mysticcat: Barry Bonds* took anabolic steroids, not corticosteroids. Big difference.
IlGreven: mysticcat: Barry Bonds* took anabolic steroids, not corticosteroids. Big difference.It took three federal grand juries to indict him on anything relating to that, and that was just for perjury. And he still has yet to be tried on that point. So if you have evidence that federal prosecutors don't, by all means bring it to their attention.
Darwin's Prophet: mysticcat: Barry Bonds* took anabolic steroids, not corticosteroids. Big difference.And this is a long-known potential side effect of corticosteroids.
red5ish: I am not convinced that steroids used by professional athletes do anything more than allow them to heal more quickly and exercise to better effect (i.e. exercise longer with shorter recovery time) which might be termed improved endurance. This allows athletes to recover more rapidly from injury and to add muscle mass, through exercise, at a faster than normal rate.I know of no evidence that steroids improve eyesight, reaction time, eye-hand coordination, agility, or athleticism.My objection to steroid use by athletes is based on the negative side effects. I do not object to them being used to help in the healing process or, in moderation, to increase endurance to aid physical training, any more than I object to the use of sun screen to avoid sunburn, icing down an arm after pitching a game, or inhaling oxygen on the sidelines after a hard run.
ElwoodCuse: Doesn't even matter what he did or didn't take, you don't get to be the best baseball player of all time because of drugs.
forgotmydamnusername: They do increase athleticism. They increase strength abnormally, beyond where genetics would otherwise let it go. For an event where strength is important, this is obviously an unfair advantage. Ask Ben Johnson or Marion Jones whether steroids can make you faster.
Dear Jerk: Bonds has been convicted in the court of public opinion, which is not always wrong. He won't be fined, he won't go to the big house because of it, but it does make him a pariah, which is income limiting.
Fark_Guy_Rob: Yeah there are.
red5ish: Fark_Guy_Rob: Yeah there are.No, there aren't. Link
red5ish: Because Bonds is black and unfriendly to sports reporters and had the temerity to break sacred records he has been abused by the press and the public. We can see in this "post-racial" America how successful black men are fairly treated by public opinion, which apparently has the questionable status of being "not always wrong" or, to put it another way, is almost never right.
cato113: red5ish: Fark_Guy_Rob: Yeah there are.No, there aren't. LinkFrom the first bloody sentence,Anabolic androgenic steroids are synthetic derivatives of the male hormone testosterone that are taken to build muscle, enhance performance, and improve appearance.It would also help your case if you found something more current than a 20 year old gym class hand out
mjbok: The fact that he refused to talk to the press and was generally thought of as a douche has nothing to do with his pariah status, right?
red5ish: Because Bonds is black and unfriendly to sports reporters and had the temerity to break sacred records he has been abused by the press and the public.
red5ish: forgotmydamnusername: They do increase athleticism. They increase strength abnormally, beyond where genetics would otherwise let it go. For an event where strength is important, this is obviously an unfair advantage. Ask Ben Johnson or Marion Jones whether steroids can make you faster.They allow the user to increase muscle mass more quickly through exercise but do not increase athleticism. The musculature of the athletes you gave as examples is well within normal range. The only time you see "beyond where genetics would otherwise let it go" is in body builders. Steroids do not make muscles that are faster.I agree that in sports where strength is important there is the possibility of abuse, which is why I said I don't object to steroid use "in moderation". My personal objection to steroid use is to the bad side effects, and the pressure young athletes might feel to use steroids to be competitive.There is a widely held view that using steroids results in some sort of magical improvement in performance and that is a view not supported by facts. Even the athletes who use steroids may believe this and there is a placebo effect in play.
red5ish: I wouldn't have mentioned Bonds' race at all if I thought his generally being a douche fully explained the insane degree of animosity and hatred directed at him, but it doesn't. If you don't recognize that there is a racist element underlying the vitriol then you are willfully ignoring something that is pretty damned obvious.
mjbok: Maybe, just maybe, that race is so important to you says more about you than those that judge him.
ISO15693: mysticcat: Barry Bonds* took anabolic steroids, not corticosteroids. Big difference.[www.wisdomportal.com image 666x490]Recognize this iconic image? Kirk Gibson's Amazing HR?Yeah, Kirk Gibson was on stanozolol at the time. An anabaolic steroid. The same steroid that got Ben Johnson's Olympic record 100m gold medal revoked.Gibson was a proven juicer, this iconic image is of a roider, hitting a PED enhanced HR - yet people still feel good about his HR, and sweep his PED use under the rug - because they -liked- Gibson.But you dont see people going around like douches putting asterisks next to his name, or the dodgers for that matter.
red5ish: If it appears that I feel that being black is the biggest contributor to people hating Bonds that was not my intention
red5ish: I believe Bonds was the target of unprecedented media bashing because he was unfriendly to the media and because he broke really big records. Bonds was singled out by the media to be the example and prime recipient of scathing media attention surrounding steroids. You can hold up Armstrong and McGuire as examples but there is no comparison to the amount of trashing and hate that was directed at Bonds
182: MOTHERfarkING THIS!!!/big fan of gibson//doesn't give a shiat if they all took steriods
red5ish: I am not convinced that steroids used by professional athletes do anything more than allow them to heal more quickly and exercise to better effect
Jedekai: [Kirby Picture]
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