If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Chicago Sun-Times)   Only in Chicago can you get a federal bribery conviction overturned because you accepted too small of a bribe   (suntimes.com) divider line 43
    More: Asinine, Chicago, Gary Bauer, appeals court, technicality, building codes, bribes, convictions, conviction overturned  
•       •       •

5901 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Oct 2012 at 8:42 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



43 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2012-10-12 08:45:53 AM
Owens' attorney Michael Nash declared his client "delighted" with the ruling. He rejected the idea that Owens got off on a technicality, adding "it was because he was not guilty."

Oh God this is the best part. "Sure, he took $600 and we said as much in court and on the record. But he didn't get off on a technicality, he's not guilty!"
 
2012-10-12 08:50:46 AM
If that's the way the law is written, wtf else are they supposed to do?
 
2012-10-12 08:51:11 AM
It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.
 
2012-10-12 08:51:40 AM
Make that "Only in Federal Court anywhere in the United States..."
 
2012-10-12 08:53:39 AM
So what's the minimum illegal bribe level? Is it cumulative? Can you promise someone $600 a day bribe until they've had $50,000 from you?
 
2012-10-12 08:55:43 AM
cdn.visiontoamerica.org
 
2012-10-12 09:00:39 AM
People die in badly built homes. This guy is a bastard.
 
2012-10-12 09:03:32 AM

Slaxl: So what's the minimum illegal bribe level? Is it cumulative? Can you promise someone $600 a day bribe until they've had $50,000 from you?


Someone needs to make a chart.
 
2012-10-12 09:04:29 AM
Underachiever!
 
2012-10-12 09:07:41 AM

Nickster79: Slaxl: So what's the minimum illegal bribe level? Is it cumulative? Can you promise someone $600 a day bribe until they've had $50,000 from you?

Someone needs to make a chart.


The law they prosecuted him under sets the amount at $5000. If he didn't accept at least that much, then he didn't violate that particular law. If there is another law that sets a lower amount, then they should have prosecuted him under that one.
 
2012-10-12 09:08:05 AM

Slaxl: So what's the minimum illegal bribe level? Is it cumulative? Can you promise someone $600 a day bribe until they've had $50,000 from you?


You apparently didn't read the article, it's $5,000. The guy didn't get $5,000 so there was zero violation of the law as it is not considered a crime until you reach that threshold. The prosecutors knew this and tries a novel theory of the mortgage value which I think the court correctly rejected.
 
2012-10-12 09:09:47 AM
Baldric approves.

retiredrambler.typepad.com
 
2012-10-12 09:11:32 AM
I wonder how much it cost to get the bribe conviction overturned?
 
2012-10-12 09:11:37 AM
It's OK, submitter. Some people are stupid. You're just one of them.
 
2012-10-12 09:15:17 AM
Justices ruled that Owens should not have been convicted because prosecutors didn't prove the bribes he took were worth more than $5,000, as the law requires.

Dumb requirement, but if that's what law, he should never have been convicted for two $600 bribes. I don't like the government enforcing criminal laws that don't exist when the crime occurred.
 
2012-10-12 09:15:59 AM
I didn't read FTA, but taking money from people trying to influence your position is kind of par for the course in American politics. In DC there's a reason you can get GREAT seats for around $50. $50 is ceiling for items of "nominal value" given as "friendly gifts" from lobbyists.

Chicago, I guess, sets the limit 100 times higher.
 
2012-10-12 09:17:20 AM

XveryYpettyZ: I didn't read FTA, but taking money from people trying to influence your position is kind of par for the course in American politics. In DC there's a reason you can get GREAT seats for around $50. $50 is ceiling for items of "nominal value" given as "friendly gifts" from lobbyists.

ChicagoThe entire USA under federal law, I guess, sets the limit 100 times higher.


fixed it for you
 
2012-10-12 09:18:02 AM

mauricecano: Slaxl: So what's the minimum illegal bribe level? Is it cumulative? Can you promise someone $600 a day bribe until they've had $50,000 from you?

You apparently didn't read the article, it's $5,000. The guy didn't get $5,000 so there was zero violation of the law as it is not considered a crime until you reach that threshold. The prosecutors knew this and tries a novel theory of the mortgage value which I think the court correctly rejected.


This law is straight out of a videogame: you can do the wrong thing and that's fine for a while, but if your meter gets too high you're in trouble.
 
2012-10-12 09:21:59 AM
Chicago. The most corrupt city in the United States.

1.) Law abiding citizens are banned from owning guns, yet the city has one of the highest crime and murder rates in the country.
2.) Citizen-slaves are banned from recording police encounters and politicians. They claim its "illegal wire tapping", when in reality it is to perpetuate corruption and abuse.
3.) Corrupt at all levels of government. Hell, their last governor is sitting in jail for trying to sell Obama's empty seat.
4.) Being let go for taking too small of a bribe....? Seriously? Wow.


Other articles describing Chicago as nation's most corrupt:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/15/chicago-most-corrupt-city_n_ 1 278988.html
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/14/chicago-called-most-corrupt-ci t y-in-nation/
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/72961.html
 
2012-10-12 09:22:04 AM

HotWingConspiracy: If that's the way the law is written, wtf else are they supposed to do?


Exactly, I don't see the story here.

Plenty of laws have numerical thresholds. $5 grand seems a tad high imho, but what you gonna do?
 
2012-10-12 09:25:49 AM

Dadoody: Chicago. The most corrupt city in the United States.

1.) Law abiding citizens are banned from owning guns, yet the city has one of the highest crime and murder rates in the country.
2.) Citizen-slaves are banned from recording police encounters and politicians. They claim its "illegal wire tapping", when in reality it is to perpetuate corruption and abuse.
3.) Corrupt at all levels of government. Hell, their last governor is sitting in jail for trying to sell Obama's empty seat.
4.) Being let go for taking too small of a bribe....? Seriously? Wow.


Other articles describing Chicago as nation's most corrupt:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/15/chicago-most-corrupt-city_n_ 1 278988.html
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/14/chicago-called-most-corrupt-ci t y-in-nation/
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/72961.html


RTFA so you can be less stupid.

1) It was a federal law, so it could have happened anywhere.
2) Said federal law had a threshold of $5,000, and that threshold was not met. Therefore the crime for which he was prosecuted wasn't committed.
 
2012-10-12 09:26:44 AM

Dadoody: Chicago. The most corrupt city in the United States.

1.) Law abiding citizens are banned from owning guns, yet the city has one of the highest crime and murder rates in the country.
2.) Citizen-slaves are banned from recording police encounters and politicians. They claim its "illegal wire tapping", when in reality it is to perpetuate corruption and abuse.
3.) Corrupt at all levels of government. Hell, their last governor is sitting in jail for trying to sell Obama's empty seat.
4.) Being let go for taking too small of a bribe....? Seriously? Wow.


Other articles describing Chicago as nation's most corrupt:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/15/chicago-most-corrupt-city_n_ 1 278988.html
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/14/chicago-called-most-corrupt-ci t y-in-nation/
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/72961.html


On the other hand, the snow gets plowed. It's all about tradeoffs.
 
2012-10-12 09:27:04 AM

mauricecano: You apparently didn't read the article, it's $5,000. The guy didn't get $5,000 so there was zero violation of the law as it is not considered a crime until you reach that threshold. The prosecutors knew this and tries a novel theory of the mortgage value which I think the court correctly rejected.


If this is the same as US law (18 USC § 666) it's not the value of the bribe that counts, but the value of the transaction to which the bribe applies.

So if you gave or accepted a $1000 bribe to influence a $1,000,000 contract, the fact that it's a million-dollar contract causes it to exceed the $5000 minimum. On the other hand, it would be legal (if stupid) to give a million-dollar bribe to influence a thousand-dollar contract.

That's why they were trying to use the property value of the houses in their arguments.
 
2012-10-12 09:30:29 AM
Chicagoland; the cesspool of American politics and the behavioral armpit of the U.S.

Da Bears!
 
2012-10-12 09:37:22 AM

Dadoody: Chicago. The most corrupt city in the United States.

1.) Law abiding citizens are banned from owning guns, yet the city has one of the highest crime and murder rates in the country.
2.) Citizen-slaves are banned from recording police encounters and politicians. They claim its "illegal wire tapping", when in reality it is to perpetuate corruption and abuse.
3.) Corrupt at all levels of government. Hell, their last governor is sitting in jail for trying to sell Obama's empty seat.
4.) Being let go for taking too small of a bribe....? Seriously? Wow.


Other articles describing Chicago as nation's most corrupt:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/15/chicago-most-corrupt-city_n_ 1 278988.html
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/14/chicago-called-most-corrupt-ci t y-in-nation/
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/72961.html


Also the judges are throwing out those cases and declared the law unconsitutional. Link

When spewing irrational hate why don't you actually know what you are talking about ?
 
2012-10-12 09:39:48 AM

mauricecano: Also the judges are throwing out those cases and declared the law unconsitutional. Link

When spewing irrational hate why don't you actually know what you are talking about ?


welcometofark.jpg
 
2012-10-12 09:50:30 AM
the guy was innocent of the charge they convicted him for

Suppose you knock someone off their bike, with your car while driving DUI - and you break their arm

and some idiot DA charges you with attempted murder

if you dont get convicted for attempted murder, did you get off 'on a technicality'?
or do you just have an idiot for a DA?
 
2012-10-12 09:50:41 AM
Whew -- it's a good thing there's no one from Chicago with any real power in American politics.
 
2012-10-12 09:56:40 AM

NannyStatePark: People die in badly built homes. This guy is a bastard.


Sure, but do people die because of badly built homes?
 
2012-10-12 09:59:04 AM

homelessdude: It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.


Move to Texas. The idiocy and criminal behavior is just as bad. I can also say that, without a shadow of doubt, that Arizona is another place. F*ck man, pretty much anyplace because humans are greedy forking a$$hole$.
 
2012-10-12 10:04:04 AM

homelessdude: It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.


Was I the only person to read the charges against Blagojevich and think "really? you can't do that?"

/Born and raised in Chicago.
 
2012-10-12 10:05:02 AM

LordOfThePings: NannyStatePark: People die in badly built homes. This guy is a bastard.

Sure, but do people die because of badly built homes?


That too! I had insomnia and gave up on sleep last night.
 
2012-10-12 10:07:20 AM
homelessdude: It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.

Move to Texas. The idiocy and criminal behavior is just as bad. I can also say that, without a shadow of doubt, that Arizona is another place. F*ck man, pretty much anyplace because humans are greedy forking a$$hole$.



heh heh heh....I feel like I am on the World Bus and I keep pulling the cord, the bell rings, but the bus does not stop. I guess I will just have to make a jump for it and hope for the best.

(Not that any of those stops seem better than the place I came from, but that is another issue altogether)
 
2012-10-12 10:11:00 AM

homelessdude: It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.


It's actually one of the things I like about the city.
 
2012-10-12 10:13:34 AM
he broke the law by not breaking the law?
or he didn't break the law by breaking it??
I'm confused, he took a bribe, but because the amount was too low, it wasn't a bribe?
I GET IT! IT WAS A TIP!!!
 
2012-10-12 10:17:32 AM
You'd think that issuing fraudulent building certifications would be a crime in and of itself, independent of the bribery. I guess not
 
2012-10-12 10:34:15 AM
It's my kind of town, Chicago is....

/former Chi-towner
 
2012-10-12 10:35:03 AM

HotWingConspiracy: If that's the way the law is written, wtf else are they supposed to do?


Exactly. They were charged with the wrong crime. The DA charged with the highest offense he could dream of and it didn't stick. This wouldn't be the first time an obviously guilty person walked because of an overzealous DA.

SwiftFox: Justices ruled that Owens should not have been convicted because prosecutors didn't prove the bribes he took were worth more than $5,000, as the law requires.

Dumb requirement, but if that's what law, he should never have been convicted for two $600 bribes. I don't like the government enforcing criminal laws that don't exist when the crime occurred.


It's not a dumb requirement. There are many laws that distinguish based on the dollar value. Normally there is a small value offense (petty theft) vs a large value offense (grand theft). You charge a guy with grand theft for stealing an ordinary lunchbox and he will quite correctly be found not guilty.
 
2012-10-12 10:36:17 AM

inglixthemad: homelessdude: It's the Chicago way.

I have lived in many places and never have I experienced the ability to spin a denial so ingrained into a region's culture as I have here. I am sure it exists elsewhere, but this is par for the course in this area and Chicago takes it a step further and elevates it to an art form.

/Chicago area resident.

Move to Texas. The idiocy and criminal behavior is just as bad. I can also say that, without a shadow of doubt, that Arizona is another place. F*ck man, pretty much anyplace because humans are greedy forking a$$hole$.


Well, yeah, considering it's a Federal case, I would think the outcome was the same...unless y'all have activist Federal judges who ignore the law.

Seriously, it's a Federal law in a Federal court. I know, I know, Chicago sucks. Believe me, as a downstate Illinoisan, I understand. But...nevermind, continue your Chicago-hating circlejerk, everyone.
 
2012-10-12 10:44:30 AM

Prince George: Baldric approves.


Even if it's that special sex act?

i131.photobucket.com 

Do the turnips count toward the $5000 limit?
 
2012-10-12 12:23:03 PM
I'm guessing this is a difference between a felony bribery and a misdemeanor bribery?
 
2012-10-12 01:18:15 PM
If the bribes ain't legit, you must acquit!
 
2012-10-12 05:16:46 PM

Lost Thought 00: You'd think that issuing fraudulent building certifications would be a crime in and of itself, independent of the bribery. I guess not


He probably only issued it too early.. you can tell an inspector - hey we're going to do this, we just haven't gotten the material yet. They're then supposed to say 'call me when it's in for reinspection' but this guy apparently did not. The prosecution was saying that he would have awarded the certificate of occupancy eventually anyway, so it shouldn't matter. But people are crooked (obviously) and skip important things like fire-caulking or grounding wires to save money but end up hurting someone.
 
Displayed 43 of 43 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report