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(Yahoo)   School forces boy out because of his jeans. Wait, you mean his GENES? What kind of stupid shiat is that?   (gma.yahoo.com) divider line 30
    More: Dumbass, cystic fibrosis, Columbia University Medical Center, lung disease, respiratory tract infections, Cystic Fibrosis Foundation, for-profit schools, zygosity, mutations  
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16478 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Oct 2012 at 3:32 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-10-20 03:41:32 PM  
5 votes:
1/25 people of European descent is a carrier for this disease. Most do not know they are carriers. How in the world is this school going to transfer every single carrier?

Bacterial Cross-Contamination or no, this is logistically untenable.
2012-10-20 03:38:34 PM  
5 votes:
"However, researchers say it may be risky for him to encounter someone who does have the disease.
Exposure can cause bacterial cross-contamination and a higher risk for infections among people who are carriers of the gene or who have the disease"

There's already one kid there who has it. Did anyone actually RTFA?
2012-10-20 03:54:08 PM  
4 votes:

TheOther: FormlessOne: The kid is no risk to you. He's actually the one at risk - encountering another with the CF gene could escalate matters, and the school is just looking out for the welfare of not just him, but the other CF gene kid. There's enough scientific evidence to identify the risk, and so the school is acting on it.

Naw, let the parents win the lawsuit and the kid get CF and die, just for the Darwinlulz.


That's not how cystic fibrosis works. The kid will never "get" CF. You're either born with full-blown CF or you're not, and if you're born without it you will never get it. Carriers can pass on the gene for it, and if they fark another carrier their kid might have CF, but that's it.
2012-10-20 03:48:26 PM  
4 votes:

TorqueToad: "However, researchers say it may be risky for him to encounter someone who does have the disease.
Exposure can cause bacterial cross-contamination and a higher risk for infections among people who are carriers of the gene or who have the disease"

There's already one kid there who has it. Did anyone actually RTFA?


I did. I also read all the way to the end, where the director of the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation Burkholderia cepacia Research Laboratory and Repository at the University of Michigan said what the school was doing was stupid and not factually based.
2012-10-20 03:45:27 PM  
3 votes:

TorqueToad: "However, researchers say it may be risky for him to encounter someone who does have the disease.
Exposure can cause bacterial cross-contamination and a higher risk for infections among people who are carriers of the gene or who have the disease"

There's already one kid there who has it. Did anyone actually RTFA?


My reaction as well. School isn't work - unfortunately, parents actually expect schools to take care of their kids, and so schools try to minimize risk where they can.

Whether the parents like it or not, their kid is at risk because another kid carries the gene. Keeping them apart minimizes that risk. What's the problem?

mcwehrle: As someone who went to school with a boy that had CF, this is utter bullshiat. These people need kicked in the head. Repeatedly and hard. With steel toed boots. With spikes.

RIP Walter Sauerwein, you enriched all our lives.


Didn't RTFA, eh?

While Colman, who has the mutation, may be at higher risk for lung infections, he poses no risk to children without cystic fibrosis or those who do not have the gene for the disease. However, researchers say it may be risky for him to encounter someone who does have the disease.

Exposure can cause bacterial cross-contamination and a higher risk for infections among people who are carriers of the gene or who have the disease, according to a paper published in 2003 by Dr. Lisa Saiman, a professor of clinical pediatrics at Columbia University Medical Center in New York.


The kid is no risk to you. He's actually the one at risk - encountering another with the CF gene could escalate matters, and the school is just looking out for the welfare of not just him, but the other CF gene kid. There's enough scientific evidence to identify the risk, and so the school is acting on it.
2012-10-20 10:09:34 PM  
2 votes:

hankhorsey: ch_destroi: For all of you in here calling this 'derp'-- if the article were instead about the other CF boy dying because the school did nothing about the risk of having a second carrier in close contact with the school, what would you be saying?

What it were your child at risk?

You (and the school) got the derp backwards. The boy being kicked out is the one who's "at risk"; the other boy already has the disease. To spell it out for you, the kicked-out boy is perfectly healthy but at risk of catching the disease from the cystic fibrosis carrier who is already attending the school. But the thing is that the risk isn't all that high if the two kids keep a reasonable distance and practice good hygiene.


No. No he's not. You can't catch CF. He is a carrier. He will never have CF.

TFA is discussing secondary bacterial infections, NOT CF.
2012-10-20 05:35:44 PM  
2 votes:
School absolutely cannot win, no matter what they do. CF is a pretty brutal and sometimes unpredictable condition. If the kid with active CF suddenly has a bad episode or his condition gets worse, the school will not be able to prove that it WASN'T from cross-contamination from the carrier. They will be sued right into the ground by upset parents claiming the school didn't care enough to keep their son safe.

Instead, they're being sued into the ground by a different set of parents because they did what they're supposed to do - listen to the advice of a doctor who told them the most effective way to minimize risk. Now, if the medical advice they got is shiat, then there's a doctor who needs to get fired from his advisory capacity. But they really haven't done anything malicious or stupid.
2012-10-20 04:55:02 PM  
2 votes:
For all of you in here calling this 'derp'-- if the article were instead about the other CF boy dying because the school did nothing about the risk of having a second carrier in close contact with the school, what would you be saying?

What it were your child at risk?
2012-10-20 04:21:30 PM  
2 votes:
Colman's mother, Jennifer Chadam, told the San Francisco Chronicle she listed Colman's genetic condition on his school health form.

Do not list genetic conditions on school health forms unless you want your kid to be treated like someone who actually has the disease associated with those genes.
2012-10-20 03:55:06 PM  
2 votes:
Even if the lung infection risk were legitimate, and looking at the literature it real dubious, this is still false logic: 1 in 28 caucasians carry at least one of the many known mutations in the CFTR gene that lead to cystic fibrosis. Given that frequency CF sufferers encounter hetrozygous carriers multiple times per day (the vast majority of carriers would not even know are carriers), meaning any benefit the child with CF would receive is negligible.

Also, does the kid with CF have siblings? If so, each has a 50% chance of being a carrier. Are they segregated from him as well?
2012-10-20 03:52:35 PM  
2 votes:

FormlessOne:

Didn't RTFA, eh?

While Colman, who has the mutation, may be at higher risk for lung infections, he poses no risk to children without cystic fibrosis or those who do not have the gene for the disease. However, researchers say it may be risky for him to encounter someone who does have the disease.

Exposure can cause bacterial cross-contamination and a higher risk for infections among people who are carriers of the gene or who have the disease, according to a paper published in 2003 by Dr. Lisa Saiman, a professor of clinical pediatrics at Columbia University Medical Center in New York.

The kid is no risk to you. He's actually the one at risk - encountering another with the CF gene could escalate matters, and the school is just looking out for the welfare of not just him, but the other CF gene kid. There's enough scientific evidence to identify the risk, and so the school is acting on it.


Actually, I did read the article, several days ago, on another site, and this one as well. That STILL does not excuse the segregation of a child due to information that his parents did not have to divulge. Where does it stop? There is not enough scientific data to correlate to "a child with active CF WILL cause a child with a latent CF gene will contract it". There is scientific evidence that it MAY escalate matters. That is the issue. May =/= Will.

But yeah, let's just isolate everyone. Bubbles for all.
2012-10-20 03:48:15 PM  
2 votes:

FormlessOne: The kid is no risk to you. He's actually the one at risk - encountering another with the CF gene could escalate matters, and the school is just looking out for the welfare of not just him, but the other CF gene kid. There's enough scientific evidence to identify the risk, and so the school is acting on it.


If (as noted above) 4% of the population of European-descent is a carrier, this policy sets an effective limit of an average of 25 white kids per middle school.

My guess is it's the equivalent of "OMG! Someone could get hurt playing outside! Better cancel recess!"
2012-10-21 11:27:19 AM  
1 votes:

Lachwen: I did. I also read all the way to the end, where the director of the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation Burkholderia cepacia Research Laboratory and Repository at the University of Michigan said what the school was doing was stupid and not factually based.


THIS. When my husband and I got engaged his CF clinic had me tested for carrier status because I have frequent sinus infections and that's a sign that I might be a carrier. They did the test in case we were thinking of having children. They've told me over and over and over and over and over again that I can't catch the cepacia or psudomonas strains that will eventually kill him, and I also can't pass them to him. This article and school are full of fail.
2012-10-20 11:21:34 PM  
1 votes:
Have the parents sign a hold harmless agreement & be done with it.

Though I have to say....everyone screaming how stupid this is would be the first screaming that the school didn't do enough if something should happen.
2012-10-20 10:52:45 PM  
1 votes:

namegoeshere: hankhorsey: ch_destroi: For all of you in here calling this 'derp'-- if the article were instead about the other CF boy dying because the school did nothing about the risk of having a second carrier in close contact with the school, what would you be saying?

What it were your child at risk?

You (and the school) got the derp backwards. The boy being kicked out is the one who's "at risk"; the other boy already has the disease. To spell it out for you, the kicked-out boy is perfectly healthy but at risk of catching the disease from the cystic fibrosis carrier who is already attending the school. But the thing is that the risk isn't all that high if the two kids keep a reasonable distance and practice good hygiene.

No. No he's not. You can't catch CF. He is a carrier. He will never have CF.

TFA is discussing secondary bacterial infections, NOT CF.


correct. The risk is that the carrier may have enough lung disfunction that he can be colonized by atypical bacteria. These atypical bacteria do not cause him any disease but if spread to a cf patient who has a much greater diminishment in cftr activity will have serious complications. However the problem with this is there is already probably several kids in the school who are carriers without knowing it. plus we have no idea if the kid being banned is colonized or not, just that it is more likely due to his genetics. The school district is being incredibly dumb which makes me wonder if somehow the cf student's parents are somehow behind this.
2012-10-20 09:09:59 PM  
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: This student (the one transferred) has the CF gene and is at risk for it becoming activated, which it could be if he's exposed to an active CF infection.


This is fractally wrong.
2012-10-20 07:40:16 PM  
1 votes:
My take on what happened:

Principal: Does your son have any medical conditions?
Mother: Yes, he is a carrier of the cystic fibrosis mutation
Principal: Is he taking medication or something for it?
Mother: No.
Principal: Okay...

The mother leaves, and the principal goes to the school nurse

Principal: Is there any reason the school needs to know if a child is a carrier for cystic fibrosis?
Nurse: Not that I know of.
Principal: Well there has to be something. Why else woulkd a parent bother notifying the school?
Nurse: Google?

They go to a computer and google "medical concerns for carriers of cystic fibrosis" and find some articles saying carriers of cystic fibrosis are normal children with a slightly higher risk of developing lung infections. That risk may be increased if there is contact with a child who has cystic fibrosis. Therefore, carriers and those affected with the disease should not be in the classroom or within three feet of each other.

Principal: Ohh... She must told us so that we could separate her son from the kid who has cystic fibrosis. Too bad the kid with CF was here first. Oh well...
2012-10-20 05:02:05 PM  
1 votes:
I see a lot of derpy derp in here from the "AHH CHRISTIANS BAD, SCIENCE GOOD" crowd who obviously don't possess the reading skills to look through and understand that it's all about science in the article.

30 seconds people. 30 seconds and you wouldn't have looked like an idiot.
2012-10-20 04:12:05 PM  
1 votes:
Maybe they'll win a few million dollars, then the kid can just live a grand life without having to go to school or work.
2012-10-20 04:07:15 PM  
1 votes:
That's ok kid, you really didn't want to go to Mengele Academy anyway.
2012-10-20 04:00:19 PM  
1 votes:

FormlessOne: Whether the parents like it or not, their kid is at risk because another kid carries the gene. Keeping them apart minimizes that risk. What's the problem?


1/25 whities is a carrier, so it looks like they're going to have to test the whole damn school so they know who else to kick out.
2012-10-20 03:52:10 PM  
1 votes:
White people problems

/amidoingitrite?
2012-10-20 03:47:18 PM  
1 votes:

5monkeys: RandomCommenter: 1/25 people of European descent is a carrier for this disease. Most do not know they are carriers. How in the world is this school going to transfer every single carrier?

Bacterial Cross-Contamination or no, this is logistically untenable.

That was my thought. My ex-sister in law found out she was a carrier when she was pregnant at 32.


And, now that she knows about it, she has some small responsibility, right?

That's the school's case. No, they can't test every kid. However, they know they have two kids in the same location with the CF gene, and so they have some small responsibility in separating them to minimize the clearly identified risk. Makes sense.
2012-10-20 03:44:59 PM  
1 votes:

RandomCommenter: 1/25 people of European descent is a carrier for this disease. Most do not know they are carriers. How in the world is this school going to transfer every single carrier?

Bacterial Cross-Contamination or no, this is logistically untenable.


That was my thought. My ex-sister in law found out she was a carrier when she was pregnant at 32.
2012-10-20 03:41:42 PM  
1 votes:
"This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it."
2012-10-20 03:40:42 PM  
1 votes:
As someone who went to school with a boy that had CF, this is utter bullshiat. These people need kicked in the head. Repeatedly and hard. With steel toed boots. With spikes.

RIP Walter Sauerwein, you enriched all our lives.
2012-10-20 03:39:25 PM  
1 votes:
He got cooties
2012-10-20 03:38:34 PM  
1 votes:

OtherLittleGuy: When they find the other kid that he is suppose to be a risk to, is the other kid going to be kicked out as well?


According to the article that I read earlier, since the other kid was there first, he gets first dibs on being a student in the school. Not to mention that the other kid actually has full-blown cystic fibrosis, while the kid in the article is only a carrier.

Employers can't legally ask you about your medical conditions during an interview, why should a school have that information? I can understand advising the school of a full-blown medical situation (has asthma, carries an epi-pen...), but why on earth do they need to know if you're a carrier of a disease? Talk about a slippery slope.

/you know who else liked to segregate people because of genetic "inferiority"?
//yea I Godwin'd the thread...
2012-10-20 03:36:36 PM  
1 votes:
This is what happens when you teach Christianist "science" in school instead of real science. I assume their textbooks are of the Texas mandated variety.
2012-10-20 12:22:24 PM  
1 votes:
Another school teaching more derp than science?
 
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