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(Huffington Post)   Nineteen of the biggest film plot holes ever. (Spoilers)   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 280
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23954 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 18 Oct 2012 at 11:56 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-19 05:04:55 PM
It was the year 3000, so yeah, about a thousand years. Things were pretty well destroyed, many things were moth balled, and the cavemen did a LOT of repair on man made stuff to fight the aliens.

100% sound? no, but the difference in absurdity between the book's many years of thousands of humans rebuilding versus 30 days of cave men pulling a harrier straight out of bubble, didn't trigger my BS detector.

The movie is also only about the first 3rd of the book, which goes on.....

***! Spoiler alert !*****

who am I kidding? who read L. Ron Hubbard these days?

Anyway, the second 2/3rd of the book is mankind basically fighting them fully back and pretty much taking over the universe.

Realistic? No.
Epic scifi adventure? sure.
Cavemen hot-wiring jets in bearskin? no where to be found.
 
2012-10-19 05:11:16 PM
Battlefield Earth:
Also in the book they do not fly/drive any earth vehicles. They steal the alien's vehicles which they've been trained on using.
 
2012-10-19 05:36:07 PM

barneyfifesbullet: Anyone that worries about plot holes in a fantasy-based film is a pretentious douche.


Why? Movies shouldn't be written with some sense of internal logic? Why do you hate decent writing?
 
2012-10-19 05:44:13 PM

rausrh: Battlefield Earth:
Also in the book they do not fly/drive any earth vehicles. They steal the alien's vehicles which they've been trained on using.


Now THAT makes sense. No irony or sarcasm. Now, left unanswered, why did they never question surprise where the mananimals were finding bricks of pure gold. Did they melt them down in the book? Because that makes the psyclos pretty damn stupid.
 
2012-10-19 05:48:03 PM

czetie: Frankly, I find it hard to avoid the conclusion that Lucas knew much of the terminology of sci-fi without knowing or caring what any of it actually meant. "Parsec" sounds cool, and so does "hyperspace". And just for the record, none of this stops me from enjoying Star Wars as a damn good movie in its own right; but it does make it hard for me to enjoy the subsequent movie, each of which further undermines key dramatic elements of the original.


Lucas wrote the film without even knowing if it would get a wide release, much less that 30 years later people would be examining it like the Zapruder Film. So yeah, the terms that he threw out in the screenplay are by his own admission not scientifically accurate. It's holes in the actual plot that make for sloppy writing, not science definitions that you can quibble over.

If you want to see movies that try to sound scientifically accurate but have plot holes you can fly a Dyson Sphere into, see the Star Trek TNG movies.
 
2012-10-19 05:52:21 PM
"It: The Terror From Beyond Space" the 1950's movie that "Aliens" is a ripped off of was actually, in some ways, a much more logical movie. The spaceship design has hatches between decks which actually makes more sense than the layout of Nostromo. Also the crew is not idiots they figure out pretty quickly what they are up against and are only distracted by tending to their injured crew and their belief that conventional weapons are the answer to their problem. Once the figure out how much oxygen the alien needs it is dead in moments. There is not a single intelligent person on the Nostromo. Even Ripley does stupid stuff over and over. She essentially lucks into the solution at the end of the movie.

Aliens 2 features anachronistic marines who are dumber than the dumbest jar head to ever come out of Paris Island. He can't detect the aliens in the room because of the drop ceiling! Any marine worth his salt would identify the ceiling as a hiding place in an instant! NO military force is a stupid as the marines in this movie are. Hell even the average low tech al queda fighter is smarter!
 
2012-10-19 06:10:21 PM

czetie: LesserEvil: Actually, the "Kessel Run" takes smugglers around "The Maw" - a cluster of black holes (as explained in many of the expanded universe books).

Navigating through them takes skill and speed to avoid the gravity wells.

Yes, it's retconning, but it does work in this case. Hyperdrives can be overloaded by strong enough gravity wells.

Serious question: does anything in the extended universe explain why the movies don't seem to acknowledge the difference between hyperspace and FTL travel in regular space as alternative ways of getting around quickly/not making the most boring space travel movie in the history of ever? Do both exist alongside each other? It seems like the two are used interchangeably, often when talking about the same ship.

IIRC, Solo brags that the Falcon will "make point five past lightspeed". If that means, as it seems to at face value, 1.5 times the speed of light, that's still not very fast compared to interstellar distances. Do the books retcon that to something more useful? Or does Solo simply have no idea what he's talking about?

Frankly, I find it hard to avoid the conclusion that Lucas knew much of the terminology of sci-fi without knowing or caring what any of it actually meant. "Parsec" sounds cool, and so does "hyperspace". And just for the record, none of this stops me from enjoying Star Wars as a damn good movie in its own right; but it does make it hard for me to enjoy the subsequent movie, each of which further undermines key dramatic elements of the original.


From what I understand in Star Wars tech manuals, the lower the number the faster the hyperspeed. Like a class 4 or class 3 would be standard civilian freighters and such, class 2 would be like for Star Destroyers and other military ships. Class 1 for X-Wings and illegal hot rods. The Falcon had a 0.5 making it the fastest known.

But noone ever says "my ship can make 4 past lightspeed." So Han saying "point five past lightspeed" still makes no sense until someone else says something similar.

/gets worse in Timothy Zahn books when he goes the opposite direction and assumes the higher the number the faster the speed, because he gives Star Destroyers a point four speed
 
2012-10-19 06:33:53 PM

thecpt: thecpt: Hans Kammler: all good replies on the hyperdrive etc. and i did not make my point fully.

so what if they were on the 'falcon' for 'weeks' - we are told it takes YEARS for someone to become a jedi. Yoda says Luke is too old. yeah crappy prequels aside or whatever we see younglings that take years to become jedi - and our hero Luke does it in a few hours like getting a merit badge. BZZZZZT wrong answer.

You know I've thought about this, but really Luke kind of sucks in terms of what Jedi's are capable of in the prequels. When he fights he looks like he learned the most basic abilities and makes up for it by completely giving into the ideology. He never performs any feats (force jump and such), can only move small objects, and his saber fighting is shiat.

It's almost more in line with how it should be.

But he DOES do a force jump, when Vader dumps him into the carbonite freezing chamber in Empire Strikes Back. Now, in light of the prequels, what's interesting is that Vader's response is "impressive." Now maybe that's a dad being proud of his boy for winning his first pinewood derby, but the prequels made that a pretty bland and common feat.

Also: Anakin is "too old, too old to begin the training." Nice callback/forward to Luke, except Luke is late teens. So he would be waaaay too old. Nice job breaking the retcon, Lucas. It would have been more believable if Anakin had been Luke's age when a brash young pilot named Anakin was discovered by a barely older Obi Wan. It would also be like poetry, it would rhyme.
/hint hint
//overpowered Force abilities in PT

 
2012-10-19 07:22:25 PM
I don't think that 12 Monkeys or The Time Traveler's Wife have any time travel-related plot holes. Both are self-consistent. Inevitability and the immutability of time are central parts of both movies' endings.
 
182
2012-10-19 08:27:37 PM
Fark Me To Tears:
The WORST plot hole in Independence Day was that Jeff Goldblum and his father were able to drive from New York City to Washington DC, get into the White House, brief the president, and get over to Andrews Air Force base to escape in Air Force One in the span of about five hours.

it's a tight timeline, but plausible.
 
2012-10-19 08:32:48 PM

Fark Me To Tears: FTFA: "Independence Day"
A computer virus destroys an entire alien ship ... really? And where did David connect the device that uploaded the virus. We doubt they sell alien ports at Best Buy.

WTF? Did the author actually watch any of these movies?

The virus didn't destroy the alien ship. The nuclear bomb that was detonated inside the alien ship destroyed the alien ship. The virus just screwed up the alien computer systems that controlled their ships.

The virus was transmitted to the mother ship from an antenna that had been mounted on the captured spaceship.

The REAL plot hole in Independence Day was that the virus worked at all. Jeff Goldblum's character goes from correctly interpreting a countdown signal to being able to write malicious code for a completely alien computer system in the span of a couple of days... On a f*ckin' Mac, no less.

The WORST plot hole in Independence Day was that Jeff Goldblum and his father were able to drive from New York City to Washington DC, get into the White House, brief the president, and get over to Andrews Air Force base to escape in Air Force One in the span of about five hours.


***This thread already has 259 posts and I think it is likely that this post may have been addressed previously.....but just in case: That fact that the Jeff Goldblum character was able to create a computer virus for the alien mothership on a MAC computer was not a plothole - it was supposed to show the viewer that the computer technology from the crashed Roswell alien ship was handed off to American software-makers who adapted the alien software technology for human use. Hence, our MAC computers and software ARE the invading aliens' technology........
 
2012-10-19 09:20:27 PM

TheDebbieDee: Fark Me To Tears: FTFA: "Independence Day"
A computer virus destroys an entire alien ship ... really? And where did David connect the device that uploaded the virus. We doubt they sell alien ports at Best Buy.

WTF? Did the author actually watch any of these movies?

The virus didn't destroy the alien ship. The nuclear bomb that was detonated inside the alien ship destroyed the alien ship. The virus just screwed up the alien computer systems that controlled their ships.

The virus was transmitted to the mother ship from an antenna that had been mounted on the captured spaceship.

The REAL plot hole in Independence Day was that the virus worked at all. Jeff Goldblum's character goes from correctly interpreting a countdown signal to being able to write malicious code for a completely alien computer system in the span of a couple of days... On a f*ckin' Mac, no less.

The WORST plot hole in Independence Day was that Jeff Goldblum and his father were able to drive from New York City to Washington DC, get into the White House, brief the president, and get over to Andrews Air Force base to escape in Air Force One in the span of about five hours.

***This thread already has 259 posts and I think it is likely that this post may have been addressed previously.....but just in case: That fact that the Jeff Goldblum character was able to create a computer virus for the alien mothership on a MAC computer was not a plothole - it was supposed to show the viewer that the computer technology from the crashed Roswell alien ship was handed off to American software-makers who adapted the alien software technology for human use. Hence, our MAC computers and software ARE the invading aliens' technology........


But Data (didnt know that was him until recently) says they are all excited because all the gadgets started up when the mother ship showed up.
 
2012-10-19 09:32:24 PM
Minority Report drives me nuts! Hear me out...

So Anderton's boss, Lamar, decides to set him up. He does this by hiring "Leo Crow" to hang out in an apartment with a load of photographs including a few of Anderton's lost child. Then Lamar... what? He just sits back and assumes that the Precogs will predict Anderton will murder Crow, when at that time there's no direct link between the two men? Lamar has no way to influence what the Precogs do. But somehow they make a prediction from nowhere that sets the entire plot into motion, despite the fact that there's nothing at that point that would force Anderton and Crow to meet.

It's like if i wanted to have you sent to jail, so i hide a stash of money in my closet and assume that you will steal it, at which point i can report you to the cops. This is my plan. Except that you never go in my closet, and i never tell you about the money. But i assume that somehow, for no logically reason, you will discover the existence of the money somehow within the next day.

MAKES NO SENSE. SOMEONE HELP ME.
 
2012-10-20 12:26:51 AM

thecpt: Hans Kammler: all good replies on the hyperdrive etc. and i did not make my point fully.

so what if they were on the 'falcon' for 'weeks' - we are told it takes YEARS for someone to become a jedi. Yoda says Luke is too old. yeah crappy prequels aside or whatever we see younglings that take years to become jedi - and our hero Luke does it in a few hours like getting a merit badge. BZZZZZT wrong answer.

You know I've thought about this, but really Luke kind of sucks in terms of what Jedi's are capable of in the prequels. When he fights he looks like he learned the most basic abilities and makes up for it by completely giving into the ideology. He never performs any feats (force jump and such), can only move small objects, and his saber fighting is shiat.

It's almost more in line with how it should be.


He actually does do a Force Jump during the fight with Vader on Bespin. When Vader kicks him into the Carbonite chamber he does a Force Jump out when Vader activates then chamber so he doesn't get frozen. After that the best guess why the Jedi were far deadlier in the prequels is because Lucas is a hack writer and the special effects technology could make them look better.

TFA also forgets another thing from the "Stepford Wives" remake. There is a scene where one of the "Wives" spits money out of her mouth like an ATM which apparently you can do if you get a computer chip installed.
 
2012-10-20 09:02:27 AM
As far as the Matrix is concerned, it doesn't matter what time period the machines used to create the Matrix. If they used the Dark Ages, some humans would still reject the simulation, the only difference is they'd describe it in terms of "magic" instead of closer understanding of the technology. That said, maybe a simpler simulation would make it harder for people to adjust to reality when they are finally freed - but then, Zion itself was part of the whole control mechanism.

Personally, I'm somewhat of the opinion that the "reality" of the Matrix is yet another simulation, hence why Neo could disable the sentinels and those bomb projectile things. It is likely it wasn't intended that way, though, since that and his ability to detect machine-life (as opposed to everything, since everything would be a simulation) were his only real powers in the Zion simulation. Why those powers exist at all isn't clear, nor is it explained why he's the only one that rejected the Zion simulation.
 
2012-10-20 10:08:37 AM

therecksays: He actually does do a Force Jump during the fight with Vader on Bespin. When Vader kicks him into the Carbonite chamber he does a Force Jump out when Vader activates then chamber so he doesn't get frozen. After that the best guess why the Jedi were far deadlier in the prequels is because Lucas is a hack writer and the special effects technology could make them look better.



I mentioned the force jump Luke did in a response that nested html failed, but what I find interesting is that Vader says "impressive" when he does it. Maybe Vader's mechanical legs haven't done a jump in 18 years, but surely he wouldn't be impressed, unless maybe as a father watching his kid make his first catch in Little League.

Come to think of it, other than maybe the Emperor divined it, or perhaps Vader saw his lack of training, but he wouldn't know that Obi Wan/Yoda wasn't training Luke from birth.

Enhancing the Jedi is no problem for the prequels, but it takes it too far. Jedi mind tricks and the like seemed to be majority of Jedi powers, as though if some monk trained long enough and had the proper discipline, anyone could do it. Somehow space opera went from low fantasy to high fantasy, from having rare and relatively weak sorcerers to 36 level mages casting haste on whole armies and raining meteors from the sky.
 
2012-10-20 10:41:07 AM

Niveras:
Personally, I'm somewhat of the opinion that the "reality" of the Matrix is yet another simulation, hence why Neo could disable the sentinels and those bomb projectile things. It is likely it wasn't intended that way, though, since that and his ability to detect machine-life (as opposed to everything, since everything would be a simulation) were his only real powers in the Zion simulation. Why those powers exist at all isn't clear, nor is it explained why he's the only one that rejected the Zion simulation.


I think what Neo was able to do, that Oracle said he wasn't supposed to know how to do yet, was (using the hardware left in his body and his brain as a "software radio,") hack into the machine network, and accidentally jack himself into the Matrix. Doesn't really explain that bomb-thing going THROUGH him....

None of the other "Ones" had a Trinity, the others were out to save mankind in general, that's why he rejected it.
 
2012-10-20 11:19:03 AM

MolsonCanadian: Niveras:
Personally, I'm somewhat of the opinion that the "reality" of the Matrix is yet another simulation, hence why Neo could disable the sentinels and those bomb projectile things. It is likely it wasn't intended that way, though, since that and his ability to detect machine-life (as opposed to everything, since everything would be a simulation) were his only real powers in the Zion simulation. Why those powers exist at all isn't clear, nor is it explained why he's the only one that rejected the Zion simulation.

I think what Neo was able to do, that Oracle said he wasn't supposed to know how to do yet, was (using the hardware left in his body and his brain as a "software radio,") hack into the machine network, and accidentally jack himself into the Matrix. Doesn't really explain that bomb-thing going THROUGH him....

None of the other "Ones" had a Trinity, the others were out to save mankind in general, that's why he rejected it.


They recycled old linksys routers when they installed the hardware into people. Neo just got a functional WRT54G installed. HE installed DD-WRT on it.
 
2012-10-20 12:34:08 PM

wiredroach: Porous Horace: If Grady exists only in Jacks mind, who let him out of the pantry?

Answer: Grady, because he's "real."


Answer: the lodge, because read the book.
 
2012-10-21 12:18:37 AM

SevenizGud: Answer: the lodge, because read the book.


The film abandons the book pretty significantly, so why bother referencing it? For example, in the book, Jack redeems himself at the end. Not so in the film. Kubrick kept the question open about whether Jack is merely going crazy or under the influence of the ghosts in the hotel until the storeroom door is unlocked. Then it's obvious that no matter his mental state, the ghosts are real.
 
2012-10-21 02:45:20 AM
A big plot hole for me is Wrath of Khan, how does the genesis being fired in a supernova make a planet? Is it built of stardust and ship parts?
 
2012-10-21 03:09:43 AM
As far as the Matrix goes, there's one interpretation of the films that answers every problem - no one has ever escaped the Matrix. The "real world" is just the highest level in the construct, the machines don't need people to power anything, except possibily the matrix itself. The Matrix is a wildlife preserve for human beings, set up by the machines to make it possibile for humans to continue existing without destroying everything and making Earth inhabitable.
 
2012-10-21 03:15:33 AM

walrusonion: A big plot hole for me is Wrath of Khan, how does the genesis being fired in a supernova make a planet? Is it built of stardust and ship parts?


WTF are you on about?

I'm sorry to take a swing at a fellow walrus here, but you need to watch that movie again, pal.
 
2012-10-21 03:26:32 AM

burndtdan: Uchiha_Cycliste: Those lazy cocks, simply saying, "Oh, it's a time travel movie, lol so there's totally plot holes" doesn't mean there were plot holes, much less one of the worst of all time. I thought the movie was very consistent.

Looper had one glaring problem.

If the Bruce Willis version of Joe killed his future self, then who killed the Rainmaker's mom to make him the Rainmaker to cause that whole future problem he's trying to prevent? This isn't a problem with time-travel consistency so much as it's a big brain fart on Joe's part. Clearly, something ELSE in the kid's life turns him evil, so he probably didn't prevent anything.


Probably the kid who doesn't trust her until she's about to die. Easily the most lethal thing in her vicinity. There are no hard facts about the Rainmaker's origin in the BruceWillisChineseWifeMurdered future. We just accept the rumors when they add up to the truth. The only hard thing that changed at the end of the film was that the kid recognized his mother as his mother and released his vengeance grief.
 
2012-10-21 03:35:38 AM

czetie: Smackledorfer: I get the continuous line bit, but you aren't walking when you time travel so if your ant got turned around and the line was all over the map the you just wound up in outer space.

Yes, sort of. Sure, you could wind up in outer space. But it would be because the spacetime curve you are following curves away from the spacetime curve the earth is following, and you would notice it happening, and could change your mind. It wouldn't be because you "skipped over" some period of time while the earth moved on. Observers wouldn't see you vanish before their eyes, only to reappear minutes later in the sky above them because the earth had moved.

And oddly, you could be walking when you time travel. In this model, time travel isn't a magical high tech device or a portal; it's the curvature of spacetime itself so that when you move through space you follow a loop in time. The trick to creating a "time machine" is that it isn't a machine at all; it's a region of space where the time curves back in a loop.

(Ironically, the popular TV show that comes closest to describing it this way is Seven Days, which relies on "a spacetime distortion" that the sphere moves in. Frank doesn't get thrown off the surface of the earth because it moves under him, but because that's where the space part of the spacetime distortion leads. At least, that's what I choose to believe.)i>

If you remember on Seven Days the shpere had a joystick control which the chrononaut had to use to keep the needles aligned. The alighment was crucial to the sphere arriving in the correct place and time.

 
2012-10-21 03:38:15 AM

thecpt: Hans Kammler: all good replies on the hyperdrive etc. and i did not make my point fully.

so what if they were on the 'falcon' for 'weeks' - we are told it takes YEARS for someone to become a jedi. Yoda says Luke is too old. yeah crappy prequels aside or whatever we see younglings that take years to become jedi - and our hero Luke does it in a few hours like getting a merit badge. BZZZZZT wrong answer.

You know I've thought about this, but really Luke kind of sucks in terms of what Jedi's are capable of in the prequels. When he fights he looks like he learned the most basic abilities and makes up for it by completely giving into the ideology. He never performs any feats (force jump and such), can only move small objects, and his saber fighting is shiat.

It's almost more in line with how it should be.


Really the difference between Luke's abilities in Jedi and Empire are much harder to explain. He received no training between the two films, visits Yoda for the second time AFTER saving Han from Jabba, yet is better dressed, has a new lightsaber, does biatchin' jumps etc.
 
2012-10-21 07:01:38 AM

The All-Powerful Atheismo: Fark Me To Tears: FTFA: "Citizen Kane"
The entire movie is based on Kane's famous last word, "rosebud." However, Kane died alone. So who was there to pass on what he said?

The movie is not based on Kane's famous last word. And the movie itself is the story teller here. The utterance of "Rosebud" didn't need to be "passed on" in order for the movie to tell the story to the audience.

Is the author of TFA 14 years old?

Well the narrative basis for the movie is that the reporter was assigned to go interview all of these people (Joseph Cotten, you rock) to find out what "Rosebud" meant. So someone had to have heard that it was his last word in order for the reporter to know that it was.

I just assumed it was Paul Stewart, the butler at Xanadu, who heard him say it.


You don't need to assume. Every time the issue of plot holes comes up, someone mentions how nobody heard Charles Foster Kane say "Rosebud." Which really only reveals that they've never seen the farking movie.

"I see. And that's what you know about 'rosebud'?"

"Yeah. I heard him say it that other time too. He just said uh... 'rosebud.' Then he dropped the glass ball and it broke on the floor. He didn't say anything after that and I knew he was dead."

That's in the movie. A character says, explicitly, that he heard CF Kane say it. And people always harp on "Oh, but there's nobody in the room when we see him die!" You mean in the room shrouded in darkness that we only ever see half of for all of 40 seconds? Well, I'm glad you watched the first 5 minutes of the film but if you'd watch the whole thing, you'd get your answer.
 
2012-10-21 12:42:51 PM

100 Watt Walrus: walrusonion: A big plot hole for me is Wrath of Khan, how does the genesis being fired in a supernova make a planet? Is it built of stardust and ship parts?

WTF are you on about?

I'm sorry to take a swing at a fellow walrus here, but you need to watch that movie again, pal.


No, he's completely right. They're looking for a dead planet to test the Genesis device, which will re-tool the surface of that planet for organic life. They then detonate the device inside a space ship in the middle of a dust cloud, the Motara Nebula. Where does the planet come from?
 
2012-10-21 04:12:46 PM

macadamnut: 100 Watt Walrus: walrusonion: A big plot hole for me is Wrath of Khan, how does the genesis being fired in a supernova make a planet? Is it built of stardust and ship parts?

WTF are you on about?

I'm sorry to take a swing at a fellow walrus here, but you need to watch that movie again, pal.

No, he's completely right. They're looking for a dead planet to test the Genesis device, which will re-tool the surface of that planet for organic life. They then detonate the device inside a space ship in the middle of a dust cloud, the Motara Nebula. Where does the planet come from?


Watch again. Where does the nebula go after the Genesis device detonates?
 
2012-10-21 05:40:10 PM

flaminio: macadamnut: 100 Watt Walrus: walrusonion: A big plot hole for me is Wrath of Khan, how does the genesis being fired in a supernova make a planet? Is it built of stardust and ship parts?

WTF are you on about?

I'm sorry to take a swing at a fellow walrus here, but you need to watch that movie again, pal.

No, he's completely right. They're looking for a dead planet to test the Genesis device, which will re-tool the surface of that planet for organic life. They then detonate the device inside a space ship in the middle of a dust cloud, the Motara Nebula. Where does the planet come from?

Watch again. Where does the nebula go after the Genesis device detonates?


Well, there's a lot that could be called plot holes in the finale of that movie if you bring anything resembling science or physics into it, but the planet that is transformed is the one the two ships were orbiting on opposites sides just before the Enterprise made a run for it into the nebula, which based on how the scene plays out is "right next door," so to speak. So when the Genesis device blew (apparently accelerated and enhanced by the explosion of the Reliant's anti-matter?), it splooged enough Genesis juice in the direction of that dead rock to terraform it.

But then again, according to Memory Alpha, "The resulting cataclysmic explosion reorganized the matter that constituted the nebula (and possibly the ship itself) and formed a new planet, Genesis."

Either way, it's a big narrative leap of faith that makes not a damn bit of sense. But then neither does "Star Trek II's" notion of what a nebula is, so whatcha gonna do?
 
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