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(Huffington Post)   Papa John's to cut employee hours due to Obamacare. No word on if they also plan to cut the number of free pizzas Peyton Manning is forcing them to give away   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 227
    More: Asinine, John Schnatter, John McCain, human beings, CEO, Commonwealth Fund, Betsy McCaughey, quality improvement, Naples Daily News  
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3183 clicks; posted to Business » on 10 Nov 2012 at 9:34 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-10 09:10:14 PM

BarkingUnicorn: wellreadneck: Now that I know which places not to support, I'd like to see a list of local pizza joints, neighborhood bars, and family style restaurants that will be willingly supporting Obamacare for the good of their employees, just so I know which deserve my support.

Why don't you just get out of the house and go see these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses?


I've been out of the house enough to know that pretty much NONE of these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses being touted as alternatives ever offered health care benefits to their employees, nor will they. One of the reasons people choose to work at the Papas, the Applebees, and the Dardens is the opportunity to purchase the coverage that has never existed at the Mom and Pop joints. I'm as "screw corporate" as the next guy but let's not pretend that the majority of these owners are any more concerned about the healthcare of their workers than the big guys.
 
2012-11-10 09:16:51 PM
Translation: "I'm taking my ball of dough and going home".
 
2012-11-10 09:22:00 PM

wellreadneck: BarkingUnicorn: wellreadneck: Now that I know which places not to support, I'd like to see a list of local pizza joints, neighborhood bars, and family style restaurants that will be willingly supporting Obamacare for the good of their employees, just so I know which deserve my support.

Why don't you just get out of the house and go see these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses?

I've been out of the house enough to know that pretty much NONE of these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses being touted as alternatives ever offered health care benefits to their employees, nor will they. One of the reasons people choose to work at the Papas, the Applebees, and the Dardens is the opportunity to purchase the coverage that has never existed at the Mom and Pop joints. I'm as "screw corporate" as the next guy but let's not pretend that the majority of these owners are any more concerned about the healthcare of their workers than the big guys.


You're right; nationwide, 35.7% of firms with fewer than 50 employees offer health insurance

Oddly, 77.9% of Hawaiian tiny businesses offer health insurance. Is there some state requirement out there?
 
2012-11-10 09:49:11 PM

BarkingUnicorn: wellreadneck: BarkingUnicorn: wellreadneck: Now that I know which places not to support, I'd like to see a list of local pizza joints, neighborhood bars, and family style restaurants that will be willingly supporting Obamacare for the good of their employees, just so I know which deserve my support.

Why don't you just get out of the house and go see these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses?

I've been out of the house enough to know that pretty much NONE of these LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD businesses being touted as alternatives ever offered health care benefits to their employees, nor will they. One of the reasons people choose to work at the Papas, the Applebees, and the Dardens is the opportunity to purchase the coverage that has never existed at the Mom and Pop joints. I'm as "screw corporate" as the next guy but let's not pretend that the majority of these owners are any more concerned about the healthcare of their workers than the big guys.

You're right; nationwide, 35.7% of firms with fewer than 50 employees offer health insurance

Oddly, 77.9% of Hawaiian tiny businesses offer health insurance. Is there some state requirement out there?


In my experience, the food service industry comes in at quite a bit below that, not to mention that, at least when working corporate, there's a hierarchy that can sometimes help. Working at Olive Garden can be a shiatty job but being trapped at Tony's Family Restaurant can be much worse.
 
2012-11-10 10:07:28 PM
Is there anyone who doesn't see right through this sort of stunt for the bullshiat that it is?
 
2012-11-10 10:26:57 PM

StrangeQ: Well, good thing I haven't eaten Papa Johns in years. I got a hankering now and then, but then I learned a recipe for some dough and pizza sauce and now I can make a pie 10x better for .1 the cost.


Papa John's success has always kind of baffled me.

They're more expensive than their main competitors: Domino's, Pizza Hut, and Little Caesar's. They charge roughly what a really good, local, "craft" pizzeria charges, and it's about the same quality as Domino's.

If I want a good pizza, I'll order from a local place, run by someone (usually an actual Italian-American) who actually cares.
If I want something decent and affordable, I'd order Domino's or Pizza Hut.
If I need a shiatload of cheap, barely edible pizza for a party, I'll get Little Caesar's.

I really don't see where Papa John's fits in.
 
2012-11-10 10:28:37 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: They all have delusions of rulership: first you get the pizza, then you get the power. Like a bunch of little Caesars.


Winner!
 
2012-11-10 10:36:26 PM

AbsentFriends: The number of small business owners who show up in these threads to offer advice on how they should cope with increased health care costs is amazing amusing.


Ok, I'll bite. First of all, any business with over 50 employees is NOT considered a small business. Second, many states and some cities already have this law or a more strict version already in place. Lastly, my company has less than 50 employees...mostly low skill jobs...and we provide health insurance. Not because we have to, because its the right thing to do. Employees > Shareholders
 
2012-11-10 10:40:57 PM
Republican business owners forget how long of a memory and how unforgiving the public can be. Two decades ago Sears screwed me out of forty dollars they owed me for a refund. Not only did they never make another dime of my money, they lost thousands in future sales. When they bought KMart I stopped shopping there too. I warn everyone how dishonest those companies are. I never forget. I never forgive.

I suspect there are many consumers just like me.

Republicans business owners would do well to keep their mouths shut.
 
2012-11-10 11:06:42 PM

Mija: Republican business owners forget how long of a memory and how unforgiving the public can be. Two decades ago Sears screwed me out of forty dollars they owed me for a refund. Not only did they never make another dime of my money, they lost thousands in future sales. When they bought KMart I stopped shopping there too. I warn everyone how dishonest those companies are. I never forget. I never forgive.

I suspect there are many consumers just like me.

Republicans business owners would do well to keep their mouths shut.


Probably. I still refuse to go to chick-fil-a, and took nearly 10 years for me to get over something a waitress and manager pulled at Apple Bees on me... Already plan to remember this for Papa Johns and if Apple Bees does this shiat, I guess they're back on the list too
 
2012-11-10 11:13:19 PM
and the list just keeps growing.

Forward™
 
2012-11-10 11:41:03 PM

Prussian_Roulette: he's being crucified because he wants to stay in the black


He would have been in the black regardless. But by all means, cry harder.
 
2012-11-10 11:50:14 PM

Glockenspiel Hero: Is there a reason pizza chain CEOs are such colossal douchebags? I understand that most CEOs don't align with the (D)s, but seriously

-Papa John Nutter will cut the hours of his employees rather than raise the cost of a pizza by $0.14 because of OBAMAEVILSOCULISMS
-Tom Monaghan has poured millions into pro-life and anti-gay programs, and is busy building a law "school" devoted to christian dominionism.
-We all got to hear plenty from Herman Cain

Is there something in the cheese?


Tom Monaghan --- He sold his controlling stake in Domino's Pizza in 1998 to Bain Capital, an investment firm based in Boston, for an estimated $1 billion
 
2012-11-10 11:51:03 PM

Bontesla: We've stopped buying their pizza after Papa John held a fundraiser for Romney.


...really? That was your reason?

I stopped buy their pizza because of their pizza.
 
2012-11-10 11:52:06 PM

China White Tea: I stopped buying their pizza because of their pizza.


ftfm
 
2012-11-11 12:02:42 AM

Sgt Otter: StrangeQ: Well, good thing I haven't eaten Papa Johns in years. I got a hankering now and then, but then I learned a recipe for some dough and pizza sauce and now I can make a pie 10x better for .1 the cost.

Papa John's success has always kind of baffled me.

They're more expensive than their main competitors: Domino's, Pizza Hut, and Little Caesar's. They charge roughly what a really good, local, "craft" pizzeria charges, and it's about the same quality as Domino's.

If I want a good pizza, I'll order from a local place, run by someone (usually an actual Italian-American) who actually cares.
If I want something decent and affordable, I'd order Domino's or Pizza Hut.
If I need a shiatload of cheap, barely edible pizza for a party, I'll get Little Caesar's.

I really don't see where Papa John's fits in.


I really don't see where you find people to come to your parties!
 
2012-11-11 12:05:03 AM

China White Tea: Bontesla: We've stopped buying their pizza after Papa John held a fundraiser for Romney.

...really? That was your reason?

I stopped buy their pizza because of their pizza.


but you look cooler to the Fark crowd if you say the other reason

 
2012-11-11 12:17:46 AM
Opinions on Papa Murphy's Take N Bake Pizza? Zagat's # 1 Chain Pizza for the past three years. FWIW

Novel business plan: customers get their pizzas raw and bake 'em themselves. Saves store space and operating costs, lowers price. Hotter, fresher pizza. Since it's unheated food, you can buy it with food stamps. 

Never had it, just wondering if anyone has tried it.
 
2012-11-11 12:33:49 AM
Just raise your freaking prices buck a pie....and buy better damn ingredients...
 
2012-11-11 12:44:25 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Opinions on Papa Murphy's Take N Bake Pizza? Zagat's # 1 Chain Pizza for the past three years. FWIW

Novel business plan: customers get their pizzas raw and bake 'em themselves. Saves store space and operating costs, lowers price. Hotter, fresher pizza. Since it's unheated food, you can buy it with food stamps. 

Never had it, just wondering if anyone has tried it.


It's good but it's not what you order delivered at 12 midnight because you can't find your pants.
 
2012-11-11 12:49:38 AM

CujoQuarrel: BarkingUnicorn: Opinions on Papa Murphy's Take N Bake Pizza? Zagat's # 1 Chain Pizza for the past three years. FWIW

Novel business plan: customers get their pizzas raw and bake 'em themselves. Saves store space and operating costs, lowers price. Hotter, fresher pizza. Since it's unheated food, you can buy it with food stamps. 

Never had it, just wondering if anyone has tried it.

It's good but it's not what you order delivered at 12 midnight because you can't find your pants.


You greet the pizza delivery person without your pants?
 
2012-11-11 01:05:05 AM

WhyteRaven74: Of all the industries where you really really don't want sick people showing up at work and unable to see a doctor, food service is at the top of the list.


Also the fact the very people that buy their crap pizza are broke college kids and poor people.
 
2012-11-11 01:09:14 AM
Dammit, will the owners of chain restaurants I sometimes patronize kindly quit being petty assholes? I'd have been perfectly happy to disagree in principle but keep giving them my money, but no ... some mother farkers always gotta ice skate uphill.
 
2012-11-11 01:17:55 AM

log_jammin: including Applebee's which has said it won't hire new workers because of the law.

yeah that makes sense.

"Bob didn't show up for work and we need a fry cook. also tony is sick and out for a week plus our head waitress is 8 months pregnant and will be gone soon. should we hire more workers?"

"NO!!!!"

"but who's going to..."

"I SAID NO! OBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACARE!!!"


These are the stupidest publicity stunts ever.



sounds familiar. something will have to be done to fix this because it is broken.
 
2012-11-11 01:33:02 AM
You can always get your pizza at COSTCO. Since their employees already have health insurance, they aren't affected by Obamacare.
 
2012-11-11 01:36:49 AM
alright, am i confused or what:

some companies want their employees to be covered by insurance but they don't want to pay for it (obamacare) so in order to get around obamacare, they cut hours so they don't have to pay while we in the restaurant industry have to get two jobs to just break even on our bills -- we're in it for the food, not the money, by the way, and not all of us work at Papa Johns or for a corporation/franchise...

i feel confused and would like some clarity if possible

what if i already have private insurance and don't need my employer to cover me? can i have the 10-15 hours a week back you motherf*ckers took away from me?

/i have the spins
 
2012-11-11 02:25:11 AM
I'd like to say I won't buy from them, but I will. Pizza is tasty. Garlic Sauce is good. Crust taste and texture to it is also good. Don't get the pepper thing but meh. They are sucesfull because they are awesome at marketing pizza ONLY $10 but you know by time they hit u with the fee's tax and tip you're busting out a $20
 
2012-11-11 03:28:13 AM
Lots of manufactured rage over this.
He made the initial statement about the likely price increase during his company's shareholders' meeting. This is relevant for anyone holding stock or thinking of buying. If they identified any other business risks on the horizon - like some shortages in the supply chain leading to price hikes - you bet that info would be put in front of the shareholders as well.
Of course the media went quote mining and made it look like he was whining on national TV about Obamacare or something.
And this time around?
"Schnatter said it was likely that some franchise owners would reduce employees' hours in order to avoid having to cover them." . That, and "The good news is 100 percent of the population is going to have health insurance. We're all going to pay for it."
 
2012-11-11 03:45:04 AM

log_jammin: including Applebee's which has said it won't hire new workers because of the law.

yeah that makes sense.

"Bob didn't show up for work and we need a fry cook. also tony is sick and out for a week plus our head waitress is 8 months pregnant and will be gone soon. should we hire more workers?"

"NO!!!!"

"but who's going to..."

"I SAID NO! OBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACAREOBAMACARE!!!"


These are the stupidest publicity stunts ever.


And the costs in question don't kick in for another year or two. In the meantime enterprising young enterprisers will find ways to make admin costs all but disappear and offer up their services, and businesses that know how to do business will survive and/or thrive.

/Apparently, I have more faith in American business than these schmucks.
 
2012-11-11 04:45:20 AM
i haven't had papa john's in about 10 years, but i remember that i enjoyed it... i did like the big tub of garlic butter notion as well...
 
2012-11-11 08:37:49 AM
This is one reason why health care shouldn't be employer based.
 
2012-11-11 09:11:31 AM

Prussian_Roulette: Go ahead and boycott Papa Johns. I'm sure their margins are just as thin as Dominos or the other chains, and depend on the competent few that put in full hours + overtime to make up for the show-up-to-work-if-they-feel-like-it members of the team. And when you have to order for three dozen people, I'm sure everyone will be willing to pay top dollar for your personal favorite Cygnoid Family Bros. pizza.

This guy's sin was having the gall to explain economic cause and effect and he's being crucified because he wants to stay in the black rather than taking a loss until Obama's magical pixie dust cures the nation.

I'm dreading the jobs reports in early 2013 - wait for the Sequestration shoe to drop next. The Democrats own the economy now - the It's Bush's Fault card has officially expired - and the really sad part is the damage can't be limited to be people who voted for it.


Butthurt like typing detected.
 
2012-11-11 09:55:33 AM

China White Tea: Bontesla: We've stopped buying their pizza after Papa John held a fundraiser for Romney.

...really? That was your reason?

I stopped buy their pizza because of their pizza.


That was our reason - and it's a good one.

Only two pizza establishments deliver to our neighborhood (he live in a rural setting) and Papa John's accompanied alcohol very well.
 
2012-11-11 10:28:00 AM
Gosh, is that fourteen whole cents more AMERICAN per pizza to insure everybody full-time at Papa John's? How much more to pay 'em all minimum wage, too?
 
2012-11-11 10:53:53 AM

Forbidden Doughnut: draw


It looks to me as if the drawbridge goes into a cave under the golf course, which might (should? must??) be where keeps cars. Admit, any 8 year old would find that the most awesome thing ever, and of course it requires a drawbridge because, hey, secret bat cave.

Of course the guy's a huge jerkass , but I can appreciate on some level the point of having an awesome drawbridge in your ostentatious pizza castle which was built on the sweat of minimum wage teenagers.
 
2012-11-11 12:03:50 PM
Franchises with razor thin margins cannot afford additional payouts.

...

Film at 11. This is Ric Romero reporting.
 
2012-11-11 12:14:51 PM

BarkingUnicorn: CujoQuarrel: BarkingUnicorn: Opinions on Papa Murphy's Take N Bake Pizza? Zagat's # 1 Chain Pizza for the past three years. FWIW

Novel business plan: customers get their pizzas raw and bake 'em themselves. Saves store space and operating costs, lowers price. Hotter, fresher pizza. Since it's unheated food, you can buy it with food stamps. 

Never had it, just wondering if anyone has tried it.

It's good but it's not what you order delivered at 12 midnight because you can't find your pants.

You greet the pizza delivery person without your pants?


"Dear Penthouse,

I never thought this would happen to me, but..."
 
2012-11-11 12:20:10 PM

TheZorker: Franchises with razor thin margins cannot afford additional payouts.


14 cents, you stupid jackass.
If you can't provide for your employees' wellbeing, you shouldn't be in business. You are not entitled to cheap labor. The price difference here is so negligible for something so important that the only explanations are intentional cruelty and political posturing.
 
2012-11-11 12:29:16 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: TheZorker: Franchises with razor thin margins cannot afford additional payouts.

14 cents, you stupid jackass.
If you can't provide for your employees' wellbeing, you shouldn't be in business. You are not entitled to cheap labor. The price difference here is so negligible for something so important that the only explanations are intentional cruelty and political posturing.


I don't get why everyone is so upset.
This guy is just playing within the rules, and his employees will still get health care REGARDLESS of the number of hours they work. THAT'S the whole point of Obamacare, I thought?
 
2012-11-11 12:38:10 PM

Peter von Nostrand: Their pizza sucks and the owner is a world class douchebag. So pretty much nothing new here


You're right, he's a world class douchebag:

Except you apparently didn't know this

or

this either, the end result.

Maybe they'd be able to save some money if they'd stop giving my farking wife a free pizza every two weeks.
 
2012-11-11 12:39:57 PM

FlashHarry: once again, i ask: if you're a retail business, why the f*ck would you risk alienating HALF of your customers by making political statements?

i don't like boycotts, but i will not eat a papa john's pizza now (not that i did before, but still...), i won't eat at applebees, and i won't eat at chick-fil-a. had they just kept their damned mouths shut, i would't care, normally. but they made me care. and a whole lot of other pissed-off people, i'm guessing.


According to my conservative friends, who are all relatively young (which makes said statement even dumber), conservatives always have more money so when these companies "alienate" the libruls, the conservatives will just take over from there and spend DOUBLE because all liberals are poor bums and the right wing can not only keep these businesses up, but they can help them thrive. This was a status on my FB today :

The sad part is that liberals boycotting any business will only cause them to make money because conservatives will spend more in response than any of those liberals make. Papa John's is the only pizza I'll buy now. +1 for free enterprise and wise business decisions.
 
2012-11-11 01:01:57 PM

Your Average Witty Fark User: Peter von Nostrand: Their pizza sucks and the owner is a world class douchebag. So pretty much nothing new here

You're right, he's a world class douchebag:

Except you apparently didn't know this


So he loves the police. That's normal for Republicans and in line with the accusation that he's a world class douchebag.
 
2012-11-11 01:03:49 PM

Sgt Otter: If I want a good pizza, I'll order from a local place, run by someone (usually an actual Italian-American) who actually cares.
If I want something decent and affordable, I'd order Domino's or Pizza Hut.
If I need a shiatload of cheap, barely edible pizza for a party, I'll get Little Caesar's.

I really don't see where Papa John's fits in.


Papa Johns is the "Lexus" or "Bose" of the pizza industry. Their excellent marketing has fooled people into thinking they're getting quality for the extra money.
 
2012-11-11 02:28:19 PM
It's a sound business decision but publicly announcing it is stupid. Great way to piss off half your customers, dude.

Expect alot more of this, but most will be smart enough to keep it off the radar.
 
2012-11-11 03:00:53 PM
I hope that people stop getting pizza from this guy over this. He has admitted that the extra cost is only 15 cents, for every $10 pizza. If they stopped putting in those peppers, that would even out the cost of offering healthcare coverage for their eligible employers.
 
2012-11-11 04:39:23 PM

FirstNationalBastard:
Seriously, a quarter per pizza?

No one is going to biatch about paying a quarter more for their pizza. A Quarter is nearly worthless these days, anyway.


People tip their drivers $5 or so anyway, a quarter per pizza would be ignored.
 
2012-11-11 04:49:36 PM
My initial reaction to the 11-14 cents comment was 'ok, so raise the price and shut up'. But then I thought more and I realized that his statement would never have been made if it was truly business-related. But it's 100% politics and you know why? He's a 0.1%er, that's why. He doesn't give a flying F about Obamacare...it's the tax rates that are going to wallop his douchiness.

I would like to add that i never took Fark users to be such a haughty group who would disparage any pizza that is available in more than two cities in the country. The major chain pizzas did not become major by producing garbage. Their pizza is fine...pretty much ALL pizza is fine. Not every community has an immigrant family hand-kneading dough and fire-grilling their pizzas.

I'm so sorry for actually enjoying the new recipe Dominos pizzas (hated the old), Papa Johns and Hungry Howies. I do have a decent local chain but they don't deliver and the pizza is cold by the time I get home. I am not interested in driving across town with a 6 month old and 2 year old to eat pizza.
 
2012-11-11 05:12:34 PM

Mister Peejay: FirstNationalBastard:
Seriously, a quarter per pizza?

No one is going to biatch about paying a quarter more for their pizza. A Quarter is nearly worthless these days, anyway.

People tip their drivers $5 or so anyway, a quarter per pizza would be ignored.


Very true, I tend to tip drivers heavy to begin with anyway. You'll get your pizza quicker and the kitchen is much more willing to do special orders for you.
 
2012-11-11 06:42:13 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: Glockenspiel Hero: Is there a reason pizza chain CEOs are such colossal douchebags? I understand that most CEOs don't align with the (D)s, but seriously

-Papa John Nutter will cut the hours of his employees rather than raise the cost of a pizza by $0.14 because of OBAMAEVILSOCULISMS
-Tom Monaghan has poured millions into pro-life and anti-gay programs, and is busy building a law "school" devoted to christian dominionism.
-We all got to hear plenty from Herman Cain

Is there something in the cheese?

They all have delusions of rulership: first you get the pizza, then you get the power. Like a bunch of little Caesars.


Little Ceasars actually, from what I've seen, is pretty good with their franchise owners. Story in Fast Food Nation, plus three kids I went to high school who worked at a corporate owned joint ended up buying it... they still own it and run it, last time I checked, a good decade from when they started working there.

F--k Papa John's, though. Laid off my ex after he got manager status and some raises... which apparently I've learned is the norm there. Lovely.

That Papa John's closed, though. Sucks to be them.

/have an awesome local joint with a $7 pick up special, plus for every 10 pizzas we get we get one free
//adds up quick when we host a coworker gathering at the house every other month or so
///the (young-ish) guys who own it weren't that happy with Obama, but some of the looming hits they were complaining about were actually thanks to our Republican legislature... and even then, they weren't voting for Romney and sure as f--k weren't getting rid of employees. They have a really good reputation and actually need those employees to operate...
 
2012-11-11 06:57:32 PM

cryinoutloud: OH FFS. Not this horseshiat again. I have worked in many restaurants, in many states, in several different capacities. I never worked anywhere close to "full-time." Restaurant workers are scheduled for about 25-30 hours a week. The bosses want to make damn sure that no one collects overtime, and there's always some reason why you have to stay later or come in earlier--doofuses who come in at 10:45 when the place closes at 11, special parties, people get "sick" a lot. Since you're on a clock, the employees know to the minute how long they've worked, and the bosses go to quite a bit of trouble to make sure that no one collects overtime.

What kind of fantasy land do some people live in that they think restaurant workers actually get 40 hours a week? Yeah good luck with that.


My aunt has worked multiple decades at a family run restaurant. She gets benefits and almost a month off for vacation each year. And this is a place where you can have a full meal, including tip, for under $10. The SO picked up a seasonal job doing pastry prep at a local business that gives medical and dental to any staff that works more than 30 hours a week (employee contributes some). They have a restaurant and a deli and the employees there get the same deal.

Both of those places are doing *quite* well despite treating their employees pretty damn well. Yeah, there's always restaurants that short people on hours for those reasons, but from what I've seen from friends who've worked the restaurant scene here everyone pushes to get into the places that don't do that... so those places have their pick of talented, reliable help, and oddly enough those places are also the ones that seem to have the biggest potential for staying power. Almost all of the shops I've seen close up here in the past decade were ones that treated their employees (and the hours they gave them) like crap. Maybe that was a symptom of an underlying financial panic, but that's how it went... with the exception of one or two family run joints.

I don't expect anyone who works at a corporate run throwing a hissy fit over .14 cents per pie place to get to 40 a week though.
 
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