FARK.com: (7437951) "Papa" John who is worth $600M, lives in a $7M mansion (with a 22-car garage), pays his employees an average of $7 per hour and is doing a $30M "free pizza" promotion is upset that he has to spend $8M to provide his employees with healthcare

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		"Papa" John who is worth $600M, lives in a $7M mansion (with a 22-car garage), pays his employees an average of $7 per hour and is doing a $30M "free pizza" promotion is upset that he has to spend $8M to provide his employees with healthcare (politico.com)		706
		More: Stupid, Papa John, obamacare, John Schnatter, Justen Charters, Manchurian Candidate, Facebook users, Boehner, Red Lobster

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badaboom		2012-11-16 07:39:07 PM

clowncar on fire: Peter von Nostrand: Employers are pissed that they can't keep passing off their responsibility to their employees to the rest of society. And yet these are the same people that biatch because the hospital tax for their county hospital keeps going up year after year and Medicare/Medicaid costs keep going up and up

Not shocking. At all

It's your parents who should be taking care of your needs, not some stranger that, by mutual contract, payed money for your labors. They brought you into world, they can take care of you.
No wait- the govermnent is suppose to take care of you- isn't that why you voted? i took care of you now where's mine?
Surely someone out there is responsible for your care, somebody. Any takers?

Hi. I make this product. Currently it costs me a $1.00 to make. I sell it for $1.25 so I am doing pretty well. But now the government wants me to provide X to each of my workers at a cost of .20 cents per product more in expense. So now it costs me $1.20 to make the product. So what are my choices? Well, I could just lower my profit margins to 5 cents per product. But that would affect my stock holders and my ability to reinvest in the company. Oh, and my profit margin is directly responsible for my ability to raise capital. Lower my margin and my interest rates go up. But, it is a choice. Or I could pass the cost onto the consumer, I'll start charging $1.45. Hmm, but that might lower sales and make me less competitive. Or I could lower the salaries and benefits of my employees. Hmm, but that might make it less attractive to work for my company, I may have a hard time hiring people. The good thing is, in a free farking country I get to decide what I want to do. Me. Not you. Want to make decisions like this? Become me.

badaboom		2012-11-16 07:41:07 PM

Lionel Mandrake: badaboom: Hobodeluxe: Forbes did a study and it costs them like 5 cents a pizza to give their employees health care.
they think they can't absorb 5 cents a pie. that's bullshiat. they can. they just don't want to.

Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

*plonk*

tiresome troll is tiresome.

Ironic that you just exerted your freedom. Are you against freedom for others? Should everyone do what you want? I just favorited you as an idiot.

badaboom		2012-11-16 07:44:27 PM

Hobodeluxe: badaboom: Hobodeluxe: Forbes did a study and it costs them like 5 cents a pizza to give their employees health care.
they think they can't absorb 5 cents a pie. that's bullshiat. they can. they just don't want to.

Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

yeah and asshole tyrant employers that people like you defend. I ,myself wouldn't mind the 5 cent increase per pizza. I think a lot of people are like me. I also think he could use the fact that he's giving his employees health care in his advertising and increase his bottom line in a better way than giving away free pizzas.

So you support his freedom to decide? Excellent. Don't like what he is doing? Don't buy his pizza or work for him. And I don't support tyrants. I support liberty and the freedom to let the marketplace of ideas to decide what is right.

Lionel Mandrake		2012-11-16 07:46:58 PM

Wow. Lots of gray bars on this page all of a sudden. It's kind of pretty.

serial_crusher		2012-11-16 07:48:03 PM

Freudian_slipknot: serial_crusher: When you worked at your job, you probably cared about it, tried to do it right

Oh hell no I didn't. I tried to do as little as possible and not get caught. Back when I was working min wage crap jobs they were utterly interchangeable and could be replaced the same day if I was ever fired.

And I was never fired, btw. Because god knows the managers never wanted to go through the work of training a replacement.

ok, but did you carry that mentality into your real jobs? Did you ever make the switch back to carelessness?
You might be unique in that you can switch back and forth between caring or not.
Or maybe you went through a big change when you first got out, and might not have such an easy time going back?

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 07:49:36 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Wow. Lots of gray bars on this page all of a sudden. It's kind of pretty.

I had my heart set on a soothing pastel :(

BarkingUnicorn		2012-11-16 07:50:37 PM

I'm thinking this is all part of Obama's diabolical plan. Let the nation see how bad things can get under employer-channeled health care, then go for single payer.

Dem Muslin Keenyins is tricksy. ;)

More_Like_A_Stain		2012-11-16 07:52:52 PM

BalugaJoe: If they could get people to work for free they would do it.

Not without complaining about the quality of the worker. After all, they're obviously working just for the love of the job. They should be a little more conscientious. farking slackers.

BarkingUnicorn		2012-11-16 07:54:02 PM

I wonder if we'll see businesses make lemonade out of Obamacare. I mean decals on store windows informing customers that yes, we do provide health insurance to all of our employees.

badaboom		2012-11-16 07:54:02 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Wow. Lots of gray bars on this page all of a sudden. It's kind of pretty.

What he really means to say is : Wow, lot's of opposing viewpoints I never need to consider. Now I can suck my thumb in the corner while stroking my teddybear and repeating over and over "The world is how I see it, the world is how I see it"

Needlessly Complicated		2012-11-16 07:55:12 PM

If, like me, you like Papa John's because of that crack-like garlic butter sauce but wish to stick it to the chain because of its CEO's douchy farkery, here is a super-easy way to make your own garlic butter sauce:

http://m.myrecipes.com/details/search R .rbml?id=1^C20247.xml&bcat =search&cat=Search%20Result&fl=recipe/ garlic-butter-sauce-1^C202 47/

You're welcome.

/on mobile, so sue me

badaboom		2012-11-16 07:55:59 PM

BarkingUnicorn: I wonder if we'll see businesses make lemonade out of Obamacare. I mean decals on store windows informing customers that yes, we do provide health insurance to all of our employees.

If that is what the marketplace demands then yes, you will see this.

WhyteRaven74		2012-11-16 07:57:12 PM

badaboom: Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

How free exactly is the employee who's being screwed because their boss wants to try to make a political score and who, unlike their boss, can't just go to a doctor when they want?

vrax		2012-11-16 07:58:29 PM

badaboom: Lionel Mandrake: badaboom: Lionel Mandrake: badaboom: This guy is a total dick.

First, he rounded up all these people and forced them to work for his company. Then he found a way to force people to buy his product.

Is he some sort of wizard?

No he's not a wizard.

But he is a total dick. You got that part right.

So how did he get all these people to work for him? How does he get people to buy his product?

Because people sometimes have to take work where they can get it, and most people don't know or care if the owner is a dick.

If you are damn near a billionaire, and you're looking at cutting the hours of your minimum-wage workers to avoid a dime and a half per pie to insure them, you are a dick.

If you think high profits automatically make a person not a dick, then you are a fool.

So he did not force them to work there. In other words, they have choices. Go work somewhere else?

But, Obama's terrible, no job economy!

More_Like_A_Stain		2012-11-16 07:59:16 PM

clowncar on fire: nor was offering a perk like healthcare when offering minimum wages seemed to attract all the labor needed.

You see, that's the thing. It's not a perk any more. It's a requirement. In much the same way that being reasonably sure that workers wouldn't be trapped inside the building if it caught on fire due to locked and chained doors was a perk, now it's a requirement.

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:00:56 PM

WhyteRaven74: badaboom: Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

How free exactly is the employee who's being screwed because their boss wants to try to make a political score and who, unlike their boss, can't just go to a doctor when they want?

Job seekers seek the best jobs. If the difference between company A and company B is that company A provides healthcare and company B does not and THAT is what matters to the job seeker than company B will not be able to hire and obtain employees. Company B will be punished and Company A will thrive.

vrax		2012-11-16 08:01:21 PM

More_Like_A_Stain: clowncar on fire: nor was offering a perk like healthcare when offering minimum wages seemed to attract all the labor needed.

You see, that's the thing. It's not a perk any more. It's a requirement. In much the same way that being reasonably sure that workers wouldn't be trapped inside the building if it caught on fire due to locked and chained doors was a perk, now it's a requirement.

And it should be a right.

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:03:57 PM

vrax: More_Like_A_Stain: clowncar on fire: nor was offering a perk like healthcare when offering minimum wages seemed to attract all the labor needed.

You see, that's the thing. It's not a perk any more. It's a requirement. In much the same way that being reasonably sure that workers wouldn't be trapped inside the building if it caught on fire due to locked and chained doors was a perk, now it's a requirement.

And it should be a right.

So should shelter and food which are just as necessary. Now who pays for it? THAT is the central issue.

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:04:32 PM

badaboom: Job seekers seek the best jobs. If the difference between company A and company B is that company A provides healthcare and company B does not and THAT is what matters to the job seeker than company B will not be able to hire and obtain employees. Company B will be punished and Company A will thrive.

Exactly! Because minimum wage workers can pick and choose their employers at will!

More_Like_A_Stain		2012-11-16 08:05:19 PM

badaboom: I support liberty and the freedom to let the marketplace of ideas to decide what is right.

Are elections NOT a marketplace of ideas? It seems that we just had one of those, and your ideas lost.

ModernLuddite		2012-11-16 08:05:32 PM

I have great local pizza places near me, but the thing about small places are that their hours of operation depend on when the owner wants to be open. So.......you can either call the local business and hope it's open, then call Papa John's or Dominos or whatever, or just not waste the extra few minutes and call the chain.

//Seriously, I hate evil corporations, but small businesses are awful in their own special way.
///And but I've stopped ordering from Papa Johns, despite enjoying their pizza.

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:06:26 PM

Whiskey Pete: badaboom: Job seekers seek the best jobs. If the difference between company A and company B is that company A provides healthcare and company B does not and THAT is what matters to the job seeker than company B will not be able to hire and obtain employees. Company B will be punished and Company A will thrive.

Exactly! Because minimum wage workers can pick and choose their employers at will!

Actually, they can. Unless there is some law I am unaware of.

Needlessly Complicated		2012-11-16 08:07:44 PM

badaboom: WhyteRaven74: badaboom: Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

How free exactly is the employee who's being screwed because their boss wants to try to make a political score and who, unlike their boss, can't just go to a doctor when they want?

Job seekers seek the best jobs. If the difference between company A and company B is that company A provides healthcare and company B does not and THAT is what matters to the job seeker than company B will not be able to hire and obtain employees. Company B will be punished and Company A will thrive.

Job seekers will still seek to work at the companies with the best reputation, stability, working conditions and perks. That's how the free market works. Why do you hate freedom?

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:08:23 PM

More_Like_A_Stain: badaboom: I support liberty and the freedom to let the marketplace of ideas to decide what is right.

Are elections NOT a marketplace of ideas? It seems that we just had one of those, and your ideas lost.

Winner take all eh? Ignore the 49% that disagree?

tenpoundsofcheese		2012-11-16 08:08:26 PM

dericwater: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Raharu: Generally No. Few people make it that high up the ladder without being some kind of greedy sociopath.

[img845.imageshack.us image 250x250]
[img846.imageshack.us image 402x402]
[img29.imageshack.us image 492x340]

So true

I would say Steve Jobs would be one of the few non-greedy sociopath.

He never gave to charities, at least not in public.

But he rarely showed ostentatiousness like some of the other uber-rich.

wut? To you it is all about whether he was ostentatious? Even if he never gave any money to charity?

Besides, he wasn't generous to employees. It wasn't his farking money. The company was generous to employees.

Poor Bill Gates. Given billions to charity but lives in a big house. OMG. History's greatest monster.

For people like you it is all about the show, not the substance which is why you get fooled so easily.

killermartinis		2012-11-16 08:08:34 PM

BarkingUnicorn:

It's not his business alone; it's the shareholders' business.

He really did set himself up for this with his plentiful comments about the election; he should have known his personal position would be conflated with his official position. Free speech and all, but most CEOs know how to maintain a public persona and quietly donate to the GOP. Had he done that we'd all be focused on the asshole in Florida.

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:08:59 PM

badaboom: Actually, they can. Unless there is some law I am unaware of.

The point I was making is that low skill workers take what they can get. Until people like you get it through your skulls that healthcare is a basic human right and not a job perk there is no point in talking to you.

Toodles!

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:09:17 PM

Needlessly Complicated: badaboom: WhyteRaven74: badaboom: Thank god we live in a country with freedom and liberty.

How free exactly is the employee who's being screwed because their boss wants to try to make a political score and who, unlike their boss, can't just go to a doctor when they want?

Job seekers seek the best jobs. If the difference between company A and company B is that company A provides healthcare and company B does not and THAT is what matters to the job seeker than company B will not be able to hire and obtain employees. Company B will be punished and Company A will thrive.

Job seekers will still seek to work at the companies with the best reputation, stability, working conditions and perks. That's how the free market works. Why do you hate freedom?

Um, you just made my exact point.

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:10:59 PM

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:12:22 PM

badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

WhyteRaven74		2012-11-16 08:12:37 PM

badaboom: Job seekers seek the best jobs.

Domino's is pulling basically the same stunt Papa John's is. So is Pizza Hut....noticing a trend here?

tenpoundsofcheese		2012-11-16 08:13:12 PM

badaboom: The good thing is, in a free farking country I get to decide what I want to do. Me. Not you. Want to make decisions like this? Become me.

But that takes work (and often a lot of luck)
The left wants things handed to them. It is a lot easier that way.

Orange-Pippin		2012-11-16 08:14:36 PM

AdolfOliverPanties:
Subby forgot to mention that this guy's pizza is farking terrible.

So true. I live in the middle of nowhere and there's a choice between horrible Pizza (Pizzahut) about 45 minutes away and terrible Pizza (PapJohns) about 50 minutes away.

I just make my own.

Fart_Machine		2012-11-16 08:15:37 PM

badaboom: So should shelter and food which are just as necessary. Now who pays for it? THAT is the central issue.

See the funny thing is that by passing off the burden to the emergency room you're paying for it eventually.

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:17:02 PM

Fart_Machine: See the funny thing is that by passing off the burden to the emergency room you're paying for it eventually.

Shhhh. Don't tell him that. He's on a roll.

serial_crusher		2012-11-16 08:17:20 PM

clowncar on fire: I haven't seen this posted yet but anyone know the demographics of the minimum wage worker? Most of the Papa Johns' I've patronized were manned by employees who appeared to be still covered under their parent's insurance (as well as other staples like food and rent, transportation) so having health insurance is not really the issue we want to make it out to be.

That's definitely a function of location. If you're in an area that has lots of poverty, you'll get impoverished adults doing it, because they'll work cheaper than high school kids (and I imagine in bigger cities the high school kids have more options available for real jobs).

I grew up in a reasonably middle class suburb of Charleston, WV, where there were plenty of local high school students working that job. Went to school in Blacksburg, VA, so naturally college students controlled that whole segment of the job market. There were probably 1 or 2 townies delivering pizzas, because during the summer there was probably only enough demand for that many.

In Houston, I lived in a kind of dumpy part of town that was in the process of being gentrified, so yeah every delivery guy was an illegal immigrant who could barely speak coherently in Spanish, let alone English. They were willing to work cheap for shiatty hours.

Now in Austin, as I lived closer to town there was a mix of college students and pothead college dropouts. Moved farther away and it's just stoners who could probably apply themselves if they cared to.

/ My favorite thing about Houston was that my apartment complex was fenced in, so I needed to let the guys through the gate. I always put directions on the additional order information telling them to call me so I'd meet them there, but they'd always show up 30 minutes late because they'd just sit there. When I asked why they didn't call me they'd say they didn't have a cell phone. this is 2008 we're talking about. Do you have any idea how poor somebody had to be in 2008 to not have a cell phone? Every other place I've lived the pizza guys carried phones.

// More CSB: My mom always tells people her metric for how the economy is going is whether or not the people at the drive through have a damned clue what they're doing. If the economy sucks, smart people work at the drive through. When the economy is good, they go back to work and the dregs come off of welfare and fark up your order. So enjoy the recession while it lasts folks. Once we turn things around, you're going to get mustard on your burger despite specifically asking for no damned mustard.

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:17:25 PM

Whiskey Pete: badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

That is what makes it so complicated. We could provide HC to EVERYONE tomorrow. But can we afford it? If the marketplace wants to punish Papa Johns so be it. Whether it is the employees leave or no one buys their crappy pizza. But I stand on the side of liberty which includes the right to be stupid and/or wrong. The left is great at wanting everyone to have a puppy and rainbows but sucks at figuring a way to pay for it. Just saying (or wishing) that everyone pay for something is not reality.

You and I do not disagree on the point that everyone should have the ability to have their health taken care of.

tenpoundsofcheese		2012-11-16 08:18:37 PM

Whiskey Pete: badaboom: Actually, they can. Unless there is some law I am unaware of.

The point I was making is that low skill workers take what they can get. Until people like you get it through your skulls that healthcare is a basic human right and not a job perk there is no point in talking to you.

Toodles!

A basic human right? Can you define the level of healthcare and the cost of that healthcare that is a person's right to have? And where is that defined as a basic human right? If it isn't provided, is someone violating your rights? Who? What is the penalty for violating these rights? What is the statute of limitations for enforcing these rights since 10 years ago no one gave me health insurance. Who can I sue?

Claiming something is a basic human right does not mean it is.

Silly Jesus		2012-11-16 08:19:19 PM

OTHER PEOPLE OWE ME THINGS! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

badaboom		2012-11-16 08:19:31 PM

Fart_Machine: badaboom: So should shelter and food which are just as necessary. Now who pays for it? THAT is the central issue.

See the funny thing is that by passing off the burden to the emergency room you're paying for it eventually.

It's way more complicated than that

Fart_Machine		2012-11-16 08:21:04 PM

badaboom: Fart_Machine: badaboom: So should shelter and food which are just as necessary. Now who pays for it? THAT is the central issue.

See the funny thing is that by passing off the burden to the emergency room you're paying for it eventually.

It's way more complicated than that

Not really. Unless you think that uninsured people who get sick or injured are nice enough to die rather than seek treatment.

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:22:18 PM

badaboom: Whiskey Pete: badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

That is what makes it so complicated. We could provide HC to EVERYONE tomorrow. But can we afford it? If the marketplace wants to punish Papa Johns so be it. Whether it is the employees leave or no one buys their crappy pizza. But I stand on the side of liberty which includes the right to be stupid and/or wrong. The left is great at wanting everyone to have a puppy and rainbows but sucks at figuring a way to pay for it. Just saying (or wishing) that everyone pay for something is not reality.

You and I do not disagree on the point that everyone should have the ability to have their health taken care of.

First off, shiatty pizza guy claiming that the ACA is cutting into his bottom line in any significant way is an outright lie, and if we REALLY wanted to pay for things like this we could start by shaving a few billion off of our obscenely huge defense budget and maybe eliminate a whole bunch of corporate welfare. EXXON doesn't need a handout from the government. Just my opinion, man.

jso2897		2012-11-16 08:23:52 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: badaboom: The good thing is, in a free farking country I get to decide what I want to do. Me. Not you. Want to make decisions like this? Become me.

But that takes work (and often a lot of luck)
The left wants things handed to them. It is a lot easier that way.

You two probably shouldn't start sucking each others dicks quite yet. You lost, and will lose even more in the future. We are going to civilize this country, even as you wave your arms and scream "Nooooo!'
See - you reactionaries are a shrinking tribe. Women, minorities, and mature white men outnumber you, and will outnumber you vastly soon. You're done. Deal with it.

BarkingUnicorn		2012-11-16 08:24:01 PM

tenpoundsofcheese:
Claiming something is a basic human right does not mean it is.

Actually, that's exactly how it has worked throughout world history.

tenpoundsofcheese		2012-11-16 08:25:17 PM

badaboom: Whiskey Pete: badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

That is what makes it so complicated. We could provide HC to EVERYONE tomorrow. But can we afford it? If the marketplace wants to punish Papa Johns so be it. Whether it is the employees leave or no one buys their crappy pizza. But I stand on the side of liberty which includes the right to be stupid and/or wrong. The left is great at wanting everyone to have a puppy and rainbows but sucks at figuring a way to pay for it. Just saying (or wishing) that everyone pay for something is not reality.

You and I do not disagree on the point that everyone should have the ability to have their health taken care of.

well, if we want that, and we want society to pay for it, then people need to step up and be part of society by doing everything they can to lower their health care costs:
Mandatory exercise, maximum calories per day, no smoking, alcohol, drugs, transfats, etc.

People want the freedom to do what they want and then want everyone else to pay for their consequences.

vrax		2012-11-16 08:26:23 PM

badaboom: vrax: More_Like_A_Stain: clowncar on fire: nor was offering a perk like healthcare when offering minimum wages seemed to attract all the labor needed.

You see, that's the thing. It's not a perk any more. It's a requirement. In much the same way that being reasonably sure that workers wouldn't be trapped inside the building if it caught on fire due to locked and chained doors was a perk, now it's a requirement.

And it should be a right.

So should shelter and food which are just as necessary. Now who pays for it? THAT is the central issue.

One thing at a time, sparky! It is in our best interest as a society (you know, coexisting with other people) to make healthcare freely available, so we fund it as a society. This is fallacy that all aspects of socialism are wrong, well, a fallacy. Food and shelter are often subsidized too, but are each separate issues to address.

Whiskey Pete		2012-11-16 08:26:29 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Whiskey Pete: badaboom: Actually, they can. Unless there is some law I am unaware of.

The point I was making is that low skill workers take what they can get. Until people like you get it through your skulls that healthcare is a basic human right and not a job perk there is no point in talking to you.

Toodles!

A basic human right? Can you define the level of healthcare and the cost of that healthcare that is a person's right to have? And where is that defined as a basic human right? If it isn't provided, is someone violating your rights? Who? What is the penalty for violating these rights? What is the statute of limitations for enforcing these rights since 10 years ago no one gave me health insurance. Who can I sue?

Claiming something is a basic human right does not mean it is.

I meant a basic human right in as much as we don't shiat all over our most vulnerable citizens and we owe them healthcare just because they occupy the same earth as we do.

Except for you. I hope you get untreatable ball cancer.

BarkingUnicorn		2012-11-16 08:27:20 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: badaboom: Whiskey Pete: badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

That is what makes it so complicated. We could provide HC to EVERYONE tomorrow. But can we afford it? If the marketplace wants to punish Papa Johns so be it. Whether it is the employees leave or no one buys their crappy pizza. But I stand on the side of liberty which includes the right to be stupid and/or wrong. The left is great at wanting everyone to have a puppy and rainbows but sucks at figuring a way to pay for it. Just saying (or wishing) that everyone pay for something is not reality.

You and I do not disagree on the point that everyone should have the ability to have their health taken care of.

well, if we want that, and we want society to pay for it, then people need to step up and be part of society by doing everything they can to lower their health care costs:
Mandatory exercise, maximum calories per day, no smoking, alcohol, drugs, transfats, etc.

People want the freedom to do what they want and then want everyone else to pay for their consequences.

See? Corporations ARE people!

jso2897		2012-11-16 08:27:24 PM

badaboom: Whiskey Pete: badaboom: EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE HEALTHCARE!! THE ONLY QUESTION IS WHO PAYS FOR IT?

We do! Congratulations! I think we've made a breakthrough here today. *HUGS*

That is what makes it so complicated. We could provide HC to EVERYONE tomorrow. But can we afford it? If the marketplace wants to punish Papa Johns so be it. Whether it is the employees leave or no one buys their crappy pizza. But I stand on the side of liberty which includes the right to be stupid and/or wrong. The left is great at wanting everyone to have a puppy and rainbows but sucks at figuring a way to pay for it. Just saying (or wishing) that everyone pay for something is not reality.

You and I do not disagree on the point that everyone should have the ability to have their health taken care of.

Well, at least you are honest enough to admit that you are an ideologue, and don't actually care what happens to society as a pragmatic matter. But your view will not carry the day. The times they are a changing - even dumbass Bill O'Rielly knows that.

tenpoundsofcheese		2012-11-16 08:27:32 PM

jso2897: tenpoundsofcheese: badaboom: The good thing is, in a free farking country I get to decide what I want to do. Me. Not you. Want to make decisions like this? Become me.

But that takes work (and often a lot of luck)
The left wants things handed to them. It is a lot easier that way.

You lost, and will lose even more in the future. We are going to civilize this country, even as you wave your arms and scream "Nooooo!'
.

what did I lose? was I running for office? I missed that.
You think this country is uncivilized? You are sick.

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