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(Daily Kos)   Hostess employee gives the inside filling on what just happened and why the bakers rejected the management offer: "It will be hard to replace the job I had, but it will be easy to replace the job they were trying to give me"   ( dailykos.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Hostess Brands, Health Care, International, Lenexa  
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7562 clicks; posted to Politics » on 18 Nov 2012 at 2:27 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-18 10:58:48 AM  
vulture capitalists
 
2012-11-18 11:57:56 AM  
Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.
 
2012-11-18 12:31:34 PM  
Good thing the union could do anything to stop the 3 dollar theft...o wait they didn't do shat
 
2012-11-18 01:29:29 PM  
its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.
 
2012-11-18 01:39:56 PM  
FTA: It said that the $3+ per hour that we as a Union contribute to the pension was going to be 'borrowed' by the company until they could be profitable again. Then they would pay it all back. The Union was notified of this the same time and method as the individual members. No contact from the company to the Union on a national level. This money will never be paid back. The company filed for bankruptcy and the judge ruled that the $3+ per hour was a debt the company couldn't repay

I can understand how this conforms to existing law.
I don't see why, given this possibility, it is in the public interest to leave such "borrowing" lawful for any entity allowed to declare bankruptcy, save when the "loan" is secured by a primary lein against capital.
 
2012-11-18 02:12:23 PM  

Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.


But, yeah, this is gonna be held up as an example of how unions are farking up the economy. Never mind that the company was not negotiating in anything that could be called good faith.

And expect a nice heaping dollup of nativism on top of it if Bimbo does end up buying Hostess' brands out. "THEY TOOK OUR TWINKIES!"
 
2012-11-18 02:29:02 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.


THIS
 
2012-11-18 02:29:29 PM  
A shame they didn't stick it out for marijuana decriminalization.
 
2012-11-18 02:30:18 PM  
keep it you coonts.


www.cmarshallfab.com
 
2012-11-18 02:32:24 PM  
Their pensions were already stolen, and their jobs were gone. What did they have to lose?
And that is where the bosses are screwing up. When they have backed the working class into a corner, and they have nothing left to lose...........well, history informs us.
 
2012-11-18 02:33:12 PM  
no no no, unions were involved so they must be responsible.

Bootstrappy capitalists are never responsible for anything
 
2012-11-18 02:33:12 PM  
Exactly, if they reduce your wages to that of a fast-food guy, you might as well strike and bring down the company. Especially when you find out that, just as you suspected, management got raises and bonuses.
 
2012-11-18 02:33:45 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.


Oh, and it's better. Notice how most people are ignoring all the bonuses and pay raises the management gave themselves recently?
 
2012-11-18 02:33:50 PM  

Bontesla: ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.

THIS


ditto
 
2012-11-18 02:35:01 PM  
Obama will create millions of jobs so you'll land on your feet in no time.
 
2012-11-18 02:35:48 PM  

Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.


People eating healthier and cutting back on carbs had nothing to do with their financial performance.
 
2012-11-18 02:37:18 PM  

Guess_Who: Obama will create millions of jobs so you'll land on your feet in no time.


Yep. Mismanagement of Hostess: all on Obama.

Forget Bengazigate: TWINKIEGATE is here.
 
2012-11-18 02:37:48 PM  

jake_lex: But, yeah, this is gonna be held up as an example of how unions are farking up the economy. Never mind that the company was not negotiating in anything that could be called good faith.


It's been that way in all union negotiations for the last ten years, from UAW to the NBA, NFL, and NHL players' unions. And every time, people want to blame the unions, and by proxy, the workers, when every time, it's the suits' incompetence that's gotten them in those situations.
 
2012-11-18 02:37:53 PM  

Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.


Hostess's products suck and that is ultimately why they went out of business. Wonderbread is the worst bread in the history of breads.
 
2012-11-18 02:39:44 PM  
Hero tag is missing.
 
2012-11-18 02:40:39 PM  

tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.

People eating healthier and cutting back on carbs had nothing to do with their financial performance.


Look, I know the politics tab is dry for us liters today, but that doesn't mean you have to go even derpier. FTA even posted some of the numbers.
 
2012-11-18 02:42:35 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.


But gross incompetence of a president should be overlooked. Just ask Obama.

But really, the unions are the problem... As usual.
 
2012-11-18 02:43:38 PM  

Muta: Hostess's products suck and that is ultimately why they went out of business. Wonderbread is the worst bread in the history of breads.


You obviously don't remember Vomitbread or Poisonbread.
 
2012-11-18 02:44:15 PM  

randomjsa: But gross incompetence of a president should be overlooked. Just ask Obama.


ronehot1079philly.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-11-18 02:44:23 PM  
The unions allowed a shiatty company to die, but they weren't responsible for making a good company shiatty.
 
2012-11-18 02:44:32 PM  
the real issue here is that no twinkies, no wonderbread & no dingdongs could cause a massive famine in red sates.
 
2012-11-18 02:45:16 PM  

Greil: tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.

People eating healthier and cutting back on carbs had nothing to do with their financial performance.

Look, I know the politics tab is dry for us liters today, but that doesn't mean you have to go even derpier. FTA even posted some of the numbers.


Now hold on a minute - I am invoking the "broken clock" meme. Ten pounds is correct - Hostess sales have been tailing off, and there is little doubt that changing eating habits contributed to that. It was one of the myriad of problems that brought them down.
 
2012-11-18 02:45:23 PM  

born_yesterday: Guess_Who: Obama will create millions of jobs so you'll land on your feet in no time.

Yep. Mismanagement of Hostess: all on Obama.

Forget Bengazigate: TWINKIEGATE is here.


Twinkiegate sounds sexier and edible.
 
2012-11-18 02:46:21 PM  

Greil: tenpoundsofcheese: Weaver95: its interesting how this story is being covered by the corporate press. they keep wanting to blame the unions but...its easy to see that the CEO and his buddies were basically running the company into the ground.

People eating healthier and cutting back on carbs had nothing to do with their financial performance.

Look, I know the politics tab is dry for us liters today, but that doesn't mean you have to go even derpier. FTA even posted some of the numbers.


Wut?
Revenue doesn't matter as much as their profit
2.5b in revenue with no mention of cost or marketing costs to convince people to buy their products
 
2012-11-18 02:46:54 PM  

alltim: the real issue here is that no twinkies, no wonderbread & no dingdongs could cause a massive famine in red sates.


All of America is fat. The red states are very slightly fatter. It would affect all of the country basically the same.
 
2012-11-18 02:47:59 PM  

randomjsa: ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.

But gross incompetence of a president should be overlooked. Just ask Obama.

But really, the unions are the problem... As usual.


2/10. The President only has moderate control over the economy on the best of days, most of the blame from a governmental angle is dispersed throughout most of the legislative branch of the government. A CEO like, say, Mitt Romney, wants and gets absolute control over any action taken in the company unless he delegates or ignores it. Gross incompetence by a CEO, therefore, often leads directly into a crashed company. I don't think that should be illegal. I do, however, think that raising management pay while cutting worker pay should be. No one gets bonuses unless no one's pay is cut, and no one gets raises unless everyone gets raises. Call me a communist, I know it's coming for an opinion like that, but a company is a team and should succeed or fail as one.
 
2012-11-18 02:48:45 PM  
Good, twinkies are disgusting anyways. Actually most of the the snack cake things hostess made were gross.
 
2012-11-18 02:49:49 PM  
I stand with the Teamsters.

The Bakers' Union tried to use this to score political points at their members' disadvantage.

Combining all of the lavish executive pay packages they cite together, you've got 4 million dollars.

Assuming that the execs decide to reduce their compensation to zero and that you distribute that equally among the 18,000 employees at Hostess, you're talking about $200 per person per year, pre-tax. $20 a month.

If you think that's worth fighting over, you've miscalculated. That's not to say that the executive pay wasn't immoral (it was), but it is unlikely that they'll give up over it.

But hey, the AFL-CIO gets to join in on the GOP feeding frenzy while both its members and the ChangeToWin group who wanted nothing to do with your strike are both out of work. Good jorb.
 
2012-11-18 02:51:36 PM  
Must not be that big of a deal, nobody has gone postal at any of the twinkie plants. If it aint worth killing over then its not worth getting mad about.
 
2012-11-18 02:51:42 PM  
I still can't wrap my head around how a company (or indeed, the government) can simply "borrow" a pension fund and never repay it. Isn't it considered part of the compensation for your work? It's like if a company could just suddenly demand that you pay them 15% of all your past paychecks.
 
2012-11-18 02:53:48 PM  

Greil: randomjsa: ecmoRandomNumbers: Jesus Christ, why aren't these people in prison for embezzlement? Gross incompetence of a CEO should also be a felony.

But gross incompetence of a president should be overlooked. Just ask Obama.

But really, the unions are the problem... As usual.

2/10. The President only has moderate control over the economy on the best of days, most of the blame from a governmental angle is dispersed throughout most of the legislative branch of the government. A CEO like, say, Mitt Romney, wants and gets absolute control over any action taken in the company unless he delegates or ignores it. Gross incompetence by a CEO, therefore, often leads directly into a crashed company. I don't think that should be illegal. I do, however, think that raising management pay while cutting worker pay should be. No one gets bonuses unless no one's pay is cut, and no one gets raises unless everyone gets raises. Call me a communist, I know it's coming for an opinion like that, but a company is a team and should succeed or fail as one.


Having learned some economic theory in my time from such prolific economists as Dr. Beck, what you just espoused was more socialism than communism. However, irregardless of that distinction, you are still a pinko-fascist, lieberal Un-American.
 
2012-11-18 02:55:18 PM  

andrewagill: I stand with the Teamsters.

The Bakers' Union tried to use this to score political points at their members' disadvantage.

Combining all of the lavish executive pay packages they cite together, you've got 4 million dollars.

Assuming that the execs decide to reduce their compensation to zero and that you distribute that equally among the 18,000 employees at Hostess, you're talking about $200 per person per year, pre-tax. $20 a month.

If you think that's worth fighting over, you've miscalculated. That's not to say that the executive pay wasn't immoral (it was), but it is unlikely that they'll give up over it.

But hey, the AFL-CIO gets to join in on the GOP feeding frenzy while both its members and the ChangeToWin group who wanted nothing to do with your strike are both out of work. Good jorb.


So the fact that the salary of the woman in the article was going to decrease by half in 10 years means nothing?
 
2012-11-18 02:56:38 PM  
That is a very clever line, but not accurate.
 
2012-11-18 02:58:41 PM  
where oh where is that free Obama bail-out?

Or did they not pay him with enough dough?
 
2012-11-18 03:02:08 PM  

hawcian: I still can't wrap my head around how a company (or indeed, the government) can simply "borrow" a pension fund and never repay it. Isn't it considered part of the compensation for your work? It's like if a company could just suddenly demand that you pay them 15% of all your past paychecks.


Social Security? Why are you bashing SS?
 
2012-11-18 03:02:26 PM  

andrewagill: But hey, the AFL-CIO gets to join in on the GOP feeding frenzy while both its members and the ChangeToWin group who wanted nothing to do with your strike are both out of work. Good jorb.


Hostess was doomed no matter what, if the bakers didn't go on strike it might have last maybe a month longer, maybe not that long maybe a little longer.
 
2012-11-18 03:03:59 PM  
This has been going around on Facebook:

fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net 

Sounds like they didn't do a good job getting rid of that debt during the first bankruptcy.
 
2012-11-18 03:04:25 PM  
FTFA: "We have watched 6 CEO's come and go since 2002"

They were already dead. Either their board managed to find half a dozen loot-and-scoot assholes in a row, or things were so bad that half a dozen guys said "F this, I quit."

Of course, I've always held that the "golden parachute" is the problem.

When it becomes more personally lucrative to QUIT YOUR JOB than to keep coming to work, what do you think is going to happen?

/the President of my local State University just got in the news that she's quitting her job after less than a year, but demands TWO MILLION dollars, President Emeritus status, POSITIVE letter of reference, and a while bunch of other perks as well, so I'm really getting a kick...
 
2012-11-18 03:04:32 PM  

andrewagill: I stand with the Teamsters.

The Bakers' Union tried to use this to score political points at their members' disadvantage.

Combining all of the lavish executive pay packages they cite together, you've got 4 million dollars.

Assuming that the execs decide to reduce their compensation to zero and that you distribute that equally among the 18,000 employees at Hostess, you're talking about $200 per person per year, pre-tax. $20 a month.

If you think that's worth fighting over, you've miscalculated. That's not to say that the executive pay wasn't immoral (it was), but it is unlikely that they'll give up over it.

But hey, the AFL-CIO gets to join in on the GOP feeding frenzy while both its members and the ChangeToWin group who wanted nothing to do with your strike are both out of work. Good jorb.


So how do you feel about that extraordinary and lavish bonus the CEO got just before this? You know, the bonus that exceeds what they were attempting to extort from the workers in paycuts.
 
2012-11-18 03:05:12 PM  

WhyteRaven74: andrewagill: But hey, the AFL-CIO gets to join in on the GOP feeding frenzy while both its members and the ChangeToWin group who wanted nothing to do with your strike are both out of work. Good jorb.

Hostess was doomed no matter what, if the bakers didn't go on strike it might have last maybe a month longer, maybe not that long maybe a little longer.


thats what I said about Gov Motors. I give them 1 year or less.
 
2012-11-18 03:05:51 PM  
Goddamn, that makes my blood boil. There is no loyalty in business anymore, dedicated employees are thanked with stolen pensions, slashed benefits, and cut pay. The worst thing that's happening to me this year is no annual "cost of living" raise. Guess I should feel lucky to be somewhat treated like a human being.
 
2012-11-18 03:06:37 PM  

ghare: ....reduce your wages to that of a fast-food guy....management got raises and bonuses.


Say hello to cause and effect.
 
2012-11-18 03:09:53 PM  

themindiswatching: Sounds like they didn't do a good job getting rid of that debt during the first bankruptcy.


They actually picked up a decent amount of debt while they were in bankruptcy.
 
2012-11-18 03:11:44 PM  

A Terrible Human: Good, twinkies are disgusting anyways. Actually most of the the snack cake things hostess made were gross.


I don't know how old you are, but they used to be quite good a few decades ago.
 
2012-11-18 03:14:19 PM  

jso2897: Their pensions were already stolen, and their jobs were gone. What did they have to lose?


Yeah, my initial reaction to the story as I heard it was "wow, that is a stupid union" but as I read more about the situation I think your assessment is spot on.

And just the other day some Palin-american was trying to argue the Pensions are superior to a 401k.
 
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