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(Washington Examiner)   Somehow, Ohio has still managed not to count 300,000 votes. Not that it will change the results--but how hard can it be?   (washingtonexaminer.com) divider line 108
    More: Asinine  
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7837 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Nov 2012 at 11:56 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-14 12:49:17 PM

Gosling: Lumpmoose: So there are a number of uncounted ballots and each will eventually be counted once it's determined if they're valid or not. And it almost certainly won't change the outcome of Ohio because of where they're from. What's [img.fark.com image 54x11]?

If it was your vote that was one of those ballots, I guarantee you'd get pissed off for someone even suggesting there isn't a problem.


If my vote was one of those ballots, then I'd be secure in the knowledge that it would eventually be included in the final tally. If that final tally changed any "called" races, I'd assume the Ohio Secretary of State would make that information known.

Hell, I have no guarantee my actual ballot was ever counted. But unless there are new reports of confirmed problems, I'm not going to lose sleep over it.
 
2012-11-14 12:49:22 PM
We are OHIO don't expect us to do anything correctly. Nuthun ! 
www.theage.com.au

i38.photobucket.com

cph.osu.edu

libertyintel.com

www.sportscasualties.com
 
2012-11-14 12:53:08 PM
"we're here for the chili!"

delicious-cooks.com
 
2012-11-14 12:53:43 PM
Popular Vote.
 
2012-11-14 12:54:38 PM

OnlyM3: Generation_D

when your stated goal is voter suppression, this looks like everythings going according to plan.
Suppression like 25 some odd OH counties not having a single republican vote?


Look at how dumb you are.
 
2012-11-14 12:57:47 PM
Um.. not to be a pragmatist here, but...

If Ohio is anything like New York, there are other elections on those ballots, as well.. there's not a separate "Presidential Election" ballot.

So while these 300,000 ballots not-yet-counted may not change the presidential outcome, they could be important to municipal, county, and state elections, right?

Right?
 
2012-11-14 01:01:52 PM

BlueDuckFarker: So while these 300,000 ballots not-yet-counted may not change the presidential outcome, they could be important to municipal, county, and state elections, right?


That's why they're being counted. You guys know these things don't take effect instantly, right?
 
2012-11-14 01:02:05 PM
I think the reason Floriduh is so derp-y is because of all the trashy Ohioans who've moved here.

Florida didn't get stupid on its own. Remember, it's the stupid people who fled from the other 49 that made this such a great place.
 
2012-11-14 01:08:19 PM
I'm really surprised that the states with GOP leadership that have been trying to gum up the election process are dealing with a gummed up election process.
 
2012-11-14 01:16:25 PM

senorpogo: This isn't a matter of being slow or unable to count ballots. In Ohio, provisional ballots are given to voters whose eligibility is in question. Voters then have ten days to prove their eligibility. The votes will be counted this Saturday.

Things have been set up this way to avoid voter disenfranchisement and make sure that people's votes do get count. That's a good thing, right?


This.
In addition, Ohio allows overseas absentee ballots to be counted as long as they are postmarked on Election Day and received by the 10th day after the election.
 
2012-11-14 01:17:33 PM

DontMakeMeComeBackThere: You can argue about how Ohio got 300,000+ provisional ballots in the first place...but it's gonna take a long time to sort out...no amount of "Where's my flying car" logic is going to change that.


To be clear, nobody is arguing about how Ohio found themselves in a place where they are unable to count nearly one in twenty votes. It's very clear that an almost criminal level of incompetence and negligence allowed that to happen. This is so obviously true that it's not even worth our time to discuss.

And, nobody is saying that there should be a magical way to fix this after it has already happened. When your alcoholic uncle drops his trousers at thanksgiving dinner and shiats all over the turkey, nobody has a discussion about the fastest way to clean up the mess so they can eat the bird before it gets cold. Instead, the kids table has a really good laugh, while the adults have a serious grown-up discussion about the best way to get that uncle into treatment before he destroys himself and his family.

And, that's where we are with Florida and Ohio. We can all sit at the kids table and laugh at how stupid it all is on Fark, but it's long past time where the adults have a serious discussion about how we as a nation get these states the help they need to be responsible contributors to the common good before we have a repeat of November 2000.
 
2012-11-14 01:19:33 PM

Lumpmoose: Generation_D: Lumpmoose: nekom: Lumpmoose: So there are a number of uncounted ballots and each will eventually be counted once it's determined if they're valid or not. And it almost certainly won't change the outcome of Ohio because of where they're from. What's [img.fark.com image 54x11]?

You don't think that in 2012 maybe a system to count the votes at LEAST within a few days is too much to ask?

No, it doesn't look like it will affect the vote, and even if it did Obama wins without Ohio anyway, but still, come the fark on! This isn't rocket surgery.

I agree that the voting system needs to be improved--perhaps even federally regulated for national races. But I also think the secretary's office can take its time to sort through 300,000 provisional and absentee paper ballots. If Ohio was close enough to trigger a recount, I think they should take even longer.

In my mind, Minnesota's very transparent and coordinated recount of the Franken-Coleman race is ideal. The Supreme Court preventing the true outcome of Florida in 2000 is not. Taking your time and establishing methods is preferable.

[www.lizardpersonornot.com image 225x300]

[www.lizardpersonornot.com image 225x300]

I love that example because it actually counted as an overvote, not a vote for Franken. The State Canvassing Board decided that write-ins would count as votes even if the oval wasn't filled in. So the above ballot had two votes for Senator and was discounted. I disagree--I think it should have been a vote for Franken since only his oval was filled in. But I respect the board's procedures and final decision. It's a great example of election fairness.


You could equally argue it was originally filled in, then crossed out.
 
2012-11-14 01:20:47 PM

Fizpez: OnlyM3: Generation_D

when your stated goal is voter suppression, this looks like everythings going according to plan.
Suppression like 25 some odd OH counties not having a single republican vote?

Here ya go ACE Link

Don't let facts get in the way of a good talking point.


Nicely done. Now, what do you suppose the odds are that he's going to go back to whoever told him that and hold him accountable for the lies?
 
2012-11-14 01:22:58 PM
You know, these ballots that have not been counted yet are for more than the president. True that Obama wins either way, but there might be congressional seats still in play.
 
2012-11-14 01:23:11 PM

thomasvista: I think the reason Floriduh is so derp-y is because of all the trashy Ohioans who've moved here.


No, I believe you're talking about the state of Georgia; their economic development department's main function is to steal Ohio companies and a fair amount of Ohioans with them. Repeat for any other Northern state.

The hanging chad issue pales in comparison to governments moving large companies without as much as a peep from the destination state involved.
 
2012-11-14 01:25:48 PM
Am I seriously in before Eric Cartman
 
2012-11-14 01:29:22 PM

BlueDuckFarker: Um.. not to be a pragmatist here, but...

If Ohio is anything like New York, there are other elections on those ballots, as well.. there's not a separate "Presidential Election" ballot.

So while these 300,000 ballots not-yet-counted may not change the presidential outcome, they could be important to municipal, county, and state elections, right?

Right?


CSB time
Years ago there was a school tax increase on the ballot. I was stationed in Germany at the time and received my ballot just a week before the election. I sent it back but it didn't get there until a week after the election. On election day the school tax measure ended in a tie, but the board of elections reminded people there were still an absentee ballots they hadn't received. At the end of the 10 day waiting period, they tallied the votes and the measure failed by 1 vote. My mom worked at the board of elections at the time and she said they had only received one absentee ballot and it was mine.

/CSB
 
2012-11-14 01:33:15 PM
Has anybody figured out how many registered voters didn't vote and how many eligible citizens didn't even register? Once again there wasn't a candidate eligible to actually hold the office who could represent ME and what I think is important, even the Socialist Party candidate was only on (I think) four states' ballots, so I let my registration lapse when I moved across town. Fuggit: voting for a Lesser Evil violates my ethics anyway: voting for the lesser evil still means voting for evil, which is just wrong. So until y'all come up with a good candidate to vote for you'll just have to fark yourselves over without my help; maybe someday you'll get it right, but I ain't a-countin' on it, not in my lifetime anyway.

Anyway. Has anybody blamed The Jews for this Ohio thing yet? Last night it struck me that there's only one really powerful conspiracy, the conspiracy to blame everything on The Jews, either to divert attention from the real problem or just because. You don't even have to be a genuine antisemite, just have a finger to point. So the next time you hear somebody blame The Jews for something you'll know right away he's bullshiatting, and he could well be in on the Plot himself. (Remember, you heard it here first!)
 
2012-11-14 01:35:06 PM

HotWingConspiracy: I'm really surprised that the states with GOP leadership that have been trying to gum up the election process are dealing with a gummed up election process.


At least give credit to the Ohioans that brought some sanity to Ohio by repudiating Kasich's influence in 2011 - by killing a bill that was worse than Wisconsin's. In addition, it provides some evidence that prosperity didn't depend on the ramrodding of an ALEC-made bill.


/Yes, I voted Romney to bring sanity to the GOP.
//I knew that if he failed, the next candidate would bring more derp to the table
 
2012-11-14 01:38:53 PM
"Somehow" indeed. They are just following the direction of the Secretary.

And given John Husted's recent lambasting from a Federal Judge over eleventh hour changes to provisional vote tallies (provisional ballots would not be counted if the paperwork contained a mistake after he told the judge they would nine days earlier), I fully expect the Justice Department to be stepping in and monitoring Ohio elections from this point forward.

Linky
 
2012-11-14 01:45:17 PM

hdhale: RedPhoenix122: HST's Dead Carcass: Do you think Karl Rove is pointing to this as a means to distract the Koch Brothers from him funneling the SuperPAC money to his offshore accounts?

/just asking questions

I thought about this. How do we know Karl Rove isn't just doing what the Koch Brothers want him to do, which is get money from their offshore accounts, funneled through the SuperPAC, then back through to their bank accounts in the states, to avoid tax laws.


Someone didn't watch The Colbert Report this week.
 
2012-11-14 01:50:16 PM

jack21221: BlueDuckFarker: So while these 300,000 ballots not-yet-counted may not change the presidential outcome, they could be important to municipal, county, and state elections, right?

That's why they're being counted. You guys know these things don't take effect instantly, right?


That was my point. There are a lot of "Who cares? Those votes won't make a difference" comments in here, suggesting that people think the presidential election was the only ballot item.
 
2012-11-14 01:57:28 PM
Others have pointed out that the provisional ballots aren't counted until 10 days after the election. That's Ohio law. Not hurr-durr, we're Ohioans and counting is hard. Voters have 10 days to prove they cast a ballot in the correct precint. The same rules were in effect in 2008 when Brunner, a Democrat, was Secretary of State.

That Examiner story was much ado about nothing. Focusing on why there are so many provisional ballots is more germane. There were about 200 thousand provisional ballots cast in '08.
 
2012-11-14 01:59:36 PM

DontMakeMeComeBackThere: nekom: Lumpmoose: So there are a number of uncounted ballots and each will eventually be counted once it's determined if they're valid or not. And it almost certainly won't change the outcome of Ohio because of where they're from. What's [img.fark.com image 54x11]?

You don't think that in 2012 maybe a system to count the votes at LEAST within a few days is too much to ask?

Let's say someone shows up to vote, and their name is not on the list, even though they say they've lived in the same house for 30 years. They cast a provisional ballot. Now, some live person (not a computer) has to verify that this person really does live at the address they provided, and really should have been able to vote AND the person in question may even have to show up in person and show someone ID and power bills or something to prove who they are and where they live.

That times 300 THOUSAND...and you want that done in a couple days? Really?

You can argue about how Ohio got 300,000+ provisional ballots in the first place...but it's gonna take a long time to sort out...no amount of "Where's my flying car" logic is going to change that.


Or you could quit just jacking around with their right to vote in the first place.

Washington State got a little derpy 6 years ago, the local Republicans were out to prove everyone that lived in Seattle was committing voter fraud because "our signatures did not match" in their opinion. Kind of shut their sh*t down when they were shown on the news depriving old people of the right to vote on flimsy evidence like their handwriting signature had changed in 20 years. The public outcry was loud and they implemented full by-mail voting by 2008.

There's still occasional issues, but I confirmed 2 weeks ahead of the election day that my ballot had been received and my signature checked.

States can do this right. The ones that aren't are deliberately messing it up to mess with Democratic voting. They tried to do that in Washington, and the public curb-stomped the petty faction down and we got a better system as a result.

And no blithering from the local pissed off Republican contingent about voter fraud this year either. As they got their a--es handed to them statewide on about every race that was competitive.
 
2012-11-14 02:10:18 PM

Svlad Cjelli: Others have pointed out that the provisional ballots aren't counted until 10 days after the election. That's Ohio law. Not hurr-durr, we're Ohioans and counting is hard. Voters have 10 days to prove they cast a ballot in the correct precint. The same rules were in effect in 2008 when Brunner, a Democrat, was Secretary of State.


And others have pointed out, the election system in the United States is a nation-wide disgrace and the entire thing needs to be revamped. There is absolutely no excuse for any first world nation to allow every state to design their own hackneyed voting system in such an inept way that ten days after the election we still have no way of knowing if we should even count nearly one in ten ballots in some counties.

Yes, as you have pointed out, the system is working as designed. And, as the rest of us are pointing out, the design of the system is stunningly bad, and the designers are stunningly incompetent.

So let's be very clear about what I am saying. I am not saying that Ohio is the only place where the election procedures are so mindlessly incompetent that I honestly believe that people should be thrown in prison for negligence. I'm just saying that Ohio just happens to be the place that we are laughing at on Fark right now.
 
2012-11-14 02:22:43 PM
D'ohio!
 
2012-11-14 02:51:22 PM
wun....
too.....
thray....
fo-er....
feyev....
see-ux...
sebun...
ate....
neyen....
tea-in....
.
.
.
Uh, hmm. Say Buford whut come after tea-in agin'?
 
2012-11-14 03:02:18 PM

DontMakeMeComeBackThere: nekom: Lumpmoose: So there are a number of uncounted ballots and each will eventually be counted once it's determined if they're valid or not. And it almost certainly won't change the outcome of Ohio because of where they're from. What's [img.fark.com image 54x11]?

You don't think that in 2012 maybe a system to count the votes at LEAST within a few days is too much to ask?

Let's say someone shows up to vote, and their name is not on the list, even though they say they've lived in the same house for 30 years. They cast a provisional ballot. Now, some live person (not a computer) has to verify that this person really does live at the address they provided, and really should have been able to vote AND the person in question may even have to show up in person and show someone ID and power bills or something to prove who they are and where they live.

That times 300 THOUSAND...and you want that done in a couple days? Really?

You can argue about how Ohio got 300,000+ provisional ballots in the first place...but it's gonna take a long time to sort out...no amount of "Where's my flying car" logic is going to change that.


If only there was some way we could get a live person to do most of that stuff before the election. Perhaps some local government office to which a body could go and show their ID and a power bill to prove their residence. Perhaps in return they could be given some kind of ... I don't know ... let's call it a 'voter registration' card which proves this, and which they could show when they go to vote.

Of course this whole hairbrained idea will never work since it hinges on some asshole not removing huge swaths of people from those registration rolls for purely partisan shiats and giggles. And no, even this plan won't get things sorted out faster this year, but I'm thinking the 2014 and 2016 election will go a lot smoother if Ohio just de-assholefies it's secretary of state's office.
 
2012-11-14 03:02:34 PM
This is the way the laws are set up in Ohio. Provisional and absentee ballots are never counted before 11/17. It's the law.

They were actually discussing the possibility of this delaying the full Electoral College result if Ohio ended up being the tipping point state, which thankfully it wasn't.
 
2012-11-14 03:04:06 PM

The Larch: And others have pointed out, the election system in the United States is a nation-wide disgrace and the entire thing needs to be revamped. There is absolutely no excuse for any first world nation to allow every state to design their own hackneyed voting system in such an inept way that ten days after the election we still have no way of knowing if we should even count nearly one in ten ballots in some counties.


This is the results of State's Right. Each state gets to have their own election process and the people who oversee elections are elected officials (partisans).

The whole thing needs to be nationalized and run by the federal government. Heck, let the IRS run it. If they can accept electronic tax returns and quickly turn around and deposit refund checks in bank accounts via EFT, they could handle a hybrid mail-in and online voting system.
 
2012-11-14 03:10:17 PM

Generation_D: And no blithering from the local pissed off Republican contingent about voter fraud this year either. As the y got their a--es handed to them statewide on about every race that was competitive. other team didn't recount the ballots over and over again until the final tally ended up in their favor this time


FTFY
 
2012-11-14 03:12:48 PM

thornhill: The whole thing needs to be nationalized and run by the federal government.


The electoral college is part of state elections. It's not a federal process.
 
2012-11-14 03:14:32 PM

HST's Dead Carcass: So, Obama concedes Ohio to Romney, he still won by a long shot. Romney is still not president!


The point, ever hear of it?
 
2012-11-14 03:15:37 PM
Was there any math involved?
 
2012-11-14 03:17:43 PM

This text is now purple: thornhill: The whole thing needs to be nationalized and run by the federal government.

The electoral college is part of state elections. It's not a federal process.


Did you read my post?
 
2012-11-14 03:17:53 PM

This text is now purple: thornhill: The whole thing needs to be nationalized and run by the federal government.

The electoral college is part of state elections. It's not a federal process.


Yes. And the whole thing needs to be nationalized and run by the federal government.
 
2012-11-14 03:42:42 PM

The Larch: Svlad Cjelli: Others have pointed out that the provisional ballots aren't counted until 10 days after the election. That's Ohio law. Not hurr-durr, we're Ohioans and counting is hard. Voters have 10 days to prove they cast a ballot in the correct precint. The same rules were in effect in 2008 when Brunner, a Democrat, was Secretary of State.

And others have pointed out, the election system in the United States is a nation-wide disgrace and the entire thing needs to be revamped. There is absolutely no excuse for any first world nation to allow every state to design their own hackneyed voting system in such an inept way that ten days after the election we still have no way of knowing if we should even count nearly one in ten ballots in some counties.

Yes, as you have pointed out, the system is working as designed. And, as the rest of us are pointing out, the design of the system is stunningly bad, and the designers are stunningly incompetent.

So let's be very clear about what I am saying. I am not saying that Ohio is the only place where the election procedures are so mindlessly incompetent that I honestly believe that people should be thrown in prison for negligence. I'm just saying that Ohio just happens to be the place that we are laughing at on Fark right now.


Which procedures are incompetent? Making sure all legitimate votes are counted? You haven't addressed any of the reasons for provisional ballots to exist in the first place. And if there are legitimate reasons, than it will necessarily take time to ensure they are legitimately cast.

But you must know the results of every vote in the country immediately. Never mind that the electoral college doesn't vote until December. If it makes you feel better, I am fairly certain who will be inaugurated come January.

When you come up with the perfect national voting system, let me know. We can start the process to amend the Constitution.
 
2012-11-14 04:04:00 PM

Svlad Cjelli: When you come up with the perfect national voting system, let me know. We can start the process to amend the Constitution.


I am glad that you agree with me that the Constitution should be amended to improve the disgraceful election system in the United States. It seems that we have achieved some common ground.

I'm afraid that you're not ever going to get your "perfect" system, though. I think you might want to talk to your math professors about that one, because they can best explain why that is logically impossible. But it seems like at least we both agree that much better system is possible, and that we should have a Constitutional Amendment to get there.
 
2012-11-14 04:06:27 PM

Svlad Cjelli: When you come up with the perfect national voting system, let me know. We can start the process to amend the Constitution.


*waves from Canada*

No, ours isn't perfect, but it's a damn sight better.
 
2012-11-14 04:10:25 PM
And still no Ohio tag.
 
2012-11-14 04:15:43 PM
We did a good job of making it harder for Romney-leaning military peeps to vote absentee this cycle, so we should be fine.
 
2012-11-14 04:25:36 PM

GORDON: We did a good job of making it harder for Romney-leaning military peeps to vote absentee this cycle, so we should be fine.


How was that Kool Aid, anyway?
 
2012-11-14 04:32:57 PM

LL316: The point, ever hear of it?


I hide it under my Trucker cap, why do you ask?
 
2012-11-14 04:54:51 PM
The comments in that article are mind-blowing. The levels of Repubtard butthurt are tremendous and they will really believe anything. In fact, the butthurt thing is sorta getting stale now and moving to the realm of the ridiculous. States wanting to secede from the US, some kind of conspiracy theory that even with an inferior number of votes the state could flip hands and make 0 difference in the outcome of the election, and who could forget the ENDLESS whining about another 4 years. Seriously. Get over it. Bush sucked and people complained, but I really don't remember this level of stupid when he was re-elected (please someone correct me if I am wrong here).
 
2012-11-14 04:54:56 PM

Lumpmoose: nekom: Lumpmoose: So there are a number of uncounted ballots and each will eventually be counted once it's determined if they're valid or not. And it almost certainly won't change the outcome of Ohio because of where they're from. What's [img.fark.com image 54x11]?

You don't think that in 2012 maybe a system to count the votes at LEAST within a few days is too much to ask?

No, it doesn't look like it will affect the vote, and even if it did Obama wins without Ohio anyway, but still, come the fark on! This isn't rocket surgery.

I agree that the voting system needs to be improved--perhaps even federally regulated for national races. But I also think the secretary's office can take its time to sort through 300,000 provisional and absentee paper ballots. If Ohio was close enough to trigger a recount, I think they should take even longer.

In my mind, Minnesota's very transparent and coordinated recount of the Franken-Coleman race is ideal. The Supreme Court preventing the true outcome of Florida in 2000 is not. Taking your time and establishing methods is preferable.


What is really telling to me is that Romney and Ryan lost both of their home states. The voters that know them the best said Aw Hellz No.
 
2012-11-14 04:59:54 PM

Soulcatcher: What is really telling to me is that Romney and Ryan lost both of their home states. The voters that know them the best said Aw Hellz No.


Heck, Romney managed to lose in every one of his four home states.
 
2012-11-14 05:04:47 PM
300,000 provisional ballots? Is that supposed to sound reasonable?

Jesus farking christ am I glad we defeated the 'voter ID' amendment in Minnesota this year.
 
2012-11-14 05:16:22 PM

tallguywithglasseson: 300,000 provisional ballots? Is that supposed to sound reasonable?


In Cayahoga county, about one in twenty ballots ended up being provisional. Basically what happens is that the Ohio registration process is very badly broken, the poll workers are very badly trained, and the state refuses to spend enough money to have enough polling locations, so the lines are very long. So whenever there is a problem, the people working at the polls have no choice but to hand out a provisional ballot, and move on to the next person. And, because no effort has ever been made to improve a badly broken system, there is a problem with one in twenty people who show up to vote.

And yes, telling one in twenty people that you either can't be bothered find their name in the registration book, or that you can find their name in the registration book but you have decided that you don't like how they have identified themselves, is disgraceful.
 
2012-11-14 05:24:15 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Jesus farking christ am I glad we defeated the 'voter ID' amendment in Minnesota this year.


And just as an aside, I do think that a national identity card, given for free to every single permanent resident in the United States, would be a good idea. And once we get to the point that 98% of the people in the United States possess a national identity card, I think we should start using them for voting.

Basically, my scheme is this: Every single permanent resident in the United States should have a national identity card. And every single citizen over the age of 18 who has a national identity card should be automatically registered to vote.

I believe that our goals should be: every citizen over the age of 18 has a national identity card, every citizen with an identity card is registered to vote, and every citizen who is registered to vote does vote.

But the voter ID laws that most states are trying to pass really are just voter suppression efforts, and are shameful.
 
2012-11-14 05:49:55 PM
This election was rigged by the Chicago thugs. The voting machines in ALL battleground states were hacked into and programed to "steal" 5% of the vote from Romney (meaning 5% was taken away from Romney as not being counted in the Romney column without adding them to Obama's column). This would explain why it was so close in FL, VA, and NC (in FL Romney was up by about 5% a day before election, in VA he was up by about 3%, and in NC he was up by about 6%, the reason Chicago thugs wouldn't steal NC because 6% was too high of a number for them to overcome). The voting machines in ALL battleground states need to be impounded and examined by the appropriate experts. This is not a joking matter - it is a fraud election that we just had, it needs to be thoroughly investigated by the authorities and perpetrator brought to justice.

Earlier he says his evidence will be presented.........soon.
 
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