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(Guardian)   Death-row inmate thinks he's the son of God and will be resurrected. His lawyers say that makes him too crazy to execute, but the judge points out most Christians believe the same stuff and are still thought sane   ( guardian.co.uk) divider line
    More: Florida, death row  
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7138 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Oct 2012 at 11:19 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-15 12:09:40 AM  
We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.
 
2012-10-15 12:14:41 AM  

feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.


With all due respect, it's time to fire this puppy up!

orig.jacksonsun.com
 
2012-10-15 12:19:26 AM  

feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.


He shot 6 men and killed 2 teenagers in the 70's, he's lived long enough, eliminate this scum.
 
2012-10-15 12:20:19 AM  

Brick-House: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.

With all due respect, it's time to fire this puppy up!

[orig.jacksonsun.com image 225x387]


While the death penalty can be applied when necessary, with the prison system we have in Florida (and everywhere else in the US) we need not kill people, they can be safely incarcerated until their natural death.

No matter how atrocious a crime, no matter how repulsive a criminal we need not lower ourselves to their level. It at all possible we should avoid killing one another.
 
2012-10-15 12:21:29 AM  

knbber2: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

He shot 6 men and killed 2 teenagers in the 70's, he's lived long enough, eliminate this scum.


Yes, I am well aware of the case unfortunately. A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.
 
2012-10-15 12:23:02 AM  

feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.


I generally disagree with everything you say -and I do this time as well; but the difference here is, I appreciate your position because it should feel wrong to execute people. It should be distasteful.

But it is necessary and appropriate for certain crimes like murder and rape.

\good to know you have a conscience, feckingmorons
 
2012-10-15 12:27:22 AM  

Brick-House: With all due respect, it's time to fire this puppy up!

[orig.jacksonsun.com image 225x387]


It won't be long before that specific "puppy" is never fired up again, FYI. No inmates sentenced to death after 1998 in Tennessee are allowed to opt for the electric chair.
 
2012-10-15 12:34:27 AM  

feckingmorons: A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.


Unfortunately for him, the laws in the state say they can. Guess he should have picked a more compassionate state in which to kill people.
 
2012-10-15 12:50:34 AM  

feckingmorons: knbber2: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

He shot 6 men and killed 2 teenagers in the 70's, he's lived long enough, eliminate this scum.

Yes, I am well aware of the case unfortunately. A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.


Why not? Why is killing a murderer as punishment inherently wrong? His victims did not get the same compassionate treatment. Should we not hold him to his own ethical standard?

I ask because I find my own feelings about this issue becoming muddied in recent months. Explain to me please why killing in this case is wrong - not snark, honestly, I'd like to hear your argument in opposition.

Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.
 
2012-10-15 12:55:11 AM  

Frederick: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.

I generally disagree with everything you say -and I do this time as well; but the difference here is, I appreciate your position because it should feel wrong to execute people. It should be distasteful.

But it is necessary and appropriate for certain crimes like murder and rape.

\good to know you have a conscience, feckingmorons


It is not at all necessary. We have fine prisons. In places where the prisons are substandard and where the prisoner might escape it might be necessary. However they have make the death penalty illegal so they are far more advanced than we are. Do we want to be like the Iranians or the Norwegians?
 
2012-10-15 01:01:12 AM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: feckingmorons: knbber2: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

He shot 6 men and killed 2 teenagers in the 70's, he's lived long enough, eliminate this scum.

Yes, I am well aware of the case unfortunately. A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.

Why not? Why is killing a murderer as punishment inherently wrong? His victims did not get the same compassionate treatment. Should we not hold him to his own ethical standard?

I ask because I find my own feelings about this issue becoming muddied in recent months. Explain to me please why killing in this case is wrong - not snark, honestly, I'd like to hear your argument in opposition.

Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.


My wife was murdered 24 years ago in a robbery in the store in which she worked. I wanted the man caught, and imprisoned. I never wanted him killed.
I have in my will that if I am murdered I don't want my murderer executed.

Life in prison is fine. I am sure that is a fate much worse than death.

It is quite simple. If there is any possibility of avoiding it we shouldn't kill people. Killing people simply devalues all life, the murderers, yours and mine. Life is precious. We don't need to lower ourselves to the level of psychopaths and criminals. As a society we know justice can be served without killing people, however in our zeal for retribution we sometimes forget that.

If that fails to convince you, look at The Innocence Project. We might be wrong and killing innocent people.

/my wife's murderer was killed by the Georgia State Patrol when he fired on them as they were making a traffic stop three days after her murder.
 
2012-10-15 01:06:47 AM  

feckingmorons: As a society we know justice can be served without killing people, however in our zeal for retribution we sometimes forget that.


Do we? What, precisely, is justice in the case of murder? There are many who would call the death penalty justice in the case of your wife's murderer, and your stance as heroically merciful.

And I am sorry for your loss. I can't even begin to imagine.
 
2012-10-15 01:12:53 AM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: There are many who would call the death penalty justice


Yet there are many, many more who would call the death barbaric.

I'm going with the don't kill people group. It is an easier choice.
 
2012-10-15 01:24:07 AM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.


There is no argument that can beat the $$ numbers incarceration vs. death row, or the human compassion angle. But there are crimes that our society simply cannot tolerate and the death penalty is a option that should always be on the table in those cases. We argue about people like this, but when someone massacres a kindergarten class we'll once again remember why we have that option. It's trite and sounds like Texas, but there are some people who need to die. It makes us feel better. And I believe it can bring closure to some.
 
2012-10-15 01:25:09 AM  

violentsalvation: Benevolent Misanthrope: Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.

There is no argument that can beat the $$ numbers incarceration vs. death row, or the human compassion angle. But there are crimes that our society simply cannot tolerate and the death penalty is a option that should always be on the table in those cases. We argue about people like this, but when someone massacres a kindergarten class we'll once again remember why we have that option. It's trite and sounds like Texas, but there are some people who need to die. It makes us feel better. And I believe it can bring closure to some.


We shouldn't kill people.
 
2012-10-15 01:30:15 AM  

feckingmorons: violentsalvation: Benevolent Misanthrope: Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.

There is no argument that can beat the $$ numbers incarceration vs. death row, or the human compassion angle. But there are crimes that our society simply cannot tolerate and the death penalty is a option that should always be on the table in those cases. We argue about people like this, but when someone massacres a kindergarten class we'll once again remember why we have that option. It's trite and sounds like Texas, but there are some people who need to die. It makes us feel better. And I believe it can bring closure to some.

We shouldn't kill people.


I know that's your belief and I respect it.
 
2012-10-15 01:33:03 AM  

feckingmorons: violentsalvation: Benevolent Misanthrope: Anyone who would like to make a coherent argument in favor, I'd like to hear that as well.

There is no argument that can beat the $$ numbers incarceration vs. death row, or the human compassion angle. But there are crimes that our society simply cannot tolerate and the death penalty is a option that should always be on the table in those cases. We argue about people like this, but when someone massacres a kindergarten class we'll once again remember why we have that option. It's trite and sounds like Texas, but there are some people who need to die. It makes us feel better. And I believe it can bring closure to some.

We shouldn't kill people.


Interesting that this is the only thing most anti-death-penalty people will say. Killing people is wrong. Period. It is never justified. I did, too.

I'm now wondering if that absolutist view is any more valid than any other absolutism. Whether there are indeed cases where killing is justified. We kill other humans in defense of a life. What makes the death penalty so different from, say, killing someone to prevent a murder? Morally speaking, I mean.
 
2012-10-15 02:29:05 AM  
If he is the Son of God, what harm will executing him do? Isn't that what usually happens.

I think this guy is just nuts or acting.

But we still shouldn't kill people, unless it is the Son of God and then perhaps we're required too.

What a fecking conundrum.
 
2012-10-15 04:29:35 AM  

feckingmorons: If he is the Son of God, what harm will executing him do? Isn't that what usually happens.

I think this guy is just nuts or acting.

But we still shouldn't kill people, unless it is the Son of God and then perhaps we're required too.

What a fecking conundrum.


Look at the inmates being released, against the protests of the state, no less, due to exonerating evidence brought forth by technological advances.

A system this fraught with the potential for human error and outright abuse should not be trusted to execute anyone.
 
2012-10-15 04:39:57 AM  

thismomentinblackhistory: feckingmorons: If he is the Son of God, what harm will executing him do? Isn't that what usually happens.

I think this guy is just nuts or acting.

But we still shouldn't kill people, unless it is the Son of God and then perhaps we're required too.

What a fecking conundrum.

Look at the inmates being released, against the protests of the state, no less, due to exonerating evidence brought forth by technological advances.

A system this fraught with the potential for human error and outright abuse should not be trusted to execute anyone.


I'm good with what you said.
 
2012-10-15 04:47:19 AM  

thismomentinblackhistory: Look at the inmates being released, against the protests of the state, no less, due to exonerating evidence brought forth by technological advances.

A system this fraught with the potential for human error and outright abuse should not be trusted to execute anyone.


That is fair reason for apprehension. But in plenty of murders and rapes the perpetrator is not in doubt. Such as where confessions corroborate evidence.

In those cases, are you still opposed?
 
2012-10-15 05:24:43 AM  

Frederick: thismomentinblackhistory: Look at the inmates being released, against the protests of the state, no less, due to exonerating evidence brought forth by technological advances.

A system this fraught with the potential for human error and outright abuse should not be trusted to execute anyone.

That is fair reason for apprehension. But in plenty of murders and rapes the perpetrator is not in doubt. Such as where confessions corroborate evidence.

In those cases, are you still opposed?


No. But I operate under the assumption that forensics labs will look as different to day as they did in the 1980's thirty years from now.

Justice is civilized revenge. It's why we weight crimes. Given the human capacity for evil, it is only logical that certain crimes would call for death.

In the face of indisputable evidence with guilt, I still wouldn't allow the state to decide. I would give the decision to the next of kin. I wouldn't oppose the death penalty being carried out on someone who is found to be 100% guilty based on forensic evidence.

I'm not suggesting something I would want implemented, just trying to explain my position.

The people committing crimes that warrant the death penalty aren't like indoor marijuana growers who avoid risk by planting fewer plants to avoid a specific penalty. What to so with them is our choice. Is just rather err on the side of caution due to flaws in the justie system.

In other words: make it safe, legal, and rare?
 
2012-10-15 06:10:33 AM  
IMO I really do think that lethal injection is too controversial to use. I think we should just give em a shiatton of sleeping pills or better yet give him anesthesia then replace it with nitrogen when he is sleeping.
 
2012-10-15 08:19:53 AM  
I'm against the death penatly but I'm also happy to see we finally have the clinical diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia for Christians. It all makes perfect sense.
 
2012-10-15 08:21:36 AM  
I'm not morally opposed to the death penalty, but we use it too frequently and get enough false convictions that I think we're better staying away from it.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-15 08:23:41 AM  

feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.


True, but we shouldn't discriminate on the basis of religion either.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-15 08:25:42 AM  

cman: IMO I really do think that lethal injection is too controversial to use. I think we should just give em a shiatton of sleeping pills or better yet give him anesthesia then replace it with nitrogen when he is sleeping.


Isn't that pretty much the same thing as a lethal injection? Both involve asphyxiation.
 
2012-10-15 08:26:31 AM  
I also don't see mental illness as a valid excuse. If anything, it's more reason to get rid of you. If you're a sane person in prison for life, maybe you'll still provide some benefit to society one day. I unno, repent and write a book about how regretful you are, to serve as a warning to others.

But if you're just a jutjob, who's just going to continue being a nutjob until the rest of your life.... no sense in keeping you around. If it was cheaper to kill you in that case, I'd say go right for it.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-15 08:28:55 AM  

serial_crusher: I also don't see mental illness as a valid excuse. If anything, it's more reason to get rid of you. If you're a sane person in prison for life, maybe you'll still provide some benefit to society one day. I unno, repent and write a book about how regretful you are, to serve as a warning to others.

But if you're just a jutjob, who's just going to continue being a nutjob until the rest of your life.... no sense in keeping you around. If it was cheaper to kill you in that case, I'd say go right for it.


I can't imagine that it's cheaper considering all the taxpayer funded appeals that go on for decades. But if it is; You know who else killed mentally ill people to save money?
 
2012-10-15 08:35:56 AM  

vpb: serial_crusher: I also don't see mental illness as a valid excuse. If anything, it's more reason to get rid of you. If you're a sane person in prison for life, maybe you'll still provide some benefit to society one day. I unno, repent and write a book about how regretful you are, to serve as a warning to others.

But if you're just a jutjob, who's just going to continue being a nutjob until the rest of your life.... no sense in keeping you around. If it was cheaper to kill you in that case, I'd say go right for it.

I can't imagine that it's cheaper considering all the taxpayer funded appeals that go on for decades. But if it is; You know who else killed mentally ill people to save money?


Yeah, that's the problem. It's not cheaper. It never made sense to me why the cost of the appeals process is so much higher in death row appeals though. A life sentence is still pretty serious, so shouldn't it be just as easy to appeal?

Does the appeals cost go down in cases where the guy is like 100% clearly guilty? I imagine if they'd caught Osama bin Laden alive, we wouldn't need a long trial or a lot of appeals. I guess it would take a while to find an unbiased jury...
 
2012-10-15 08:43:25 AM  
Think of what its like to be the Unibomber. 23hrs of lockdown and 1 in the yard. I bet he prays for death. Don't give it to him. Life in prison can be worse than death.
 
2012-10-15 08:48:02 AM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: Interesting that this is the only thing most anti-death-penalty people will say. Killing people is wrong. Period. It is never justified. I did, too.


Actually I don't believe in the death penalty because too many people on death row were exonerated by DNA and other new evidence. It therefore stands to reason that there were some innocent people executed. That's why it's farked up.
 
2012-10-15 08:50:06 AM  

Frederick: That is fair reason for apprehension. But in plenty of murders and rapes the perpetrator is not in doubt. Such as where confessions corroborate evidence.

In those cases, are you still opposed?


People say that a lot, "well only if he's positively guilty". That line can get blurry really fast.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-15 09:14:07 AM  

Mugato: Frederick: That is fair reason for apprehension. But in plenty of murders and rapes the perpetrator is not in doubt. Such as where confessions corroborate evidence.

In those cases, are you still opposed?

People say that a lot, "well only if he's positively guilty". That line can get blurry really fast.


You don't hear that much in Texas I think.
 
2012-10-15 09:17:12 AM  
We should not let the government or 'the people' kill people.
 
2012-10-15 09:32:28 AM  

feckingmorons: knbber2: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

He shot 6 men and killed 2 teenagers in the 70's, he's lived long enough, eliminate this scum.

Yes, I am well aware of the case unfortunately. A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.


Cruel and unusual punishment. Kinder to hang him.
 
2012-10-15 10:07:11 AM  
I am not morally opposed to the death penalty.

There are some acts that are so heinous that the perpetrator needs to be removed from ALL human society, even that inside a prison.

That being said, the number of exonerations shows that we have difficulty in making sure that it is imposed only on those who are guilty, and until we can do so, it should not be used.
 
2012-10-15 10:21:46 AM  
Execution seems barbaric to me. I understand those up for execution were convicted of performing barbaric acts, I just don't think we, as a society, should sink to that level.
 
2012-10-15 10:25:17 AM  
Ah, capital punishment... here's a subject I'm firmly torn over. On the one hand, as people have mentioned, there are too many cases where people have been exonerated.

On the other hand, there's somebody like the Aurora shooter- there's really no doubt that he's guilty, and I really don't know why we're spending a single dollar to house and feed him. Let's kill his ass already, and leave his useless carcass out for the vultures. That sumbiatch doesn't need a trial, just a gallows.

So... yeah. I'm of two minds here.
 
2012-10-15 10:46:29 AM  

knbber2: feckingmorons: A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.

Unfortunately for him, the laws in the state say they can. Guess he should have picked a more compassionate state in which to kill people.


Actually no... Thats why their will be an appeal. You are not allowed to execute the certifiably mentally ill in Florida no matter how heinous their crime. Snark about Christian beliefs aside there is ample evidence going back decades that this man is not right in the head.
 
2012-10-15 10:47:51 AM  

Gonz: On the other hand, there's somebody like the Aurora shooter- there's really no doubt that he's guilty, and I really don't know why we're spending a single dollar to house and feed him.


It is cheaper to incarcerate someone for life than to execute them. Counter-intuitive I know. But there you have it.
 
2012-10-15 10:59:36 AM  

Gonz: Ah, capital punishment... here's a subject I'm firmly torn over. On the one hand, as people have mentioned, there are too many cases where people have been exonerated.

On the other hand, there's somebody like the Aurora shooter- there's really no doubt that he's guilty, and I really don't know why we're spending a single dollar to house and feed him. Let's kill his ass already, and leave his useless carcass out for the vultures. That sumbiatch doesn't need a trial, just a gallows.

So... yeah. I'm of two minds here.


You started out rational and then you devolved into the typical masturbatory revenge fantasy shiat.
 
2012-10-15 11:22:11 AM  
Why is this topic about the death penalty?

Shouldn't it be about religion?

Lul Religion.
 
2012-10-15 11:25:40 AM  

feckingmorons: Frederick: feckingmorons: We shouldn't kill people.

I've written Rick Scott and asked him not to kill this man.

I do that with all scheduled executions. It is sad that I have a form letter for that request.

I generally disagree with everything you say -and I do this time as well; but the difference here is, I appreciate your position because it should feel wrong to execute people. It should be distasteful.

But it is necessary and appropriate for certain crimes like murder and rape.

\good to know you have a conscience, feckingmorons

It is not at all necessary. We have fine prisons. In places where the prisons are substandard and where the prisoner might escape it might be necessary. However they have make the death penalty illegal so they are far more advanced than we are. Do we want to be like the Iranians or the Norwegians?


The quality of prisons is the worst reasoning behind eliminating the death penalty that I have ever known.
 
2012-10-15 11:27:17 AM  
I'm not Post-Tribulation
I'm not Pre-Tribulation
I'm not Mid-Tribulation

I'm a Pan-Tribulationist.

Pan?

Yep. It'll all pan out in the end.
 
2012-10-15 11:34:35 AM  
If their mental illness causes them to be dangerously violent then that's all the more reason to put them to death.
 
2012-10-15 11:35:05 AM  
Christians believe if they die they will be resurrected?

I must have missed that day in Sunday school.
 
2012-10-15 11:37:11 AM  
I don't know how the judge could have ruled this way. Ferguson is black.
 
2012-10-15 11:37:45 AM  

quickdraw: knbber2: feckingmorons: A small concrete box with meals thrown in three times a day is his proper place, we don't need to kill anyone.

Unfortunately for him, the laws in the state say they can. Guess he should have picked a more compassionate state in which to kill people.

Actually no... Thats why their will be an appeal. You are not allowed to execute the certifiably mentally ill in Florida no matter how heinous their crime. Snark about Christian beliefs aside there is ample evidence going back decades that this man is not right in the head.


well... crazy-crazy and legal-crazy are two different things. there are a lot of crazies out there who wouldn't considered legally insane when the judgment is coming out.

/ either way, I'm opposed to the death penalty. barbaric, pointless, and inefficient.
 
2012-10-15 11:38:24 AM  
Jesus was a Capricorn, he ate organic foods.
He believed in peace and love, and never wore no shoes.
Long hair, beard and sandals and a funky bunch of friends.
Reckon they'd just nail him up if He come down again.

'Cause everybody's got to have somebody to look down on.
Who they can feel better than at anytime they please.
Someone doin' somethin' dirty, decent folks can frown on.
If you can't find nobody else, then help yourself to me.

Get back, John!

Egg Head's cussin' Red Neck's cussin' hippies for their hair.
Others laugh at straights who laugh at freaks who laugh at squares.
Some folks hate the whites who hate the blacks who hate the Klan.
Most of us hate anything that we don't understand.

'Cos everybody's got to have somebody to look down on.
Who they can feel better than at anytime they please.
Someone doin' somethin' dirty, decent folks can frown on.
If you can't find nobody else, then help yourself to me.

Help yourself, brother.
Help yourself, Gentlemen.
Help yourself Reverend. 

-K. Kristofferson 

/come at me, Jesus
 
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