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(Boston Herald)   Manager: Line crew 73 worked 17 hours each day last week repairing storm damage. Payroll computer: Inconceivable   (bostonherald.com) divider line 127
    More: Fail, Hurricane Irene, electrical grid  
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16582 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Nov 2012 at 10:31 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-13 09:54:07 AM
www.elevenwarriors.com

"We fixed the glitch."
 
2012-11-13 10:05:05 AM
With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?
 
2012-11-13 10:06:12 AM
This happened when I was working at USPS during the Christmas rush. They offered 'unlimited overtime' to all Contractors. We had people literally sleeping in their cubes. One guy racked up 128 hours of OT in a 2 week period (he worked 208 hours total the in 2 weeks). He (finally) received a paycheck for $3,400 after HR went after him for submitting a fake timecard. His manager cleaned it up pretty quick, so the check was only 2 days late. Not bad for a cube monkey in a call center, eh?
 
2012-11-13 10:26:26 AM
Part of what I do at the small business where I work is payroll. I see time cards every week. 17 hours days are not the norm, but they are certainly seen, especially when a job has a rush order on it, or when on-site work is required. I can only imagine that a hurricane is a similar "one of those times" when no payroll department personnel would at all be shocked to see 17 hour days.
 
2012-11-13 10:34:31 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


It isn't the income, it's the outgo. Poor folks have poor ways, and income level doesn't matter.
 
2012-11-13 10:37:09 AM
LOL, at least the computer knows there are only 16 hours in a day. Cant believe they actually tried pulling a fast one like that. Aren't there laws against taking advantage of companies like that by faking more time in a day then is even possible.. especially during an emergency?
 
2012-11-13 10:37:21 AM
"Be assured that we are making this pay correction process a top priority, and all affected employees will be made whole as soon as possible,"

Shiat happens.
 
2012-11-13 10:37:43 AM
Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.
 
2012-11-13 10:39:11 AM
FTFA "It's not surprising that the company has trouble keeping the lights on when it can't even master a payroll system, said Dan Hurley, president of the Utility Workers Union of America Local 369

Two problems with this comment. The first is that running a payroll system isn't a utility companies main business. I expect them to suck at it. And this is an extraordinary situation that the payroll system was not designed to deal with. The second is that this union rep is basically saying his own people suck at keeping the lights on.

/never had a positive experience dealing with a union rep
 
2012-11-13 10:40:15 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


Why do you hate America?
 
2012-11-13 10:42:06 AM

fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.


My wife's job uses Kronos as well... yeah they just "love" it.

Another insanity: If they are desperately short they can call you in early for your shift and pay time and a half. If they are desperately short and no one wants to come in early they can NOT offer employees time and half to stay on after their shift because the payroll software cant figure out how to do that.
 
2012-11-13 10:42:41 AM

fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.


That's why we still do everything in-house. On an ANCIENT system. It's actually a slightly more modern AS-400 but it's emulating a System/36. We've tested a few suites out but nothing seems to fit, so we're still running and maintaining 2 decade old custom software that began its life two companies ago. Still storing dates in the NON-Y2K compliant 2 digit form.

lol small business world
 
2012-11-13 10:43:00 AM

ArkAngel: $76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


There's a comedian(?) who has a bit about how the average Joe will say he works hard and parties hard. What this means is that he puts in 40 at a job he doesn't like and then goes to Applebee's happy hour and orders a pitcher with a couple friends once a month. Then he goes on to say that that isn't work hard/party hard. Work hard/party hard is the guys who work for months straight on oil rigs doing outrageous hours and walk off the rig with $20-30,000 in their pockets and blow it all in a week. That's what work hard/party hard is.
 
2012-11-13 10:43:06 AM

HST's Dead Carcass: This happened when I was working at USPS during the Christmas rush. They offered 'unlimited overtime' to all Contractors. We had people literally sleeping in their cubes. One guy racked up 128 hours of OT in a 2 week period (he worked 208 hours total the in 2 weeks). He (finally) received a paycheck for $3,400 after HR went after him for submitting a fake timecard. His manager cleaned it up pretty quick, so the check was only 2 days late. Not bad for a cube monkey in a call center, eh?


I'm failing to see a problem with this. The guy submitted a timecard that should of been double checked and the fact that his manager was able to fix it in a reasonable time period says to me the system worked.

/I really doubt it would be HR - most likely accounting - their little brains can't deal with anomalies
 
2012-11-13 10:44:42 AM
does not compute
 
2012-11-13 10:44:46 AM
I bet they're using SAP.

HR software is literally written by monkeys, and the people who administer it are not much better.

That union guy should calm the fark down. They have trouble keeping the lights on? oh gee, I dunno, maybe the farking hurricane had something to do with that
 
2012-11-13 10:44:47 AM

fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.


I see Kronos hasn't gotten any better. Do they still have the Java version checks that require a specific version (usually 2-3 years old) instead of looking for "at least version x"?
 
2012-11-13 10:45:48 AM
FYI - most payroll systems actually have a hard daily cutoff of 16 hours. It is there to block miskeying errors and brazen fraudsters.
 
2012-11-13 10:46:01 AM
Solution: make all payroll software developers, including execs, hourly workers.
 
2012-11-13 10:46:08 AM

gingerjet: FTFA "It's not surprising that the company has trouble keeping the lights on when it can't even master a payroll system, said Dan Hurley, president of the Utility Workers Union of America Local 369

Two problems with this comment. The first is that running a payroll system isn't a utility companies main business. I expect them to suck at it. And this is an extraordinary situation that the payroll system was not designed to deal with. The second is that this union rep is basically saying his own people suck at keeping the lights on.

/never had a positive experience dealing with a union rep


God forbid highly-paid executives should be able to do something like pay their employees.

They've GOT jobs, what more do they want?
 
2012-11-13 10:46:23 AM
Our local radio station had one of the out of state line workers call and complain that they wouldn't "let" him work 24 hrs a day until everything was fixed. Yeah, not only are you going to jeopardize yourself in one of the most dangerous professions in America, you're most likely going to cause a delay due to your gross misunderstanding of human capability. This was 2 days into it, and what truly miffed me was that the radio hosts agreed that it was stupid to not let him work. Not to mention the boat loads of money that worker would of made before he got workman's comp and sued his company for negligence or something.
 
2012-11-13 10:46:57 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


Get back to me when you have calculated the average cost of living for the families, and have reviewed all financial records and burdens of same so you can make that specious statement.
 
2012-11-13 10:49:02 AM
Stupid. Unless the program is so high tech that there aren't 3 error checks in place for the person to use.

At least the payroll company I work for has those checks. It's still dependent on our clients to report the time however.

On the time clock side we get the print-outs from the time clock we have our clients use, those that use a time clock. Then we print out. If it's a time clock issue, the computer itself is making a clocking error.

Conclusion

1) it is a time clock issue

2) It's a human being ordered not to pay some hours issue.
 
2012-11-13 10:49:07 AM

DingleberryMoose: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

It isn't the income, it's the outgo. Poor folks have poor ways, and income level doesn't matter.


I feel like I would have no trouble living comfortably and well within my means with this kind of pay.
 
2012-11-13 10:54:22 AM

fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.


Kronos is the farking devil. The reporting system is attrocious. I get more errors from that thing in any given week than I have seen come from my entire web surfing career at home.
 
2012-11-13 10:55:03 AM
Jeez with screw ups like that you would think they are using ADP. At least once a year they screw up everything and send us double pay. Our managers will get everyone together and tell them to their face not to spend double the pay because monday it will be fixed. We sign a sheet verifying that and some dummy or 2 always spends more then they should then cry the next 2 pay periods when it gets deducted from their pay.
 
2012-11-13 10:55:15 AM

gingerjet: FTFA "It's not surprising that the company has trouble keeping the lights on when it can't even master a payroll system, said Dan Hurley, president of the Utility Workers Union of America Local 369

Two problems with this comment. The first is that running a payroll system isn't a utility companies main business. I expect them to suck at it. And this is an extraordinary situation that the payroll system was not designed to deal with. The second is that this union rep is basically saying his own people suck at keeping the lights on.

/never had a positive experience dealing with a union rep


Aw, give Dan a break. He's the president of people not getting paid; the voice of the righteously pissed. He knows the checks will comes, but he has to represent his people. And they do have a ligitemit
 
2012-11-13 10:56:52 AM

tetsoushima: DingleberryMoose: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

It isn't the income, it's the outgo. Poor folks have poor ways, and income level doesn't matter.

I feel like I would have no trouble living comfortably and well within my means with this kind of pay.


My wife and I make just a few grand more than this per year, about $80k between the two of us. We have two kids with moderate special needs and she has MS. Her car, my car, and our house are all paid in full and we're saving for retirement and vacations and such.

/make a written budget
//stick to it
///spend only real cash, no checks or debit cards or credit cards
////interest is what eats your money
 
2012-11-13 10:57:06 AM

tetsoushima: I feel like I would have no trouble living comfortably and well within my means with this kind of pay.


Me too. But that's because my wife makes 6 figures and I'm a stay-at-home dad.

/American dream
 
2012-11-13 10:59:09 AM
Workflow Management software is never wrong and do not ever argue with itr
 
2012-11-13 11:01:28 AM

Chuck Ruffcorn: gingerjet: FTFA "It's not surprising that the company has trouble keeping the lights on when it can't even master a payroll system, said Dan Hurley, president of the Utility Workers Union of America Local 369

Two problems with this comment. The first is that running a payroll system isn't a utility companies main business. I expect them to suck at it. And this is an extraordinary situation that the payroll system was not designed to deal with. The second is that this union rep is basically saying his own people suck at keeping the lights on.

/never had a positive experience dealing with a union rep

Aw, give Dan a break. He's the president of people not getting paid; the voice of the righteously pissed. He knows the checks will comes, but he has to represent his people. And they do have a ligitemit


...I didn't... farking phone...

Anyhow, paying your employees is like business 101. Dan is saying management sucks at what they do because the farked up the payroll.
 
2012-11-13 11:04:01 AM
25.media.tumblr.com

/surprised it took this long
 
2012-11-13 11:05:48 AM
Had a gig a few years ago as a Contractor working Call Center support. Had some really good managers that treated us well and did a great job of paying attention to whom needed time off and when.

Then we had one that didn't.

As a result I ended up working 27 hours in a row.

First HR sent it back because they thought it was an error. Then it came back a second time because the software couldn't comprehend it. After that I went to the Manager that screwed up and told him if he ever expected me to bail his arse out again like I did and and have done nearly once a week then he needed to head down it and fix it and come back with a check for me.

Twenty minutes later it was all behind us.

I miss that job, but not the Manager. Nice guy but he really couldn't manage people to save his life.
 
2012-11-13 11:06:26 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.
 
2012-11-13 11:06:44 AM
It's a glitch regarding overtime, not base pay. A delay in getting overtime pay is an annoyance. It's not going to put anyone out on the street unless they were already thoroughly farked.

The situation reminds me of a coworker who had a "100% flex time" schedule. He'd basically come and go whenever. He might be in from 6am to 11am, leave for 4 hours, then come back from 3pm to 5pm, then go run an errand and work from 6pm to 8pm. The gal that did payroll hated it because she never knew when to start a day and when to end it. And the guy couldn't remember whether his 3am-6am block from last week was a carryover from the day before or a really early start to a new day.

The obvious solution would have been to switch him to salary but they wouldn't offer enough to compensate for the lost overtime. The company was notoriously bad about low-balling salaries. Any time someone switched, they regretted it.
 
2012-11-13 11:11:23 AM

Krieghund: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.


Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means ftw.
 
2012-11-13 11:14:22 AM

TheSelphie: Budgeting and spending below your means ftw.


THE key to fiscal happiness, regardless of income level.
 
2012-11-13 11:15:44 AM
God forbid you have a math disagreement with someone who thinks they are an accountant and that they can do no wrong with numbers. Run the numbers every which way and they keep showing up the way you expect, but "accountant" who insist the total is Y, will keep insisting the total is Y because that's what their system shows. UGH

//Sorry long day of dealing with a stupid accountant yesterday on my "day off".
 
2012-11-13 11:18:58 AM

gingerjet: /I really doubt it would be HR - most likely accounting - their little brains can't deal with anomalies


The accountants turned him into HR for Fraud. HR did the investigation into the fraud claim. That's why HR went to his boss.

/I hope that cleared it up.
 
2012-11-13 11:21:22 AM

MindStalker: God forbid you have a math disagreement with someone who thinks they are an accountant programmer and that they can do no wrong with numbers.


FIFY

In my experience (38 years in IT), most programmers have severe trouble with "debts = credits" NO exceptions.

No surprise on a payroll system that can't handle more than the legal maximums. Laws aren't very good at dealing with emergencies either.
 
2012-11-13 11:21:58 AM

Chuck Ruffcorn: Anyhow, paying your employees is like business 101. Dan is saying management sucks at what they do because the farked up the payroll.


Not anymore. Since paying someone competent costs a lot more, it's all just outsourced now; the accounts person (not an accountant, rarely even a bookkeeper) just plugs the numbers in and signs off on the result. Their main duty is to harp on anyone spending money for any reason, I think.

jtown: The company was notoriously bad about low-balling salaries. Any time someone switched, they regretted it.


Companies have so little concept of how they create burnouts that drag down profits and lose people they invested tons of time and money in.
 
2012-11-13 11:22:28 AM
4500 dollars of overtime a week we will get back to you on that take a number you are a high priority please hold.
 
2012-11-13 11:23:32 AM

Krieghund: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.


Also if he personally has to pay union dues.
 
2012-11-13 11:26:26 AM
From the story comments: Easy for you to say...when there are bills to pay and your check DOES NOT get deposited, you can't pay the bills. Who cares how much they made during the storm some of them ARE living paycheck to paycheck..it's the new America. Or haven't you heard???

First, they are getting their standard wage, the computer is choking on the extra hours. Secondly, "new America" or not, If you burn through that much money and are living paycheck to paycheck, you are doing it wrong. Get some financial counseling. I realize housing costs a lot out there but still.
 
2012-11-13 11:29:23 AM

DingleberryMoose: My wife and I make just a few grand more than this per year, about $80k between the two of us. We have two kids with moderate special needs and she has MS. Her car, my car, and our house are all paid in full and we're saving for retirement and vacations and such.

/make a written budget
//stick to it
///spend only real cash, no checks or debit cards or credit cards
////interest is what eats your money


Location: West Texas

My wife and I make a little more than this, have a small house, 1 kid, and 1 car, no debt other than the mortgage and are wondering if we'll ever be able to afford a 2nd kid. Location: Philly Suburbs.

Cost of living is a biatch.
 
2012-11-13 11:30:28 AM

TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means ftw.


Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.
 
2012-11-13 11:34:38 AM

Krieghund: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.


Those Boston Starbucks employees must be making way more than the midwest locations.
 
2012-11-13 11:34:55 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


Are they actually working 40 hour weeks? Is there always 40 hours of repair work that needs to be done in a week? I figure if something isn't busted, they don't get called out, so they don't get put on the clock.
 
2012-11-13 11:35:27 AM

Krieghund: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.


76k will get you along just fine in Boston. My fiance and I got by comfortably on 60k. And if you live outside the city, you shouldn't have any trouble getting by on 76k unless you've got expensive hobbies/4+ kids/crazy medical bills.
 
2012-11-13 11:35:43 AM

DingleberryMoose: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

It isn't the income, it's the outgo. Poor folks have poor ways, and income level doesn't matter.


I was watching a news report about a NY family who lost their home during the storm. Mom and Dad, and three sons (all in their 30s) living in one home. All four men were full-time FDNY.

Granted, I sympathize with the loss of their home. That's what insurance is for. But my mind reeled at having FOUR full-time salaries going into one modest Brooklyn home, and I could only wonder where their paychecks went.
 
2012-11-13 11:37:59 AM

MugzyBrown: Cost of living is a biatch.


That's true, and it makes budgeting that much more important. An idea which the remainder of your comment leads me to believe you understand.
 
2012-11-13 11:41:51 AM

nekom: fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.

That's why we still do everything in-house. On an ANCIENT system. It's actually a slightly more modern AS-400 but it's emulating a System/36. We've tested a few suites out but nothing seems to fit, so we're still running and maintaining 2 decade old custom software that began its life two companies ago. Still storing dates in the NON-Y2K compliant 2 digit form.

lol small business world


Fizpez: My wife's job uses Kronos as well... yeah they just "love" it.

Another insanity: If they are desperately short they can call you in early for your shift and pay time and a half. If they are desperately short and no one wants to come in early they can NOT offer employees time and half to stay on after their shift because the payroll software cant figure out how to do that.


Moral: Don't buy out of the box business software if it doesn't fit your needs. They don't modify the code for you, only allow configuration to best match your business practices, but not every scenario can be conceivably covered(believe me, I work in public safety staffing and have in-depth knowledge of staffing and payroll softwares and their capabilities in comparison to actual staffing practices). Complaining that it doesn't 100% fit your business is ridiculous. Write your own or pay the massive amounts for them to build a one-off for you, or change your business practices.
 
2012-11-13 11:44:24 AM

Kraftwerk Orange: I was watching a news report about a NY family who lost their home during the storm. Mom and Dad, and three sons (all in their 30s) living in one home. All four men were full-time FDNY.

Granted, I sympathize with the loss of their home. That's what insurance is for. But my mind reeled at having FOUR full-time salaries going into one modest Brooklyn home, and I could only wonder where their paychecks went.


since they're first reponders, I'll answer this.

The three Bs

Booze, Broads, and Blow
 
2012-11-13 11:45:26 AM

Matthew Keene: Kraftwerk Orange: I was watching a news report about a NY family who lost their home during the storm. Mom and Dad, and three sons (all in their 30s) living in one home. All four men were full-time FDNY.

Granted, I sympathize with the loss of their home. That's what insurance is for. But my mind reeled at having FOUR full-time salaries going into one modest Brooklyn home, and I could only wonder where their paychecks went.

since they're first reponders, I'll answer this.

The three Bs

Booze, Broads, and Blow


I was thinking another B as well: Boats.
 
2012-11-13 11:49:00 AM

Kit Fister: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

Get back to me when you have calculated the average cost of living for the families, and have reviewed all financial records and burdens of same so you can make that specious statement.


Specious?
You're farking kidding me, right?
Here in reality, half of US workers earn less than $35K per year.

There is no relationship between a lineman's ability to assume debt and/or living expenses and his income.
That's like seeing a grotesquely obese person and saying his calorie requirements are dependent on how much he needs to eat. Don't they teach logic in schools any more?

A wage of $38 per hour puts these lineman in the upper 29 percent US incomes. And that's individual, not household. That's about $51,000 per year after taxes.
With a BASE wage like that, it's hard times for those guys, for sure.

/And what about 80 hours of overtime on top of that base wage? That would come to about $3,009 per WEEK after taxes. Must be nice, that's all I can say.
 
2012-11-13 11:49:11 AM

Felgraf: Are they actually working 40 hour weeks? Is there always 40 hours of repair work that needs to be done in a week? I figure if something isn't busted, they don't get called out, so they don't get put on the clock.


They are in a union. yes, they work 40 hour weeks, minimum, and they get overtime. I know linemen that clear 100k a year because of the OT. I'm not saying these guys do, but, they make more than 76k.

The "paycheck to paycheck" line is being overreacted to, here on Fark. It is not necessarily true that any of these guys actually do that. The union rep, however, wants to suggest to the public that the evil and also feckless management is causing these heroic men to not be able to feed their children. Don't fall for it.
 
2012-11-13 11:52:25 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


Sometimes linemen are called upon to travel on their dime to distant jobsites, where they arrange for their own food and lodging. They are partially reimbursed most of the time. They also purchase their own work clothes and personal tools. Also sometimes people have families to support.
 
2012-11-13 11:52:50 AM

hockeyfarker: The union rep, however, wants to suggest to the public that the evil and also feckless management is causing these heroic men to not be able to feed their children. Don't fall for it.


This.
It sucks to not get paid what's due. And these guys work harder than most of us could imagine to keep us living in post-1907 living conditions and they risk their lives to do it. Far as I'm concerned, these folks deserve what they get for the value they bring.
But they're not hurting.
 
2012-11-13 11:54:51 AM

ThighsofGlory: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

Sometimes linemen are called upon to travel on their dime to distant jobsites, where they arrange for their own food and lodging. They are partially reimbursed most of the time. They also purchase their own work clothes and personal tools. Also sometimes people have families to support.


And those are called write-offs.
 
2012-11-13 12:02:13 PM
I covered our company's chemist during his vacation, along with my own shift afterward. I had 6 hours between shifts for two weeks. The company's vice president gave me my paycheck, personally. He then told me, he had to intervene with payroll to get it done. They figured out how many hours I had off a day, and had major issues with it . He told me, I would never be asked to do that again, and thanked me for my hardwork. He also told me they split the OT hours up, between two checks because the taxes would have robbed me of all the money I had earned.

I lost one full week of regular pay to taxes. From that point on, I never worked more than 20 hours of OT, because at some point you're working for free. I've done 28 hours straight at one job, and 38 hours straight while formatting a slide/notepage presentation to be presented to M.S.

Don't question the hardworkers, and give them their pay. You'll need them again.
 
2012-11-13 12:11:28 PM

DingleberryMoose: ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?

It isn't the income, it's the outgo. Poor folks have poor ways, and income level doesn't matter.


How do you know they work full time year round? Maybe they average 20 hours/week? That would not be out of the ordinary.
 
2012-11-13 12:15:51 PM

missiv: I lost one full week of regular pay to taxes. From that point on, I never worked more than 20 hours of OT, because at some point you're working for free. I've done 28 hours straight at one job, and 38 hours straight while formatting a slide/notepage presentation to be presented to M.S.


At least if you get overtaxed like crazy for a couple weeks because of OT you'll get most of it back on your tax return, when it turns out you weren't actually making tons of money by working 6000 hours that year.
 
2012-11-13 12:18:50 PM

jjwars1: How do you know they work full time year round? Maybe they average 20 hours/week? That would not be out of the ordinary.


If so, then they just got paid for 40 hours of base pay, which is twice what they normally see. If they're normally living paycheck to paycheck at 20 hours then this is already a windfall.
 
2012-11-13 12:22:23 PM

hockeyfarker: I bet they're using SAP.

HR software is literally written by monkeys, and the people who administer it are not much better.


I'll take anything over shiftplanning and their continual 'upgrades' that break crap. Watched as our timecards magically began rounding to :15, watched as the system went down (can't punch in 'cause it's in the cloud!) with no warning, started begging us to add 'shifts' to our cards, just overall turned to crap.

//csb
 
2012-11-13 12:27:24 PM

bhcompy: or change your business practices.


That was the real deal breaker for us. The off the shelf system we had would have worked IF people weren't absolutely unwilling to change how things go here. Which is fine by me, as my job security is about as high as I can imagine it being as long as I'm the only one able to care for our lumbering dinosaur of a mainframe. Good luck finding anyone else who knows System/36 basic, or even how to run the thing.
 
2012-11-13 12:32:02 PM
With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

so the average line worker makes twice what the average worker makes in America, and still living paycheck to paycheck! Damn! no wonder the US is farked up!
 
2012-11-13 12:32:46 PM
Let me guess... timetracking powered by....

www.health2con.com

I have it on good authority the "S" stands for "Schadenfreude". Germans understand torture all too well.
 
2012-11-13 12:34:36 PM
Something tells me that if the payroll system screwed up and forgot to pay the top executives their lavish bonuses, it would have been fixed overnight and someone would have gotten fired.
 
2012-11-13 12:51:14 PM
$38/hour puts you well into the top 20%. If you're living check to check, ur dum.
 
2012-11-13 12:52:27 PM
Do all these people making $38 an hour actually work 40 hours a week, or is it an arrangement along the lines of "part time most weeks, full time + overtime in weeks where there's some major event"?
 
2012-11-13 12:57:10 PM
i felt sorry too....till paycheck to paycheck thing

also not into unions
 
2012-11-13 12:59:15 PM
The board of directors released another statement: "They can have that OT money when they pry it out of our cold, dead fingers."
 
2012-11-13 01:02:24 PM
I also would like to guess SAP. Though be fair, almost all payroll software sucks.
 
2012-11-13 01:16:11 PM

jjwars1: How do you know they work full time year round? Maybe they average 20 hours/week? That would not be out of the ordinary.


If that's the case, utility work up there is very different from utility work down here.
 
2012-11-13 01:18:02 PM

FitzShivering: I also would like to guess SAP. Though be fair, almost all payroll software sucks.


People complain about the software when really it is the people using it. When it's configured they set up all kinds of business rules to setup conditions where OT kicks in, maximum working hours, etc. Then they go and throw all of those out the window a few times every year and get pissed off because the system gives them trouble when they do it. Business software doesn't like arbitrary, it likes rules, that's how it is supposed to save you time. When you spend a bunch of time overriding your own rules and creating arbitrary, your software is going to give you fits.
 
2012-11-13 01:36:44 PM
A lot of people are upset y'all just need chill out andrelax to some good lineman music
 
2012-11-13 01:39:53 PM

bhcompy: FitzShivering: I also would like to guess SAP. Though be fair, almost all payroll software sucks.

People complain about the software when really it is the people using it. When it's configured they set up all kinds of business rules to setup conditions where OT kicks in, maximum working hours, etc. Then they go and throw all of those out the window a few times every year and get pissed off because the system gives them trouble when they do it. Business software doesn't like arbitrary, it likes rules, that's how it is supposed to save you time. When you spend a bunch of time overriding your own rules and creating arbitrary, your software is going to give you fits.


I've spent a lot of time cleaning up after people who say things like you do. The fact is that businesses, even large ones, tend to be arbitrary, and have a need to violate their "rules" on a regular basis. When you set up a system on fixed rules that don't meet all business conditions, you've set up a failed system, and it isn't the "people using it."
 
2012-11-13 01:49:46 PM
I used to direct a union workforce and their rules were:
First 7.5 hrs = straight time
Next 4.0 hrs = time and one half
Anything after the 3.7 hrs OT = double time
Pay rate was $34.50 / hr.
Overtime was mandatory and most of the folks made 120K + a year.
And everyone of them lived up to their last dime.
We used SAP and it sucked.
 
2012-11-13 02:25:17 PM

fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.


I have done payroll on Kronos. It used to take my entire Wednesdays to make sure everything was accurate.
 
2012-11-13 02:35:17 PM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


If it's a family of 4 and he's the sole bread winner because mom stays at home with the kids? Totally believable.
 
2012-11-13 02:47:05 PM

jtown: It's a glitch regarding overtime, not base pay. A delay in getting overtime pay is an annoyance. It's not going to put anyone out on the street unless they were already thoroughly farked.

The situation reminds me of a coworker who had a "100% flex time" schedule. He'd basically come and go whenever. He might be in from 6am to 11am, leave for 4 hours, then come back from 3pm to 5pm, then go run an errand and work from 6pm to 8pm. The gal that did payroll hated it because she never knew when to start a day and when to end it. And the guy couldn't remember whether his 3am-6am block from last week was a carryover from the day before or a really early start to a new day.

The obvious solution would have been to switch him to salary but they wouldn't offer enough to compensate for the lost overtime. The company was notoriously bad about low-balling salaries. Any time someone switched, they regretted it.


No, the obvious solution was to put him and every other salary guy on data entry system. Most are done with swipe cards now a days. You swipe in with beginning of tour, swipe out for lunch, swipe in from lunch and swipe out with end of tour.
 
2012-11-13 02:54:18 PM

FitzShivering:

I've spent a lot of time cleaning up after people who say things like you do. The fact is that businesses, even large ones, tend to be arbitrary, and have a need to violate their "rules" on a regular basis. When you set up a system on fixed rules that don't meet all business conditions, you've set up a failed system, and it isn't the "people using it."


that is a problem with the people that set the business rules In the first place, then, and that is done by the purchasing party either directly(direct configuration) or by proxy(filling in questionnaires and the provider doing the configuration). From experience, the problem almost invariably is "oh we forgot about x scenario when the scoping was done". I'm involved in a scenario right now where it was established firmly that all accrual grants were done upfront at fiscal new year, except now they forgot to mention that people that have anniversary dates that grant them higher accrual ratios get the bonus benefit granted on their anniversary date. The system they're using wasn't implemented in such a fashion and requires a great deal of work to reconfigure to do that in an automated fashion. Would have not been a problem from a time or cost perspective if it was mentioned up front, and it's no fault of the software vendor despite the customer being unhappy with the software as a result
 
2012-11-13 03:25:51 PM

goobergal: fuligin: Oh man, does payroll software suck ass. Our company recently hired on with a system called "Kronos" and basically, it's like they let a semi-sentient AI take over for scheduling, previously done well by a very competent human being. They were even told, "this will not work for some of your employees, due to their scheduling constraints". They went with it anyway.

I have done payroll on Kronos. It used to take my entire Wednesdays to make sure everything was accurate.


hmm...nice to see it's not just us that hates that God awful software.

Anyone have any idea why their company went with Kronos? I'm fairly certain mine went with it on a recommendation from the idiot that runs the PeopleSoft application.

As crappy as it is, I have to wonder if they are paying people under the table to take it.
 
2012-11-13 03:36:08 PM

Slaves2Darkness: jtown: It's a glitch regarding overtime, not base pay. A delay in getting overtime pay is an annoyance. It's not going to put anyone out on the street unless they were already thoroughly farked.

The situation reminds me of a coworker who had a "100% flex time" schedule. He'd basically come and go whenever. He might be in from 6am to 11am, leave for 4 hours, then come back from 3pm to 5pm, then go run an errand and work from 6pm to 8pm. The gal that did payroll hated it because she never knew when to start a day and when to end it. And the guy couldn't remember whether his 3am-6am block from last week was a carryover from the day before or a really early start to a new day.

The obvious solution would have been to switch him to salary but they wouldn't offer enough to compensate for the lost overtime. The company was notoriously bad about low-balling salaries. Any time someone switched, they regretted it.

No, the obvious solution was to put him and every other salary guy on data entry system. Most are done with swipe cards now a days. You swipe in with beginning of tour, swipe out for lunch, swipe in from lunch and swipe out with end of tour.


You missed the point. If he worked from 11am to 5pm then 9pm 11pm then 1am to 4am then 12pm to 6pm, where does one day end and the next day start? Seems pretty clear to a human that day 1 is 11am to 4am and day 2 is 12pm to 6pm. So day 1 is 11 hours. 8 hours at RT, 2 hours at OT, 1 hour at DT and day 2 is 6 hours of RT. But, if you call midnight the cutoff, day 1 drops to 8 hours and day 2 gets bumped to 9 hours.

Depending on how the days are sliced, he could lose out on 1 hour of overtime and 1 hour of doubletime. (We got paid double after 2 hours of OT.)
 
2012-11-13 03:58:43 PM
4.bp.blogspot.com

Pay hem hees money
 
2012-11-13 04:16:32 PM

BarkingUnicorn: Solution: make all payroll software developers, including execs, hourly workers.


I'm sure that'll get the creme of the crop!
 
2012-11-13 04:19:11 PM

Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.


$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.
 
2012-11-13 05:03:11 PM

nekom: Still storing dates in the NON-Y2K compliant 2 digit form.


I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but that's going to be a HUGE problem for you in 988 years. Just sayin'...
 
2012-11-13 05:03:35 PM

missiv: I covered our company's chemist during his vacation, along with my own shift afterward. I had 6 hours between shifts for two weeks. The company's vice president gave me my paycheck, personally. He then told me, he had to intervene with payroll to get it done. They figured out how many hours I had off a day, and had major issues with it . He told me, I would never be asked to do that again, and thanked me for my hardwork. He also told me they split the OT hours up, between two checks because the taxes would have robbed me of all the money I had earned.

I lost one full week of regular pay to taxes. From that point on, I never worked more than 20 hours of OT, because at some point you're working for free. I've done 28 hours straight at one job, and 38 hours straight while formatting a slide/notepage presentation to be presented to M.S.

Don't question the hardworkers, and give them their pay. You'll need them again.


IANATP but I'm pretty sure it's impossible to end up working for free because of tax. Perhaps your company is stupid about how much they withhold, but at the end of the year you would never end up owing more in tax than you had grossed.

People say stuff like this sometimes and I really burns my bacon. The US enjoys one of the lowest tax rates in the first world and yet still everyone thinks they're paying obscene amounts of tax. Perhaps this is why you're so deeply in debt.
 
2012-11-13 05:15:24 PM
Overtime pay? WTF is that?. Work for salary and get farked out of it all the time. Sure I might get some comp time the next week, but would much much rather get the time and a half.
I have zero incentive to do anything above and beyond the bare minimum required out of me.
 
2012-11-13 05:36:18 PM

Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.


God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.
 
2012-11-13 06:32:37 PM

bhcompy: Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.

God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.


Given that it's more than twice what the Commonwealth of Massachusetts says is a minimum wage for a human to live off of, even if they work 80 hours 52 weeks a year ($8*80*52=$33,280), I'm not buying the poverty plea.
 
2012-11-13 06:51:14 PM
There is more information that this article is not telling you....

The Union agreement states that union employees can only work 16 hours per day max even in emergencies. Therefore the utilities payroll computer system was set to kickback any timesheet that had more than 16 hours per day on it for union employees.

The 16 hour rule was waived for the Sandy emergency; however the payroll computer was still rejecting overtime days that were over 16 hours. This is just a minor technology glitch that I am sure will be resolved quickly and the linemen will be appropriately compensated for their long hours.
 
2012-11-13 07:10:33 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: bhcompy: Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.

God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.

Given that it's more than twice what the Commonwealth of Massachusetts says is a minimum wage for a human to live off of, even if they work 80 hours 52 weeks a year ($8*80*52=$33,280), I'm not buying the poverty plea.


Poverty is different than paycheck-to-paycheck. If these guys' budgets are built around the idea of a paycheck every two weeks and then a paycheck doesn't come, they might be a little bit farked that week. Yeah, they hopefully have savings for something like this, but they might not. One paycheck might be for monthly expenses and the other for mortgage. Suddenly the mortgage payment isn't in your account and you have to scramble to make sure the check doesn't bounce. And if you're making the money while mom stays home with three kids, $38/hr still isn't living large.

It's not poverty, but it's not necessarily without problems if a check doesn't come through.
 
2012-11-13 07:30:29 PM

I_Hate_Iowa: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: bhcompy: Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.

God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.

Given that it's more than twice what the Commonwealth of Massachusetts says is a minimum wage for a human to live off of, even if they work 80 hours 52 weeks a year ($8*80*52=$33,280), I'm not buying the poverty plea.

Poverty is different than paycheck-to-paycheck. If these guys' budgets are built around the idea of a paycheck every two weeks and then a paycheck doesn't come, they might be a little bit farked that week. Yeah, they hopefully have savings for something like this, but they might not. One paycheck might be for monthly expenses and the other for mortgage. Suddenly the mortgage payment isn't in your account and you have to scramble to make sure the check doesn't bounce. And if you're making the money while mom stays home with three kids, $38/hr ...


TFA says it's just the OT that got held up, not the base pay they'd hopefully be budgeting for.
 
2012-11-13 07:33:27 PM

I_Hate_Iowa: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: bhcompy: Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.

God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.

Given that it's more than twice what the Commonwealth of Massachusetts says is a minimum wage for a human to live off of, even if they work 80 hours 52 weeks a year ($8*80*52=$33,280), I'm not buying the poverty plea.

Poverty is different than paycheck-to-paycheck. If these guys' budgets are built around the idea of a paycheck every two weeks and then a paycheck doesn't come, they might be a little bit farked that week. Yeah, they hopefully have savings for something like this, but they might not. One paycheck might be for monthly expenses and the other for mortgage. Suddenly the mortgage payment isn't in your account and you have to scramble to make sure the check doesn't bounce. And if you're making the money while mom stays home with three kids, $38/hr ...


The point is, people who don't know how to handle their money should work for free.
 
2012-11-13 07:54:23 PM
All I'm gonna say is if I'm owed money for doing my job, I want to be paid for the work. After all, I did the job, didn't I?
 
2012-11-13 09:14:33 PM
Hurley said union officials plan to contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office today to gauge whether "there's anything we can do."
Hurley said union officials plan to contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office today
contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office
Attorney General Martha Coakley


How can no one have noticed this... Is this the Martha Coakley who cost the Dems even the possibility of 60 votes by losing to Scott Brown?
 
2012-11-13 09:25:04 PM
Ha, reminds me of a former job. I put in big hours to push through a project my boss said we had to complete (and we had to, it was ship that was leaving). I worked something like 240 hours over two weeks and got it done. Then on payday, there was a big meeting where we were all told that the company was having financial trouble. I look at my pay stub and only got paid for 60 hours for 2 weeks! Not only did I get stiffed for my OT, but I didn't even get paid straight time. I think I yelled "Are you f*ing kidding me?" in the middle of the meeting and stomped out (I was so angry it's kind of blurry). My boss came up to my office and said it was an honest mistake, which I replied "Bullshiat!" On top of that, my expenses check for that job didn't come until I threatened to go to the Labor Department and also file a suit in small claims (our state allows something like triple damages for cases like that).

Yeah, as soon as I found something else I was out of there.

/csb
 
2012-11-13 09:31:48 PM

nekom: That's why we still do everything in-house. On an ANCIENT system. It's actually a slightly more modern AS-400 but it's emulating a System/36.


Web based enterprise tools suck. Bring back the green screens.
 
2012-11-13 09:35:58 PM

erik-k: Hurley said union officials plan to contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office today to gauge whether "there's anything we can do."
Hurley said union officials plan to contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office today
contact Attorney General Martha Coakley's office
Attorney General Martha Coakley

How can no one have noticed this... Is this the Martha Coakley who cost the Dems even the possibility of 60 votes by losing to Scott Brown?


Yep. One of the Dem political machine pols, she thought she could just coast into the job without campaigning.
 
2012-11-13 10:02:11 PM
I've noticed over a long lifetime that about 98% of mistakes with money favor the other guy.

I'm either in the eye of one heck of a statistical anomaly vortex, or 96% of money mistakes aren't mistakes.

/No, they don't have the money on hand to pay you schmoes that kind of overtime, and they won't two weeks from now either.
 
2012-11-13 10:04:58 PM

jjwars1: How do you know they work full time year round? Maybe they average 20 hours/week? That would not be out of the ordinary.


It SERIOUSLY TOOK THIS LONG TO GET TO THIS POINT? Jesus Christ!

I don't know if these people do or not, but that really didn't cross ANYBODY'S mind?
 
2012-11-13 10:17:03 PM
They added one of these electronic time management systems to my office, and it is incredibly uncompromising and unintuitive. They come to me once a month or so and ask me to lie about my exact hours, so it makes the books balance correctly, because apparently they can't be bothered to fix the software, can't afford to, don't know how to. The software was built for cube drones who never vary their 8 hour routine except to maybe shift the lunch by an hour once in a while. It wasn't made for field ops men and our crazy schedules. But they insist it is I that must conform reality to their software.
 
2012-11-13 10:19:09 PM

bhcompy: FitzShivering: I also would like to guess SAP. Though be fair, almost all payroll software sucks.

People complain about the software when really it is the people using it. When it's configured they set up all kinds of business rules to setup conditions where OT kicks in, maximum working hours, etc. Then they go and throw all of those out the window a few times every year and get pissed off because the system gives them trouble when they do it. Business software doesn't like arbitrary, it likes rules, that's how it is supposed to save you time. When you spend a bunch of time overriding your own rules and creating arbitrary, your software is going to give you fits.


This. Our state agency uses SAP. The HR folks lack the ability to do simple tasks. Our fiscal chief can't even use excel. Functions, they do what? Pivot tables, huh???
Scary that these idiots have the power that they do.
 
2012-11-13 10:28:23 PM
Hey that's like at my work... After the hurricane they told all the salaried people "Yeah we were closed, so instead of your normal pay we'll give you $50. Don't say we never think of you."
 
2012-11-14 04:38:01 AM

missiv: I covered our company's chemist during his vacation, along with my own shift afterward. I had 6 hours between shifts for two weeks. The company's vice president gave me my paycheck, personally. He then told me, he had to intervene with payroll to get it done. They figured out how many hours I had off a day, and had major issues with it . He told me, I would never be asked to do that again, and thanked me for my hardwork. He also told me they split the OT hours up, between two checks because the taxes would have robbed me of all the money I had earned.

I lost one full week of regular pay to taxes. From that point on, I never worked more than 20 hours of OT, because at some point you're working for free. I've done 28 hours straight at one job, and 38 hours straight while formatting a slide/notepage presentation to be presented to M.S.

Don't question the hardworkers, and give them their pay. You'll need them again.


First, it's illegal for an employer to hold over your pay. Secondly they sound like they were bullshiatting you because they didn't have the money to pay right away. Third, the highest tax bracket is 35% so even if the accounting somehow pushed you into a different bracket, you'd still be getting 50% or more what you earned. But I didn't think they calculated withholding that way. I thought they went by your w4 exemptions.
 
2012-11-14 07:28:41 AM
FTA "Be assured that we are making this pay correction process a top priority, and all affected employees will be made whole as soon as possible," the National Grid statement reads. "We anticipated that the implementation that had been in the works for more than a year would not go without its challenges. What we couldn't forecast is that our launch date would coincide with a storm of equal magnitude and challenges."

Wait, wait, sure you cant ANTICIPATE the implementation (apparently of equal size to superstorm sandy) would coincide with a giant storm and unusually high levels of payroll work, but you can sure as hell postpone the damn implementation. I work with a cell phone company that cancelled a world wide update to a small part of an ordering software because the storm MIGHT cause damage.

Basic change management. 95+ percent of IT departments would have gotten this one right. Frankly, its unforgivable. Unless they HAD to be off the old system the same day the new one was scheduled in, which again, would be unforgivable.
 
2012-11-14 07:37:57 AM

TiMthisIS: missiv: I covered our company's chemist during his vacation, along with my own shift afterward. I had 6 hours between shifts for two weeks. The company's vice president gave me my paycheck, personally. He then told me, he had to intervene with payroll to get it done. They figured out how many hours I had off a day, and had major issues with it . He told me, I would never be asked to do that again, and thanked me for my hardwork. He also told me they split the OT hours up, between two checks because the taxes would have robbed me of all the money I had earned.

I lost one full week of regular pay to taxes. From that point on, I never worked more than 20 hours of OT, because at some point you're working for free. I've done 28 hours straight at one job, and 38 hours straight while formatting a slide/notepage presentation to be presented to M.S.

Don't question the hardworkers, and give them their pay. You'll need them again.

First, it's illegal for an employer to hold over your pay. Secondly they sound like they were bullshiatting you because they didn't have the money to pay right away. Third, the highest tax bracket is 35% so even if the accounting somehow pushed you into a different bracket, you'd still be getting 50% or more what you earned. But I didn't think they calculated withholding that way. I thought they went by your w4 exemptions.


38 hours to format a slide presentation? Were you doing stop motion animation with slides or something?
 
2012-11-14 07:39:34 AM
"look, I can make the footer dance!"
 
2012-11-14 08:11:25 AM

ArkAngel: With the average line worker making $38 per hour - and 11/2 times that in overtime - many live paycheck to paycheck, Hurley said, meaning any delay in the hard-earned cash hits families hard.

$76,000 a year before overtime and they're living paycheck to paycheck?


Well like 20% is extorted by the mob, err "union"

And don't forget three car notes, vacations and at least one morgage
 
2012-11-14 08:28:50 AM

gblive: There is more information that this article is not telling you....

The Union agreement states that union employees can only work 16 hours per day max even in emergencies. Therefore the utilities payroll computer system was set to kickback any timesheet that had more than 16 hours per day on it for union employees.

The 16 hour rule was waived for the Sandy emergency; however the payroll computer was still rejecting overtime days that were over 16 hours. This is just a minor technology glitch that I am sure will be resolved quickly and the linemen will be appropriately compensated for their long hours.


It wasn't a *TECHNOLOGY* glitch: The software just did what it was told to do. It was a glitch in the people running the software, in that they didn't think to change that condition in the software when they waived the rule.
 
2012-11-14 09:21:24 AM
If you make 75k a year and you live paycheck to paycheck, I have a really hard time feeling any sort of sympathy for you, considering I make about 1/4th of that and don't have major reasons to complain.
 
2012-11-14 10:38:49 AM

nekom: lol small business world


I'm a Software Engineer, and I make my living building things to replace older things like that. But I absolutely hate the mindset that just because something is old, that it needs replacing. Missing a feature you need? That's a reason for upgrade or replacement. But just old? And working? Do NOT touch it. You have that rarest of rare things-- *finished* software.
 
2012-11-14 10:47:10 AM

raygundan: nekom: lol small business world

I'm a Software Engineer, and I make my living building things to replace older things like that. But I absolutely hate the mindset that just because something is old, that it needs replacing. Missing a feature you need? That's a reason for upgrade or replacement. But just old? And working? Do NOT touch it. You have that rarest of rare things-- *finished* software.


As a Programmer/Analyst, I heartily agree.
 
2012-11-14 10:58:12 AM

raygundan: nekom: lol small business world

I'm a Software Engineer, and I make my living building things to replace older things like that. But I absolutely hate the mindset that just because something is old, that it needs replacing. Missing a feature you need? That's a reason for upgrade or replacement. But just old? And working? Do NOT touch it. You have that rarest of rare things-- *finished* software.


Agree, with one caveat: can they survive a system failure? If they're relying on old software or hardware that can't be easily obtained anymore then it's time to move to a more supportable system.
 
2012-11-14 12:25:24 PM

un4gvn666: If you make 75k a year and you live paycheck to paycheck, I have a really hard time feeling any sort of sympathy for you, considering I make about 1/4th of that and don't have major reasons to complain.


Amen to that.
 
2012-11-14 01:19:37 PM

Fish in a Barrel: raygundan: nekom: lol small business world

I'm a Software Engineer, and I make my living building things to replace older things like that. But I absolutely hate the mindset that just because something is old, that it needs replacing. Missing a feature you need? That's a reason for upgrade or replacement. But just old? And working? Do NOT touch it. You have that rarest of rare things-- *finished* software.

Agree, with one caveat: can they survive a system failure? If they're relying on old software or hardware that can't be easily obtained anymore then it's time to move to a more supportable system.


Old software can run on new hardware.

Don't forget, you were responding to a *SOFTWARE* engineer, talking about *SOFTWARE*. Sometimes, we confuse software and hardware, because often at the retail level we just toss the old software with the old hardware.

Right now I'm looking at the guts of a 20+ year old COBOL program that is maintained with just minimal occasional tweaks because it works. It's been compiled on a succession of servers, and at least 3 different operating systems I'm aware of.
 
2012-11-14 01:52:53 PM

dittybopper: Fish in a Barrel: raygundan: nekom: lol small business world

I'm a Software Engineer, and I make my living building things to replace older things like that. But I absolutely hate the mindset that just because something is old, that it needs replacing. Missing a feature you need? That's a reason for upgrade or replacement. But just old? And working? Do NOT touch it. You have that rarest of rare things-- *finished* software.

Agree, with one caveat: can they survive a system failure? If they're relying on old software or hardware that can't be easily obtained anymore then it's time to move to a more supportable system.

Old software can run on new hardware.

Don't forget, you were responding to a *SOFTWARE* engineer, talking about *SOFTWARE*. Sometimes, we confuse software and hardware, because often at the retail level we just toss the old software with the old hardware.

Right now I'm looking at the guts of a 20+ year old COBOL program that is maintained with just minimal occasional tweaks because it works. It's been compiled on a succession of servers, and at least 3 different operating systems I'm aware of.


Yeah, I'm a software engineer. I'm aware of the difference between software and hardware. :)

I was referring to instances where the system relies on (for instance) an ancient OS with long-lost or moldy installation disks, or a proprietary ISA card. Sometimes old software just doesn't work on newer platforms, and if you don't have the code there's nothing you can do about that. We see this a lot in my industry. You'll have factories running on systems that are one power surge away from unmitigated disaster.
 
2012-11-14 02:09:28 PM
This makes me laugh. At work, my job got switched to a different department where I'm the only one in it. Im just a peon (union) so I cant punch in whenever I want, I go by when I'm scheduled.

Funny thing is, since I'm my own department, everyone forgets about me. So I'm never in payroll to begin with so I can't punch in out unless a manager helps me (or I wrote it in a paper log). Plus I've missed lunch and other breaks because they've turned off their walking talkies and don't get my messages.

Yeah will be bringing this up to my boss before work today.
 
2012-11-14 02:45:36 PM
Just for fun, I got asked the software equivalent of adding a "power on" LED to a table lamp today.

I got a kick out of it.
 
2012-11-15 12:22:43 AM

gingerjet: FTFA "It's not surprising that the company has trouble keeping the lights on when it can't even master a payroll system, said Dan Hurley, president of the Utility Workers Union of America Local 369

Two problems with this comment. The first is that running a payroll system isn't a utility companies main business. I expect them to suck at it. And this is an extraordinary situation that the payroll system was not designed to deal with. The second is that this union rep is basically saying his own people suck at keeping the lights on.

/never had a positive experience dealing with a union rep


Anti union talk is anti fark sir.

But really union reps suck, most union workers are fine but just short sighted and think they give a shiat about the workers at all. The union leaders are just as bad as the companies they are protecting the workers from while making a shiat ton of cash for themselves.
 
2012-11-15 03:53:29 AM
/works in telecom
//in the northeast
///getting paid tomorrow for Sandy outage restoration work
////check is going to be double what I am used to.

Giggity.
 
2012-11-15 04:01:06 AM

I_Hate_Iowa: One paycheck might be for monthly expenses and the other for mortgage. Suddenly the mortgage payment isn't in your account and you have to scramble to make sure the check doesn't bounce. And if you're making the money while mom stays home with three kids, $38/hr still isn't living large.


$38/hr isn't living large with 3 kids, or 5 kids, or 10 kids. Thing is kids are expenses and if you enjoy having them, it is likely to require more money to take care of them. i dont grudge people for having kids but I dont have sympathy for someone who has 4 of them and then claims to live paycheck to paycheck on a fat salary while claiming never to have money.

Responsible people who have a few months worth of cash on hand for emergencies dont even bat an eyelash at the prospect of having to wait 2-3 days for payroll to FedEx a payroll correction.
 
2012-11-15 10:52:39 AM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: jjwars1: How do you know they work full time year round? Maybe they average 20 hours/week? That would not be out of the ordinary.

It SERIOUSLY TOOK THIS LONG TO GET TO THIS POINT? Jesus Christ!

I don't know if these people do or not, but that really didn't cross ANYBODY'S mind?


Ok let's say they don't normally work 40 hours a week but work 30 hours a week. So they budget for a 30 hour week every week. THEY ARE GETTING PAID FOR 40 HOURS! 40 hours is greater than 30 hours so they already have a windfall on their hands they just have to wait a few more days for the OT.

Try to think things over.
 
2012-11-15 11:47:28 AM

o5iiawah: Responsible people who have a few months worth of cash on hand for emergencies dont even bat an eyelash at the prospect of having to wait 2-3 days for payroll to FedEx a payroll correction.


QFT
 
2012-11-15 03:37:57 PM

bhcompy: Loreweaver: Krieghund: TheSelphie: Krieghund: 76k is a nice paycheck in Wisconsin, but it won't get you very far in Boston.

Heh, my husband makes about that, and I make a fair bit less than that. Once we pay off the house in about five years (trying to pay it down as fast as possible), we'd probably be fine on half of $76k here a few miles out of Boston. Budgeting and spending below your means.

Yes, exactly. $76,000 plus a whole additional income is what you need to live in metro Boston.
Up to the point where your house is paid for, then you can get by on less.

$76k/yr is a little more than $6000 per month, before taxes. if you figure 20%-25% total in fed,State, and local taxes, that still leaves about $5k take-home. The only way you could be "living paycheck-to-paycheck" would be if you were spending $3000/mo just on rent or a mortgage, then blowing the rest on dining out every other night, a 500-channel HD Sports Package, buying/leasing new cars every year, and have several recreational vehicles.

And trust me, if you have all those luxuries, you are hardly living paycheck-to-paycheck.

God forbid you have something like kids, college tuition/loans, health problems, etc.


I have 2 sisters, who each spend less than $500/mo on groceries for to feed a family of 4.

If your family is spending $1k+ per month on groceries (like the families in TFA who live paycheck to paycheck on $76k), then they are obviously eating things more expensive than hamburg and frozen veggies. Eating veal and steak every night is a luxury, especially if you are serious about living within your means.

I used to work in a grocery store, and my experience was, the very people complaining about the high cost of living and food, were the ones buying the $30 steaks, lobsters, and party trays every week. The problem with the people in TFA is, they don't want to have to "settle" for the cheaper food that us commoners live off of. They'd rather complain about how they can barely afford the car payment on their 2 BMWs because the cost of clam meat is going up.
 
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