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(The Atlantic Cities)   American cities' equality ratings puts them on par with countries like Swaziland and El Salvador   (theatlanticcities.com) divider line 129
    More: Cool, Swaziland, El Salvador, Americans, american cities, United States, CIA World Factbook, American Community Survey, Joseph Stiglitz  
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7809 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Oct 2012 at 2:57 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-09 11:08:45 AM  
Yeah but if we can get unemployment up to 20% we can actually bust those unions and then bring all those manufacturing jobs back here from China and Thailand and the Philippines.
 
2012-10-09 11:11:04 AM  
So, the solution is to shuffle rich people around to average out the local numbers? Or just have all the rich people take their money out of the country so everyone's poor?
 
2012-10-09 11:19:25 AM  
Ah. I see Richard Florida has found something new to latch onto. He didn't seem to give a damn about poverty back when he was shilling his "Creative Class" thesis, like some sort of carnival huckster.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-09 11:22:36 AM  
So wealthy people live in cities? What point is he trying to make?
 
2012-10-09 01:05:32 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Ah. I see Richard Florida has found something new to latch onto. He didn't seem to give a damn about poverty back when he was shilling his "Creative Class" thesis, like some sort of carnival huckster.


Neither did Jeffrey Sachs when he was neoliberalizing Eastern Europe and Latin America to the point of almost starving the citizenry. Now all of a sudden he's all about "The End of Poverty". GTFO.
 
2012-10-09 01:15:13 PM  

vpb: So wealthy people live in cities? What point is he trying to make?


That the income disparity in the US in the cities is quite high and as a nation overall it's not much better.
 
2012-10-09 01:45:13 PM  
What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair
 
2012-10-09 02:49:32 PM  

coco ebert: Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Ah. I see Richard Florida has found something new to latch onto. He didn't seem to give a damn about poverty back when he was shilling his "Creative Class" thesis, like some sort of carnival huckster.

Neither did Jeffrey Sachs when he was neoliberalizing Eastern Europe and Latin America to the point of almost starving the citizenry. Now all of a sudden he's all about "The End of Poverty". GTFO.


It's almost as if certain economists are trying to peddle books trumpeting the newest fad to the gullible masses.
 
2012-10-09 03:00:01 PM  
WOO! EL SALVADOR!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIblyCXtlEw

Link
 
2012-10-09 03:03:01 PM  
Appleton (.395)

Way to go neighbor!
 
2012-10-09 03:05:24 PM  
But...but...trickle down!!!
 
2012-10-09 03:05:49 PM  

mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair


You win the "Crown of Lowering Expectations" this week.
 
2012-10-09 03:06:19 PM  
A country spends decades importing people from 3rd world countries and then it is surprised it looks like a 3rd world country. Damn out does that work?
 
2012-10-09 03:06:27 PM  

Rogue Surf: But...but...trickle down!!!


Yes, this is truly trickle down economics inaction
 
2012-10-09 03:08:05 PM  

mysticcat: The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair


So much for American Exceptionalism.
 
2012-10-09 03:09:16 PM  
Is it really fair though to compare a US city to an entire country?

And what does it really mean anyway? Bangladesh is pretty income equal. Everybody is poor. Versus if you look at a city like Memphis. Some parts of town are basically shacks, but if you get over near Collierville it is mostly all high end homes. Same with St. Louis. The North side (especially inside 270) is a disaster zone.
 
2012-10-09 03:09:49 PM  
Why should I care about this?
 
2012-10-09 03:10:21 PM  

Vectron: A country spends decades importing people from 3rd world countries and then it is surprised it looks like a 3rd world country. Damn out does that work?


Yeah, letting those Irish in was a huge mistake. ANd don't get me started on the Italians.
 
2012-10-09 03:11:43 PM  
BFD

Massaging statistics to make America look bad.

Does anyone in their right mind thing Nigeria and Madagascar are as good a places to be poor as Seattle and San Francisco? Or that life is somehow the same in those places?
 
2012-10-09 03:13:11 PM  
The idea is that high Gini coefficients lead to political instability and revolution. Basically, they're a measure that indicates your country is being looted by an elite.
 
2012-10-09 03:13:13 PM  
ricketyclick.com
 
2012-10-09 03:13:19 PM  
Come to the islands, mon. Denver = Jamaica... close.. but not really.
 
2012-10-09 03:13:41 PM  

unlikely: Yeah but if We can get unemployment up to 20 47% if we can actually bust those unions and then bring send all those manufacturing jobs back here from to China and Thailand and the Philippines.


FTFY, because it's more likely.
 
2012-10-09 03:13:44 PM  

mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair


Why should we not compare ourselves to other developed nations of the world? The Scandinavian model results in less poor people while still retaining high overall wealth. Why would we not want that?
 
2012-10-09 03:14:26 PM  
Did the IMF do this analysis?
 
2012-10-09 03:14:47 PM  
What was the point of the article? That things are better when everyone is poor.

/The US still has the fattest poor people in the world.
 
2012-10-09 03:18:33 PM  
Égalité !

Fairness above all !

How can it be fair that you have so much when I have so little ?
 
2012-10-09 03:19:55 PM  

big pig peaches: What was the point of the article?


Richard Florida's ex-wife has an alimony payment due.
 
2012-10-09 03:23:21 PM  
Somebody should write a book about what happens when we strive for equality as a goal.

Somebody should write a song about it too.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-10-09 03:24:43 PM  

big pig peaches: What was the point of the article? That things are better when everyone is poor.

/The US still has the fattest poor people in the world.


Is he trying to say that flyover country is better than cities because almost everyone is equally poor?
 
2012-10-09 03:25:44 PM  
Awesome. Where I want to be for the years to come is largely in a grey area according to yet another dipshiat math guy that is in need of a grant to complete his research of something and try to explain all of humanity via maps and whatnot.

/have fun math boy....see ya at the BBQ.
 
2012-10-09 03:25:46 PM  
There's a guy in my town worth $2 billion. I'm worth about $8 grand. BUT, if you take the average, we're both billionaires, and that's still pretty farking good.
 
2012-10-09 03:27:08 PM  

mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair


Gini coefficients are a time worn and accepted method for discussing geographies of inequality in populations. The method has its faults, but its generally agreed upon that they are a good method for quantifying inequality at a varity of scales. So nah [sticks out tongue].

Next week, can we learn how the elevation of your home has a direct correlation with your race? That was always my favorite lesson to teach in human geography.
 
2012-10-09 03:29:02 PM  

big pig peaches: What was the point of the article? That things are better when everyone is poor.

/The US still has the fattest poor people in the world.


So let's end the food stamp program? Also, fat is not healthy or a sign people are eating well, it is just a sign that you are consuming empty calories with few nutrients, like sugar or high fructose corn syrup.

Also, not everyone in poor countries are poor, there is almost a group of highly wealthy individuals in poor countries, that why they have a high Gini index. What you can have though is slightly less rich people and a lot more middle class people, which is better than a few really rich people and a lot of poor people.
 
2012-10-09 03:31:00 PM  

CmndrFish: mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair

Why should we not compare ourselves to other developed nations of the world? The Scandinavian model results in less poor people while still retaining high overall wealth. Why would we not want that?


oh oh I got this one! Cuz Socialism warrrgarrrable!!

(amidoinitrite?)
 
2012-10-09 03:31:16 PM  

Rogue Surf: But...but...trickle down!!!


Dick Trickle?
 
2012-10-09 03:32:02 PM  
Inequality in America:

U.S. top earners pay larger share of taxes than any other industrialized nation 

"The United States is actually more dependent on rich people to pay taxes than even many of the more socialized economies of Europe. According to the Tax Foundation, the United States gets 45 percent of its total taxes from the top 10 percent of tax filers, whereas the international average in industrialized nations is 32 percent. America's rich carry a larger share of the tax burden than do the rich in Belgium (25 percent), Germany (31 percent), France (28 percent), and even Sweden (27 percent)."
 
2012-10-09 03:32:07 PM  

CmndrFish: mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair

Why should we not compare ourselves to other developed nations of the world? The Scandinavian model results in less poor people while still retaining high overall wealth. Why would we not want that?


Scandanvia is three countries, and when it comes to quality of life none of them beat the US...

http://internationalliving.com/2010/02/quality-of-life-2010/

And look,they don't beat the US at human development either:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_I n dex

Economic Freedom? Nope, don't win there either...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Index_of_Economic_Freedom

And if you look closely you will realize a lot of the "advantage" that Scandanavia has over the US is due mostly to taxes and forced wealth redistribution. We could do the same thing, and probably should to a degree with some minor changes to our tax system, but basically there is no inherent superiority being displayed here...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality

So what is your point exactly?
 
2012-10-09 03:33:30 PM  

Rogue Surf: But...but...trickle down!!!


Yes, and it worked so well before that Mittens and Ayn Ryan think we should do it again.
 
2012-10-09 03:34:28 PM  

Nightsweat: Vectron: A country spends decades importing people from 3rd world countries and then it is surprised it looks like a 3rd world country. Damn out how does that work?

Yeah, letting those Irish in was a huge mistake. ANd don't get me started on the Italians.



Those aren't 3rd world countries. I'm talking about poor people from Central America. We're importing poverty.
 
2012-10-09 03:37:07 PM  

SandMann: "The United States is actually more dependent on rich people to pay taxes than even many of the more socialized economies of Europe. According to the Tax Foundation, the United States gets 45 percent of its total taxes from the top 10 percent of tax filers, whereas the international average in industrialized nations is 32 percent. America's rich carry a larger share of the tax burden than do the rich in Belgium (25 percent), Germany (31 percent), France (28 percent), and even Sweden (27 percent)."


Which means nothing without evaluating how much wealth the rich actually possess as a fraction of the total wealth of the various countries. If I pay 1% in taxes on $1,000,000 of income, I'm paying more in taxes than I am if I pay 50% of my $1,000 of income. The rich paying more in taxes despite having lower tax rates is probably actually a symptom of wealth inequality rather than evidence of anything to the contrary.
 
2012-10-09 03:40:03 PM  

arentol: CmndrFish: mysticcat: What a ridiculous statistic. The goal is not equality. If that were the case, a nation that was entirely dirt poor would be the winner.

What you're looking for is standard of living. For instance, in Swaziland, 70% of the population lives below the poverty line, in the Dominican Republic 34%, in El Salvador 37%, Madagascar 50%, Phillipines 27%, Nigeria 70%. Jamaica and Malaysia are actually pretty reasonable at 4%(!) and 17%. In the U.S. that number is 15%. (CIA World Factbook). The U.S. could do better, but comparing us to countries like Denmark and Sweden is unfair

Why should we not compare ourselves to other developed nations of the world? The Scandinavian model results in less poor people while still retaining high overall wealth. Why would we not want that?

Scandanvia is three countries, and when it comes to quality of life none of them beat the US...

http://internationalliving.com/2010/02/quality-of-life-2010/

And look,they don't beat the US at human development either:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_I n dex

Economic Freedom? Nope, don't win there either...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Index_of_Economic_Freedom

And if you look closely you will realize a lot of the "advantage" that Scandanavia has over the US is due mostly to taxes and forced wealth redistribution. We could do the same thing, and probably should to a degree with some minor changes to our tax system, but basically there is no inherent superiority being displayed here...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality

So what is your point exactly?


i think the point of your post is to show that you dont know what you're talking about. like, at all.
 
2012-10-09 03:40:38 PM  

serial_crusher: So, the solution is to shuffle rich people around to average out the local numbers? Or just have all the rich people take their money out of the country so everyone's poor?


No, with all the rich people out of the country the magic GINI will adjust and make everybody left behind feeling richer. The rich are our misfortune!
 
2012-10-09 03:41:36 PM  

Vectron: Nightsweat: Vectron: A country spends decades importing people from 3rd world countries and then it is surprised it looks like a 3rd world country. Damn out how does that work?

Yeah, letting those Irish in was a huge mistake. ANd don't get me started on the Italians.


Those aren't 3rd world countries. I'm talking about poor people from Central America. We're importing poverty.



Yes, but we're also exporting wealth, so it all evens out.

Our next goal should be to make everyone the same color.
 
2012-10-09 03:43:21 PM  

Father_Jack: Scandanvia is three countries, and when it comes to quality of life none of them beat the US...


Then why is Denmark considered the happiest country on Earth?
 
2012-10-09 03:45:23 PM  
Sorry, meant to respond to Arentol, not Father Jack.
 
2012-10-09 03:46:55 PM  

SandMann: Inequality in America:

U.S. top earners pay larger share of taxes than any other industrialized nation 

"The United States is actually more dependent on rich people to pay taxes than even many of the more socialized economies of Europe. According to the Tax Foundation, the United States gets 45 percent of its total taxes from the top 10 percent of tax filers, whereas the international average in industrialized nations is 32 percent. America's rich carry a larger share of the tax burden than do the rich in Belgium (25 percent), Germany (31 percent), France (28 percent), and even Sweden (27 percent)."


Wow, what an amazing set of facts.

The article you wrote implies that this says that the rich pay far too much in income as taxes.

Yet, these facts are actually another indicator of systemic inequality, where the top 10% of tax filers make so much far and above than the average American, that countries with higher tax rates than us have their wealthy paying a lower share of the tax burden.

Its funny that the article you link defeats itself with its own statistics.
 
2012-10-09 03:47:16 PM  

Gwyrddu: Father_Jack: Scandanvia is three countries, and when it comes to quality of life none of them beat the US...

Then why is Denmark considered the happiest country on Earth?


Happy pills.
 
2012-10-09 03:47:39 PM  
thepatriotperspective.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-10-09 03:47:59 PM  
Tell those lazy bums to get a goddamn job if they want to be equal. Laying around on your ass collecting welfare isn't going to help you get equal with anything but your neighbor... who has the same ambitions as you.
 
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