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(ESPN)   Eli Manning humiliates DeAngelo Hall. This is not a repeat from Sunday   (espn.go.com) divider line 216
    More: Amusing, DeAngelo Hall, Eli Manning, DeAngelo Willingham, Observer-Reporter, Justin Tuck, WFAN, Redskins, Giants  
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3858 clicks; posted to Sports » on 25 Oct 2012 at 11:21 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-25 01:20:57 PM

IAmRight: The problem I have is that people conflate "tournament champion" with "best team" and don't understand that yes, there is a difference between the two. All people should say about the Giants is that they were the tourney champions.


How is this any different than the packers in 2010, not the best team but the hottest team going into the playoffs.

There is no award for 'BEST TEAM' of a year, there is a Lombardi trophy for the Superbowl winners, for every 85 bears there is an 07 pats.

Fans equating a team accomplishing their goal with BEST TEAM is such a slight miscontruction of the truth, and saying "were the best" is so much easier to do while drunk and celebrating than it is to say "Our team accomplished its preseason goal of winning a super bowl!"

/not that I would know what the feels like
//falcons fan
 
2012-10-25 01:22:57 PM
I'm enjoying the downfall of Cam. The only thing that upsets me is that most of the others who are enjoying it are doing so for racist reasons, which makes me look bad. At least I hate him purely because he came from the SEC (well, and the whole thing that no one's ever going to get in trouble for paying him - yeah, I'm sure he and his dad turned down hundreds of thousands from Miss. St. to go to Auburn for free).
 
2012-10-25 01:26:04 PM

farbekrieg: How is this any different than the packers in 2010, not the best team but the hottest team going into the playoffs.


It's not.
 
2012-10-25 01:26:50 PM

you have pee hands: Rwa2play: LOL true. RGIII is where McNabb was in his rookie year IMHO; and if Snyder lets Allen and Shanahan work their magic, they'll be a handful in the future.

When's their next 1st round pick again?


If you think that a team gets to the next level by way of their 1st round pick, you've obviously never seen Bobby Beathard's history with the Redskins.
 
2012-10-25 01:28:19 PM

you have pee hands: RGIII isn't really McNabb though. He seems more like Vick with a brain and some touch on his passes. McNabb was a good runner but RGIII has true breakaway speed.


I was about to say that, but that would've been an insult to RGIII.
 
2012-10-25 01:29:57 PM

IAmRight: ddam: It's a team sport and if you don't get the win you didn't acheive the most important stat. Everything else is secondary. And when a team isn't doing good the leaders of the team shoulder the majority of the blame even if they might not be the most at fault. In football, with very few exceptions, the QB is one of the leaders of the team as well as the best paid position so they get most of the blame/praise.

This is why Mark Sanchez and Tim Tebow are universally lauded. They win lots of games.


Beat me to it. If wins are all that matter, Tebow must be upper-echelon and Alex Smith is probably the best QB in football. Actual performance is underrated, particularly when compared to the wins they get through their stunning leadership/being on the same team as Revis or Willis/Bowman.
 
2012-10-25 01:33:05 PM

Rwa2play: you have pee hands: Rwa2play: LOL true. RGIII is where McNabb was in his rookie year IMHO; and if Snyder lets Allen and Shanahan work their magic, they'll be a handful in the future.

When's their next 1st round pick again?

If you think that a team gets to the next level by way of their 1st round pick, you've obviously never seen Bobby Beathard's history with the Redskins.


Luckily, Bobby Beathard isn't the Redskins GM, and since Snyder became the owner they haven't exactly been known for mining talent out of the mid-late rounds.
 
2012-10-25 01:34:31 PM

Jubeebee: Beat me to it. If wins are all that matter, Tebow must be upper-echelon and Alex Smith is probably the best QB in football. Actual performance is underrated, particularly when compared to the wins they get through their stunning leadership/being on the same team as Revis or Willis/Bowman.


How has Joe Flacco not come into this conversation yet?
 
2012-10-25 01:37:12 PM

IAmRight: ddam: I don't care if the QB had a bad game and his stats aren't Fantasy league friendly. Did he lead his team to a win or not? And if he did, great.

So Mark Sanchez is an upper-tier QB for you.


No he's not. He's an average QB that might put quality numbers up if he's surrounded by talent but he won't win many games on his own. There are very few QBs in the league today that I see as upper-tier (Brees, Brady, both Mannings, Rodgers) and there are a couple of others that show signs that can be upper-tier but are plagued by inconsistencies.
 
2012-10-25 01:39:05 PM

ddam: IAmRight: ddam: ***snip***

It's a team sport and if you don't get the win you didn't acheive the most important stat. Everything else is secondary. And when a team isn't doing good the leaders of the team shoulder the majority of the blame even if they might not be the most at fault. In football, with very few exceptions, the QB is one of the leaders of the team as well as the best paid position so they get most of the blame/praise.


Y/A+ NY/A+ AY/A+ ANY/A+ Cmp%+ TD%+ Int%+ Sack%+ Rate+
111 109 113 112 108 113 108 100 113
102 95 99 95 96 95 97 79 97


Here are 2 QBs rate stats from Pro Football Reference. ddam, which one would you rather have as your QB for the season based on these stats alone? Since I am making the assumption that you aren't an idiot, of course you would say the top one, he is superior in every category (higher numbers are better). The top QB (Aaron Rodgers) went 6-10 in 2008, and the bottom QB (Ben Roethlisber) won the Super Bowl. It's almost as if wins have more to do with the team as a whole, than how well a QB performs.
 
2012-10-25 01:40:09 PM

ddam: He's an average QB that might put quality numbers up if he's surrounded by talent but he won't win many games on his own.


He is surrounded by absurd talent.
 
2012-10-25 01:40:54 PM

thecpt: ddam: He's an average QB that might put quality numbers up if he's surrounded by talent but he won't win many games on his own.

He is surrounded by absurd talent.


Sanchez?
 
2012-10-25 01:41:45 PM

Gunny Highway: thecpt: ddam: He's an average QB that might put quality numbers up if he's surrounded by talent but he won't win many games on his own.

He is surrounded by absurd talent.

Sanchez?


Flacco. Definitely not the utter ineptitude that is the Jets
 
2012-10-25 01:42:43 PM

roc6783: ddam: IAmRight: ddam: ***snip***


glad I took the time to make all that look pretty in the preview window, just to have it scrunch when I hit Add Comment.
 
2012-10-25 01:45:26 PM
Eli Manning always looks like he just missed the bus whenever a play breaks down.
manningface.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2012-10-25 01:55:45 PM
You can't have it both ways. Either the Packers of 2010 were the best team for winning the Super Bowl (after finishing 2nd in their division,) or the Packers were the best team of 2011 for going 15-2 (and being the only team to ever accomplish the rare 15-1-and-lose-your-first-home-playoff-game.)
 
2012-10-25 01:58:42 PM

roc6783: ddam: IAmRight: ddam: ***snip***

It's a team sport and if you don't get the win you didn't acheive the most important stat. Everything else is secondary. And when a team isn't doing good the leaders of the team shoulder the majority of the blame even if they might not be the most at fault. In football, with very few exceptions, the QB is one of the leaders of the team as well as the best paid position so they get most of the blame/praise.

Y/A+ NY/A+ AY/A+ ANY/A+ Cmp%+ TD%+ Int%+ Sack%+ Rate+
111 109 113 112 108 113 108 100 113
102 95 99 95 96 95 97 79 97


Here are 2 QBs rate stats from Pro Football Reference. ddam, which one would you rather have as your QB for the season based on these stats alone? Since I am making the assumption that you aren't an idiot, of course you would say the top one, he is superior in every category (higher numbers are better). The top QB (Aaron Rodgers) went 6-10 in 2008, and the bottom QB (Ben Roethlisber) won the Super Bowl. It's almost as if wins have more to do with the team as a whole, than how well a QB performs.


I can't read those stats due to the format but I'm just not a stat guy. I don't pay attention to them and I admit that. To me all that matters is that the team wins. Stats only come into the picture if I'm having a conversation about individual trophies or HOF and I typically don't get involved in those.

The QB has a lot of influence on the defence as well and consistent performance at the QB position fuels the defense (at least it did when I played football). And you can tell a team is in trouble when the defense doesn't have much respect for their own QB or they have no confidence in their QB.

But you are probably right as most of my experience comes from playing a sport that doesn't have offense and defense separate but all players play both ways and the leaders on the field lead the whole team. All in all I think that a lot of football fans are too concentrate on stats and ignore the timing of mistakes or the overall flow of the game. An INT or two during a game will be a footnote if the game is won while that INT will be the turning point if the team loses. I remember the years before Eli's first SuperBowl win when the media wasn't nice to him at all because of the INTs he was throwing but 2 rings buys you a lot of credibility from the media.

As far as Sanchez and Tebow go, they haven't won the SuperBowl so I don't get it where you say that I would view them as top-tier. They were top-tier college QBs (and probably HS level too) but not in NFL. Sanchez did have the Jets go deep in the playoffs but he (just like many in the NFL today) are not consistent enough to get to the elite status.
 
2012-10-25 02:09:29 PM

Harv72b: Jubeebee: Beat me to it. If wins are all that matter, Tebow must be upper-echelon and Alex Smith is probably the best QB in football. Actual performance is underrated, particularly when compared to the wins they get through their stunning leadership/being on the same team as Revis or Willis/Bowman.

How has Joe Flacco not come into this conversation yet?


Joe Flacco has his strengths. He throws a great looking deep ball and can glare at Ernie like nobody's business.

But if we're really going to rank QBs by JUST WINS BABY, I would argue that Cutler has to be considered among the best in the league. For example, Cutler is 12-4 in games started over the last two seasons. In 4 of those wins, Cutler lead his team to victory through his fiery personality and legendary leadership abilities despite posting a sub-70.0 passer rating.
 
2012-10-25 02:14:42 PM

poughdrew: You can't have it both ways. Either the Packers of 2010 were the best team for winning the Super Bowl (after finishing 2nd in their division,) or the Packers were the best team of 2011 for going 15-2 (and being the only team to ever accomplish the rare 15-1-and-lose-your-first-home-playoff-game.)


I didn't say the Packers were the best team of 2010. They were the Super Bowl champions that year. The next year, they had a better season and weren't the champions. Just like the Giants probably will be better than 9-7 this year and probably won't win the Super Bowl.
 
2012-10-25 02:17:55 PM

ddam: I remember the years before Eli's first SuperBowl win when the media wasn't nice to him at all because of the INTs he was throwing but 2 rings buys you a lot of credibility from the media.


They weren't nice to him at all because he was throwing more INTs than TDs and led the league in interceptions. And not garbage-time Interceptions, or 1st quarter INTs. He was regularly blowing it in spectacular fashion and just throwing up jump balls.
 
2012-10-25 02:19:35 PM

Jubeebee: In 4 of those wins, Cutler lead his team to victory through his fiery personality and legendary leadership abilities despite posting a sub-70.0 passer rating.


Would you tell that SOB to start actually throwing some goddamn TD passes? I got all excited that they were facing the Lions' clown defense and even moreso after that early TD...then nothing.

/needed about 30 points and had Cutler, Forte, and Jason Hanson
//got nowhere near anything
 
2012-10-25 02:19:50 PM

Super Chronic: This is not the first time an opponent has said that it gift-wrapped a victory for the Giants. Green Bay's Clay Matthews told Yahoo! Sports earlier this summer the Packers beat themselves during their playoff loss to the Giants last season.

Minor rant: I hate, hate, HATE when people offer the excuse of "they didn't beat us, we beat ourselves." Sure, there are occasions when teams play well but lose due to, for example, avoidable penalties or rare mental errors. But about 95% of the time, this is just a rationalization and a lame way to boost one's own self-image, essentially saying "just because they beat us doesn't mean they're better than us." When you lose, you lose. Think twice before you offer this excuse because it makes you look stupid -- especially when the game in question is an all-around beatdown like the one the Giants laid on the Packers in last year's playoffs.

Today's recommended reading: How We Know What Isn't So, by Thomas Gilovich, which addresses the bias of dissecting and analyzing failures while taking successes at face value.


It's true for dbs and offensive tackles though. In particular for offensive tackles if you're winning 90% of the time, you're giving up 3 sacks a game.
 
2012-10-25 02:20:41 PM
New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.
 
2012-10-25 02:23:05 PM

Treygreen13: They weren't nice to him at all because he was throwing more INTs than TDs


That happened exactly once, his rookie year, when he took over the starting job after 9 games. Then again I expect you to be wrong, so it's hardly anything new.
 
2012-10-25 02:23:29 PM

robsul82: New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.


09 Saints....oh i see what you're doing.

/thought the colts had an easy division
 
2012-10-25 02:32:34 PM

Treygreen13: ddam: I remember the years before Eli's first SuperBowl win when the media wasn't nice to him at all because of the INTs he was throwing but 2 rings buys you a lot of credibility from the media.

They weren't nice to him at all because he was throwing more INTs than TDs and led the league in interceptions. And not garbage-time Interceptions, or 1st quarter INTs. He was regularly blowing it in spectacular fashion and just throwing up jump balls.


So they were tough on Eli when he was throwing INTs which resulted in losses but now that he's won two rings and he throws two picks in a game his team wins he isn't getting attacked for it... and you see a problem with this. Why?

I remember when Romo was getting national love from every media type even if he was throwing picks because they reminded everyone of Favre. But after a while you got to put Ws in the standings or the media will turn on you very quickly especially if you're QB of a franchise like the Cowboys.

And I got no love for Giants and as a matter of fact I hope that Eli throws a few picks this weekend that result in a loss for his team.
 
2012-10-25 02:34:00 PM
Isn't deangelo hall the guy terrell owens spit on?
 
2012-10-25 02:35:26 PM

robsul82: New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.


Of the 5 Super Bowls the Dallas Cowboys have won:

1971 - Tied for the best record (11-3)
1977 - Tied for the best record (12-2)
1992 - 2nd best record (13-3)
1993 - Tied for the best record (12-4)
1995 - 2nd best record (12-4)

Interestingly enough, the best record in 1995 was the Kansas City Chiefs, at 13-3 - who ended up losing their first playoff game to the 9-7 Indianapolis Colts.
 
2012-10-25 02:37:59 PM

IAmRight: Jubeebee: In 4 of those wins, Cutler lead his team to victory through his fiery personality and legendary leadership abilities despite posting a sub-70.0 passer rating.

Would you tell that SOB to start actually throwing some goddamn TD passes? I got all excited that they were facing the Lions' clown defense and even moreso after that early TD...then nothing.

/needed about 30 points and had Cutler, Forte, and Jason Hanson
//got nowhere near anything


That game was classic giving it away. Bears D was playing well, but the Lions should have scored at least enough to tie the game but didn't.
"I'm going to put the ball in my fingertips and dive into a pile of players who pride themselves on takeaways. What could go wrong?"
right up there with
"Cruz is slow, I'm sure letting him get behind me will still work out ok." Hall is right, anyone could have thrown that pass, but the only way what he is saying makes Eli look bad is if Eli had missed, which he didn't.

The Pack did beat themselves in the Giants game last playoffs. They might still have lost had they played better, but there were not even close enough to win. It's like parking your car in an alley unlocked with the keys in it. Sure, if you locked it and took the keys it might still have been stolen, but the way it happened you only have yourself to blame.
 
2012-10-25 02:38:37 PM

Treygreen13: robsul82: New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.

Of the 5 Super Bowls the Dallas Cowboys have won:

1971 - Tied for the best record (11-3)
1977 - Tied for the best record (12-2)
1992 - 2nd best record (13-3)
1993 - Tied for the best record (12-4)
1995 - 2nd best record (12-4)

Interestingly enough, the best record in 1995 was the Kansas City Chiefs, at 13-3 - who ended up losing their first playoff game to the 9-7 Indianapolis Colts.


If Romo had the O-lines Cowboys had between 91-96 he'd be a 1st ballot HOF. Those lines were just brutal. Since you're a stat kind of guy, can you figure out how many games were missed by starting linemen those years? The Cowboys today not only have an average line at best at the start of the season but they got a lot of injuries too.
 
2012-10-25 02:40:09 PM

ddam: now that he's won two rings and he throws two picks in a game his team wins he isn't getting attacked for it... and you see a problem with this. Why?

Because he threw two crucial INTs in a one-score game and nobody will even mention it because of his previous success. That's my problem with it.

ddam: I remember when Romo was getting national love from every media type even if he was throwing picks because they reminded everyone of Favre. But after a while you got to put Ws in the standings or the media will turn on you very quickly especially if you're QB of a franchise like the Cowboys.


Jesus farking christ did Tony Romo pee in your shoes one day? Why is everything about him?
 
2012-10-25 02:40:51 PM

robsul82: New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.


By what criteria? Overall record, because I don't think that's always a good measure with the unbalanced nature of the NFL schedule. Anyway, here's my list:

2008 Steelers
2003-04 Patriots
1999 Rams
1998 Broncos
1996 Packers
1994 49ers
1993 Cowboys
1991 Redskins
1989 49ers
1986 Giants
1985 Bears
1984 49ers

I can't really go back any further than that.  Basically everything since the salary cap began to dissolve existing NFL rosters in the mid-90s has been a crapshoot.
 
2012-10-25 02:41:01 PM

thecpt: robsul82: New thread assignment.

Name SB winners who were ALSO Best Team of that year.

09 Saints....oh i see what you're doing.

/thought the colts had an easy division


LOL, honestly no, I was just curious to see opinions of winners through the years, but now that you mention it.

a3.ec-images.myspacecdn.com

"Made you say '09 Saints, made you say '09 Saints, ha ha ha ha!"
 
2012-10-25 02:41:47 PM

ddam: If Romo had the O-lines Cowboys had between 91-96 he'd be a 1st ballot HOF. Those lines were just brutal. Since you're a stat kind of guy, can you figure out how many games were missed by starting linemen those years? The Cowboys today not only have an average line at best at the start of the season but they got a lot of injuries too.


I don't mind rooting around for stats but I think it would be a colossal undertaking to find out how many games the starting members of the offensive line of the '71 Cowboys missed. 

Let's just say they were good.
 
2012-10-25 02:42:59 PM

ddam: So they were tough on Eli when he was throwing INTs which resulted in losses but now that he's won two rings and he throws two picks in a game his team wins he isn't getting attacked for it... and you see a problem with this. Why?


Because he can't stand Eli Manning, and he can't stand that Giants fans love their QB despite his opinion of him.
 
2012-10-25 02:43:43 PM

Yanks_RSJ: By what criteria? Overall record, because I don't think that's always a good measure with the unbalanced nature of the NFL schedule.


Yeah, not purely overall record, it'd have something to do with it, but I don't know. Just feel, I guess, very non-scientific question, lol. Just what teams won the SB and you felt they were the best overall for that year, I suppose.
 
2012-10-25 02:47:16 PM

Treygreen13: ddam: now that he's won two rings and he throws two picks in a game his team wins he isn't getting attacked for it... and you see a problem with this. Why?

Because he threw two crucial INTs in a one-score game and nobody will even mention it because of his previous success. That's my problem with it.

ddam: I remember when Romo was getting national love from every media type even if he was throwing picks because they reminded everyone of Favre. But after a while you got to put Ws in the standings or the media will turn on you very quickly especially if you're QB of a franchise like the Cowboys.

Jesus farking christ did Tony Romo pee in your shoes one day? Why is everything about him?



That's the problem with your line of thought. I don't think that they leave it out only because of his track record but also because HE farkING WON THE GAME. If Giants would have lost (and I did have a small bet on Redskins straight up) I guarantee you that the highlights would have shown the picks. Just like in politics, the highlights (history) is written from the point of view of the victorious party.
 
2012-10-25 02:49:37 PM

robsul82: Yanks_RSJ: By what criteria? Overall record, because I don't think that's always a good measure with the unbalanced nature of the NFL schedule.

Yeah, not purely overall record, it'd have something to do with it, but I don't know. Just feel, I guess, very non-scientific question, lol. Just what teams won the SB and you felt they were the best overall for that year, I suppose.


And to satisfy you, I'd say the Saints of '09 are at least in the conversation for that year. Then again, I'd say the same about the 1990 Giants, one of the very best defensive teams in the history of the NFL, but I left them off because the 49ers and Bills were technically "better" that year.
 
2012-10-25 02:50:25 PM
Oh, and everything revolves around Romo because he happens to be the QB of the team I root for and I'm most familiar with his performance since I watch every game while only catching a game or two from other teams or just highlights on RedZone or online.

Maybe if LA gets a team I'll slowly lose interest in the Cowboys due to the local team pulling me in but until then Cowboys are the only team I give a damn about in the NFL.
 
2012-10-25 02:52:10 PM

robsul82: Yanks_RSJ: By what criteria? Overall record, because I don't think that's always a good measure with the unbalanced nature of the NFL schedule.

Yeah, not purely overall record, it'd have something to do with it, but I don't know. Just feel, I guess, very non-scientific question, lol. Just what teams won the SB and you felt they were the best overall for that year, I suppose.


In recent memory:
XLIV - Saints
XXXVIII and XXXIX -Patriots
XXXVII - Buccaneers
XXXIV - Rams
 
2012-10-25 02:54:35 PM

ddam: That's the problem with your line of thought. I don't think that they leave it out only because of his track record but also because HE farkING WON THE GAME. If Giants would have lost (and I did have a small bet on Redskins straight up) I guarantee you that the highlights would have shown the picks. Just like in politics, the highlights (history) is written from the point of view of the victorious party.


The problem with your line of thought is that players can perform independently of the outcome of the game.

ddam: only catching a game or two from other teams or just highlights on RedZone or online.


Well, that certainly explains a lot.

You're extremely critical of everything he does because all you see of other QBs is highlights of when they win games.
 
2012-10-25 02:58:07 PM

Jubeebee: Joe Flacco has his strengths. He throws a great looking deep ball and can glare at Ernie like nobody's business.


Well Kyle Boller could throw a great looking deep ball, he just couldn't throw it anywhere close to his receivers.

Of course, none of these guys can come close the all-time greatest "just win" quarterback:

www.smashinglists.com
 
2012-10-25 03:01:04 PM

Treygreen13: ddam: That's the problem with your line of thought. I don't think that they leave it out only because of his track record but also because HE farkING WON THE GAME. If Giants would have lost (and I did have a small bet on Redskins straight up) I guarantee you that the highlights would have shown the picks. Just like in politics, the highlights (history) is written from the point of view of the victorious party.

The problem with your line of thought is that players can perform independently of the outcome of the game.

ddam: only catching a game or two from other teams or just highlights on RedZone or online.

Well, that certainly explains a lot.

You're extremely critical of everything he does because all you see of other QBs is highlights of when they win games.


Do we have to go over this again... It's a team sport and thus the whole team wins or loses but the QB position is the highest paid and fair or not they get the most praise for when the team does good and the most blame when the team doesn't. Inconsistent play (especially at the QB position) leads to lack of confidence in the team's ability to perform. For example, the Giants team was not very confident in Eli at the start of his career and it showed. For the past few years he has shown the consistence needed to win on the big stage and no matter what the situation is the team trusts him 100%.

And of course I'm critical of Romo because I want him to perform consistently. Every QB has bad games but I don't give a damn about their bad games (unless I got money on their team). It pains me when Romo has a bad game and that's the difference.
 
2012-10-25 03:04:04 PM
As a Giants fan I will certainly agree that Eli had one of his worst games of the year and that the talking heads are pumping him up too much. He missed a few easy TDs and looked off all game. But, at the end of the day, I am very happy with how the game turned out and how Eli has come along as the Giants' QB.

Also, as a brief aside, I don't hear many people talking much about the turnovers that RGIII had in the game (also two, an INT and a fumble). In terms of total yardage (passing and rushing) Eli and RGIII had similiar totals and two of the Giants TDs were rushing from the 1 yrd line so so I wouldn't put much stock in comparing their TD totals since Eli did put the Giants into those short running situations.

In the end the Giants were able to capitalize on the Redskins mistakes (Cruz TD, fumbles galore) while also minimizing their own mistakes (only two turnovers).

/The only upside of playing RGIII twice a year is that the Eagles and Cowboys do too.
 
2012-10-25 03:05:02 PM

Yanks_RSJ: Gunny Highway: What current QBs are better than Eli? Not that it matters. Giants fans love the QB. They trust him when the game is on the line and he has been a major part of two SB championship teams.

Just let him be, he's totally unhinged about Eli and shows up in every thread to biatch about something. I would be too if my team only had one playoff win since 1996.

By the way, have the Giants ever actually beaten anyone? Because it seems like every week there's a jackass out there saying they beat themselves and the Giants got lucky, or some variation. Oh well, I'll take the wins however they come, and the Giants thrive when people are casting doubts on how good they are.


Oh that's rich. Coming from the quintessential "Yankees lost it. The other team just happened to be there" Douchecans.
 
2012-10-25 03:06:49 PM

ddam: Do we have to go over this again...


No, because this is the 3rd time I'm going to try to re-direct the conversation away from Tony Romo. A topic you will. not. stop. bringing. up.

Seriously, drop it. Tony Romo is my favorite player and I'm willing to discuss him at great lengths, but even I am getting sick of talking about the guy with you.

Just drop it. This thread isn't about Tony Romo.

This thread is about a game between the Redskins and the Giants. A close game that featured 4 total turnovers by 2 QBs not named Tony Romo.
 
2012-10-25 03:08:03 PM

Phil Ken Sebben: Yanks_RSJ: Gunny Highway: What current QBs are better than Eli? Not that it matters. Giants fans love the QB. They trust him when the game is on the line and he has been a major part of two SB championship teams.

Just let him be, he's totally unhinged about Eli and shows up in every thread to biatch about something. I would be too if my team only had one playoff win since 1996.

By the way, have the Giants ever actually beaten anyone? Because it seems like every week there's a jackass out there saying they beat themselves and the Giants got lucky, or some variation. Oh well, I'll take the wins however they come, and the Giants thrive when people are casting doubts on how good they are.

Oh that's rich. Coming from the quintessential "Yankees lost it. The other team just happened to be there" Douchecans.


Oh look, Yanks_RSJ is exactly the same moron as the guy I put on ignore a year ago.
 
2012-10-25 03:09:44 PM

Yanks_RSJ: Rwa2play: you have pee hands: Rwa2play: LOL true. RGIII is where McNabb was in his rookie year IMHO; and if Snyder lets Allen and Shanahan work their magic, they'll be a handful in the future.

When's their next 1st round pick again?

If you think that a team gets to the next level by way of their 1st round pick, you've obviously never seen Bobby Beathard's history with the Redskins.

Luckily, Bobby Beathard isn't the Redskins GM, and since Snyder became the owner they haven't exactly been known for mining talent out of the mid-late rounds.


Oh too true. What I meant was that many teams have tried and failed on that strategy of the 1st round pick being "the guy" that'll turn the team around. It's usually finding those hidden gems in the latter rounds (or even undrafted FAs, like one Victor Cruz) that can be the difference.
 
2012-10-25 03:11:59 PM

Phil Ken Sebben: Oh that's rich. Coming from the quintessential "Yankees lost it. The other team just happened to be there" Douchecans.


I don't ever recall having that conversation with you. I do remember the thread in which Tigers fans whined all day long that they weren't getting their dicks sucked hard enough.

Treygreen13: Oh look, Yanks_RSJ is exactly the same moron as the guy I put on ignore a year ago.


Nobody cares that you ignored me, yet you announce it every chance you can. Congrats.
 
2012-10-25 03:14:07 PM

Dr Quest DFA: Also, as a brief aside, I don't hear many people talking much about the turnovers that RGIII had in the game (also two, an INT and a fumble). In terms of total yardage (passing and rushing) Eli and RGIII had similiar totals and two of the Giants TDs were rushing from the 1 yrd line so so I wouldn't put much stock in comparing their TD totals since Eli did put the Giants into those short running situations.


You could also compare their completion percentages, quarterback ratings, and/or the number of turnovers they've had this season. Plus of course the fact that Griffin would likely have totaled more yardage had Alfred Morris not been running over the Giants defense, New York gives up 75 fewer pass yards/game on average, or that Moss, Hankerson, and Josh Morgan are not exactly Cruz, Nicks, and Hixon. ;)

Griffin has outperformed pretty much everyone's expectations every week so far, and particularly mine (I was one of the people who felt the Redskins payed way too much for the right to draft him). Not saying that he's in any way better than or even comparable to Eli as a quarterback right now, but he certainly did have a better game than Manning did this time.
 
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