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(Wikipedia)   Although secession is unconstitutional, the constitution allows for states to split or combine into new states. North and South Florida anyone?   (en.wikipedia.org) divider line 239
    More: Interesting, South Florida, United States, Articles of Confederation, secession, American Revolution, combine, foreign intervention, Zogby International  
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3472 clicks; posted to Politics » on 11 Nov 2012 at 10:25 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-11 04:48:37 PM
I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.
 
2012-11-11 05:03:23 PM

abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.


I'd say more than five. Like, however many atoms that make that place up.
 
2012-11-11 06:25:49 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: I'd say more than five. Like, however many atoms that make that place up.


An interesting notion; but "five" is what they were promised by the treaty of annexation.
 
2012-11-11 06:42:25 PM
North/South Florida?

Cutting Florida in half?

So.. the Bobbitt amendment?

/Yeah, not proud of that one.
 
2012-11-11 06:43:10 PM
Clearly we need to do whatever is most beneficial to the Republican party.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-11-11 07:03:05 PM
I have wondered about this.

You have states that are insignificant in the electoral college but have oversize representation in the senate. And you have states where it's the other way around.

If you could combine small states they could matter more in the electoral college, if you could divide states like New York, they would matter more in the Senate.

It's a matter of trading Senatorial influence for Presidential influence I think.
 
2012-11-11 07:09:22 PM
Wikipedia? Well, ok I guess.

I am sure the Supreme Court will be referencing this Wikipedia article if the matter ever gets that far. What a great find and even better green-light!

An entire legion of US Constitutional Law professionals thank you subby.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-11-11 07:12:31 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.

I'd say more than five. Like, however many atoms that make that place up.


Each of which would be entitled to two senators, regardless of how small it's population?
 
2012-11-11 07:23:17 PM
Leaving the union is constitutional.

The CSA just did it wrong, like everything else they ever did except cuisine and women.
 
2012-11-11 07:28:56 PM
I have a better idea:

i.imgur.com
 
2012-11-11 07:29:23 PM

abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.


Nah, just split Alaska in half, so Texas becomes the 3rd biggest state.
 
2012-11-11 07:38:02 PM

quatchi: North/South Florida?

Cutting Florida in half?

So.. the Bobbitt amendment?

/Yeah, not proud of that one.


you shouldn't be.

/I loled
 
2012-11-11 09:50:51 PM

vpb: Each of which would be entitled to two senators, regardless of how small its population?


Aye, there's the rub. Still, silly states like Wyoming have two senators, don't they? Pretty much every person in Wyoming IS a senator, and that's less logical than having two senators for the metro Houston area which, with ten times as many people as the entire state of Wyoming, would STILL be proportionately underrepresented in the senate.

There is precedent to create new states from the splitting of existing states. Maine was born when God took a rib from Massachusetts. Same with West Virginia and Virginia. (And other examples which should or should not be included.) I think, however, that the United States needs to avoid balkanization. The only fair way to reapportion would be to create 50 new governing units of approximately equal size. In other words, if you are going to give Houston two senators, which would be fair, you would also have to combine some silly states into one.

For example:

Wyoming, Montana, the Dakotas and Idaho would be combined to form one real state instead of five silly ones.

Same with Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire

Rhode Island and Connecticut

Kansas and Nebraska

And so forth

Let's face it, none of this will ever happen, for many, many reasons, so it might be beneficial for us to learn to live and work united, as specified in the country's name.
 
2012-11-11 10:01:50 PM
Texas out, Puerto Rico in. Money saved by keeping the flag the same.
 
2012-11-11 10:14:39 PM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Texas out, Puerto Rico in. Money saved by keeping the flag the same.


Sold!
 
2012-11-11 10:20:03 PM
Combine virginia and west virginia, enough of this sh*t, they're the ONLY instance of 'country' and 'west country'... f8ckin' rednecks
 
2012-11-11 10:28:31 PM
Repubicans suffering from incredible butthurt.l
 
2012-11-11 10:29:56 PM
That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.
 
2012-11-11 10:31:29 PM
California needs to be split into 3 or more. SoCal, North California, and Farmer Cal.
 
2012-11-11 10:32:57 PM

Smallberries: California needs to be split into 3 or more. SoCal, North California, and Farmer Cal.


So Cal, No Cal, and Cal Worthington and his dog Spot.
 
2012-11-11 10:33:02 PM
north and south Florida, north and south California, Manhattan and it's immediate area and upstate new york, and then a special area in far west tx for governor hair and his friends
 
2012-11-11 10:33:20 PM
I'll just leave this here...

www.perno.com
 
2012-11-11 10:34:00 PM

Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.


Gerrymandering FTW!
 
2012-11-11 10:34:22 PM
Uh, how about Central Florida and North/South Florida? We're the least psychotic part of the state. I said least, so still rather psychotic.
 
2012-11-11 10:34:23 PM
Or we could take the far more straight forward approach and use a direct election.
 
2012-11-11 10:34:59 PM

urban.derelict: Combine virginia and west virginia, enough of this sh*t, they're the ONLY instance of 'country' and 'west country'... f8ckin' rednecks


Then how would we tell who was a Johnny Reb and who was a damn Yankee Carpetbagger?
 
2012-11-11 10:35:31 PM

Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.


This is perhaps the worst idea I've ever heard.

It'll just give politicians even more incentive to gerrymander districts.
 
2012-11-11 10:35:58 PM
Punt and start over:

www.marksettle.com
 
2012-11-11 10:36:02 PM

one small post for man: urban.derelict: Combine virginia and west virginia, enough of this sh*t, they're the ONLY instance of 'country' and 'west country'... f8ckin' rednecks

Then how would we tell who was a Johnny Reb and who was a damn Yankee Carpetbagger?


i'm sure it was noted on the gravestones, assuming they weren't moved but damnit you didn't move the bodies
 
2012-11-11 10:36:05 PM

Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.


Your idea has some promise, until you consider gerrymandering.
 
2012-11-11 10:36:49 PM
fark it...let's start from scratch.

Long live Jefferson State!

upload.wikimedia.org
encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com 

Unfortunately, it'd be a Republican state.

/never mind
 
2012-11-11 10:37:04 PM

Vangor: Uh, how about Central Florida and North/South Florida? We're the least psychotic part of the state. I said least, so still rather psychotic.


I think it should be split down the middle, with I-4 as the boundary. 

I would have to get a really really good job to have any incentive to live north of I-4 in Florida.
 
2012-11-11 10:37:08 PM

The Jami Turman Fan Club: Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.

Gerrymandering FTW!


Well, yeah, spread that to Illinois, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and a few others, yeah. That's it exactly.
 
2012-11-11 10:38:57 PM

Hunter_Worthington: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.

Gerrymandering FTW!

Well, yeah, spread that to Illinois, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and a few others, yeah. That's it exactly.


Why do you want to give politicians more incentive to gerrymander their districts?

Because it will help the GOP win?
 
2012-11-11 10:39:03 PM

theorellior: I'll just leave this here...

[www.perno.com image 800x618]


Wait, what? Is there some background to that image I'm not aware of?
 
2012-11-11 10:40:54 PM
Wait, since when is secession "unconstitutional"? That doesn't even make sense. It's anti-constitutional, sure, but the document isn't a suicide pact.
 
2012-11-11 10:41:45 PM

Mrtraveler01: Hunter_Worthington: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Hunter_Worthington: That would be a waste of time. The better thing to do would be allocate Electoral Votes to the candidate winning the majority of the House Districts in the state, i.e., if Florida had a majority GOP delegation, the GOP candidate would get the whole state's electoral vote.

That would end that "swing state" nonsense.

Gerrymandering FTW!

Well, yeah, spread that to Illinois, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and a few others, yeah. That's it exactly.

Why do you want to give politicians more incentive to gerrymander their districts?

Because it will help the GOP win?


That would be one benefit, yes. The others would be to limit the "madness of the masses", reinforce the federal organization of the nation, and help give the states more say in the direction of the Federal Government.
 
2012-11-11 10:42:01 PM
An interesting idea, but the state legislatures have to agree to a new state created from part of a current state.

Article 4, Sec. 3:

[N]o new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress.

I can't imagine the state legislature of Florida voting to split itself.
 
2012-11-11 10:43:23 PM

Hunter_Worthington: That would be one benefit, yes. The others would be to limit the "madness of the masses", reinforce the federal organization of the nation, and help give the states more say in the direction of the Federal Government.


You think that's what it would do? Really?

i2.kym-cdn.com 

/that's adorable
 
2012-11-11 10:45:40 PM

abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.


That would give them 10 senators and 8 more electorial votes.
 
2012-11-11 10:47:22 PM
Wisconsin could probably be split right down the middle leaving a western half which would be predominately Democrat, with the eastern half being predominately Republican.
 
2012-11-11 10:49:24 PM

Kevin72: abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.

That would give them 10 senators and 8 more electorial votes.


At least three of those five new states would be blue.
 
2012-11-11 10:50:09 PM
i seceded from my cul-de-sac, and will be appointing housepets as senators.
 
2012-11-11 10:52:33 PM
Republicans should br thinking long and hard over the fact that they can no longer be expected to win any national elections without resorting to dirty tricks, schemes to prevent people from voting, and gerrymandering to the point of blatant racism (they would not have won the house this time around without gerrymandering)
Perhaps it is time to come up with a new platform and set of ideas that people, you know, like? You can't disenfranchise your way to victory forever. This election should have made that clear.
 
2012-11-11 10:54:10 PM

tomasso: Same with Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire


Wouldn't combining New Hampshire and Vermont be like oil and water? Who has the bigger population? That state would win out, but either way the Vermont Democrats and the NH Republican would both have to move to the center.
 
2012-11-11 10:55:10 PM
Sounds like a clusterfark of massive proportions to me.
 
2012-11-11 10:55:19 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: abb3w: I think the split of Texas into five pieces makes more immediate sense.

I'd say more than five. Like, however many atoms that make that place up.


Where will you get enough senators?
 
2012-11-11 10:56:09 PM

abb3w: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: I'd say more than five. Like, however many atoms that make that place up.

An interesting notion; but "five" is what they were promised by the treaty of annexation.


I have passing familiarity with this situation because I portrayed a Texan militant secessionist, Richard Keyes on I Almost Got Away With It. There is a (I suppose) trivial segment of Texas' population that believe they were never a part of the US because of their treaty of (what, 1854?) and that the US has been illegally occupying their state(nation) since. They really believe that they can and should leave ASAP.

\I have nothing of value to add to this conversation, I'm just proud of having had the lead role for an episode of that show.
 
2012-11-11 10:56:38 PM
I've lived here for a long time and splitting the state into 2 isn't going to help.
 
2012-11-11 11:00:10 PM
It's the law that we should rejoin the British Empire. Let's do it before we get arrested.
 
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