born_yesterday: Until the President and Congress are willing to engage in honest reform of defense spending and Medicare, it's all just political masturbation. No matter what letter comes after their name.

You can disapprove it if you want, but the democrats have a plan: taxes. And it would work. To suggest that the two are the same is absurd.

You may not agree that the democrats' approach is the right approach, but at least it's an approach, as opposed to republicans who continually run on fiscal conservatism then actually add trillions to the deficit with stupid shiat like unfunded wars and a Medicare expansion that doesn't hold any of its costs in check. 

One side may not have the best idea, but the other side is actively lying about theirs.

I also love this ongoing two-faced meltdown the right is having.

Why won't those jerkface stinking liberal moochers who want America to fail and only voted for the president because he's near and going to give the urbans free stuff just sit down and bargain with us in good faith on issues we've said we won't budge on!?. It's all their fault!

Repeat after me: THERE IS NO AMERICAN LEFT

It would help this country to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Democratic party. The shame is that the Republicans have gone so off the deep end that they have lost all credibility.

Thinking about it, given the events of the Reagan/Bush years, it would also have helped to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Republican party.

Senate, Presidency, AND nearly half-a-million more people voted for a Democratic member of the House than for a Republican one^*, biatches.

^*: True story... due to the current districting map the Repubs hold 55% of the seats, but got fewer votes than Dems.

Stage Three: Barganing

clowncar on fire: You won due to: a lackluster candidate and over confidence on our part, and of course, having a more populist message to run on. Having a exceptionally loud extremis on our side certainly didn't hurt your cause.

So other than having policies which the American people didn't like, a terrible strategy, and bad candidates at all levels, things went pretty well?

Vegan Meat Popsicle: born_yesterday: Until the President and Congress are willing to engage in honest reform of defense spending and Medicare, it's all just political masturbation. No matter what letter comes after their name.

You can disapprove it if you want, but the democrats have a plan: taxes. And it would work. To suggest that the two are the same is absurd.

You may not agree that the democrats' approach is the right approach, but at least it's an approach, as opposed to republicans who continually run on fiscal conservatism then actually add trillions to the deficit with stupid shiat like unfunded wars and a Medicare expansion that doesn't hold any of its costs in check. 

One side may not have the best idea, but the other side is actively lying about theirs.

Oh, I'm completely with you on taxes. At the very least, allowing the Bush tax cuts to expire.

However, I recall watching a CSPAN panel discussion on the Pentagon's procurement process. Long story short, we could make significant cuts to defense spending by changing the process without any decrease in the amount of equipment produced. In addition, it is thought that this would also lead to BETTER equipment being produced. Funny, when you make a jet or machine gun in one place, instead of across ten different congressional districts, they tend to be constructed better and at a lower cost.

Similarly, there is no incentive under the current system to improve Medicare. As long as providers can charge cost + X%, with no price competition, health care costs will continue to rise, as will the cost of Medicare coverage.

So please note that I said these systems need to be reformed. Although I support taxes for these programs as well as other "entitlement" programs (if for no other reason than deficit reduction and paying for two wars), the system is rotten at its core, and more money won't fix that.

/Hope I don't sound argumentative
//Or like some sort of Teabagger

Psychohazard: It would help this country to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Democratic party. The shame is that the Republicans have gone so off the deep end that they have lost all credibility.

Thinking about it, given the events of the Reagan/Bush years, it would also have helped to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Republican party.

Until the President and Congress are willing to engage in honest reform of defense spending and Medicare, it's all just political masturbation. No matter what letter comes after their name.

Apparently, while I was sleeping, the Left Wing took over the Presidency of this country. Go figure.

FTA: "They should ignore what the media says and what the polls say, even if it looks like voters will cost the GOP the House in 2014 and the presidency in 2016."

That sounds like a brilliant plan. Please, proceed.

I alone am best: So let me get this right.

Obama win = mandate
Republicans win house = do what Obama says just because you want to still have a job in 2015.

FTFY

theknuckler_33: compromise -- meaning higher tax rates and more unaffordable spending --

It is as if they are genetically incapable of acknowledging that the Democrat's proposal includes spending cuts.

I honestly don't get it. It is a FACT that we have near record low tax rates in our nation right now. It is verifiable fact that we have had economic growth when tax rates were higher than they are today, as recently as Clinton. Why is "raise taxes a little and cut spending a little" so difficult for them to accept.

My 10 year old gets it.

Fart_Machine: As someone who was a Republican back in the 80s the conservative candidate did win. What you call Democrats today would have been considered Republicans over thirty years ago. It's just that the GOP has thrown itself over the cliff.

I know what you mean-Reagan was really big on making gay marriage legal and not firing government union members.

He's right. We do have a spending problem: a war in Iraq, a war in Afghanistan, and Medicare Part D (at least these are the big ones). I think the Stimulus package pales in comparison to this level of spending. When you factor in the 1.8 trillion dollars in tax cuts, it just makes the situation worse. Look, I don't believe in a "blame the last guy" philosophy, but in this case, what else can you do? As I see it, the only thing we can really lay at the feet of Obama (in terms of major spending) is the Stimulus package in 2009.

I alone am best: So let me get this right.

Obama win = mandate
Republicans win house = do what Obama says just because it's good for our country to have a congress that actually passes legislation

FTFY

Do you think doing nothing is really better than doing something slightly more left than what the extreme right wants?

I alone am best: So let me get this right.

Obama win = mandate
Republicans win house = do what Obama says just because?

The American people voted for divided government.

Maybe it's time the Republicans sit down at the table and work on a compromise like big boys and girls.

clowncar on fire: Blue_Blazer: clowncar on fire: Citrate1007: Lets continue to destroy the economy out of spite!!!

"And while we're at it, let's lay all our failure on Bush's doorstep for the next four years".

I don't think you'll find that happening as much in the future- partly out of damage control, partly out of the realization that this tactic has resulted in fail and in part, due to the realization that we cannot continue on with business as usual. With the last four years we had a little wiggle room and could afford a little colateral damage in effort to shift the political tide in the conservative's favor. We now know this is not the case, and we also know four more years of similar obstructionism will be the death of us all. While four more years of enforcing the sluggish expectations of a lame duck POTUS is possible, I firmly believe that there will a more centrist shift on the part of the conservatives, especially in areas where we believe can walk away with some dignity still intact.

Regarding extremis "news sources". Keep in mind these are the individual thought of the far extremes of both sides, not the voice of the majority. The media- as well as the liberal party-- has done an excellent job at marginalizing and downplaying the voice of extreme liberal belief while at the same time allowing for the creation of iconic representatives out of voices and deeds coming from the extreme right. I short, we played right into your hands by failing not to allow our extremist right to do the talking for us.

You say liberal party, I did not realize the Greens took control. Oh and it is this fantasy liberal party that is to blame for "the creation of iconic representatives out of voices and deeds coming from the extreme right."

In other words, you are still in denial, and nothing is the responsibility of the radical right.

OK, then. You're nit-picking here. By "liberal", I'm generalizing as "not conservative". If you'ld prefer The Left or Democrats, so be it. We can both safely agree that the conservatives (republicans/right)did not win the POTUS and the senate- the "other guys" did. Are we happy now?

I never placed the blame on the "left" for our inability to muzzle our rightist extremis- we won't credit you there for our mistakes. On the other hand, hats off to the left for downplaying their extremis and not allowing them to become the voice of the democratic party. Regarding the media: they were only too happy to bring our more "colorful" personalities to the forefront portraying them as the true voice of the republican party.

You won due to: a lackluster candidate and over confidence on our part, and of course, having a more populist message to run on. Having a exceptionally loud extremis on our side certainly didn't hurt your cause.

So loosen up those panties, shake out the sand, and go have yourself another victory beer.

As someone who was a Republican back in the 80s the conservative candidate did win. What you call Democrats today would have been considered Republicans over thirty years ago. It's just that the GOP has thrown itself over the cliff.

clowncar on fire: Citrate1007: Lets continue to destroy the economy out of spite!!!

"And while we're at it, let's lay all our failure on Bush's doorstep for the next four years".

I don't think you'll find that happening as much in the future- partly out of damage control, partly out of the realization that this tactic has resulted in fail and in part, due to the realization that we cannot continue on with business as usual. With the last four years we had a little wiggle room and could afford a little colateral damage in effort to shift the political tide in the conservative's favor. We now know this is not the case, and we also know four more years of similar obstructionism will be the death of us all. While four more years of enforcing the sluggish expectations of a lame duck POTUS is possible, I firmly believe that there will a more centrist shift on the part of the conservatives, especially in areas where we believe can walk away with some dignity still intact.

Regarding extremis "news sources". Keep in mind these are the individual thought of the far extremes of both sides, not the voice of the majority. The media- as well as the liberal party-- has done an excellent job at marginalizing and downplaying the voice of extreme liberal belief while at the same time allowing for the creation of iconic representatives out of voices and deeds coming from the extreme right. I short, we played right into your hands by failing not to allow our extremist right to do the talking for us.

The rape thing is part of the GOP platform. The anti-gay thing as well. The immigration thing as well. As were many things that the general public was revolted by. The so called extremists are merely piss poor spokespersons for the agenda.

The GOP is held together by different factions, but those factions create a philosophical paradox. How can you be for small government yet be the ones who expand the federal government when you are in power. How can the infringement on personal freedom as a result of legislating religious morals
be considered small government. How can bloating a DoD budget that contains massive pork barrel spending in the form of non-competitive contracts be considered free market. The factions no longer work together and in my opinion the only hope for the GOP is to marginalize the tea party and bible pounding factions and appeal to the more moderate voters. Or voters like me who understand the need for fiscal responsibility, are smart enough to know the GOP hasn't been providing it, and also hold personal liberty above the financial concerns for our country.

Zeb Hesselgresser: starsrift: Zeb Hesselgresser: Meanwhile, somebody post a picture of Nero and his fiddle.

If we had Clinton's revenues today, the budget would be almost balanced. As you could see by the chart I posted . . .

I forget how it was put yesterday, but I think this where I mention my Mom's sister having the alternative genital configuration.

Yeah, exactly. Nobody's saying cuts don't have to be made. They do. But you can't cut your way out of the deficit. Taxes need to be raised as well.
But at the end of the day, you have to remember that the boomers are retiring and becoming dependents. Until they die, the USA will have a deficit, barring some sort of extreme measures. It's just something the farked over generations will have to live with.

born_yesterday: /Hope I don't sound argumentative
//Or like some sort of Teabagger

My point is that it's not fair to suggest that both parties are equally to blame. People may not like the solutions offered by the dems, but they are offering solutions. The republicans, on the other hand, have championed the idea of fiscal conservatism for the last thirty years while they have engaged in the practice of running the deficit through the roof.

One party is offering less than entirely popular solutions, the other is just lying to stay in power. These are not equivalent things. To suggest that both parties are to blame for the current state of affairs is absurd.

Psychohazard: It would help this country to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Democratic party. The shame is that the Republicans have gone so off the deep end that they have lost all credibility.

Thinking about it, given the events of the Reagan/Bush years, it would also have helped to have a fiscally conservative counter-balance to the Republican party.

Now, I will give credit where it's due though. George H.W. Bush looked at the mess left behind by St. Reagan and went, "f*ck, there goes that campaign promise."

His son? Looked at the upcoming cliff and said, "f*ck it, I want a second term. Let the next guy deal with it."

compromise -- meaning higher tax rates and more unaffordable spending --

It is as if they are genetically incapable of acknowledging that the Democrat's proposal includes spending cuts.

jayhawk88: Is anyone tracking the right's 5 Stages of Grief progress? Are we still in Denial?

One thing's for sure: they will never, EVER reach Acceptance.

Jiro Dreams Of McRibs: oligarchy

You misspelled "oligarhy".

/pet peave

Nurglitch: kumanoki: Jackson Herring: [i.imgur.com image 240x243]

Please stop this. Don't do this anymore.

It's disrespectful to the atheletes and to children with special needs.

THIS. As a third, it's sinking down to the level of Coulter.

thirded, if we can't get political correctness on the politics tab where can we get it? now excuse me while I make a joke about extreme poverty in Africa. 

chance4510: Uh....wasn't there some other 'tax holiday' that people want to expire?

That's a permanent tax cut that is only temporarily temporary.

The point of representation is to impose your will upon as many people as such people will allow.

This is real similar to; Who cares what the independent pollsters think? We can use our own stats that say this is a close race.

//Reality has little impact on those who rely on their own bias

rumpelstiltskin: It's a message from Paul Revere! It must be important!

It says, "I'm drunk at the tavern, could you pick me up?"

I like reading these stories alongside the ones about how the GOP is moderating and has a grand vision for expanding the party.

At some point they'll have to calculate that abandoning their current base is the only path forward, but they just aren't there yet.

TenJed_77: Too ashamed to print that under his real name? What about cutting the defense budget you idiot.

I particularly like the part where he calls on fellow Republicans to ignore intelligent people. At this point, I can only assume it's a secret Democratic plant because anything else seems like an absurd reality.