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(Cincinnati Enquirer)   Red Cross to Mitt Romney campaign: "Uh, thanks, but we don't actually need all of this stuff you just dumped at our doorstep"   (cincinnati.com) divider line 207
    More: Dumbass, Mitt Romney, Red Cross, Ted Strickland, Kettering, Southern New Jersey, Delaware Valley, water bottles, thank you  
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6292 clicks; posted to Politics » on 04 Nov 2012 at 5:49 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-04 07:49:20 PM

wotthefark: Mitt Romneys Tax Return: Katie98_KT: He could have organized a blood drive. Something the red cross specifically said they needed. Many people who are eligible do not give blood, and having a presidental candidate get out there, and donate blood and encourage people to do so might have actually HELPED. Maybe during the campaign rallies he could have the red cross set up donation tents (etc), and have a photo-op of him and his family donating.

That's actually an excellent idea. If he had a competent campaign staff someone might have thought of it.

We already have those it's called the military.


The army's coming to take our blood?!?
 
2012-11-04 07:49:27 PM

make me some tea: Is it possible politics is at play here?


ic.pics.livejournal.com

You just blew poor Ric Romero's mind.
 
2012-11-04 08:01:45 PM
Screw the Red Cross...someone needs to haul the food to the people that need it.
 
2012-11-04 08:04:49 PM

redTiburon: Screw the Red Cross...someone needs to haul the food to the people that need it.


Such as?

It would've been nice if Romney and his goons actually did their homework before doing this half-assed, storm relief thing. 

But it would also be nice if the GOP ran someone who was competent for once as well.
 
2012-11-04 08:11:19 PM
Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.
 
2012-11-04 08:13:23 PM

St_Francis_P: Vodka Zombie: Mitt Romney is not a smart or considerate man.

I'm not even sure about that. He's lived in the equivalent of a Fairy Castle all his life, he has no way of knowing how most people live.


You know what though? He's run basically his entire campaign off the idea that his business experience gives him all sorts of insight into  things that are only tangentially related to running a business.

The way supply chain logistics work though? That he should actually have a firm grasp on, and he should therefore be able to understand Red Cross operations well enough to know this was not the way to do any real good.

He didn't mess this up because he's stupid. He messed this up because he was cynical enough to care more about the photo op than actually contributing to disaster relief.


 
 
2012-11-04 08:14:11 PM

deadcrickets: And what they don't tell you is that the reason is they want MONEY is they can skim that. Only a tiny fraction goes to the victims of disasters.


We went over this in another thread. Forbes and Charitynavigator.org both say that the American Red Cross is 92% efficient; 92 cents of every dollar they receive goes to providing relief, which is pretty good for an organization of that size. The only charities that do better than that tend to be small, local, and narrower in focus.
 
2012-11-04 08:18:01 PM

IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.


I heard about that and thought that was dickish.

This is nothing like that though, no matter how much you want it to be.
 
2012-11-04 08:19:19 PM
The main reason the Red Cross doesn't handle food and clothes and stuff like that is that there are already smaller, local organizations that DO handle that...and they apply to the Red Cross for grant money to do their thing. The Red Cross mostly doesn't set up the soup kitchens and food banks themselves; they coordinate with smaller local branches and agencies that are already in place. That's why sending them bales of used clothing and old food doesn't help them--they have to centralize it, and then ship it out to their subsidiaries, and the local nonprofits who apply to them for grants and supplies.

You can cry all you want about how their CEOs and board of directors get six-figure salaries; but its because of them that satellite agencies and affiliates have money to spend and supplies to hand out during disasters; because the Red Cross is able to decentralize at the drop of a hat--unlike the FEMA response we saw during Katrina, when there was no CEO or board to speak of and everything was located in Washington. The Red Cross exists as a corporation so that, in a crisis, the board can call the New York office and say "Go get what you need, the money is on the way." And so that other agencies even exist because they have money already because they have a little tag in the corner of their sign that says "a Red Cross affiliate." That's how this works.
 
2012-11-04 08:20:14 PM

Mrtraveler01: IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.

I heard about that and thought that was dickish.

This is nothing like that though, no matter how much you want it to be.



Yea, except that didn't actually happen.
 
http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp
 
2012-11-04 08:21:02 PM

Gyrfalcon: The main reason the Red Cross doesn't handle food and clothes and stuff like that is that there are already smaller, local organizations that DO handle that...and they apply to the Red Cross for grant money to do their thing. The Red Cross mostly doesn't set up the soup kitchens and food banks themselves; they coordinate with smaller local branches and agencies that are already in place. That's why sending them bales of used clothing and old food doesn't help them--they have to centralize it, and then ship it out to their subsidiaries, and the local nonprofits who apply to them for grants and supplies.

You can cry all you want about how their CEOs and board of directors get six-figure salaries; but its because of them that satellite agencies and affiliates have money to spend and supplies to hand out during disasters; because the Red Cross is able to decentralize at the drop of a hat--unlike the FEMA response we saw during Katrina, when there was no CEO or board to speak of and everything was located in Washington. The Red Cross exists as a corporation so that, in a crisis, the board can call the New York office and say "Go get what you need, the money is on the way." And so that other agencies even exist because they have money already because they have a little tag in the corner of their sign that says "a Red Cross affiliate." That's how this works.


Yeah, but they made a Republican look bad so "off with their heads!"
 
2012-11-04 08:22:47 PM

Genevieve Marie: Mrtraveler01: IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.

I heard about that and thought that was dickish.

This is nothing like that though, no matter how much you want it to be.


Yea, except that didn't actually happen.
 
http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp


Well I'll be darned.

I saw it on the NBC 10 website from Philly and just assumed it was true.

That's a relief then.
 
2012-11-04 08:23:09 PM
Of course they only want money, it's hard to steal goods

The Red Cross= We donate to ourselves

Link
 
2012-11-04 08:25:59 PM

hbk72777: Of course they only want money, it's hard to steal goods

The Red Cross= We donate to ourselves

Link


Man, it must really make you butthurt to see the Red Cross make Romney an ass that you had to dig an article from 2005 where a bunch of call center works stole money from the actual organization.
 
2012-11-04 08:26:26 PM

hbk72777: Of course they only want money, it's hard to steal goods

The Red Cross= We donate to ourselves

Link


Look, it's not that hard to understand why donations of this sort are really inefficient to accept and process. There's no overarching strategic planning to it- no way of determining that the food donated is what's needed. There's also no good way to ship it, and there's no process in place to distribute it.

Also, why on earth would you encourage people to pay retail for commodities when the Red Cross and other big agencies can negotiate for wholesale deals with efficient distribution?

It really just doesn't make sense on a logical level.

Also, Mitt Romney's not dumb. He understands all of this. A really good supply chain is what companies like Staples are built on.
 
2012-11-04 08:26:34 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: I have friends who make very little money working for a non profit who lost their office and many lost all their belongings in their cheap as hell off season rentals. So FU. I actually hope you're trolling.


AOL. Lots of New Jersey got it, so there is no shortage of genuine suffering and homelessness. I agree that barrier islands should be used only for recreation, and abandoned when a hurricane is on the way--which appears to have been the case for many of them.
 
2012-11-04 08:29:16 PM

Mrtraveler01: It would've been nice if Romney and his goons actually did their homework before doing this half-assed, storm relief thing.


The fault with your logic is that Romney and his campaign gave one single fark over the relief effort aspect of their campaign rally. The entire thing was an excuse to hold a rally in Ohio to remain in the news. I'm only amazed they didn't just drop the stuff in a dumpster the second the cameras were put away.
 
2012-11-04 08:29:34 PM

Genevieve Marie: Also, Mitt Romney's not dumb. He understands all of this. A really good supply chain is what companies like Staples are built on.


That's the thing that baffles me.

He screwed up with some of the most basic stuff here:

1. He didn't bother to see if the Red Cross wanted the stuff and just assumed that they did.
2. He didn't think of any alternate organizations that would want all of the stuff after finding out the Red Cross didn't want it.

And this is who the GOP thinks would make a great president?

These are farkups a middle school organizations would've avoided.
 
2012-11-04 08:30:15 PM

IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.


debunked.

Link
 
2012-11-04 08:32:46 PM

Mrtraveler01: Genevieve Marie: Also, Mitt Romney's not dumb. He understands all of this. A really good supply chain is what companies like Staples are built on.

That's the thing that baffles me.

He screwed up with some of the most basic stuff here:

1. He didn't bother to see if the Red Cross wanted the stuff and just assumed that they did.
2. He didn't think of any alternate organizations that would want all of the stuff after finding out the Red Cross didn't want it.

And this is who the GOP thinks would make a great president?

These are farkups a middle school organizations would've avoided.


That's the thing: he understood perfectly that this wasn't helping. He's not a stupid man. I give him enough credit to recognize that he knows how large organizations run and how distribution works.

This was just a particularly crass photo op.
 
2012-11-04 08:33:18 PM

Genevieve Marie: Mrtraveler01: IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.

I heard about that and thought that was dickish.

This is nothing like that though, no matter how much you want it to be.

Yea, except that didn't actually happen.
 
http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp


In before ZOMG SNOPES IS A LIBERAL CONSPIRACY!!!
 
2012-11-04 08:37:23 PM
Add "Red Cross" to the List of threats to conservatism.
 
2012-11-04 08:37:31 PM

Shrugging Atlas:

The fault with your logic is that Romney and his campaign gave one single fark over the relief effort aspect of their campaign rally. The entire thing was an excuse to hold a rally in Ohio to remain in the news. I'm only amazed they didn't just drop the stuff in a dumpster the second the cameras were put away.

Genevieve Marie: That's the thing: he understood perfectly that this wasn't helping. He's not a stupid man. I give him enough credit to recognize that he knows how large organizations run and how distribution works.

This was just a particularly crass photo op.


I know, I really should stop trying to see the goodness in everyone and bring my inner cynic out.
 
2012-11-04 08:40:30 PM
Scumbag Romney Holds Fake Sandy Hurricane Relief (NSFW Language)  
 
2012-11-04 08:43:45 PM

pciszek: deadcrickets: And what they don't tell you is that the reason is they want MONEY is they can skim that. Only a tiny fraction goes to the victims of disasters.

We went over this in another thread. Forbes and Charitynavigator.org both say that the American Red Cross is 92% efficient; 92 cents of every dollar they receive goes to providing relief, which is pretty good for an organization of that size. The only charities that do better than that tend to be small, local, and narrower in focus.


I thought I'd show this again, so that it's clear that it is a defunct talking point by the Right.
 
2012-11-04 08:44:31 PM
And NOBODY in the Romney campaign figured this out on Tuesday or so when the issue first came up? The Red Cross said fromt he beginning that this did not fit into their particular 'storm aid' scenario. There are other charities that focus on that, and if Romney was actually doing this to help, he would have paid attention. Sure, it's getting to other charities now, but that means the Red Cross has to divert employees who have other stuff to do, to babysitting this shiat until it gets where it needs to go. Some charities do food, some do things like blankets tents and sleeping bags, and some just do food and money. It's not that hard to figure out, but this is what happens when all of your charitable contributions are done as a business decision, rather than a true sense of charity.
 
2012-11-04 08:46:19 PM

fusillade762: Genevieve Marie: Mrtraveler01: IronTom: Just like the IBEW turning away helpers that did not sign up for their unions.

I heard about that and thought that was dickish.

This is nothing like that though, no matter how much you want it to be.

Yea, except that didn't actually happen.
 
http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sandyunion.asp

In before ZOMG SNOPES IS A LIBERAL CONSPIRACY!!!


that snopes article basically says it did happen, more or less. They weren't turned away, they just never got there because they received information that they'd have to join the union to help out.
 
2012-11-04 08:46:57 PM

Mrtraveler01: I know, I really should stop trying to see the goodness in everyone and bring my inner cynic out.


Everyone? That's a bit much. Romney? Good move.
 
2012-11-04 08:47:39 PM

verbaltoxin: Add "Red Cross" to the List of threats to conservatism.


Red Cross hates Staten Islanders
 
2012-11-04 08:49:43 PM
"They'll be fine. We tithe!"

downloads.thedaily.com
 
2012-11-04 08:50:06 PM

skullkrusher: that snopes article basically says it did happen, more or less. They weren't turned away, they just never got there because they received information that they'd have to join the union to help out.



No, the Snopes article says that no one was turned away, but that one crew turned back and went home before they arrived due to confusion about what was going on.

That's a completely different scenario than the malicious one that's been circulating in right wing media.

 
 
2012-11-04 08:52:03 PM

randomjsa: Once again, F the Red Cross, they are not the "authority" on disaster relief


Well who is? You? You're welcome to compete. I'm sure catching a train to New York and handing out cans to Staten Islanders would be more efficient than all the red tape and bureaucrats
 
2012-11-04 08:52:04 PM

Genevieve Marie: skullkrusher: that snopes article basically says it did happen, more or less. They weren't turned away, they just never got there because they received information that they'd have to join the union to help out.


No, the Snopes article says that no one was turned away, but that one crew turned back and went home before they arrived due to confusion about what was going on.

That's a completely different scenario than the malicious one that's been circulating in right wing media.


The utility even released a statement to the effect that they received info that implied they'd need to join the union when they arrived. The further implication being they would not have been allowed to help out had they not done so. No, no one was turned away because they went home before they could be turned away.
 
2012-11-04 08:56:21 PM

skullkrusher: Genevieve Marie: skullkrusher: that snopes article basically says it did happen, more or less. They weren't turned away, they just never got there because they received information that they'd have to join the union to help out.


No, the Snopes article says that no one was turned away, but that one crew turned back and went home before they arrived due to confusion about what was going on.

That's a completely different scenario than the malicious one that's been circulating in right wing media.

The utility even released a statement to the effect that they received info that implied they'd need to join the union when they arrived. The further implication being they would not have been allowed to help out had they not done so. No, no one was turned away because they went home before they could be turned away.


Except the union released a statement saying they weren't sure what papers the group had received, and stated that it was their policy to welcome non-union assistance.
 
 
2012-11-04 08:58:43 PM
Oh, and Chris Christie also stated that the crew who didn't come got bad information, and made it clear that non-union workers were welcome.

This feels like a particularly craven attempt to use this tragedy to demonize unions, even as their workers are busting their asses trying to restore services.

 
 
2012-11-04 09:00:14 PM

Genevieve Marie: Except the union released a statement saying they weren't sure what papers the group had received, and stated that it was their policy to welcome non-union assistance.


the head of the IBEW released such a statement. Who's to say what a local did? I don't see why the utility would lie and then release a press release to continue that lie
 
2012-11-04 09:00:50 PM

skullkrusher: Genevieve Marie: skullkrusher: that snopes article basically says it did happen, more or less. They weren't turned away, they just never got there because they received information that they'd have to join the union to help out.


No, the Snopes article says that no one was turned away, but that one crew turned back and went home before they arrived due to confusion about what was going on.

That's a completely different scenario than the malicious one that's been circulating in right wing media.

The utility even released a statement to the effect that they received info that implied they'd need to join the union when they arrived. The further implication being they would not have been allowed to help out had they not done so. No, no one was turned away because they went home before they could be turned away.


FROM the AP and the actual crews:
HUNTSVILLE, Ala., Nov. 2 (UPI) -- Three Alabama utility companies Friday denied reports their crews weren't permitted to help restore power in New Jersey because the workers were non-union.

Several conservative media organizations -- including Fox News and the Drudge Report -- picked up a story from an Alabama TV station that crews from Huntsville Utilities and Joe Wheeler Electrical Membership Corp. weren't allowed to help with electrical service restoration in New Jersey because they don't belong to a union.

A third Alabama utility, Decatur Utilities, said its employees were asked to affiliate with a union before starting to work on the power restoration in the aftermath of superstorm Sandy, AL.com reported.

Huntsville Utilities spokes Bill Yell said nine of his company's employees were working in New Jersey.

"That's a rumor," he said of the report that workers who traveled to New Jersey to help out were being turned away.

Joe Wheeler EMC said on its website reports that its workers were turned away from Hurricane Sandy relief efforts "are not true."

"Joe Wheeler EMC was never commissioned to go to New Jersey or New York," the company said. "Instead, JWEMC sent eight linemen to Denton, Maryland, to help out Choptank Electric Cooperative."

The statement said JWEMC crews were returning to Alabama from Maryland.

"Joe Wheeler EMC employees are members of The International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers - Local 558 union," the company said. "Any reports that claim JWEMC is not unionized are false."

Yell and JWEMC spokeswoman Mandi Phillips told AL.com they have been swamped with media inquiries following reports of the matter on cable channels, including Fox News and CNN, as well as in several New Jersey newspapers.

Yell noted that in cases where crews are sent to other states to help in emergencies, "it's not a situation where everybody jumps in truck and heads up there. You have to work through trade associations. You have mutual-aid agreements and you've got to find a system that needs you and is able to take you."

He said not all electric systems use the same voltage and technical configurations.



Read more: Link
 
2012-11-04 09:01:12 PM
Mitt Romney makes me wistful for the last true Republican president, Richard Nixon.
 
2012-11-04 09:02:49 PM

skullkrusher: Genevieve Marie: Except the union released a statement saying they weren't sure what papers the group had received, and stated that it was their policy to welcome non-union assistance.

the head of the IBEW released such a statement. Who's to say what a local did? I don't see why the utility would lie and then release a press release to continue that lie


The utility company in question said in their statement that at no time were their workers turned away, and that they held them pending clarification on requirements.

I agree there was probably a little bureaucratic confusion, but there's absolutely no implication that it was intentional or that it was the result of unions turning away non-union workers.

This is getting a bit off-topic though, and I'm done arguing the nuances of this.
 
2012-11-04 09:03:34 PM

Genevieve Marie: The utility company in question said in their statement that at no time were their workers turned away, and that they held them pending clarification on requirements.


right - they were not turned away. They never even arrived in NJ
 
2012-11-04 09:04:13 PM

sdd2000: Read more: Link


You won't get through to him. skullkrusher has a job to do: to lie his ass off and use the damage done on the east coast of the United States to further the right-wing agenda to smear unions. Because unions vote for democrats.
 
2012-11-04 09:04:33 PM

sdd2000: FROM the AP and the actual crews:
HUNTSVILLE, Ala., Nov. 2 (UPI) -- Three Alabama utility companies Friday denied reports their crews weren't permitted to help restore power in New Jersey because the workers were non-union.

Several conservative media organizations -- including Fox News and the Drudge Report -- picked up a story from an Alabama TV station that crews from Huntsville Utilities and Joe Wheeler Electrical Membership Corp. weren't allowed to help with electrical service restoration in New Jersey because they don't belong to a union.

A third Alabama utility, Decatur Utilities, said its employees were asked to affiliate with a union before starting to work on the power restoration in the aftermath of superstorm Sandy, AL.com reported.

Huntsville Utilities spokes Bill Yell said nine of his company's employees were working in New Jersey.

"That's a rumor," he said of the report that workers who traveled to New Jersey to help out were being turned away.

Joe Wheeler EMC said on its website reports that its workers were turned away from Hurricane Sandy relief efforts "are not true."

"Joe Wheeler EMC was never commissioned to go to New Jersey or New York," the company said. "Instead, JWEMC sent eight linemen to Denton, Maryland, to help out Choptank Electric Cooperative."

The statement said JWEMC crews were returning to Alabama from Maryland.

"Joe Wheeler EMC employees are members of The International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers - Local 558 union," the company said. "Any reports that claim JWEMC is not unionized are false."

Yell and JWEMC spokeswoman Mandi Phillips told AL.com they have been swamped with media inquiries following reports of the matter on cable channels, including Fox News and CNN, as well as in several New Jersey newspapers.

Yell noted that in cases where crews are sent to other states to help in emergencies, "it's not a situation where everybody jumps in truck and heads up there. You have to work through trade ...


Decatur is the one we are discussing
 
2012-11-04 09:05:37 PM

LouDobbsAwaaaay: sdd2000: Read more: Link

You won't get through to him. skullkrusher has a job to do: to lie his ass off and use the damage done on the east coast of the United States to further the right-wing agenda to smear unions. Because unions vote for democrats.


Lie about objective and clear content of a snopes article? Stop posting man, you've gotten really off the rails of late.
 
2012-11-04 09:06:02 PM

mrshowrules: Because People in power are Stupid: mrshowrules: Because People in power are Stupid: But as showboating goes, it's very effective for Romney.

It blew up in his face from the perspective. Any idiot was that was impressed by this was voting for him anyways.

I don't think it blew up in his face. Nobody who donated like that really paid attention after they cleaned out the old food cans from their cabinet.

Anyone who was there that found this out is blaming the "Liberul Media" as obviously one can merely shoot the messenger if you don't like the message.

He purchased $5,000 worth of stuff that Red Cross specifically said they didn't want the day before and had had people pretending to donate the goods load it in the back of the truck. This is just as pathetic as Ryan cleaning the clean pots and pans at the soup kitchen.


Speaking of whom, where the heck is Ryan?
 
2012-11-04 09:07:40 PM

skullkrusher: The utility even released a statement to the effect that they received info that implied they'd need to join the union when they arrived.


You can blame Michelle Malkin, Daily Caller and Free Republic for that because THEY were the ones crowing about it the most.
 
2012-11-04 09:08:05 PM

Coelacanth: Scumbag Romney Holds Fake Sandy Hurricane Relief (NSFW Language)


That was worth watching. Thanks.

/goddamn
//donated money already; donating blood after elections
 
2012-11-04 09:08:08 PM
I read a story the other day that said about 60% of the stuff donated after disasters was either useless, or just plain trash. Somehow that doesn't surprise me. People, cleaning out your garage doesn't count as "helping out after a disaster."
 
2012-11-04 09:08:48 PM
Mitt Romney's Fake Disaster Relief Event In Ohio This Link is SFW
 
2012-11-04 09:09:26 PM

skullkrusher: Decatur Utilities


Decatur Utilities later issued a statement on Friday that said: "To be clear, at no time were our crews 'turned away' from the utility in Seaside Heights."

Link
 
2012-11-04 09:10:10 PM

dantheman195: Why do we care that a bunch of wealthy people lost their 2nd or 3rd home in a strong windstorm? I mean, Coastal NJ is nothing like New Orleans, you can't even buy a crap shack on the shore for less the $750K


Link


Look how stupid you are!
 
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