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(Politico)   A week and a half after the elections, five seats in the House of Representatives are too close to call. Of course, Democrats are leading in all of them. How did you know?   (politico.com) divider line 101
    More: Obvious, U.S. House, Mike McIntyre, precincts reporting  
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3850 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Nov 2012 at 6:35 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



101 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2012-11-16 05:50:51 AM  
1. November 12th? old-news-is-so-exciting.jpg

2. The woman in the photo in TFA is set to become the first openly bisexual member of Congress. (From Arizona, no less.)

Hold my calls for the rest of the day, I'll be in my bunk.
 
2012-11-16 06:44:24 AM  
teabags poisoned the well
 
2012-11-16 06:52:09 AM  
I dunno... Maybe because local-level - Republicans - are infamous - for their whining?
 
2012-11-16 06:55:43 AM  
It's never, ever, EVER a Republican losing because they were less able to convince people to vote for them, it must be evil Librul deceit. It can't possibly be that anything the Republicans have ever done has had a negative outcome. Anything bad you've ever accused the Republicans of is moot, because somewhere a Democrat once did something bad. And god help you if you try and back them into a corner over mutually contradictory beliefs or the raging hypocrisy of the religious right, you'll find yourself playing a game of intellectual Calvinball.

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the Party Of Personal Responsibility.
 
2012-11-16 07:04:17 AM  
Damn Obama and his majority of voters for continuing to subvert the will of the people!
 
2012-11-16 07:12:09 AM  

jayhawk88: Damn Obama and his majority of voters for continuing to subvert the will of the people!


IT'S TIME TO TAKE AMERICA BACK!!!...from the majority of American citizens, friends and neighbors, that duly elected their representatives.
 
2012-11-16 07:16:04 AM  
erik-k:

you'll find yourself playing a game of intellectual Calvinball.

Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.
 
2012-11-16 07:17:42 AM  
I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

If it turns out that the GOP kept a staggering control of the house in spite of getting fewer total nationwide votes, that will demonstrate a catastrophic moral failure of gerrymandering and a tyrranical offense against democracy. We already have the Senate to trample on democracy. The House is supposed to be pure and populist. I'm sick of seeing districts that pack urban blacks, Latinos, and college students into a 90% Democrat district so Republicans can win the surrounding six districts 55:45.
 
2012-11-16 07:18:14 AM  
Just do what I did.

Be a white male and show up as a registered republican.

Suppression issue solved!
 
2012-11-16 07:18:34 AM  
Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.

Technically, there is no wrong way to play Calvinball. But I do see your point.
 
2012-11-16 07:20:51 AM  

maxheck: erik-k:

you'll find yourself playing a game of intellectual Calvinball.

Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.


No, someone deciding what is a wrong way to play Calvinball is the wrong way to play Calvinball.
 
2012-11-16 07:21:04 AM  

Lenny and Carl: Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.

Technically, there is no wrong way to play Calvinball. But I do see your point.


Thanks to your username I suddenly thought of a poll worker checking the writing on their four fingered yellow hand:

Lenny = Vote
Carl = Suppress
 
2012-11-16 07:22:19 AM  
Would this be a bad time to mention that I was a poll worker? Oh the CSBs. So very many CSBs.
 
2012-11-16 07:25:31 AM  
Lenny and Carl:

Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.

Technically, there is no wrong way to play Calvinball. But I do see your point.


I have tiny nieces and nephews. Believe me, there *is* one rule in Calvinball.

They win.
 
2012-11-16 07:34:55 AM  
Of course, we all know that anything within 45 percentage points is too close to call.

That is, unless it's a Presidential race, the state in question is Florida, the Sec of State for Florida is ultimately in charge of deciding if a recount is necessary, and also happens to be the campaign manager for your state, then it's just "The Democrats being cry-baby sore losers".

Right?
 
2012-11-16 07:35:03 AM  
Here's a rundown of the races that remain uncalled:
Arizona's 2nd District. Democratic Rep. Ron Barber leads Republican Martha McSally 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent, or 698 votes, with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 7th District. Democrat Ami Bera leads Republican Rep. Dan Lungren 50.4 percent to 49.6 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 52nd District. Democrat Scott Peters leads Republican Rep. Brian Bilbray 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

Florida's 18th District. Democrat Patrick Murphy leads Republican Rep. Allen West 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

North Carolina's 7th District. Democratic Rep. Mike McIntyre leads Republican David Rouzer 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.


... uncalled?

Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.
 
2012-11-16 07:35:32 AM  

Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?


A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally
 
2012-11-16 07:36:21 AM  
For anyone remotely interested in my poll worker CSB, I'll leave you with an open letter I penned on the subject of Voter ID laws after a particularly grueling day of working with the public.

From An Anonymous Precinct Worker, An Open Letter to Each Ticked Off Republican Voter:

1. NC State Law does not require me to see a photo ID. Quite the opposite. NC law FORBIDS me from asking for ID unless the registration requirement has not been met.

2. Nothing you have to say on the subject will change point #1. The fact that you don't like state law in no way changes state law.

3. Insisting that I "need" to check everyone's ID means that you're not only obnoxious, but ignorant of the existing law.

4. You are not the 1st person to detail how you could attempt in-person voter fraud. Your ideas are not new, they are not clever, and they are in no way relevant. In fact they are quite stupid. Should you meet the existing requirement of correctly stating a name and corresponding address I will gladly give you the ballot of someone other than yourself, provided you wish to risk 5 years in prison on a felony conviction in order to move an election by 1 vote. If that trade off is worth it to you I'm happy to watch you try.

5. Complaining to me about the lack of a Voter ID law is the equivalent of complaining to the cashier at McDonald's about the cost of your fries: he had nothing to do with it, he can't change it, you're only holding up his line by whining to him. The only thing you have going for you is that I, unlike the guy at McDonald's, can't spit in your ballot before you eat it.

6. The place to voice these ever so important opinions of yours is about 40 feet away from me in the actual voting booth. If you were less angry and more intelligent you would have known that before you walked in. This knowledge would have saved us both some time.

7. The next time you feel it important to occupy some portion of my day by telling me what you think, please go to Hell instead.

In summation, you are not making any significant or profound points. You are wasting everyone's time. You are a self-important pain in the ass and we are laughing at you as soon as you are out of earshot. Please redirect this righteous indignation of yours into some worthwhile cause like feeding the hungry or caring for abused animals. I assure you that what you're doing now benefits no one, least of all yourself.
 
2012-11-16 07:36:58 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting"


Maybe they are close enough that a recount is mandatory?
 
2012-11-16 07:37:43 AM  
jaytkay:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Because.... ?
 
2012-11-16 07:38:52 AM  
Because Democrats won the House popular vote, and if it weren't for extensive gerrymandering they would likely have had retaken the House as well this year?

They got similar results to 08 in the White House and the Senate. They got similar vote percentages for the House, but are still down 15-20 seats. That strongly suggests a rigged system.
 
2012-11-16 07:40:23 AM  
^ Farking this. Also a NC poll worker, and these republican "you gotta check my ID, you just gotta!" assholes are the worst. They're ignorant as hell, and just a pain in the ass in general. I'm convinced they need their ID out all the time just to remember where they actually live.
 
2012-11-16 07:41:09 AM  
docmattic:

maxheck: erik-k:

you'll find yourself playing a game of intellectual Calvinball.

Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.

No, someone deciding what is a wrong way to play Calvinball is the wrong way to play Calvinball.


But you just...

and then...

(recusion loop... Cronenberg-style head asplosion)
 
2012-11-16 07:43:37 AM  

jaytkay: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally


The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.
 
2012-11-16 07:45:28 AM  

Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

If it turns out that the GOP kept a staggering control of the house in spite of getting fewer total nationwide votes, that will demonstrate a catastrophic moral failure of gerrymandering and a tyrranical offense against democracy. We already have the Senate to trample on democracy. The House is supposed to be pure and populist. I'm sick of seeing districts that pack urban blacks, Latinos, and college students into a 90% Democrat district so Republicans can win the surrounding six districts 55:45.


Having lived in Texas when Austin was stripped by the legislature of its congressional representation, I agree entirely. Morally, the Supreme Court ought to have rejected gerrymandering long ago, as part of "one man one vote." Politically, it will never happen. The Court used to be above the fray. Now it's just another agency of partisan politics.
 
2012-11-16 07:45:29 AM  
I live in one of the saner states, though in a very red district. I offered my driver's license unrequested and told the nice little-old-lady my name, she checked my name on a list and handed my ID back and pointed me to another official who pointed me onward to the polling booth. 5 minutes later I had done my part for democracy. (or not.)
 
2012-11-16 07:47:27 AM  

Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives


They're already in. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House of Representatives.

Link

The GOP House of Representatives has neither political legitimacy, nor moral authority.
 
2012-11-16 07:50:22 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.


All the local precincts have reported. But they still need to count absentee ballots, and maybe provisional ballots.
 
2012-11-16 07:51:39 AM  

Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

If it turns out that the GOP kept a staggering control of the house in spite of getting fewer total nationwide votes, that will demonstrate a catastrophic moral failure of gerrymandering and a tyrranical offense against democracy. We already have the Senate to trample on democracy. The House is supposed to be pure and populist. I'm sick of seeing districts that pack urban blacks, Latinos, and college students into a 90% Democrat district so Republicans can win the surrounding six districts 55:45.


And yet its been part of our system of government for over 100 years. Try not to cry too hard.
 
2012-11-16 07:51:51 AM  

Lenny and Carl: For anyone remotely interested in my poll worker CSB, I'll leave you with an open letter I penned on the subject of Voter ID laws after a particularly grueling day of working with the public.

From An Anonymous Precinct Worker, An Open Letter to Each Ticked Off Republican Voter:

1. NC State Law does not require me to see a photo ID. Quite the opposite. NC law FORBIDS me from asking for ID unless the registration requirement has not been met.

2. Nothing you have to say on the subject will change point #1. The fact that you don't like state law in no way changes state law.

3. Insisting that I "need" to check everyone's ID means that you're not only obnoxious, but ignorant of the existing law.

4. You are not the 1st person to detail how you could attempt in-person voter fraud. Your ideas are not new, they are not clever, and they are in no way relevant. In fact they are quite stupid. Should you meet the existing requirement of correctly stating a name and corresponding address I will gladly give you the ballot of someone other than yourself, provided you wish to risk 5 years in prison on a felony conviction in order to move an election by 1 vote. If that trade off is worth it to you I'm happy to watch you try.

5. Complaining to me about the lack of a Voter ID law is the equivalent of complaining to the cashier at McDonald's about the cost of your fries: he had nothing to do with it, he can't change it, you're only holding up his line by whining to him. The only thing you have going for you is that I, unlike the guy at McDonald's, can't spit in your ballot before you eat it.

6. The place to voice these ever so important opinions of yours is about 40 feet away from me in the actual voting booth. If you were less angry and more intelligent you would have known that before you walked in. This knowledge would have saved us both some time.

7. The next time you feel it important to occupy some portion of my day by telling me what you think, please go to Hell instead.

In summation, you are not making any significant or profound points. You are wasting everyone's time. You are a self-important pain in the ass and we are laughing at you as soon as you are out of earshot. Please redirect this righteous indignation of yours into some worthwhile cause like feeding the hungry or caring for abused animals. I assure you that what you're doing now benefits no one, least of all yourself.


CSB time: I voted in NC.

Since I had spent the last two years in Africa serving in the Peace Corps, I wasn't registered, and I had no proof of address other than the post-service correspondence PC mailed to me at my parents' house.

When I explained this to the poll worker, he was awesome. He was like 'No problem, we can absolutely get you set up. I can't ask you for ID, but I can tell you if you have it this process will be a lot faster. So...fast way, or slower way?'

I thought that was pretty intelligent. I was going to pull my ID anyway, but that made it that much simpler. But when the wing-nut in line next to me saw me pull it and started yelling 'VOTER FRAUD!! YOU ASKED HIM FOR ID BUT NOT ME!!' I have never wanted to cock-punch someone so much in my entire life. The poll worker looked like he was thinking that too.

There's a time and a place for ID. But if you're already registered and there's a line out the door, well...that isn't it.

/ CSB
 
2012-11-16 07:51:53 AM  

Tommy Moo: jaytkay: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally

The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.


Iowa does it this way, and then the legislature votes among the 5 optimal computer solutions
 
2012-11-16 07:52:43 AM  

bugontherug: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives

They're already in. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House of Representatives.

Link

The GOP House of Representatives has neither political legitimacy, nor moral authority.


Wow. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House by a million votes, but still have only an inconsequential minority in it?

Between this kind of crap and the electoral college, our democracy is a travesty.
 
2012-11-16 07:54:06 AM  
Hurry and finish the recount so those reps can get busy voting against a repeal of Obamacare for the 69th time
 
2012-11-16 07:56:03 AM  

Lenny and Carl: For anyone remotely interested in my poll worker CSB, I'll leave you with an open letter I penned on the subject of Voter ID laws after a particularly grueling day of working with the public.

From An Anonymous Precinct Worker, An Open Letter to Each Ticked Off Republican Voter:

1. NC State Law does not require me to see a photo ID. Quite the opposite. NC law FORBIDS me from asking for ID unless the registration requirement has not been met.

2. Nothing you have to say on the subject will change point #1. The fact that you don't like state law in no way changes state law.

3. Insisting that I "need" to check everyone's ID means that you're not only obnoxious, but ignorant of the existing law.

4. You are not the 1st person to detail how you could attempt in-person voter fraud. Your ideas are not new, they are not clever, and they are in no way relevant. In fact they are quite stupid. Should you meet the existing requirement of correctly stating a name and corresponding address I will gladly give you the ballot of someone other than yourself, provided you wish to risk 5 years in prison on a felony conviction in order to move an election by 1 vote. If that trade off is worth it to you I'm happy to watch you try.

5. Complaining to me about the lack of a Voter ID law is the equivalent of complaining to the cashier at McDonald's about the cost of your fries: he had nothing to do with it, he can't change it, you're only holding up his line by whining to him. The only thing you have going for you is that I, unlike the guy at McDonald's, can't spit in your ballot before you eat it.

6. The place to voice these ever so important opinions of yours is about 40 feet away from me in the actual voting booth. If you were less angry and more intelligent you would have known that before you walked in. This knowledge would have saved us both some time.

7. The next time you feel it important to occupy some portion of my day by telling me what you think, please go to Hell instead.

...


That was beautiful.

I think you just summed up the best argument for vote-by-mail ever made. Not having to go out and get whiny old people on me when I'm voting.
 
2012-11-16 07:58:24 AM  

Tommy Moo: jaytkay: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally

The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.


Bbbbut.. State's Rights!

Seriously: as liberal as I am, I don't see a problem with each state's legislature deciding how to draw
districts in their own state.

Is the system rigged? You betcha, and this is truly a case of "Both sides are bad!", since the Dems
were and are doing such things in their strongholds for years*. But the GOP has been so nakedly brazen about it that you just have to laugh in between crying.

*I shall refrain from pointing out that a lot of the Democrats who gerrymandered in the
southern states to cut out black voters in years past would, in our current climate, probably have
moved to the GOP side because of Nixon's Southern Strategy; the NY Dems sure as hell mess with
their districts in NYC.
 
2012-11-16 07:58:42 AM  

maxheck: I live in one of the saner states, though in a very red district. I offered my driver's license unrequested and told the nice little-old-lady my name, she checked my name on a list and handed my ID back and pointed me to another official who pointed me onward to the polling booth. 5 minutes later I had done my part for democracy. (or not.)


Here in Louisiana, you have to produce an official ID of one kind or another. Often, several precincts vote at a single school or wherever. So they check your ID against the printed list of registered voters for your precinct and you sign your name in the space next to it, and then you line up in front of the antique voting machine. (You're not allowed to feed the squirrels spinning the cage attached to the machine.)

If you're in the wrong precinct line -- or the wrong freaking gymnasium -- they can look at the address on your ID and tell you where to go. And they're remarkably polite about it.

Not many things having to do with government work very well in Louisiana, but this actually seems to be one of them.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2012-11-16 07:59:02 AM  
I am not sure of the subtext of the headline, but I choose to interpret it this way..

i.ebayimg.com

schief2: 2. The woman in the photo in TFA is set to become the first openly bisexual member of Congress. (From Arizona, no less.)

Hold my calls for the rest of the day, I'll be in my bunk.


I think I agree with this statement for the first time in a long time....
 
2012-11-16 08:00:27 AM  
I'll leave you with this other gem I wrote after a day at the polls...

Multiple voters have expressed concerns that Barack Obama "owns all of the voting machines" and that by entering their precinct numbers into said machines we are in fact typing a secret code which erases previous ballots. Unfortunately I was not permitted to give the answer I'd like to give these people: "Shhhh... they'll hear you..."
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2012-11-16 08:01:56 AM  

mksmith: maxheck: I live in one of the saner states, though in a very red district. I offered my driver's license unrequested and told the nice little-old-lady my name, she checked my name on a list and handed my ID back and pointed me to another official who pointed me onward to the polling booth. 5 minutes later I had done my part for democracy. (or not.)

Here in Louisiana, you have to produce an official ID of one kind or another. Often, several precincts vote at a single school or wherever. So they check your ID against the printed list of registered voters for your precinct and you sign your name in the space next to it, and then you line up in front of the antique voting machine. (You're not allowed to feed the squirrels spinning the cage attached to the machine.)

If you're in the wrong precinct line -- or the wrong freaking gymnasium -- they can look at the address on your ID and tell you where to go. And they're remarkably polite about it.

Not many things having to do with government work very well in Louisiana, but this actually seems to be one of them.


In a world where the farking marketers can look up everyone's favorite type of lip balm and whether you prefer thin blondes or curvy brunettes in a database, why in the hell can't state be using vote centers by now?
 
2012-11-16 08:03:56 AM  
"A week and a half after the elections, 5 seats in the House of Representatives too close to call. Of course, Democrats are leading in all of them. How did you know?"

Because of whatever Acorn morphed into/ Maybe if the libs weren't committing voter fraud all over the place, we wouldn't have to worry about "too close to call". If you don't like your gerrymandered district, move out of it. No one is forcing you to live in your ramshackled shack with people like you.
 
2012-11-16 08:05:23 AM  

d23: curvy brunettes


One vote for curvy brunettes.
 
2012-11-16 08:07:43 AM  

bugontherug: Jim_Callahan: Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.

All the local precincts have reported. But they still need to count absentee ballots, and maybe provisional ballots.


OK, fair enough. Average district has 650k people, participation rates are usually on the order of 30% or so (130k people), so I guess in the districts that are 49.9 to 50.1 that's a difference of less than a thousand votes, I could see a district having that many absentee ballots still uncounted if it's a military town or sommat.

I'm a bit more dubious about the 49.5 to 50.5 districts being "too close to call", that's an advantage of in excess of 6k votes to overcome, seems unlikely that that many absentee ballots would even be left uncounted at this point, let alone in proportions so much more skewed than the rest of the district that it could actually tilt things.

Basically, were I a media outlet, I'd go ahead and call most of those and get back to more important stories, like kittens being rescued from trees and human-interest stories about homeless people winning the lottery or whatever.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2012-11-16 08:08:08 AM  

snowshovel: "A week and a half after the elections, 5 seats in the House of Representatives too close to call. Of course, Democrats are leading in all of them. How did you know?"

Because of whatever Acorn morphed into/ Maybe if the libs weren't committing voter fraud all over the place, we wouldn't have to worry about "too close to call". If you don't like your gerrymandered district, move out of it. No one is forcing you to live in your ramshackled shack with people like you.


I think that on the list of "words that mark you as an idiot" in a political argument, "Acorn" must be high up on the list, along with "lib," "socialism," "Marxism," "teleprompter," "Democrat party," and "thug," Oh.. and "voter fraud" when paired with the Democratic party.
 
2012-11-16 08:08:34 AM  

snowshovel: Because of whatever Acorn morphed into/ Maybe if the libs weren't committing voter fraud all over the place, we wouldn't have to worry about "too close to call". If you don't like your gerrymandered district, move out of it. No one is forcing you to live in your ramshackled shack with people like you.


But that's the thing, modern, Democratic urban centers are being gerrymandered to be part of districts with Republican country folk (shack dwellers). I don't want to move to some shiathole.
 
2012-11-16 08:09:36 AM  

born_yesterday: jayhawk88: Damn Obama and his majority of voters for continuing to subvert the will of the people!

IT'S TIME TO TAKE AMERICA BACK!!!...from the majority of American citizens, friends and neighbors, that duly elected their representatives.


I am still gobsmacked by the sheer stupidity of that slogan. Any way it's parsed, it's a losing slogan. "Taking America Back" to a time when we were attacked on our own soil. "Taking America Back" to the point where we crashed the market. "Taking America Back" to a fictional time when women knew their place and minorities were rarely seen and never heard from. "Taking America Back" from the wrong half.
 
2012-11-16 08:11:06 AM  

bugontherug: Tommy


The GOP House: The minority majority.
 
2012-11-16 08:13:49 AM  

Generation_D: And yet its been part of our system of government for over 100 years. Try not to cry too hard.


But, do keep in mind that this situation, a house majority gained with a minority of the popular vote, has only occurred something like 3 times before, and it is only in recent years where computer models have been refined to a level where this sort of result could be the new norm unless something changes.
 
2012-11-16 08:15:15 AM  

d23: snowshovel: "A week and a half after the elections, 5 seats in the House of Representatives too close to call. Of course, Democrats are leading in all of them. How did you know?"

Because of whatever Acorn morphed into/ Maybe if the libs weren't committing voter fraud all over the place, we wouldn't have to worry about "too close to call". If you don't like your gerrymandered district, move out of it. No one is forcing you to live in your ramshackled shack with people like you.

I think that on the list of "words that mark you as an idiot" in a political argument, "Acorn" must be high up on the list, along with "lib," "socialism," "Marxism," "teleprompter," "Democrat party," and "thug," Oh.. and "voter fraud" when paired with the Democratic party.


Up until this week, the only time I'd heard the word "libtard" used was here on FARK, either by trolls or people mocking them.

This week, I saw a friend's wing-nut son go off on a rant about all the good reasons for Texas to secede, and how America needs them more than they need us, and somewhere in there, he used the word "libtard" seriously.

Pretty tough to take someone seriously after they do that. shiat, it's pretty tough to not berate them until they're weeping (or apoplectic!).
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2012-11-16 08:16:42 AM  

Skleenar: Generation_D: And yet its been part of our system of government for over 100 years. Try not to cry too hard.

But, do keep in mind that this situation, a house majority gained with a minority of the popular vote, has only occurred something like 3 times before, and it is only in recent years where computer models have been refined to a level where this sort of result could be the new norm unless something changes.


And the same type of computer technology could be used to draw districts that were more-or-less square and had equal number of people and DID NOT take into account party stats.

It's absurd that the sane in the U.S. haven't risen up with torches and pitchforks yet.
 
2012-11-16 08:17:37 AM  

Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

If it turns out that the GOP kept a staggering control of the house in spite of getting fewer total nationwide votes, that will demonstrate a catastrophic moral failure of gerrymandering and a tyrranical offense against democracy. We already have the Senate to trample on democracy. The House is supposed to be pure and populist. I'm sick of seeing districts that pack urban blacks, Latinos, and college students into a 90% Democrat district so Republicans can win the surrounding six districts 55:45.


I believe only 1/3 of the house was up for reelection this year. I don't know the breakdown, but if most of those seats were in dem or rep strongholds, you'd expect them to be reelected. And incumbents usually win regardless, as people love THEIR representative but hate congress
 
2012-11-16 08:19:01 AM  
assets.motherjones.com
 
2012-11-16 08:26:17 AM  

Baz744: bugontherug: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives

They're already in. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House of Representatives.

Link

The GOP House of Representatives has neither political legitimacy, nor moral authority.

Wow. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House by a million votes, but still have only an inconsequential minority in it?

Between this kind of crap and the electoral college, our democracy is a travesty.


Well, yeah, considering the fact that the founders that crafted this "Democracy" hated the notion and wanted to try a different system. We're not a Democracy, we are a Representative Republic.
 
2012-11-16 08:26:39 AM  
dopirt:

d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.


Bah. Curvy blondes are where it's at.
 
2012-11-16 08:29:45 AM  
If these gerrymandered districts create too many close calls, it could actually make it easier to flip a whole bunch of seats all at once with a few extra %.. Has anyone made a list yet of the most vulnerable Republicans for 2014? Are there enough to flip the house?
 
2012-11-16 08:32:04 AM  

Tommy Moo: The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.


Even better: we can let the legislatures (or anybody else) draw the districts, and simply require that the do so such that the Hausdorff dimension of the resulting shapes be less than ~1.1 or 1.2 (exact number needs a bit of research to determine the best cutoff value).
 
2012-11-16 08:32:45 AM  
mksmith:

maxheck: I live in one of the saner states, though in a very red district. I offered my driver's license unrequested and told the nice little-old-lady my name, she checked my name on a list and handed my ID back and pointed me to another official who pointed me onward to the polling booth. 5 minutes later I had done my part for democracy. (or not.)

Here in Louisiana, you have to produce an official ID of one kind or another. Often, several precincts vote at a single school or wherever. So they check your ID against the printed list of registered voters for your precinct and you sign your name in the space next to it, and then you line up in front of the antique voting machine. (You're not allowed to feed the squirrels spinning the cage attached to the machine.)

If you're in the wrong precinct line -- or the wrong freaking gymnasium -- they can look at the address on your ID and tell you where to go. And they're remarkably polite about it.

Not many things having to do with government work very well in Louisiana, but this actually seems to be one of them.


I have nothing bad to say about most poll workers... They tend to be elderly sorts who actually give a damn, which makes me happy.
 
2012-11-16 08:34:38 AM  
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-11-16 08:35:11 AM  

maxheck: dopirt:

d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.

Bah. Curvy blondes are where it's at.



Why not both?
 
2012-11-16 08:40:12 AM  
Wyalt Derp:

maxheck: dopirt:

d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.

Bah. Curvy blondes are where it's at.


Why not both?


There is that. Include curvy redheads and we have a big-tent party.

/ getting a tent just thinking about it.
 
2012-11-16 08:40:34 AM  

maxheck: I have nothing bad to say about most poll workers... They tend to be elderly sorts who actually give a damn, which makes me happy.


When me and the fam went a voting there was an older woman directing people. She was polite but you could tell that she was very tired and had been through a very long day.

I made sure to thank her for her efforts and she hugged me.

When we voted there was a little table with paper and crayons where the kids could color in an American flag.

Before we left I had the kids color in a flag and give it to the poll worker. The smile on her face was a mile wide.
 
2012-11-16 08:42:02 AM  

dopirt: d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.


Seconded!

And I would like to submit the following evidence in support of the motion: 

fc01.deviantart.net 

/And what a sweet, sweet motion it must be......
 
2012-11-16 08:42:52 AM  

DjangoStonereaver: dopirt: d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.

Seconded!

And I would like to submit the following evidence in support of the motion: 

[fc01.deviantart.net image 600x900] 

/And what a sweet, sweet motion it must be......


Is that a watermelon thief?
 
2012-11-16 08:44:19 AM  
There is now one last opportunity to compel Congress to remove Obama for ineligibility and thereby render null and void all legislation he signed and all appointments he made since 2009. It is up to the voters to compel the political leadership in Congress to remove Obama. Link
 
2012-11-16 08:44:28 AM  

Tommy Moo: It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?


A lot of it had to do with the size of the "war chests" this year. Numerous Democrats contributed to Obama's campaign but ignored their local races. Republican congressmen, on the other hand, can always raise a few million from businesses they've "nurtured" within their districts.
 
2012-11-16 08:46:50 AM  

DjangoStonereaver: Tommy Moo: jaytkay: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally

The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.

Bbbbut.. State's Rights!

Seriously: as liberal as I am, I don't see a problem with each state's legislature deciding how to draw
districts in their own state.

Is the system rigged? You betcha, and this is truly a case of "Both sides are bad!", since the Dems
were and are doing such things in their strongholds for years*. But the GOP has been so nakedly brazen about it that you just have to laugh in between crying.

*I shall refrain from pointing out that a lot of the Democrats who gerrymandered in the
southern states to cut out black voters in years past would, in our current climate, probably have
moved to the GOP side because of Nixon's Southern Strategy; the NY Dems sure as hell mess with
their districts in NYC.


My grandfather worked in city politics in Chicago in the 1950s and 1960s. Thats big D Democratic for you kids just joining the discussion.

Some of the jobs he used to perform, or had people that reported to him perform:

1) Punching multiple ballots. They had a basement at a shop where over 20 of them stayed up all night in 1960 punching ballots for Kennedy. Thousands of ballots, many hours of work. All over the city other Ward Committeemen were doing the same. Thats old school cheating, it took muscle. You kids and your computers.

2) Need some more votes in your district? No problem. Check out an electoral map of the Chicago area some time. There are some districts that snake their way down single city streets for over a mile to connect different neighborhood voting blocs. It used to just be Democrats, now Republicans in the suburbs have gotten in on this game too.

3) Who needs dead people voting when you have the city and county clerk all tallying the vote? A lot of those figures never get checked. Certify the results, then go back and fix the numbers later if anyone asks.

To sum up: There are all kinds of ways to cheat in local elections, and people whose job it is to know how and make it happen. This is not new, in American cities especially it has been going on for centuries now. Good ol Democratic fun. Its been that way since the 1850s at the very least.

So latter-day complaints of Republican cheating completely misses the mark, we had over 100 years worth of cheating in favor of Democrats in large east coast (and San Franciscan) urban areas. Does it justify it, no it does not. But it points out the people crying for reform have zero sense of history or even of how the system has always "worked."

They don't get into politics because they want a fair fight. They get in because they want to win, because it gets them paid.
 
2012-11-16 08:57:49 AM  
Skarekrough:

maxheck: I have nothing bad to say about most poll workers... They tend to be elderly sorts who actually give a damn, which makes me happy.

When me and the fam went a voting there was an older woman directing people. She was polite but you could tell that she was very tired and had been through a very long day.

I made sure to thank her for her efforts and she hugged me.

When we voted there was a little table with paper and crayons where the kids could color in an American flag.

Before we left I had the kids color in a flag and give it to the poll worker. The smile on her face was a mile wide.


I know this is Fark, and everything has to go through the snark filter first, but...

That was cool to hear.
 
2012-11-16 08:58:40 AM  

Alphax: DjangoStonereaver: dopirt: d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.

Seconded!

And I would like to submit the following evidence in support of the motion: 

[fc01.deviantart.net image 600x900] 

/And what a sweet, sweet motion it must be......

Is that a watermelon thief?


Her name is Denise Milani, and I will help her smuggle watermelons any time. ANY TIME.
 
2012-11-16 08:59:28 AM  

mksmith: The Court used to be above the fray. Now it's just another agency of partisan politics.


and yet they get pissed off if called on it.
 
2012-11-16 09:02:06 AM  
Tyrants when they win, children when they lose.
 
2012-11-16 09:04:47 AM  

Zeno-25: [assets.motherjones.com image 630x566]


Oh, look. Both sides are bad.

/Marylander, and reasonably happy
 
2012-11-16 09:18:11 AM  

pivazena: I believe only 1/3 of the house was up for reelection this year.


Roughly 1/3 of the Senate was up for reelection because Senators server 6 year terms. Representatives only serve 2 year terms, so the whole House is up for reelection every 2 years.
 
2012-11-16 09:19:19 AM  

dopirt: d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.


You know,to be sure I think you should send over ten of each, plus some athletic red heads as a control group... you know, for science
 
2012-11-16 09:26:49 AM  
GIS for "curvy brunette war chest"

t2.gstatic.com

/I'll be in my bunk
 
2012-11-16 09:28:39 AM  

Generation_D: To sum up: There are all kinds of ways to cheat in local elections, and people whose job it is to know how and make it happen. This is not new, in American cities especially it has been going on for centuries now. Good ol Democratic fun. Its been that way since the 1850s at the very least.

So latter-day complaints of Republican cheating completely misses the mark, we had over 100 years worth of cheating in favor of Democrats in large east coast (and San Franciscan) urban areas. Does it justify it, no it does not. But it points out the people crying for reform have zero sense of history or even of how the system has always "worked."


Precisely; the reason the GOP has gotten so good at gerrymandering and other electoral
shenanigans is that they learned their craft from the Democrats.
 
2012-11-16 09:34:23 AM  

dopirt: d23: curvy brunettes

One vote for curvy brunettes.


Sorry, you've been redistricted. Your new district has selected "morbidly obese Steelers fans."
 
2012-11-16 09:36:57 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Here's a rundown of the races that remain uncalled:
Arizona's 2nd District. Democratic Rep. Ron Barber leads Republican Martha McSally 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent, or 698 votes, with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 7th District. Democrat Ami Bera leads Republican Rep. Dan Lungren 50.4 percent to 49.6 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 52nd District. Democrat Scott Peters leads Republican Rep. Brian Bilbray 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

Florida's 18th District. Democrat Patrick Murphy leads Republican Rep. Allen West 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

North Carolina's 7th District. Democratic Rep. Mike McIntyre leads Republican David Rouzer 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

... uncalled?

Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.


Arizona CD 2 has thousands of provisional ballots that need to be qualified and voted.
 
2012-11-16 09:38:20 AM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Jim_Callahan: Here's a rundown of the races that remain uncalled:
Arizona's 2nd District. Democratic Rep. Ron Barber leads Republican Martha McSally 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent, or 698 votes, with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 7th District. Democrat Ami Bera leads Republican Rep. Dan Lungren 50.4 percent to 49.6 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 52nd District. Democrat Scott Peters leads Republican Rep. Brian Bilbray 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

Florida's 18th District. Democrat Patrick Murphy leads Republican Rep. Allen West 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

North Carolina's 7th District. Democratic Rep. Mike McIntyre leads Republican David Rouzer 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

... uncalled?

Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.

Arizona CD 2 has thousands of provisional ballots that need to be qualified and voted.

*starts brewing more coffee* COUNTED. FTFM
 
2012-11-16 09:38:56 AM  
Crunching some numbers from NY Times's big board, if Democrats got a universal 5-point swing in vote (i.e. a race lost by 4 points becomes a race won by 1 point), the House would be 222-213. Republicans. Democrats need a SEVEN-point swing to claim a majority.

STATE LEGISLATURES 2020. Whereever possible (i.e. where state legislatures in 2010 did not already gerrymander themselves into permanence).
 
2012-11-16 09:41:57 AM  

thurstonxhowell: pivazena: I believe only 1/3 of the house was up for reelection this year.

Roughly 1/3 of the Senate was up for reelection because Senators server 6 year terms. Representatives only serve 2 year terms, so the whole House is up for reelection every 2 years.


Oops! Civics fail
 
2012-11-16 09:44:06 AM  

maxheck: docmattic:

maxheck: erik-k:

you'll find yourself playing a game of intellectual Calvinball.

Just wanted to point out, that is *entirely* the wrong way to play Calvinball.

No, someone deciding what is a wrong way to play Calvinball is the wrong way to play Calvinball.

But you just...

and then...

(recusion loop... Cronenberg-style head asplosion)


Possibly... but I have official Waterson canon on my side.

/"The only permanent rule in Calvinball is that you can't play it the same way twice."
 
2012-11-16 09:48:01 AM  

mksmith: maxheck: I live in one of the saner states, though in a very red district. I offered my driver's license unrequested and told the nice little-old-lady my name, she checked my name on a list and handed my ID back and pointed me to another official who pointed me onward to the polling booth. 5 minutes later I had done my part for democracy. (or not.)

Here in Louisiana, you have to produce an official ID of one kind or another. Often, several precincts vote at a single school or wherever. So they check your ID against the printed list of registered voters for your precinct and you sign your name in the space next to it, and then you line up in front of the antique voting machine. (You're not allowed to feed the squirrels spinning the cage attached to the machine.)

If you're in the wrong precinct line -- or the wrong freaking gymnasium -- they can look at the address on your ID and tell you where to go. And they're remarkably polite about it.

Not many things having to do with government work very well in Louisiana, but this actually seems to be one of them.


I remarked on this after my wife and I voted. We heard reports of people in other States waiting for hours. This was the longest I have ever waited to vote, about 30 minutes, and that was because we had a disable person and a elderly and disabled person few people in front of us. If flipping Louisiana can get it right, how the hell can the others not? (unless it is by design of course).

As for antique machine, they are actually fairly modern, more so than paper ballots. AVC Advantage PDF
 
2012-11-16 10:17:55 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.


There's a difference between reporting and vote counting. Besides, it takes time to 'find' more GOP votes.
 
2012-11-16 10:19:07 AM  

jaytkay: Jim_Callahan: Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting"

Maybe they are close enough that a recount is mandatory?


100% precincts reporting means that the election day vote has been collected from the polling locations. It says nothing about provisional or absentee ballots.
 
2012-11-16 10:21:51 AM  

DjangoStonereaver: Generation_D: To sum up: There are all kinds of ways to cheat in local elections, and people whose job it is to know how and make it happen. This is not new, in American cities especially it has been going on for centuries now. Good ol Democratic fun. Its been that way since the 1850s at the very least.

So latter-day complaints of Republican cheating completely misses the mark, we had over 100 years worth of cheating in favor of Democrats in large east coast (and San Franciscan) urban areas. Does it justify it, no it does not. But it points out the people crying for reform have zero sense of history or even of how the system has always "worked."

Precisely; the reason the GOP has gotten so good at gerrymandering and other electoral
shenanigans is that they learned their craft from the Democrats.


Nope. Pretending that Republicans used to be lily white innocents is crap. In the 1960 election while city Democrats were fixing the election for Kennedy, suburban and downstate Republicans were doing the exact same thing trying to fix the election for Nixon. The story of Illinois politics is that Democrats are corrupt and Republicans are corrupt and incompetent.
 
2012-11-16 10:30:20 AM  

TwistedFark: Her name is Denise Milani, and I will help her smuggle watermelons any time.


I'm getting old. My first thought was "I bet she biatches about her back hurting ALL THE TIME".
 
2012-11-16 10:40:06 AM  

iq_in_binary: Baz744: bugontherug: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives

They're already in. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House of Representatives.

Link

The GOP House of Representatives has neither political legitimacy, nor moral authority.

Wow. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House by a million votes, but still have only an inconsequential minority in it?

Between this kind of crap and the electoral college, our democracy is a travesty.

Well, yeah, considering the fact that the founders that crafted this "Democracy" hated the notion and wanted to try a different system. We're not a Democracy, we are a Representative Republic.


If the minority party holds the House of Representatives, it isn't representing the body politic.

However much it angers you, the simple fact is, we are a democratic republic.
 
2012-11-16 11:04:26 AM  

Johnny Swank: ^ Farking this. Also a NC poll worker, and these republican "you gotta check my ID, you just gotta!" assholes are the worst. They're ignorant as hell, and just a pain in the ass in general. I'm convinced they need their ID out all the time just to remember where they actually live.


Whereas in my precinct, in a state that does have voter ID laws (with a very generous definition of ID), I had people coming in all day surprised when they were asked for ID because they'd heard about this voter ID business on the radio and thought Democrats had made it so no one needed any anywhere. I'm like, have you never ever voted before? It's been like this at least eight years here.
 
2012-11-16 11:15:49 AM  

pivazena: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

If it turns out that the GOP kept a staggering control of the house in spite of getting fewer total nationwide votes, that will demonstrate a catastrophic moral failure of gerrymandering and a tyrranical offense against democracy. We already have the Senate to trample on democracy. The House is supposed to be pure and populist. I'm sick of seeing districts that pack urban blacks, Latinos, and college students into a 90% Democrat district so Republicans can win the surrounding six districts 55:45.

I believe only 1/3 of the house was up for reelection this year. I don't know the breakdown, but if most of those seats were in dem or rep strongholds, you'd expect them to be reelected. And incumbents usually win regardless, as people love THEIR representative but hate congress


All the house is up for election every two years. You're thinking of the senate.
 
2012-11-16 11:16:21 AM  

Generation_D: DjangoStonereaver: Tommy Moo: jaytkay: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives. It's strange that Obama won the popular vote but the GOP kept the house. Is it likely that millions of Americans voted for Obama and a Republican for Congress?

A few points off the top of my head:

Obama won in Paul Ryan's district, so yes, it definitely happens.

Incumbents usually win.

Districts are re-drawn (yes, gerrymandered) every 10 years , so maybe they lag changing opinion

Alaska, Delaware, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, and Vermont have only one Representative each, so their voters count disproportionally

The process should be done by computer algorithm. Districts are drawn by state legislatures, which gives state governments an unfair ability to influence the makeup of the federal government. A voter should be able to vote for one party in state elections and the other party in federal elections without it being a conflict of interests.

Bbbbut.. State's Rights!

Seriously: as liberal as I am, I don't see a problem with each state's legislature deciding how to draw
districts in their own state.

Is the system rigged? You betcha, and this is truly a case of "Both sides are bad!", since the Dems
were and are doing such things in their strongholds for years*. But the GOP has been so nakedly brazen about it that you just have to laugh in between crying.

*I shall refrain from pointing out that a lot of the Democrats who gerrymandered in the
southern states to cut out black voters in years past would, in our current climate, probably have
moved to the GOP side because of Nixon's Southern Strategy; the NY Dems sure as hell mess with
their districts in NYC.

My grandfather worked in city politics in Chicago in the 1950s and 1960s. Thats big D Democratic for you kids just joining the discussion.

Some of the jobs he used to perform, or had people that reported to him perform:

1) Punching multiple ballots. T ...


So let me get this straight:

The fact that your family cheated on the ballot before I was born and the fact that the last time people cheated in such an obvious manner was before I was allowed to vote means that when I learn about this now, I'm not allowed to be angry about it? Is that what you're telling me?
 
2012-11-16 11:21:30 AM  

Johnny Swank: ^ Farking this. Also a NC poll worker, and these republican "you gotta check my ID, you just gotta!" assholes are the worst. They're ignorant as hell, and just a pain in the ass in general. I'm convinced they need their ID out all the time just to remember where they actually live.


I got my ID stolen on election day and haven't had a chance to get a new one yet (have to go in person, don't have a car, can't bike or bus in time around work hours so I gotta take a day off next week) so I'm getting a kick out of awesome poll worker posts.

/did poll greeting so voted absentee anyway
//no ID req and I had it forwarded
///sigh
 
2012-11-16 11:44:29 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Here's a rundown of the races that remain uncalled:
Arizona's 2nd District. Democratic Rep. Ron Barber leads Republican Martha McSally 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent, or 698 votes, with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 7th District. Democrat Ami Bera leads Republican Rep. Dan Lungren 50.4 percent to 49.6 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

California's 52nd District. Democrat Scott Peters leads Republican Rep. Brian Bilbray 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

Florida's 18th District. Democrat Patrick Murphy leads Republican Rep. Allen West 50.3 percent to 49.7 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

North Carolina's 7th District. Democratic Rep. Mike McIntyre leads Republican David Rouzer 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent with 100 percent of precincts reporting.

... uncalled?

Either Politico is unclear on the meaning of "100 percent of precincts reporting", or I am. I know this is impolitic of me, but I'm kind of hoping it's Politico, I don't really wanna have to relearn math based on the assumption that 1 =/= 1.


I was wondering if I'd missed something here. I mean, it's not like AP has some sort of legal mandate on 'calling' races...if 100% of the precincts report in, the race is over. You might not like who won, but there is in fact a winner.
 
2012-11-16 11:54:45 AM  

Jim_Callahan: t 1 =/= 1.


If the counts are close enough many jurisdictions have automatic recount rules. I can't say for certain that each of these races fall into that category but *shrug* I guess it's a possibility. I think it's been mentioned but there are also probably provisional/absentee ballots that still need to be counted.
 
2012-11-16 11:57:44 AM  
Weird...I lost most of your quote some where...oh well
 
2012-11-16 12:09:48 PM  
they way the GOP draws congressional lines for Ohio should be a crime. If Republicans had any morals they'd be ashamed. But they don't. They are pudgy, pasty ass hats.
 
2012-11-16 12:22:16 PM  

snowshovel: "A week and a half after the elections, 5 seats in the House of Representatives too close to call. Of course, Democrats are leading in all of them. How did you know?"

Because of whatever Acorn morphed into/ Maybe if the libs weren't committing voter fraud all over the place, we wouldn't have to worry about "too close to call". If you don't like your gerrymandered district, move out of it. No one is forcing you to live in your ramshackled shack with people like you.


ACORN! DRINK!
 
2012-11-16 01:09:45 PM  

Baz744: iq_in_binary: Baz744: bugontherug: Tommy Moo: I eagerly await the statistics on nationwide popular vote for House representatives

They're already in. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House of Representatives.

Link

The GOP House of Representatives has neither political legitimacy, nor moral authority.

Wow. The Democrats won the national popular vote for House by a million votes, but still have only an inconsequential minority in it?

Between this kind of crap and the electoral college, our democracy is a travesty.

Well, yeah, considering the fact that the founders that crafted this "Democracy" hated the notion and wanted to try a different system. We're not a Democracy, we are a Representative Republic.

If the minority party holds the House of Representatives, it isn't representing the body politic.

However much it angers you, the simple fact is, we are a democratic republic.


Wrong on that count too. In a democracy the minority party wouldn't have any power, none, zero, zilch, nada. Take a look at states with Republican Super Majorities. That's what a democracy looks like at normalcy.

We are not a democracy, the founding fathers hated the notion of mob rule and established the senate and the congress specifically to offset the disadvantages present in a democracy. Most true democracies that our founding fathers had knowledge of were essentially limited dictatorships with varying levels of success. See: Rome. They hated the idea of mob rule and the coliseum/church/bath houses being used as a tool to both gain and secure power by feeding the wants of the mob and offering incentives for willful ignorance. We are, by definition a Representative Republic. Plain and simple. There is no wiggle room, no technicality you can use, nothing that changes that fact. Words mean things. We are not a democracy.
 
2012-11-16 01:22:00 PM  

iq_in_binary: Wrong on that count too. In a democracy the minority party wouldn't have any power, none, zero, zilch, nada. Take a look at states with Republican Super Majorities. That's what a democracy looks like at normalcy.

We are not a democracy, the founding fathers hated the notion of mob rule and established the senate and the congress specifically to offset the disadvantages present in a democracy. Most true democracies that our founding fathers had knowledge of were essentially limited dictatorships with varying levels of success. See: Rome. They hated the idea of mob rule and the coliseum/church/bath houses being used as a tool to both gain and secure power by feeding the wants of the mob and offering incentives for willful ignorance. We are, by definition a Representative Republic. Plain and simple. There is no wiggle room, no technicality you can use, nothing that changes that fact. Words mean things. We are not a democracy.


He's right because he did not say we are a democracy. We are a democratic republic. A non-democratic republic would be one like the Roman Senate where representatives are not elected by the people.
 
2012-11-16 01:24:05 PM  

iq_in_binary: Wrong on that count too. In a democracy the minority party wouldn't have any power, none, zero, zilch, nada. Take a look at states with Republican Super Majorities. That's what a democracy looks like at normalcy.


You are almost completely uninformed. That characteristic does not inhere to the concept of democracy.

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America is now and has always been a democratic republic.

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What's more: the House of Representatives was always intended to be the people's house. Above the Senate, the presidency, and the courts, the House of Representatives should reflect the will of the people. When one party so gerrymanders the districts that it becomes easy for them to lose the popular vote while retaining a substantial majority in it, it undermines the plain intent of the framers.
 
2012-11-16 01:26:53 PM  

odinsposse: iq_in_binary: Wrong on that count too. In a democracy the minority party wouldn't have any power, none, zero, zilch, nada. Take a look at states with Republican Super Majorities. That's what a democracy looks like at normalcy.

We are not a democracy, the founding fathers hated the notion of mob rule and established the senate and the congress specifically to offset the disadvantages present in a democracy. Most true democracies that our founding fathers had knowledge of were essentially limited dictatorships with varying levels of success. See: Rome. They hated the idea of mob rule and the coliseum/church/bath houses being used as a tool to both gain and secure power by feeding the wants of the mob and offering incentives for willful ignorance. We are, by definition a Representative Republic. Plain and simple. There is no wiggle room, no technicality you can use, nothing that changes that fact. Words mean things. We are not a democracy.

He's right because he did not say we are a democracy. We are a democratic republic. A non-democratic republic would be one like the Roman Senate where representatives are not elected by the people.


It doesn't matter, because we are a democracy too. We are a republic, a democracy, and a democratic republic all at the same time.
 
2012-11-16 02:12:41 PM  

Baz744: odinsposse: iq_in_binary: Wrong on that count too. In a democracy the minority party wouldn't have any power, none, zero, zilch, nada. Take a look at states with Republican Super Majorities. That's what a democracy looks like at normalcy.

We are not a democracy, the founding fathers hated the notion of mob rule and established the senate and the congress specifically to offset the disadvantages present in a democracy. Most true democracies that our founding fathers had knowledge of were essentially limited dictatorships with varying levels of success. See: Rome. They hated the idea of mob rule and the coliseum/church/bath houses being used as a tool to both gain and secure power by feeding the wants of the mob and offering incentives for willful ignorance. We are, by definition a Representative Republic. Plain and simple. There is no wiggle room, no technicality you can use, nothing that changes that fact. Words mean things. We are not a democracy.

He's right because he did not say we are a democracy. We are a democratic republic. A non-democratic republic would be one like the Roman Senate where representatives are not elected by the people.

It doesn't matter, because we are a democracy too. We are a republic, a democracy, and a democratic republic all at the same time.


Did you, or did you not vote directly on the Budget? Did you or did you not directly vote on all the various policy matters that our Legislative branch handles, say for instance tax codes or appropriations bills? Did those show up on your ballot?

Oh, they didn't? We are not a democracy. Period. Full Stop. End Of Story.

English, do you speak it?
 
2012-11-16 02:29:20 PM  

iq_in_binary: Did you, or did you not vote directly on the Budget? Did you or did you not directly vote on all the various policy matters that our Legislative branch handles, say for instance tax codes or appropriations bills? Did those show up on your ballot?

Oh, they didn't? We are not a democracy. Period. Full Stop. End Of Story.

English, do you speak it?


Why, yes. Yes, I do.

/You're such a wit.
//Well, half.
 
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