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(Newsday)   Gov. Cuomo: "There has been a series of extreme weather incidents. That is not a political statement. That is a factual statement. Anyone who says there's not a dramatic change in weather patterns, I think is denying reality"   (newsday.com) divider line 162
    More: Scary, Andrew Cuomo, political statement  
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1323 clicks; posted to Politics » on 31 Oct 2012 at 3:44 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-31 01:26:07 PM
[HERO]
 
2012-10-31 01:29:29 PM
Yet people are biatching because he's "making political speeches" during this time of crisis. Because an unprecedented tidal surge is not something that should make people start thinking about the merest inkling crossing their mind of the possibility of a chance the climate is farked up.
 
2012-10-31 01:32:38 PM
Is this man made? I really don't give a crap. It's here and it's real. And it's going to fark us up. Plan and adapt, or die.
 
2012-10-31 01:35:41 PM

PC LOAD LETTER: Is this man made? I really don't give a crap. It's here and it's real. And it's going to fark us up. Plan and adapt, or die.


Chris Hayes summed it up yesterday.

Whether climate changed "caused" Sandy isn't the point. The point is a) carbon emissions are producing a climate with more extreme weather

- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

b) with more extreme weather will come more extreme weather events *like Sandy* c) extreme weather events will disrupt our lives

- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

<con't> and cause tremendous economic damage, death and human misery. We are presently doing essentially nothing to prepare for this

- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

The scale of what needs to change is mind-boggling: a) re-engineering infrastructure b) revolutionizing our energy sources and transmission

- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

And yet our elites and the beltway are *obsessed* with the nation's budget projections for 2050 (!) and say almost nothing about this threat

- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012
 
2012-10-31 01:46:22 PM
The extreme right wing denying reality?

That would certainly be a new event that was unforeseeable and unprecedented.
 
2012-10-31 03:46:28 PM
Look, there's not! I don't care about facts! I don't care about the weather! Nothing is different, and I don't care what you say! The Bible says things don't change, and that's good enough for me! Plus, China and India, so there!
 
2012-10-31 03:46:35 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: [HERO]


This.
 
2012-10-31 03:49:56 PM
I guess we need a few more hurricanes to quell the "skeptics" who are still being politically cautious dipsh*ts before this gets taken seriously.
 
2012-10-31 03:50:15 PM
Reality, what a concept.
 
2012-10-31 03:50:35 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: PC LOAD LETTER: Is this man made? I really don't give a crap. It's here and it's real. And it's going to fark us up. Plan and adapt, or die.

Chris Hayes summed it up yesterday:


In non-obnoxious, untweetified format:
Whether climate changed "caused" Sandy isn't the point. The point is
a) carbon emissions are producing a climate with more extreme weather
b) with more extreme weather will come more extreme weather events *like Sandy*
c) extreme weather events will disrupt our lives and cause tremendous economic damage, death and human misery. We are presently doing essentially nothing to prepare for this

The scale of what needs to change is mind-boggling: a) re-engineering infrastructure b) revolutionizing our energy sources and transmission And yet our elites and the beltway are *obsessed* with the nation's budget projections for 2050 (!) and say almost nothing about this threat
-Christopher Hayes October 30, 2012 via twitter

/I know it's an amazing technology, STOP
//but god damnit do I find the telegraph style communication annoying STOP
///We need to define a notation for referencing tweets STOP
////Preferably one that doesn't look so much like... twitter. STOP
 
2012-10-31 03:50:43 PM

Freudian_slipknot: The extreme right wing denying reality?

That would certainly be a new event that was unforeseeable and unprecedented.


fail.brm.sk
 
2012-10-31 03:51:19 PM

MyEnamine: Dusk-You-n-Me: [HERO]

This.


The media cannot label a democrat a "hero" because that would mean they are part of liberal MSM and cannot be trusted. The term "hero" can only be applied to Republicans.
 
2012-10-31 03:51:40 PM
It almost seems like people are waking up way too late into the game.
 
2012-10-31 03:51:55 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: PC LOAD LETTER: Is this man made? I really don't give a crap. It's here and it's real. And it's going to fark us up. Plan and adapt, or die.

Chris Hayes summed it up yesterday.

Whether climate changed "caused" Sandy isn't the point. The point is a) carbon emissions are producing a climate with more extreme weather- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

b) with more extreme weather will come more extreme weather events *like Sandy* c) extreme weather events will disrupt our lives- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

<con't> and cause tremendous economic damage, death and human misery. We are presently doing essentially nothing to prepare for this- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

The scale of what needs to change is mind-boggling: a) re-engineering infrastructure b) revolutionizing our energy sources and transmission- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012

And yet our elites and the beltway are *obsessed* with the nation's budget projections for 2050 (!) and say almost nothing about this threat- Christopher Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 30, 2012


I know Hayes has passion for this subject but everytime I see that MSNBC commercial with him riding a bike, I just think to myself "god what a dork".
 
2012-10-31 03:52:13 PM
It's fun to watch humans' greatest flaw become exposed like this. We are so hosed.

\interesting times
 
2012-10-31 03:52:40 PM

BeesNuts: /I know it's an amazing technology, STOP
//but god damnit do I find the telegraph style communication annoying STOP
///We need to define a notation for referencing tweets STOP
////Preferably one that doesn't look so much like... twitter. STOP


Hey I'm with you on this. Every other website has tweet-box rendering built in. Nice and clean. Not sure why Fark is lagging. Or maybe it's not up to them, I'm not a web designer.
 
2012-10-31 03:54:38 PM
Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.
 
2012-10-31 03:58:17 PM

whidbey: I guess we need a few more hurricanes to quell the "skeptics" who are still being politically cautious dipsh*ts before this gets taken seriously.


It's one thing to be "politically cautious."

It's another thing to completely deny the evidence and say that anyone who "believes" it is "part of the conspiracy".

/Lord Bugeye is not being "politically cautious."
 
2012-10-31 03:58:26 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.


^^^^^^A Major Part of the Problem^^^^^
 
2012-10-31 03:58:33 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.


Way to miss the point.

It's not that we're having the most extreme weather ever... it's that we're having extreme weather a lot more often.
 
2012-10-31 03:58:34 PM

JohnAnnArbor: but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways


We are saying that. You got a problem with it?
 
2012-10-31 03:59:43 PM
A friend of mine who lives in NYC posted this on Facebook this morning:

This is absolutely climate change. How can a child who is not even two years old already have been through two hurricanes in NYC?
 
2012-10-31 04:00:21 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.


You a farking moron, and people like you are going to get all of us killed.

fark you.
 
2012-10-31 04:02:38 PM

IlGreven: whidbey: I guess we need a few more hurricanes to quell the "skeptics" who are still being politically cautious dipsh*ts before this gets taken seriously.

It's one thing to be "politically cautious."

It's another thing to completely deny the evidence and say that anyone who "believes" it is "part of the conspiracy".

/Lord Bugeye is not being "politically cautious."


Yeah but you know what? That is still the reason why we're not seeing confident action.

Hell, even the governor of my blue state was in bed with a Canadian coal company.
 
2012-10-31 04:03:20 PM

Evil High Priest: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

You a farking moron, and people like you are going to get all of us killed.

fark you.


Facts? Or just invective?
 
2012-10-31 04:03:26 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: //but god damnit do I find the telegraph style communication annoying STOP


I don't:

i47.tinypic.com

That's my home straight key. I don't have an image of the one in my car.

Yes, I Morse while driving. In the last week or so, I've made contacts to places like Tatakoto Atoll in French Polynesia, Edmond Oklahoma, Riihimaki Finland, Elektrogouli Russia, and Havana Cuba using Morse code from my car. 

/Used to use Morse professionally.
//Google "ditty bopper" to see what I used to do.
 
2012-10-31 04:05:02 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.


My Aunt Sarah once had a huge-boil on her butt that the doctor had to lance and stitch-up. Long story short, I don't feel smoking is necessarily bad for your health.
 
2012-10-31 04:05:24 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Facts? Or just invective?


You're the one ignoring the bulk of scientific consensus.

Yeah it isn't science, it's a "feeling." That's an insult to intelligence, and you deserve what's coming to you here.
 
2012-10-31 04:06:04 PM

Evil High Priest: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

You a farking moron, and people like you are going to get all of us killed.

fark you.


No you a farking moron!

//see what I did there?
 
2012-10-31 04:06:29 PM

ddam: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

Way to miss the point.

It's not that we're having the most extreme weather ever... it's that we're having extreme weather a lot more often.


Again, no calculation to point to. $$$ doesn't count; our coastlines are a LOT more built up than a few decades ago, so each hurricane causes more damage, naturally (with some counter-effect of better construction methods).
 
2012-10-31 04:06:33 PM
If we'd only listen to enviroalarmists, we could have an unvarying climate for the rest of eternity. Yet here we sit, not allowing them the authority to restructure the economy and all of society to attain this end. Tragic.
 
2012-10-31 04:06:44 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.



Ah, another "needs more study" concern troll.
 
2012-10-31 04:06:49 PM
Because NYC being hit by a Hurricane is unprecedented.

OMG! There's bad weather - it's da global warming!

/maybe if stupid people didn't build cities on barrier islands you wouldn't have this problem.
 
2012-10-31 04:08:02 PM
Bah, you liberals, with your facts, and your reality.

/reality can haz liberal bias
 
2012-10-31 04:08:11 PM

beta_plus: Because NYC being hit by a Hurricane is unprecedented.


Congrats, you won an argument with yourself.
 
2012-10-31 04:08:50 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.


The vast majority of climate scientists, including the father of skepticism, Richard Lindzen, say that it's getting warmer, and that it's even our fault. Lindzen departs from many of his colleagues in saying this is a self-correcting system. But neither the notion climate is getting warmer and therefore will result in extreme weather events, nor that it is caused by humans, is anything other than a majority view.

We might ask if mitigation is less expensive than prevention, and the null-hypothesis should be that it is more expensive, but I also expect few studies have examined this nor are they likely give us a definitive answer to whether we can choose to do nothing.

The problem is partly that our economy is totally farked because of this. We just aren't willing to admit it yet. Half of us think we can grow our way out of this with green energy. The other half cling to the hope that mitigation will be inexpensive enough that it will either not be ruinous or so far into the future that it won't affect us, or that we will be able to avoid responsibility for mitigation.

We're doomed. Our golden age was the '90s, and I doubt anyone alive now will see humanity's next golden age. (China's just hoping to get one before it all comes crashing down - they still need a Great Person.)
 
2012-10-31 04:09:01 PM

JohnAnnArbor: ddam: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

Way to miss the point.

It's not that we're having the most extreme weather ever... it's that we're having extreme weather a lot more often.

Again, no calculation to point to. $$$ doesn't count; our coastlines are a LOT more built up than a few decades ago, so each hurricane causes more damage, naturally (with some counter-effect of better construction methods).


We're not talking about damage here. We're talking about number of severe storms per year. And that has been documented and I'm sure people have pointed this to you before but you choose to ignore it.
 
2012-10-31 04:09:04 PM

shower_in_my_socks: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

Ah, another "needs more study" concern troll.


I think you mean "Study it out."
 
2012-10-31 04:09:49 PM

mrshowrules: My Aunt Sarah once had a huge-boil on her butt that the doctor had to lance and stitch-up. Long story short, I don't feel smoking is necessarily bad for your health.


You're suppose to put cigarettes in your mouth. Unless you like having a "Yo Dawg" experience
 
2012-10-31 04:10:32 PM
Oooh, a Halloween Climate Change Thread! Between the popcorn and the rugrats' leftover candy, I'm gonna be hurlin' tonight!
 
2012-10-31 04:11:12 PM

dittybopper: Yes, I Morse while driving. In the last week or so, I've made contacts to places like Tatakoto Atoll in French Polynesia, Edmond Oklahoma, Riihimaki Finland, Elektrogouli Russia, and Havana Cuba using Morse code from my car.


You can contact places all over the world that have shiatty cell phone reception.
 
2012-10-31 04:12:33 PM

Ricardo Klement: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

The vast majority of climate scientists, including the father of skepticism, Richard Lindzen, say that it's getting warmer, and that it's even our fault. Lindzen departs from many of his colleagues in saying this is a self-correcting system. But neither the notion climate is getting warmer and therefore will result in extreme weather events, nor that it is caused by humans, is anything other than a majority view.

We might ask if mitigation is less expensive than prevention, and the null-hypothesis should be that it is more expensive, but I also expect few studies have examined this nor are they likely give us a definitive answer to whether we can choose to do nothing.

The problem is partly that our economy is totally farked because of this. We just aren't willing to admit it yet. Half of us think we can grow our way out of this with green energy. The other half cling to the hope that mitigation will be inexpensive enough that it will either not be ruinous or so far into the future that it won't affect us, or that we will be able to avoid responsibility for mitigation.

We're doomed. Our golden age was the '90s, and I doubt anyone alive now will see humanity's next golden age. (China's just hoping to get one before it all comes crashing down - they still need a Great Person.)


...or the sunspots disappear for a century starting five years from now and we have to worry about cold. The point is: we don't know. The Earth is complex. So is the Sun. We're getting a LOT better at figuring them out, but we've got a long way to go with both.
 
2012-10-31 04:12:47 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: beta_plus: Because NYC being hit by a Hurricane is unprecedented.

Congrats, you won an argument with yourself.


Using facts to make liberals look stupid isn't fair, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!
 
2012-10-31 04:14:42 PM

JohnAnnArbor: The point is: we don't know.


You're making a very good point--for the Flat Earthers.
 
2012-10-31 04:16:17 PM

ddam: We're talking about number of severe storms per year.


Yes, there's been a change. Downward. We've been told "new normal" since Katrina. Seven years ago.

Anybody here old enough to remember the 1950s? 10 (t-e-n) major hurricanes hit the east coast between New England and the Carolinas just from '54 to '60. Irene and Sandy? Two points might make a line in geometry class, but they don't establish, well, whatever the fark chief scientist Cuomo is saying.
 
2012-10-31 04:17:00 PM
Hundreds of hurricanes hit the Gulf/Southren States. Cuomo does not say a thing.
One hurricane hits NYC and he's talking about dramatic changes in the weather patterns? How self centered can this guy be?
 
2012-10-31 04:17:22 PM

JohnAnnArbor: ddam: JohnAnnArbor: Um, odd weather events like this are rare. But not unprecedented.

In 1703, a hurricane hit the UK full-force.

The "little ice age" was still going on. We don't have a perfect understanding of these things and how they work. We're getting better, but saying that these things are a result of Man's Evil Capitalist Ways is pretty much the same as the reactions in 1703 (we have offended the Lord). There's no calculation to point to, just a feeling.

Way to miss the point.

It's not that we're having the most extreme weather ever... it's that we're having extreme weather a lot more often.

Again, no calculation to point to. $$$ doesn't count; our coastlines are a LOT more built up than a few decades ago, so each hurricane causes more damage, naturally (with some counter-effect of better construction methods).


The original calculations were done by Svante Arrhenius in 1896. It is now 2012.

For the record, his assumptions were optimistic compared to what we now know.
 
2012-10-31 04:17:34 PM
*sigh*

Weather isn't climate. Just because we have a few weird storms now and then doesn't mean a thing. "Frankenstorm" Sandy means nothing--during the depths of the Little Ice Age they had record heat waves and killer droughts, one of which set up the Great Fire of London. Sandy was a strange confluence of a tropical storm and a cold nor'easter coming together. That's weather.

Climate is different. Climate is what makes weather. As the climate changes globally, it may or may not impact the weather locally--but what it does do is change things long-term. There MAY be more intense storms, or there may not; but what there will be for sure is things like shorter growing seasons, or extended periods of drought or rain, or decades where winters are a couple of degrees colder than they have been. Those are things we need to worry about, not occasional bad storms or more tornadoes than usual. One or two very cold winters are not bad; a couple of Cat 5 hurricanes are not bad. What IS bad is ten years in a row when the snow pack melts in mid-January instead of mid-February, and then the runoff is gone in May instead of June; then there's no water for irrigation by August and farmers lose the third wheat crop; then food prices go up. THAT is why climate change is a problem. Or if the permafrost in Canada starts to thaw, and we get a huge influx of mosquitoes, and we start seeing West Nile virus moving north.

Not these storms. Weather isn't a problem Climate is.
 
2012-10-31 04:19:40 PM

beta_plus: Using facts to make liberals look stupid isn't fair, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!


You used a fact to argue against a point no one else in the thread, liberal or otherwise, made. Maybe it makes you feel better about yourself, going online and declaring victory against imaginary liberal arguments. I don't get it. But go you.
 
2012-10-31 04:20:58 PM

Gyrfalcon: Sandy was a strange confluence of a tropical storm and a cold nor'easter coming together. That's weather.


The key word being "strange confluence."

Science really isn't regarding it as "strange" anymore, and it's hardly in the minority to indicate that climate change is causing "strange confluences" like Sandy.
 
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