done--at which time you will look again and they will be gone or else serving another employee.

It is impossible to get servce in a service economy. I can see why some nutters want to go back to a gold-based economy, but then it would be impossible to find any gold. Gold is too useful to sit around in vaults, so I favour a fiat currency which lets it get out and do something once in a while.
2012-11-18 04:36:26 PM
2 votes:

hbk72777: Maybe the Jews, Muslims, Jehovahs, etc WANT THE WORK


I honestly can't think of a single Jewish family I know that doesn't celebrate Thanksgiving, and I am a practicing Jew.
2012-11-18 04:33:44 PM
2 votes:
I don't like this idea, because soon we will hear in the news of "Walmart scabs".

And Walmart scabs sound itchy and infectious if you pick them.
2012-11-18 04:27:17 PM
2 votes:
i turned down a job at Best Buy cause unemployment pays more.
2012-11-18 04:25:21 PM
2 votes:

basemetal: Weaver95: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.

Working for WalMart, other than management (and even them sometimes), is not rocket science, and it doesn't take that long to get an employee up to speed.


The union knows that, and that's why they're not doing a full-out strike. They're doing brief, targeted walkouts, which bleeds Wal-Mart, but doesn't get to the point where Wal-Mart would save money by firing the workers and hiring new ones.

If the Hostess unions had been as smart, you might still be able to buy Twinkies (probably not; that company was so mismanaged and overleveraged that labor problems were the least of it).
2012-11-18 04:23:44 PM
2 votes:
Good. I'm sick of Walmart encouraging it's employees to get on welfare instead of providing them with insurance and a living wage. I try not to do business with companies like that.
2012-11-18 04:22:01 PM
2 votes:
As the greatest philosopher, politician, businessman, and video game player to ever walk this Earth, you should take me seriously when I say that Wal-Mart is the highest form of art to ever exist.
2012-11-18 04:18:59 PM
2 votes:
I haven't bought anything on black friday in 4 or 5 years. WHO CARES!
2012-11-18 03:55:31 PM
2 votes:

coco ebert: Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.


But it is incredibly Libertarian.
2012-11-18 03:14:38 PM
2 votes:
Awesome. Go for it, workers!
2012-11-19 12:27:06 AM
1 votes:
Don't the executives at Wal-Mart understand that the world owes things to people? They were SPECIAL enough to BE BORN, for goodness' sake. Only many billions of people have ever BEEN BORN before. Can't they see how unique and special every mouth-breathing idiot that's too lazy to get a real job is? How much they DESERVE just for BEING?
2012-11-18 11:50:29 PM
1 votes:
Capitalism isn't a system. It's a component. Socialism is a component, All these ostensibly absolute sociopolitical / economic constructs are just components of management methods that mostly work. The ideologies are just the mechanism, though. The the people who oversee them are what makes them work or be ill applied to the point where they do not.

We built all of this stuff on this planet to serve US. Greedy men try and convince us that it's the other way 'round.

Corporations are not people. No, they're not. That law is pure fantasy like saying "red is blue for the purposes of this particular construct", but it isn't, is it? Nope.

All of this "who owes who what, who should kiss who's ass, who is or isn't obligated to do what for whom" bullsh*t is red herrings they feed yo while they clean out the safe. And to see how addicted we are to bad ideas as a norm. And do you know why? Because if everybody to whom we attribute authority keeps saying "well, you can't have anything good unless you accept something bad to get it", and we keep believing it, we're overlooking the fact that accepting that idiot's delight logic means that the "good thing" isn't good at all. It's just leverage to fit your rear end for a larger size boot. You can only keep a slave class for so long, even if you never have to smell their stink or throw bread in their cage. History will eat you if you don't read it's map. And this is nothing more than a rerun.
2012-11-18 10:53:51 PM
1 votes:

Dinkledort: Why on earth would anyone be inspired to strike by18,000 people losing their jobs thanks to their union?


Ah, yes, it's the unions fault they all lost their jobs and not the fault of upper management that negotiated lower wages with the unions the LAST time and then voted everyone in upper management pay raises. Mhmm ... yep ...

How can anyone be AGAINST unions? It's the most basic ideal of democracy alive today. The fact that people can organize and demand benefits en masse that they would never be able to demand individually. They give power back to the employees. See, it's a purely basic power struggle in which one group (the business owners) usually can't afford to fire, rehire, and retrain employees that choose to strike and unions who can't ask for too much because of the reality of the company or being fired en masse (like Reagan did in the 1980s with the ATCs).

See, if you're against unions, you're against the basic freedom and liberty that is afforded us in this country and you're against the basic ideal of how the free market works. If your workforce feels their labor is being undercompensated, well, that's the basis of capitalism. You buy the labor at whatever the market will support ... your market essentially just told you to fark off and die when they strike.

It's a beautiful system and I can't see why anyone could be against unions. If you really feel like they are getting too much power, fire all your union workers and rehire new people. I'm sure retraining will be far cheaper than the $1/hour raise your old workforce was demanding ... facepalm.
2012-11-18 10:43:24 PM
1 votes:

clowncar on fire: HempHead: clowncar on fire: No. Finish the post. Kids don't really need healthcare coverage because when you live with your parents it's already covered.

What? Where do kids get free medical care for living with their parents?

Do you mean Medicaid?

Last I checked- lot's of parents make sure those little rascals were covered due to their annoying habit of breaking things or getting sick. Seems this coverage was recently extended up until the age of 26 or so.

I guess if the kid was 18 or over and had been given the boot by mom and dad, they might need coverage. Judging from the tiny sample i know about via my daughter, most of the afternoon employees are still living at home with their folks and presumeably aren't required to cover their own expenses on a $100 a week part time job.


Oh, I see. You mean the kids with parents with Middle-Class jobs(although there is still hope the Republican Senate will get rid of Obamacare and insurance companies will be free to toss off children 18+).

I thought you meant all children.

Obviously, the children of the parents working minimum wage jobs do not deserve medical insurance.
2012-11-18 10:39:19 PM
1 votes:
I'm really surprised this didn't happen sooner. Being retail is a huge chunk of our economy.
2012-11-18 10:34:57 PM
1 votes:
Why on earth would anyone be inspired to strike by18,000 people losing their jobs thanks to their union?
2012-11-18 10:28:30 PM
1 votes:
Just thought I'd add: we've all worked shiatty jobs in our lives. If you're going to work a shiat job, then that's the decision you took, you knew that going in. We've all been there. But you don't take a job scraping shiat all day long, and then 2 months into it decide that it's a shiatty job with shiatty pay. It was in the job description and you knew the pay upfront. If Walmart is so beneath you, then quit. You can't work at Walmart and then pretend like you're above working at Walmart. You're not fooling anyone. You're not skilled labor, you just pass items by a scanner all day long, something a trained monkey can do. I've been a cashier myself, and I had no illusions about the value of my work at that talentless position. It is what it is, and it kept me afloat until I found something better. It's time for a reality check for these idiots that think menial labor is somehow worth $50,000.
2012-11-18 10:26:53 PM
1 votes:
i734.photobucket.com

Seriously, what's the point of Black Friday? A mob of sheep fight each other to die with the most toys, while the zillionaires laugh all the way to the bank?

STAY HOME ON BLACK FRIDAY. Your nerves will thank you and you'll avoid being part of the problem. Kick back, have some leftover turkey and whatever beverage suits you. Watch some football, pop in a DVD or fire up the Roku. WalmartKmartTargetMacysCVSBestBuy will still be there when the madness cools down a bit. There's a whole month to go till Christmas. And if you don't have kids who still believe in Santa Claus, the extra evening hours make a great low-hassle time to shop.
2012-11-18 08:05:17 PM
1 votes:
I used to work in restaurants and had to work holidays all the time. What's the big deal? Nation of whiners.
2012-11-18 07:53:52 PM
1 votes:
Anybody who thins we're doing it right, needs to look at what they do in the Netherlands. Capitalist AND socialist paradise. Cradle to grave social safety net, and a buttload of rich capitalists.
2012-11-18 07:49:12 PM
1 votes:

ronaprhys: So, said dolt is making almost a dollar/hour more than minimum wage and is complaining.


Given her annual income, she should be complaining. A lot.

Silly Jesus: Have you given thought to the fact that your real problem may be with our welfare system rather than Wal*Mart?


So the problem is people can get food stamps not that walmart pays so little many employees need them. Gotcha.
2012-11-18 07:48:05 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: Have you given thought to the fact that your real problem may be with our welfare system rather than Wal*Mart?


Yes, I did think about that. I came to the conclusion, and so will you, that without government assistance Walmart's employees would be so impoverished they would be homeless or starving or both, so the problem goes back to Walmart's business practices.
2012-11-18 07:46:53 PM
1 votes:

BarkingUnicorn: red5ish: Walmart is profitable enough to pay living wages to its employees, keeping them off the dole, but instead choose to pay less and to pocket the extra profit. Taxpayers subsidize their business model. I don't see how anybody who dislikes taxes could argue in favor of Walmart's business practices.

Walmart's net profit for the past four quarters was $15.7 billion. Divide that by 2.2 million employees and you get about $7100 each. What percentage of that should go to employees?


Enough so that their full time employees don't need food stamps for starters.
2012-11-18 07:38:27 PM
1 votes:

fredklein: Oh, and how crappy of a "manager" are you if you make farking minimum wage!?!?!


I assume this is like my Executive Director of Personal Assistance, who I pay $9/hour and sometimes buy a sammich.
2012-11-18 07:37:48 PM
1 votes:

red5ish: DrewCurtisJr: red5ish: Walmart is profitable enough to pay living wages to its employees, keeping them off the dole, but instead choose to pay less and to pocket the extra profit.

Low prices are the main reason for Walmart's success, it is fine to blame Walmart for working conditions but if Walmart decides to pay workers more and some other retailer comes along and undercuts it in prices and wages where do you think people are going to shop?

Nice hypothetical question, but not to the point. When Walmart's business plan depends on their employees being on government assistance then they are not a viable business. That is not the case, however, as they can afford to pay living wages and still be comfortably profitable. They are gaming the system, and you and I, as taxpayers, are contributing to their more than comfortable profit margin. I personally don't feel happy about subsidizing the profit margins of Walmart and its stockholders.

If "some other retailer" can compete with Walmart and undercut their prices due to efficiency, then more power to them, that is competition in the free market, I just don't want to subsidize either Walmart or its competitors.


Have you given thought to the fact that your real problem may be with our welfare system rather than Wal*Mart?
2012-11-18 07:32:04 PM
1 votes:

red5ish: Nice hypothetical question, but not to the point. When Walmart's business plan depends on their employees being on government assistance then they are not a viable business.


Walmart's business plan is to pay as low as it can get away within the current job market. The fact that this amount is so low that many employees also qualify for government assistance is irrelevant.
2012-11-18 07:22:37 PM
1 votes:

DrewCurtisJr: red5ish: Walmart is profitable enough to pay living wages to its employees, keeping them off the dole, but instead choose to pay less and to pocket the extra profit.

Low prices are the main reason for Walmart's success, it is fine to blame Walmart for working conditions but if Walmart decides to pay workers more and some other retailer comes along and undercuts it in prices and wages where do you think people are going to shop?


Nice hypothetical question, but not to the point. When Walmart's business plan depends on their employees being on government assistance then they are not a viable business. That is not the case, however, as they can afford to pay living wages and still be comfortably profitable. They are gaming the system, and you and I, as taxpayers, are contributing to their more than comfortable profit margin. I personally don't feel happy about subsidizing the profit margins of Walmart and its stockholders.

If "some other retailer" can compete with Walmart and undercut their prices due to efficiency, then more power to them, that is competition in the free market, I just don't want to subsidize either Walmart or its competitors.
2012-11-18 07:20:29 PM
1 votes:

GroverCleveland: [i511.photobucket.com image 526x473]

I'm afraid the WalMart will be quite operational when Black Friday arrives


I am in awe.
2012-11-18 07:19:57 PM
1 votes:

Mija: Good. I'm sick of Walmart encouraging it's employees to get on welfare instead of providing them with insurance and a living wage. I try not to do business with companies like that.


Walmart should replace welfare-recipient employees with prison labor. That will maximize profits and end this nonsense of society's takers thinking they have a say in what they get or what they do to serve the economy. We already have a lot of people in prison, but if we need new laws tailored to keeping the prison labor pool strong, that's the kind of support from government that entrepreneurial people like Walmart are entitled to have.
2012-11-18 07:19:34 PM
1 votes:

WhyteRaven74: so you're saying people have no right to demand to be treated well? also your assumption is rather flawed....


So take a shiatty paying job with shiatty benefits and then biatch about it? Guess that's the American way these days.
2012-11-18 07:14:59 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: So you actually DO believe that?


Here's what Hormel did during the depression. First thing they did when they saw the economy was going into the shiatter was to institute a 52 week lay off notice policy. No one could be laid off without being given 52 weeks notice first. So even with demand cratering they were keeping people on the payroll. At some of their facilities there were times when people showed up and basically spent their shifts talking, there wasn't enough demand for Hormel products to give them much to do. But that wasn't all, Hormel decided to also update and expand their facilities. Easy to update a facility when it's sitting almost idle. And sure things are bad today, doesn't mean they'll stay this way and may as well be well prepared for the future. So Hormel spent a ton on improving existing facilities and building new ones, new ones it had no demand for. Eventually the depression ended and things started getting better and better. Then WW2 came around and Hormel could produce food on a scale that allowed them to get tons of government contracts and then came the baby boom and Hormel was able to meet that demand easily. Oh yeah, the number of people they laid off during the depression? Zero.
2012-11-18 07:04:01 PM
1 votes:

Fail in Human Form: Great Janitor:
Today I am in a position where I don't have to work at a minimum wage job. My last job interview had the boss explaining to me how in one week I could earn $5,000 commission with residuals for life selling to one person. There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skil ...

Everyone isn't as awesome as you are.



And you can do it from the comfort of your home for only 2 hours a day!
2012-11-18 07:02:34 PM
1 votes:
i511.photobucket.com

I'm afraid the WalMart will be quite operational when Black Friday arrives
2012-11-18 06:45:21 PM
1 votes:
static.themetapicture.com
2012-11-18 06:38:36 PM
1 votes:
If corporations are only obligated to serve the shareholders, how can we blame employees for wanting to be obligated to themselves? Management is essentially collective bargaining for the shareholders, employees should be able to team up bargain for themselves.
2012-11-18 06:38:12 PM
1 votes:
What caught my eye was the warehouse trouble.
These are Walmart's regional distribution centers.
It appears that in union states, Walmart uses temp service agencies to staff these places with people who work very low wage, no-benefit paying jobs.
In non-union states, these distribution center jobs are relatively well paid, full-benefits jobs. Like $16/hour to start with benefits and regular raises thereafter.

Funny how that works.
2012-11-18 06:28:44 PM
1 votes:

DrewCurtisJr: jst3p: This coupled with "lots of people are dumb".

Desperate, and without food security, are the more PC terms.


I say tomato, Wal-mart employee says "Hey, you gonna finish that tomato?"
2012-11-18 06:27:02 PM
1 votes:

jst3p: This coupled with "lots of people are dumb".


Desperate, and without food security, are the more PC terms.
2012-11-18 06:21:55 PM
1 votes:

ronaprhys: Where are the company towns?


Most robber barons didn't have company towns. And using violence to fight strikers was also not that common, indeed when it did happen it caused just a dust up that those running the companies found themselves in worse shape with the public.
2012-11-18 06:19:31 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: easterneurope.dow.com


you might want to look at Australia, they have a high minimum wage, lots of vacation leave, everyone has medical coverage and their economy is doing pretty darn well.

tenpoundsofcheese: social responsibility" is the same thing as whether you are allowed to burn someone's house down.


Well it is. That's why we have laws and courts and such for people who do burn down houses. The expectation is you don't damage someone's property and if you do, you get punished for it.
2012-11-18 06:18:30 PM
1 votes:
garotasperversas.files.wordpress.com
2012-11-18 06:15:40 PM
1 votes:

Gunderson: One of the downsides of paying your workers crap is that you get crap in return. Employees just flat out don't give a fark. Employee theft goes through the roof, workers call in sick often, people work while they're "Chemically Enhanced", etc. All these cost companies millions in lost revenue, productive and training expenses. On top of that, the best workers will leave at the first sign of a better opportunity, leaving the place staffed with the 'slugs'.

By just paying people a few dollars/hour more and taking care of their workers, a company can actually get a positive return on their labor investments.


Ah! So very very true.

I used to know not just one, but at least 3 different people, who worked at WAL MART who would steal anything in the store and bring it out the back for you as long as you paid them $20 to do it. They were in collusion with the also-underpaid security guards. TVs, high-end stereos, and electronics behind the glass cost you a bit more, but still were much less cheaper than actually buying them from the store. That's how my husband managed to outfit his old Camaro with the killer stereo system he had in it; also how we managed to furnish our first apartment together with all brand new items instead of having to scrounge up whatever we could find for free or second-hand.

And from what I understand, this is not an uncommon occurrence at all. I have a few good friends in other states who also know of Wal Mart employees that do similar things to supplement their Wal Mart wages.
2012-11-18 06:15:10 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: but that person hasn't worked very hard to get ahead in life.


the people who worked on Henry Ford's assembly lines didn't either, yet Ford saw to it they were well paid. Indeed they were very well paid. And it helped Ford make a fark ton of money. Indeed Ford didn't pay well at first and found that it was almost impossible to make money with high turnover. So he took care of the turnover issue and promptly started swimming in money. Oh and it also allowed Ford employees to be Ford customers quite easily.
2012-11-18 06:12:11 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: Do I think you have the social responsibility to me to give me money because I have less than you? Nope.


What about a social responsibility to make sure someone working for you isn't out groveling for government benefits which in turn cost other people money?

Ed_Severson: All that matters is that these employees are complaining about something and then acting in direct opposition to the basis of their complaint,


They've been showing up for work and asking for hours that have never materialized. When plan A doesn't work, it's time for plan B.
2012-11-18 06:11:54 PM
1 votes:

dopekitty74: Thatsthejoke.jpg


You suck McBain!

DrPainMD: There's no excuse for not bettering yourself; libraries are free and ANYBODY can get a student loan. Even those with no skills can make good money... go to work on an off-shore oil rig (I put myself thru college with a job as a dishwasher on rigs in the North Sea [and was making more money than my dad, who was a colonel in the Army])


True that... I had a job as a dishwasher's assistant on an oil rig and was making more money than my father who was a four-star admiral with lucrative consultant gigs that were totally ethical.
2012-11-18 06:10:36 PM
1 votes:
If we just raised the minimum wage to 20 dollars an hour with mandatory 4 weeks vacation and full health insurance, there would be no more problems.
2012-11-18 06:10:22 PM
1 votes:

WhyteRaven74: Among the hardest working people around are people who make very little.


Absolutely. Especially the most labor intensive jobs. I would watch my grandfather, father, and ex-husband work at LEAST 40 hour weeks doing various construction/HVAC/painting/contracting jobs throughout the years and as the economy has tanked, they have been making less and less each year while increasing their work loads at the same time. And because they are contractors, they don't have any kind of insurance plan in place to protect them should they get hurt at work or be otherwise unable to continue working.

Before my dad died, he was laid off from the construction crew he was working for and had to start supplementing his income by taking whatever jobs he could get; he was a "skilled" guy, too. He used to work as an engineer, had experience in CAD, went to college, etc. etc. but when the engineering firm he worked for went under, again, he took up work on the construction crew and would continue to search for work in his previous field. He was unable to ever find a position because most companies were hiring kids straight out of school with little to no experience in the field, but who were willing to work for less. Many companies prefer hiring the young ones because they know that if shiat hits the fan and they wind up having to do some lay offs, those kids are gonna be the first to go, and they won't have to feel as bad knowing they can fall back on their parents; basically, that they won't be out of work with 4 kids to feed and no gainful employment.

Dad wound up in retail, still trying to interview and search for that elusive "good job" he had been trying to find FOR YEARS...and he never did manage to find it again.
2012-11-18 06:06:25 PM
1 votes:

DrewCurtisJr: I think it is the fact that the poorest people are most likely to go for the lowest prices even if it can be against their own self interest in the bigger picture.


This coupled with "lots of people are dumb".
2012-11-18 06:05:34 PM
1 votes:
i.imgur.com

i.imgur.com
2012-11-18 06:04:37 PM
1 votes:

brantgoose: I predict that it will soon be even harder to spot a helpful employee in a WalMart store.

In my experience, in addition to occupying the locations of old K-mart stores, WalMart stores have this in common with the aged chain: if you look at an employee, they disappear.

They will happly stock shelves or stand around or whatever it is that employees do when they are not working, but the moment you have a question or have made a decision and need help getting something down from twenty feet over your head, they are nowhere to be found.

Soon they will not be waiting for you to decide to buy something. They will be gone.

There is something seriously quantum mechanical going on in the giant box retail trade. Is that an employee? Look and they will either disappear or turn out to be an employee who is serving somebody else and won't be free until they are done--at which time you will look again and they will be gone or else serving another employee.

It is impossible to get servce in a service economy. I can see why some nutters want to go back to a gold-based economy, but then it would be impossible to find any gold. Gold is too useful to sit around in vaults, so I favour a fiat currency which lets it get out and do something once in a while.


Take an African-American friend with you (not necessary if you are African-American) and go to a Wal-Mart in Redneckistan. You'll probably get plenty of attention.
2012-11-18 06:04:11 PM
1 votes:

MelGoesOnTour: Those of you folks who don't care to hear about anecdotal stories about how WM has badly treated local economies, well, those stories nonetheless represent REAL situations for REAL people. I won't go into detail but I've seen first-hand how local mom-n-pop stores in small towns have been eradicated by the arrival of a WM. And it's not like the people who live in small towns have a choice when it comes to what they are forced to deal with. WM takes advantage of small economies to the detriment of those local populations and that's a fact.


I care about anecdotal stories, but please answer me this, why are these small town folk so willing to shop their neighbors and sometimes themselves out of jobs if Walmart is so bad for the area? Just because a Walmart opens doesn't mean people are forced to shop there instead of Johnson's Grocery and Henderson's Butcher Shop.


I think it is the fact that the poorest people are most likely to go for the lowest prices even if it can be against their own self interest in the bigger picture. Upper income people can afford to shop with a "conscience".
2012-11-18 06:01:41 PM
1 votes:
One of the downsides of paying your workers crap is that you get crap in return. Employees just flat out don't give a fark. Employee theft goes through the roof, workers call in sick often, people work while they're "Chemically Enhanced", etc. All these cost companies millions in lost revenue, productive and training expenses. On top of that, the best workers will leave at the first sign of a better opportunity, leaving the place staffed with the 'slugs'.

By just paying people a few dollars/hour more and taking care of their workers, a company can actually get a positive return on their labor investments.
2012-11-18 06:01:40 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: Start your own business and find out.


or you could read up on Costco, much easier.
2012-11-18 06:00:09 PM
1 votes:
I'm imagining the chaos if all of the employees at even just one store participate on black Friday. Everyone shows up for work, they let the screaming horde of crazy black Friday shoppers in, and then they just leave? No cashiers, no loss-prevention, no one to stop an unruly mass of shoppers wrapped up in mob-mentality from just loading up their carts and walking out with free 55" TVs?

I wonder how long it would take to loot the store bare, or if the police would show up to stop it in time.
2012-11-18 05:59:09 PM
1 votes:

whistleridge: Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown?


I don't blame Wal-Mart for that. The decline of the American downtown began with malls in the 1960s.

You can blame large chains, or the aggregation of stores in larger shopping centers, but ultimately American consumers are to blame. We collectively chose to have more stuff - cheap stuff - over having less with higher quality and service.

If Americans want the chains to go, and the local shops to come back, then you have to shop with your wallet, even if it means you get by with less. (I freely admit to failing at this myself - I'm willing to pay 30-40% more, but not 80-100%)
2012-11-18 05:57:11 PM
1 votes:

tenpoundsofcheese: Please list out the terms of the social compact for the US.


Check your 1040
2012-11-18 05:53:54 PM
1 votes:

jshine: Diogenes Teufelsdrockh: jshine: There's nothing in the Bible that says "And verily did Jesus feast upon the turkeys and stuffing and mashed potatoes and pie, then get drunk and watch football. So sayeth The Lord. Amen".

Psst...it actually kind of is, just pushed back a tad. See: Feast of Tabernacles
...
So how did the one stem from the other? ...


He didn't say one came from the other. He's saying there's a parallel between the not-in-the-Bible Jesus quote above, and Deuteronomy 14:22-27 (especially 26, which some translations make sound more debauched than others) which is part of the official instructions for observing the Feast of Tabernacles.
2012-11-18 05:53:29 PM
1 votes:

Silly Jesus: How do you figure they wouldn't be?


if they were paid better they wouldn't need food stamps and if they were provided benefits, like insurance, they wouldn't need help there.

It's not the job of WalMart to "take care of" their employees

Sam Walton felt differently
2012-11-18 05:50:19 PM
1 votes:

Popcorn Johnny: The chick in the article is a damn liar. If she was working full time and only bringing in $14,000 a year, that would mean she was working for around $6.73 an hour. We know as a matter of fact that can't be the case.


It is entirely possible if Wal-Mart defines full time employment at 32 hours.
2012-11-18 05:50:05 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: coco ebert: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

As someone who studies labor markets, I can say that there really aren't that many options for "unskilled" or "low-skilled" jobs in this economy. Retailers have largely followed Wal-mart's lead and have increasingly relied on low-wage, part-time work that offers next to zero benefits. Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.

PS. Retail has ALWAYS been a minimum wage job.


It doesn't have to be and it wasn't always so. In my hubby's native Switzerland, people who work in retails are trained in their jobs and know their sh*t. They're also paid a decent wage and have good benefits. And actually, having read the history of retail in America, companies used to train their employees as well in the profession. We don't do that anymore. It doesn't have to be this way.
2012-11-18 05:49:34 PM
1 votes:

WhyteRaven74: jst3p: There is no universal standard when it comes to "full time" employee, the company gets to define it.

Actually federal law does define it as 40 hours, however it can be defined as fewer hours. Though that big of wiggle room really should be done away with.




The Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) does not define full-time employment or part-time employment. This is a matter generally to be determined by the employer. Whether an employee is considered full-time or part-time does not change the application of the FLSA, nor does it affect application of the Service Contract Act or Davis-Bacon and Related Acts wage and fringe benefit requirements.

Link
2012-11-18 05:49:32 PM
1 votes:

tjfly: So if you don't love your job, you should strike. Sounds logical... For a liberal.


if you're being treated badly at your job, yes you should stand up for yourself.
2012-11-18 05:48:24 PM
1 votes:

Popcorn Johnny: The chick in the article is a damn liar. If she was working full time and only bringing in $14,000 a year, that would mean she was working for around $6.73 an hour. We know as a matter of fact that can't be the case.


Depends on how you define full time, walmart may not define it as 40 hours for her position.
2012-11-18 05:48:00 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: WhyteRaven74: ronaprhys: Nothing. What year did you fail history in?

While we may not call them robber barons we have plenty of people acting like them, see Papa John's.

If it weren't for the "robber barons," you wouldn't have cheap energy, free libraries, and most of what gives you one of the highest standards of living the human race has ever seen. But, go ahead and complain about them... it's edgy and in fashion, and your peers will consider you to be an intellectual.


"Let's focus on that nice dinner we had instead of the rape" eh?
2012-11-18 05:47:59 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: coco ebert: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

As someone who studies labor markets, I can say that there really aren't that many options for "unskilled" or "low-skilled" jobs in this economy. Retailers have largely followed Wal-mart's lead and have increasingly relied on low-wage, part-time work that offers next to zero benefits. Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.

PS. Retail has ALWAYS been a minimum wage job.


I worked for 5 years at Radio Shack, I made well over minimum wage. I worked at Egghead Software for a few years (it used to be a thing) and made more than minimum wage. My ex wife works retail today (not in management) and she makes $11 an hour last I heard.

In Colorado the minimum wage is $7.63. If someone making minimum wage were to work 40 hours a week that puts the salary at $15,870.

Salary.com puts the average salary of a Retail "Sales Staff - Full Time" at almost $29k in Longmont Colorado.

In short, you don't know what you are talking about and should spend a couple minutes on google before posting things on the internet that make you look like an ignorant, misinformed, idiot.
2012-11-18 05:46:46 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: it weren't for the "robber barons," you wouldn't have cheap energy, free libraries, and most of what gives you one of the highest standards of living the human race has ever seen.


you're not even smart enough to realize what you're defending.

Silly Jesus: They are the kind of people that would be 100% on the government teat if not for WalMart. I


they wouldn't be, and if Walmart actually took care of their employees they wouldn't need government benefits at all.
2012-11-18 05:45:41 PM
1 votes:
Wal Mart has refused to let the employees unionize for quite some time, this is nothing new. Doesn't anyone remember that documentary they did on Wal Mart a few years back? With all the former managers and employees speaking out about their shady business practices and the threats of firing those who even began to SPEAK of forming a union?

I don't get how so many people can sit here and say "oh well they should just find a better job"...a lot of the people who worl at Wal Mart simply can't! I know a lot of the people who work at my local Wal Mart do so because it's in a mall where one of the few running buses continues to travel. And when you are an "unskilled" laborer, there aren't too many options available. A lot of these people are simply working the only job they are a) qualified for and b) able to actually get.

I feel sorry for the people who are too scared to protest and walk out; the ones who know that they can't even take the risk doing so, even though it would be a tremendous benefit for them to do so, because if they do, they're afraid they will lose their job and will be unable to provide for their families.
2012-11-18 05:44:31 PM
1 votes:

deanayer: "Empowered by the Hostess strike"?? Seriously subby?? The unions drove the company into bankruptcy and now its dead, closed, out of business, gone. There is no more strike at Hostess because there is no more Hostess.


Hostess was owned by two hedge funds with a long history of liquidating and looting companies, They stopped contributing to the employee pensions but tripled the CEO's salary, and gave similar raises and bonuses to other executives.

There was never any intention of coming to an agreement. They forced the confrontation so they could walk away with a giant stack of cash and no longer be encumbered by having to actually run a business.

The Hostess shutdown was a classic looting job. The fact that they got to blame he union is just icing on the cake.
2012-11-18 05:44:19 PM
1 votes:

tenpoundsofcheese: Oh please, where is the social compact? Details? When does a person enter into it? How?


living as a member of society
2012-11-18 05:44:11 PM
1 votes:

DrPainMD: 12349876: Great Janitor: There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skills, education, what ever.

If everyone did this those who did it the least would still be stuck working at Wal Mart where people who refuse to better themselves belong.

FTFY

Also, it's already happening. Lots of successful people worked at Walmart earlier in their lives. The ones who went home and watched TV every night are the ones still working there.


I'm talking philosophically here. There will always be people at the bottom of the rung who are stuck at Wal Mart type jobs. Bottom of the rung used to be dropping out in the middle school, then high school, now it's a high school graduate and may in a few decades be a bachelor's degree and no matter how high it gets, there will be those at the bottom and there's not enough white collar jobs for them.
2012-11-18 05:41:10 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: I honestly don't get this. My first two jobs were retail jobs. I hated it. Hours sucked, pay was minimum wage, hated dealing with idiot and rude customers, got pissed everytime I came in on my day off to work a special project for the boss (building shelves in the stock room or swapping out seasonal merchandise from the holiday that just ended to the new one, or just expanding the christmas section) and the boss took credit for all of it when the DM commented to him how great that area looked. I decided that if anything was going to get better in my life, it had to be me who made the change. I could either biatch and moan to my managers until they caved into my demands or I could better myself. I did. I took a series of entry level jobs that offered to train anyone and learned a variety of skills. Went to college, got a degree that was designed to better my job prospects. Even learned how to sell swimming pools, cars and insurance. When you learn how to sell your income is unlimited. As opposed to working hourly where your income is limited to the number of hours you work.

I realized that while I could change where I worked, the place where I worked and those I worked for aren't fixed. I could in theory make the retail chain I worked for the best place to ever work with great hours and above average pay, but when it comes to jobs your boss can give you two words and you're gone (You're fired, good bye, get out). And if management changes, that great deal I worked out could die or come back to bite me in the ass. I make myself better and no manager or job can change that.

Today I am in a position where I don't have to work at a minimum wage job. My last job interview had the boss explaining to me how in one week I could earn $5,000 commission with residuals for life selling to one person. There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skil ...


Guess what, asshole? Not everyone is a skilled liar, which is the basic skill set for a sales job.
2012-11-18 05:38:18 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: I honestly don't get this. My first two jobs were retail jobs. I hated it. Hours sucked, pay was minimum wage, hated dealing with idiot and rude customers, got pissed everytime I came in on my day off to work a special project for the boss (building shelves in the stock room or swapping out seasonal merchandise from the holiday that just ended to the new one, or just expanding the christmas section) and the boss took credit for all of it when the DM commented to him how great that area looked. I decided that if anything was going to get better in my life, it had to be me who made the change. I could either biatch and moan to my managers until they caved into my demands or I could better myself. I did. I took a series of entry level jobs that offered to train anyone and learned a variety of skills. Went to college, got a degree that was designed to better my job prospects. Even learned how to sell swimming pools, cars and insurance. When you learn how to sell your income is unlimited. As opposed to working hourly where your income is limited to the number of hours you work.

I realized that while I could change where I worked, the place where I worked and those I worked for aren't fixed. I could in theory make the retail chain I worked for the best place to ever work with great hours and above average pay, but when it comes to jobs your boss can give you two words and you're gone (You're fired, good bye, get out). And if management changes, that great deal I worked out could die or come back to bite me in the ass. I make myself better and no manager or job can change that.

Today I am in a position where I don't have to work at a minimum wage job. My last job interview had the boss explaining to me how in one week I could earn $5,000 commission with residuals for life selling to one person. There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skil ...


While social mobility exists, it is in decline. In short it is becoming more and more difficult for someone to better their position in our nation and those at the top like it that way.

Link
2012-11-18 05:36:50 PM
1 votes:

coffee smells good: FIFY


Or Apple, or plenty of other companies. I just went with Papa John's cause they've been in the news the last week

Great Janitor: There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skills, education, what ever


and how exactly should they pay for that?
2012-11-18 05:34:47 PM
1 votes:

red5ish: Making $14,000/year is a rate of $6.74/hour for a 40 hour per week employee, which is below minimum wage.
Is this "Customer Service Manager" exempt? If so, she is being really and truly screwed. If not, then she is working less than 40 hours per week.


There is no universal standard when it comes to "full time" employee, the company gets to define it. I have seen it defined as 30 or 32 hours a week in some places.
2012-11-18 05:34:25 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: I honestly don't get this. My first two jobs were retail jobs. I hated it. Hours sucked, pay was minimum wage, hated dealing with idiot and rude customers, got pissed everytime I came in on my day off to work a special project for the boss (building shelves in the stock room or swapping out seasonal merchandise from the holiday that just ended to the new one, or just expanding the christmas section) and the boss took credit for all of it when the DM commented to him how great that area looked. I decided that if anything was going to get better in my life, it had to be me who made the change. I could either biatch and moan to my managers until they caved into my demands or I could better myself. I did. I took a series of entry level jobs that offered to train anyone and learned a variety of skills. Went to college, got a degree that was designed to better my job prospects. Even learned how to sell swimming pools, cars and insurance. When you learn how to sell your income is unlimited. As opposed to working hourly where your income is limited to the number of hours you work.

I realized that while I could change where I worked, the place where I worked and those I worked for aren't fixed. I could in theory make the retail chain I worked for the best place to ever work with great hours and above average pay, but when it comes to jobs your boss can give you two words and you're gone (You're fired, good bye, get out). And if management changes, that great deal I worked out could die or come back to bite me in the ass. I make myself better and no manager or job can change that.

Today I am in a position where I don't have to work at a minimum wage job. My last job interview had the boss explaining to me how in one week I could earn $5,000 commission with residuals for life selling to one person. There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skil ...


larryfire.files.wordpress.com
2012-11-18 05:33:27 PM
1 votes:
I honestly don't get this. My first two jobs were retail jobs. I hated it. Hours sucked, pay was minimum wage, hated dealing with idiot and rude customers, got pissed everytime I came in on my day off to work a special project for the boss (building shelves in the stock room or swapping out seasonal merchandise from the holiday that just ended to the new one, or just expanding the christmas section) and the boss took credit for all of it when the DM commented to him how great that area looked. I decided that if anything was going to get better in my life, it had to be me who made the change. I could either biatch and moan to my managers until they caved into my demands or I could better myself. I did. I took a series of entry level jobs that offered to train anyone and learned a variety of skills. Went to college, got a degree that was designed to better my job prospects. Even learned how to sell swimming pools, cars and insurance. When you learn how to sell your income is unlimited. As opposed to working hourly where your income is limited to the number of hours you work.

I realized that while I could change where I worked, the place where I worked and those I worked for aren't fixed. I could in theory make the retail chain I worked for the best place to ever work with great hours and above average pay, but when it comes to jobs your boss can give you two words and you're gone (You're fired, good bye, get out). And if management changes, that great deal I worked out could die or come back to bite me in the ass. I make myself better and no manager or job can change that.

Today I am in a position where I don't have to work at a minimum wage job. My last job interview had the boss explaining to me how in one week I could earn $5,000 commission with residuals for life selling to one person. There is no reason why these Walmart employees who are complaining about low hours each week can't be spending their down time bettering themselves with added skills, education, what ever.
2012-11-18 05:33:05 PM
1 votes:

coffee smells good: mbillips: A Day Older than Yesterday: whistleridge:
Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown? Where do you think the folks that worked in those businesses went? Where else would they go?

I believe you're thinking of the Ames stores in the 1950's and 1960's that put a significant number of mom & pops out of business. Please study some business history before you post the well worn cliche. You may also want to read about hows malls really destroyed Main Streets in the 1960's and 1970's.

/shops at Walmart and has shopped at Toys-r-us, Barnes & Noble and Target.
//Sam Walton gave the max to Obama's Victory Fund two cycles in a row.

Sam Walton died in 1992, so I'm going to need a citation.


Good God are you helpless, that statistic was on every political article/blog/comment this week. Some refer to Sam as CEO but he's actual heir. 

Typical liberal response to an argument they can't logically discuss: 1) call someone a name like we're still in the 4th grade, 2) ask for a citation to a known or easily ascertained idea 3) lie. 

Am so tired of the "citation" call by the lazy & stupid.


Oh, THAT Sam Walton. The grandson hippie lib'ral who has nothing to do with Wal-Mart.
2012-11-18 05:32:20 PM
1 votes:

Spirit Hammer: I don't shop a walmart, and I don't have a dog in this fight.
But I wanted to make a couple of observations.

Do people seriously believe that the purpose of a company is to "Better Humanity"?
That may be what you formed YOUR company to do, but it isn't what most others were formed for.

According to the google (various. I won't link them, but you can do your own search) Customer Service Managers make between $12 and $14 an hour.

I seriously doubt that the person in the article is making only $14,000 a year full time.
Minimum wage (what floor associates start at) is over $18,000 full time.

The last time the walmart in my area had a job fair, they had over 1000 people for each of 15 jobs apply.

They run the largest retail chain in history (and without my patronage. go figure). A pretty impressive feat.


I don't doubt her claim that she works "full time" (I am sure it is less than 40 hours) and depends on food stamps. That is something that we should all be concerned about.
2012-11-18 05:31:53 PM
1 votes:

WhyteRaven74: ronaprhys: Nothing. What year did you fail history in?

While we may not call them robber barons we have plenty of people acting like them, see Papa John's Apple.


FIFY
2012-11-18 05:29:38 PM
1 votes:
Making $14,000/year is a rate of $6.74/hour for a 40 hour per week employee, which is below minimum wage.
Is this "Customer Service Manager" exempt? If so, she is being really and truly screwed. If not, then she is working less than 40 hours per week.
2012-11-18 05:28:57 PM
1 votes:

ronaprhys: Nothing. What year did you fail history in?


While we may not call them robber barons we have plenty of people acting like them, see Papa John's.
2012-11-18 05:28:52 PM
1 votes:
I don't shop a walmart, and I don't have a dog in this fight.
But I wanted to make a couple of observations.

Do people seriously believe that the purpose of a company is to "Better Humanity"?
That may be what you formed YOUR company to do, but it isn't what most others were formed for.

According to the google (various. I won't link them, but you can do your own search) Customer Service Managers make between $12 and $14 an hour.

I seriously doubt that the person in the article is making only $14,000 a year full time.
Minimum wage (what floor associates start at) is over $18,000 full time.

The last time the walmart in my area had a job fair, they had over 1000 people for each of 15 jobs apply.

They run the largest retail chain in history (and without my patronage. go figure). A pretty impressive feat.
2012-11-18 05:28:51 PM
1 votes:

A Day Older than Yesterday: whistleridge:
Have you ever been to some towns in flyover country? You know, the ones where there used to be 20 - 30 businesses downtown, and now there's a Wal-Mart on the edge of the bunch of shuttered buildings that used to be downtown? Where do you think the folks that worked in those businesses went? Where else would they go?

I believe you're thinking of the Ames stores in the 1950's and 1960's that put a significant number of mom & pops out of business. Please study some business history before you post the well worn cliche. You may also want to read about hows malls really destroyed Main Streets in the 1960's and 1970's.

/shops at Walmart and has shopped at Toys-r-us, Barnes & Noble and Target.
//Sam Walton gave the max to Obama's Victory Fund two cycles in a row.



You left off McDonalds, KMart, In-n-Out, Lowes, Home Depot, the former Borders, Kroger...................
2012-11-18 05:26:58 PM
1 votes:

EVERYBODY PANIC: vartian: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

Yeah, because people who work at Walmart have all these options just laid out in front of them.

Hey, if working for Wal*Mart is the best that these folks can do...

1 - I sorta feel sorry for them.

2 - They should try to make the best of it.

3 - There are equivalent positions at Home Depot, Lowes, various food stores, Target etc. It's hard to get on in a bad economy, but not impossible. They could at least try to get a better job.

4 - They should be grateful that SOMEBODY took them in. Below Walmart level employment would probably be a bunch of dangerous, difficult, backbreaking horror-jobs. Thank you Wal*Mart for saving these people 'from certain peril'. 
[img17.imageshack.us image 678x441]


I'm guessing you haven't spent much time in flyover country. Outside your affluent suburbs, they're AIN'T a lot of HDs, Lowes, food stores. In much of Amurka, there's Wal-Mart, Mickie D's and nothing.
2012-11-18 05:24:54 PM
1 votes:

IlGreven: ...when it gets to the point that you'd rather starve than work at Wal-Mart, they lose the leverage.


Hey, people at Foxconn got to the point they'd rather jump out of windows than work there, and you saw what that got the workers...
2012-11-18 05:23:23 PM
1 votes:

deanayer: This is called REALITY if you happen to be taking notes.


nothing says management and employees have to be in adversarial positions. There are plenty of companies where they aren't in opposition. And there are entire countries where if you suggested management butting heads with the employees to save a buck or something you'd be laughed out of the room.
2012-11-18 05:22:37 PM
1 votes:

mbillips: basemetal: Weaver95: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.

Working for WalMart, other than management (and even them sometimes), is not rocket science, and it doesn't take that long to get an employee up to speed.

The union knows that, and that's why they're not doing a full-out strike. They're doing brief, targeted walkouts, which bleeds Wal-Mart, but doesn't get to the point where Wal-Mart would save money by firing the workers and hiring new ones.

If the Hostess unions had been as smart, you might still be able to buy Twinkies (probably not; that company was so mismanaged and overleveraged that labor problems were the least of it).


Hostess was telling them to go from a middle-class job to a minimum-wage one with no pension. At that point you really can't negotiate much.
2012-11-18 05:21:50 PM
1 votes:

buckler: Those people are called "scabs".


Not in this case. The article references 30 employees spread across six stores. The people picking up the shifts given up by those 30 are their co-workers who just went from 32 to 40 hours per week at the expense of somebody who complained they couldn't make it on 32 and volunteered themselves for 24.

It's simple: when you say you want to work more and then fail to show up for work, management will pay attention to your actions, not your words.
2012-11-18 05:20:50 PM
1 votes:

Ed_Severson: ph0rk: What else should they do? Walkouts and strikes are labor's only tool.

Walkouts and strikes can be effective for other problems, but when you complain that you aren't allowed to work enough and then you willingly give up hours, nobody is going to listen to you. You just voluntarily gave up a shift -- you're probably never going to get that shift back and somebody who shows up to work and busts his ass will get the 8 hours per week that used to be yours.


"I'm not getting enough sex."

"Well, here, let me rape you."

"No!"

"Then it's your own damned fault you're not getting enough sex!"
2012-11-18 05:17:40 PM
1 votes:
To those asking why that sara gilbert girl is making only 14k as a "manager" at walmart. I will explain, She is a part time employee. CSM's are not real managers, they are glorified cashier babysitters with the option of keyturn overrides.
2012-11-18 05:17:09 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: So, instead of making their big scene during black Friday when the stores, as planned, they are going to start early, meaning that they'll be fired by Wednesday and not have to worry about striking on Black Friday.

Honestly, if you don't like the way your company treats you, find another job. Staying there and thinking that you can change it from the inside is no different than idiot women who stay with their abusive husbands thinking that they can change them.


Right but in the interim they're still working at Walmart.

I worked for three years at an exploitive company. I finally was hired elsewhere and my salary instantly doubled, I'm working less hours, and I'm only a contract employee.

So, between having the Walmart job now and the future job they want - they have every right to strike. Further, not having the perfect job now doesn't mean they've settled for this current position.
2012-11-18 05:16:29 PM
1 votes:

mbillips: Yeah. "customer service manager" is probably a bogus title for "cashier."


Nah, they're the Cashier+ people who walk around, watch cashiers as they cash out their drawers and cash in, crack the whip when a given cashier gets a little slow or messes up, has to ring up booze when the cashier isn't yet 21, and handles all the little technical screw-ups with the hardware that never, ever happen because Wal-Mart provides the latest and greatest and properly maintains all its hardware.

Oh, who am I kidding. They're the assholes in red vests who stand in groups of two or three near the little podium things, keeping a hawk-eye on the one cashier out of 30+ aisles while directing traffic towards the U-scans.
2012-11-18 05:14:21 PM
1 votes:

Ed_Severson: ph0rk: What else should they do? Walkouts and strikes are labor's only tool.

Walkouts and strikes can be effective for other problems, but when you complain that you aren't allowed to work enough and then you willingly give up hours, nobody is going to listen to you. You just voluntarily gave up a shift -- you're probably never going to get that shift back and somebody who shows up to work and busts his ass will get the 8 hours per week that used to be yours.


Those people are called "scabs".
2012-11-18 05:10:30 PM
1 votes:

vegasj: Seattle Walmart worker Sara Gilbert said she had taken the decision to go on strike to protest the fact that she could only make around $14,000 dollars a year. Despite working as a customer service manager, she said, her family remained reliant on food stamps and other benefits. "I work full time at the richest company in the world," she said.

That is pretty sad.

full time, $14,000/yr as a manager...

and still must rely on food stamps & other benefits while working for the largest retailer in the world.

Something is wrong with that folks.


memecrunch.com
2012-11-18 05:09:01 PM
1 votes:

basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.


Pssh. They're going to bring in strike-busters from a correctional facility in AR.
2012-11-18 05:06:43 PM
1 votes:

jestme: PleaseHamletDon'tHurtEm: I'm stuck working at my temp call-center job on Friday, so I'm getting a kick out of these replies...

I will be working at Walmart. I am far from stupid or unskilled. I have another part-time job and am a full-time student. I work at Walmart because I get health insurance and other benefits despite my telling Walmart that I'll only work a couple of evenings and one weekend day each week. Oh and I've never made minimum wage there, either.


I hear it.

Work is work. Lots of people in my building having a hard time finding it elsewhere.

And we get treated pretty well for temps. Feel sorry for the folks in retail hell. At least our contacts can be put on hold when they go off.

/not above temp work or Wal-mart to earn my keep, but hoping for more
/in a few decades maybe?
2012-11-18 05:03:23 PM
1 votes:

LovingTeacher: coco ebert: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

As someone who studies labor markets, I can say that there really aren't that many options for "unskilled" or "low-skilled" jobs in this economy. Retailers have largely followed Wal-mart's lead and have increasingly relied on low-wage, part-time work that offers next to zero benefits. Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.

Sadly in this labor market not all of the people working at Walmartare "unskilled" or "low-skilled" workers. The simple truth is that sometimes we don't have much of a choice in where we work. Despite being educated several times in my life I've just had to take the first job that came along. This has more to do with a bad attitude towards authority in my younger days than my actual skill level.


This. I'm highly skilled in my field, but jobs in my field aren't happening right now, so I have to take spotty temp-casual jobs, and the low-skill jobs are filled by low-skilled workers. I once applied to work at a coffee shop, and was denied because there were 200 applicants applying to work as a barista. The employer can be choosy in this environment.
2012-11-18 05:02:25 PM
1 votes:

Ed_Severson: Retail 101: If your complaint is "I don't get enough hours" walking out on your job isn't going to solve your problem.


What else should they do? Walkouts and strikes are labor's only tool.
2012-11-18 05:01:20 PM
1 votes:

deanayer: "Empowered by the Hostess strike"?? Seriously subby?? The unions drove the company into bankruptcy and now its dead, closed, out of business, gone. There is no more strike at Hostess because there is no more Hostess.


Bullshiat.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/helaineolen/2012/11/16/who-killed-hostess - brands-and-twinkies/

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/18/1162786/-Inside-the-Hostess- B ankery

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/16/1162355/--Hostess-Brands-is- a -microcosm-of-what-s-wrong-with-America
2012-11-18 05:00:56 PM
1 votes:

Brontes: So, corporations upper management can stand united when it comes to deciding employee benefits, but employees can't stand united to decide employee benefits?


Employees dont decide what benefits they get usually. There is this point everyone seems to forget, its when you are applying for the job and they tell you what they want you to do and what they are willing to pay you in terms of wages and benefits and then you think about the work it will take and what you get for it and you then say "yes I will take this job". If you decide you made a mistake later on and feel you should get more wages or benefits you can ask for it and if they say no you can then try to find a better job. If you can't find a better job you can improve your skills and become more valuable or you can reevaluate your worth to the job-offering world and realize that at your skill level there are many others who will take your job for the current offer. This is called REALITY if you happen to be taking notes.
2012-11-18 04:59:34 PM
1 votes:
Seattle Walmart worker Sara Gilbert said she had taken the decision to go on strike to protest the fact that she could only make around $14,000 dollars a year. Despite working as a customer service manager, she said, her family remained reliant on food stamps and other benefits. "I work full time at the richest company in the world," she said.

That is pretty sad.

full time, $14,000/yr as a manager...

and still must rely on food stamps & other benefits while working for the largest retailer in the world.

Something is wrong with that folks.
2012-11-18 04:59:03 PM
1 votes:

tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...


which means since you choose to live in this country you have no right to protest any of the laws
2012-11-18 04:58:27 PM
1 votes:

whatshisname: freewill: ^^^ This.

If you're at a company that treats you badly, do whatever you need to do to get out. Life is too short, and if the pay was good enough to justify it, you wouldn't feel like you needed to justify it anymore.


What happens when ALL the companies treat their employees badly?

Should a company merely be a profit centre at any cost or should profits be secondary to providing a good living to employees and excellent products and services to consumers?


Are you honestly so pessimistic as to think that all companies will one day treat their employees badly? I have a job right now with great hours, great bonuses, wonderful pay and the two company events I've been to the higher ups paid out of their pocket, the money for us lower level people to eat $30 steak dinners with open bar and dessert.

Companies honestly can't afford to treat their employees like garbage. Do that and you lose your good employees and are left with the ones who suck. Walmart does it because they know that high school students and college students would love that part time cashiering job, not to mention adults who'd settle for a minimum wage job. Companies that actually need talented or skilled workers can't pay their people poorly and treat them badly.
2012-11-18 04:55:12 PM
1 votes:
Wal-Mart has over 2 million employees worldwide. I don't think a few hundred strikers are going to be missed.
2012-11-18 04:54:44 PM
1 votes:

GranoblasticMan: They simultaneously believe that you can just up and get another job on a whim while there are hundreds of others waiting to fill that position for you. There's no way these can both be true.


They are if your initials are F.Y.I.G.M.
2012-11-18 04:54:05 PM
1 votes:

Friskya: Jon iz teh kewl: i turned down a job at Best Buy cause unemployment pays more.

You sound Democrat.


Because if you continued to collect unemployment, you were in violation of unemployment regulations and lied on your weekly statement by turning down work.
2012-11-18 04:52:13 PM
1 votes:

proteon: Good for chaos.


Let the Lord of Chaos rule?
2012-11-18 04:52:00 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: RanDomino: tbhouston
People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

except for the police who will throw them out of their house and board it up if they don't, and places with plenty of food that demand these strange green slips of paper before they'll give any of it

Because the only employer is Walmart? No temp services, no restaurants or dry cleaners. No options at even self employment? Either work at Walmart or become homeless?


In a lot of rural communities, yeah. There are other employers, but the local retail economy, which typically has a fair amount of new hiring, consists of Wal-Mart and very little else.
2012-11-18 04:51:19 PM
1 votes:

Bit'O'Gristle: 14K for a manager is pretty farking low, seriously. And I'm sure that the workers get much less. Good for them, maybe their walk out will accomplish something.


My sister is a manager at a Claire's store and makes way the hell more than that. If she has management experience, why the hell is she at Walmart and not spending her time off applying for manager jobs at every other retail company in a 30 mile radius?
2012-11-18 04:51:17 PM
1 votes:

Great Janitor: So, instead of making their big scene during black Friday when the stores, as planned, they are going to start early, meaning that they'll be fired by Wednesday and not have to worry about striking on Black Friday.

Honestly, if you don't like the way your company treats you, find another job. Staying there and thinking that you can change it from the inside is no different than idiot women who stay with their abusive husbands thinking that they can change them.


Yep. Management is already on the phone to the next batch of applicants on the stack. Some stock boys will be given a crash course in register ops, the freshmeat will be consigned to dragging pallet jacks through the store at oh-fark-thirty in the morning but they will be ecstatic that they will be getting a paycheck.
2012-11-18 04:50:51 PM
1 votes:

p51d007: No one forces you to work at a particular job, quit, go somewhere else


Why do you hate it when people innovate to better their lot?

mbillips: Farmers and factory workers between 1870 and 1940 had it WAY worse than Wal-Mart employees today.


People in 1870 had it bad, so let's cut everyone's pay to what people made in 1880!
2012-11-18 04:50:49 PM
1 votes:
Walmart sells ammo, that's enough reason for me to shop there.
2012-11-18 04:49:52 PM
1 votes:

coco ebert: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

As someone who studies labor markets, I can say that there really aren't that many options for "unskilled" or "low-skilled" jobs in this economy. Retailers have largely followed Wal-mart's lead and have increasingly relied on low-wage, part-time work that offers next to zero benefits. Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.


Speaking as someone in one of those low-paying jobs, though admittedly I'm better off because of a narrow but much needed skill set withing this industry, the major box stores have been forever moving toward the wal-mart example, while at the same time trying to figure out why their turnover was so high. Recently the twits in charge of my current company hit on the idea of paying a decent wage and giving benefirts to full-time employees. After 3 years of biatching about wanting full time and benefits, I fianlly have a good paying 2nd job(not full time, though), that I don't want to stop(side benefits and such), I am in college for engineering, and I have my own start-up design business. They are just now going to full time for the majority of employees. And they wonder why I don't want to quit college and my other job.

/wait a minute, the job landscape will change
2012-11-18 04:48:20 PM
1 votes:
"Empowered by the Hostess strike"?? Seriously subby?? The unions drove the company into bankruptcy and now its dead, closed, out of business, gone. There is no more strike at Hostess because there is no more Hostess.
2012-11-18 04:47:52 PM
1 votes:
Last time someone tried this, WAL*MART closed the store rather than allow unions.

But they can't afford to close stores in 10 states and DC.

Go for it, workers! Stand up for your rights.
2012-11-18 04:45:52 PM
1 votes:
Fine....go on strike...worked well for Hostess, Eastern Airlines, the auto manufacturers and countless other UNION shops. Yes, Wally world isn't union, but there are a lot of unions that want a piece of the walmart pie. In this Obama economy, I wouldn't be so quick to go on a strike. With 9+% unemployment, there are a LOT of people that would be willing to have that "low wage" job, even without benefits.
Yes, there have been downsizing due to the economy, but, you have to stop and ask yourself something.
Unless you are in high school, college, or are retired, you have to ask yourself something. Why are you only qualified to work a minimum wage job, (even if the economy was good)?
No one forces you to work at a particular job, quit, go somewhere else.
2012-11-18 04:42:21 PM
1 votes:
So, instead of making their big scene during black Friday when the stores, as planned, they are going to start early, meaning that they'll be fired by Wednesday and not have to worry about striking on Black Friday.

Honestly, if you don't like the way your company treats you, find another job. Staying there and thinking that you can change it from the inside is no different than idiot women who stay with their abusive husbands thinking that they can change them.
2012-11-18 04:40:16 PM
1 votes:

XveryYpettyZ: The central story of the United States is the idea that if you work hard, sacrifice, delay gratification, save and live frugally, in the end you will get ahead and your children will have an opportunity at a better life. Wal Mart, and other stores of their ilk, make a mockery of that ideal by having full-time employees still on public assistance. What is popularly railed-against as lazy people taking advantage of the system is often more a form of corporate welfare than one that benefits the individuals collecting the checks/food stamps/WIC vouchers, etc.

That story is largely bullshiat, except when a) there was a frontier and b) the government stepped in to create opportunity between 1945 and 1980. Farmers and factory workers between 1870 and 1940 had it WAY worse than Wal-Mart employees today.
2012-11-18 04:37:31 PM
1 votes:
Oh NOOOEZZZZZZ!

WHERE WILL I GO TO BUY CHEAP CHINESE shiat NOW!!!!!?????

WHERE...WHERE...WHERE!!!!!??????

Wait a minute.....

encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com

Nevermind.
GBB [TotalFark]
2012-11-18 04:37:11 PM
1 votes:
TFA: Seattle Walmart worker Sara Gilbert said ...

t2.gstatic.com

Really?? No one??
2012-11-18 04:35:17 PM
1 votes:
I'm about to go get some shopping done at Wal-Mart so I'm getting a kick out of these replies. Also, fark unions.
2012-11-18 04:35:03 PM
1 votes:

Jon iz teh kewl: i turned down a job at Best Buy cause unemployment pays more.


You sound Democrat.
2012-11-18 04:34:56 PM
1 votes:

XveryYpettyZ: The central story of the United States is the idea that if you work hard, sacrifice, delay gratification, save and live frugally, in the end you will get ahead and your children will have an opportunity at a better life. Wal Mart, and other stores of their ilk, make a mockery of that ideal by having full-time employees still on public assistance. What is popularly railed-against as lazy people taking advantage of the system is often more a form of corporate welfare than one that benefits the individuals collecting the checks/food stamps/WIC vouchers, etc.


Maybe its the labor market saying "there are too many workers"? I mean, if an employer can offer $x/hr and someone is willing to take it, that fact must have some meaning other than "the employer is evil".
2012-11-18 04:30:55 PM
1 votes:

Mike_LowELL: As the greatest philosopher, politician, businessman, and video game player to ever walk this Earth, you should take me seriously when I say that Wal-Mart is the highest form of art to ever exist.


No, sir, you are. YOU. ARE.
2012-11-18 04:28:50 PM
1 votes:
Online black friday shopping is so much better.
2012-11-18 04:25:22 PM
1 votes:
Monday's headline "Walmart training 30 new employees"

/Every Walmart I've shopped in regularly, has had the same people there for years.

/Not everyone celebrates Thanksgiving. Maybe the Jews, Muslims, Jehovahs, etc WANT THE WORK
2012-11-18 04:25:19 PM
1 votes:
WalkoutMart
2012-11-18 04:25:17 PM
1 votes:

Weaver95: basemetal: Weaver95: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.

Working for WalMart, other than management (and even them sometimes), is not rocket science, and it doesn't take that long to get an employee up to speed.

it costs more than most people realize. not merely in terms of training but in terms of lost revenue, lost consumer confidence and time.


Not to mention that actually staffing a new position is done by people in management positions, which takes up their time at their salaries. It's expensive to replace even a Wal-Mart Greeter.

Regarding this strike, my thought is that it's going to be a net-negative for labour in general. Not because it's a bad thing that they're doing - IMO, it's not - but because Wal-Mart is going to win, which will set a precedent going forward in future labour actions. Things aren't going to improve until enough people have been directly impacted by the changing business climate and realize how dangerous it is becoming.
2012-11-18 04:23:12 PM
1 votes:
I'm stuck working at my temp call-center job on Friday, so I'm getting a kick out of these replies...
2012-11-18 03:59:59 PM
1 votes:

coco ebert: Did you go to that monstrosity they erected by the St. Thomas neighborhood?


Yup. It's widely regarded as the worst Wal-Mart in the world.

And it is.

But since Katrina, everything past Canal St. closes (there used to be plenty of 24 hour stores, but oh well). I almost went to that Rouse's in the CBD we talked about a month or so ago, but the Wally World was closer. I do live next to a gas station that's open all night, but they don't sell beer. They do sell pipes and screens, but no beer.

Point is, I can walk to Wal-Mart in about 15 minutes (think I told you I recently moved to the Irish Channel). I ride a motorcycle, so driving to Rouse's is out of the question after the first beer, which of course is when I want more.

Who in New Orleans doesn't sell beer?
2012-11-18 03:53:42 PM
1 votes:

dickfreckle: Bontesla: Good for you employees.
/Will not be doing any Christmas shopping at Walmart anyway

I had to go there recently because it was the only store open that late, and I desperately needed something.

I'm not trying to pull a hipster dislike of the store; I genuinely despise going there and feel like I'm at the cusp of a heart attack each minute I'm there. Crotchfruit everywhere, muffin-tops, women beating their children...

Anyway, I'm proud of the workers for even planning a walk-out, but at the same time, they have to work or starve. Wal-Mart knows they have this leverage, unless all the employees planning to walk out have spouses that can support them.


Did you go to that monstrosity they erected by the St. Thomas neighborhood?
2012-11-18 03:48:10 PM
1 votes:

Weaver95: basemetal: And in other news, WalMart is now hiring.

wal-mart's problem is that they've started to realize that they cannot actually fire their entire work force without it affecting their bottom line. turns out that even the min wage slaves play an important part in the business cycle.


Working for WalMart, other than management (and even them sometimes), is not rocket science, and it doesn't take that long to get an employee up to speed.
2012-11-18 03:33:10 PM
1 votes:

coco ebert:

Simply telling workers, "oh well it's your fault you don't have a better job" is lazy and not grounded in empirical reality.


But it IS funny
2012-11-18 01:07:43 PM
1 votes:

vartian: tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...

Yeah, because people who work at Walmart have all these options just laid out in front of them.


Didn't you realize that they PICKED Walmart?
2012-11-18 01:00:22 PM
1 votes:

tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...


Yeah, because people who work at Walmart have all these options just laid out in front of them.
2012-11-18 12:53:27 PM
1 votes:
Good for them.
2012-11-18 12:49:31 PM
1 votes:

tbhouston: People choose to work at Walmart for what ever reason..no one is forcing them...


Everyone who works at Walmart really must love their job then, right?
 
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