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(Palm Beach Post)   Florida State Board of Education Chairwoman wants everyone to know that, even though the new race-based education standards are separate, they are all equal. Hey, that sounds like a good slogan: Separate, but Equal   (palmbeachpost.com) divider line 70
    More: Florida, Florida State, No Child Left Behind Act, Florida Department of Education, School District of Palm Beach County, strategic plan, Palm Beach County, FCAT, standards  
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4741 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Oct 2012 at 11:04 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-12 02:53:57 PM  
TFA is hilarious.
 
2012-10-12 03:05:49 PM  
"The waivers have been granted to free states. . . ."

Giggle.
 
2012-10-12 03:11:12 PM  
This program actually sets higher expectations for Hispanic and black students!

Compare the stats in TFA of where each group is now vs. the goals set for them. White students are expected to go from 69% reading at grade level to 88%, a 28% improvement. Hispanics are expected to improve by 53%, and blacks by 95%.

And the goal is the same for everyone: reading at grade level standards.

Nobody is "dumbing down" expectations for Hispanic and black students; in fact, this plan raises expectations for them!
 
2012-10-12 03:19:47 PM  

ForgotMyTowel: It's typical to see the knee-jerk response of "racism!" but once again, people miss the bigger picture. Take race out of it for a moment. Suppose some company has 4 factories. Factory A is currently running at 72% efficiency, Factory B at 69%, Factory C at 53% and Factory D 38%. Now as CEO, you come in and want to raise efficiency standards. A good CEO won't demand that all factories be immediately brought up to 100% efficiency. That's an unrealistic goal and unrealistic goals seldom get met. Instead, the CEO looks at the current efficiency ratings and realities they all need to be brought up incrementally. So he decrees that Factory A increase it's efficiency to 90%, Factory B to 88%, C to 8%1 and D to 74%.

Why would anyone have a problem with that? Those are realistic goals to bring up the standards relative to their current efficiency. It's the same exact concept here. Some groups are scoring lower so it will take longer to get their number to 100%.


That's great. Much better than the truly awful sports analogy I was churning in my brain.
 
2012-10-12 03:32:35 PM  

keypusher: dustygrimp: keypusher: Acknowledging reality makes you an asshole? Good to know. If you find a state where Asians>whites>Hispanics>blacks doesn't hold, alert the media! Fame and fortune will be yours.

Of course, this lady is living in a fantasy world too. Right now, according to the article, 38% of black students are reading at or above grade level. Under her plan 74% are supposed to be at or above grade level in 2018, six years from now. That will not happen, unless they water down the standards to Cat In The Hat level.

The problem with the standards is just that. The numbers expect a 95% improvement for black students while the numbers are lower for other groups. In context, it seems fairly progressive. On it's face, it looks like racism.

Well, if white students are at 69% already, obviously it's mathematically impossible to double that figure. And of course the higher the percentage performing at an acceptable level the harder it gets to make improvements. You've presumably reached most of the unmotivated kids or kids with trouble at home and are moving into tard territory, as extroverted suicide might say.


You are describing the ceiling effect. As you near the top of a measurement scale, additional (upward) movement becomes very difficult, because you literally have no where left to go but down.

At the bottom end of the scale, you have a totally different problem. In theory, tremendous gains should be possible, since there's nowhere to go but up. However, when it comes to learning, the gains at the low end are typically depressed to merely moderate, because the kids are so badly lacking in the fundamentals required to actually learn. Time has to be spent doing triage, teaching them how to learn, before actual learning can take place.

This NCLB waiver system is an improvement in that it replaces the statistically and actually impossible goals of NCLB and replaces them with goals that are just nearly impossible. What Little Miss Rage FTFA seems to be missing is that the measurement system and demographic subgroups have not changed at all, it's the same as it was 10 years ago. Only the outcome has changed.

Final comment in regards to the quoted text above. The proportion of proficient students does not have to be doubled. As pointed out, that wouldn't always be possible. Rather, the proportion of non-proficient students must be halved.
 
2012-10-12 03:56:58 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: OK, this looks bad, and because it's Florida (realistically, it could have come from any state in the south), it probably does have a racist rationale.


um....

Stereotype much? Try being "different than us" in New England States.

Not saying any part of the US, or world for that matter, deals with racial issues better than others but you can't hope to start with thinking it is "those people" who "live there" that have the problem.
 
2012-10-12 05:07:17 PM  
These differing standards sound wrong as they set different expectations for races. Which is exactly how college admissions work. So we don't like it, but we do, but we don't. I confused.
 
2012-10-12 05:27:38 PM  
So do Blacks get disability payments because being Black sounds like a disability to me.
 
2012-10-12 06:35:28 PM  
If a person can't read, then all the school's effort should work toward fixing that first. It may be all they achieve, but it would be worth it. It only takes an eight year old a year to do this. If you have a teenager who can't read, you are a poor teacher.
 
2012-10-12 06:42:53 PM  

K_Trout: If a person can't read, then all the school's effort should work toward fixing that first. It may be all they achieve, but it would be worth it. It only takes an eight year old a year to do this. If you have a teenager who can't read, you are a poor teacher.


Teachers only have access to children after their parents have had them for 5 years, and the only 7 hours a day for 3/4 of the year.

If you have a teenager who can't read, you are a utter peice of shiat parent.
 
2012-10-12 06:58:07 PM  

Apeboy: Smelly Pirate Hooker: OK, this looks bad, and because it's Florida (realistically, it could have come from any state in the south), it probably does have a racist rationale.

um....

Stereotype much? Try being "different than us" in New England States.

Not saying any part of the US, or world for that matter, deals with racial issues better than others but you can't hope to start with thinking it is "those people" who "live there" that have the problem.


Lighten up, Francis. I'm from Oklahoma and live in Texas, so i can make fun of them as much as I want to. And I know there are farking racists all over. It's just the south seems determined to make sure we all know that when it comes to racism, they excel. It's about the only thing they excel at, other than meth manufacturing and incest.
 
2012-10-12 06:59:09 PM  

Girion47: K_Trout: If a person can't read, then all the school's effort should work toward fixing that first. It may be all they achieve, but it would be worth it. It only takes an eight year old a year to do this. If you have a teenager who can't read, you are a poor teacher.

Teachers only have access to children after their parents have had them for 5 years, and the only 7 hours a day for 3/4 of the year.

If you have a teenager who can't read, you are a utter peice of shiat parent.


This.
 
2012-10-12 08:07:28 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: OK, this looks bad, and because it's Florida (realistically, it could have come from any state in the south), it probably does have a racist rationale.


I'm surprised the story isn't from California, the state that wanted federal funds for English as a second language for black kids.
 
2012-10-12 08:18:07 PM  

Masquerader317: I'm having difficulty believing that a person who is clearly articulate still has difficulty wrapping their mind around the concept that a group desiring that their cultural identity be given equal respect...


What culture? Black culture? In the US, black culture is nothing more than "fark you whitey... I'm going to be different just for difference's sake." I've been to Africa (Kenya and Nigeria) and there are no jive-talking, strutting-in-low-hanging-pants homies there. None. Those who speak English speak it perfectly... even the bums on the street.
 
2012-10-12 11:05:00 PM  
For the fark lawyers: I'm opening up a company soon, a software company. I HATE the idea of having to hire people of different races. I want the best programmers, I don't give a whit what their skin color is. I pretty well refuse to hire a bunch of Indians just to pass some numbers game. I don't know how yet, but I'm planning to interview in some way that I'll have no idea what nationality the person is. That way I can hire the best people and nobody can claim I'm discriminatory. One, any ideas how? Two, if I came up with this magic process, would it pass the AA laws? Do they deal with the process or only the results?
 
2012-10-13 04:21:57 AM  

andyfromfl: For the fark lawyers: I'm opening up a company soon, a software company. I HATE the idea of having to hire people of different races. I want the best programmers, I don't give a whit what their skin color is. I pretty well refuse to hire a bunch of Indians just to pass some numbers game. I don't know how yet, but I'm planning to interview in some way that I'll have no idea what nationality the person is. That way I can hire the best people and nobody can claim I'm discriminatory. One, any ideas how? Two, if I came up with this magic process, would it pass the AA laws? Do they deal with the process or only the results?


you can't actively discriminate.
plus if the criteria you are using to select among applicants has a disparate impact on say blacks, and you are sued not hiring a black person, then you have to show that your criteria you were using that had the effect of removing blacks from your group of potential hires was in fact a business necessity. if a jury finds that what you thought was a business necessity wasn't really necessary your business then the jig is up.
hey don't need to find actual intent to discriminate. in fact they can find that you had no intent to discriminate, but you just held the bar to high for everyone and one group got hurt. just hire some people of color already.
there are no quotas as such, just don't piss anyone off, and keep good documentation, and perhaps just hire some black people regardless of qualifications.
 
2012-10-13 08:25:38 AM  

andyfromfl: For the fark lawyers: I'm opening up a company soon, a software company. I HATE the idea of having to hire people of different races. I want the best programmers, I don't give a whit what their skin color is. I pretty well refuse to hire a bunch of Indians just to pass some numbers game. I don't know how yet, but I'm planning to interview in some way that I'll have no idea what nationality the person is. That way I can hire the best people and nobody can claim I'm discriminatory. One, any ideas how? Two, if I came up with this magic process, would it pass the AA laws? Do they deal with the process or only the results?


Courts have ruled that companies were in violation of the 1964 Civil Rights Act (which clearly says that you cannot discriminate) where the racial makeup of their employees didn't match the racial makeup of the local community. By law, you MUST discriminate. Welcome to 1984.
 
2012-10-13 02:00:27 PM  
Socioeconomic factors bring the minority scores down in many areas, so the school board lowers the minimum standards for minorities and the bigwigs can say "look, we're meeting/exceeding standards!"
 
2012-10-13 05:07:32 PM  

Apeboy: Smelly Pirate Hooker: OK, this looks bad, and because it's Florida (realistically, it could have come from any state in the south), it probably does have a racist rationale.

um....

Stereotype much? Try being "different than us" in New England States.

Not saying any part of the US, or world for that matter, deals with racial issues better than others but you can't hope to start with thinking it is "those people" who "live there" that have the problem.


Everyone has a need to feel superior to someone else.
 
2012-10-13 09:17:00 PM  

andyfromfl: For the fark lawyers: I'm opening up a company soon, a software company. I HATE the idea of having to hire people of different races. I want the best programmers, I don't give a whit what their skin color is. I pretty well refuse to hire a bunch of Indians just to pass some numbers game. I don't know how yet, but I'm planning to interview in some way that I'll have no idea what nationality the person is. That way I can hire the best people and nobody can claim I'm discriminatory. One, any ideas how? Two, if I came up with this magic process, would it pass the AA laws? Do they deal with the process or only the results?


It's still legal to limit hiring employees to members of the human race who are of age and legally authorized to work in the United States.
But what do you have against Native Americans?
 
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