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(Huffington Post)   Romney in CNN debate: Get rid of FEMA, let states handle disasters. Romney campaign now that there's a major emergency: We need to make sure states "have the resources and assistance they need"   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 334
    More: Amusing, Mitt Romney, FEMA, GOP, hurricane warning, United States, Ocean City, Hilton Head Island, Hurricane Irene  
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7713 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Oct 2012 at 3:06 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-29 03:40:17 AM

Frederick: \looking at you Kansas


I live in kansas, and we had a severe drought this summer. I can't help but wonder who all those farmers who cashed their federally subsidized crop insurance checks are still voting for romney and tea partiers with out any hint of the irony.
 
2012-10-29 03:41:17 AM

brigid_fitch:
Nope--the state has to declare a state of emergency and request assistance from FEMA. In fact, that was a contributing factor to the Katrina fiasco. Gov. Blanco didn't declare a state of emergency soon enough, delaying aid. Granted, the entire situation still managed to get royally botched from there, but the delay in requesting additional aid certainly didn't help them any.

By contrast, the MS governor declared it a day before LA did and FEMA was already standing by at the first hint of problems.


True. I remember at the time being stunned at how long it was taking the state government of LA to do anything, and being flat-out flabbergasted on reading that Bush actually called them to ask them what the hell they were doing. I wonder how much lower the death toll would have been if the governor had acted sooner.
 
2012-10-29 03:42:32 AM
Can I ruin the thread?

MITT ROMNEY IS A CHODE
 
2012-10-29 03:42:41 AM
To be fair, as a Democrat, we will see this same type of pandering in 4 years from the left.

But for right now, who would vote for this dickwad Romney?
 
2012-10-29 03:44:02 AM

SlappyKincaid:
As for Hume I have not read his works but I have read Kant among others. I will check him out. Thanks!


[facepalm.jpg]
How the fark can you believe you comprehend a critique of the philosophy of the Enlightenment - Kant's Critique of Pure Reason was an explicit refutation of Hume - if you haven't studied the actual philosophy of the Enlightenment?

PS We tried having a weak federal government. The Articles of Confederation were an abject failure.
 
2012-10-29 03:44:45 AM

tuna fingers: To be fair, as a Democrat, we will see this same type of pandering in 4 years from the left.

But for right now, who would vote for this dickwad Romney?


Not nearly to the level of this years republican antics.
 
2012-10-29 03:44:49 AM

katfairy: brigid_fitch:
Nope--the state has to declare a state of emergency and request assistance from FEMA. In fact, that was a contributing factor to the Katrina fiasco. Gov. Blanco didn't declare a state of emergency soon enough, delaying aid. Granted, the entire situation still managed to get royally botched from there, but the delay in requesting additional aid certainly didn't help them any.

By contrast, the MS governor declared it a day before LA did and FEMA was already standing by at the first hint of problems.

True. I remember at the time being stunned at how long it was taking the state government of LA to do anything, and being flat-out flabbergasted on reading that Bush actually called them to ask them what the hell they were doing. I wonder how much lower the death toll would have been if the governor had acted sooner.


There was a horrible delay in response to that disaster. Just awful. I hope that never happens again.

I still don't know if the State Government can override FEMA once they are envoked, or if FEMA can override the state government. It may be a question semantics but I'm curious to know the answer!
 
2012-10-29 03:46:40 AM

gameshowhost: Can I ruin the thread?

MITT ROMNEY IS A CHODE


DAMN YOU GAMESHOWHOST

We are acting like grownups here!
 
2012-10-29 03:47:05 AM

SlappyKincaid: katfairy: brigid_fitch:
Nope--the state has to declare a state of emergency and request assistance from FEMA. In fact, that was a contributing factor to the Katrina fiasco. Gov. Blanco didn't declare a state of emergency soon enough, delaying aid. Granted, the entire situation still managed to get royally botched from there, but the delay in requesting additional aid certainly didn't help them any.

By contrast, the MS governor declared it a day before LA did and FEMA was already standing by at the first hint of problems.

True. I remember at the time being stunned at how long it was taking the state government of LA to do anything, and being flat-out flabbergasted on reading that Bush actually called them to ask them what the hell they were doing. I wonder how much lower the death toll would have been if the governor had acted sooner.

There was a horrible delay in response to that disaster. Just awful. I hope that never happens again.

I still don't know if the State Government can override FEMA once they are envoked, or if FEMA can override the state government. It may be a question semantics but I'm curious to know the answer!


FEMA can be overridden by state governments. Unless if there is a military rebellion, the Federal government must respect their sovereignty
 
2012-10-29 03:47:48 AM

Genevieve Marie: gameshowhost: Can I ruin the thread?

MITT ROMNEY IS A CHODE

DAMN YOU GAMESHOWHOST

We are acting like grownups here!


*teehee*
 
2012-10-29 03:47:52 AM

SlappyKincaid: katfairy: brigid_fitch:
Nope--the state has to declare a state of emergency and request assistance from FEMA. In fact, that was a contributing factor to the Katrina fiasco. Gov. Blanco didn't declare a state of emergency soon enough, delaying aid. Granted, the entire situation still managed to get royally botched from there, but the delay in requesting additional aid certainly didn't help them any.

By contrast, the MS governor declared it a day before LA did and FEMA was already standing by at the first hint of problems.

True. I remember at the time being stunned at how long it was taking the state government of LA to do anything, and being flat-out flabbergasted on reading that Bush actually called them to ask them what the hell they were doing. I wonder how much lower the death toll would have been if the governor had acted sooner.

There was a horrible delay in response to that disaster. Just awful. I hope that never happens again.

I still don't know if the State Government can override FEMA once they are envoked, or if FEMA can override the state government. It may be a question semantics but I'm curious to know the answer!


It cost her re-election too. The vast majority of my friends are progressives, and many of them went through Katrina. (My family did, I was in school in another state)

None of them voted for her again. Several of them held  their noses and voted Republican to get rid of her.
 
2012-10-29 03:48:34 AM
Of course, when he says the states should have the resources and assistance they need, he means the all-benevolent and community-loving private corporations, who will be happy to discount the prices on their emergency goods so they only make a 10% profit rather than their usual 30%. This is, of course, because the big bad EEEEEEEEEEBIL gubmint can't do anything right.
 
2012-10-29 03:48:47 AM

brigid_fitch: sendtodave: brigid_fitch: I think that's why Christie waited as long as he did to declare it (3pm today, as opposed to the rest of the East Coast states who declared it on Saturday). He's gunning for a 2016 presidential election and doesn't want to be seen relying on the Feds.

If FEMA comes late to the party, he can blame Obama. Natch.

As I said in another thread, if anyone--especially someone in NJ--complains that FEMA didn't act quickly enough, I'm going to beat them over the head w/a video of Christie's 2:45pm press conference. We were the last state on the East Coast to declare a state of emergency. That means FEMA had put aside resources for 7-8 states before we got added to the list.


Beat them over the head all you want, facts don't matter. Obama will be blamed for any delay in the response.

I'm thinking that Christie is playing politics with his constituency's lives.
 
2012-10-29 03:49:39 AM

sendtodave: brigid_fitch: sendtodave: brigid_fitch: I think that's why Christie waited as long as he did to declare it (3pm today, as opposed to the rest of the East Coast states who declared it on Saturday). He's gunning for a 2016 presidential election and doesn't want to be seen relying on the Feds.

If FEMA comes late to the party, he can blame Obama. Natch.

As I said in another thread, if anyone--especially someone in NJ--complains that FEMA didn't act quickly enough, I'm going to beat them over the head w/a video of Christie's 2:45pm press conference. We were the last state on the East Coast to declare a state of emergency. That means FEMA had put aside resources for 7-8 states before we got added to the list.

Beat them over the head all you want, facts don't matter. Obama will be blamed for any delay in the response.

I'm thinking that Christie is playing politics with his constituency's lives.


Like Bush was with Katrina, right? Two can play that game
 
2012-10-29 03:50:51 AM

sendtodave: I'm thinking that Christie is playing politics with his constituency's lives.


I honestly don't think it'll go there. Katrina taught a lot of lessons there- and I guarantee they're prepared. I doubt there will be a delay in the response.
 
2012-10-29 03:52:22 AM
There is an easy out for Rmoney.

"Yes, I want to kill FEMA and turn it over to the States, but that will be with block grants to the States so that they can more efficiently manage their disasters. But until you elect me President, that is not yet possible."

I'll bet you $10,000 that is his answer.
 
2012-10-29 03:53:18 AM

cman: Like Bush was with Katrina, right? Two can play that game


My thoughts there have always been... never attribute malice to that which can be explained by ignorance.

I genuinely believe that most of the federal agencies were completely and totally unprepared to deal with as many people who live in abject poverty as we have in New Orleans. I think there was some assumption that they had more resources than they did.

You almost have to live there for awhile to really get how many people in that city have almost nothing.
 
2012-10-29 03:53:40 AM

cman:

FEMA can be overridden by state governments. Unless if there is a military rebellion, the Federal government must respect their sovereignty


I hope you're right. Part of me, the skeptic in me, questions that. But I do hope you're right!



Genevieve Marie:

It cost her re-election too. The vast majority of my friends are progressives, and many of them went through Katrina. (My family did, I was in school in another state)

None of them voted for her again. Several of them held  their noses and voted Republican to get rid of her.


So it was the governor that delayed FEMA and other agencies from responding quickly to the disaster? I knew there was delays but I always thought it was, in part, the Bush Administration's fault. If the local state doesn't invoke a state of emergency or request FEMA, I guess that means the federal government's hands are tied, which is what others said earlier in posts.

If anything, that answers my question then.

Very good to know! Thanks!
 
2012-10-29 03:56:28 AM

cman: Like Bush was with Katrina, right? Two can play that game


Playing games is precisely what we should NOT be doing.
 
2012-10-29 03:57:06 AM

propasaurus: Romney has been consistently white


americablog.com
 
2012-10-29 03:58:32 AM

SlappyKincaid: So it was the governor that delayed FEMA and other agencies from responding quickly to the disaster? I knew there was delays but I always thought it was, in part, the Bush Administration's fault. If the local state doesn't invoke a state of emergency or request FEMA, I guess that means the federal government's hands are tied, which is what others said earlier in posts.

If anything, that answers my question then.

Very good to know! Thanks!



Honestly- it was a combination of a lot of failures by a lot of people. This is actually a pretty decent summary: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_government_response_to_Hurr i cane_Katrina

 
 
2012-10-29 03:58:56 AM

propasaurus: I can't wait for the shills to get here with their rationalizations for this. Talking points are being distributed right about now.
I'm sure it'll be something about bloated federal government stealing tax money from citizens/states and the states could do better without burdensome federal FEMA/EPA regulations, but since FEMA hasn't been abolished yet we deserve to get back all the tax money we've paid into the failed bureaucracy and Obama failed to respond in time because he's punishing red states for not voting for him.
And something something Benghazi.


but....but....but....but....but....but....but....OBAMAPHONES IN BENGHAZI.
 
2012-10-29 03:59:25 AM

sendtodave: cman: Like Bush was with Katrina, right? Two can play that game

Playing games is precisely what we should NOT be doing.


I wasnt playing a real game, I was using an idiom to say that if you are gonna biatch about one person farking it up for everyone at least be consistent when a team member does the same a few years later.
 
2012-10-29 04:00:04 AM

Mikey1969: There is a reason that a lot of this stuff is done at the federal level.


I no rite? Federales jist wanna take away mah freedumbs.
 
2012-10-29 04:00:21 AM

Genevieve Marie:
Honestly- it was a combination of a lot of failures by a lot of people. This is actually a pretty decent summary: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_government_response_to_Hurr i cane_Katrina


Awesome. These are the kinds of links I love reading. Thanks for this!
 
2012-10-29 04:03:15 AM
I never believed in shape shifters until I saw that man attempt to debate Obama.
 
2012-10-29 04:04:15 AM

AbbeySomeone: I never believed in shape shifters until I saw that man attempt to debate Obama.


I believe the political correct title is "changeling", you bigot
 
2012-10-29 04:05:52 AM

Stibium: Mikey1969: There is a reason that a lot of this stuff is done at the federal level.

I no rite? Federales jist wanna take away mah freedumbs.


Awesome... More like awesome squared.
 
2012-10-29 04:06:17 AM

AbbeySomeone: I never believed in shape shifters until I saw that man attempt to debate Obama.



Heh. That just reminded me of boggarts, from Harry Potter. Take the shape of whatever frightens you most.
 
2012-10-29 04:11:29 AM
If you hold up a plate with two slits in it in front of Mitt Romney and place a screen behind it, you can clearly see an interference pattern on the screen, demonstrating the dual quantum nature of Romney.
 
2012-10-29 04:13:04 AM

0Icky0: There is an easy out for Rmoney.

"Yes, I want to kill FEMA and turn it over to the States, but that will be with block grants to the States so that they can more efficiently manage their disasters. But until you elect me President, that is not yet possible."

I'll bet you $10,000 that is his answer.


But isn't that evil redistribution?

I would bet he says something completely illogical, like "The federal government could have responded sooner to this storm, but FEMA refused to act until the state governors asked directly. So vote for me, and we'll use the money from a decrease in capital gains tax to fund state disaster programs that would have prevented this storm. Oh, and I would have prevented the seas from rising."
 
2012-10-29 04:16:26 AM

T-Servo: But isn't that evil redistribution?

I would bet he says something completely illogical, like "The federal government could have responded sooner to this storm, but FEMA refused to act until the state governors asked directly. So vote for me, and we'll use the money from a decrease in capital gains tax to fund state disaster programs that would have prevented this storm. Oh, and I would have prevented the seas from rising."


I'm kind of hoping that the storm impact isn't as bad as predicted and all disaster relief efforts run according to plan, personally. That way residents of these states get the help they need quickly, and the rest of us are spared from ever having to hear that speech.

Everyone wins!
 
2012-10-29 04:18:29 AM

Genevieve Marie:
I'm kind of hoping that the storm impact isn't as bad as predicted and all disaster relief efforts run according to plan, personally. That way residents of these states get the help they need quickly, and the rest of us are spared from ever having to hear that speech.

Everyone wins!


I completely agree. I truly hope this becomes a non-issue. The way every meteorologist is talking about this, I doubt it, but I do hope you're right!
 
2012-10-29 04:18:52 AM

cman: AbbeySomeone: I never believed in shape shifters until I saw that man attempt to debate Obama.

I believe the political correct title is "changeling", you bigot


The preferred nomenclature is 'speciest'.
 
2012-10-29 04:19:11 AM
Notice also what he said about privatization; sending that money to the private sector would be better than either the feds or the states handling emergency response. He didn't say that the private sector should step in and take over disaster relief or that private enterprise should fill gaps in coverage or anything like that. He said we should send the money we now spend on FEMA directly to the private sector. Then, what? Trust that they'll be there when needed? That if you didn't pay your disaster response company they won't dig your house out of the rubble?
 
2012-10-29 04:19:55 AM

Genevieve Marie: T-Servo: But isn't that evil redistribution?

I would bet he says something completely illogical, like "The federal government could have responded sooner to this storm, but FEMA refused to act until the state governors asked directly. So vote for me, and we'll use the money from a decrease in capital gains tax to fund state disaster programs that would have prevented this storm. Oh, and I would have prevented the seas from rising."

I'm kind of hoping that the storm impact isn't as bad as predicted and all disaster relief efforts run according to plan, personally. That way residents of these states get the help they need quickly, and the rest of us are spared from ever having to hear that speech.

Everyone wins!


I agree completely, and actually, I think that's the way it'll play out.
 
2012-10-29 04:24:30 AM

SlappyKincaid: Genevieve Marie:
I'm kind of hoping that the storm impact isn't as bad as predicted and all disaster relief efforts run according to plan, personally. That way residents of these states get the help they need quickly, and the rest of us are spared from ever having to hear that speech.

Everyone wins!

I completely agree. I truly hope this becomes a non-issue. The way every meteorologist is talking about this, I doubt it, but I do hope you're right!



I have never wanted to see a right turn happen so much in my life than this week.
 
2012-10-29 04:25:19 AM

sendtodave: I'm thinking that Christie is playing politics with his constituency's lives.


I think that part of it is he may now have national ambitions, and the clip of him telling people "Get the hell off the beach in Asbury Park and get out. You're done. It's 4:30, you've maximized your tan. Get off the beach." is haunting him it adds to the whole Jersey thug image he cant win with.

Im pissed with my mayor who has only closed schools on Monday. A third of all students take public transit to schools, and much more in upper grades. they would need to get the trains started by 6pm on tues to have the trains running in time and I dont think that will be happening. Hell they closed wall st, but they even shut electronic trading.
 
2012-10-29 04:25:57 AM

homelessdude:
I have never wanted to see a right turn happen so much in my life than this week.


Indeed!
 
2012-10-29 04:26:03 AM

Genevieve Marie: I'm kind of hoping that the storm impact isn't as bad as predicted and all disaster relief efforts run according to plan, personally. That way residents of these states get the help they need quickly, and the rest of us are spared from ever having to hear that speech.


I hope it isn't bad, either, I was just commenting on how everything will be spun for political gain at this time. I hear people complaining about the Hawaii tsunami warning and how it's a waste of government resources ("We can do this on our own!"), the same survivalist-cowboy crap I hear from my parents all the time.

But I suspect the flooding will be very bad, indeed.

/love your dog
 
2012-10-29 04:28:03 AM

Genevieve Marie: cman: Like Bush was with Katrina, right? Two can play that game

My thoughts there have always been... never attribute malice to that which can be explained by ignorance.

I genuinely believe that most of the federal agencies were completely and totally unprepared to deal with as many people who live in abject poverty as we have in New Orleans. I think there was some assumption that they had more resources than they did.

You almost have to live there for awhile to really get how many people in that city have almost nothing.


Absolute pureed bullshiat, sweetheart. I read an article in Scientific American several years prior to Katrina that described the exact thing that happened and how horrible it would. Lots of people knew, the people in charge didn't care.
 
2012-10-29 04:30:12 AM

T-Servo: /love your dog


Thank you. She's happily snoring on my feet as I post. I'll pass along the compliment.

And yea, I just don't quite know what to expect from this one. Flooding for sure. I really do think the emergecy response teams are going to be super efficient this time. And it helps that you're not dealing with some of the unique challenges the gulf coast presents.

 
 
2012-10-29 04:34:29 AM

AdrienVeidt: Absolute pureed bullshiat, sweetheart. I read an article in Scientific American several years prior to Katrina that described the exact thing that happened and how horrible it would. Lots of people knew, the people in charge didn't care.


I don't overly care for being called sweetheart- probably because I read it in a New Jersey accent. *shudder*

But aside from that, I understand your point as well. I just know I've read about it quite a bit, and I know a lot of people that lived through it, and I think there was just a chain of major screw ups. Some from incompetence, but you're right- some because people didn't care.

 I just try not to lose sight of how complicated the disaster response to that storm was and I try not to lay all the blame in one place.
 
2012-10-29 04:36:35 AM

T-Servo: I hear people complaining about the Hawaii tsunami warning and how it's a waste of government resources ("We can do this on our own!"), the same survivalist-cowboy crap I hear from my parents all the time.


Yep, and they're the FIRST ones to biatch when the warning DOESN'T come. Seriously, I don't understand how people can complain about being warned of a potential disaster when all of the prerequisites are in place. With something like a tsunami or a hurricane, I'd rather the government over react than under react...
 
2012-10-29 04:39:46 AM
Alright my nightly ambien has begun to kick in, so I'll take my leave before I start doing something embarassing, like writing bad poetry.

I really enjoyed talked to everyone. Have a good week.
 
2012-10-29 04:42:51 AM

IlGreven: Of course, when he says the states should have the resources and assistance they need, he means the all-benevolent and community-loving private corporations, who will be happy to discount the prices on their emergency goods so they only make a 10% profit rather than their usual 30%. This is, of course, because the big bad EEEEEEEEEEBIL gubmint can't do anything right.


Yeah, scary part is; he said EXACTLY that...

And if you can go even further, and send it back to the private sector, that's even better.

Seriously, what kind of nutter can actually convince himself that the private sector acts out of the benevolence of its own heart? There would be absolutely zero upside to putting disaster relief in the hands of the private sector, and I would bet that even the most pro-business, libbie hating Republican would admit this if they would just stop and THINK for one second.
 
2012-10-29 04:43:40 AM

Lionel Mandrake: teto85: Mittens ist ein arseloch Arschloch.

Aber du bist richtig


Du auch.

/Also
 
2012-10-29 04:50:30 AM

SlappyKincaid: log_jammin: SlappyKincaid: Thanks for the info. The if the National Guard already does this at a statewide level why is FEMA needed? Is it purely coordination or do they put boots on the ground?

I follow politics pretty closely however I am lacking in understanding about FEMA. I know what the acronym means but I can't find a true reason why they are not superfluous.


resources. Bottled water, food, communications, doctors, coordinating state relief efforts with federal efforts, etc.. It's just a way to provide more than what one state can do on it's own.

Again thanks. It just seems to be that a state should be able to supply much of this, short of full devastation, without having to rely on others, especially in a populous state. I live in Chicago, IL and if we had massive damage due to Tornadoes, which we do get from time to time, I don't see why we can't send in our own doctors etc. Each state could have an army of volunteers. I would sign up and volunteer my talents in case of disaster.

I'm just trying to find a creative way to solve the problem that would also help mitigate cost to the tax payers.


Okay then. Who is going to pay for the medication, shelters, food, water, transportation, etc.? Speaking of the medication, let's not forget all that goes under that label: anesthetics, antibiotics, sterilization of instruments --- oh wait! Who is going to provide the instruments, facilities, etc.? Who will pay for all of that?

Is all of this just going to fall free form the skies like manna?

That was one derptastic suggestion, d3wd.
 
2012-10-29 04:50:51 AM
Romney "I saved the Olympics" (on the back of the Fed)

Romney "Every time you have an occasion to take something from the federal government and send it back to the states, that's the right direction."

Sounds consistent to me.
 
2012-10-29 04:51:37 AM
images2.sina.com

Don't be suprised if Romney wins. THIS guy was re-elected.

Think about that. 

The whole nation can be informed of their candidates GROSS unsuitability to hold office. Doesn't matter. Half the nation WILL vote for them if they have an -R after their name. 

You could have thousands of Americans die because of the deliberate inaction of a candidate. Twice. It STILL wouldn't mean a thing. They're voting GOP. 

/ But seriously, a Missile Shield would solve everything.
 
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