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(Huffington Post)   Q: What do airlines owe passengers displaced by Sandy? A: Nothing. You get nothing. Good day, sir   (huffingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, airlines  
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3662 clicks; posted to Business » on 01 Nov 2012 at 3:29 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-11-01 08:02:35 AM  
They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.
 
2012-11-01 08:28:38 AM  

I SAID GOOD DAY!

 
2012-11-01 08:29:26 AM  
Are the home builders who originally built the houses destroyed by the hurricane supposed to give refunds now?
 
2012-11-01 09:20:27 AM  
I read that in Gene Wilder's voice and it was funny.
 
2012-11-01 10:08:02 AM  

queenalice: They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.


Does anything more really need to be said?
 
2012-11-01 11:50:09 AM  

eraser8: queenalice: They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.

Does anything more really need to be said?


trip insurance....what is it for?

bummer when you get stranded in the airport for days

even worse when you and a million others are trying to get out of town
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-11-01 11:57:47 AM  
So, it's like rape? It's all part of God's plan.
 
2012-11-01 12:20:12 PM  
Yeah, but it's Frankenstorm-related!

It's an entirely different kind of delay, altogether.
 
2012-11-01 12:20:17 PM  
Not "nothing" according to TFA:

In the case of a "Force Majeure" event, otherwise known as an "Act of God," few airlines assume responsibility to do anything but offer passengers refunds or traveler certificates.

So if the flight doesn't occur, you get a refund for whatever you paid or credit for the same amount towards another flight. It sounds like the return policy for most retail stores. If subsequent flights are more expensive however, you'll have to pay more.

Government regulation for prices or honoring tickets would be nice but success seems unlikely without farking up a volatile industry.
 
2012-11-01 12:29:56 PM  

BunkoSquad: It's an entirely different kind of delay, altogether.


It's an entirely different kind of delay.
 
2012-11-01 12:38:08 PM  
Wait, can an Atheist invoke "Act of God" and receive compensation?
 
2012-11-01 01:30:37 PM  

Cythraul: I SAID GOOD DAY!


dl.dropbox.com
 
2012-11-01 01:41:19 PM  
I honestly don't really know what people were thinking traveling out to the coast this week. I mean, we knew this was coming and a NORMAL rainstorm will set off delays and cancellations.

Even the consultants I know were excused from traveling to projects out there that week.

You'd think that, if forced to travel, you'd have a bus/rental car contingency plan.
 
2012-11-01 02:02:01 PM  
We all know Wonka's "Nothing" speech, but I prefer

scienceblogs.com

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! YOU SO STUPID!
 
2012-11-01 02:44:15 PM  
Travel insurance doesn't cost that much.
 
2012-11-01 02:58:12 PM  
img202.imageshack.us

Doesn't want to hear "Act of God"
 
2012-11-01 03:13:14 PM  

Freudian_slipknot: I honestly don't really know what people were thinking traveling out to the coast this week. I mean, we knew this was coming and a NORMAL rainstorm will set off delays and cancellations.


To be quite honest, there's a not insignificant number of people who pay very little attention to the news at all and probably had no idea this was imminent.
 
2012-11-01 03:41:13 PM  

TheBeastOfYuccaFlats: Freudian_slipknot: I honestly don't really know what people were thinking traveling out to the coast this week. I mean, we knew this was coming and a NORMAL rainstorm will set off delays and cancellations.

To be quite honest, there's a not insignificant number of people who pay very little attention to the news at all and probably had no idea this was imminent.


Plus they had tickets for the Book of Mormon.
 
2012-11-01 03:47:41 PM  
That's why it's called Force Majeure (quotes not needed, Kate). The airlines are in no way responsible for the cancelled flights, so anything beyond a refund is not an option. It cuts both ways. Companies can't hold people responsible for Force Majeure. If a tree on your property explodes due to excessive rainfall and knocks down power lines, it isn't your fault and neither you or your insurance company pays a nickel.

Based on an actual event experienced by my business partner.

(Yes, trees can explode due to hydrostatic pressure.)
 
2012-11-01 03:57:09 PM  
Would the displaced passengers prefer to DIAF as their plane crashes after taking off into a hurricane? They got their money back, go buy a new ticket!
 
2012-11-01 04:00:35 PM  

RedPhoenix122: BunkoSquad: It's an entirely different kind of delay, altogether.

It's an entirely different kind of delay.


It's an entirely different kind of delay
 
2012-11-01 04:05:02 PM  
Unfortunately, this situation is unlikely to be remedied in the near the future.

No, it's remedied. They got a refund or will get one shortly. Idiot.
 
2012-11-01 04:12:19 PM  

queenalice: They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.


Surely you can't be serious.
 
2012-11-01 04:38:27 PM  

xynix: Are the home builders who originally built the houses destroyed by the hurricane supposed to give refunds now?


Troll?

There's a difference between paying for a service and paying for a physical object. If the company is unable or unwilling to supply the agreed upon service or object, you should get a refund.

If I order a $2000 tv from Amazon and it's out of stock, they aren't allowed to cancel the order and still keep the money. If I buy tickets to the Nutcracker next month and the performance is canceled, they don't keep the money. If you order pizza and don't deliver it because the store burns down while cooking it, you don't still have to pay them.

So why should air lines still get to keep the money?
 
2012-11-01 04:42:41 PM  

Freudian_slipknot: I honestly don't really know what people were thinking traveling out to the coast this week. I mean, we knew this was coming and a NORMAL rainstorm will set off delays and cancellations.

Even the consultants I know were excused from traveling to projects out there that week.

You'd think that, if forced to travel, you'd have a bus/rental car contingency plan.


Well you have people like my sister and bro in law. They were gone on a 2 week vacation to Nepal. They were flying back to Texas via some airport around NYC, but their flight that stopped in Rome got cancelled Monday. The upside is that they are stuck in Rome until at least Sunday, they had purchased travel insurance so their hotel is covered and now they basically get an extra week of vacation to tool around Italy.

Had some friends get 'stuck' in Paris at the tail end of a work trip after 9/11. Work picked up their extended tab.

I think the only thing the airline owes you is your ticket refund or a flight as soon as they can work you in. In this case, weather really was the problem.
 
2012-11-01 04:50:45 PM  

TheBeastOfYuccaFlats: Freudian_slipknot: I honestly don't really know what people were thinking traveling out to the coast this week. I mean, we knew this was coming and a NORMAL rainstorm will set off delays and cancellations.

To be quite honest, there's a not insignificant number of people who pay very little attention to the news at all and probably had no idea this was imminent.


My sister and her BF were supposed to fly last Sunday afternoon from Bostion to National with a layover in JFK. They changed their return to leave at noon and made it back without an issue.
 
2012-11-01 04:52:26 PM  

vpb: So, it's like rape? It's all part of God's plan.


BunkoSquad: Yeah, but it's Frankenstorm-related!

It's an entirely different kind of delay, altogether.


Franken-rape! This game... is... I got a weird visual.
 
2012-11-01 04:52:38 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?


Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.
 
2012-11-01 04:54:14 PM  
A few years ago I got an angry call from our Houston office about where their checks were. I looked it up on our FedEx server and it said that they were in Memphis grounded due to the snowsotrm they had there. Well she just found this unacceptable and demanded that I find a way to get her checks to her. She went on a tirade I put the phone on mute and speaker so my coworkers could hear. She went on an on even after I explained once payroll is in FedEx hands Ive done my job. She still cussed up a storm and flipped out to no end. I even suggested to her that she would have better luck dealing with FedEx than me since I have no power over making the planes fly. I got lucky at that time because one of the big wigs from payroll was coming down to talk about the delays. He heard her on the phone picked it up and went off on her. All of us just sat around there with a bemused look on our face. He made her apologise to us and he bought us lunch. I always want to believe he deducted it from her pay.
 
2012-11-01 04:56:05 PM  

Wellon Dowd: queenalice: They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.

Surely you can't be serious.


Actually, it's well known that if you fly and have a weather-related delay, you get nothing and should like it. If there's an equipment problem that leads to your delay, then the airline will usually pay for your food/lodging. They've been doing this for years now. So if you're ever delayed on a flight, know to ask: "weather or equipment?" The answer matters.
 
2012-11-01 04:59:19 PM  

Leopold Stotch: Would the displaced passengers prefer to DIAF as their plane crashes after taking off into a hurricane? They got their money back, go buy a new ticket!


wait a minute here.. I didn't bother to actually read the article, but... these people got their money back
and they want more? Fark them firmly in their fart place.
 
2012-11-01 05:14:27 PM  
WAIT, WAIT!!

Does subby mean that the passengers may only get a mere REFUND for their tickets?

WTF is this world coming to? I should get a steak and lobster dinner, a weeks' stay at a four star hotel, a massage and a happy ending when weather delays my flights!!!

On a side note, airlines have been doing this for years, anyway. Our family got stuck in Atlanta overnight, having to pay for our own hotel. In that case, it was a bit unfair, since the airline lied to us about being able to make the connecting flight (due to storms in Atlanta) - had they not lied to us, we'd have stayed in Las Vegas, instead of being dumped out into the night (late night) and booking into a worthless airport hotel, unable to even order a damn meal due to the late hour. ANYWAY.... I could have understood if they hadn't given us a guarantee that we would be able to connect ("all flights are delayed the same, sir, both into and out of Atlanta, connecting will be no problem" - and flight was leaving the terminal 'on time' next to our arrival gate before we even came to a stop). They didn't need to handle us that way; they just wanted to fill the flight out of Vegas (several passengers were going to be stranded for DAYS after missing their connector), then delayed us getting out of the airport in Atlanta to the point where every deliver place and restaurant near the airport was closed.
 
2012-11-01 05:24:58 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: [img202.imageshack.us image 326x246]

Doesn't want to hear "Act of God"



i2.photobucket.com

You leave Jack Burton ALONE!

...he pays them 6 G'S a year in premiums...
 
2012-11-01 05:30:20 PM  
They cancel the flight and return your money, but you are now left scrambling to buy a ticket with short notice. Book a flight 6 weeks in advance and it's only $300. Book that same flight 2 days in advance--$1000.
 
2012-11-01 05:35:06 PM  

warrenn: They cancel the flight and return your money, but you are now left scrambling to buy a ticket with short notice. Book a flight 6 weeks in advance and it's only $300. Book that same flight 2 days in advance--$1000.


OH... SO YOU'RE TOO GOOD FOR THE BUS NOW EH, WARRENN????
 
2012-11-01 05:37:24 PM  
To quote from Roger Waters lyrics: "God wants insurance, God wants to cover himself".

\Amused to Death... a great and under-rated album, in my opinion.
 
2012-11-01 05:48:28 PM  
i think you're forgetting something:
i have one of these

z.about.com

that means i WIN and get the ENTIRE CHOCOLATE FACTORY !!
 
2012-11-01 06:39:35 PM  

StoneColdAtheist: Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?

Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.


And why should they be even allowed to do that? Honestly, can you name a single other industry that operates like that? You don't perform the service you don't get the money.
 
2012-11-01 06:58:49 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: StoneColdAtheist: Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?

Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.

And why should they be even allowed to do that? Honestly, can you name a single other industry that operates like that? You don't perform the service you don't get the money.


Uh...see: basically any "final sale" item. If you order a shirt final sale & it arrives wrapped around a baby's arm, covered in a giant turd stain, and ridden with mice holes, you get no compensation. If you purchase a ticket for a service and that ticket is NON-REFUNDABLE...what do you expect? If the company chooses to extend any waiver or refund to you after telling you ahead of time that it wouldn't, I'd think you should count yourself lucky.
 
2012-11-01 07:05:49 PM  

Tell Me How My Blog Tastes: Wellon Dowd: queenalice: They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into.

Surely you can't be serious.

Actually, it's well known that if you fly and have a weather-related delay, you get nothing and should like it. If there's an equipment problem that leads to your delay, then the airline will usually pay for your food/lodging. They've been doing this for years now. So if you're ever delayed on a flight, know to ask: "weather or equipment?" The answer matters.


Problem is that unless the aircraft is sitting at the gate right in front of you, they can almost always call it a weather delay. Passenger load factors are so high that there is no slack in the system, meaning where they used to be able to find a crew and aircraft to fill in the gaps, today it's much harder and they can often point to a weather delay somewhere in the system that is causing your delay.

Also, they don't warn passengers when there is planned construction/maintenance at an airport months ahead of time. A planned runway closure can severely impact an airport's capacity. Thusly, if the wind is coming from the "wrong" direction or there are low ceilings/visibility, the chances of your flight getting cancelled go way up. It should be mandatory to let a traveler know when booking if an airport he or she is booked through is impacted by planned construction. I successfully argued this once with Northwest at MSP, got an overnight hotel out of it, even though my flight was cancelled.

I had just arrived in MSP and saw the connecting flight and a bunch of others were cancelled, so I found the nearest gate agent.

Me: any chance of me getting out of here tonight?
NW: we're sorry but your flight has been cancelled due to weather.
Me: that's a bunch of crap - weather is marginal at worst
NW: sorry sir, would you like me to re-book you for a flight tomorrow morning?
Me: yeah, and how about a hotel for tonight?
NW: sorry, we can't do that for weather
Me: WTF, this airport is more than equipped for marginal ceilings!
NW: nothing I can do

So I check aviation weather on my phone, find out the parallel runway is NOTAM closed. That's a massive reduction in capacity even in good weather. I find a place where I can see what's going on on the other side of the airport, and sure as shiat, the runway is all torn up. This isn't unscheduled maintenance, it's construction. I called the direct number to NW (thanks to getarealperson) and make the point that passengers should be made aware that major construction could impact their travel plans and I got a night at a nice hotel out of the deal. Huh, CSB.

Still, there should be a warning when you book the flight. Consumers should be able to make an informed choice.
 
2012-11-01 07:33:24 PM  
Hey, you don't take the ride, you don't gotta pay.
Move on with your life.
 
2012-11-01 07:35:33 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: StoneColdAtheist: Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?

Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.

And why should they be even allowed to do that? Honestly, can you name a single other industry that operates like that? You don't perform the service you don't get the money.


But the airlines are refunding the money. I'm not sure what you're complaining about.
 
2012-11-01 07:44:22 PM  

LittleKidLover: Satanic_Hamster: StoneColdAtheist: Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?

Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.

And why should they be even allowed to do that? Honestly, can you name a single other industry that operates like that? You don't perform the service you don't get the money.

Uh...see: basically any "final sale" item. If you order a shirt final sale & it arrives wrapped around a baby's arm, covered in a giant turd stain, and ridden with mice holes, you get no compensation. If you purchase a ticket for a service and that ticket is NON-REFUNDABLE...what do you expect? If the company chooses to extend any waiver or refund to you after telling you ahead of time that it wouldn't, I'd think you should count yourself lucky.


The difference is that if you get a poo shirt from one company you just don't order from that company again, you're out $20. If you're stuck in an airport because of a major weather event and not mechanical issues EVERYONE is in the same boat as you and the airline CAN'T fulfill it's obligation. If the airlines had their way they'd fly every flight with no problems because it costs them money to fill up later planes with people that had planned to travel earlier. Rather than bump people to later flights it's easier in multi-day cancellations like Sandy to just give people their money back and leave them to fend for themselves rather than try to fill planes on flights that they aren't sure will leave in the next few days.
 
2012-11-01 07:58:27 PM  

Minarets: RedPhoenix122: BunkoSquad: It's an entirely different kind of delay, altogether.

It's an entirely different kind of delay.

It's an entirely different kind of delay


It's an entirely different kind of delay.
 
2012-11-01 08:33:29 PM  
Many airline tickets are booked weeks to months in advance. The only complaint people can have about these cancellations is that the airlines aren't psychic. You might be able to make a case about getting screwed if you booked after the "HUGE STORM TO RAPE EAST COAST" headlines were announced, but a good rebuttal to that is "why did you book a ticket if you knew there would be a huge storm, asshole?". 

Frankly, I'm surprised they gave anyone anything at all. When dealing with airlines there's simple flow chart: Are the airlines doing something? Y: They're screwing you through their actions. N: They're screwing you through their inaction.
 
2012-11-01 08:58:20 PM  
I imagine a lot of those travelers headed out to the coast had their plans arranged for months and thought they'd give it ago despite the storm. At least, I hope people plan things months in advance, I like to.
 
2012-11-01 09:00:15 PM  
I fly a fair amount. I was traveling with a girlfriend once and got a call that the flight was cancelled while in the cab on the way to the airport. I get to the airport and go up to the desk only to find out they know nothing about the cancellation. The problem, according to them, is that I was there the wrong day and that my flight was actually the following day. I knew this wasn't true so I stood there arguing with her for ten to fifteen minutes until she finally just gave me my 2 boarding passes. I'm still not sure what was up with that whole situation and I didn't have time to waste trying to find out.

Another time I flew into an airport for a connection only to get a voice mail saying my next flight was canceled. I was already in the terminal so I asked some airline employees who once again had no idea what I was talking about. I got on that flight just fine as well.

In both cases earlier flights to the same destinations had been canceled. I assume the airlines were trying to get people to not show up so they would have more open seats for the passengers who's flight was actually canceled for real. The second time it happened to me I recognized 3 of the passengers as the flight crew from the flight I had taken in the opposite direction just 5 days earlier. The airline just wanted to get its own employees home so they didn't have to pay them lodging. Unfortunately it was at the expense of people who had purchased tickets.
 
2012-11-01 09:24:10 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?


They don't. They have to provide a refund.

Try reading the article, instead of relying on the submitter's headline. I realize Fark is usually incredibly scrupulous about the accuracy of the headline, but this one seems to have slipped through the gaps.

What airlines don't do any more is offer extra tickets or free hotel rooms to displaced travelers.
 
2012-11-01 09:41:03 PM  
NEWS FLASH: Airlines are not responsible for acts of God.

/they should exchange tickets instead of refunding.
//rescinding the reciprocity rule is just ass rape, though
 
2012-11-01 10:08:40 PM  

pudding7: Satanic_Hamster: StoneColdAtheist: Satanic_Hamster: So why should air lines still get to keep the money?

Because you agree to those terms when you bought the ticket?

Read the fine print.

And why should they be even allowed to do that? Honestly, can you name a single other industry that operates like that? You don't perform the service you don't get the money.

But the airlines are refunding the money. I'm not sure what you're complaining about.


this.

and for other cases, that's what trip insurance is for.
 
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