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(CNN)   "It shouldn't be news when someone speaks out FOR equality, it should be news when someone speaks out AGAINST equality," says straight NFL football player getting flack for being pro-gay marriage   (cnn.com) divider line 154
    More: Hero, NFL, Chris Kluwe, Howard University, Steve Bisciotti, online games, athlete of the year, Scott Fujita, same-sex marriages  
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4894 clicks; posted to Politics » on 19 Oct 2012 at 2:56 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-19 11:42:23 AM
How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English
 
2012-10-19 11:49:35 AM
says straight NFL football player getting flack for being pro-gay marriage

Nobody will give Kluwe flack, mainly because they're scared to death that he'll eviscerate them with his awesome replies.

I love the guy, definitely my favorite player in the NFL.
 
2012-10-19 12:11:12 PM

TheManofPA: How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English


I wasn't going to get dressed up for Halloween this year. Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.
 
2012-10-19 12:14:15 PM

Diogenes: TheManofPA: How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English

I wasn't going to get dressed up for Halloween this year. Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.


Take pics. I gotta see your interpretation of a 'lustful c**kmonster."
 
2012-10-19 12:20:17 PM

Diogenes: TheManofPA: How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English

I wasn't going to get dressed up for Halloween this year. Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.


There's an nsfw photo out there that you'll probably find if you GIS "dildo costume", but I'm not going to do that because, well, I'm at work.
 
2012-10-19 12:20:20 PM
This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.
 
2012-10-19 12:20:23 PM
I love Chris Kluwe.

In a non-gay way.

NTTAWWT
 
2012-10-19 12:21:21 PM

Cythraul: Take pics. I gotta see your interpretation of a 'lustful c**kmonster."


I could always just get my Marcus Bachmann costume dry cleaned.
 
2012-10-19 12:23:00 PM

Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.


That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?
 
2012-10-19 12:25:09 PM
In addition to being a hero for equal rights, Kluwe is gonna get so much tail for being outspoken like that. Chicks dig dudes whoa re straight, manly and yet have a heart.

I know, as I used to be pretty manly. I should work on getting that back.
 
2012-10-19 12:25:13 PM
I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.
 
2012-10-19 12:27:03 PM

kid_icarus: And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?


Unfortunately I tend to like 'em big and stupid. But that's my own issue ;-)
 
2012-10-19 12:29:17 PM

Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.


Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn
 
2012-10-19 12:31:30 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: I know, as I used to be pretty manly. I should work on getting that back.


You can start by coming over to my place dressed in ass-less leather chaps, a harness, ball-gag, and biker's boots. Just don't ask any questions about what I'm doing when I start to handcuff you.

Trust me, it brings the manly back.
 
2012-10-19 12:38:43 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn


Why can't I ever find these tests?
 
2012-10-19 12:41:14 PM

Diogenes: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

Why can't I ever find these tests?


Why can't I ever persuade some of these men?
 
2012-10-19 12:47:48 PM
I know nothing about football whatsover but based on this statement alone I suppose I could call this guy my favourite football player.
 
2012-10-19 12:53:50 PM

serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.


To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.
 
2012-10-19 12:55:04 PM

serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.


i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2012-10-19 12:56:38 PM
Also: Woot! Go Chris Kluwe, and go Vikings! . . . as long as you still don't beat the Patriots.
 
2012-10-19 12:59:17 PM
Yep. Anti-gay rights people are farked in the head. Let us suppose "Roger" loves "Michael" and they have lived and loved together for ten years or so, or even six months. Who cares? They had a civil union ceremony because that is all they can get in their state. Roger's family disowned him years ago when they found out he was gay. Now Roger has cancer and is dying. Thanks to bigoted laws, the only people allowed to make decisions for him, visit him and take care of him are the same people who disowned him for his lifestyle.

Fark that shiat. It is bad enough his asshole family disowned him but now the law won't let him be comforted in his final days by someone who truly loves him?

If either of my kids turns out to be gay, that shiat will not happen. In another 50 years, this probably won't be an issue and our generation will be looked back at with incredulity at how small minded we were.

Hats off to Kluwe, and for you gay guys, pants off to Kluwe.
 
2012-10-19 01:07:33 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: Yep. Anti-gay rights people are farked in the head. Let us suppose "Roger" loves "Michael" and they have lived and loved together for ten years or so, or even six months. Who cares? They had a civil union ceremony because that is all they can get in their state. Roger's family disowned him years ago when they found out he was gay. Now Roger has cancer and is dying. Thanks to bigoted laws, the only people allowed to make decisions for him, visit him and take care of him are the same people who disowned him for his lifestyle.

Fark that shiat. It is bad enough his asshole family disowned him but now the law won't let him be comforted in his final days by someone who truly loves him?


I saw a documentary where a man in the Northern midwest had his home taken away from him after his partner died due to a technicality in the will that was challenged by estranged family members (cousins, no less) of the deceased. It all pretty much came down to the ruling of one judge, who was most likely a bigoted prick.

The surviving member of that couple was a sad sight to see. Not sure if it was his natural demeanor, but he seemed to be struggling with a mild depression at the time of the interview. He had a large storage shed/container that the extended family of the deceased had broken into to steal things as well, as if being awarded the property and the house wasn't enough.

Pretty sad.
 
2012-10-19 01:12:58 PM

Diogenes: Unfortunately I tend to like 'em big and stupid


Julie Brown, is that you?
 
2012-10-19 01:14:27 PM

SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.


I agree philosphicly with serial crusher there. But I also agree with Spherical time, that it is a straw man argument.

Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married at the last second if its the fan.

While there are many ways that they can protect themselves and thier loved ones, gay couples will always face the risk of a family member coming in at the last second and mucking it all up, and there not much recourse when that happens
 
2012-10-19 01:20:03 PM

Diogenes: Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.


You need a costume for that?
 
2012-10-19 01:28:39 PM

SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.


Income tax rates are my big gripe. They can either help or hurt depending on your respective income levels. In my perfect world, the IRS would expect married couples to file two individual returns, with no special checkboxes or different rates.
(I'd also settle for making it legal to marry my dog. Under the current tax code, a stay at home spouse would save me a shiatload of money).

For most cases I'd rather see the privileges taken away from married couples rather than granted to unmarried individuals. Say, tax free inheritance. Ideally I'd like to see your spouse just have to pay inheritance taxes just like any other person would if you willed something to them. Or alternatively, get rid of inheritance taxes for everybody.

On the joint decisions in case of incapacity thing, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to pick an arbitrary person to make those decisions for me. Of course, I can fill out some paperwork to give somebody power of attorney to solve that problem. But, so can a gay couple, so there's really no reason to include it in the discussion. You can argue that it's unfair that gay couples have to pay more money to file powers of attorney than straight couples do to get a marriage certificate, but then isn't it also unfair that a single person has to pay more? Lower prices for everybody or raise them on straight couples.

Then there's the laws that require insurance companies to offer coverage to the insured's spouse at the same rate. I'd like to be able to pick up an arbitrary person and include them on my plan.
 
2012-10-19 01:37:24 PM

Cerebral Knievel: SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.

I agree philosphicly with serial crusher there. But I also agree with Spherical time, that it is a straw man argument.

Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married at the last second if its the fan.

While there are many ways that they can protect themselves and thier loved ones, gay couples will always face the risk of a family member coming in at the last second and mucking it all up, and there not much recourse when that happens


What specifically are you talking about family members mucking up? Is this the "I'm in a coma, spouse knows I want to pull the plug, fundie parents don't want to" situation?
1) How'd that turn out for Terri Schiavo
2) Doesn't an unmarried person who disagrees with his parents have the same problem?

I just don't think a marriage certificate is the right solution to that one.
 
2012-10-19 01:41:29 PM
Chris Kluwe can be sort of hit-or-miss with me with his opinions, but he's dead-on right here. And "lustful c**kmonster" makes me guffaw out loud.
 
2012-10-19 01:45:00 PM

Jackson Herring: Diogenes: Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.

You need a costume for that?


I have to dress down to that level.
 
2012-10-19 01:45:06 PM

serial_crusher: Cerebral Knievel: SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.

I agree philosphicly with serial crusher there. But I also agree with Spherical time, that it is a straw man argument.

Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married at the last second if its the fan.

While there are many ways that they can protect themselves and thier loved ones, gay couples will always face the risk of a family member coming in at the last second and mucking it all up, and there not much recourse when that happens

What specifically are you talking about family members mucking up? Is this the "I'm in a coma, spouse knows I want to pull the plug, fundie parents don't want to" situation?
1) How'd that turn out for Terri Schiavo
2) Doesn't an unmarried person who disagrees with his parents have the same problem?

I just don't think a marriage certificate is the right solution to that one.


Yes
 
2012-10-19 01:45:41 PM

Gecko Gingrich: Diogenes: Unfortunately I tend to like 'em big and stupid

Julie Brown, is that you?


One of the last pieces of vinyl I ever bought.
 
2012-10-19 01:53:35 PM

Diogenes: One of the last pieces of vinyl I ever bought.


Great album.

/Cause I'm a Blonde is my favorite.
 
2012-10-19 02:13:41 PM
"It shouldn't be news when someone speaks out FOR equality, it should be news when someone speaks out AGAINST equality,"

Well, I can't top that, so I'll just say "Good on ya, sir"
 
2012-10-19 02:22:59 PM

Diogenes: Jackson Herring: Diogenes: Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.

You need a costume for that?

I have to dress down to that level.


i.imgur.com
 
2012-10-19 02:31:24 PM
I knew this was going to be about that Vikings punter, and good on him.
 
2012-10-19 02:55:53 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: Yep. Anti-gay rights people are farked in the head. Let us suppose "Roger" loves "Michael" and they have lived and loved together for ten years or so, or even six months. Who cares? They had a civil union ceremony because that is all they can get in their state. Roger's family disowned him years ago when they found out he was gay. Now Roger has cancer and is dying. Thanks to bigoted laws, the only people allowed to make decisions for him, visit him and take care of him are the same people who disowned him for his lifestyle.

Fark that shiat. It is bad enough his asshole family disowned him but now the law won't let him be comforted in his final days by someone who truly loves him?

.


Well, he could be comforted by Jesus if he weren't a sinful sodomite bound for the depths of hell.

/And for how many people does the whole homosexuality argument boil down to "B-b-b-b-b-but JEEZUS!"?
 
2012-10-19 02:58:37 PM
Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.
 
2012-10-19 03:06:15 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn


I bet Gay Men are Most Aroused by Gay Porn.
 
2012-10-19 03:09:45 PM
Kluwe's just farking awesome.

I'mma have to break down and get a Kluwe jersey or something.
 
2012-10-19 03:10:28 PM

mrshowrules: I know nothing about football whatsover but based on this statement alone I suppose I could call this guy my favourite football player.


It's a game played with a round ball where two teams run around the field trying to kick the ball into a large net on either end of the field.
 
2012-10-19 03:11:27 PM

Mrtraveler01: Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.


Wow. Amazing what a Viking punter can do.
 
2012-10-19 03:13:29 PM

Mrtraveler01: Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.


Its made a Packers fan like both a Viking and a Raven . Funny world
 
2012-10-19 03:16:46 PM

ravenlore: Kluwe's just farking awesome.

I'mma have to break down and get a Kluwe jersey or something.


They just started carrying them at the Vikings store at the Mall of America, and he apparently is occasionally there on Wednesday nights.
 
2012-10-19 03:16:58 PM
Who would've thought that the coolest dude in the NFL was a punter?
 
2012-10-19 03:17:01 PM

Uranus Is Huge!: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

I bet Gay Men are Most Aroused by Gay Porn.


Precisely.
 
2012-10-19 03:17:10 PM

Quasar: I love Chris Kluwe.

In a non-gay way.


Fark that, if the man shows up with flowers and a blood test I'd have to think about it.
 
2012-10-19 03:18:57 PM
Nice.
 
2012-10-19 03:19:39 PM

kid_icarus: That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?


For me, it was the day I realized that gay men are not in competition with me for tail. I started down the road thinking "wait, if every other man on earth were homosexual, then all the women would be mine."

From that day forward, I have been incredibly sympathetic to gay rights. I encourage other men to take up the cock.
 
2012-10-19 03:20:31 PM

Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.


Pretty much.

Kluwe is the man. His agreement with Donovan McNabb re: the use of jersey #5 was nothing short of genius. Our family fantasy football league trophy is named the Kluwe in his honor.

/ Lions fan
 
2012-10-19 03:20:46 PM

scottydoesntknow: says straight NFL football player getting flack for being pro-gay marriage

Nobody will give Kluwe flack, mainly because they're scared to death that he'll eviscerate them with his awesome replies.


I'd say they should be scared he'd grab an axe, but no one's scared of Kluwe holding an axe except Kluwe.

alienated: Mrtraveler01: Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.

Its made a Packers fan like both a Viking and a Raven . Funny world


Why would a Packer not like a Raven? We like you guys out there in cheeseland just fine. Your division has been kind of funny in past years (like a slightly stronger flavor of NFC West except for your Pack), and not at all involved with ours.

// don't tell me you're upset about the MNF beating Kyle Boller laid down 8 years ago
// I mean, if Kyle farking Boller outplayed me, I'd be pissed too, but not for this long
 
2012-10-19 03:22:50 PM

serial_crusher: Cerebral Knievel: SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.

I agree philosphicly with serial crusher there. But I also agree with Spherical time, that it is a straw man argument.

Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married at the last second if its the fan.

While there are many ways that they can protect themselves and thier loved ones, gay couples will always face the risk of a family member coming in at the last second and mucking it all up, and there not much recourse when that happens

What specifically are you talking about family members mucking up? Is this the "I'm in a coma, spouse knows I want to pull the plug, fundie parents don't want to" situation?
1) How'd that turn out for Terri Schiavo
2) Doesn't an unmarried person who disagrees with his parents have the same problem?

I just don't think a marriage certificate is the right solution to that one.


See this.

serial_crusher: SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.

Income tax rates are my big gripe. They can either help or hurt depending on your respective income levels. In my perfect world, the IRS would expect married couples to file two individual returns, with no special checkboxes or different rates.
(I'd also settle for making it legal to marry my dog. Under the current tax code, a stay at home spouse would save me a shiatload of money).


I can kind of see that, although marriage laws in this country were specifically written to make it easier for a man to support his stay at home wife. Even now, the tax codes do benefit a division-of-labor couple, one who makes more and another who can do more around the house. But you're asking for the benefit for yourself . . . alone. I can see the benefit for a couple, but I'm not sure what applying the discount to single people would do, aside from lower a whole bunch of people's taxes. Might as well just ask for a tax break.

serial_crusher: For most cases I'd rather see the privileges taken away from married couples rather than granted to unmarried individuals. Say, tax free inheritance. Ideally I'd like to see your spouse just have to pay inheritance taxes just like any other person would if you willed something to them. Or alternatively, get rid of inheritance taxes for everybody.


Gods, that's . . . I mean. That applies to property as well, you know? A minorly famous gay science fiction writer committed suicide when his partner died and he was asked to pay tens of thousands of dollars in taxes for inheriting half of their shared NYC apartment. He didn't have the money. And think of all the straight couples that could be utterly devastated by this if it were removed . . .

I'm gay, in MA, but not married to my boyfriend of four years. I make a decent living, but he makes a lot more than I do. If we did get married and he later died, I wouldn't be able to keep the house. I'd basically lose everything.

serial_crusher: On the joint decisions in case of incapacity thing, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to pick an arbitrary person to make those decisions for me. Of course, I can fill out some paperwork to give somebody power of attorney to solve that problem. But, so can a gay couple, so there's really no reason to include it in the discussion. You can argue that it's unfair that gay couples have to pay more money to file powers of attorney than straight couples do to get a marriage certificate, but then isn't it also unfair that a single person has to pay more? Lower prices ...


Er . . . no, it's a lot more than that. Visitation, co-adoption, and a whole host of other things that really can't be covered by power of attorney. Not to mention that you actually have to present paperwork at the time that you're invoking power of attorney.
 
2012-10-19 03:23:29 PM
Seriously, what is this headline?

"Are athletes who speak their minds out of bounds?"

It's like, fark, I work in retail. I'm not going to listen to 'shut up and stock'. Why should Kluwe have to listen to 'shut up and kick'?
 
2012-10-19 03:24:12 PM
Chris Kluwe? *checks* Chris Kluwe.


I'm not a vikings fan, but I may have to buy that guy's jersey.
 
2012-10-19 03:24:50 PM

Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: kid_icarus: That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?

For me, it was the day I realized that gay men are not in competition with me for tail. I started down the road thinking "wait, if every other man on earth were homosexual, then all the women would be mine."

From that day forward, I have been incredibly sympathetic to gay rights. I encourage other men to take up the cock.


And we can be highly effective wing men for our straight friends.
 
2012-10-19 03:25:03 PM
Hoping he manages to avoid any serious brain injuries in his career...we need folks like him.

/at least he'd a kicker
//now there's going to be a small part of me that wants to see the Viking's do well...weird
 
2012-10-19 03:25:34 PM

serial_crusher: Cerebral Knievel: SphericalTime: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

To whom would the rights go to, for unmarried people? Most of the time these rights involve things like property transfer, mutual ownership, or joint decisions in the case of incapacity. They sort of require a close relationship with a second person. For straight people, the state recognizes that with civil marriage. For gay people . . . on the federal level, they've basically got nothing.

I agree philosphicly with serial crusher there. But I also agree with Spherical time, that it is a straw man argument.

Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married at the last second if its the fan.

While there are many ways that they can protect themselves and thier loved ones, gay couples will always face the risk of a family member coming in at the last second and mucking it all up, and there not much recourse when that happens

What specifically are you talking about family members mucking up? Is this the "I'm in a coma, spouse knows I want to pull the plug, fundie parents don't want to" situation?
1) How'd that turn out for Terri Schiavo
2) Doesn't an unmarried person who disagrees with his parents have the same problem?

I just don't think a marriage certificate is the right solution to that one.




Cute, but basically misses the point. Gay couples, in circumstances sufficiently similar to those of straight couples, are treated differently under the law. The fact that single individuals - individuals in circumstances that are nothing at all like those of a gay or straight couple - are treated differently under the law is entirely unremarkable, insofar as the law treats people in different circumstances differently by design. Different tax rates for people with different incomes. Different laws for people of different ages (i.e. minors vs adults). See how that works?

Also, Terri Schiavo, really? You want to use THAT to make a point?

I once got into a debate with this gay acquaintance about gay marriage, which he was opposed to. What reason, I asked him, could a gay person have for opposing gay marriage?! He told me he had a longterm relationship with a guy that turned out to be a real asshole, and had gay marriage been legal, he would surely have married him and now he'd be married to aforementioned asshole.

You sound like that guy.
 
2012-10-19 03:26:08 PM

YouAreItNoTagBacks: Hoping he manages to avoid any serious brain injuries in his career...we need folks like him.

/at least he'd he's a kicker
//now there's going to be a small part of me that wants to see the Viking's do well...weird


FTFM...I'm clearly not ready to start skipping the preview button.
 
2012-10-19 03:27:10 PM

FirstNationalBastard: AdolfOliverPanties: Yep. Anti-gay rights people are farked in the head. Let us suppose "Roger" loves "Michael" and they have lived and loved together for ten years or so, or even six months. Who cares? They had a civil union ceremony because that is all they can get in their state. Roger's family disowned him years ago when they found out he was gay. Now Roger has cancer and is dying. Thanks to bigoted laws, the only people allowed to make decisions for him, visit him and take care of him are the same people who disowned him for his lifestyle.

Fark that shiat. It is bad enough his asshole family disowned him but now the law won't let him be comforted in his final days by someone who truly loves him?

.

Well, he could be comforted by Jesus if he weren't a sinful sodomite bound for the depths of hell.

/And for how many people does the whole homosexuality argument boil down to "B-b-b-b-b-but JEEZUS!"?


Quite a few of them throw the Jesus card even though Jesus never said anything on the topic whatsoever.

The Episcopalians would probably take him, they're pretty dang Sodomite friendly. Don't confuse the fundie evangelicals with the regular folks who are more concerned with what covered dish they're going to bring on sunday for the potluck then what you may or may not be doing in your bedroom.
 
2012-10-19 03:27:35 PM

alienated: Mrtraveler01: Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.

Its made a Packers fan like both a Viking and a Raven. Funny world


This Viking and his Ravens are a package deal:

3.bp.blogspot.com
 
ecl
2012-10-19 03:29:34 PM

Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: kid_icarus: That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?

For me, it was the day I realized that gay men are not in competition with me for tail. I started down the road thinking "wait, if every other man on earth were homosexual, then all the women would be mine."

From that day forward, I have been incredibly sympathetic to gay rights. I encourage other men to take up the cock.



You should go further and try to turn your straight friends and coworkers. Then you'll really be swimming in tuna.
 
2012-10-19 03:32:09 PM

Dr Dreidel: Why would a Packer not like a Raven?


Um, I am a SoCal who also like the Chargers . I started liking the packers when Reggie White ( i know,sigh ) signed and more good people of colour came to GB due to his encouragement and they started being well, good. That and a guy who I have lost all respect for who was the QB.
 
2012-10-19 03:33:29 PM

fracto: This Viking and his Ravens are a package deal:


Haha. Well played .
 
2012-10-19 03:36:46 PM

alienated: Mrtraveler01: Gay marriage has done the impossible:

It's made this Steelers fan actually support and defend a Baltimore Raven.

Its made a Packers fan like both a Viking and a Raven . Funny world


You know Ayanbadejo used to be a Bear right?
 
2012-10-19 03:37:21 PM
I guess I can understand invoking Jackie Robinson in a discussion about gay rights, but Muhammed Ali?
 
2012-10-19 03:38:25 PM

antidisestablishmentarianism: You know Ayanbadejo used to be a Bear right?


Nonsense. Not hairy enough.
 
2012-10-19 03:38:41 PM

antidisestablishmentarianism: You know Ayanbadejo used to be a Bear right?


Nobody is perfect
 
2012-10-19 03:38:50 PM
The one thing that I noticed about the fundie crowd when they were prattling on this one time about all the "immorality" that they imagined that went on a gay pride parade .. they reminded me of the gay guy you some times see at the bar a sort of bar fly that gossips about everyone and everyone's sex life and they want to tell you every detail -- that is the christian fundie -- I personally do not think of what the old people next door do in their bedroom ,, i don't think of what the Gay guy across the street does either ( I m in Canada so this whole thing ( gay marriage ) now is like watching people argue over if the world is round .

If gay people want to choose one person in this world and say that they love them above all others and they get their stuff when they are dead and pull the plug when a vegetable and make it all legal and binding and have no way some douche bag religion to butt in later and say "" Ohhhh we mean real 'marriage' not your 'civil union ' , so you may not visit your dying loved one ! .... Fark it let gay people marry it is a contract nothing more .
 
2012-10-19 03:44:45 PM
Chris Kluwe is f*cking awesome.
 
2012-10-19 03:47:18 PM

ecl: Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: kid_icarus: That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?

For me, it was the day I realized that gay men are not in competition with me for tail. I started down the road thinking "wait, if every other man on earth were homosexual, then all the women would be mine."

From that day forward, I have been incredibly sympathetic to gay rights. I encourage other men to take up the cock.


You should go further and try to turn your straight friends and coworkers. Then you'll really be swimming in tuna.


Well, I'm married now so it doesn't matter. My penis is not my own to command.
 
2012-10-19 03:48:19 PM

Diogenes: Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: kid_icarus: That's always been my experience. When I was a kid I used to think all straight guys hated queers...then as I got older I realized it was actually just the immature asshat ones riddled with insecurity. And who wants to be friends with them, anyway?

For me, it was the day I realized that gay men are not in competition with me for tail. I started down the road thinking "wait, if every other man on earth were homosexual, then all the women would be mine."

From that day forward, I have been incredibly sympathetic to gay rights. I encourage other men to take up the cock.

And we can be highly effective wing men for our straight friends.


This reminds me of a site (that I can't find right now), which was 10 Straight arguments in favor of Gays. Things like reducing the competition, great wing men, and calling women on their shiat when straight men can't. My husband was the one who sent it to me.

/Which I'm pretty sure doesn't mean I need my shiat called on... Probably.
 
2012-10-19 03:49:14 PM

Aidan: This reminds me of a site (that I can't find right now)


Found it! A Pragmatic Pro-Gay-Rights Argument
 
2012-10-19 03:51:47 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: In addition to being a hero for equal rights, Kluwe is gonna get so much tail for being outspoken like that. Chicks dig dudes whoa re straight, manly and yet have a heart.

I know, as I used to be pretty manly. I should work on getting that back.


He's married. And part of the reason he is speaking out is because his brother-in-law is gay.
 
2012-10-19 03:54:30 PM

SphericalTime: I'm gay, in MA, but not married to my boyfriend of four years. I make a decent living, but he makes a lot more than I do. If we did get married and he later died, I wouldn't be able to keep the house. I'd basically lose everything.


I have basically the same problem at the moment. The reason my partner isn't on the lease for our apartment is because he couldn't afford the rent if something happened to me. But in order for him to get on my health insurance - he must be on my lease to prove "financial dependence". Meanwhile no one asks for the marriage license for someone's opposite sex husband and wife or insist that they co-own or co-rent anything.
 
2012-10-19 03:58:58 PM
If you can play, you can play

NHL is on-board as are a ton of minor and college hockey teams. Every major and minor league should be on-board with this campaign.

Really...that's what it comes down to. If you can play, then you can play.
 
2012-10-19 04:02:10 PM

alienated: Dr Dreidel: Why would a Packer not like a Raven?

Um, I am a SoCal who also like the Chargers . I started liking the packers when Reggie White ( i know,sigh ) signed and more good people of colour came to GB due to his encouragement and they started being well, good. That and a guy who I have lost all respect for who was the QB.


The way you phrased it ("It's made a Packers fan like both a Viking and a Raven") made it seem like:
a) you're the Packer fan
b) you now like the Ravens when you ordinarily wouldn't have.

I get why a Packer fan appreciating a Viking is a tough step, but why not the Ravens? Different conference, thousands of miles apart, no big games between the two (other than the shellacking Boller put down a few years back, which was almost as meaningless an MNF game as there can be)...that was why I'm confused.

Is the fact that you're also a Charger fan keeping you from the Ravens? Same conference at least, but I still don't get it.
 
2012-10-19 04:09:01 PM

Aidan: Aidan: This reminds me of a site (that I can't find right now)

Found it! A Pragmatic Pro-Gay-Rights Argument


Unfortunately pragmatism is often overtaken by some people's "Ick Factor" and/or archaic thinking.
 
2012-10-19 04:11:21 PM

Diogenes: Cythraul: Take pics. I gotta see your interpretation of a 'lustful c**kmonster."

I could always just get my Marcus Bachmann costume dry cleaned.


now that's just wrong.
 
2012-10-19 04:12:23 PM

xander450: Gay couples, in circumstances sufficiently similar to those of straight couples, are treated differently under the law. The fact that single individuals - individuals in circumstances that are nothing at all like those of a gay or straight couple - are treated differently under the law is entirely unremarkable, insofar as the law treats people in different circumstances differently by design. Different tax rates for people with different incomes. Different laws for people of different ages (i.e. minors vs adults). See how that works?


Well, that's a good point in the areas where the different treatment is relevant to the existing differences. i.e. if you were hiring an actor to play George Bush in a movie, you'd be justified in only hiring a white person, but not if you were hiring an accountant....
Coincidentally this is why I don't like having different tax rates for different income levels either, but that's a completely separate thread right there.

So, you make a compelling argument for supporting marriage, with the exception of income tax incentives. Inheritance rights, decision making, etc are clearly reflective of different situations in those events.

As for the tax incentives, some married couples do have different situations (i.e. one spouse works, another stays home), but there's plenty of couples who both work reasonably well paying careers. If we wanted to encourage stay at home spouses (I don't, but plenty of people do), a tax incentive specifically for them might apply, but should rule out those married couples that both work, or those that don't have children (since that's arguably the only time that staying at home is beneficial).
 
2012-10-19 04:15:47 PM

Dr Dreidel: Same conference at least, but I still don't get it.


I dont like the ravens as they always have the potential of knocking the chargers out of the playoffs.I know, dont laugh, but it might happen. And, I like at least one player on the ravens, off the field.
On the field ? all bets are off, same goes for Kluwe / vikings.
I did make one exception in the past. I hate denver. But, there i was, many years ago cheering on elway to go out on top, and get one ring. Its complicated
 
2012-10-19 04:17:44 PM
I will never, ever understand why any straight man would hate gay men. IT JUST MEANS LESS COMPETITION FOR YOU, YOU FARKING IDIOTS! Clearly, the moral angle doesn't work on people like this at all. But just based on pure self interest, doesn't it make more sense for straight men to actually appreciate the existence of gay men? Frankly, my idea of a perfect world is one in which all women are straight and all men are gay with the exception of myself.
 
2012-10-19 04:23:32 PM
Chris Kluwe will debate a chair on this topic tonight. It will be moderated by a local radio personality.

Ms. Bachmann has not responded to her invitation.

Link
 
2012-10-19 04:24:14 PM

The Dog Ate My Homework: I will never, ever understand why any straight man would hate gay men. IT JUST MEANS LESS COMPETITION FOR YOU, YOU FARKING IDIOTS! Clearly, the moral angle doesn't work on people like this at all. But just based on pure self interest, doesn't it make more sense for straight men to actually appreciate the existence of gay men? Frankly, my idea of a perfect world is one in which all women are straight and all men are gay with the exception of myself.


Well, within the scope of marriage it doesn't really matter. Being unmarried doesn't suddenly make them competition to me, unless they're the types who get sham straight married. But for those guys I'm pretty sure they'd lose a big chunk of their voter base even if gay marriage was legal.
 
2012-10-19 04:24:49 PM

serial_crusher: xander450: Gay couples, in circumstances sufficiently similar to those of straight couples, are treated differently under the law. The fact that single individuals - individuals in circumstances that are nothing at all like those of a gay or straight couple - are treated differently under the law is entirely unremarkable, insofar as the law treats people in different circumstances differently by design. Different tax rates for people with different incomes. Different laws for people of different ages (i.e. minors vs adults). See how that works?

Well, that's a good point in the areas where the different treatment is relevant to the existing differences. i.e. if you were hiring an actor to play George Bush in a movie, you'd be justified in only hiring a white person, but not if you were hiring an accountant....
Coincidentally this is why I don't like having different tax rates for different income levels either, but that's a completely separate thread right there.

So, you make a compelling argument for supporting marriage, with the exception of income tax incentives. Inheritance rights, decision making, etc are clearly reflective of different situations in those events.

As for the tax incentives, some married couples do have different situations (i.e. one spouse works, another stays home), but there's plenty of couples who both work reasonably well paying careers. If we wanted to encourage stay at home spouses (I don't, but plenty of people do), a tax incentive specifically for them might apply, but should rule out those married couples that both work, or those that don't have children (since that's arguably the only time that staying at home is beneficial).


Yeah, look, you're not wrong - tax policy with regard to marriage (and most other things) is sort of a mess, and it's not clear that providing tax incentives for marriage is a good use of resources, especially where there are no children involved.

But when you say that talk of equal rights is disingenuous insofar as not all advocates of gay marriage would extend those rights to people in entirely different circumstances (i.e. people who are not in any form of couple at all) - well, that's just goofy.

That is all.
 
2012-10-19 04:29:24 PM
to go on te hetero angle, I must invoke my mother and my dead step father.

well... not really step they never married, and that was the problem, niether of them wanted to get married again, him, because he had been married to a succubus. that woman refused to sign any divorce papers so he was stuck out there in that way, my mother was of the belief that you only ever get married once. she wouldn't have married him anyways because of that ( shacking up apperntly was Okay though huh ma? ;-) love ya babe.)

they, my mother and charlie lived a very love filled life together for some 20 years, until the man got himself a bad case of the pancreatic cancer and died within four months of diagnosis. the old ex wife, knowing the man had ammased a mess of assets in realestate continued to refuse a divorce on the grounds she had thought she had won the redneck lottery.

there really wasn't any time to FIX anything.

so charlie died.... mom was the power of attorney, the executor of the will. stood by the mans bed side for the entire four months sitting with him as he passed away and as soon as it happened, the family ran all over the whole scene. the "wife" claimed the body, disreguarded any funeral wishes and proceeded to play the jilted widow card, sued my mother repeatidly, called her a whore of babylon and all that stuff. charlie had left that woman about 15 years prior to have ever meeting my mother might I add.

but that's where it stood... the jilted widow could make all that fuss because of her legal familial standing and it almost trumped all the legal Power of attorney stuff.

things could've been handled better all over the place, do not get me wrong. a lot of it was stubborn people being stubborn and screwing themselves and others in the process.

the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time. the case I point out is admittedly an extreme one, but an overriding point is that if you've been shacked up with your old lady for some 20 years, any old estranged family member can come in and throw a giant wrench into the works if you don't have that legal protection. straight couples usually, at least, have an option to fix that shiat, but gay couples, usually, do not.

it must also be noted, that back in the day, there were many fundies out there that considered anyone out of their racial and religious world view to either not have a, or have an inferior soul. So, to them, a white person wanting to be with a black person was like committing an act of Bestiality to them.
 
2012-10-19 04:39:27 PM
I'm not sure why the party of small government is filled with people who are perfectly okay with the government telling you who you can marry.
 
2012-10-19 04:39:43 PM
state Delegate Emmett C. Burns Jr. wrote a letter to Ravens owner, Steve Bisciotti saying that many football fans are "opposed to such a view" and suggesting that Bisciotti "inhibit such expressions" from his employee.

You'd think that homophobic fark would have more to do with his daily schedule than abuse it to make sure his bigoted attitudes are above challenge.
 
2012-10-19 04:40:41 PM

alienated: Dr Dreidel: Same conference at least, but I still don't get it.

I dont like the ravens as they always have the potential of knocking the chargers out of the playoffs.I know, dont laugh, but it might happen. And, I like at least one player on the ravens, off the field.
On the field ? all bets are off, same goes for Kluwe / vikings.
I did make one exception in the past. I hate denver. But, there i was, many years ago cheering on elway to go out on top, and get one ring. Its complicated


Fair enough, even though your QB is the douchiest douche to have ever introduced CH3CO2H to a vagina.
 
2012-10-19 04:46:32 PM

Cythraul: Diogenes: TheManofPA: How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English

I wasn't going to get dressed up for Halloween this year. Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.

Take pics. I gotta see your interpretation of a 'lustful c**kmonster."


Seconded.
 
2012-10-19 04:49:34 PM

Dr Dreidel: Fair enough, even though your QB is the douchiest douche to have ever introduced CH3CO2H to a vagina


like i said, I lost all respect for Favre a long time ago.

Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time


Agreed . Sad story, I hope it worked out well for your Mom.
 
2012-10-19 04:55:37 PM

Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time. the case I point out is admittedly an extreme one, but an overriding point is that if you've been shacked up with your old lady for some 20 years, any old estranged family member can come in and throw a giant wrench into the works if you don't have that legal protection. straight couples usually, at least, have an option to fix that shiat, but gay couples, usually, do not.


I was executor of the will of a friend of mine more than a few years ago. He and his partner were together some 30 years. When he died his sister came barging in, attempted to take over the funeral planning, demand access to the will, and started (literally) taking things. She threaten to sue and asked when his partner was going to move out. We finally cornered her in a bedroom and explained to her that the house, the property, the cars, etc wasn't in her brothers name and if she continued she would be forcibly removed from the premises. When my friend first came down with cancer the first time he started to quietly transfer all property to his partner - sometimes paying large sums of taxes in the process - so in the end he didn't really own anything of significance. She left in a huff and didn't bother coming to the funeral.

/made executing the will easy
//his partner is still contently living in the house
///many people don't have the luxury of time to get their affairs together
 
2012-10-19 05:23:58 PM

Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.


Bingo.

I am also fairly confident that Mr. Kluwe would not feel the need for a press conference to declare that he is not gay, a butt-chugger, or both.

Did he really pose for Out? If so, that's pretty awesome.

/I would go check the Out website, but alas my employer is not secure in its sexuality...
 
2012-10-19 05:25:48 PM

Cerebral Knievel: Monogomous hetero couples have the option of getting married


And that's why SC's "standard argument" is full of shiat.
 
2012-10-19 05:27:03 PM
hooray kluwe.... and the other guy in the article.

but, basically, in 50 years, the next generations are going to look at us like we look at our grandparents with the issue of race. and we will be considered assholes, because this issue will be won in favor of civil rights. (it'll just take several decades)

there needs to be more people like kluwe speaking out to audiences who are not traditionally going to hear the argument, and who definitely won't hear the argument from a source that they will listen to.
 
2012-10-19 05:32:29 PM

Jackson Herring: Diogenes: Jackson Herring: Diogenes: Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.

You need a costume for that?

I have to dress down to that level.

[i.imgur.com image 209x242]


Whelp, here comes Ghastly I'm sure.

Heh, here he comes.
 
2012-10-19 05:33:19 PM

gingerjet: Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time. the case I point out is admittedly an extreme one, but an overriding point is that if you've been shacked up with your old lady for some 20 years, any old estranged family member can come in and throw a giant wrench into the works if you don't have that legal protection. straight couples usually, at least, have an option to fix that shiat, but gay couples, usually, do not.

I was executor of the will of a friend of mine more than a few years ago. He and his partner were together some 30 years. When he died his sister came barging in, attempted to take over the funeral planning, demand access to the will, and started (literally) taking things. She threaten to sue and asked when his partner was going to move out. We finally cornered her in a bedroom and explained to her that the house, the property, the cars, etc wasn't in her brothers name and if she continued she would be forcibly removed from the premises. When my friend first came down with cancer the first time he started to quietly transfer all property to his partner - sometimes paying large sums of taxes in the process - so in the end he didn't really own anything of significance. She left in a huff and didn't bother coming to the funeral.

/made executing the will easy
//his partner is still contently living in the house
///many people don't have the luxury of time to get their affairs together


yep, in the case of my mom and charlie, less than four months.. just no time to do all that stuff.

alienated:
Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time

Agreed . Sad story, I hope it worked out well for your Mom.


more or less, we are still dealing with stuff, but the jilted widow has backed off, it took many, MANY lawyers to get her to understand that the the man had NO money ONLY ascets. at his hieght as a house flipper and landlord, he had some 80 properties, on paper worth in excess of a 1.5 large..
but the bottom had dropped out JUST as he was diagnosed, and his net worth was wiped out, he was self employed, he did EVERYTHING with the houses. bought them, restored them with his owned hands and them rented them out, using the rent and mortgage value to pay off the bills and to continue the buisness.

So, he had NO health insurance at all and the medical bills far exceeded the over all worth of the estate.whenever he got a bill, he would sell a house to pay it. then the realestate market crapped out.
Charlies kids got what they were promised and proceeded to go into forclsure and bankruptcy because mom had never taught them how to deal with money, and dad wasn't there to bail them out anymore, didn't stop them from trying to direct all thier fincial and leagal woes to us though. the daughter lost her kid because the SS and the doc's realized there was a bunch of munchousin stuff going on.

when all the fighting was going on , the only advice I could tell the mother was to just fire sale everything at auction, throw all the money at the medical bills, because the state is going to get theirs first anyways, and hand over the estate to the ex wife how she wanted..

of course, at that point, the estate probably would be worth about -$500k in unpaid bills.

deeeeevious! :D
 
2012-10-19 05:33:22 PM

Rambino: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

Bingo.

I am also fairly confident that Mr. Kluwe would not feel the need for a press conference to declare that he is not gay, a butt-chugger, or both.

Did he really pose for Out? If so, that's pretty awesome.

/I would go check the Out website, but alas my employer is not secure in its sexuality...


cdn01.cdn.justjared.com
 
2012-10-19 05:40:20 PM

Trivia Jockey: Who would've thought that the coolest dude in the NFL was a punter?


Who would've thought the Hero tag would ever be applied to a punter?
 
2012-10-19 05:41:32 PM

serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.


What?

How the hell would that even work? I mean take a sample issue: hospital visitation rights. You're suggesting that unmarried people should get the same visitation rights as spouses?

So...I should be able to visit a complete stranger in the hospital, speak to their doctor, make decisions regarding their care, in the same way their spouse would? That would be "equal rights?"

You're dumb.
 
2012-10-19 05:48:57 PM

whidbey: state Delegate Emmett C. Burns Jr. wrote a letter to Ravens owner, Steve Bisciotti saying that many football fans are "opposed to such a view" and suggesting that Bisciotti "inhibit such expressions" from his employee.

You'd think that homophobic fark would have more to do with his daily schedule than abuse it to make sure his bigoted attitudes are above challenge.


Also, what about the fans that are for such a view?
 
2012-10-19 05:50:09 PM

Cerebral Knievel: deeeeevious! :D


Ha. I have yet to do the legal stuff as the old man / dad ( i was adopted) died 10 years after his wife and went to every damn living trust / will planning thing he could as it involved a free lunch, but he never spent the 10 bucks to have anything notarised. He has 2 sisters, both very old and living miles away, so i doubt there will be any contest ( it has been 4 years now ) when i can afford to file for probate, and I did ,shall we say, a few illegal things ( thanks ,shawshank redemption ! ) to sell some stocks to pay for the funeral ( he was not big on life insurance, so there is that ) and there is only one thing left- the house.
I know, not so csb, but wanted to share, a little bit.
 
2012-10-19 06:00:10 PM

Diogenes: Rambino: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

Bingo.

I am also fairly confident that Mr. Kluwe would not feel the need for a press conference to declare that he is not gay, a butt-chugger, or both.

Did he really pose for Out? If so, that's pretty awesome.

/I would go check the Out website, but alas my employer is not secure in its sexuality...

[cdn01.cdn.justjared.com image 425x586]


Sweet. Thanks.
 
2012-10-19 06:13:16 PM

gingerjet: Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time. the case I point out is admittedly an extreme one, but an overriding point is that if you've been shacked up with your old lady for some 20 years, any old estranged family member can come in and throw a giant wrench into the works if you don't have that legal protection. straight couples usually, at least, have an option to fix that shiat, but gay couples, usually, do not.

I was executor of the will of a friend of mine more than a few years ago. He and his partner were together some 30 years. When he died his sister came barging in, attempted to take over the funeral planning, demand access to the will, and started (literally) taking things. She threaten to sue and asked when his partner was going to move out. We finally cornered her in a bedroom and explained to her that the house, the property, the cars, etc wasn't in her brothers name and if she continued she would be forcibly removed from the premises. When my friend first came down with cancer the first time he started to quietly transfer all property to his partner - sometimes paying large sums of taxes in the process - so in the end he didn't really own anything of significance. She left in a huff and didn't bother coming to the funeral.

/made executing the will easy
//his partner is still contently living in the house
///many people don't have the luxury of time to get their affairs together


I don't... how can people DO that to other people? Especially family?

Especially when someone has lost someone they care for, deeply, and that wound is still fresh. Why the FARK would people scramble in their and twist the knife, just for material gain?

I can't even concieve of cutting my younger brother out of my life. We don't talk that much (BUSY BUSY), but we don't SHUN each other.

I just...

Argh. Sometimes people confuse the hell out of me.

/I suppose that shows my parents raised me right?
 
2012-10-19 06:28:14 PM

Diogenes: Rambino: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

Bingo.

I am also fairly confident that Mr. Kluwe would not feel the need for a press conference to declare that he is not gay, a butt-chugger, or both.

Did he really pose for Out? If so, that's pretty awesome.

/I would go check the Out website, but alas my employer is not secure in its sexuality...

[cdn01.cdn.justjared.com image 425x586]


WOW I'm glad he's not gay.

He can kick one through my uprights any time.
 
2012-10-19 06:36:59 PM

Diogenes: Rambino: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

Bingo.

I am also fairly confident that Mr. Kluwe would not feel the need for a press conference to declare that he is not gay, a butt-chugger, or both.

Did he really pose for Out? If so, that's pretty awesome.

/I would go check the Out website, but alas my employer is not secure in its sexuality...

[cdn01.cdn.justjared.com image 425x586]


holy carp batman!!!!

*dabs drool*

I've never seen him not in a helmet and football gear.....

I'll.....I'll be back....later......
 
2012-10-19 06:39:16 PM

Bill_Wick's_Friend: If you can play, you can play

NHL is on-board as are a ton of minor and college hockey teams. Every major and minor league should be on-board with this campaign.

Really...that's what it comes down to. If you can play, then you can play.


Beat me to linking to that. Great message, sad so few will man up and back it. Props to those behind it though

/yes, I said behind
 
2012-10-19 06:44:28 PM

skepticultist: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

What?

How the hell would that even work? I mean take a sample issue: hospital visitation rights. You're suggesting that unmarried people should get the same visitation rights as spouses?

So...I should be able to visit a complete stranger in the hospital, speak to their doctor, make decisions regarding their care, in the same way their spouse would? That would be "equal rights?"

You're dumb.


CSB: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.

So, legalized gay marriage is a helpful bandaid for a tiny number of people who find themselves in that position, but if we fixed the root of the problem we could solve it for everybody.
 
2012-10-19 06:52:40 PM

serial_crusher: skepticultist: serial_crusher: I'm going to bring up my standard gripe about the "equal rights" talk being disingenuous. If you really wanted equal rights, you'd have a problem with all unmarried people being denied the benefits that come along with marriage, not just gay couples.

What?

How the hell would that even work? I mean take a sample issue: hospital visitation rights. You're suggesting that unmarried people should get the same visitation rights as spouses?

So...I should be able to visit a complete stranger in the hospital, speak to their doctor, make decisions regarding their care, in the same way their spouse would? That would be "equal rights?"

You're dumb.

CSB: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.

So, legalized gay marriage is a helpful bandaid for a tiny number of people who find themselves in that position, but if we fixed the root of the problem we could solve it for everybody.


Huh. When my fiance (then-girlfriend) had a stroke (in her late twenties. While I had brought her *home for thanksgiving break* for the first time, to meet my parents.), the ER doctors let me stay with her.

/She's completely, totally, amazingly fine now. The only thing is she says she "thinks she swallows" differently than she did before the stroke.
//UNC-Chapel Hill Hospital Neurologists, you are like tiny little gods.
 
2012-10-19 06:57:18 PM

alienated: Dr Dreidel: Reggie White


Speaking of bigots....
 
2012-10-19 07:04:56 PM
A guy who gets paid to jump on piles of sweaty men is in favor of gay marriage? What a shock.
 
2012-10-19 07:11:16 PM

MrEricSir: A guy who gets paid to jump on piles of sweaty men is in favor of gay marriage? What a shock.


Clearly you DNRTFA. This guy gets paid to avoid sweaty men at all costs.
 
2012-10-19 07:21:31 PM

Rambino: MrEricSir: A guy who gets paid to jump on piles of sweaty men is in favor of gay marriage? What a shock.

Clearly you DNRTFA. This guy gets paid to avoid sweaty men at all costs.


Well, unless nobody else can manage to farking tackle the punt return.

And we ARE talking about the Vikes here.
 
2012-10-19 07:39:29 PM

serial_crusher: CSB: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.


If only there had been some institution you could have legally entered into that would have obviated that problem. But since it's illegal for people like you, oh, well.
 
2012-10-19 07:49:44 PM

Theaetetus: serial_crusher: CSB: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.

If only there had been some institution you could have legally entered into that would have obviated that problem. But since it's illegal for people like you, oh, well.


Seriously. Like ... is the argument there actually "why can't I get the benefits of marriage without having to be married?" Because that seems kind of self-evident to me.

If you want the benefits of marriage, get married. Sorry that being married comes with certain legal and social responsibilities and repercussions, but you can't have your cake and eat it, too.

Lots of same-sex couples would love to take on these responsibilities, but can't in most of this country. Signing legal contracts--even getting a civil union--isn't enough, as many situations have shown (especially regarding visitation rights). Even if these other arrangements should protect their rights, they don't. Suing a hospital after the fact is all well and good, but it doesn't help you any if your partner dies in one that doesn't let you see them. No litigation gives you that back.

The solution is marriage, and nothing less.
 
2012-10-19 07:59:11 PM

austerity101: Theaetetus: serial_crusher: CSB: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.

If only there had been some institution you could have legally entered into that would have obviated that problem. But since it's illegal for people like you, oh, well.

Seriously. Like ... is the argument there actually "why can't I get the benefits of marriage without having to be married?" Because that seems kind of self-evident to me.

If you want the benefits of marriage, get married. Sorry that being married comes with certain legal and social responsibilities and repercussions, but you can't have your cake and eat it, too.


Part of the problem is that the people arguing for this are still thinking of marriage as the "sacred holy union" of religion, leading them to think "gosh, I can't marry my girlfriend of 4 years, because I'm just not ready yet! Or the wedding will be so expensive! Or I'm too young to get married! Or I don't know if we'll stay together!"
Marriage is a contract, and can have any reasonable conditions attached to it you want in a pre-nup or even post-nup in some states, and can be just as easily voided as any other contract (or bitterly fought over, just like any other contract). If more people thought of marriage like car insurance, we wouldn't have all these fights about it.
 
2012-10-19 08:05:01 PM

Theaetetus: austerity101: If you want the benefits of marriage, get married. Sorry that being married comes with certain legal and social responsibilities and repercussions, but you can't have your cake and eat it, too.

Part of the problem is that the people arguing for this are still thinking of marriage as the "sacred holy union" of religion, leading them to think "gosh, I can't marry my girlfriend of 4 years, because I'm just not ready yet! Or the wedding will be so expensive! Or I'm too young to get married! Or I don't know if we'll stay together!"
Marriage is a contract, and can have any reasonable conditions attached to it you want in a pre-nup or even post-nup in some states, and can be just as easily voided as any other contract (or bitterly fought over, just like any other contract). If more people thought of marriage like car insurance, we wouldn't have all these fights about it.


Yes, exactly. I put in the bit about "social responsibilities" but you explained it far better than I did. We ascribe a lot of emotional/spiritual/social meaning to marriage, and we don't have to. If you want to buy into the idea that marriage is a onerous sacred institution, fine, but understand that you can't get the benefits until you actually marry someone.

It doesn't have to be a big deal--we just make it one.
 
2012-10-19 08:12:23 PM
I just can't see where society has a compelling interest in preventing gay marriage.
I cannot get a response from any of the "anti's" on this.
Where is the compelling interest?
And , if there is not one, this being America - should not the default postion be to permit it?
I don't get it.
 
2012-10-19 08:14:54 PM

austerity101: If you want to buy into the idea that marriage is a onerous sacred institution, fine, but understand that you can't get the benefits until you actually marry someone.


That, plus you need to understand that that idea doesn't actually exist in the law, just your own head, so don't complain that the law is the problem and should be changed. :)
 
2012-10-19 08:19:24 PM

serial_crusher: My ex-girlfriend hospitalized herself on a ski trip with me. The hospital wouldn't let me visit her and wouldn't give me any info until her parents got there, like 10 hours later. Yeah, that pretty much sucked.

So, legalized gay marriage is a helpful bandaid for a tiny number of people who find themselves in that position, but if we fixed the root of the problem we could solve it for everybody.


So... you want to outlaw skiing?
 
2012-10-19 08:23:15 PM

Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.


I believe homophobia is the flip side of sexism. A person who believes women should be subservient to men believes that a relationship is based on dominance. From a sexist point of view, two men together means that one of them is being abused (by being forced to act as a woman).
 
2012-10-19 08:23:52 PM

Diogenes: TheManofPA: How can we be so sure that he hasn't turned into a lustful c**kmonster after the magazine interview?

/love Kluwe's twitter
//gotta learn English

I wasn't going to get dressed up for Halloween this year. Now I want to go as a lustful c**kmonster.


I'll send you a picture of my mom for reference.
 
2012-10-19 08:27:32 PM

Garble: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

I believe homophobia is the flip side of sexism. A person who believes women should be subservient to men believes that a relationship is based on dominance. From a sexist point of view, two men together means that one of them is being abused (by being forced to act as a woman).


It further explains why anti-homosexual slurs focus on the receiver (e.g. cawksucker, taking it up the ass, etc.) as opposed to the giver (no one calls anyone a beej-receiver as an insult); and also explains why they don't mind femme lesbians nearly as much.
 
2012-10-19 08:37:34 PM
Is it just me or does this quote from the article feel really incredibly dated like something out of an old-timey news story?

"Although he himself is not a homosexual, Kluwe posed for the November cover of Out magazine."
 
2012-10-19 08:59:02 PM

Trivia Jockey: Who would've thought that the coolest dude in the NFL was a punter?


It's not surprising at all, really.
It's the safest position I think (I don't know sports that well), he won't get brain damage or die at 40.
 
2012-10-19 08:59:37 PM

rynthetyn: Is it just me or does this quote from the article feel really incredibly dated like something out of an old-timey news story?

"Although he himself is not a homosexual, Kluwe posed for the November cover of Out magazine."


It's certainly very poorly phrased.
 
2012-10-19 09:15:34 PM

Blue_Blazer: Speaking of bigots....


I did do a sigh after his name- context man. Now, sure, Reggie was a bigot, but, he did open up that team, as I stated, to not just white ( no pun intended ) guys going to Green Bay to play.
Like only Nixon could go to china where asians can turn a watch into a telly, Only Reggie could be the biggest baddest respected player who would help get free agents and draft picks to even think about playing for TitleTeam. I might be wrong, but that is how I saw things at the time, and I still think that way.
Loved him on the field, but off ? not so much. This is a hard point for me to type- i hope that you get the gist. Lesser evil and so forth
 
2012-10-19 09:19:12 PM
And I know, very well, how reggie hated the queers, but- its just a player in a dumb game that i used to follow more than i do now. I shed few tears when he died. Just to make that clear.I liked him as a football player and recruiter for the team, nothing more.
 
2012-10-19 09:44:16 PM
BTW folks...

lustful c*ckmonsster....

underthelobsterscope.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-10-19 09:45:31 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn


Because guys who you might think of as "homophobic" yet go sign up to watch male porn, are a great indicator of all guys who aren't cool with teh buttsex. Yeah, I could sign up for a study in which I have to watch animals being thrown into combines, but even though I've never seen any such thing, I'll still avoid that shiat at all costs.. now people who secretly enjoy torturing animals on the other hand, they'll probably sign up.
 
2012-10-19 09:52:22 PM

BraveNewCheneyWorld: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

Because guys who you might think of as "homophobic" yet go sign up to watch male porn, are a great indicator of all guys who aren't cool with teh buttsex. Yeah, I could sign up for a study in which I have to watch animals being thrown into combines, but even though I've never seen any such thing, I'll still avoid that shiat at all costs.. now people who secretly enjoy torturing animals on the other hand, they'll probably sign up.


that is a good point, its a selective study at best.
 
2012-10-19 09:55:42 PM

Cerebral Knievel: BTW folks...

lustful c*ckmonsster....

[underthelobsterscope.files.wordpress.com image 350x350]


I dunno....he looks more "jolly" than "lustful".
 
2012-10-19 10:05:26 PM

Gyrfalcon: Cerebral Knievel: BTW folks...

lustful c*ckmonsster....

[underthelobsterscope.files.wordpress.com image 350x350]

I dunno....he looks more "jolly" than "lustful".


maybe that's why he's jolly? ever think about that one?
 
2012-10-19 10:09:20 PM
alright then, the cuttlefish of Cthulhu...

that's a lustfull C*ckmonster..

fc04.deviantart.net
 
2012-10-19 10:21:52 PM
imageshack.us
 
2012-10-19 10:41:00 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn


To do that test properly, you would need to make sure there isn't a big difference in the amount of gay porn that each group had already viewed. It would be best to test subjects that had not already watched significant amounts of gay porn. I just don't think you can find a statistically significant sample size of homophobic men that fit that criteria.
 
2012-10-19 10:59:21 PM
kluwe makes me proud to be a minnesotan. seems to just be a real cool guy, and i appreciate his willingness to stand up when so many others don't.
 
2012-10-19 11:02:53 PM
Hero tag well deserved.
 
2012-10-19 11:04:49 PM

Cerebral Knievel: BraveNewCheneyWorld: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

Because guys who you might think of as "homophobic" yet go sign up to watch male porn, are a great indicator of all guys who aren't cool with teh buttsex. Yeah, I could sign up for a study in which I have to watch animals being thrown into combines, but even though I've never seen any such thing, I'll still avoid that shiat at all costs.. now people who secretly enjoy torturing animals on the other hand, they'll probably sign up.

that is a good point, its a selective study at best.


Does anyone have a copy of the full paper (I can just find the abstract)? The recruitment for those studies typically (if done correctly) done so that the people signing up do not know the details of the study, if even the general field. The don't recruit as a "Come watch gay porn", they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study". They then ask all kinds of questions, some of which have no relevance to the study (1: "rate gay sex on 1 to 10, 1 being teh gay, 10 being awesomesauce"..... 2: Rate beer drinking.... 3: Rate art films... etc).

Then, you tell them they'll watch an explicit video (and explain the whole "why we're hooking up stuff to your junk"), but not tell them what the vids are, just that they must watch them to the end).

Now, I can't read the paper, so I don't know if it details the recruitment methodology, on if the authors actually know how to recruit or if they did it poorly and biased their data.
 
2012-10-19 11:22:29 PM

PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".


i480.photobucket.com
Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
 
2012-10-19 11:30:09 PM

BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.

Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week out closeted gays?
 
2012-10-19 11:31:16 PM

PhDemented: BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week weed out closeted gays?

 
2012-10-19 11:33:31 PM

PhDemented: PhDemented: BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week weed out closeted gays?


Yeah, most psychological studies are so obsfucated by bullshiat by design that it was probably billed as a "visual attentiveness" study or something.
 
2012-10-19 11:56:31 PM

PhDemented: PhDemented: BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week weed out closeted gays?


Well, mother of god, I HOPE so.
 
2012-10-20 12:16:37 AM

PonceAlyosha: PhDemented: PhDemented: BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week weed out closeted gays?

Yeah, most psychological studies are so obsfucated by bullshiat by design that it was probably billed as a "visual attentiveness" study or something.


"Now, we're measuring your visual acuity and concentration. Please focus on the hole in the wall in front of you... closer... closer... closer... Feel free to open your mouth slightly if it helps you concentrate..."
 
2012-10-20 12:17:44 AM
The Electoral College Results contest is now on the "Today's racist teahadist doing something horrible to an Obama campaign office comes to us via the city of Conifer, Colorado" thread. 34 entries so far. Two months of Total Fark as prize! Come on and pick your winning numbers!
 
2012-10-20 12:41:04 AM
Honk bag if you thought this thread was going to be about Romney's lame attempt at scoring political points by mentioning that he actually hires women.
 
2012-10-20 07:04:46 AM

Cerebral Knievel: BTW folks...

lustful c*ckmonsster....

[underthelobsterscope.files.wordpress.com image 350x350]


Ah a fellow player of Flexible Survival, well played.
 
2012-10-20 11:00:34 AM
A better question would be "Why do people get persecuted for doing or saying the right thing?" I say that because as far as I'm concerned, all that people getting persecuted for doing or saying the right thing does is to demotivate others from doing the right thing.
 
2012-10-20 11:43:49 AM

Gyrfalcon: PhDemented: PhDemented: BraveNewCheneyWorld: PhDemented: they recruit as "Come participate in a sex study".

Look, they may be closeted gays, but they're not farking retarded.
Are you arguing that every sex study in existence is designed to week weed out closeted gays?

Well, mother of god, I HOPE so.


Well, we all HOPE we get to watch gay porn when we sign up for any study

/don't we
//don't we?
 
2012-10-20 01:31:09 PM

Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.


THIS.

I used to hang out at a gay bar because it was 3 blocks from my home, comfy, had a split adult classy section and jukebox/pool section, and was the only damn place in town that could make a decent Irish Coffee or Old Fashioned. Plus locally owned and the owners did a lot for local charities, lgbt focused and others. And had free safe sex stuff at the front door that helped many of my straight and gay broke friends get laid safely.

Sometimes I got hit on, politely demurred, and bought them a drink. Same as my other favorite bar (BF lived 2 hours away for awhile)... well, I just bought the ladies drinks cause I was on their turf.

So coworkers and I decide to get drinks. 5 of us, I suggest gay bar. 2 folks who had been there with me agree immediately. 1 guy agrees after being reassured that it's not a club atmosphere.

Last guy - apparently straight, hardcore liberal - flipped the f--k out and refused to go, sputtering some nonsense as we all just gave each other WTF stares.

We all had suspicions before that but oh did that clinch it.

If you're so damn insecure you can't say thanks but no thanks *if* someone hits on you holy crap. Take out that goddamn plank in your eye already.
 
2012-10-20 01:38:33 PM

gingerjet: Cerebral Knievel: the point is, next of Kin laws mess with gay couples and non married hetero couples all the time. the case I point out is admittedly an extreme one, but an overriding point is that if you've been shacked up with your old lady for some 20 years, any old estranged family member can come in and throw a giant wrench into the works if you don't have that legal protection. straight couples usually, at least, have an option to fix that shiat, but gay couples, usually, do not.

I was executor of the will of a friend of mine more than a few years ago. He and his partner were together some 30 years. When he died his sister came barging in, attempted to take over the funeral planning, demand access to the will, and started (literally) taking things. She threaten to sue and asked when his partner was going to move out. We finally cornered her in a bedroom and explained to her that the house, the property, the cars, etc wasn't in her brothers name and if she continued she would be forcibly removed from the premises. When my friend first came down with cancer the first time he started to quietly transfer all property to his partner - sometimes paying large sums of taxes in the process - so in the end he didn't really own anything of significance. She left in a huff and didn't bother coming to the funeral.

/made executing the will easy
//his partner is still contently living in the house
///many people don't have the luxury of time to get their affairs together


You're a good friend.

And my friends moved out of state and got properly married in Canada because they feared that exact worst case scenario from one's immediate family. Effing sucked, don't blame them, but they talk about a brain drain in my state and every single goddamn gay friend I had in college has moved out. Our defense of marriage crap wasn't always the only reason but it was always a big one.
 
2012-10-20 03:52:33 PM

PhDemented: Cerebral Knievel: BraveNewCheneyWorld: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

Because guys who you might think of as "homophobic" yet go sign up to watch male porn, are a great indicator of all guys who aren't cool with teh buttsex. Yeah, I could sign up for a study in which I have to watch animals being thrown into combines, but even though I've never seen any such thing, I'll still avoid that shiat at all costs.. now people who secretly enjoy torturing animals on the other hand, they'll probably sign up.

that is a good point, its a selective study at best.

Does anyone have a copy of the full paper (I can just find the abstract)?


Found this.

Participants
Caucasian heterosexual male volunteers (n = 64) recruited from the Psychology Department Research Subject Pool at the University of Georgia participated in the study. They were screened during large group testing during which time they completed the modified version of the Kinsey Heterosexual-Homosexual Rating Scale (Kinsey, Pomeroy, & Martin, 1948), the Index of Homophobia (IHP; Hudson & Ricketts, 1980), and the Aggression Questionnaire (Buss & Perry, 1992). They were contacted by telephone at a later date to schedule the laboratory portion of the study. All participants received partial course credit. The mean age of the men was 20.3 years ( range = 18 to 31 years).

Screening Measures
Kinsey Heterosexual-Homosexual Rating Scale. A modified version of the Kinsey Heterosexual-Homosexual Rating Scale was used to assess sexual arousal and prior sexual experiences. This version of the Kinsey is a 7-point scale on which individuals separately rated their sexual arousal and experiences from exclusively homosexual to exclusively heterosexual. Only participants who reported exclusively heterosexual arousal and experiences (i.e., ls on both sections) were selected for participation.

IHP. The IHP is the most widely used measure of homophobia (O'Donahue & Caselles, 1993 ). The items of the IHP assess affective components of homophobia. The scale contains 25 items, and scores range from 0 to 100. Respondents were divided into four groups on the basis of their score: 0-25, high-grade nonhomophobic men; 26-50, low-grade nonhomophobic men; 51-75, low-grade homophobic men; and 76-100, high-grade homophobic men. The score obtained is a measure of "dread" an individual experiences when placed in close quarters with a homosexual; a low score equals low dread, and a high score equals high dread. Because most of the items contain the terms comfortable or uncomfortable, dread can be assumed to mean anticipatory anxiety about interacting with a homosexual person. For example, one item states "I would feel nervous being in a group of homosexuals." Positive and negative statements are used to control for response set biases. The authors reported .90 reliability coetficient on a sample of 300 respondents. O'Donahu¢ and Caselles ( 1993, p. 187 ) commented that the authors of the IHP used a "more empirical and psychometrically sophisticated approach than previous researchers who have produced instruments to measure homophobia."

The men were divided into two groups on the basis of their scores on the IHP: 0-50 = nonhomophobic men, n = 29, M = 30.48, SD = 14.70; 51-100 = homophobic men, n = 35, M = 80.40, SD = 13.2. This split was necessary because of an inability to find an adequate number of exclusively heterosexual men who scored in the high-grade nonhomophobic range (0-25).
 
2012-10-21 02:07:03 AM

Uranus Is Huge!: Dusk-You-n-Me: Diogenes: I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor.

Homophobic Men Most Aroused by Gay Male Porn

I bet Gay Men are Most Aroused by Gay Porn.


Gay men are aroused by homophobic men getting aroused by gay porn.
 
2012-10-21 02:25:35 AM

The Dog Ate My Homework: I will never, ever understand why any straight man would hate gay men. IT JUST MEANS LESS COMPETITION FOR YOU, YOU FARKING IDIOTS! Clearly, the moral angle doesn't work on people like this at all. But just based on pure self interest, doesn't it make more sense for straight men to actually appreciate the existence of gay men? Frankly, my idea of a perfect world is one in which all women are straight and all men are gay with the exception of myself.


I agree. But for different reasons.
 
2012-10-21 05:33:14 AM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: Diogenes: This is the what men who are secure in their sexuality sound like.

I don't subscribe to the idea that all men who hate gays are secretly gay themselves, though I think that's sometimes a factor. But I do think that men who are secure in their sexuality really don't give a shiat about the sexuality of others.

THIS.

I used to hang out at a gay bar because it was 3 blocks from my home, comfy, had a split adult classy section and jukebox/pool section, and was the only damn place in town that could make a decent Irish Coffee or Old Fashioned. Plus locally owned and the owners did a lot for local charities, lgbt focused and others. And had free safe sex stuff at the front door that helped many of my straight and gay broke friends get laid safely.

Sometimes I got hit on, politely demurred, and bought them a drink. Same as my other favorite bar (BF lived 2 hours away for awhile)... well, I just bought the ladies drinks cause I was on their turf.

So coworkers and I decide to get drinks. 5 of us, I suggest gay bar. 2 folks who had been there with me agree immediately. 1 guy agrees after being reassured that it's not a club atmosphere.

Last guy - apparently straight, hardcore liberal - flipped the f--k out and refused to go, sputtering some nonsense as we all just gave each other WTF stares.

We all had suspicions before that but oh did that clinch it.

If you're so damn insecure you can't say thanks but no thanks *if* someone hits on you holy crap. Take out that goddamn plank in your eye already.


What he was really afraid of happening when he went in:

"Norm!"
 
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