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(The Nation)   I'm pretty sure this isn't how NYC's "Stop and Frisk" policy is supposed to be carried out, citizen   (thenation.com) divider line 238
    More: Scary, Police Commissioner Ray Kelly, New York Police Department, Center for Constitutional Rights, New York Civil Liberties Union, The Nation, systemic problems  
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5827 clicks; posted to Politics » on 09 Oct 2012 at 7:49 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-09 03:08:33 PM  
Actually, I'm pretty sure that's *exactly* how stop and frisk is supposed to work.
 
2012-10-09 03:14:37 PM  
If they keep this up, we're going to need another 9-11 to make us see the NYPD as heroes again.
 
2012-10-09 03:22:16 PM  
For those of us that don't pass the paper bag test, this sort of behavior by cops was news pretty much the first time you met a cop.
 
2012-10-09 03:23:37 PM  
how did you think it was going to work?
 
2012-10-09 03:24:41 PM  
Well I feel safer.
 
2012-10-09 03:32:18 PM  
If you look at how Stop and Frisk is carried out, that is exactly what it is for. Stop and Frisk almost exclusively targets minorities, particularly those that step out of their neighborhoods. If you look at the actual data, and for similar studies like the "random" stops Maryland does which are nothing but Driving While Black stops, while the minorities are obviously stopped and searched more, you are more likely to find illegal weapons or drugs on whites than on minorities.
 
2012-10-09 03:33:39 PM  
Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.
 
2012-10-09 03:38:21 PM  

ourbigdumbmouth: Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.


The minorities being stopped might disagree with that statement.
 
2012-10-09 03:40:27 PM  
Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.
 
2012-10-09 03:43:16 PM  

BSABSVR: Actually, I'm pretty sure that's *exactly* how stop and frisk is supposed to work.


yeah THIS
 
2012-10-09 03:47:19 PM  

Blues_X: ourbigdumbmouth: Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.

The minorities being stopped might disagree with that statement.


This. Go be brown in Arizona for a month. Or black in any major city. Get back to us.
 
2012-10-09 05:39:41 PM  
, 2nd, 4th, it doesn't matter. The Constitution only applies in New York if you're wealthy or politically connected.

ourbigdumbmouth: Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.


It's the definition of a police state.
 
2012-10-09 06:05:47 PM  

Blues_X: ourbigdumbmouth: Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.

The minorities being stopped might disagree with that statement.


I think he was being sarcastic.
And if he wasnt, well then he is just a troll.

we NEED to start using sarcasm marks here PEOPLE
 
2012-10-09 06:37:44 PM  
...and yet, people wonder why some folks are reluctant to cooperate with cops.
 
2012-10-09 06:50:07 PM  
Police are the enemy. They prey on American citizens to fund their departments and are enablers of a system that imprisons more of its citizenry than China in a for-profit private prison industry. When you see a cop, go the other way.
 
2012-10-09 07:12:57 PM  
Cops being thugs? Quick! Someone call Rick Romero!
 
2012-10-09 07:32:59 PM  
Time for the city, police department and Bloomberg to be sued and hit hard in the pocketbook.
 
2012-10-09 07:41:39 PM  
Disgusting.
 
2012-10-09 07:42:29 PM  
img.photobucket.com
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2012-10-09 07:46:27 PM  
Time for the city, police department and Bloomberg to be sued and hit hard in the pocketbook.

The city is too big for one or a few people to dig into pocketbooks. There are about 10 million taxpayers (including income tax on commuters). Precedent says a poor black guy shot to death for no good reason, with adverse media coverage, is worth $3 million*. Cops can kill a man a week and the average taxpayer is out $16 per year.

* It amuses me that when I searched for "41 shots" to get the guy's name Google offered me the handy conversion 41 shots = 1.81877207 liters.
 
2012-10-09 07:50:13 PM  

ZAZ: The city is too big for one or a few people to dig into pocketbooks.


Make it a class action type deal, you start multiplying, say $10,000 per stop, by the number of stops made and you're talking some pretty hefty amounts of money.
 
2012-10-09 07:52:39 PM  
I'll bet the policy would change of "Stop and Frisk" turned into "Stop and Take Your Life In Your Hands" for the cops.
 
2012-10-09 07:52:42 PM  
never forget, it's all for our own safety
 
2012-10-09 07:57:12 PM  
Where are our cop defenders? Come on, you authoritarian douchebags, tell us how this isn't emblematic of all cops.

Then we will point and laugh at you.
 
2012-10-09 07:57:19 PM  
shiat, I was stopped and frisked while jogging in my own neighborhood and I'm white. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen more with minorities because it does but my point is that the cops can do whatever the fark they want to whoever they want. Unless you're a young female celebrity in Hollywood.
 
2012-10-09 07:57:32 PM  
I'm a youngish male who lives in NYC and I've never been stopped and frisked. I think the whole thing is just a myth.
 
2012-10-09 07:59:05 PM  

Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.


They're not mutually exclusive. I'd say they're dependent. The reason so many minorities get arrested and thrown into the system for minor shiat is precisely because that's where the cops are because there's more violent crime in the neighborhoods and the poor can't get good lawyers. Of course the answer is to decriminalize drugs and let the minor shiat that doesn't hurt anyone go.
 
2012-10-09 07:59:45 PM  

namatad: Blues_X: ourbigdumbmouth: Doesn't matter what anyone says, this still isn't what a police state is.

The minorities being stopped might disagree with that statement.

I think he was being sarcastic.
And if he wasnt, well then he is just a troll.

we NEED to start using sarcasm marks here PEOPLE


I tried using the period at the end of the post (I read that was the sarcasm indicator somewhere). It went unnoticed, and I got flamed. ME, the libbiest lib that ever libbed a lib.

If you know of another subtle way, I'd like to know.
 
2012-10-09 08:00:05 PM  
Remember:
More young black men are subject to stop and frisking then even live in NYC. This is from NYC's own numbers.
 
2012-10-09 08:00:32 PM  
That is farking disturbing. Anyone who supports stop-and-frisk needs to be forced to listen to that on a loop for a few hours.
 
2012-10-09 08:00:38 PM  

Moopy Mac: I'm a youngish male who lives in NYC and I've never been stopped and frisked. I think the whole thing is just a myth.


are you white?
 
2012-10-09 08:02:13 PM  

Cyclometh: Where are our cop defenders? Come on, you authoritarian douchebags, tell us how this isn't emblematic of all cops.

Then we will point and laugh at you.


this is indefensible but i'm not going to start hating all cops.
 
2012-10-09 08:03:55 PM  

12349876: Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.

They're not mutually exclusive. I'd say they're dependent. The reason so many minorities get arrested and thrown into the system for minor shiat is precisely because that's where the cops are because there's more violent crime in the neighborhoods and the poor can't get good lawyers. Of course the answer is to decriminalize drugs and let the minor shiat that doesn't hurt anyone go.


I'm pretty sure that's what Rincewind53 was getting at.
 
2012-10-09 08:07:32 PM  

Isitoveryet: Cyclometh: Where are our cop defenders? Come on, you authoritarian douchebags, tell us how this isn't emblematic of all cops.

Then we will point and laugh at you.

this is indefensible but i'm not going to start hating all cops.


ACAB. Where are the cops who resist this kind of shiat? Where are the ones who actually do protect and serve and refuse to act like gangster thugs? I'll tell you where: They don't exist, not in this day and age.
 
2012-10-09 08:07:50 PM  

Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.


The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

If their goal is to find a criminal, and they have the choice of white guy, Asian guy, and black guy, there is an obvious choice that any betting man would make.
 
2012-10-09 08:09:25 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: Remember:
More young black men are subject to stop and frisking then even live in NYC. This is from NYC's own numbers.


Proves it works!
 
2012-10-09 08:10:41 PM  

Isitoveryet: Cyclometh: Where are our cop defenders? Come on, you authoritarian douchebags, tell us how this isn't emblematic of all cops.

Then we will point and laugh at you.

this is indefensible but i'm not going to start hating all cops.


I don't hate them- I fear them because I have yet to meet or hear of a decent one. Every time you see one of these assholes get caught, look into their record for all the great shiat they get lauded for. Newspaper articles, awards, citations, "Cop of the Year", hey're all farking heroes until they turn up on a camera somewhere.

Disgusting criminal thugs acting under the color of law.
 
2012-10-09 08:11:05 PM  
Whatcha gonna do?
The mafia in blue
Huntin' for queers
N*ggers and you

Dead cops
Dead cops
Dead cops
Dead cops

Time for a switch
Army of the rich
Macho f*ckin' slaves
We'll piss on your graves.

- MDC
 
2012-10-09 08:11:30 PM  

Silly Jesus: The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?


www.usprisonculture.com

Yes, how do they work.
 
2012-10-09 08:12:57 PM  

Silly Jesus: Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.

The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

If their goal is to find a criminal, and they have the choice of white guy, Asian guy, and black guy, there is an obvious choice that any betting man would make.


You really don't understand statistics, or are just being intentionally stupid here.

Protip: It's a good bet because the house sets the odds.
 
2012-10-09 08:14:24 PM  

Silly Jesus: ...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? S


BTW it's pretty well established there are lots of investment bankers, lawyers and other professional types with various drug habits that stagger the mind, how is it no one is frisking them?
 
2012-10-09 08:15:58 PM  

Moopy Mac: I'm a youngish male who lives in NYC and I've never been stopped and frisked. I think the whole thing is just a myth.


That's kind of the point. Most people have no concept of what it's like being targeted like that so we assume that when we here these stories they must be isolated incidents and the person involved must've done something to warrant that treatment.

An african-american coworker of mine was telling me a story about he was taking a girl out for a date when he was in high school. He came from a well-to-do family so he borrowed his parents' car to impress her. Anyways, he was pulled over and the cop made him get out, and lean over the hood. He was cuffed while the car was searched and they checked to make sure the car wasn't stolen. When everything turned up ok, he was allowed to be on his way, but it was a solid 20 to 30 min ordeal. But yeah, if you're not doing anything illegal you have nothing to hide and you shouldn't care... riiiight.
 
2012-10-09 08:20:06 PM  
So this is why, when someone asks what you think is the worst supreme court case, Terry v. Ohio should be much higher on your list than Citizens United.
 
2012-10-09 08:22:37 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Silly Jesus: The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

[www.usprisonculture.com image 300x390]

Yes, how do they work.


Ooh, I can find graphs too.

www.prisonpolicy.org

It's a little dated, but it was easy to find. The more recent data is about the same.
 
2012-10-09 08:24:30 PM  
How is this not unlawful search?

Why hasn't this gone to Federal court yet?
 
2012-10-09 08:26:30 PM  

Cyclometh: Silly Jesus: Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.

The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

If their goal is to find a criminal, and they have the choice of white guy, Asian guy, and black guy, there is an obvious choice that any betting man would make.

You really don't understand statistics, or are just being intentionally stupid here.

Protip: It's a good bet because the house sets the odds.


Look at the graph above. Just one subset of crime, murder. Roughly 6% of the population (black males) commits 60% + of the murders. Many other crimes are similarly skewed.
 
2012-10-09 08:26:49 PM  

Silly Jesus: Ooh, I can find graphs too.


Which has nothing to do with the disproportionate amount of minorities in prison for drug related crimes. But maybe it makes you feel warm and fuzzy.
 
2012-10-09 08:27:28 PM  

Silly Jesus: Dusk-You-n-Me: Silly Jesus: The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

[www.usprisonculture.com image 300x390]

Yes, how do they work.

Ooh, I can find graphs too.

[www.prisonpolicy.org image 600x450]

It's a little dated, but it was easy to find. The more recent data is about the same.


So is this where you go all in and tell us that black men are just more inclined to be murderers because they're black?
 
2012-10-09 08:28:16 PM  

Silly Jesus: Cyclometh: Silly Jesus: Rincewind53: Wait just a few more minutes, guys, and you'll get the Fark Independents coming in saying that the massive number of stop and frisks against minorities are justified because black people and minorities are more likely to commit crimes.

The tactics are heavy handed and I don't condone them...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? Statistics, how do they work?

If their goal is to find a criminal, and they have the choice of white guy, Asian guy, and black guy, there is an obvious choice that any betting man would make.

You really don't understand statistics, or are just being intentionally stupid here.

Protip: It's a good bet because the house sets the odds.

Look at the graph above. Just one subset of crime, murder. Roughly 6% of the population (black males) commits 60% + of the murders. Many other crimes are similarly skewed.


Ah, stupidity and racism all in one package. How efficient of you.
 
2012-10-09 08:28:51 PM  

WhyteRaven74: Silly Jesus: ...but are you really arguing that the odds aren't in favor of any given minority being a criminal? S

BTW it's pretty well established there are lots of investment bankers, lawyers and other professional types with various drug habits that stagger the mind, how is it no one is frisking them?


1. It's harder to frisk people in cabs.
2. They probably generally keep the drugs in their officer or house.
3. Odds are still better to pick a minority at random than to pick a stock broker at random.
4. I didn't intend on solely speaking of drug crimes.
 
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