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(Slate)   "The Case for Not Voting." Apparently it boils down to being too busy   (slate.com) divider line 474
    More: Asinine, Lena Dunham, false choice, Biden  
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6662 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Oct 2012 at 12:29 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-26 02:41:29 PM

GanjSmokr: You keep leaving out / ignoring / dismissing the fact that if Gary Johnson gets enough "throw away" votes, it changes the game next presidential election.


Is this some sort of bad joke I'm not in on? I'm just going to assume yes. Or your a troll. Or both.
 
2012-10-26 02:41:32 PM
Warlordtrooper

rumpelstiltskin: Voting is a responsiblilty in a democracy, not a right.

Actually voting is a constitutionally protected right.

Care to quote the Article and Section that appears in?
 
2012-10-26 02:42:15 PM
I live in Oklahoma. This election, like almost every presdiential election, features no 3rd party presidential candidates and write-in votes are not allowed. I dont want to vote for either presidential candidate so what do I do?

Oklahoma has a minimum 50,000 signatures required to get a presidential candidate (one of the highest in the country) on the ballot and one of only 5 states not allowing write-ins. Until something is done at the state level to include 3rd party candidates abstaining from presidential voting seems the only logical and ethical option.
 
2012-10-26 02:42:17 PM

The Southern Logic Company: Not registered, not voting, never voted, not going to vote.

Until we have something that isn't a two party system, I am not going to bother with it.


I'm not being an asshole, I promise, but do you think the two party system is just going to magically go away? Then you can swing by and vote for your perfect candidate? We have to make the change happen, not just sit by and watch these pricks run our country into the ground.
 
2012-10-26 02:43:41 PM

lennavan: I already voted but I'm thinkin of writing a nice trolly letter to Obama and a some IL Democrats:

Dear Mr President,

As an enthusiastic supporter of yours I just wanted to wish you the best of luck in the election. You have turned the country's economy around, made the country more secure, provided equal rights for many, improved health insurance directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy, amongst many other great accomplishments. I can only hope for four more years just like this. Unfortunately I will not be voting, I can't get off of work that day.

Hugs,
~Lenny


Lennmeister. 78% of people filing for bankruptcy had medical insurance.
 
2012-10-26 02:43:45 PM

Honest Bender: GanjSmokr: Throw Gary Johnson a vote. If he gets 5%, things might be more interesting next time around.

Unless you like being limited to the choices of CW1 and CW2 (which it seems you don't), do something to initiate change. If Gary Johnson gets 5% of the vote this time, we could see some change next time around.

I've just GOT to ask... what's your logic behind this? That if Random Dude gets a paltry number of votes, somehow it'll shake up the whole corrupt system?


If Gary Johnson gets 5% of the popular vote, the Libertarian party will be entitled to matching federal funds (about $90 million) from the Federal Government next presidential election.

Again, unless you enjoy being tied to the 2 choices of (R) guy and (D) guy that are being essentially forced upon you, throw your vote away on Gary Johnson.
 
2012-10-26 02:44:09 PM

signaljammer: Here in Il, the good guys are polling way ahead.


Nice.
 
2012-10-26 02:44:21 PM

lennavan
I'm sorry, I can't hear you. And neither can anyone else.




and yet you keep responding somehow.
So you're incapable of even understanding your own words.



/nice effort, though
 
2012-10-26 02:44:25 PM
I'm sure that if I wrote my vote on the back of $1,000,000 campaign contribution that it would actually count for something. But being poor, I could cast my ballot into a paper shredder and nothing would change.
 
2012-10-26 02:44:27 PM

FlashHarry: shiat like this just makes my blood farking boil. what farking arrogance. what farking laziness. what farking entitlement. when millions live under oppressive dictatorship around the world, to not exercise your sacred right of suffrage is just farking disgusting.


And that right there is reason enough not to vote. So some douchenozzle who has no farking right pushing his views on others can get filled with self-righteous indignation. fark you right in your inflamed brown eye with a rusty cheese grater FlashHarry! It's not up to you to decide if I vote or not.
 
2012-10-26 02:45:21 PM

midigod: I could give you quotes


Just for insano, here are a few. They're not all Founding Fathers, but the ones who aren't are still eminently qualified:

"Now more than ever before, the people are responsible for the character of their Congress. If that body be ignorant, reckless and corrupt, it is because the people tolerate ignorance, recklessness and corruption. If it be intelligent, brave and pure, it is because the people demand these high qualities to represent them in the national legislature.... If the next centennial does not find us a great nation ... it will be because those who represent the enterprise, the culture, and the morality of the nation do not aid in controlling the political forces."
- James Garfield

"To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men."
- Abraham Lincoln

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine

"It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from its government."
- Thomas Paine

A nation, as a society, forms a moral person, and every member of it is personally responsible for his society.
- Thomas Jefferson, Founding Father and third U.S. president (1743-1826), in a letter to George Hammond, 1792

"We the People are the rightful masters of both Congress and the Courts--not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
- Abraham Lincoln

This country will not be a good place for any of us to live in unless we make it a good place for all of us to live in.
- Theodore Roosevelt, American adventurer and 26th president (1858-1919)

Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost.
- John Quincy Adams

"The jaws of power are always open to devour, and her arm is always stretched out, if possible, to destroy the freedom of thinking, speaking, and writing."
- John Adams

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams

"If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin."
- Samuel Adams

"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
- Thomas Jefferson to Charles Yancey, 1816 

/peace out
 
2012-10-26 02:45:24 PM

GanjSmokr: Honest Bender: ProfessorOhki: If you don't vote at all, you're still tossing it in the trash; same net.

Yes. That's exactly the point I was trying to make. That the difference between voting and not voting is the same as leaving a piece of trash in the trash can vs. picking it up and selecting a different trash can to put it in.

But apparently I have a civic duty to select which trash can my trash should be put into. Regardless of the fact that it's all going to the landfill.

You keep leaving out / ignoring / dismissing the fact that if Gary Johnson gets enough "throw away" votes, it changes the game next presidential election. It's NOT the same trash can. In the Gary Johnson trash can, there's a chance it's going to make some change.  There's a chance you might actually get a "choice" next presidential election if enough of us do this.


Yep. It's not like we only have two Presidential candidates. On my ballot, I counted eight different sets of Presidential & Vice-Presidential candidates. Vote for one whose values you support. If you think "voting for someone that is going to lose anyway" somehow equals "throwing away your vote", you don't really understand the electoral process - sure, your guy won't win, but the point is to ensure that your guy, or your party, or your set of values, morals, and/or ethics remain represented in future elections, too.

If you're not voting at all, you're undermining the electoral process. You don't care who represents you.
 
2012-10-26 02:45:29 PM
I'll go out and vote when my ballot matters as much as one from Ohio or Florida, and not a day sooner.

I don't care about our throw-away third party, and Johnson's ideas don't particularly impress me anyways. I don't plan on living here much longer so the local stuff isn't relevant to me either.
 
2012-10-26 02:46:07 PM
To hear of women of all people not voting pisses me right the hell off. Do you know the violence women in this country suffered for decades in order to vote? Do you know in how many countries on the earth this day would kill a woman rather than let her vote? Historically women have been told you don't have the mind to vote because of your vagina. What the hell is wrong with you non-voters? I don't care who the hell you vote for, but if you have a vagina and don't vote then you support everyone that does violence to women.

/not all that much of an exaggeration.
 
2012-10-26 02:46:46 PM

Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy,

Really? Uninsured people were the number one reason for bankruptcy?

Maybe you can show us a link to a webpage that backs up this assertion.


Well. Medical expenses were the #1 cause for bankruptcy in the US

"but a new study done by Harvard University suggests that more than 62% of all personal bankruptcies are caused by the cost of over-whelming medical expenses."

http://www.giveforward.com/blog/medical-expenses-top-cause-of-bankrup t cy-in-the-united-states
 
2012-10-26 02:47:22 PM
There are better things I can do with my time like serve in a soup kitchen, work for habitat for humanity, help a friend going through a divorce, oh and research the procedure for opening a grand cayman bank account and investment company.

I have read alot of these comments, and comments by others, but nobody has managed to convince me how becoming informed (the real time commitment) or even standing in line for a day just to fill out more paperwork is a good use of my time.

Almost every single benefit I get from government is from the state. The only federal benefit I know of that I benefit from is the military. And before anybody says anything, I consider social security a tax. I am not counting on it for shiat.
 
2012-10-26 02:47:29 PM

Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy,

Really? Uninsured people were the number one reason for bankruptcy?

Maybe you can show us a link to a webpage that backs up this assertion.


I didn't say uninsured people. I said health insurance, see for instance preexisting conditions and lifetime benefit caps. Insured people go bankrupt because of their health insurance too.

1. Medical Expenses

A study done at Harvard University indicates that this is the biggest cause of bankruptcy, representing 62% of all personal bankruptcies. One of the interesting caveats of this study shows that 78% of filers had some form of health insurance, thus bucking the myth that medical bills affect only the uninsured.


Link

You can google "united states reason for bankruptcy" if you would like a different reference.
 
2012-10-26 02:49:30 PM
I approve of Katy Perry in a short, tight-ish dress.
 
2012-10-26 02:50:04 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: Kittahinaborx: GanjSmokr: moefuggenbrew: Hey, who do I vote for if I want legal weed?

If you're serious, you should do research on it.

I'll give you a hint who NOT to vote for it you want legal weed, Romney/Obama.

Roseanne Barr (Yes, THAT Roseanne Barr *from TV* ) is on the list of presidential candidates this time around and I know she is for legalizing weed. So far thats the only one I know of.

who's she running with MC Hammer??


Nope, according to the sample ballot I got sent she is running with Cindy Sheehan. Besides MC Hammer (Pants) would be way too religious for her (I think he is now a preacher last I checked). She is kind of hippyish and living on a farm in Hawaii selling nuts. They'd clash big time and we have fights in the White House, hmmm come to think about it that'd be entertaining.
 
2012-10-26 02:50:12 PM

Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: I already voted but I'm thinkin of writing a nice trolly letter to Obama and a some IL Democrats:

Dear Mr President,

As an enthusiastic supporter of yours I just wanted to wish you the best of luck in the election. You have turned the country's economy around, made the country more secure, provided equal rights for many, improved health insurance directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy, amongst many other great accomplishments. I can only hope for four more years just like this. Unfortunately I will not be voting, I can't get off of work that day.

Hugs,
~Lenny

Lennmeister. 78% of people filing for bankruptcy had medical insurance.


Nutface, it's up there in bold for you to re-read. I said health insurance was the number one reason. That includes not having health insurance as well as having health insurance that doesn't cover enough.
 
2012-10-26 02:50:31 PM

Kittahinaborx: Jon iz teh kewl: Kittahinaborx: GanjSmokr: moefuggenbrew: Hey, who do I vote for if I want legal weed?

If you're serious, you should do research on it.

I'll give you a hint who NOT to vote for it you want legal weed, Romney/Obama.

Roseanne Barr (Yes, THAT Roseanne Barr *from TV* ) is on the list of presidential candidates this time around and I know she is for legalizing weed. So far thats the only one I know of.

who's she running with MC Hammer??

Nope, according to the sample ballot I got sent she is running with Cindy Sheehan. Besides MC Hammer (Pants) would be way too religious for her (I think he is now a preacher last I checked). She is kind of hippyish and living on a farm in Hawaii selling nuts. They'd clash big time and we have fights in the White House, hmmm come to think about it that'd be entertaining.


but.. Hammertime
 
2012-10-26 02:50:44 PM
Joseph Stalin ... the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything.
 
2012-10-26 02:51:11 PM

OnlyM3: Warlordtrooper

rumpelstiltskin: Voting is a responsiblilty in a democracy, not a right.

Actually voting is a constitutionally protected right.

Care to quote the Article and Section that appears in?


15th, 19th, 26th, amendments all protect the right to vote. Most rights only need one amendment. The right to vote has 3. You can argue a few others also are involved in the right to vote but these three are the most direct.
 
2012-10-26 02:53:47 PM

lennavan: Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy,

Really? Uninsured people were the number one reason for bankruptcy?

Maybe you can show us a link to a webpage that backs up this assertion.

I didn't say uninsured people. I said health insurance, see for instance preexisting conditions and lifetime benefit caps. Insured people go bankrupt because of their health insurance too.

1. Medical Expenses

A study done at Harvard University indicates that this is the biggest cause of bankruptcy, representing 62% of all personal bankruptcies. One of the interesting caveats of this study shows that 78% of filers had some form of health insurance, thus bucking the myth that medical bills affect only the uninsured.

Link

You can google "united states reason for bankruptcy" if you would like a different reference.


Ummm this means nothing. "Some form of health insurance" doesn't mean that they didn't go bankrupt for medical reasons. Most people have garbage health insurance plans won't cover them in a variety of situations, still causing them to go bankrupt.

Correlation != Causation
 
2012-10-26 02:54:55 PM
I usually don't vote in Presidential elections, because my vote literally does not count. I live in a massively liberal state, and even is 50,000 more like me voted, it would not make a difference. Vermont.

Think about CA, millions of peoples' vote does not count at all. Electoral college really needs to go.
 
2012-10-26 02:55:10 PM

midigod: midigod: I could give you quotes

Just for insano, here are a few. They're not all Founding Fathers, but the ones who aren't are still eminently qualified:

"Now more than ever before, the people are responsible for the character of their Congress. If that body be ignorant, reckless and corrupt, it is because the people tolerate ignorance, recklessness and corruption. If it be intelligent, brave and pure, it is because the people demand these high qualities to represent them in the national legislature.... If the next centennial does not find us a great nation ... it will be because those who represent the enterprise, the culture, and the morality of the nation do not aid in controlling the political forces."
- James Garfield

"To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men."
- Abraham Lincoln

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine

"It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from its government."
- Thomas Paine

A nation, as a society, forms a moral person, and every member of it is personally responsible for his society.
- Thomas Jefferson, Founding Father and third U.S. president (1743-1826), in a letter to George Hammond, 1792

"We the People are the rightful masters of both Congress and the Courts--not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
- Abraham Lincoln

This country will not be a good place for any of us to live in unless we make it a good place for all of us to live in.
- Theodore Roosevelt, American adventurer and 26th president (1858-1919)

Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost.
- John Quincy Adams

"The jaws of power are always open to devour, and her arm is always stretched out, if possible, to destroy the freedom of thinking, speaking, and writing."
- John Adams

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, th ...


I agree with all of those, and yet don't vote.
 
2012-10-26 02:55:14 PM
Congressional races people! Congress actually has a bigger impact on your life than the President.

Living in indiana, my vote for president is meaningless. However, the senate and house races will be close.

The fact that only about half as many people vote in midterm elections is proof to me most people don't have a farking clue how their government works.
 
2012-10-26 02:56:16 PM
not voting.

No party in this election is going to do anything to make my life any better. As a matter of fact, since most of the country seems to think that Americans living oversees are basically tax dodgers, neither party ever will.

Neither party will fix the fatca or fbar laws, and neither is going to force any US student loan lender to start accepting payments from foreign bank accounts. (one company seriously told me to send them money via Western Union)

Neither party is going to do anything about the US visa process.

And, no I don't care one iota about the local elections that would be on my ballot.

4 years ago, I left those blank as it was.
 
2012-10-26 02:56:48 PM
dl.dropbox.com
 
2012-10-26 02:57:02 PM

DECMATH: God Is My Co-Pirate: every single adult has the responsibility to decide what issues matter the most to them, and which candidate aligns most closely with their own views.

Okay I'll bite with this link to http://www.isidewith.com/. Hope they can keep up with the traffic.


that's awesome. You mean I can go go a website and tell them what I think, that way the appropriate politician can have targetted google ads sent to every page i view, asking for money?
 
2012-10-26 02:57:08 PM
I'm not voting due to fear of being mugged by picketers
 
2012-10-26 02:57:40 PM
I've never voted and in all likelihood, I never will. Why? Because in order for me to vote for someone, we have to share 100% of the same values, ideals, and opinions on EVERYTHING. I'm not about to give my vote to someone simply because I disagree with him or her less than the other guy.
 
2012-10-26 02:57:55 PM
The choices aren't good enough to make me wanna
make my name and new address available from the voter registration.
 
2012-10-26 02:58:38 PM
So, let's sum up.

Between the electoral college, gerrymandering, the two-party system that supports both, media companies that have ideological agendas in their reporting, voters who only think 1 or 2 issues are important, parties that appeal to their "base" by spouting off the most inane misinformation/insanity, and a system of primaries that ensures only certain kinds of candidates even end up in the main election, I am still supposed to be pleased that I live in a country where I can "vote," nevermind the lack if real impact it would have in my district and state.

So, if I don't vote I'm supposed to endure the insults of those who do choose to participate in the existing system (whose problems I outlined above) by voting for either Democrats or Republicans when neither party wants to correct the problems. And I'm supposed to endure the ridicule of those who vote for third-party candidates when that just skews election results towards either Republicans or Democrats, rather than accomplishing any real change.

In short, I am supposed to participate in the coming election by going to a poll and voting for the incumbents of the party that dominates my gerrymandered district because they mostly ran unopposed in their primary. I can vote for the opposition party, but since my district is drawn with scientific precision, the opposition party in my district has about $5 in funding an will earn a whopping 17% of the vote. Not only will that not make a difference, the system is set up so that the incumbents don't even have to worry about what a significant portion of their constituents think. Since the party leadership controls, to a great degree, who can even run or get support during primaries, it's not like I can vote in the primaries to get a candidate I like. Unopposed incumbents give me no real choice. And when it comes to the presidential election, I'm supposed to obediently march to the polls and vote for someone, even though my state will go for Romney. It doesn't matter if I am a die-hard Republican because enough Republicans will vote to ensure that Romney gets 100% credit for the state. It doesn't matter if I'm a Democrat because Romney will still get 100% credit for the state. Hell, I could be officially a Libertarian or Green, and it still won't matter because winner takes all. 

I see all those pictures of brave people trying to vote despite roadblocks in their path. I salute those brave souls. But you know what? I don't feel any guilt about not voting on election day, as I haven't for the past 10 years. Because I know, deep down inside, that at least I don't participate in a system that pretends to give people a choice when, in fact, it does nothing of the sort. It's not that Democrats and Republicans are the same (in many ways they are not), it's that they both hold on to political power using the same tools, tools which are designed to reduce the impact of my vote, not enhance it.

So, if you self-righteous "I'm disgusted at you because you don't vote" types want to feel that way, knock yourselves out. But I'll be sitting at home with a smug smile on my face because I'll know that I may not have voted, but at least I did not participate in the facade of representative government and help lend it legitimacy. If you bothered to vote in gerrymandered districts or states that are not swing states, congratulations. You helped lend legitimacy to a system that does not really represent the people. Still feel so smug?

You folks in swing states can at least have some impact, so knock yourselves out. And if you live in a real district, please vote. But for the 75% of us stuck in bullshiat districts and winner-take all states, spare us your sanctimonious "you don't vote because you're stupid" remarks. No, I don't vote because my money and time would be better spent sending a check to a PAC that can buy advertising in a swing state, you ass.
 
2012-10-26 02:58:44 PM

Nutsac_Jim: DECMATH: God Is My Co-Pirate: every single adult has the responsibility to decide what issues matter the most to them, and which candidate aligns most closely with their own views.

Okay I'll bite with this link to http://www.isidewith.com/. Hope they can keep up with the traffic.

that's awesome. You mean I can go go a website and tell them what I think, that way the appropriate politician can have targetted google ads sent to every page i view, asking for money?


OR you could go to that website, tell them what you think, find out who you actually agree with in terms of issues, and use Adblock.
 
2012-10-26 02:58:45 PM
I especially like this one,

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine

because, my lack of time or energy to vote is in large part to the significant effort I spend preserving my freedom to enjoy the fruits of my labor against the government trying to tax it all away.
 
2012-10-26 02:59:00 PM

firefly212: The one thing the 2000 election taught me was that every once in a while, these things really do make a huge difference. Trillions of dollars of spending on destroying governments and rebuilding nations halfway around the world while neglecting our own citizens because of a supposed lack of funding... I voted this year, and I will vote every two years for the rest of my life.

If 538 more Floridians had voted for Gore, who knows what we could have had instead of Iraq.


Ah yes, 2000, the last year my American friends voted third party on principle. And probably never will again.
 
2012-10-26 02:59:13 PM

gadian: To hear of women of all people not voting pisses me right the hell off. Do you know the violence women in this country suffered for decades in order to vote? Do you know in how many countries on the earth this day would kill a woman rather than let her vote? Historically women have been told you don't have the mind to vote because of your vagina. What the hell is wrong with you non-voters? I don't care who the hell you vote for, but if you have a vagina and don't vote then you support everyone that does violence to women.

/not all that much of an exaggeration.


Who gives a fark what other people fought for? They fought for something THEY cared about. I didn't ask them too. People have suffered violence for standing up for gay rights. Does that mean I'm obligated to go out and have homo sex, since someone else fought for that right?
 
2012-10-26 02:59:35 PM

thewulf: Ummm this means nothing.


So you disagree with me? Okay, do continue.

thewulf: "Some form of health insurance" doesn't mean that they didn't go bankrupt for medical reasons.


Yeah, I agree. That completely supports what I was saying.

thewulf: Most people have garbage health insurance plans won't cover them in a variety of situations, still causing them to go bankrupt.


Yeah, I agree. That completely supports what I was saying. Wait, I thought you were going to disagree with me?
 
2012-10-26 03:00:35 PM

kindms: Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy,

Really? Uninsured people were the number one reason for bankruptcy?

Maybe you can show us a link to a webpage that backs up this assertion.

Well. Medical expenses were the #1 cause for bankruptcy in the US

"but a new study done by Harvard University suggests that more than 62% of all personal bankruptcies are caused by the cost of over-whelming medical expenses."

http://www.giveforward.com/blog/medical-expenses-top-cause-of-bankrup t cy-in-the-united-states


4 out of 5 people with medical bankruptcies had insurance. So, not much was really done.
If I cut off both your legs, it doesnt matter much whether you had insurance or not.
 
2012-10-26 03:02:01 PM

doubled99: lennavan
I'm sorry, I can't hear you. And neither can anyone else.



and yet you keep responding somehow.
So you're incapable of even understanding your own words.



/nice effort, though


I didn't post that. That isn't just a mistake deleting text to shorten the quote, my name was nowhere in that post. You actually had to manually type in my name to incorrectly attribute that to me.

Wow are you ever a dick. Seriously, a modmin might not take too kindly to doing that.
 
2012-10-26 03:02:20 PM
All of the electoral votes in my state have already been attributed and cast. What good is it for me to vote? I have no real say in any outcome.

Additionally, Weeners the post is a horrible model for determining a proper leader. The choices handed to me at this point mean that I'm not voting for who I want to win, I'm voting for who I hate the least.

Suffrage is an illusion. We're all disenfranchised from the word go.
 
2012-10-26 03:04:18 PM
It always seems like the people who don't want to vote because it 'sucks' or 'shiat won't change' are white males. People who have ALWAYS had the right to vote and have never had to see people fight and march in America to GAIN that right.
 
2012-10-26 03:04:20 PM

lennavan: Nutsac


thewulf: lennavan: Nutsac_Jim: lennavan: directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy,

Really? Uninsured people were the number one reason for bankruptcy?

Maybe you can show us a link to a webpage that backs up this assertion.

I didn't say uninsured people. I said health insurance, see for instance preexisting conditions and lifetime benefit caps. Insured people go bankrupt because of their health insurance too.

1. Medical Expenses

A study done at Harvard University indicates that this is the biggest cause of bankruptcy, representing 62% of all personal bankruptcies. One of the interesting caveats of this study shows that 78% of filers had some form of health insurance, thus bucking the myth that medical bills affect only the uninsured.

Link

You can google "united states reason for bankruptcy" if you would like a different reference.

Ummm this means nothing. "Some form of health insurance" doesn't mean that they didn't go bankrupt for medical reasons. Most people have garbage health insurance plans won't cover them in a variety of situations, still causing them to go bankrupt.

Correlation != Causation


The assertion was that uninsured people were the number one cause of bankruptcy.
 
2012-10-26 03:04:39 PM
Americans fought and died in illegal wars throughout Asia, Central America and the Middle East for decades.
Don't we owe it to them and their sacrifice to continue these conflicts?
 
2012-10-26 03:05:05 PM
If you don't think voting is enough to cause positive change, maybe you should do more than just vote instead of doing nothing at all.
 
2012-10-26 03:05:50 PM
Isn't it interesting how everyone who tells you that you should "get out and vote" also happens to know exactly HOW you should vote, and is more than happy to tell you, whether you want them to or not?
 
2012-10-26 03:05:58 PM

ladykills82: It always seems like the people who don't want to vote because it 'sucks' or 'shiat won't change' are white males. People who have ALWAYS had the right to vote and have never had to see people fight and march in America to GAIN that right.


You'll get your equal opportunity.
 
2012-10-26 03:06:36 PM

Nutsac_Jim: 4 out of 5 people with medical bankruptcies had insurance. So, not much was really done.


Why did those people with insurance go bankrupt?

• Denied claims as "pre-existing conditions."
• Lifetime maximums.
• Maximizing profits, every denied claim goes directly to increasing profits.

What was done?

• No more pre-existing conditions.
• No more lifetime maximums.
• Cap on the profits.

Yeah, actually some stuff was done.

Recall, I did not post "Obama completely solved the number one reason for bankruptcy." I did not say "Obama eliminated the number one reason for bankruptcy." I said "Obama addressed the number one reason for bankruptcy."

At this point we have established:

1) Health insurance was the number one reason for bankruptcy.
2) Yes, Obamacare did address it.

I accept your apology.
 
2012-10-26 03:08:16 PM

Nutsac_Jim: The assertion was that uninsured people were the number one cause of bankruptcy.


No it wasn't.

lennavan: improved health insurance directly addressing the number one reason for bankruptcy


The assertion was Obamacare addressed the number one reason for bankruptcy. Stop being a nutsac, Jim.
 
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