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(Orlando Sentinel)   Olive Garden says, gosh, I guess we'll just have to shoulder the new Obamacare costs in this crappy economy. Just kidding, they want to make all their workers part time   (articles.orlandosentinel.com) divider line 269
    More: Obvious, obamacare  
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3342 clicks; posted to Politics » on 08 Oct 2012 at 11:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-08 06:55:47 PM
I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?
 
2012-10-08 07:04:51 PM

BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?


Making them share tips with the bartenders, who had their pay cut.

That said, given the anecdote of one person saying "Fine, I will work somewhere else", this is probably going to backfire on them as they acquire a reputation for being more concerned about costs than employees and offering a less beneficial package to people seeking work.

But hey more power to them, hand of the free market and all that.
 
2012-10-08 07:32:45 PM
In Massachusetts under RomneyCare many of the penalties are assessed per full-time equivalent. So two workers working part time doing the same job count as a full time position. So if the cut off is 50 employees before the mandates for coverage kick in you could in theory have 100 part time workers and then have the mandates apply, but you can't just make everyone part time without limit and get away with it. Seems fair.

Also, you're allowed to pay them what like $2/hr as servers and you still can't afford a cheap plan that just barely meets the coverage requirements?
 
2012-10-08 07:36:49 PM

itsdan: Also, you're allowed to pay them what like $2/hr as servers and you still can't afford a cheap plan that just barely meets the coverage requirements?


Well, this IS Olive Garden we're talking about.
 
2012-10-08 07:41:16 PM

Ambivalence: Well, this IS Olive Garden we're talking about.


I don't think you should be able to offer unlimited soup/salad/breadsticks and then cry poor.
 
2012-10-08 08:34:34 PM
and people are surprised by this, why?

businesses have stated that it is easier for them to ditch people's health care and pay the fine (for those full time) or to just shift more people to part time.
 
2012-10-08 08:36:11 PM
There seemed to be an awful lot of "might"s, and "maybe"s in that article

/so the obvious answer appears to be "f*ck everybody, just in case"
 
2012-10-08 08:37:38 PM

BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?


They don't have to take the job if they aren't willing to agree to the terms of employment.
 
2012-10-08 08:39:31 PM
And this is on top of already reducing labor costs over the past few years? This seems like less issues over health care and more like "We're maximizing profits any way we can."
 
2012-10-08 08:45:23 PM
Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.
 
2012-10-08 08:45:31 PM
I know nothing of business but isn't the largest cost of a restaurant payroll?
 
2012-10-08 08:45:55 PM

Irving Maimway: And this is on top of already reducing labor costs over the past few years? This seems like less issues over health care and more like "We're maximizing profits any way we can."


Record breaking profits with historically low taxes. Sounds like a trickle down supporter's greatest dream. Too bad for the middle class that it is doing exactly as it was planned to do.
 
2012-10-08 08:46:55 PM
This is a test program, and hopefully it will be shown to be unfeasible. Just that it's a test program and they're not doing it across the board shows that they're not confident they can fight this and are just floating a balloon.
 
2012-10-08 08:55:44 PM
If destroying Olive Garden isn't in the "pro" column for ObamaCare, I don't know what is.
 
2012-10-08 08:57:31 PM

BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Every

restaurant that has a bar I've ever worked in does this. The philosophy is, the diner is tipping based on total guest experience. Since people are such assholes that they will stiff their waiter if the hostess takes too long to seat them, or the busboy doesn't take their dinner plates soon enough, or the bartender doesn't put extra liquor in their drinks, then the owners figure that the server should pitch in part of the tips for the times those people tip well.

The worst part is that your "tip-out" at the end of the night is based on your total sales, and there is no exception for the dickwad that stiffed you because the bartender made sh*tty drinks - you pay the same tipshare out of your pocket. The highest I ever had to pay was 3 1/2%, but I know people that have paid at least 5%. This means that if you sell $1000 in a night, you can expect tips of about $150 (Yes, most people might tip 18-20%, but the remainder tip less, not more). Out of this, I would give the house $35, so I would take home $115 for about 10-12 hrs. work.

The restaurant that took 5% generally had about the same sales (the food was more expensive, but you were only allowed to take care of fewer tables) but the people tipped better. The waiters there would make $180 in tips on $1000 in sales, but then would "tip out" $50, so would be left with $130. Yes, the high-end restaurants paid about the same to their waiters as the cheaper ones.

FWIW, the best money I ever made waiting tables was at a buffet restaurant that rhymes with "Olden Doral". Yes, I got tipped about $2 -$5 per table, but I waited on about 8-10 tables at a time. I didn't walk in to a 6 1/2 hour shift for less than $100, with no tip-out.
 
2012-10-08 08:57:39 PM
When you're here, you're family.

When you work here, you're farked.
 
2012-10-08 09:04:12 PM

MoonPirate: I know nothing of business but isn't the largest cost of a restaurant payroll?


Actually, generally speaking, food cost should be about 25-26%, liquor cost 20% (of liquor drinks, of course), overhead less than 30%, and labor cost somewhere around 25-28%. Advertising can vary from 0% to 10%, depending on circumstances,

Restaurants vary greatly in these numbers. For example, some buildings, especially family-owned restaurants, are totally paid off, so their overhead costs are lower (they only pay for repairs and utilities). Advertising specials such as cheap wings or coupons may not only raise your advertising costs, but also raise your food costs at the same time it raises total income. At the same time, you may not let anyone know that you've raised the price of drinks by $1 each, which lowers your liquor costs in an effort to make up for the shortfall on the food.
 
2012-10-08 09:06:07 PM
So olive garden is going to suck even more now?

Is that possible?
 
2012-10-08 09:08:41 PM

Aarontology: If destroying Olive Garden isn't in the "pro" column for ObamaCare, I don't know what is.


I never worked at Olive Garden, but as a customer, I say the food is on the level of Marie Callender's from the Wal-Mart freezer. I do think it is worth $10-15 for the unlimited soup, salad, and breadsticks every once in a while, since I also eat Marie Callender's on a regular basis. The (relatively) fresh-baked breadsticks are far superior to anything I can do at home without a lot of preparation.

I eat McDonald's, too. I don't expect a royal feast every time I consume food. Most of the time, if it tastes okay, and it's not too expensive, I'm good.
 
2012-10-08 09:10:41 PM

Dead for Tax Reasons: So olive garden is going to suck even more now?

Is that possible?


Well, look at this way. Other restaurants will soon have cooks and servers that have health care for a change. Olive Garden servers and cooks will still not have health care. Which group of people would you rather have handling your food?
 
2012-10-08 09:13:31 PM
Analysts said limiting hours could pose new challenges, including higher turnover and less-qualified workers.

What could possibly go wrong?
 
2012-10-08 09:19:07 PM

fusillade762: Analysts said limiting hours could pose new challenges, including higher turnover and less-qualified workers.

What could possibly go wrong?


Not to mention competing against other restaurants that provide health insurance, so the employees aren't stuck trying to get it on the exchanges.
 
2012-10-08 09:22:47 PM

fusillade762: Analysts said limiting hours could pose new challenges, including higher turnover and less-qualified workers.

What could possibly go wrong?


Less qualified. Less qualified than a present Olive Garden employee

/just wrap your brain around that concept
 
2012-10-08 09:24:30 PM

Aarontology: If destroying Olive Garden isn't in the "pro" column for ObamaCare, I don't know what is.


Bingo!
 
2012-10-08 09:28:07 PM

ox45tallboy: Dead for Tax Reasons: So olive garden is going to suck even more now?

Is that possible?

Well, look at this way. Other restaurants will soon have cooks and servers that have health care for a change. Olive Garden servers and cooks will still not have health care. Which group of people would you rather have handling your food?


I hadn't thought of that... Euwww.
 
2012-10-08 09:41:07 PM

davidphogan: I hadn't thought of that... Euwww.


Why not an ad campaign by one of their competitors?

(OPEN SCENE)

Server is coughing and sneezing into their white, button-down starched shirt, then wiping their face with the long apron.
(VOICEOVER)
AT SOME RESTAURANTS, THEY DENY THEIR EMPLOYEES BASIC RIGHTS LIKE HEALTH CARE

(CUT TO KITCHEN IN SAME RESTAURANT)
Cook in chef's hat is coughing while stirring white clam chowder

(CUT TO SMILING HAPPY SERVERS IN SOLID-COLORED POLO SHIRTS)

(VOICEOVER)
AT APPLEBEE'S WE TAKE PRIDE IN PROVIDING THE BEST HEALTH CARE IN THE INDUSTRY FOR OUR BEST RESOURCE - OUR PEOPLE!

(CUT TO ATTRACTIVE BLONDE SERVER IN APPLEBEE'S UNIFORM AND MINISKIRT)

(VOICEOVER)
OUR EMPLOYEES ARE EVEN REGULARLY TESTED FOR STD'S, SO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE BRINGING HOME!

(CUT BACK TO ATTRACTIVE BLONDE SERVER DELIVERING LARGE STEAK WITH SIDE ITEMS, THEN CLOSE-UP OF ATTRACTIVE BLONDE)

(CUT TO CLOSEUP OF PASTA WITH BREADSTICKS, SLOW PAN BACK TO SERVERS FACE IN OLIVE GARDEN UNIFORM IMMEDIATELY ABOVE IT, COMPLETE WITH COLD SORE, SMILING, THEN COUGHING ONTO FOOD)
Is there anything else I can... give you?

(QUICK CUT TO BLACK)
 
2012-10-08 09:54:04 PM

BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?


Every restaurant I ever worked at required me to tip out a percentage of my this to bus boys and a percentage of my alcohol sales to the bar. That's pretty standard. And servers who stiff the bus boys and bartenders don't last long when their beverages come at a snails pace and their tables aren't getting cleaned to get the sat again.
 
2012-10-08 09:58:28 PM
You guys expected anything less?

If you did not see this coming when obamacare was being debated then you are a moron. Businesses care not for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.
 
2012-10-08 09:59:26 PM

cman: You guys expected anything less?

If you did not see this coming when obamacare was being debated then you are a moron. Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.


Whoops, that made no sense. Fixt
 
2012-10-08 10:07:53 PM

cman: Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.


All the more reason to de-couple employers and health insurance.
 
2012-10-08 10:09:17 PM
"I think a lot of those employers, especially restaurants, are just going to ensure nobody gets scheduled more than 30 hours a week," said Matthew Snook, partner with human-resources consulting company Mercer.

Because if there's one thing that really makes me want to eat there it's knowing that the staff handling my food don't have adequate health care coverage AND know they're getting boned by their greedy employer.

yeah. no thanks.
 
2012-10-08 10:11:29 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: When you're here, you're family.

When you work here, you're farked.


isn't that the 111th rule of acquisition? Treat people in your debt like family ... exploit them.
 
2012-10-08 10:16:01 PM
That doesn't sound like hospitaliano.
 
2012-10-08 10:17:38 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: cman: Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.

All the more reason to de-couple employers and health insurance.


I ain't saying that is a bad idea.

Liberals won, you got your healthcare bill passed. However, the sting of the bill is unbearable (individual mandate). As I have said in the past I would have preferred government run healthcare over being forced to buy a product from a for profit business. It is a matter of principles for me. Government ran tax payers healthcare is acceptable, but forcing one to partake in commerce is not.
 
2012-10-08 10:18:03 PM

JerseyTim: That doesn't sound like hospitaliano.


When you're here, you're family.

Unless you work here, then go f*ck yourself.
 
2012-10-08 10:20:10 PM

cman: Liberals won


lol
 
2012-10-08 10:22:33 PM

ox45tallboy: Well, look at this way. Other restaurants will soon have cooks and servers that have health care for a change. Olive Garden servers and cooks will still not have health care. Which group of people would you rather have handling your food?


Ding, ding, ding!

Yep, that's pretty gross.
 
2012-10-08 10:22:40 PM
Money should have no connection to healthcare. Gimme the NHS any day.
 
2012-10-08 10:27:20 PM

cman: You guys expected anything less?

If you did not see this coming when obamacare was being debated then you are a moron. Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.


If Romney wins and the ACA gets repealed, do you think Olive Garden will reverse this?

/hint: no.
 
NFA [TotalFark]
2012-10-08 10:47:38 PM
Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.
 
2012-10-08 10:47:56 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: cman: Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.

All the more reason to de-couple employers and health insurance.


Go back to Kenya, socialist!!!
 
2012-10-08 10:51:48 PM

cman: Liberals won, you got your healthcare bill passed.


Liberals did not win. If liberals had won we'd have single payer healthcare right now. Moderates won. you know, those people that are neither liberal nor conservative but constantly triangulating to a mythical "sweet center" that doesn't exist?
 
2012-10-08 10:52:44 PM

NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.


Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.
 
2012-10-08 11:03:43 PM
Totally expected. More companies will offer part-time jobs rather than pay health care. Besides, the fed has offered so many exemptions, what's the point?

On the flip side, if businesses choose to keep people on full-time, wanna bet those costs get passed on to consumers?
 
2012-10-08 11:05:21 PM

themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.


Food prices haven't gone high enough for that to happen. Yet.
 
2012-10-08 11:10:07 PM
You call what they do at OG work?

img.photobucket.com

/all hail the great Sysconian Empire
 
2012-10-08 11:13:32 PM

slayer199: On the flip side, if businesses choose to keep people on full-time, wanna bet those costs get passed on to consumers?


In most cases, the "full-time" employees already have benefits such as health care.

I concede to Republicans everywhere that ObamaCare is a clusterf*ck, but it is still better than anything the Republicans have proposed since they started telling everyone that they (the Republicans) had never proposed ObamaCare in the first place.

WHAR
SINGL PAYR
OBMA
WHER?
\o/
|
/ \
 
2012-10-08 11:19:34 PM
Here's a 24 page pdf on how Olive Garden treats their staff as badly as Walmart workers. -PDF-

And then there's this:
Olive Garden, Red Lobster, Capital Grille Poor Working Conditions Creating Investor Liability
Olive Garden is already directly connected to a Hepatitis A incident, in which a class action lawsuit was filed against Darden for fostering the conditions that endangered thousands of people. Without timely corrective action, major and potentially irreparable brand damage may follow. Advocacy groups are increasingly bringing attention to public health incidents linked with the lack of paid sick days and low wages, which do not allow workers to take a day off when sick; the Olive Garden Hepatitis scare underscores how disastrous that practice can be.

My sister works for Olive Garden. If she asks for the day off because she's really sick they tell her no. They'll fire her. She tries to wash her hands as much as possible to keep from passing colds/illness to the customers, but that takes time and management get pissed if the staff isn't moving things along as quickly as possible.
 
2012-10-08 11:24:34 PM

DanZero: /all hail the great Sysconian Empire


www.syscoportland.com
"Okay, boil-in-the-bag sauces...check, pre-cooked pasta...check, frozen breadsticks...check...pre-cooked checken...pre-cooked chicken....pre-cooked chicken...Hey Mike! Where the f*ck is the pre-cooked chicken? You know this raw sh*t won't work in the microwave!"
 
2012-10-08 11:26:57 PM

penthesilea: Here's a 24 page pdf


...and you just lost 95% of Farkers. I'm sure you had a relevant point, but give us an excerpt or something. We all have ADHD here, you're lucky we can get through a single thread.
 
2012-10-08 11:42:04 PM
Does that mean I get half the breadsticks?
 
2012-10-08 11:45:47 PM

themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.


Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.
 
2012-10-08 11:45:49 PM

ox45tallboy: penthesilea: Here's a 24 page pdf

...and you just lost 95% of Farkers. I'm sure you had a relevant point, but give us an excerpt or something. We all have ADHD here, you're lucky we can get through a single thread.


Yeah, I know. I was trying to avoid tl;dr.

Tiny bit of the summary:
Darden regularly pays the lowest wages possible to its employees. The federal subminimum wage has been stuck at $2.13 since 1991. Darden has lobbied to keep minimum wages stagnant, while Darden's executive compensation of the CEO has risen 23% per year on average since 2005 to its current level of 8.5 million in 2011.

The report outlines Darden's recent wage theft lawsuits, including several Texas-based federal lawsuits for nonpayment of wages, and a California class action lawsuit in which the company was charged with forcing its workers to pay for the cost of purchasing and maintaining uniforms, in which the company was forced to pay employees $9.5 million.

The report also outlines recent lawsuits against Darden for employment discrimination based on race, including a 2008 lawsuit that charged that Beachwood, Ohio Bahama Breeze employees of color were repeatedly pelted with racial slurs such as "Aunt Jemima" and "stupid n**ger" by managers. This resulted in a EEOC announcement of a $1.26 million settlement from Darden in 2009. In describing the settlement, EEOC's acting chairman Stuart J. Ishimaru said "No worker should have to endure a racially hostile work environment in order to earn a paycheck."


...also health & safety problems...etc.
 
2012-10-08 11:47:04 PM
So compassionate. That's how you know that, in an unregulated economy, corporate entities would behave themselves and police each other. Corporations are good people, my friend.
 
2012-10-08 11:48:14 PM
This is exactly the point of ObamaCare. Make single payer look better every day.
 
2012-10-08 11:51:32 PM

WizardofToast: Does that mean I get half the breadsticks?


Sure, as long as you realize they've been sneezed on by a server without access to healthcare, nor the effort and/or ability to quit their job and go to work at any other restaurant that does offer health care.

Pass the garlic butter?
 
2012-10-08 11:51:38 PM

Weaver95: themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.

Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.


What are they doing other than sitting around and complaining?
I've yet to hear about any Occupy organizations promoting people for office or pushing legislation.
 
2012-10-08 11:52:35 PM
Last quarter they only made a profit of $110.8 million. Insurance would obviously bleed them dry.
 
2012-10-08 11:52:43 PM

Weaver95: themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.

Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.


Still here, still working. globalNOISE starts this weekend, should be interesting.
 
2012-10-08 11:52:58 PM
I worked in a lot of restaurants. No one ever worked full-time. Yawn.
 
2012-10-08 11:53:05 PM
Nearly every place that can pull this shiat will, and they have forever. Why pay for a full-timers benefits when you don't have to? I once worked at a place that hired me part-time, and wanted me to work 48 hours every week. Not during busy seasons, not when we unexpectedly lose a worker, but ALL THE TIME. I told the boss that if I did that, they would never have any incentive to hire me as a full-time employee.

Much to my surprise (/sarcasm) I was fired the next week. Imagine the give-a-farks I had. No way were they gonna pull that shiat on me. Find another sucker.

/It was a shiat job with bad pay. At the time, it was easier to get a shiat job, and most wouldn't try to put that much shiat over on you.
 
2012-10-08 11:53:39 PM
We're already at the point where, except for the double cheeseburger, it's simply easier and cheaper to cook your own meals. Even if you cook them horribly, they'll probably taste better than the alternative, and are remarkably cheaper. Costs like seven or eight bucks per meal at at a fast food place, let alone a sit-down fast food place like Olive Garden, which will drive you up to fifteen or twenty. At that point you can do better at your local grocery.
 
2012-10-08 11:53:49 PM

GhostFish: I've yet to hear about any Occupy organizations promoting people for office or pushing legislation.


And this is the downside to the lack of organization. Also, Occupy tends to be inclusive enough that any proposed legislation would have quite a few dissenters within its ranks.
 
2012-10-08 11:55:00 PM
Yeah they have to bear the burden in this tough economy where corporate profits have never been higher. Oh shiat paying more for the benefit of workers? fark that shiat. Oh "what about trickle down?" Hahaahhaa you actually believe that shiat? I'm rich as fark thanks idiots.
 
2012-10-08 11:55:11 PM
www.resistnwo.com
 
2012-10-08 11:55:52 PM

GhostFish:
I've yet to hear about any Occupy organizations promoting people for office or pushing legislation.


nor will you. it is not in the best interests of wall street (or its supporters) to see Occupy look even remotely 'mainstream'. they *must* be seen as crazy and/or ineffective. preferably laughed at, but so long as they're sidelined it's acceptable. anything to keep the idea of 'OWS' out of the mainstream consciousness.
 
2012-10-08 11:56:32 PM

GhostFish: What are they doing other than sitting around and complaining?
I've yet to hear about any Occupy organizations promoting people for office or pushing legislation.


Mostly we do useful things instead of wasting our time playing stupid political games, like strike support, or blocking foreclosures, or setting up replacement libraries when the city shuts them down. By and large electoral politics is pointless and a sucker's game. Beyond that, there are a number of groups standing in solidarity with the occupations, like MoveToAmend, that are doing exactly that.
 
2012-10-08 11:56:45 PM
Unlimited soup/salad/breadsticks/hepatitis.
 
2012-10-08 11:56:58 PM

Weaver95: themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.

Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.


I never knew you believed in conspiracy theories, Weaver.

Networks crave ratings, so they show the most bat shiat insane people (just like they did with the Tea Party) at OWS rallies. To the average American we care more about what Snooki named her kid, not a discussion of the tariff. Americans dont like that kind of news. They want to see squirrels on water boards, people getting kicked in the nuts, people who cant spell worth a shiat making a stupid protestor sign. They are a corporation in it to make money, and since no money is in real news, they have to give into what their views demand.
 
2012-10-08 11:57:18 PM
So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"

At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.
 
2012-10-08 11:57:49 PM

Brick-House: [www.resistnwo.com image 400x296]


Because we know the status quo was sooo much better.

/rolls eyes
 
2012-10-08 11:59:31 PM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"

At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.


Conservatives were right about everything in Obamacare, back when they proposed it in the 1990s.
 
2012-10-08 11:59:48 PM

cman: Weaver95: themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.

Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.

I never knew you believed in conspiracy theories, Weaver.

Networks crave ratings, so they show the most bat shiat insane people (just like they did with the Tea Party) at OWS rallies. To the average American we care more about what Snooki named her kid, not a discussion of the tariff. Americans dont like that kind of news. They want to see squirrels on water boards, people getting kicked in the nuts, people who cant spell worth a shiat making a stupid protestor sign. They are a corporation in it to make money, and since no money is in real news, they have to give into what their views demand.


um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.
 
2012-10-09 12:00:09 AM

ox45tallboy: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Every restaurant that has a bar I've ever worked in does this. The philosophy is, the diner is tipping based on total guest experience. Since people are such assholes that they will stiff their waiter if the hostess takes too long to seat them, or the busboy doesn't take their dinner plates soon enough, or the bartender doesn't put extra liquor in their drinks, then the owners figure that the server should pitch in part of the tips for the times those people tip well.

The worst part is that your "tip-out" at the end of the night is based on your total sales, and there is no exception for the dickwad that stiffed you because the bartender made sh*tty drinks - you pay the same tipshare out of your pocket. The highest I ever had to pay was 3 1/2%, but I know people that have paid at least 5%. This means that if you sell $1000 in a night, you can expect tips of about $150 (Yes, most people might tip 18-20%, but the remainder tip less, not more). Out of this, I would give the house $35, so I would take home $115 for about 10-12 hrs. work.

The restaurant that took 5% generally had about the same sales (the food was more expensive, but you were only allowed to take care of fewer tables) but the people tipped better. The waiters there would make $180 in tips on $1000 in sales, but then would "tip out" $50, so would be left with $130. Yes, the high-end restaurants paid about the same to their waiters as the cheaper ones.

FWIW, the best money I ever made waiting tables was at a buffet restaurant that rhymes with "Olden Doral". Yes, I got tipped about $2 -$5 per table, but I waited on about 8-10 tables at a time. I didn't walk in to a 6 1/2 hour shift for less than $100, with no tip-out.


Ya. Idiots like me tip way too much at buffets.

Also i tipped my bartenders and busboys fat and tried to keep my cooks happy. It really pays off when you fark up and the cook gives you the food of another server to cover your ass.

We tipped directly to the other staff.

Also what cryinoutloud said: no restaurant lets their staff get full time; they try to keep you hungry for more shifts to cover sick days and the like.

Still, waiting still beat the hell out of any other unskilled gig at the time.
 
2012-10-09 12:00:28 AM

cryinoutloud: I worked in a lot of restaurants. No one ever worked full-time. Yawn.


I was thinking the same thing. It's been a decade since I worked in a restaurant, but back then, none of the servers got insurance.

You might work full time hours, but you definitely didn't get classified as full time.
 
2012-10-09 12:00:44 AM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.


Doesn't surprise me at all. Some years ago, when doing an article on work conditions at WalMart, a journalist did the math and pointed out to their WalMart contact that giving every employee in the company a $1/hr raise would be great for morale, resulting in more productive workers, and would only cut their annual profits by 2%. The WalMart talking head said that 2% was too much of a "loss."
 
2012-10-09 12:01:00 AM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"

At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.


thanks for contributing your one and only post in this thread. you can leave now, run away and never come back to defend your comments or further explain your value system. it's ok, we understand. totally cool here man.
 
2012-10-09 12:01:59 AM

Mrtraveler01: Brick-House: [www.resistnwo.com image 400x296]

Because we know the status quo was sooo much better.

/rolls eyes


Um, yeah... You know they could have just passed a couple of small bills for pre-existing conditions, did a little tort reform and made the American people happy. But noooooooo, they had to fark it all up.
 
2012-10-09 12:02:09 AM

Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.


Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!
 
2012-10-09 12:02:21 AM

Weaver95: cman: Weaver95: themindiswatching: NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.

Occupy was supposed to be that, but that fizzled out pretty quickly.

Occupy is *still* going on you know...and it took a mulit-million dollar media effort to try to destroy them.

I never knew you believed in conspiracy theories, Weaver.

Networks crave ratings, so they show the most bat shiat insane people (just like they did with the Tea Party) at OWS rallies. To the average American we care more about what Snooki named her kid, not a discussion of the tariff. Americans dont like that kind of news. They want to see squirrels on water boards, people getting kicked in the nuts, people who cant spell worth a shiat making a stupid protestor sign. They are a corporation in it to make money, and since no money is in real news, they have to give into what their views demand.

um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.


Saying that the media were in cahoots with each other to disintegrate OWS by portraying them in a bad light is the definition of a conspiracy.
 
2012-10-09 12:02:54 AM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"
At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.


You're forgetting the fact that it was Conservatives like Gingrich that actually proposed ObamaCare. Remember HillaryCare? Liberals wanted single payer. Liberals aren't happy about ObamaCare, but it's better than what we've got, and it makes it more likely that eventually we'll get single payer.
 
2012-10-09 12:03:17 AM

cman: Saying that the media were in cahoots with each other to disintegrate OWS by portraying them in a bad light is the definition of a conspiracy.


You're asserting that the conservative corporatist media is not conservatively and corporate-biased?
 
2012-10-09 12:03:28 AM

Brick-House: Mrtraveler01: Brick-House: [www.resistnwo.com image 400x296]

Because we know the status quo was sooo much better.

/rolls eyes

Um, yeah... You know they could have just passed a couple of small bills for pre-existing conditions, did a little tort reform and made the American people happy. But noooooooo, they had to fark it all up.


And you thought Obamacare was worthless...

LOL
 
2012-10-09 12:04:03 AM
Add me to the pile that thinks single-payer is a MUCH better system.
 
2012-10-09 12:05:26 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.

Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!


You see that because you want to see that. OWS and Tea Party both got thrashed in the media. Since OWS is your side, you want to fit whatever you can to make you feel like the other side has an unfair advantage. Guess what? The Tea Party thinks exactly the same way as you do. They think that OWS has gotten a free pass while the Tea Party has been hammered week after week in the news.

We see what we only want to see. We create our own reality. If you sat back and actually watched you would see that news networks care about showing morons. Hell, Drew Curtis wrote a damn book about it.
 
2012-10-09 12:05:45 AM
For every large company like Olive Garden who says that they can't afford healthcare for their workers, we should know how much their CEOs make. I just want know how really "poor" they are in that they can treat their workers so disposable.
 
2012-10-09 12:05:57 AM

Dusk-You-n-Me: All the more reason to de-couple employers and health insurance.


What's funny is that I explain that one of the main goals of the PPACA is designed to break the employment/health insurance bond, and then they think I'm crazy.

But, if they take just one second to think about it, one measly second, they realize that it's the best thing you could ever do to the private insurance market.

And it is. And it will be. And every Republican governor who is stalling on their healthcare exchange is an absolute moron at best, because being able to buy health insurance in a way that's easy and affordable (like, you know, every other type of insurance), offers everybody significantly more economic freedom.
 
2012-10-09 12:06:36 AM

cman: A Dark Evil Omen: Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.

Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!

You see that because you want to see that. OWS and Tea Party both got thrashed in the media. Since OWS is your side, you want to fit whatever you can to make you feel like the other side has an unfair advantage. Guess what? The Tea Party thinks exactly the same way as you do. They think that OWS has gotten a free pass while the Tea Party has been hammered week after week in the news.

We see what we only want to see. We create our own reality. If you sat back and actually watched you would see that news networks care about showing morons. Hell, Drew Curtis wrote a damn book about it.


mediamatters.org

Don't be a moron.
 
2012-10-09 12:07:00 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: cman: Saying that the media were in cahoots with each other to disintegrate OWS by portraying them in a bad light is the definition of a conspiracy.

You're asserting that the conservative corporatist media is not conservatively and corporate-biased?


I am saying that I believe that Rupert Murdock hates MSNBC and would do whatever it can to put them out of business. News networks go for ratings, nothing else.
 
2012-10-09 12:07:26 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.

Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!


Tea Partiers were generally older and had more net worth.
And they actually tried to change the system by getting people elected.

You don't get real attention by staging sit-ins anymore.
Our culture has absorbed that. That kind of rebellion is sold in stores. It's trite and people don't care about it.
 
2012-10-09 12:07:29 AM
And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.
 
2012-10-09 12:08:20 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: cman: A Dark Evil Omen: Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.

Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!

You see that because you want to see that. OWS and Tea Party both got thrashed in the media. Since OWS is your side, you want to fit whatever you can to make you feel like the other side has an unfair advantage. Guess what? The Tea Party thinks exactly the same way as you do. They think that OWS has gotten a free pass while the Tea Party has been hammered week after week in the news.

We see what we only want to see. We create our own reality. If you sat back and actually watched you would see that news networks care about showing morons. Hell, Drew Curtis wrote a damn book about it.

[mediamatters.org image 400x300]

Don't be a moron.


That is Fox News going for ratings. They are targeting a specific base group. By appealing to their base they get the ratings that they want.
 
2012-10-09 12:08:40 AM
its almost as if business shouldn't provide health care, and we get medicare for all like the rest of the civilized world.
 
2012-10-09 12:09:07 AM
I tried working as a cashier at Olive Garden very briefly. 12 Hour shifts , unable to leave the cash booth unless relieved by a manager on duty...which almost never happened as they were "too busy" to allow me to piss , or take a meal brake.... I could occasionally bribe some one to bring me a farking bread stick, and attempted to keep blood sugar up eating the Andes mints. This was for minimum wage, at he time was $4.25 per hour. fark Olive Garden.
 
2012-10-09 12:09:42 AM

cman: That is Fox News going for ratings. They are targeting a specific base group. By appealing to their base they get the ratings that they want.


And then the other major outlets provided similar coverage in competition for ratings.
 
2012-10-09 12:10:33 AM

cman:
Saying that the media were in cahoots with each other to disintegrate OWS by portraying them in a bad light is the definition of a conspiracy.


oh I don't think it was 'organized'. I think the 'average' editor and/or producer at the local levels just decided that making OWS look freaky either suited their personal bias and/or just made better copy. the media higher up tho - THOSE folks have a vested interest in making OWS look bad, and the guys back in the corporate offices sure did their part to make sure that the 11 o'clock news either didn't show any coverage of OWS at all or made sure to manipulate the footage so that only the crazier looking scary people interviews got any air time.

every now and then a bit of the truth got through the corporate filters but most of the coverage was almost universally 'OWS is crazy! OWS is ineffective! OWS has no message! OWS are terrorists!' the unified message out of the corporate news networks was pretty consistent. you can draw your own conclusions as to just how that came to be...
 
2012-10-09 12:10:53 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.


It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.
 
2012-10-09 12:11:12 AM
I bet the guy who thaws out the breadsticks is pissed.
 
2012-10-09 12:11:19 AM

GhostFish: Tea Partiers were generally older and had more net worth.
And they actually tried to change the system by getting people elected.

You don't get real attention by staging sit-ins anymore.
Our culture has absorbed that. That kind of rebellion is sold in stores. It's trite and people don't care about it.


You don't change the system by getting people elected. Never in the whole history of this country has that been a thing that happened; change comes to Washington last, not first. Look at what the Tea Party "accomplished": Nothing. Literally, jack and shiat. They had one good run of quasi-victories and served only to act as a vote-getting apparatus for the Republican party. And now they're nothing.

We're still here. We're still working. And we'll keep at it. You can keep pretending that all we're doing is "sit-ins" if that's what gets you off.
 
2012-10-09 12:11:36 AM

cman: That is Fox News going for ratings. They are targeting a specific base group. By appealing to their base they get the ratings that they want.


Google Roger Ailes and tell me he's just going for ratings.
 
2012-10-09 12:11:53 AM

Weaver95: cman:
Saying that the media were in cahoots with each other to disintegrate OWS by portraying them in a bad light is the definition of a conspiracy.

oh I don't think it was 'organized'. I think the 'average' editor and/or producer at the local levels just decided that making OWS look freaky either suited their personal bias and/or just made better copy. the media higher up tho - THOSE folks have a vested interest in making OWS look bad, and the guys back in the corporate offices sure did their part to make sure that the 11 o'clock news either didn't show any coverage of OWS at all or made sure to manipulate the footage so that only the crazier looking scary people interviews got any air time.

every now and then a bit of the truth got through the corporate filters but most of the coverage was almost universally 'OWS is crazy! OWS is ineffective! OWS has no message! OWS are terrorists!' the unified message out of the corporate news networks was pretty consistent. you can draw your own conclusions as to just how that came to be...


And most coverage about the Tea Party is based on the racists and those who cannot spell. Same damn thing. Read Drews book and you will understand what I am talking about.
 
2012-10-09 12:12:16 AM
Healthy employees at a restaurant? Who needs that?
 
2012-10-09 12:12:33 AM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"

At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.


Really? So where are the following that conservatives have told us would be the result of ObamaCare:

Death panels.
Rationing of care.
Doctors moving out of the country.
Corporations moving out of the country.
People losing their ability to choose their heath insurance provider.
People losing their ability to choose their healthcare provider.
People being thrown in prison for refusing to purchase health insurance.

Being right about one thing so far still puts you at ~13% right, which coincidentally puts you on par with your presidential candidate for accuracy.
 
2012-10-09 12:15:50 AM
Screw that website.
I'm not sorting through 50 of your scripts to figure out which ones will allow your ad-infested abortion of a webpage to become usable.
 
2012-10-09 12:16:16 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.


wasn't the the papa johns guy who said that giving adequate health care to his works would have raised pizza prices a grand total of 14 cents per pizza...? 14 whole cents...and everyone there had adequate health care. I suspect that olive garden is in a similar situation - they could raise prices a couple of cents per menu item and keep people on full time AND still make their health care bills without any problems.

its interesting watching 'good christian' businessmen whine and complain about cutting corporate profits by 1% to give their workers decent health care. I dunno, maybe i'm just strange...but I like to watch heresy corrupt, distort and destroy the modern version of evangelical christianity in this country. the sheer greed of these people...it puts roman emperors and ancient Egyptian pharaohs to shame.
 
2012-10-09 12:17:07 AM

Teufelaffe: The WalMart talking head said that 2% was too much of a "loss."


Cuts into funding for Alice Walton's Crystal Bridges Art Museum. It's tax-deductible.

www.blogcdn.com
 
2012-10-09 12:17:44 AM

cman:
And most coverage about the Tea Party is based on the racists and those who cannot spell. Same damn thing. Read Drews book and you will understand what I am talking about.


I only read the chapter that had my name on it.
 
2012-10-09 12:17:55 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: You can keep pretending that all we're doing is "sit-ins" if that's what gets you off.


I take no pleasure in it. I find it frustrating that all that energy was largely wasted.
I visited a couple Occupy events, and saw nothing but people sitting around and playing music and talking out their asses.

If you've had better luck, good on you.
 
2012-10-09 12:18:40 AM

cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.


I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!
 
2012-10-09 12:19:26 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!


And who are they going to get to replace them? Who's going to be willing to work part-time for no benefits when other companies are hiring full-time with healthcare?
 
2012-10-09 12:19:41 AM

Weaver95: cman:
And most coverage about the Tea Party is based on the racists and those who cannot spell. Same damn thing. Read Drews book and you will understand what I am talking about.

I only read the chapter that had my name on it.


Ha! I knew that bugging Drew for 30 weeks straight would get him to write something defaming you
 
2012-10-09 12:19:58 AM

NFA: Soon America is going to have their fill of the corporate greed and they're going to take to the streets for an American spring. The people will push the corporate reset button and these greedy f*cks will be looking for safe haven in a socialist nations around the globe.


Will never happen
 
2012-10-09 12:20:09 AM

GhostFish: A Dark Evil Omen: You can keep pretending that all we're doing is "sit-ins" if that's what gets you off.

I take no pleasure in it. I find it frustrating that all that energy was largely wasted.
I visited a couple Occupy events, and saw nothing but people sitting around and playing music and talking out their asses.

If you've had better luck, good on you.


considering that the cops promised overwhelming levels of response if OWS so much as THOUGHT about doing anything more than 'just talk' I can understand the reluctance of the average protester to go ranging outside their designated areas.
 
2012-10-09 12:21:00 AM

cman: I am saying that I believe that Rupert Murdock hates MSNBC and would do whatever it can to put them out of business. News networks go for ratings, nothing else.


I disagree. Rupert Murdoch isn't a conservative, he's a businessman. Look at the politics of his British properties such as The Sun. They're overwhelmingly liberal.

Conservatives are the easiest rubes to fool here in the US, hence that's where he's making his money here. The existence of MSNBC does not affect the bottom line of Fox News, since they are targeting different markets. If anything, the existence of a liberal outlet like MSNBC makes the slanting of the news by Fox News more palatable to the average consumer.
 
2012-10-09 12:21:10 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.


It's not a bad thing for bad systems to change.

Olive Garden is just cementing their position as the bad guys by admitting they don't care about their employees.
 
2012-10-09 12:22:17 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!


Blaming this kind of shiat on the "libs" is like the guy who beats his wife saying, "Look what you made me do!" after he hits her. Darden should just man the fark up and be honest, "I don't like the idea of making less profit, and I don't give a flying fark about anyone who works for me, so I'm going to do whatever it takes to keep profits high, no matter what it means to my employees."
 
2012-10-09 12:24:18 AM
This isn't unexpected. This is part of the problem with Obamacare. The program has three main faults:

1) It's needlessly complicated
2) It still leaves millions of people uninsured
3) It doesn't actually do anything to deal with the high cost of health care

The situation in TFA is a combination of fault 1 and fault 2.

Obamacare was a bad idea when the Heritage Foundation invented it (the fact that the Heritage Foundation came up with this plan should have been a red flag to any sensible person that it should be avoided). Obamacare was a bad idea when Romney implemented it in Massachusetts. And, it's a bad idea today.  Sure, it's a better plan than what Republicans are offering...but, it isn't the kind of health care plan a first-world society ought to have.
 
2012-10-09 12:24:35 AM

Rapmaster2000: I bet the guy who thaws out the breadsticks is pissed.


o.aolcdn.com
"You...hab...no...ah...ah..ACHOOO!!!...idea."
 
2012-10-09 12:24:51 AM

eraser8: This isn't unexpected. This is part of the problem with Obamacare. The program has three main faults:

1) It's needlessly complicated
2) It still leaves millions of people uninsured
3) It doesn't actually do anything to deal with the high cost of health care

The situation in TFA is a combination of fault 1 and fault 2.


Please explain each of those.
 
2012-10-09 12:25:12 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!


And then OG hires anyone that walks in the door, service drops to the point where it's worse than the food, consumers vote with their dollars and go to better places, OG's profits tank, and the great nigh mythical shareholder lawsuit comes into play, the CEO gets tarred and feathered and the free market wins again. tada!
 
2012-10-09 12:25:13 AM

Irving Maimway: And this is on top of already reducing labor costs over the past few years? This seems like less issues over health care and more like "We're maximizing profits any way we can."


Well, their legal responsibility is to their shareholders. So yes, they're going to try and maximize profits anyway they can so that their shareholders get the maximum benefit out of their investment.

Especially in a very cost and economic sensitive business such as restaurants (which unless it's niche tends to be very marginal), which in a traditional sit down setting tend to have higher fixed costs because you're stuck with providing an 'experience.' It costs a lot of money to keep the lights on, the place heated/cooled, gas on for the ovens and stoves, and water for food prep; cooking; and sanitation.

This is just the law of unintended consequences playing out to its maximum potential. Darden is just one example; there will be PLENTY of others.
 
2012-10-09 12:26:04 AM
You know, I would gladly pay 20 *cents* more for my breadsticks if it meant Olive Garden employees could have health care. And yes, it really does work out to about 20 cents extra PER MEAL to cover health care costs. 20 farking CENTS.

This whole "We can't afford it!" crap is simply greedy Republican business owners playing politics.

Screw Olive Garden. Not that I ever eat their crappy food.
 
2012-10-09 12:26:35 AM

TheEdibleSnuggie: Well, their legal responsibility is to their shareholders. So yes, they're going to try and maximize profits anyway they can so that their shareholders get the maximum benefit out of their investment.


This is not the way to do that. See:

whither_apophis: And then OG hires anyone that walks in the door, service drops to the point where it's worse than the food, consumers vote with their dollars and go to better places, OG's profits tank, and the great nigh mythical shareholder lawsuit comes into play, the CEO gets tarred and feathered and the free market wins again. tada!

 
2012-10-09 12:27:00 AM

cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!

And who are they going to get to replace them? Who's going to be willing to work part-time for no benefits when other companies are hiring full-time with healthcare?


not to mention the fact that olive garden is teaching younger workers that voting for the GOP isn't going to help their personal bottom line. you make people cold and hungry, they taunt them with a life they can never have...sooner or later they're gonna want to do something about it. you might not like what they decide to do.
 
2012-10-09 12:28:09 AM

Weaver95: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!

And who are they going to get to replace them? Who's going to be willing to work part-time for no benefits when other companies are hiring full-time with healthcare?

not to mention the fact that olive garden is teaching younger workers that voting for the GOP isn't going to help their personal bottom line. you make people cold and hungry, they taunt them with a life they can never have...sooner or later they're gonna want to do something about it. you might not like what they decide to do.


We came unarmed...this time?
 
2012-10-09 12:28:11 AM

ox45tallboy: The Sun. They're overwhelmingly liberal.


Bullshiat. They took a major turn to the right recently. They were also very right in the 1980s.


Can Britain take
five more years
of hard Labour?
Published: 06th May 2010

The Conservatives are the only choice if you want to rescue Britain from disaster.

Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/sun_says/2961073/The-Sun-Say s-David-Cameron-is-our-only-hope.html#ixzz28lyRbA72


Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/sun_says/2961073/The-Sun-Say s-David-Cameron-is-our-only-hope.html#ixzz28ly6sz6W
 
2012-10-09 12:28:57 AM

doglover: It's not a bad thing for bad systems to change.


Who says it was a bad system? To anyone who depended on that job, it was proboly working out pretty well.

Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now.
 
2012-10-09 12:30:02 AM

GhostFish: A Dark Evil Omen: You can keep pretending that all we're doing is "sit-ins" if that's what gets you off.

I take no pleasure in it. I find it frustrating that all that energy was largely wasted.
I visited a couple Occupy events, and saw nothing but people sitting around and playing music and talking out their asses.

If you've had better luck, good on you.


Well, did you bring up any ideas of your own to anyone? Try to set up working groups or even get hooked in with any? I mean, I get where you're coming from in that I've fought with people over trying to be more accessible, but we won't do anything for you.

We're not a political party. We're not a PAC. We're not a charity. We're a social movement.

Here in Seattle we established the People's Library to take up the slack when the SPL was temporarily shut down because some people got together and decided to do it. We did strike support for Davis Wire and for Waste Management because some people got together and decided to do it. We've been working with the Leonard Peltier coalition because some people decided to do it. All the occupations are is a way to bring people together so they can share resources. No one gives orders, everyone gets their voice heard. Yeah, there's a lot of assholes and a lot of bullshiat and a lot of people trying to drain the movement's energy (mostly to turn it into some kind of sad electoral machine, even now that we're no longer flavor-of-the-week). If you can't do that? Well, things are getting worse before they get better. There'll be a lot more things that need fixing and a lot more gaps to fill before it gets any better. Maybe when there's something important to you that's being gutted, stolen or burned to the ground, you'll find those people to talk to.
 
2012-10-09 12:30:26 AM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"


Nobody ever claimed it would save businesses money (except perhaps small business that can get substantial tax credits). If businesses could save money by offering health benefits, they would have already been doing so.

No, this was always certain to cost business money. Just like banning child labor or instituting workplace health & safety regulations cost businesses money. Corporate profits are not the be-all and end-all of civilization.

It will, on the other hand, save money for the nation as a whole.
 
2012-10-09 12:31:09 AM

GhostFish:

We came unarmed...this time?


I think it more likely that the GOP is going to be a price for abandoning everyone under the age of 55. they don't see it right now, because the baby boomers are keeping them afloat. but 10 years? 20 years? there might not BE a Republican party anymore. the way things are trending, the GOP is losing a lot of younger voters and not getting them back. Hell, even Limbaugh is losing his audience. he hasn't picked up any new listeners in a while, just maintained his grip on what he already had. that's the way with most GOP pundits and political organizations. no new blood at all. just the same faces as always.
 
2012-10-09 12:31:20 AM

12349876: The Conservatives are the only choice if you want to rescue Britain from disaster.


If their Conservatives were anything remotely like our Conservatives you might have a point. However, they're not, so you're wrong.
 
2012-10-09 12:32:38 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: doglover: It's not a bad thing for bad systems to change.

Who says it was a bad system? To anyone who depended on that job, it was proboly working out pretty well.

Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now.


Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now but isn't going to have to go bankrupt because they're getting preventive care and don't end up going to the ER.

Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now but can afford to see the doctor about their treatment options.

Tell that to anyone who is going to be on their parents insurance until age 26

Tell that to anyone who is going to be getting insurance even though they have a "pre-existing condition"
 
2012-10-09 12:33:12 AM

Weaver95: not to mention the fact that olive garden is teaching younger workers that voting for the GOP isn't going to help their personal bottom line


Or that voting for big government and massive regualations will cause buisnesses to do what they can to watch thier bottom line.

If I were an impressable young college student cuaght up in the "Hope and Change" working there, that is what i would take away from it.
 
2012-10-09 12:33:13 AM

ox45tallboy: 12349876: The Conservatives are the only choice if you want to rescue Britain from disaster.

If their Conservatives were anything remotely like our Conservatives you might have a point. However, they're not, so you're wrong.


Point

You
 
2012-10-09 12:33:30 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: doglover: It's not a bad thing for bad systems to change.

Who says it was a bad system? To anyone who depended on that job, it was proboly working out pretty well.

Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now.


what's weird is that you really don't seem to understand that voters know they're taking a pay cut so that the CEOs and corporate insiders can add more money to the massive piles of cash they've already got...
 
2012-10-09 12:33:48 AM
Helooooooooooooo universal single-payer!
 
2012-10-09 12:33:49 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: Weaver95: not to mention the fact that olive garden is teaching younger workers that voting for the GOP isn't going to help their personal bottom line

Or that voting for big government and massive regualations will cause buisnesses to do what they can to watch thier bottom line.

If I were an impressable young college student cuaght up in the "Hope and Change" working there, that is what i would take away from it.


If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.
 
2012-10-09 12:34:34 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: Weaver95: not to mention the fact that olive garden is teaching younger workers that voting for the GOP isn't going to help their personal bottom line

Or that voting for big government and massive regualations will cause buisnesses to do what they can to watch thier bottom line.

If I were an impressable young college student cuaght up in the "Hope and Change" working there, that is what i would take away from it.


well, then you'd not be a very observant student. also - spell check is your friend. just sayin' is all.
 
2012-10-09 12:35:03 AM

cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: Well, their legal responsibility is to their shareholders. So yes, they're going to try and maximize profits anyway they can so that their shareholders get the maximum benefit out of their investment.

This is not the way to do that. See:

whither_apophis: And then OG hires anyone that walks in the door, service drops to the point where it's worse than the food, consumers vote with their dollars and go to better places, OG's profits tank, and the great nigh mythical shareholder lawsuit comes into play, the CEO gets tarred and feathered and the free market wins again. tada!


But that won't happen though. Essentially you'll have restaurants getting into price wars with one another until one chain either a) goes out of business, or b) is absorbed by another chain; business life cycle starts all over again. Either that, or Darden will start to scale back the number of restaurants it owns until they're dominant in several key markets, and they'll focus on that.

Plus, chances are you're probably eating at a Darden owned establishment and don't even know about it. So if Olive Garden starts tanking, they'll just focus operations on a high margin business like Red Lobster or recycle the food at Bahama Breeze.
 
2012-10-09 12:35:31 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: doglover: It's not a bad thing for bad systems to change.

Who says it was a bad system? To anyone who depended on that job, it was proboly working out pretty well.

Tell that to anyone who is going to have less to take home now.


It's obviously still a bad system if Olive Garden can even consider a plan like this.
 
2012-10-09 12:36:18 AM

TheEdibleSnuggie: cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: Well, their legal responsibility is to their shareholders. So yes, they're going to try and maximize profits anyway they can so that their shareholders get the maximum benefit out of their investment.

This is not the way to do that. See:

whither_apophis: And then OG hires anyone that walks in the door, service drops to the point where it's worse than the food, consumers vote with their dollars and go to better places, OG's profits tank, and the great nigh mythical shareholder lawsuit comes into play, the CEO gets tarred and feathered and the free market wins again. tada!

But that won't happen though. Essentially you'll have restaurants getting into price wars with one another until one chain either a) goes out of business, or b) is absorbed by another chain; business life cycle starts all over again. Either that, or Darden will start to scale back the number of restaurants it owns until they're dominant in several key markets, and they'll focus on that.

Plus, chances are you're probably eating at a Darden owned establishment and don't even know about it. So if Olive Garden starts tanking, they'll just focus operations on a high margin business like Red Lobster or recycle the food at Bahama Breeze.


And in the meantime, their workers are going to places that provide health insurance.
 
2012-10-09 12:36:28 AM
And with respect to TFA: The Olive Garden is an evil, soulless corporation that no one should ever give their money to? THE FARKING HELL YOU SAY.
 
2012-10-09 12:36:31 AM

ox45tallboy: 12349876: The Conservatives are the only choice if you want to rescue Britain from disaster.

If their Conservatives were anything remotely like our Conservatives you might have a point. However, they're not, so you're wrong.


Their Conservatives aren't anything remotely like liberals either, so your assertion that The Sun is "overwhelmingly liberal" is still pants-on-head retarded.
 
2012-10-09 12:37:05 AM

Teufelaffe: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: Free_Chilly_Willy: And so the gradual degradation of American businesses begins.

It's the f*cking Olive Garden. Like it was the classiest joint to begin with.

I'll be sure to tell that the waiters/cooks/hostesses/young people who will lose thier jobs and/or be cut hours because of this.

Great job libs!!!

Blaming this kind of shiat on the "libs" is like the guy who beats his wife saying, "Look what you made me do!" after he hits her. Darden should just man the fark up and be honest, "I don't like the idea of making less profit, and I don't give a flying fark about anyone who works for me, so I'm going to do whatever it takes to keep profits high, no matter what it means to my employees."


I expect the CEO to be on "Undercover boss" to try and cover their ass.

/the most ridiculous piece of propaganda foisted on the American public since John Stossel reported on ... well, anything.
 
2012-10-09 12:37:36 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

They don't have to take the job if they aren't willing to agree to the terms of employment.


Were those same terms applied to shilling, or whatever it is you actually do for a living, and the only gig you could find was one that retained a portion of your income for utterly arbitrary reasons - would you still hold that opinion?

Some restaurants require a "tip out" to the house in the amount of the fees incurred by credit cards. That's correct - rather than eat the cost of their own payment method they dink the server for it. And at chain restaurants like Darden's, those servers don't make dick (it's not like working at a nice steakhouse where every table averages well over $100). These folks are lucky to make $70 after busting their ass for a fat-ass American public that always needs four extra sides of ranch and 7 root beers only because the refills are free.

If you think this is appropriate, or your only answer is "that person can refuse employment even though it's the only job available," well, you can just fark right off.

/and if you are a paid shill (as you joked you were), you're not even good at it. The idea is to pay shills to influence opinion, not galvanize the internet's hatred of Republicans. Maybe you should try waiting tables at a Darden restaurant.
 
2012-10-09 12:38:02 AM

cman: A Dark Evil Omen: Weaver95: um...it's not a conspiracy. the corporate news folks simply manipulated the way the portrayed OWS to the nation. you saw plenty of heavily pierced and tattooed freaks with hippie hair and tie dyed shirts...but very few interviews that covered the basics of what OWS was doing. let alone the cops administering the occasional beat down on anyone who looked like they might be a protester. 'average america' never got to see what was being done in their name.

Yep. There were a number of times where reports spoke to people at Westlake and SCCC when the camps were still up, got lots of good, intelligent responses and then used whatever the dumbest, weirdest-looking person they could find said.

Compare that to the kid-glove treatment the Tea Party got. Hell, still gets!

You see that because you want to see that. OWS and Tea Party both got thrashed in the media. Since OWS is your side, you want to fit whatever you can to make you feel like the other side has an unfair advantage. Guess what? The Tea Party thinks exactly the same way as you do. They think that OWS has gotten a free pass while the Tea Party has been hammered week after week in the news.

We see what we only want to see. We create our own reality. If you sat back and actually watched you would see that news networks care about showing morons. Hell, Drew Curtis wrote a damn book about it.


Find me some tea partier's that were beaten by the police. Keep in mind they brought guns.
 
2012-10-09 12:38:44 AM

A Dark Evil Omen: And with respect to TFA: The Olive Garden is an evil, soulless corporation that no one should ever give their money to? THE FARKING HELL YOU SAY.


ya know, I don't mind working for an evil corporation...I just expect to be well paid for my efforts. i'm more than happy to help destroy the environment, pillage natural resources and rape the earth 'till it bleeds...but I want double time for working holidays, a decent medical plan AND a profit sharing arrangement.
 
2012-10-09 12:39:01 AM

cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.


If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....
 
2012-10-09 12:40:49 AM
Sounds like Obama needs to give another inspiring speech so reality will go away.
 
2012-10-09 12:40:52 AM

Weaver95: GhostFish:

We came unarmed...this time?

I think it more likely that the GOP is going to be a price for abandoning everyone under the age of 55. they don't see it right now, because the baby boomers are keeping them afloat. but 10 years? 20 years? there might not BE a Republican party anymore. the way things are trending, the GOP is losing a lot of younger voters and not getting them back. Hell, even Limbaugh is losing his audience. he hasn't picked up any new listeners in a while, just maintained his grip on what he already had. that's the way with most GOP pundits and political organizations. no new blood at all. just the same faces as always.


When the demographic shift is needed, they can switch over to paying more lip-service to the "libertarians" and Paulites and reap a healthy crop of new voters. Just look how easily they reabsorbed the Tea Party before it could fully break away. And now the Tea Party is ready and willing to vote the Neocons back into power, despite the fact that they are absolutely to blame for everything that the Tea Party was railing against. The GOP adapts well when it needs to. It's run by a lot of guys who know how to manipulate people. And there are plenty of younger guys that want to take those higher positions when the torch needs to be passed.
 
2012-10-09 12:40:56 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....


I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?
 
2012-10-09 12:41:36 AM

Notabunny: Helooooooooooooo universal single-payer nurse!


jackiesramblings.com
 
2012-10-09 12:41:46 AM

Weaver95: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....

I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?


IE6 most likely
 
2012-10-09 12:43:44 AM

Teufelaffe: Their Conservatives aren't anything remotely like liberals either, so your assertion that The Sun is "overwhelmingly liberal" is still pants-on-head retarded.


Yes, you go on thinking that.

/pats you on the head
 
2012-10-09 12:43:58 AM

GhostFish:

When the demographic shift is needed, they can switch over to paying more lip-service to the "libertarians" and Paulites and reap a healthy crop of new voters. Just look how easily they reabsorbed the Tea Party before it could fully break away. And now the Tea Party is ready and willing to vote the Neocons back into power, despite the fact that they are absolutely to blame for everything that the Tea Party was railing against. The GOP adapts well when it needs to. It's run by a lot of guys who know how to manipulate people. And there are plenty of younger guys that want to take those higher positions when the torch needs to be passed.


I don't think so. the GOP is having a LOT of problems adapting to newer technologies. the younger voter crowd uses social media a LOT - not just to find new ideas and communicate amongst themselves but to fact check their party and research their own answers to questions they think are important. the GOP, on the other hand, seems barely aware of the impact that 'net has on their message and actually told voters to ignore fact checkers as being 'irrelevant'. I don't think the Republicans are going to be able to bring younger voters into the party in any significant number. they've damaged their brand almost to the point of no return.
 
2012-10-09 12:44:39 AM

cameroncrazy1984: 1) It's needlessly complicated
2) It still leaves millions of people uninsured
3) It doesn't actually do anything to deal with the high cost of health care

The situation in TFA is a combination of fault 1 and fault 2.

Please explain each of those.


1) Needless complication: it's a patchwork of private employer-based care, government-run exchanges for private insurance, expanded government-funded healthcare (Medicaid), and so forth. Each kind of coverage is very different from the others but they all have to be overseen by government to insure that they're working. A far simpler system would have been universal single payer -- you know, the kind of health care civilized countries have.

2) Millions left uninsured: From the CBO (PDF doc): Estimates for the Insurance Coverage Provisions of the Affordable Care Act Updated for the Recent Supreme Court Decision, Page 13:
CBO and JCT now estimate that the ACA, in comparison with prior law before the enactment of the ACA, will reduce the number of nonelderly people without health insurance coverage by 14 million in 2014 and by 29 million or 30 million in the latter part of the coming decade, leaving 30 million nonelderly residents uninsured by the end of the period (see Table 3, at the end of this report). Before the Supreme Court's decision, the latter number had been 27 million.

cameroncrazy1984: 3) It doesn't actually do anything to deal with the high cost of health care:

Health care costs in Massachusetts haven't gone down. In fact, just this summer, Massachusetts enacted a new law to tackle health care costs because (from ABC News):
Paying for health care is not a problem unique to Massachusetts. But if expanding coverage is supposed to drive down costs in the long term, as advocates of health reform have suggested, it's an after-effect not yet felt in Massachusetts. Since the law was passed in 2006, per-capita spending on health care in the state has increased to 15 percent higher than the national average and health insurance premiums have skyrocketed to one of the highest in the nation, according to a study by the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation.
And, interestingly, one of the most costly parts of healthcare has increased: use of emergency department resources. As the Boston Globe noted: Emergency room visits grow in Mass; New insurance law did not reduce number of users
 
2012-10-09 12:44:40 AM

Weaver95: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....

I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?


Mainly alcohol.
 
2012-10-09 12:44:46 AM

cman: Weaver95: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....

I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?

IE6 most likely


ugh. who does that to themselves!? I mean really....seek professional mental help.
 
2012-10-09 12:45:46 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: Weaver95: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....

I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?

Mainly alcohol.


ok, being drunk is far more acceptable than using IE6.
 
2012-10-09 12:46:35 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....


But then why wouldn't they just buy it on the exchange?
 
2012-10-09 12:46:59 AM

Weaver95: cman: Weaver95: Free_Chilly_Willy: cameroncrazy1984: If you were an impressable [sic] young college student you'd be covered under your parents' insurance.

If THEY havent lost thier own insurence because thier bosses have decided just to pay the fee....

I find your lack of spell check to be distracting. are you really this bad, or are you doing it on purpose?

IE6 most likely

ugh. who does that to themselves!? I mean really....seek professional mental help.


On a somewhat related note, whenever I see your name I always think of Windows 95

And yes, IE6 is a terrible, terrible thing
 
2012-10-09 12:47:02 AM

Weaver95: ok, being drunk is far more acceptable than using IE6.


Didn't say drunk. I said mainly alcohol.
 
2012-10-09 12:47:27 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: and people are surprised by this, why?

businesses have stated that it is easier for them to ditch people's health care and pay the fine (for those full time) or to just shift more people to part time.


"But but but...I told them they could keep their current plans if they wanted to!" - Obama
 
2012-10-09 12:49:17 AM

Weaver95: GhostFish:

When the demographic shift is needed, they can switch over to paying more lip-service to the "libertarians" and Paulites and reap a healthy crop of new voters. Just look how easily they reabsorbed the Tea Party before it could fully break away. And now the Tea Party is ready and willing to vote the Neocons back into power, despite the fact that they are absolutely to blame for everything that the Tea Party was railing against. The GOP adapts well when it needs to. It's run by a lot of guys who know how to manipulate people. And there are plenty of younger guys that want to take those higher positions when the torch needs to be passed.

I don't think so. the GOP is having a LOT of problems adapting to newer technologies. the younger voter crowd uses social media a LOT - not just to find new ideas and communicate amongst themselves but to fact check their party and research their own answers to questions they think are important. the GOP, on the other hand, seems barely aware of the impact that 'net has on their message and actually told voters to ignore fact checkers as being 'irrelevant'. I don't think the Republicans are going to be able to bring younger voters into the party in any significant number. they've damaged their brand almost to the point of no return.


There are a lot of younger people that are goo-goo over Ron Paul and Gary Johnson. And the majority of them, despite constant internet access, couldn't find their asses with their own hands. Sorry to say that the low information, "I know what I believe and don't need to listen to you" voters are still out there in the younger demographics.

They will certainly sign up with the GOP if someone can market it to them well.
 
2012-10-09 12:50:20 AM

Free_Chilly_Willy: Didn't say drunk. I said mainly alcohol.


Still more acceptable than IE6.
 
2012-10-09 12:50:29 AM
ox45tallboy

Smartest
Funniest
2012-10-08 09:19:07 PM
fusillade762: Analysts said limiting hours could pose new challenges, including higher turnover and less-qualified workers.

What could possibly go wrong?

Not to mention competing against other restaurants that provide health insurance, so the employees aren't stuck trying to get it on the exchanges.


What makes you think that any of the restaurants that compete in Olive Garden's price bracket won't do the same thing? Actually only a few will have to change to adopt this business model. Most of them have always hired part timers only with no benefits.
 
2012-10-09 12:52:39 AM
They can pass whatever the fark they want, I'm still not going to be forced to buy insurance. Sorry, but I like to eat. I haven't had a job with insurance since 1986 or something and I haven't missed it once.
 
2012-10-09 12:52:50 AM
As if I needed another reason not to go to olive garden.
 
2012-10-09 12:54:19 AM

cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: Well, their legal responsibility is to their shareholders. So yes, they're going to try and maximize profits anyway they can so that their shareholders get the maximum benefit out of their investment.

This is not the way to do that. See:

whither_apophis: And then OG hires anyone that walks in the door, service drops to the point where it's worse than the food, consumers vote with their dollars and go to better places, OG's profits tank, and the great nigh mythical shareholder lawsuit comes into play, the CEO gets tarred and feathered and the free market wins again. tada!

But that won't happen though. Essentially you'll have restaurants getting into price wars with one another until one chain either a) goes out of business, or b) is absorbed by another chain; business life cycle starts all over again. Either that, or Darden will start to scale back the number of restaurants it owns until they're dominant in several key markets, and they'll focus on that.

Plus, chances are you're probably eating at a Darden owned establishment and don't even know about it. So if Olive Garden starts tanking, they'll just focus operations on a high margin business like Red Lobster or recycle the food at Bahama Breeze.

And in the meantime, their workers are going to places that provide health insurance.



I wouldn't be so sure of that either. Because those jobs will eventually end up being at a premium as businesses who now must comply with the new rule scale back their hiring or promotion of employees to even out costs. Some money coming in is better than no money, especially if you have bills or other obligations that must be paid in a timely fashion every month.

If I sound a bit cynical with all of this it's only because I've worked in or closely with HR/ Personnel and Finance/ Payroll departments; I've seen these type of patterns before.
 
2012-10-09 12:56:03 AM

eraser8: 1) Needless complication: it's a patchwork of private employer-based care, government-run exchanges for private insurance, expanded government-funded healthcare (Medicaid), and so forth. Each kind of coverage is very different from the others but they all have to be overseen by government to insure that they're working. A far simpler system would have been universal single payer -- you know, the kind of health care civilized countries have.


This is no different at all than the current state; it's not a step backwards, just not a step forwards, either. For how violently the Republicans attacked a public option, good luck seeing single payer any time in this century.

2) Millions left uninsured: From the CBO (PDF doc): Estimates for the Insurance Coverage Provisions of the Affordable Care Act Updated for the Recent Supreme Court Decision, Page 13:

There's a difference between people being voluntarily uninsured, and being involuntarily uninsured. Beyond those affected by the Supreme Court rejecting the Medicaid expansion, most of the remaining uninsured are voluntarily opting to be uninsured.
 
2012-10-09 12:56:12 AM

TheEdibleSnuggie: Because those jobs will eventually end up being at a premium as businesses who now must comply with the new rule scale back their hiring or promotion of employees to even out costs


Why would they do that? Will demand suddenly decrease because people are now required to have healthcare? If so, why?
 
2012-10-09 12:56:54 AM

Sum Dum Gai: There's a difference between people being voluntarily uninsured, and being involuntarily uninsured. Beyond those affected by the Supreme Court rejecting the Medicaid expansion, most of the remaining uninsured are voluntarily opting to be uninsured.


And, according to that same paper, the number of uninsured will go from 80% to 92%.
 
2012-10-09 01:00:10 AM
Hey, at least part time jobs count as jobs so no change in the unemployment numbers.

Yay for all this hope and change!
 
2012-10-09 01:00:37 AM

ox45tallboy: Teufelaffe: Their Conservatives aren't anything remotely like liberals either, so your assertion that The Sun is "overwhelmingly liberal" is still pants-on-head retarded.

Yes, you go on thinking that.

/pats you on the head


Really? You're going to run with the "UK Conservative party is liberal"? Let's look at some of what they're about:

Against multiculturalism
Support the war in Afghanistan
Against minimum wage
Support increased defense spending

While they have no direct equivalent to US political parties, they're not fecking liberals by any stretch of the imagination. The Sun, in 2009, dropped their support for the Labour Party and started rooting for the Conservative party. The paper might have been "overwhelmingly liberal" before then, but they sure as hell aren't now.
 
2012-10-09 01:01:48 AM

YELLOL: Hey, at least part time jobs count as jobs so no change in the unemployment numbers.

Yay for all this hope and change!


That's what you're coming up with?

So weak.
 
2012-10-09 01:03:33 AM

itsdan: Also, you're allowed to pay them what like $2/hr as servers and you still can't afford a cheap plan that just barely meets the coverage requirements?


That depends on the state. Some do not allow you to go below federal minimum wage, not including tips.
 
2012-10-09 01:06:24 AM
Decouple insurance from employment. Single payer... NOW
 
2012-10-09 01:06:57 AM
There's something everyone is missing here.

Let's assume Darden Restaurants and all the other douchebag businesses actually cut hours in order to avoid Obamacare. What happens?

1) Lots of employees get pissed at business owners who cut their hours because they're too damn cheap to provide Obamacare.
2) Businesses have to hire MORE people (albeit at fewer hours a week) to make up for the cuts .
3) UNEMPLOYMENT DROPS/MORE PEOPLE IN THE LABOR FORCE
4) Obama now looks awesome on the economy (Hey! See that unemployment figure dropping!)
5) People get pissed at the Mitt Romneys who own/run these businesses for playing these dick games
6) Obama scores again with people who are tired of the Mitt Romney-style "I've got mine so screw you!" management and operation of businesses.
7) Since it's predominantly a younger generation working these jobs (HS/college kids), a large number of people are going to realize who the good guys are (Obama and the Dems, who want them to have nice things like health care, sick time off, a job that doesn't suck) and who the bad guys are (Romney and the GOP, who play these games of cutting hours and such so they can buy another house with a car elevator, a dancing horse, and turn all the rest of the money over to their rich friends by way of dividends to the shareholders)
8) Massive GOP rage face and butthurt as they've now lost yet another generation of voters and made Obama and the Dems look good twice over.

If Darden Restaurants and the other companies actually bite the bullet and swallow Obamacare:

1) Staff get healthcare
2) Obama scores with workers who can suddenly afford to go to the doctor
3) Businesses actually get some more productivity because the employees aren't sick
4) Executives/owners/shareholders rage-face because they can't take as big a pay raise or cash-out on stock as they wanted.
5) Doom and gloom fail to happen, thus undermining the GOP message
6) GOP rage-face and butthurt as they're now shown to cry wolf and they've now lost more voters

Conclusion: Obama is not only a master troll, he has over 9000 ranks in 3-D Troll Chess, and the GOP needs to decide whether or not they want to keep playing until the only move left for them is to flip the table and storm out, or if they want to shake hands, say "well played, sir", and spend some time learning a new strategy that doesn't involve sticking one foot in their mouth while shooting themselves in the other.
 
2012-10-09 01:07:26 AM

cameroncrazy1984: YELLOL: Hey, at least part time jobs count as jobs so no change in the unemployment numbers.

Yay for all this hope and change!

That's what you're coming up with?

So weak.


This is YELLOL we're talking about. If he said something witty it would be out of character.
 
2012-10-09 01:08:13 AM

Sum Dum Gai: This is no different at all than the current state; it's not a step backwards, just not a step forwards, either. For how violently the Republicans attacked a public option, good luck seeing single payer any time in this century.


So, 900 pages of legislation to give us a system that just as screwed up as the one we have now? Well, that changes my view completely.

And, the Republicans attack everything violently. It's in their nature. With them, it's in for a penny, in for a pound. The president and the Democrats should have known that and shouldn't have accommodated them when they weren't going to get anything in return in any case.

Sum Dum Gai: There's a difference between people being voluntarily uninsured, and being involuntarily uninsured. Beyond those affected by the Supreme Court rejecting the Medicaid expansion, most of the remaining uninsured are voluntarily opting to be uninsured.


Even if we just restrict it to those affected by the Medicaid issue, that's still 3 million people. I think everyone ought to have access to health care. Obamacare doesn't give it to them.
 
2012-10-09 01:09:03 AM

ox45tallboy: Dead for Tax Reasons: So olive garden is going to suck even more now?

Is that possible?

Well, look at this way. Other restaurants will soon have cooks and servers that have health care for a change. Olive Garden servers and cooks will still not have health care. Which group of people would you rather have handling your food?


As far as I'm concerned, they should do it. One of the killers in the food industry is turnover and associated training costs. Go ahead and make your place pay less than everywhere else, and don't even give people full-time status just to save a buck by denying them benefits. See what that does for:
A) Turnover
B) The quality of your applicant pool

They're begging to become a stepping stone that incurs much of the expense of training entry-level waitstaff and bartenders for other restaurants to poach. That'll do wonders for service and customer satisfaction.
 
2012-10-09 01:09:10 AM

null: Obama is not only a master troll, he has over 9000 ranks in 3-D Troll Chess


He's not going to sleep with you.
 
2012-10-09 01:10:04 AM

cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: Because those jobs will eventually end up being at a premium as businesses who now must comply with the new rule scale back their hiring or promotion of employees to even out costs

Why would they do that? Will demand suddenly decrease because people are now required to have healthcare? If so, why?



I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars), without wanting to lay off a bunch of people-- the natural thing to do if you're a business owner is to slow the pace at which you acquire and promote employees for your business. That inevitably creates scarcity in the job market as you suddenly have thousands of potential employees applying for jobs that are there, but won't be filled because the acquisition, training, and retention costs have become too high for the employer to provide for those wishing to have full-time benefits.
 
2012-10-09 01:12:59 AM

TheEdibleSnuggie: I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars),


Someone upthread said OG would have to raise their prices by 20 cents per meal. But they'd rather let their service suffer than charge 20 cents extra. And they will, and it will.
 
2012-10-09 01:17:08 AM

cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars),

Someone upthread said OG would have to raise their prices by 20 cents per meal. But they'd rather let their service suffer than charge 20 cents extra. And they will, and it will.


I am curious, how sure is OG about the $.20 figure? I wonder how anyone could calculate the impact on their business.

/Not trying to start a debate, asking a question on how ObamaCare is taken into account
 
2012-10-09 01:19:49 AM

cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars),

Someone upthread said OG would have to raise their prices by 20 cents per meal. But they'd rather let their service suffer than charge 20 cents extra. And they will, and it will.


The major airlines have been doing that for the last decade or so; the fact restaurants might be/ already are doing it surprises me very little tbh...I almost expect it.
 
2012-10-09 01:21:58 AM

cman: cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars),

Someone upthread said OG would have to raise their prices by 20 cents per meal. But they'd rather let their service suffer than charge 20 cents extra. And they will, and it will.

I am curious, how sure is OG about the $.20 figure? I wonder how anyone could calculate the impact on their business.

/Not trying to start a debate, asking a question on how ObamaCare is taken into account


No idea, and no idea where that figure came from.
I do recall that the founder of Papa John's said that per pizza prices will need to go up about 14 cents to compensate for Obamacare.

I think the general reaction to that was, "So why the fark haven't you been doing it all along?!"
 
2012-10-09 01:25:42 AM

GhostFish: cman: cameroncrazy1984: TheEdibleSnuggie: I never said demand would decrease...As a matter of fact it'd do the exact opposite. Considering that healthcare is an escalating cost for most, if not all employers- if you're trying to control costs without significantly increasing the prices at which you do business (which negatively affect the business as we've already established that consumers choose with their dollars),

Someone upthread said OG would have to raise their prices by 20 cents per meal. But they'd rather let their service suffer than charge 20 cents extra. And they will, and it will.

I am curious, how sure is OG about the $.20 figure? I wonder how anyone could calculate the impact on their business.

/Not trying to start a debate, asking a question on how ObamaCare is taken into account

No idea, and no idea where that figure came from.
I do recall that the founder of Papa John's said that per pizza prices will need to go up about 14 cents to compensate for Obamacare.

I think the general reaction to that was, "So why the fark haven't you been doing it all along?!"


Obamacare is supposed to be free, duh.
 
2012-10-09 01:31:22 AM

GhostFish: They will certainly sign up with the GOP if someone can market it to them well.


GOP Spokesperson Auditions, Take 1:

images.politico.com
"You see, the America I believe in is one that we all can enjoy, praising God and living to His Glory..."

i2.cdn.turner.com
"Okay, a little too much Jesus there. The new generation isn't quite so religious. Next!"

a.abcnews.com
"How about... a MOON BASE! It'll be AWESOME!"

images.businessweek.com
"I thought we told you to retire, Newt. Next!"

www.addictinginfo.org
"See, the America that I love is complete with Americans that I love even more. And if we all adhere to the principles of small government, except when it comes to our sex lives, then we can still beat the Russians!"

wonkette.com
"Miss Bachmann, have you had your meds today?"

3.bp.blogspot.com
"Of course I have! And it's Misses Bachmann!"

images.politico.com
"But...um...nevermind. Next!"

ionenewsone.files.wordpress.com
"I'm not going to get this, am I?"

farm6.staticflickr.com
"Ha-hah...No. Next!"

allenwestrepublic.files.wordpress.com
"Hey, I'm Allen! I'm conservative!"

cfo-dailyreport.com
"Who the f*ck let him in here?"

netrightdaily.com
"I have the ability to speak to whatever or whomever needs to be spoken to. I can be in favor of tax cuts to the wealthy and expansion of government military spending. I can institute an assault weapons ban and still get the NRA's endorsement. I can kill off Social Security and still get grandparents to support me. I can sell anyone on anything. I can be all things to all people!"

www.nypost.com
"Yes, but you're going to get your ass handed to you in the election. People like winners!"
 
2012-10-09 01:37:27 AM

Teufelaffe: Really? You're going to run with the "UK Conservative party is liberal"? Let's look at some of what they're about:

Against multiculturalism
Support the war in Afghanistan
Against minimum wage
Support increased defense spending

While they have no direct equivalent to US political parties, they're not fecking liberals by any stretch of the imagination. The Sun, in 2009, dropped their support for the Labour Party and started rooting for the Conservative party. The paper might have been "overwhelmingly liberal" before then, but they sure as hell aren't now.


Pro-socialized medicine
Pro-gay marriage
Anti-centralized banking
Pro-foreign aid

You were saying?

I think the problem with your perception is that although the UK conservatives are to the right of Labour on many issues, they are still slightly to the Left of US Democrats.
 
2012-10-09 01:42:33 AM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.


this is illegal, and should be reported.
 
2012-10-09 01:46:52 AM

Kazan: this is illegal, and should be reported.


Of course. But do you know what happens if it gets reported?

The manager gets fired. The manager who is also my sister's friend. And then they fire my sister for whatever reason they come up with. And then they put in another manager who does the same damn thing again, and keep them in place until someone else complains.

The people in charge of this policy will never, ever, see any consequences, only profit. They're insulated from the wrongdoing better than Stringer Bell on The Wire.
 
2012-10-09 01:52:04 AM

BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?


It's common practice(And totally legal) for a lot of restaurants to require servers to tip out the bartenders. It's supposed to be because the bartenders make the servers' drinks for their tables, which is a part of the overall meal, and therefore a part of the overall tip. It's a bullshiat move, because a bartender will let your drinks wait while they pay attention to their customers at the bar, and while they get tipped at the bar for getting their customers drinks quickly, not letting a drink go empty without checking to see if the customer needs a refill, and basically paying enough attention that good tippers get priority, and some poor schlub who kind of blends in or keeps getting cut on in line finally gets to order, for the servers, it's part of the job description and not really optional.

Tipping bussers and food runners is one thing. In certain restaurants(In others, it's bullshiat), but tipping the bar is just an excuse for the establishment to pay these guys left, and not having to retrain new ones every week. I'd bet that the bar is the most training-intensive position, even more so than the cook's line.

To me, it's just another restaurant chain to mark off of my list(I almost never go there anyway). I worked far too much of my life in the food service industry to not notice when one of these chains starts whining about how hard it is to pay people to do some of the most under appreciated work in the country. Bucca Di Beppo is also on my list for being the main cheerleader fighting to keep paying servers the crap wages they currently pay. There's room for these Darden restaurants on my list, too, although my wife will be rather disappointed about the Red Lobster decision. Not living on the coast, they really are one of the best choices for seafood. Luckily they also made the brilliant decision to cut a bunch of seafood from their menu, so there's that...
 
2012-10-09 01:55:04 AM

itsdan: I don't think you should be able to offer unlimited soup/salad/breadsticks and then cry poor.


Interesting point. Hadn't thought of that one... I'm tired of restaurants talking like they over pay dishwashers who have to grub out floor sinks, and servers who make $2.13/hr, even when they are not on the floor(Such as setting up for opening and doing sidework), it's a hard claim to swallow when you look at how hard these people work, and how little they earn. Since it's usually kids, or people under 25, nobody cares about the worker though.
 
2012-10-09 02:00:34 AM

ox45tallboy: Every restaurant that has a bar I've ever worked in does this...


Yet the bar gets to keep 100% of their tips, with the exception of the busboy. You have a shiatty night, you still have to give them some of your non-existant money. They have a shiatty night, it's all good.
 
2012-10-09 02:01:48 AM
Tying healthcare to employment was stupid idea.
 
2012-10-09 02:02:46 AM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.




Home Depot tried that briefly when I worked there in high school, it worked great...until they ran out of cashiers. You get your overtime pay when the alternative is the store managers start having to work the front end. They still had to cover breaks. I liked our store managers though, HR...well they can get farked, store managers were cool. That was a good high school job, calculated it one week my average hourly wage was $19/hour, once you counted overtime, stupid little promotions they offer, and such. That was a good summer, although a little farked up that if I don't count travel I made more money that year than I do now. Oh well, travel makes up a lot.
 
2012-10-09 02:03:17 AM

ox45tallboy: AT APPLEBEE'S WE TAKE PRIDE IN PROVIDING THE BEST HEALTH CARE IN THE INDUSTRY FOR OUR BEST RESOURCE - OUR PEOPLE!


Applebee's was the most soul-sucking place I ever worked. They claimed they really cared, they told you over and over and over when you worked there, but they didn't give two squirts about you.
 
2012-10-09 02:04:42 AM

nmemkha: Tying healthcare to employment was stupid idea.


Not for the corporations that make you think twice before quitting when they come up with a new way to cut costs.
 
2012-10-09 02:08:37 AM

penthesilea: My sister works for Olive Garden. If she asks for the day off because she's really sick they tell her no. They'll fire her. She tries to wash her hands as much as possible to keep from passing colds/illness to the customers, but that takes time and management get pissed if the staff isn't moving things along as quickly as possible.


This^^^

I was extremely sick one night when I worked at Applebee's(Yes, different restaurant, but same idea). I went in the bathroom and threw up, still had to work 4 more hours. My tables all asked me from the beginning if everything was all right because I looked like shiat. I explained to every single table that I had been sick, and they wouldn't let me leave. The reason that it's significant that I threw up is that I am phobic about it. So much that I can remember the last date I threw up(It comes from when I was a kid and panicked because I couldn't breathe while it happened). The last date was October 30, 2010, and was the night I went to the hospital for pancreatitis. When you can actually point to a calendar and show the last time you vomited, doing it out of the blue usually means something not good. They didn't care, they never let anyone go home who was sick, regardless of concern for the customers.

On the other hand, I made some of my highest tips ever that night. Pity tips pay a great percentage.
 
2012-10-09 02:09:48 AM

Mikey1969: Applebee's was the most soul-sucking place I ever worked. They claimed they really cared, they told you over and over and over when you worked there, but they didn't give two squirts about you.


I quit Ruby Tuesday's after I saw a piece of paper the manager was filling out. This was an actual form from the corporate office. It listed the number of cooks, servers, hostesses, busboys, etc. needed for each and every meal, then, at the bottom, it said,

"TOTAL NUMBER OF WARM BODIES NEEDED FOR EACH SHIFT".

That's all we were to the corporate office - a warm body necessary to make all the "efficiency" studies pan out. Never mind how good at their job anyone was, as long as the manager had the requisite number of "warm bodies", then corporate should be seeing the money flowing in. Sure, maybe someone creating the form had a sense of humor, but the fact was, it wasn't funny because that's how they actually felt.
 
2012-10-09 02:10:36 AM
Olive Garden:

If you can't get your sh*t together in the accounting department to provide for a full time staff at your various franchises nationwide?

You shouldn't be in business. Period.

End of story.
 
2012-10-09 02:11:06 AM

Mikey1969: On the other hand, I made some of my highest tips ever that night. Pity tips pay a great percentage.


No kidding. Try taking a baby around with you to your tables. I made bank that night.
 
2012-10-09 02:11:35 AM
As a Hawaii resident and former state employee, this doesn't surprise me in the least.

Everyone knows Hawaii's had a great healthcare law since the 1970s. Every employer is required to offer health insurance (not for free or anything, but on some terms) to every employee who works more than half-time. So, sure enough, there are tons of people averaging 19.5 hours a week or less. Including state employees. Basically this goes on until you can get some job, any job, working more than 20 hours a week.
 
2012-10-09 02:13:25 AM

Elandriel: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Making them share tips with the bartenders, who had their pay cut.

That said, given the anecdote of one person saying "Fine, I will work somewhere else", this is probably going to backfire on them as they acquire a reputation for being more concerned about costs than employees and offering a less beneficial package to people seeking work.

But hey more power to them, hand of the free market and all that.


What? Really? With all the unemployed ready to step into any opening? And if not them, then I'm pretty sure that they could hire a bunch of "undocumented workers" to fill in.

Anyone who didn't see this coming was smoking the wacky tabacy..
 
2012-10-09 02:15:27 AM

Just Another OC Homeless Guy: Elandriel: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Making them share tips with the bartenders, who had their pay cut.

That said, given the anecdote of one person saying "Fine, I will work somewhere else", this is probably going to backfire on them as they acquire a reputation for being more concerned about costs than employees and offering a less beneficial package to people seeking work.

But hey more power to them, hand of the free market and all that.

What? Really? With all the unemployed ready to step into any opening? And if not them, then I'm pretty sure that they could hire a bunch of "undocumented workers" to fill in.

Anyone who didn't see this coming was smoking the wacky tabacy..


I can't wait until the Republicans start clamoring for the repeal of the minimum wage. This will be extremely lulzy.
 
2012-10-09 02:17:53 AM

MoonPirate: I know nothing of business but isn't the largest cost of a restaurant payroll?


The largest below-the-line cost (i.e.: excluding cost of goods and raw materials) of almost ANY business is payroll.

/accountant for 40 years
 
2012-10-09 02:21:05 AM

whidbey: I can't wait until the Republicans start clamoring for the repeal of the minimum wage. This will be extremely lulzy.


Wait no longer. Haven't you read this year's official party platform?

No, the link doesn't go to an Onion article. The Republican Party officially declared their support this year for the abolition of minimum wage for some American citizens working in the United States.
 
2012-10-09 02:21:24 AM

ox45tallboy: davidphogan: I hadn't thought of that... Euwww.

Why not an ad campaign by one of their competitors?

(OPEN SCENE)

Server is coughing and sneezing into their white, button-down starched shirt, then wiping their face with the long apron.
(VOICEOVER)
AT SOME RESTAURANTS, THEY DENY THEIR EMPLOYEES BASIC RIGHTS LIKE HEALTH CARE

(CUT TO KITCHEN IN SAME RESTAURANT)
Cook in chef's hat is coughing while stirring white clam chowder

(CUT TO SMILING HAPPY SERVERS IN SOLID-COLORED POLO SHIRTS)

(VOICEOVER)
AT APPLEBEE'S WE TAKE PRIDE IN PROVIDING THE BEST HEALTH CARE IN THE INDUSTRY FOR OUR BEST RESOURCE - OUR PEOPLE!

(CUT TO ATTRACTIVE BLONDE SERVER IN APPLEBEE'S UNIFORM AND MINISKIRT)

(VOICEOVER)
OUR EMPLOYEES ARE EVEN REGULARLY TESTED FOR STD'S, SO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE BRINGING HOME!

(CUT BACK TO ATTRACTIVE BLONDE SERVER DELIVERING LARGE STEAK WITH SIDE ITEMS, THEN CLOSE-UP OF ATTRACTIVE BLONDE)

(CUT TO CLOSEUP OF PASTA WITH BREADSTICKS, SLOW PAN BACK TO SERVERS FACE IN OLIVE GARDEN UNIFORM IMMEDIATELY ABOVE IT, COMPLETE WITH COLD SORE, SMILING, THEN COUGHING ONTO FOOD)
Is there anything else I can... give you?

(QUICK CUT TO BLACK)


Nasty.

I like it.
 
2012-10-09 02:25:08 AM

ox45tallboy: whidbey: I can't wait until the Republicans start clamoring for the repeal of the minimum wage. This will be extremely lulzy.

Wait no longer. Haven't you read this year's official party platform?

No, the link doesn't go to an Onion article. The Republican Party officially declared their support this year for the abolition of minimum wage for some American citizens working in the United States.


Well I'm sure that's got you tickled pink. After all, it's been what you've wanted for years?
 
2012-10-09 02:27:53 AM

ox45tallboy: whidbey: I can't wait until the Republicans start clamoring for the repeal of the minimum wage. This will be extremely lulzy.

Wait no longer. Haven't you read this year's official party platform?

No, the link doesn't go to an Onion article. The Republican Party officially declared their support this year for the abolition of minimum wage for some American citizens working in the United States.


And oh geez, it's time to go to bed as I have clearly confused you for someone with a slightly similar login. I actually tend to agree with what you post, pls disregard snark.
 
2012-10-09 02:32:05 AM

whidbey: And oh geez, it's time to go to bed as I have clearly confused you for someone with a slightly similar login. I actually tend to agree with what you post, pls disregard snark.


Damn it, I had a snarky retort all thought out. And an evil thingy to go in your Farkie.
 
2012-10-09 02:35:42 AM

ox45tallboy: t. And an evil thingy to go in your Farkie.


*makes badge*

WHIDBEY'S NOT REALLY A LIBERAL, HE OUTED HIMSELF IN 7370822
NEVAR FORGET

It's all good, ox45tallboy. Just never let it happen again. ;)
 
2012-10-09 02:38:57 AM

whidbey: It's all good, ox45tallboy. Just never let it happen again. ;)


I hereby award you 1 (one) Alan Simpson.

i.ytimg.com
 
2012-10-09 02:39:30 AM

ox45tallboy: I quit Ruby Tuesday's after I saw a piece of paper the manager was filling out. This was an actual form from the corporate office. It listed the number of cooks, servers, hostesses, busboys, etc. needed for each and every meal, then, at the bottom, it said,


It sounds petty to worry about, but the biggest thing I saw was a disregard for employee property. We had a pretty bad run of bikes/parts getting stolen, probably a year straight that was really bad. We actually had a bike rack in the back by our dumpster and an 8 ft tall block wall with an always-locked gate. I lost 2 1/2 bikes there(Once they stole the seat and rear wheel because I locked it up like a moron). I was just one of the employees getting bikes stolen at the rate of 1 or 2 a week. Someone was climbing this wall with a partner and stealing these. For many of us, it was our sole mode of transportation. After the last time, I mentioned something to the manager, since it kept happening, and they were breaking into the property to do it. His answer was 'Yeah? What do you want me to do about it?'. I finally actually wrote a letter to the head office that owned our franchise group, and to my surprise they told our manager to buy me the replacement wheel, hub and seat/post, but it didn't happen for anyone else, and security was not increased in any way. I also got in trouble with the managers for going to corporate because "they were going to make sure and buy what I needed", even though they had made no statements to that effect after 2 weeks.

My stepson works as a food runner at Texas Roadhouse, but I ask him about his job all of the time, and make sure to explain what he doesn't have to put up with. I also explain to him that work is hard, and not always fun but there is certain bullshiat that he doesn't have to put up with. I hope he learns from it. Nobody did that for me, they just sent me off to work, with the exception of one place that wanted me to work back to back close/open shifts of 6-8 hours each on Christmas Eve and Christmas, really leaving no time for Xmas until something like 8 pm that night. Manager told me that I was SOL and had to work. My foster parents were NOT impressed. I came in one day, the manager told me that I had both shifts free(Still had a job, BTW), and that I had better tell me "dad" that he was getting a Christmas present from the manager personally, and shouldn't expect another. As a result of pissed off people, the place was closed both Christmas Eve and Christmas day... :-)

We might think our working lives suck now, but it's nothing like back in the day when we were working our first jobs, that's for sure...
 
2012-10-09 02:50:30 AM

ox45tallboy: Mikey1969: On the other hand, I made some of my highest tips ever that night. Pity tips pay a great percentage.

No kidding. Try taking a baby around with you to your tables. I made bank that night.


And my daughter is not only cute and precocious, she's 40 lbs. of energy in a 5 lb bag. I bet they'd double.

I think I made something like $150 in 3 hours once AND got free hockey tickets(NHL, not some minor legue team), but that was waiting tables for an hour and working two simultaneous banquets... Would have LOVED to do banquet as my full time gig. Much better job, no shiatty crap because they want you to stay clean. Sidework is minimal. I got paid more money(Maybe ven the real minimum wage), people are friendly ad there to party, the things have a set start and stop sigh, and tips are known from the beginning, based on the bill, plus everyone shares the bar tips, especially when it's the kind of crew where anyone will step in and pour a drink or two if the bartender is away Add a tip jar to the bar(Not always allowed), and that's when you roll with some bank. Bonus is that you never end up in the weeds; either it's a plated dinner, and everyone has 3 or 4 meals to choose form, or it's a buffet. Either way, your night is mostly comprised of keeping the water pitcher full, clearing empty plates, resolving issues with the void, and getting booze refills. Strangely, tips suck ass when it's an open bar. I would always 'seed' the tip jar with $5 or so worth of money so people didn't just seem empty pitcher sitting there. They also didn't want to look like cheap pricks. Psychology works in serving all of the time.
 
2012-10-09 02:51:42 AM

Mikey1969: We might think our working lives suck now, but it's nothing like back in the day when we were working our first jobs, that's for sure...


Good point.
 
2012-10-09 04:10:46 AM
Lot of people suddenly think they're Henry Ford when they see consequences they don't like.
 
2012-10-09 04:16:49 AM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.


Yep. Now that they've turned the populace against unions (hey, we have laws that protect workers now!), they're slowly making inroads to repeal the very laws that protect workers that unions were made for in the first place.
 
2012-10-09 04:18:55 AM
ox45tallboy:

Oh, and where is Rick Perry in your little montage?
 
2012-10-09 04:35:39 AM

IlGreven: Oh, and where is Rick Perry in your little montage?


static.guim.co.uk
"Please."
 
2012-10-09 05:03:11 AM

Elandriel: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Making them share tips with the bartenders, who had their pay cut.

That said, given the anecdote of one person saying "Fine, I will work somewhere else", this is probably going to backfire on them as they acquire a reputation for being more concerned about costs than employees and offering a less beneficial package to people seeking work.

But hey more power to them, hand of the free market and all that.


This seems to be a point of confusion for many Farkers. Businesses are started to make a profit. Otherwise, they would be called a charity. Their primary concern IS profit making...not charity to employees.
 
2012-10-09 05:17:48 AM

Silly Jesus: This seems to be a point of confusion for many Farkers. Businesses are started to make a profit. Otherwise, they would be called a charity. Their primary concern IS profit making...not charity to employees.


McDonald's doesn't sell billions and billions of hamburgers because everyone thinks their cashier is adding to her 401K.
 
2012-10-09 07:31:22 AM
Olive Garden is in the business of making a profit.
 
2012-10-09 07:37:06 AM

Teufelaffe: ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.

Doesn't surprise me at all. Some years ago, when doing an article on work conditions at WalMart, a journalist did the math and pointed out to their WalMart contact that giving every employee in the company a $1/hr raise would be great for morale, resulting in more productive workers, and would only cut their annual profits by 2%. The WalMart talking head said that 2% was too much of a "loss."


It's not just Wal-Mart. Hospitals across the country are doing that too. One woman I know works 40 hours a week at the hospital ... in two different departments. For 20 hours a week, she's in one ward, for the other 20, she's in some sort of billing. It's payroll MAGIC!
 
2012-10-09 07:40:56 AM

itsdan: In Massachusetts under RomneyCare many of the penalties are assessed per full-time equivalent. So two workers working part time doing the same job count as a full time position. So if the cut off is 50 employees before the mandates for coverage kick in you could in theory have 100 part time workers and then have the mandates apply, but you can't just make everyone part time without limit and get away with it. Seems fair.

Also, you're allowed to pay them what like $2/hr as servers and you still can't afford a cheap plan that just barely meets the coverage requirements?


I worked at a Red Lobster. They have the servers do everything but main chef. Servers bus tables, prep salads and clean the restraunt, all for 2 dollars an hour. It is the worst place I ever worked and only a fool would choose to work there. The world is full of fools.
 
2012-10-09 07:44:03 AM

ox45tallboy: (VOICEOVER)
OUR EMPLOYEES ARE EVEN REGULARLY TESTED FOR STD'S, SO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE BRINGING HOME!


Awesome, though I think the STD line MIGHT be a bit too far.
 
2012-10-09 08:02:17 AM

Brick-House: You know they could have just passed a couple of small bills for pre-existing conditions, did a little tort reform and made the American people happy. But noooooooo, they had to fark it all up.


If that was good enough, then why the F didn't the Republicans get around to that any point between 2001 and 2006, when they had full majorities in both chambers of Congress and the White House. Hell, why didn't they from 1995-2000 (Clinton would have signed it)?

Because the GOP doesn't give a shiat about people, that's why.
 
2012-10-09 08:21:57 AM
My only wish is that I could somehow do more to keep Olive Garden from making money aside from my never going there. It's farking pasta, people. If you can master boiling water, you can make most of the Olive Garden cuisine.
 
2012-10-09 08:40:31 AM

penthesilea: Here's a 24 page pdf on how Olive Garden treats their staff as badly as Walmart workers. -PDF-

And then there's this:
Olive Garden, Red Lobster, Capital Grille Poor Working Conditions Creating Investor Liability
Olive Garden is already directly connected to a Hepatitis A incident, in which a class action lawsuit was filed against Darden for fostering the conditions that endangered thousands of people. Without timely corrective action, major and potentially irreparable brand damage may follow. Advocacy groups are increasingly bringing attention to public health incidents linked with the lack of paid sick days and low wages, which do not allow workers to take a day off when sick; the Olive Garden Hepatitis scare underscores how disastrous that practice can be.

My sister works for Olive Garden. If she asks for the day off because she's really sick they tell her no. They'll fire her. She tries to wash her hands as much as possible to keep from passing colds/illness to the customers, but that takes time and management get pissed if the staff isn't moving things along as quickly as possible.


And a wave and goodbye to those farking establishments!
 
2012-10-09 08:42:05 AM

EyeballKid: My only wish is that I could somehow do more to keep Olive Garden from making money aside from my never going there. It's farking pasta, people. If you can master boiling water, you can make most of the Olive Garden cuisine.


Give them some credit. Microwaves take a little while to master.
 
2012-10-09 08:46:55 AM
This is a business. Businesses exist to make a profit. Businesses adapt to laws and regulations in order to continue making a profit. Everyone knows businesses do this sort of thing.

Why the surprise? Why the outrage?
 
2012-10-09 08:57:56 AM
This was ALREADY happening, and they are just using health care reform to conveniently blame something other than their greed. A friend of mine worked as a bartender for Olive Garden for over ten years, and two years ago, they told all of the bartenders that they were cutting their pay by half, and most of their benefits. On TOP of this, he said, they increased the prices on their menu by a huge percentage. He said that many of the bartenders tried to strike, but then they were just plain fired. He quit a few weeks later because he couldn't believe that he and his fellow workers were being treated so poorly after all their years of service.

fark you, Olive Garden, fark you with a un-oiled breadstick.
 
2012-10-09 09:02:35 AM
Well, that's what Romney does with HIS help, and that's without Obamacare! So maybe there's something else afoot, hmmm?
 
2012-10-09 09:03:59 AM

GoldSpider: This is a business. Businesses exist to make a profit. Businesses adapt to laws and regulations in order to continue making a profit. Everyone knows businesses do this sort of thing.

Why the surprise? Why the outrage?


Business balance profit and worker benefits and public relations all the time, the attitude that it is fine for them to treat their workers poorly in the name of capitalism is a win for their public relations department I guess. The many people with your attitude means they don't have to worry about treating their workers poorly out of fear of losing your business.
 
2012-10-09 09:05:03 AM
Reminds me of Scumbag John Schnatter of Papa John's: claims pizzas will have to cost 15 cents more 'cos of Obamacare, gives away 2 million pizzas.
 
2012-10-09 09:06:02 AM
The funny thing about it too is the people who are fine with these mega corps treating their workers like shiat often call themselves libertarian, you know, the guys who think the consumer will protect the environment and the labor force through informed purchases?
 
2012-10-09 09:10:07 AM
And this is one of the many reasons I dislike chain restaurants. I am a bit of a 'foodie', and a former restaurant/catering worker.

I've been lucky to have always worked at independent restaurants, so I've never really dealt with that sort of horrible culture. Not to say that restaurant managers aren't usually insane, but at least with a private/family owned restaurant you can punch them in the balls and then justify it to the owner later.

Go to independent restaurants. Find a place you like and become a regular. It's pretty awesome for the ego when you see the looks on the other diners' faces when the chef sends out some special creation just for you. Or when the owner comes and sits with you. It's almost like actually being important.

The food will be better in almost all cases, and they will be more responsive to feedback. Granted, it's not always good, but that's part of the risk/fun of eating somewhere new.

For those of us with the luxury of eating out often, you'll get far more bang for your buck at an indie than you will at a chain.

For those who don't go out except on special occasions, do you really want to treat your loved one to the equivalent of a frozen TV dinner?
 
2012-10-09 09:20:57 AM
If you are a worker you have nothing in common with businesses, managers or owners. They want your labor at the cheapest possible cost. This is exploitation. "But hey FarkedOver, you don't have to work there! You can work where ever you want!" Ahhhh yes you can but every other place you may work is doing the same thing in terms of undercutting you. That's capitalism, it's exploitative. That is it's very nature. So if you work for a living, unionize. As a worker, your only means of redress are the strike and there are strength in numbers!
 
2012-10-09 09:27:28 AM

Headso: The many people with your attitude means they don't have to worry about treating their workers poorly out of fear of losing your business.


It means no such thing. I can still decide it's a crappy thing for the business to do and decide not to give them business. Workers can also decide not to work there anymore, which exposes the business to the risks associated with training new (and potentially less quality) hires.

I just don't get why people are surprised when businesses do things that they perceive to be in their best self interests.
 
2012-10-09 09:32:47 AM

PirateKing: Go to independent restaurants. Find a place you like and become a regular. It's pretty awesome for the ego when you see the looks on the other diners' faces when the chef sends out some special creation just for you. Or when the owner comes and sits with you. It's almost like actually being important.

The food will be better in almost all cases, and they will be more responsive to feedback. Granted, it's not always good, but that's part of the risk/fun of eating somewhere new.


This. Make yourself a more informed consumer and support the local economy at the same time.
 
2012-10-09 09:39:21 AM
If the US gov't was showed even a little responsibility to the electorate, they would have unhooked healthcare from employment decades ago.
 
2012-10-09 09:41:48 AM

Mercutio74: If the US gov't was showed even a little responsibility to the electorate, they would have unhooked healthcare from employment decades ago.


That too. Expand Medicare coverage to everyone, and BAM, you've got your national healthcare plan.
 
2012-10-09 09:42:17 AM

Mercutio74: If the US gov't was showed even a little responsibility to the electorate, they would have unhooked healthcare from employment decades ago.


But then people wouldn't be tied down to jobs they didn't want and .... that's... bad?
 
2012-10-09 09:42:20 AM
Olive Garden should be taken over by the government for being unpatriotic.
 
2012-10-09 09:47:43 AM

ManRay: Olive Garden should be taken over

/ftfy

 
2012-10-09 09:48:29 AM
This is not all bad news. For instance, under the new plan you can take your unlimited salad bowl with you even if you change doctors. Also the breadsticks can live with you until they're 26, and your bill is covered even if you have a preexisting pasta.
 
2012-10-09 09:48:40 AM

ManRay: Olive Garden should be taken over condemnedby the government for being unpatriotic unsanitary.


/ftfy
/and me
/oops
 
2012-10-09 09:53:47 AM

FarkedOver: Mercutio74: If the US gov't was showed even a little responsibility to the electorate, they would have unhooked healthcare from employment decades ago.

But then people wouldn't be tied down to jobs they didn't want and .... that's... bad?


For corporate America, yes. If you have the freedom to say "fark you, I'm quitting to work on my Etsy store full-time" without fear of getting sick and not being insured, a lot of worker bees would be lost.

When labor participation goes down, unemployment goes down and wages go up. This is what Republicans want to avoid for their donors.
 
2012-10-09 10:43:45 AM

randomjsa: So basically what you're saying, as liberals is... "Okay Conservatives, you were right, and we were liars or fools to actually say that ObamaCare would save businesses so much money!"

At some point you're just going to have to admit that conservatives were right about everything on ObamaCare... because so far we've been 100% correct.


Well, I see you've made some statements. Of course there isn't a shred of real evidence to support whatever type of point you are attempting to make.

But that's cool, since it seems to be working OK for the Romney campaign.
 
2012-10-09 11:00:30 AM
This is just a foretaste of what Saruman has in store for you.
 
2012-10-09 11:13:27 AM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.



I feel we would have heard of this one.....

Locked-in Employee: *dials 9-1-1* "Yes, I've been kidnapped and require immediate police attention at {Wal-Mart address}."
 
2012-10-09 11:18:24 AM

FarkedOver: As a worker, your only means of redress are the strike and there are strength in numbers!


Unless you actually have a skill that it is demand, then you have no problem finding work and commanding your own salary (within limits of course).
 
2012-10-09 11:20:42 AM
i512.photobucket.com

/oblig
 
2012-10-09 11:23:26 AM

cman: Dusk-You-n-Me: cman: Businesses care only for their bottom line. They will always find ways of keeping their costs low.

All the more reason to de-couple employers and health insurance.

I ain't saying that is a bad idea.

Liberals won, you got your healthcare bill passed. However, the sting of the bill is unbearable (individual mandate). As I have said in the past I would have preferred government run healthcare over being forced to buy a product from a for profit business. It is a matter of principles for me. Government ran tax payers healthcare is acceptable, but forcing one to partake in commerce is not.


But Obama won. Its funny how the left go back and forth on whether calling it Obamacare is an insult or not.
 
2012-10-09 11:41:22 AM

cryinoutloud: I worked in a lot of restaurants. No one ever worked full-time. Yawn.


What the hell are you talking about? I worked 15 hours Sat, 10 hours Sun, 7 hours last night. I'm full-time already, and have 4 shifts to go. That is standard for restaurants. Can't imagine where you "worked"
 
2012-10-09 11:45:29 AM
After all the commotion from the Right over second amendment solutions, I'm wondering if we don't actually need some Robespierre solutions for the Rentier Class?
 
2012-10-09 12:36:07 PM

ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.


And now they are opening a new line of credit with Amex, geared towards saving! I mean, the Walmart Bank idea was clearly an antitrust issue, but there is surely no way for Walmart to abuse this by paying their employees and then encouraging them to save through their line of credit, freeing up 20-50% of payroll costs for future investment! None at all! Some regulations are good, but others under Obama are clearly excessive and Romney will fix that and free up small business to hire again.

/This world is really confusing sometimes.
 
2012-10-09 12:49:56 PM

HellRaisingHoosier: ox45tallboy: Hey, this works for Wal-Mart!

My sister is part time, but has worked less than 40 hours precisely three times since she got the job. But she doesn't get benefits, because it is a "part-time position". The screwy thing is when they make the employees show up at 10 PM on Friday nights, count them tardy if they are late, but do not allow them to clock in and begin work until they have waited the amount of time they have been asked to "work over" throughout the week. For instance, if lots of stuff needs to be done Tuesday morning, a manager might ask her to stay an hour late to help out. If she does, then she won't be allowed to clock in until an hour after her scheduled time on Friday. However, she is expected to "report in" at her scheduled time, and then she can go do whatever she wants (including leaving the area if she has a car, otherwise hanging out in the parking lot with all the unsavory characters you find in a Wal-Mart parking lot at 10:30 on Friday nights) until the hour is up. Can't have anyone getting overtime they were asked to work!

Since their army of lawyers has so far kept the labor-based lawsuits at bay (including reports of locking employees in the store), they're setting precedent for many other cases, and many other businesses to take on this same way of treating their employees. After all, when someone complains, you fire the offending manager, and then put someone else in their place that is forced to make the same unrealistic goals through whatever means necessary.


I feel we would have heard of this one.....

Locked-in Employee: *dials 9-1-1* "Yes, I've been kidnapped and require immediate police attention at {Wal-Mart address}."


Tis true, or at least it was during my Wal-Mart life for about three or four years (I paid for college, man). When you were scheduled until closing, it was basically 4 p.m. until whenever the hell the manager said you could leave, which was entirely dependent on his mood. shiatty day for him? Everyone stays until 2 or 3 in the morning. And the doors were locked, and when we went to 24 hours, they posted a scrub manager at the doors to ensure that no one left. He didn't stop them, but he did write down their names, telling them not to come back to work.
 
2012-10-09 12:54:46 PM

HellRaisingHoosier: I feel we would have heard of this one.....

Locked-in Employee: *dials 9-1-1* "Yes, I've been kidnapped and require immediate police attention at {Wal-Mart address}."


Workers Assail Night Lock-Ins By Wal-Mart
Suit: Wal-Mart locked janitors into stores
Wal-Mart Locked-In Employees
 
2012-10-09 12:57:15 PM
Well, guess I'll not be eating at Olive Garden even moreso now.

On another note, thanks to ObamaCare, I have been able to leave my crappy corporate job and start my own business. I don't understand why republicans wouldn't be in favor of that kind of entrepreneurship? I thought they were supposed to represent small business?

How do they think someone is supposed to start a business if they have a pre-existing condition and can't get private insurance???
 
2012-10-09 01:30:20 PM
Hasnt this been the plan all along? America will be a country of Billionaire CEO's and minimum wage temp workers.

With nothing in between...
 
2012-10-09 01:38:41 PM

culebra: So compassionate. That's how you know that, in an unregulated economy, corporate entities would behave themselves and police each other. Corporations are good people, my friend.


This. This right farking here.
 
2012-10-09 03:59:10 PM

udhq: I thought they were supposed to represent small business?


What the hell gave you that idea? Big business is the one interest group that's been consistently Republican since the 1860's.

/they finally lost the freed slave vote in '08
 
2012-10-09 04:50:02 PM
They had full time workers?
 
2012-10-09 05:01:30 PM

LeftOfLiberal: I worked at a Red Lobster. They have the servers do everything but main chef. Servers bus tables, prep salads and clean the restraunt, all for 2 dollars an hour. It is the worst place I ever worked and only a fool would choose to work there. The world is full of fools.


I worked at a Red Lobster when I was younger for about a year, and made north of $30k just in tips (not including my hourly wage). Which isn't bad at all for a service position that literally any able-bodied person can do.

\ Now, what have we learned about anecdotes?
 
2012-10-09 07:12:22 PM

FarkedOver: If you are a worker you have nothing in common with businesses, managers or owners. They want your labor at the cheapest possible cost. This is exploitation. "But hey FarkedOver, you don't have to work there! You can work where ever you want!" Ahhhh yes you can but every other place you may work is doing the same thing in terms of undercutting you. That's capitalism, it's exploitative. That is it's very nature. So if you work for a living, unionize. As a worker, your only means of redress are the strike and there are strength in numbers!


The silly Commie's understanding of capitalism is silly.
 
2012-10-09 08:46:34 PM

eraser8: So, 900 pages of legislation to give us a system that just as screwed up as the one we have now? Well, that changes my view completely.


I'd say it's considerably better in the one we have now. Yes, it didn't kill private insurance or create a public option, but just getting so many more people participating in the system is a big win.

Even if we just restrict it to those affected by the Medicaid issue, that's still 3 million people. I think everyone ought to have access to health care. Obamacare doesn't give it to them.

I don't think that is really the fault of the authors; they tried, and the Supreme Court shot them down. I don't think anyone in Congress expected that outcome.
 
2012-10-10 12:46:26 PM

Elandriel: BarkingUnicorn: I've been expecting this move.

But why is it legal for Darden to require a cut of servers' tips?

Making them share tips with the bartenders, who had their pay cut.

That said, given the anecdote of one person saying "Fine, I will work somewhere else", this is probably going to backfire on them as they acquire a reputation for being more concerned about costs than employees and offering a less beneficial package to people seeking work.

But hey more power to them, hand of the free market and all that.


This is a result of basically the polar opposite of "free market"

/Their reputation will be fine when everyone follows suit
 
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