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(Fox News)   Pentagon spends $1.5 million trying to develop a new roll up beef jerky. Couldn't they have just gone down to any 7-Eleven and spent 99 cents on a Slim Jim?   (foxnews.com) divider line 93
    More: Asinine, G.I. Bill, statistical significance  
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1284 clicks; posted to Politics » on 17 Nov 2012 at 8:10 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-17 08:19:54 AM
Randy Savage hasn't been dead for two years and THIS is what Subby thinks is funny?

Too soon, subs, too damn soon

/Oh yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaahhhhh
 
2012-11-17 08:21:02 AM

cman: Randy Savage hasn't been dead for two years and THIS is what Subby thinks is funny?

Too soon, subs, too damn soon

/Oh yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaahhhhh


Randy Savage is dead?
 
2012-11-17 08:28:58 AM

Cuthbert Allgood: cman: Randy Savage hasn't been dead for two years and THIS is what Subby thinks is funny?

Too soon, subs, too damn soon

/Oh yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaahhhhh

Randy Savage is dead?


He saved us from the Rapture!

i.dailymail.co.uk

/hot like Miss Elizabeth in the mid-80s
 
2012-11-17 08:29:34 AM

Cuthbert Allgood: Randy Savage is dead?


Oh yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaahhhhh he is.
 
2012-11-17 08:30:15 AM
There is a movement afoot to cut one trillion dollars from the Pentagon budget over the next ten years. Anyone can read about it and, if they feel so led, participate in this effort. Link
 
2012-11-17 08:30:26 AM
Through normal military supply channels, that $.99 (retail) Slim Jim will cost $42.39, and take approximately three months to be delivered.
 
2012-11-17 08:32:05 AM
Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.
 
2012-11-17 08:32:16 AM
There's got to be a joke about trimming the fat in this somewhere.
 
2012-11-17 08:45:05 AM

Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.


I currently live on an overseas base in Spain, and although we do go shopping out in town for cool local food and things, the bulk of our shopping is still at the commissary. The Euro is kicking our asses, and the cost of living allotment is not enough to make up for that.
 
2012-11-17 08:47:57 AM
When NASA needed a writing implement, they spent a million dollars developing the space pen which could write in zero gravity. When faced with the same challenge, the Russkies used a pencil.
 
2012-11-17 08:49:41 AM

Kumana Wanalaia: When NASA needed a writing implement, they spent a million dollars developing the space pen which could write in zero gravity. When faced with the same challenge, the Russkies used a pencil.


No they didn't.

http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp
 
x23
2012-11-17 08:50:18 AM

Shadowknight: I currently live on an overseas base in Spain, and although we do go shopping out in town for cool local food and things, the bulk of our shopping is still at the commissary. The Euro is kicking our asses, and the cost of living allotment is not enough to make up for that.


hey guys. i think i found a thing that could be closed to save some money.
 
2012-11-17 08:54:22 AM

x23: hey guys. i think i found a thing that could be closed to save some money.


Get a map, and then look at Spain, and then look at North Africa. Seriously, I'm all for reducing military expenditures, but a base in Spain isn't exactly wasteful.
 
2012-11-17 08:54:29 AM

physt: Kumana Wanalaia: When NASA needed a writing implement, they spent a million dollars developing the space pen which could write in zero gravity. When faced with the same challenge, the Russkies used a pencil.

No they didn't.

http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/spacepen.asp


And even if they did, a pen would still be a better solution. Sharpen a pencil in space and you'll end up with bits of wood shaving flying into your electrics.
 
2012-11-17 08:57:04 AM
We could save money by making the quality of life for our soldiers worse, or we could buy a few less super fighter jets.

You really want to save money on soldier upkeep? Hire fewer soldiers, maintain fewer bases
 
2012-11-17 08:58:09 AM

Karac: Sharpen a pencil in space and you'll end up with bits of wood shaving flying into your electrics.


Not just wood, but nice conductive graphite too.
 
2012-11-17 08:58:38 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: x23: hey guys. i think i found a thing that could be closed to save some money.

Get a map, and then look at Spain, and then look at North Africa. Seriously, I'm all for reducing military expenditures, but a base in Spain isn't exactly wasteful.


Interesting question, which I don't know the answer to - which is more cost effective, maintaining a permanent base, or just sailing a carrier group into the general vicinity when shiat goes down?
 
2012-11-17 09:04:20 AM

Lost Thought 00: You really want to save money on soldier upkeep? Hire fewer soldiers, maintain fewer bases


That generally tends to be the GOP plan: cut benefits, cut pensions, cut VA healthcare, refuse to raise pay, as -well basically- fark soldiers and sailors.

But spend as much as you humanly can on expensive toys we don't actually need.

To some degree, I support them, as if they follow through on their plans, the military will cease trending Republican within my lifetime.
 
2012-11-17 09:05:35 AM
if they don't spend it, they won't get it next year.
 
2012-11-17 09:07:44 AM

Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.


I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.
 
2012-11-17 09:08:07 AM

Linux_Yes: if they don't spend it, they won't get it next year.


Exactly. This is why jerky decisions like this keep being made.
 
2012-11-17 09:08:36 AM
The very first paragraph in the article:

Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools and even developing a roll-up version of beef jerky, insists one of the Senate's leading fiscal conservatives.

That's the Conservative's solution: Let's stop feeding and educating our troops and their families. Or to put it more succinctly than I probably would:

Lost Thought 00: We could save money by making the quality of life for our soldiers worse, or we could buy a few less super fighter jets.

You really want to save money on soldier upkeep? Hire fewer soldiers, maintain fewer bases


That.
=Smidge=
 
2012-11-17 09:09:23 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: x23: hey guys. i think i found a thing that could be closed to save some money.

Get a map, and then look at Spain, and then look at North Africa. Seriously, I'm all for reducing military expenditures, but a base in Spain isn't exactly wasteful.


You know what else might save us a bit of money? We could stay the hell out of North Africa.
 
2012-11-17 09:10:05 AM
This is the equivalent of wanting to cut PBS funding to balance the budget.

Buying one less warplane would equal the same amount as all the other "waste" put together. And you can't tell me that that one extra plane would significantly affect our ability to respond to anything thrown at us.
 
2012-11-17 09:11:17 AM
I am shocked and awed by this beef jerky.
 
2012-11-17 09:11:48 AM
cdn.gunaxin.com
 
2012-11-17 09:12:02 AM

Shadowknight: Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.

I currently live on an overseas base in Spain, and although we do go shopping out in town for cool local food and things, the bulk of our shopping is still at the commissary. The Euro is kicking our asses, and the cost of living allotment is not enough to make up for that.


Seriously though, the above is good information. I can be propose closing bases till the cows come home, but as long as they are open; the people assigned to those bases should be allowed a decent standard of living. If that means providing a commissary, then we should provide commissary. We can save money without abusing the personnel.
 
2012-11-17 09:12:34 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: x23: hey guys. i think i found a thing that could be closed to save some money.

Get a map, and then look at Spain, and then look at North Africa. Seriously, I'm all for reducing military expenditures, but a base in Spain isn't exactly wasteful.


Considering how many other bases we have in europe, I don't see any particular reason why we need a base in spain. we don't need to be the world's policemen, it costs too much and paints a target on our back.
 
2012-11-17 09:14:33 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: Get a map, and then look at Spain, and then look at North Africa. Seriously, I'm all for reducing military expenditures, but a base in Spain isn't exactly wasteful.


Because Morocco is a hotbed, right?
We have a naval air station and naval base at Rota.
There's a giant runway there that used to be used as an alternate landing site for the space shuttle.
It's just up the coast on the Atlantic side from Gibraltar, a historically significant strategic location.
Seems reasonable.
 
2012-11-17 09:16:33 AM

ArgusRun: This is the equivalent of wanting to cut PBS funding to balance the budget.

Buying one less warplane would equal the same amount as all the other "waste" put together. And you can't tell me that that one extra plane would significantly affect our ability to respond to anything thrown at us.


We could start by cutting the hardware the Pentagon emphatically does not want. We've reached an absurd state wherein the weapons manufacturers dictate what we purchase sometimes over the objections of the Pentagon. Instead of cutting benefits to G.I.Joe, let's cut back on the largess that people like Robert J. Stevens rake in.
 
2012-11-17 09:19:20 AM

Lunaville: I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.


No, this is not in anyway a good idea. I'm an EFL teacher, and I know lots of people that tutor local kids that go to the private English-only high school for the ex-pat kids. Yes, if you get a kid who is 5 or 6 they can pretty quickly adapt. If you get a kid in high school, you're looking at several hours a night of study just to barely pass your exams. It can be incredibly damaging to the child's education.
 
2012-11-17 09:20:35 AM
Need some Africola, amirite?
 
2012-11-17 09:20:50 AM
physt:

thanks.
 
2012-11-17 09:23:09 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: Lunaville: I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.

No, this is not in anyway a good idea. I'm an EFL teacher, and I know lots of people that tutor local kids that go to the private English-only high school for the ex-pat kids. Yes, if you get a kid who is 5 or 6 they can pretty quickly adapt. If you get a kid in high school, you're looking at several hours a night of study just to barely pass your exams. It can be incredibly damaging to the child's education.


Not to mention that just as soon as the kid starts get decent at Okinawan, dad gets transferred and then he has to start over learning German.
 
2012-11-17 09:24:37 AM
--Nonmilitary research, $6 billion. Military does have access to research facilities and assets that non- military research may not have so it is entirely possible they may be performing joint ventures with non-military research projects with non-military research agencies. Speculation on my part of course

--Education, $10.7 billion. I'm assuming DoD schools. We maintain a large population of of both non-military and military families overseas in areas that either don't have the capacity nor the english based curriculum to absorb that population of students. At other times, political climate dictates that we protect our kids by having them attend classes on base. Either way, maintaining a school on base is pricey, often due to realestate requirements alone. We maintained a pretty good sized school system consisting of three separate learning facilities, softball, tennis, football, and soccer fields. Just outside our gates, an undeveloped plot of land ~1000sqft was priced in the hundreds of thousands. Understandably, the military has land use agreements, but even the costs of land rental would be staggering. And this was just at one of literally hundreds of overseas location. So yeah- educating military and support staff families gets pricey.

--Tuition assistance, $4.5 billion. No doubt about it- one of the most cited incentive for joining the military is that they do take care of your education. I dare say, we could proudly claim to be the most educated force than at any other time in our military history.

--Pentagon-run grocery stores, $9 billion. see education. add: being able to purchase comfort or hard to find items from home that may not be found in the area where your stationed. Several years ago i stayed at Osan Air Base: the top requested item of both the legitimate as well as the black market was...a decently built toaster. Something that apparantly could not be had locally.

--More than 300,000 military members performing civilian jobs and numerous general officers, $37 billion. Many of those "civilian" jobs have a military component as well that we would not expect of our civilian counterparts to perform: in wartime, kitchen staff may have to work in hostile areas perform alternative wartime assignments such as working in the morgue, ordinance details or war related tasks. I repaired and calibrated test equipment- my civilian counterpart could probably duplicate similar tasks for less pay under peace time conditions. But unlike my counterparts, I was alo required to handle sensitive and classified material as well. I was also trained to work out of a portable lab and was expected to do so under hostile conditions. Some of of my other uncivilian tasks included identifying unexploded ordinance, constructiion and testing spare fuel tanks for fighters, and assisting with freight shipments.

I'm not saying that waste does not occur in the military nor am I defending it. I'm merely offering a few details to fill in the background of how some of these expenses are derrived.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/15/from-grocery-stores-to-beef -jerky-senator-outlines-68b-in-possible-defense-cuts/#ixzz2CUDDbRu8
 
2012-11-17 09:26:04 AM

Lunaville: Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.

I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.


A noble idea, but it will never happen. Whenever it is white people moving and living in other countries, especially with a culture that is much different from theirs, they prefer and demand to live in their own little segregated community. Just don't point that out the next time one of them open their mouths complaining about immigrates in the US.
 
2012-11-17 09:27:00 AM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: Lunaville: I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.

No, this is not in anyway a good idea. I'm an EFL teacher, and I know lots of people that tutor local kids that go to the private English-only high school for the ex-pat kids. Yes, if you get a kid who is 5 or 6 they can pretty quickly adapt. If you get a kid in high school, you're looking at several hours a night of study just to barely pass your exams. It can be incredibly damaging to the child's education.


Hmm, now you've intrigued me. I see that you have deep knowledge on this topic and, because I don't, I'm going to want to pick your brain just the tiniest bit.

1. Suppose the military brats have a half day in the local school and a half day "home schooled" by military spouse volunteers?
2. What aspects of a formal exchange program could be borrowed to make such a scheme successful?
3. Or are all exchange programs damaging to a child's education? Are exchange programs to be avidly avoided by the wise parent?
4.Have you read about the family that sent their children to school in Russia? Link What do you think of that? Do you think there are any lessons there?
 
2012-11-17 09:27:26 AM

Lunaville: Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.

I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.


I've colored you in pink so I can gift you TF when I'm on my laptop later today.
You are continually awesome.
 
2012-11-17 09:27:33 AM
So, basically more cuts to soldier's person needs to buy more bombs to drop on brown people. Sounds like a GOP plan to me. Anybody that thinks the GOP is going to cut the defense budget is obtuse. Move money around to maximize war profiteering, sure, cut spending, no.
 
2012-11-17 09:29:07 AM

More_Like_A_Stain: Through normal military supply channels, that $.99 (retail) Slim Jim will cost $42.39, and take approximately three months to be delivered.


All snark aside- do the research to see what innovations military and aerospace research have resulted.
/awkward sentence but point hopefully made
 
2012-11-17 09:38:37 AM

More_Like_A_Stain: Through normal military supply channels, that $.99 (retail) Slim Jim will cost $42.39, and take approximately three months to be delivered.


Duty free at the commissary!
 
2012-11-17 09:38:58 AM

Dwight_Yeast: To some degree, I support them, as if they follow through on their plans, the military will cease trending Republican within my lifetime.


I would just like to point out that this will never happen. Not ever.
 
2012-11-17 09:39:19 AM

clowncar on fire: --Pentagon-run grocery stores, $9 billion. see education. add: being able to purchase comfort or hard to find items from home that may not be found in the area where your stationed. Several years ago i stayed at Osan Air Base: the top requested item of both the legitimate as well as the black market was...a decently built toaster. Something that apparantly could not be had locally.


I can beat the ever-loving fark out of that. When I was stationed at Camp Lemonier, Djibouti for about six months, the most requested item at the PX, one which they were either unable to procure or unable to get enough of to keep in stock was SOAP.

And I'm not talking some fru-fru bottle of Axe liquid or fancy ass thing you'd find in some high-maintenance girl's bathroom. I mean any soap AT ALL. No dove, no irish spring, none of those orange bars I only saw in boot camp. Not even any of that granulated powder stuff you used in shop class. I dare someone to say that providing a way for Marines to keep themselves clean is wasteful spending.

/As a lesson - a box of ~30 bars of Irish Spring that you had your mother mail you will keep a 16-man canvas tent smelling like a gentle summer breeze for weeks. Best damn air freshener I've ever smelled.
 
2012-11-17 09:41:13 AM
Does anyone here remember the Grace Commission Report back in the 1980's? President Reagan commissioned J. Peter Grace, a Democrat, to study government spending and find waste. He found it, about seventeen volumes worth. Not a damn thing was done about any of Grace's findings.
 
2012-11-17 09:41:47 AM

lilbjorn: Linux_Yes: if they don't spend it, they won't get it next year.

Exactly. This is why jerky decisions like this keep being made.


This is universally applicable and not just within the military. It does get under your skin though.. I was once asked how we should spend the last few thousand dollars to make budget at our squadron once. I flippantly replied that we could give it back and pay down the national debt a little, or at least debit it so we could get credit when we really needed it. We ended up with a large screen TV- for training purposes-- and the usual crop of new office furniture. Much needed test gear came from a different budget, bleah, bleah, bleah.
 
2012-11-17 09:42:58 AM

Granny_Panties: So, basically more cuts to soldier's person needs to buy more bombs to drop on brown people. Sounds like a GOP plan to me. Anybody that thinks the GOP is going to cut the defense budget is obtuse. Move money around to maximize war profiteering, sure, cut spending, no.


I have a friend who does informal, unpaid lobbying. She has observed that congressmen rarely receive any comments or visits regarding the defense budget except those that are pro-increased spending. She gifts pies to our congressmen when she visits and staff are frequently taken aback that she is there to request a reduction in military spending. She has been told repeatedly, sometimes by quietly grateful staff members, that she is the only person they have gotten that message from. I really encourage you to visit that link I included up thread and consider contacting your own representatives with your views.
 
2012-11-17 09:43:08 AM

Lunaville: 1. Suppose the military brats have a half day in the local school and a half day "home schooled" by military spouse volunteers?


So you want to give the kids less time to absorb the language and then replace trained professionals with volunteers?
 
2012-11-17 09:43:48 AM

ArgusRun: This is the equivalent of wanting to cut PBS funding to balance the budget.

Buying one less warplane would equal the same amount as all the other "waste" put together. And you can't tell me that that one extra plane would significantly affect our ability to respond to anything thrown at us.



Yep. It looks like more of that naïve Republican faith that privatization's always cheaper.

Couple days ago a Farker brought up the subject of how procurement and manufacturing of big ticket items is messed up, with subassembly manufacturing spread all across the U.S. map ( == congressional districts) for political reasons, and there could be tremendous cost savings by bringing it all together in a way that makes better sense. I notice Coburn's avoiding discussing this.

I also notice he's not wondering whether we're spending too much on mercenaries, either.
 
2012-11-17 09:43:53 AM

clowncar on fire: More_Like_A_Stain: Through normal military supply channels, that $.99 (retail) Slim Jim will cost $42.39, and take approximately three months to be delivered.

All snark aside- do the research to see what innovations military and aerospace research have resulted.
/awkward sentence but point hopefully made


I have no problem with the $200 beryllium non-sparking hammers used for working around fuel and ammo storage spaces. I do have a problem with the $3.00 1/4-20 socket head screws that are identical to the $.29 screws at Ace Hardware. I expect a mil-spec resistor or relay to cost more than a standard one. But when I can buy the same exact mil-spec part from a civilian supplier for less than 1/10th of the price, it's not the part that is at fault. It is the system.
 
2012-11-17 09:47:19 AM

Bontesla: Lunaville: Karac: Defense spending could be slashed by $68 billion over 10 years if the military stopped spending millions on running grocery stores, operating its own schools

I have no problems with the federal government running commisaries and schools on military bases, seeing as how some bases are functionally their own towns.

Unless of course, you think some SNCO who gets station in Okinawa should be forced to send his kid to the school run by the locals. Or that some officer stationed in a missile base in middle-of-farking-nowhere Montana should have to drive 50 miles to the nearest grocery store.

I don't think host governments would tolerate the added expense and responsibility, but attending school in a foreign locale, such as Okinawa, among the locals, in the local language would be a tremendous advantage for the children. Akin to a foreign exchange program, but with even more immersion; it would give the children a huge jump on acquiring marketable language skills.

I've colored you in pink so I can gift you TF when I'm on my laptop later today.
You are continually awesome.


That is very kind. Thank-you.
 
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