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(Salon)   President Obama's debate performance will soon be overshadowed by Joe "Wild Card" Biden, who might just be able to bring the campaign back where it belongs   (salon.com) divider line 176
    More: Hero, President Obama, Joe Biden, human beings, Lloyd Bentsen, Neil Kinnock, vice presidents, Dan Quayle  
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3006 clicks; posted to Politics » on 08 Oct 2012 at 10:09 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



176 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2012-10-08 08:31:58 AM  
By all means, raise expectations.
 
2012-10-08 08:34:28 AM  
Make sure you watch this debate on C-SPAN, which does the whole thing in close-up split screen. Biden's reactions to Ryan will be worth it.
 
2012-10-08 08:50:51 AM  
I have a feeling Biden will hammer the hell out of Paul Ryan on Medicare and the comically inept Ryan Budget.

That's really all he needs to do.
 
2012-10-08 08:51:45 AM  
That debate is going to be prime fap material for policy wonks.
 
2012-10-08 09:00:59 AM  
When you have to put your hope in a plagiarizing gaffe prone fool like Biden, give it up man....cause you are done.
 
2012-10-08 09:06:52 AM  
Yes, because Biden is definitely the master debater.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

...

Anyway, I do suspect that Biden will mop the floor with Ryan, but then again, Ryan isn't a complete tard like Palin. Even Bowles says Ryan's good at math-ing things and stuff...
 
2012-10-08 09:17:14 AM  

xanadian: Anyway, I do suspect that Biden will mop the floor with Ryan, but then again, Ryan isn't a complete tard like Palin. Even Bowles says Ryan's good at math-ing things and stuff...


Ryan's problem is that when he starts talking about the maths and such, he goes on and on at length. if it were a free form discussion format or something similar where he had time to explain, he'd do better. As it is, he's had to use the "I don't have time to explain" big when pressed about the Romney/Ryan tax and spending plans.
 
2012-10-08 09:24:29 AM  

EnviroDude: When you have to put your hope in a plagiarizing gaffe prone fool like Biden, give it up man....cause you are done.


Should be an easy mark for Ryan. Ryan will say "potato + potato = "Because socialism!" and Biden will plagiarize Shakespeare with something like "Truth's a dog must to kennel; he must be whipped
out" and NOT EVEN GIVE HIM CREDIT.
 
2012-10-08 09:46:56 AM  
i.imgur.com

I seriously doubt people will be that interested in the VP debate except for policy wonk types. That being said, it was sad to watch Biden obviously restraining himself against Sarah Palin last time.
 
2012-10-08 10:01:41 AM  
i.qkme.me
 
2012-10-08 10:02:14 AM  
The problem is that you do not "win" the debate by being correct. I think we learned this lesson the other night. So Biden will get pwned like a n00b.

/Is that still hip to say? I've turned into my father.
 
2012-10-08 10:04:09 AM  
he should come out with a baseball bat and quote "Lean on Me"

"They used to call me 'Crazy Joe!' Now they can call me 'Batman!'"
 
2012-10-08 10:05:10 AM  

Aarontology: xanadian: Anyway, I do suspect that Biden will mop the floor with Ryan, but then again, Ryan isn't a complete tard like Palin. Even Bowles says Ryan's good at math-ing things and stuff...

Ryan's problem is that when he starts talking about the maths and such, he goes on and on at length. if it were a free form discussion format or something similar where he had time to explain, he'd do better. As it is, he's had to use the "I don't have time to explain" big when pressed about the Romney/Ryan tax and spending plans.


Yeah, just like when he had all the time in the world with Chris Wallace, and really went in depth explaining his plan, right? (warning - video starts automatically)
 
2012-10-08 10:08:24 AM  

KyngNothing: Yeah, just like when he had all the time in the world with Chris Wallace, and really went in depth explaining his plan, right? (warning - video starts automatically)


I was talking more about those many hour long boring as shiat presentations he does for various groups.

When actually pressed on things, he clams right the hell up like a chump. He couldn't even say how much in taxes his cuts would cost.
 
2012-10-08 10:11:31 AM  
He's gonna bring it back to Stupid? Good plan derpers.
 
2012-10-08 10:11:35 AM  
If he shows up drinking a beer, I'll vote twice!

"Hold on, I gotta wipe the floor with this guy."

*belch*

"Go get some more cold ones."
 
2012-10-08 10:12:49 AM  
Paul Ryan is going to make fact checkers work over time.

www.usnews.com
 
2012-10-08 10:13:42 AM  
enjoy your smoke & mirrors, folks. election 2012 debate theatre is merely the most expensive pay-per-view event in history and the pugilists are making sure those ringside are getting plenty of entertainment for their dollar.

those cocksuckers don't fool me for one damn minute.
 
2012-10-08 10:14:58 AM  
I've said it before folks. Keep painting Biden as a gaffe prone ignoramus. It'll be hilarious when the guy who is painted as a moron but actually is smart, kind, and experienced debates the guy who is painted as a genius but is actually a green, vindictive moron with no real plan. Can't wait.
 
2012-10-08 10:16:18 AM  
I'm calling it now, Ryan will show up looking for a crazy time, and Biden will pull out "Serious Joe" like at the speech with the veterans or whatever it was, and it will be a slaughter.
 
2012-10-08 10:16:25 AM  
Hope be brings up the new engine he dropped in his Trans Am.
 
2012-10-08 10:16:55 AM  

KrispyKritter: enjoy your smoke & mirrors, folks. election 2012 debate theatre is merely the most expensive pay-per-view event in history and the pugilists are making sure those ringside are getting plenty of entertainment for their dollar.

those cocksuckers don't fool me for one damn minute.


You sound so edgy and cool. You should have a class on how to be above it all.
 
2012-10-08 10:17:36 AM  
Odds are that the VP debate will simply be a mirror of the Presidential debate. It almost always is. Expect the Romney team to score 2-3 more points
 
2012-10-08 10:17:54 AM  
farm7.staticflickr.com 
Biden's debate prep
 
2012-10-08 10:18:45 AM  
Noticed there's been a big upswing on "biden is stupid" rhetoric coming from a few of my co-workers. From overheard conversations, Rush and Michael Berry have been doing a massive amount of this the past week.
 
2012-10-08 10:19:51 AM  

KrispyKritter: enjoy your smoke & mirrors, folks. election 2012 debate theatre is merely the most expensive pay-per-view event in history and the pugilists are making sure those ringside are getting plenty of entertainment for their dollar.

those cocksuckers don't fool me for one damn minute.


Right. Both sides are bad so vote Miss Piggy.
 
2012-10-08 10:21:58 AM  

NateGrey: Paul Ryan is going to make fact checkers work over time.

[www.usnews.com image 425x328]


So that no one can pay attention to them or have their opinion swayed by the tidal wave of lies. In American politics nice guys finish last, we want the bad boy who will lie and bully and make up the rules as he goes.
 
2012-10-08 10:24:05 AM  
Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.
 
2012-10-08 10:24:26 AM  

KrispyKritter: enjoy your smoke & mirrors, folks. election 2012 debate theatre is merely the most expensive pay-per-view event in history and the pugilists are making sure those ringside are getting plenty of entertainment for their dollar.

those cocksuckers don't fool me for one damn minute.



You pay to watch this? 
 
2012-10-08 10:24:27 AM  

dehehn: NateGrey: Paul Ryan is going to make fact checkers work over time.

[www.usnews.com image 425x328]

So that no one can pay attention to them or have their opinion swayed by the tidal wave of lies. In American politics nice guys finish last, we want the bad boy who will lie and bully and make up the rules as he goes.


So you are for Chris Christie? He thinks he tough, but he is really just pushing around people who can't push back.
 
MFL
2012-10-08 10:25:31 AM  
assets.nydailynews.com
 
2012-10-08 10:26:11 AM  

The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.


Well, we want to win too. It'd be nice to win cleanly, but a win is a win.
 
2012-10-08 10:26:26 AM  
Politically apathetic people generally don't watch VP debates.
 
2012-10-08 10:27:20 AM  

Aarontology: That debate is going to be prime fap material for policy wonks.


Affirmative. Biden, a reality-based statesman who actually knows his stuff and is willing to go on for days telling you about it in excruciating detail, vs. Ryan, who pretends to be a "Numbers Guy", but knows he's really nothing more than a polished ideologue who's afraid to tell anyone any actual numbers.
 
2012-10-08 10:28:06 AM  
I came here for the four-panel Biden/Palin meme. Anyone?
 
2012-10-08 10:28:07 AM  

MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]


Where do you find all of these dumbass pictures? I thought the only conservatives who knew how to use photoshop were busy in the FOX news graphics dept.
 
2012-10-08 10:28:59 AM  
Good thing Biden has a secret weapon...
 
2012-10-08 10:30:01 AM  

MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]


wat?

Dont you have some stupid cartoon where Obama has big ears to post?
 
2012-10-08 10:30:58 AM  

EvilEgg: The problem is that you do not "win" the debate by being correct. I think we learned this lesson the other night. So Biden will get pwned like a n00b.


I'm inclined to agree, but I don't think Ryan can conjure up nearly the same level of non-stop bullshiat that Romney could nor muster the same verbal gymnastics required to overwhelm his opponent's opposition to the bullshiat. If the debate is a contest of personalities, I think Biden does have an advantage over Ryan; though i certainly hope for no repeats of the first debate.


though I should also add that even though my expectations are low for Ryan, he is nowhere near Palin levels.
 
2012-10-08 10:31:57 AM  

NateGrey: MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]

wat?

Dont you have some stupid cartoon where Obama has big ears to post?


I think hes saying the President is made out of cake, or possibly some kind of candy.

Perhaps Islamic candy.
 
2012-10-08 10:32:26 AM  
The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?
 
2012-10-08 10:32:41 AM  
The debate should be great.

If a candidate was ever to accuse his opponent of being a lying sack of shiat on national TV, it would be Biden. He is a loose canon that gets away with telling the truth when every other candidate will waffle.

Biden should also take the opportunity to focus on the 35-55 age group who Romney/Ryan want to disclude from Medicare and give a tiny voucher to pay for overpriced insurance which will absolutely screw them over. Ryan already has seniors scared over this and they aren't even the target. The big losers in the Ryan plan are Gen-X and younger Boomers.
 
2012-10-08 10:32:47 AM  
What I'm hearing is that each side is expecting very little of the other side and lots from their side.  Kind of the opposite expectation game as the first Presidential debate.  Interesting strategy.
 
2012-10-08 10:33:35 AM  

Notabunny: Ryan, who pretends to be a "Numbers Guy", but knows he's really nothing more than a polished ideologue who's afraid to tell anyone any actual numbers.


He likes to spout actual numbers: 6-8% body fat, marathon times under 3 hours, etc. But only when those numbers have no basis in reality. 

I don't think Biden is going to stand by and let him spew his bullshiat.
 
2012-10-08 10:34:28 AM  

EvilEgg: The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.

Well, we want to win too. It'd be nice to win cleanly, but a win is a win.


That's exactly the Republican mantra this year. I don't want to be like them. What's the point of supporting a candidate if you want him to debase himself for a cheap win? What's why we have 50% of the country too cynical, apathetic, and uninformed to bother voting.

Look, Obama's not going to win by playing Romney's game. He needs to get back to being himself. Even when he doesn't debate well, he still connects to the middle class, shows them who's holding them back, and offers a clear understandable path to upward mobility. He lost Wednesday because he didn't do that, not because he wasn't the bigger bully. Stop trying to turn a finesse tactician into a pit fighter.
 
2012-10-08 10:34:42 AM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?


His marathon time is amazing.

myfivebest.com
 
2012-10-08 10:36:47 AM  

madgonad: If a candidate was ever to accuse his opponent of being a lying sack of shiat on national TV, it would be Biden. He is a loose canon that gets away with telling the truth when every other candidate will waffle.


I don't know if you noticed, but Romney flat-out called Obama a liar several times during his debate.

Of course, Romney was actually lying when he said that the President was lying, but I guess he figured it would somehow cancel things out.
 
2012-10-08 10:37:28 AM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?


BIden has actually boxed, and Ryan has a glass jaw.
 
2012-10-08 10:37:40 AM  

madgonad: The debate should be great.


I have my doubts. Ryan is even better at talking in circles than Romney. I expect another train wreck of rehtorical nonsense that the punditry will call "winning."
 
2012-10-08 10:38:32 AM  
Has Ryan accepted Biden's challenge to shotgun a beer every 10 minutes during the debate?
 
2012-10-08 10:40:06 AM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.


They're not armwrestling or shooting hoops, dumbass.
 
2012-10-08 10:40:40 AM  

The Great EZE: Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.


Welcome to Fark?
 
2012-10-08 10:41:27 AM  
I"m a Stupid American who believes everything the corporate owned TV tells me.


i'm not going to look at the last 3.5 years of Obama's performance, i'm going to base my vote a 90 minute debate.

that's how stupid some americans are.

and THAT is why this nation is in the sh*thole its in that has its roots in the Reagan 80's.

anyone remember in the 80's when Ronnie, et al, allowed our Steel Industry to be shipped overseas??? that, among others, was the begining of what we see today.

but blame it on the black guy. so american. so easy. so convenient.

and the most pathetic thing is that Obama/Biden are two of the best things this Nation has going for it.

but go ahead, America, and listen to your corporate owners on the TV machine.

its worked so well for you in the past..................
 
2012-10-08 10:44:49 AM  

czei: Good thing Biden has a secret weapon...


i.ebayimg.com
 
2012-10-08 10:45:41 AM  
The whole "Biden is a bad speaker/debtor" meme is hilarious. His best moments never receive any attention from the "Liberal" media. Only the "gaffes" do, which really aren't gaffes but a man who doesn't care speaking his mind. If the morons on the right actually listened to what he had to say instead of relying on Fatbaugh or Rupert Murdoch to translate they may actually realize that Paul "I can certainly tell several lies" Ryan isn't actually that great of the speaker, especially when most of his speeches are full of so much shiat the Roto-Rooter man would wince.

Relying on Ayn Rand and a few Onion articles for debate prep ain't gonna save his ass.
 
2012-10-08 10:46:57 AM  

EnviroDude: When you have to put your hope in a plagiarizing gaffe prone fool like Biden, give it up man....cause you are done.


God damn, son. Look at how stupid what you wrote is.
 
2012-10-08 10:47:02 AM  

EyeballKid: Has Ryan accepted Biden's challenge to shotgun a beer every 10 minutes during the debate?


Ryan would have that beat

i.ytimg.com
 
2012-10-08 10:47:46 AM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?


Ryan could tell him about the time he ran NY Marathon in 2:05.
 
2012-10-08 10:48:06 AM  

Cyclometh: EnviroDude: When you have to put your hope in a plagiarizing gaffe prone fool like Biden, give it up man....cause you are done.

God damn, son. Look at how stupid what you wrote is.



excessive drug use will do that. it kills brain cells.
 
2012-10-08 10:48:28 AM  

Linux_Yes: I"m a Stupid American who believes everything the corporate owned TV tells me.


i'm not going to look at the last 3.5 years of Obama's performance, i'm going to base my vote a 90 minute debate.

that's how stupid some americans are.

and THAT is why this nation is in the sh*thole its in that has its roots in the Reagan 80's.

anyone remember in the 80's when Ronnie, et al, allowed our Steel Industry to be shipped overseas??? that, among others, was the begining of what we see today.

but blame it on the black guy. so american. so easy. so convenient.

and the most pathetic thing is that Obama/Biden are two of the best things this Nation has going for it.

but go ahead, America, and listen to your corporate owners on the TV machine.

its worked so well for you in the past..................


Sadly, the average voter doesn't even bother to watch the debates. Instead they are pissed that it interrupted the a rerun of Honey Boo Boo or whatever the hell is on at the time. They base their decision on either misinformation and trivial matters. This is why we can't have nice things and are slowly progressing towards an idiocracy.
 
2012-10-08 10:51:17 AM  

EyeballKid: Has Ryan accepted Biden's challenge to shotgun a beer every 10 minutes during the debate?


It is doable. I used to watch debates and whenever someone says something so outragous that I have to scream at the TV "BS" I would take a drink. I think I averaged a beer every 5 minutes..... After 2008 my doctor told me my liver cannot take any more so I cannot watch the debates any more.
 
2012-10-08 10:52:21 AM  

Fart_Machine: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

Ryan could tell him about the time he ran NY Marathon in 2:05.



i was 22 and ran a half marathon in 1:29:35 in Germany and it damn near wasted me. i had been running average 10 miles per day, 6 days per week since i was 17 years old. so by 22, i was in the best shape of my life. a 5 or 6 mile run was nothing to me.

granted, the course did have hills and all, but Ryan is a f*cking liar. just like most republicans. they tell u what they think you want to hear.

Bill Rogers won that race, btw.
 
2012-10-08 10:53:39 AM  

Linux_Yes: Fart_Machine: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

Ryan could tell him about the time he ran NY Marathon in 2:05.


i was 22 and ran a half marathon in 1:29:35 in Germany and it damn near wasted me. i had been running average 10 miles per day, 6 days per week since i was 17 years old. so by 22, i was in the best shape of my life. a 5 or 6 mile run was nothing to me.

granted, the course did have hills and all, but Ryan is a f*cking liar. just like most republicans. they tell u what they think you want to hear.

Bill Rogers won that race, btw.



correction: bill rodgers.
 
2012-10-08 10:53:54 AM  

MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]


I got to tell you, I really dislike that. It's kind of unnerving. You can dislike the man, you can dislike his policies but showing a sitting President in the Oval Office like that? That's just not right.
 
2012-10-08 10:54:25 AM  
Because Lloyd Benson wiping the floor with Quayle really changed the election outcome.
 
2012-10-08 10:54:36 AM  

devilEther: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

They're not armwrestling or shooting hoops, dumbass.


So you cut off my joke about the debate being in an octagon, thus taking my post out of context, then call me a dumbass?

Clever stuff there, Poindexter.
 
2012-10-08 10:56:00 AM  
Everyone did think that Obama had the debate in the bag too.
Don't jinx it by expecting a complete blowout by Biden or we might end up with Ryan winning.
 
2012-10-08 10:56:48 AM  

Aarontology: Ryan's problem is that when he starts talking about the maths and such, he goes on and on at length. if it were a free form discussion format or something similar where he had time to explain, he'd do better. As it is, he's had to use the "I don't have time to explain" big when pressed about the Romney/Ryan tax and spending plans.


He buzzes like a fridge, too.
 
2012-10-08 10:56:56 AM  
So liberals are hoping for Biden to pull out a V and good debate to help Obama look good?!

BWAHAHAHAHHAAAA HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAA HAHAHAHHAHAAAHAHAH

oh man.
 
2012-10-08 10:58:16 AM  

vegasj: So liberals are hoping for Biden to pull out a V and good debate to help Obama look good?!

BWAHAHAHAHHAAAA HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAA HAHAHAHHAHAAAHAHAH

oh man.


Actually, I'm hoping Biden start to curse Ryan out like the whipping boy he is. They don't have time delay censors on VP debates :)
 
2012-10-08 10:59:59 AM  

CPennypacker: MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]

Where do you find all of these dumbass pictures? I thought the only conservatives who knew how to use photoshop were busy in the FOX news graphics dept.


You forgot the Iranian missile program.
 
2012-10-08 11:01:13 AM  

EvilEgg: The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.

Well, we want to win too. It'd be nice to win cleanly, but a win is a win.


OK, let's boil it down to cavemen.

You have two cavemen and one dead wildebeest (or whatever it was they ate). One caveman has a big club and is not afraid to use it. The other one is the same size, has a club but is loathe to use it, and observes that the wildebeest is big enough to share.

See if you can guess what happens to the wildebeest.

I too would hate to see a win by Obama by being as venal and mendacious as the GOP.
 
2012-10-08 11:04:46 AM  

Cletus C.: devilEther: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

They're not armwrestling or shooting hoops, dumbass.

So you cut off my joke about the debate being in an octagon, thus taking my post out of context, then call me a dumbass?

Clever stuff there, Poindexter.


Welcome to politics.
 
2012-10-08 11:06:12 AM  

Somacandra: [i.imgur.com image 635x357]

hahahaha!

*saved*

 
2012-10-08 11:08:09 AM  

Linux_Yes: Linux_Yes: Fart_Machine: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

Ryan could tell him about the time he ran NY Marathon in 2:05.


i was 22 and ran a half marathon in 1:29:35 in Germany and it damn near wasted me. i had been running average 10 miles per day, 6 days per week since i was 17 years old. so by 22, i was in the best shape of my life. a 5 or 6 mile run was nothing to me.

granted, the course did have hills and all, but Ryan is a f*cking liar. just like most republicans. they tell u what they think you want to hear.

Bill Rogers won that race, btw.


correction: bill rodgers.


Ummm....that time isn't anywhere close to believable. If he's going to lie, could he at least know how far a marathon is?
 
2012-10-08 11:10:40 AM  
SNL did a pretty funny take on this in the Winner/Losers bit of Weekend Update
 
2012-10-08 11:12:29 AM  

skullkrusher: SNL did a pretty funny take


I know you're lying. SNL hasn't been funny in over a decade.
 
2012-10-08 11:13:13 AM  
Biden will almost certainly throw a few gaffes out there during the debate. That being said, I think he will actually win.
 
2012-10-08 11:13:58 AM  

Fart_Machine: skullkrusher: SNL did a pretty funny take

I know you're lying. SNL hasn't been funny in over a decade.


haven't watched this season yet? It's been pretty good so far. Even in the lean times, Weekend Update was usually a bright spot. Plus I want to have relations with Kate McKinnon. I would penis the gay right outta her (or so I'd like to believe)
 
2012-10-08 11:19:38 AM  
I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....


/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...
 
2012-10-08 11:20:29 AM  
dunno about you, but after Obama's debate performance, I am setting my expectations pretty low.
 
2012-10-08 11:21:21 AM  

Cuthbert Allgood: I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....


/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...


I fully expected BO to kick Romney's ass. The VP debates were more of a question mark imo. Still are.
 
2012-10-08 11:23:34 AM  

Cuthbert Allgood: I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....


/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...


I am not sure either. It really blindsided Obama. I am hoping the Obama campaign learned from that experience and are at least mentally prepared for the potential of more.

How do you handle complete fabrication and a sudden, cliff-like rebuttal of a year of campaigning though? I mean, Romney sat up on stage and utterly walked back more than three quarters of the previous year. Sure, you can say "well, your full of shiat" but that's not responding to the soundbite is it.
 
MFL
2012-10-08 11:24:09 AM  
The Great EZE SmartestFunniestLook, Obama's not going to win by playing Romney's game. He needs to get back to being himself. Even when he doesn't debate well, he still connects to the middle class, shows them who's holding them back, and offers a clear understandable path to upward mobility. He lost Wednesday because he didn't do that, not because he wasn't the bigger bully. Stop trying to turn a finesse tactician into a pit fighter.

Obama lost this debate because as Newt said so elequently yesterday on meet the press "17 words than an attack on Mitt Romney is not a vision for the future for a sitting president."

1. He has no vision.
2. He has a record that is almost impossible to defend.
3. He has to stand there fully exposed and completely himself - a cypher, facing a superior man and candidate. 

Obama is like Notre Dame in a BCS bowl.
 
2012-10-08 11:24:13 AM  
I just want to hear someone actually come out and say, "What my opponent just said is a bald-faced lie. The truth is <something true>
 
2012-10-08 11:25:16 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.


To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."
 
2012-10-08 11:25:39 AM  

t3knomanser: I just want to hear someone actually come out and say, "What my opponent just said is a bald-faced lie. The truth is <something true>


nah, professional courtesy and all that
 
2012-10-08 11:25:53 AM  

MFL: The Great EZE SmartestFunniestLook, Obama's not going to win by playing Romney's game. He needs to get back to being himself. Even when he doesn't debate well, he still connects to the middle class, shows them who's holding them back, and offers a clear understandable path to upward mobility. He lost Wednesday because he didn't do that, not because he wasn't the bigger bully. Stop trying to turn a finesse tactician into a pit fighter.

Obama lost this debate because as Newt said so elequently yesterday on meet the press "17 words than an attack on Mitt Romney is not a vision for the future for a sitting president."

1. He has no vision.
2. He has a record that is almost impossible to defend.
3. He has to stand there fully exposed and completely himself - a cypher, facing a superior man and candidate. 

Obama is like Notre Dame in a BCS bowl.


See, that's how I know you're lying.
 
2012-10-08 11:27:08 AM  

skullkrusher: nah, professional courtesy and all that


The same reason politicians never have to fear snake bite or rat infestations.
 
2012-10-08 11:27:45 AM  

EyeballKid: Has Ryan accepted Biden's challenge to shotgun a beer every 10 minutes during the debate?


I'll bet Biden has the same reaction to alcohol as Dr. Johnny Fever.
 
2012-10-08 11:28:04 AM  

t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.

To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."


Oh, I fully realize that. My question is how, in fact, DO you respond to that effectively? I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?" You wouldn't think an adequate response would even be necessary since its so obviously ridiculous. But yet, here we are.
 
2012-10-08 11:28:46 AM  

t3knomanser: skullkrusher: nah, professional courtesy and all that

The same reason politicians never have to fear snake bite or rat infestations.


also why lawyers can swim with sharks sans cage
 
2012-10-08 11:31:08 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.

To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."

Oh, I fully realize that. My question is how, in fact, DO you respond to that effectively? I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?" You wouldn't think an adequate response would even be necessary since its so obviously ridiculous. But yet, here we are.


It didn't help that Obama took copious bong hits prior to the debate.
 
2012-10-08 11:31:25 AM  
Everyone knows that Biden says crazy shiat.....wouldn't be surprised if he does flat out call Ryan a liar. Obama couldn't get away with it against Mitt, but the news results of Bidden calling Ryan a liar would put all of their debate claims under closer scrutiny and get it far enough into the mainstream to reach the Honey Boo Boo voters.
 
2012-10-08 11:31:26 AM  

skullkrusher: t3knomanser: skullkrusher: nah, professional courtesy and all that

The same reason politicians never have to fear snake bite or rat infestations.

also why lawyers can swim with sharks sans cage


i229.photobucket.com
 
2012-10-08 11:32:00 AM  

NateGrey: skullkrusher: t3knomanser: skullkrusher: nah, professional courtesy and all that

The same reason politicians never have to fear snake bite or rat infestations.

also why lawyers can swim with sharks sans cage

[i229.photobucket.com image 525x394]


you're trying really hard this morning and still failing. So sad.
 
2012-10-08 11:32:02 AM  
Ryan might pull a Palin: "The American people don't want to hear about a bunch of hair-splitting about statistics; this election is nothing less than a referendum on the way this country should work: should we enable hard working people to succeed, or should we reward those who believe the government should pervade every aspect of their lives?"

In other words, if you don't give your opponent a stable target, there's no way he can hit it.

/man I'm good at this
//in my own mind!
 
2012-10-08 11:32:05 AM  
I think that Ryan will use the same debate technique that Romney did, and I'm not sure how it can be countered. The technique is to spout so many lies and half truths that your opponent simply does not have time to refute any of your points, even though you could win a discussion if there was enough time.. Romney did this by talking fast, combines with flopping his positions. Ryan will be good at just plain lying but making it sound like he knows what he is talking about. It may be impossible in the allocated time to counter this. I think that the only possible counter is to ignore what the person using this debate technique is saying, and launch your own attacks. Unfortunately this is going to reduce the debates to a series of zingers and attacks instead of any sort of discussion based on facts.
 
2012-10-08 11:32:19 AM  

Publikwerks: i.ebayimg.com


I'm gonna have to ask for your written permission to use that image.
 
2012-10-08 11:34:14 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.

To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."

Oh, I fully realize that. My question is how, in fact, DO you respond to that effectively? I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?" You wouldn't think an adequate response would even be necessary since its so obviously ridiculous. But yet, here we are.


imageshack.us
 
2012-10-08 11:37:37 AM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?


All Ryan has to do is show off his abs and the women will vote for him.
 
2012-10-08 11:37:50 AM  

LesterB: Wicked Chinchilla: t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.

To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."

Oh, I fully realize that. My question is how, in fact, DO you respond to that effectively? I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?" You wouldn't think an adequate response would even be necessary since its so obviously ridiculous. But yet, here we are.

[imageshack.us image 650x436]


Wow that is some ownage. Newt should STFU.

Politicians who regularly switch positions to suit them and party are a disgrace to humanity.

Romney is a case in point.
 
2012-10-08 11:38:58 AM  

SithLord: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

All Ryan has to do is show off his abs and the women will vote for him.


Honestly, he just has to wear suits that fit him and it would improve his odds.
/why does he always wear suits that are too big?
 
2012-10-08 11:39:32 AM  

bdub77: Politicians who regularly switch positions to suit them and party are a disgrace to humanity


I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with a politician switching positions. We would hope that with time and experience, they learn things and change their stance on issues. The world around us also changes, and a stance that makes sense today might not make sense tomorrow.

However, there's a very clear and well marked line between "changing stances" and "saying whatever the rubes will buy". Romney is quite clearly on the latter side.
 
2012-10-08 11:40:03 AM  
i86.photobucket.com
 
2012-10-08 11:40:39 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: why does he always wear suits that are too big?


I'm gonna go out a limb and think that his opinion of how bulked P90x made him and how bulked he actually is aren't close. He just strikes me as the kind of guy that is a walking mid-life crisis looking for a 20 year old stripper to bang.
 
2012-10-08 11:40:56 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: SithLord: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

All Ryan has to do is show off his abs and the women will vote for him.

Honestly, he just has to wear suits that fit him and it would improve his odds.
/why does he always wear suits that are too big?


The Oompa Loompa Factory Outlet closed due to Fartbama's miserable economy.
 
2012-10-08 11:42:01 AM  

Citrate1007: Everyone knows that Biden says crazy shiat.....wouldn't be surprised if he does flat out call Ryan a liar. Obama couldn't get away with it against Mitt, but the news results of Bidden calling Ryan a liar would put all of their debate claims under closer scrutiny and get it far enough into the mainstream to reach the Honey Boo Boo voters.


I think that if he did that, the media would be talking about how Biden was mean, testy, and unprofessional, and "Do we really need people with that kind of temper in the White House?"

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
 
2012-10-08 11:42:29 AM  

Car_Ramrod: Citrate1007: Everyone knows that Biden says crazy shiat.....wouldn't be surprised if he does flat out call Ryan a liar. Obama couldn't get away with it against Mitt, but the news results of Bidden calling Ryan a liar would put all of their debate claims under closer scrutiny and get it far enough into the mainstream to reach the Honey Boo Boo voters.

I think that if he did that, the media would be talking about how Biden was mean, testy, and unprofessional, and "Do we really need people with that kind of temper in the White House?"

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


damn right wing media
 
2012-10-08 11:43:23 AM  

skullkrusher: Car_Ramrod: Citrate1007: Everyone knows that Biden says crazy shiat.....wouldn't be surprised if he does flat out call Ryan a liar. Obama couldn't get away with it against Mitt, but the news results of Bidden calling Ryan a liar would put all of their debate claims under closer scrutiny and get it far enough into the mainstream to reach the Honey Boo Boo voters.

I think that if he did that, the media would be talking about how Biden was mean, testy, and unprofessional, and "Do we really need people with that kind of temper in the White House?"

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

damn right wing media


Not Racist, Not Nielsen, But #1 with Racists AND Nielsen.
 
2012-10-08 11:46:30 AM  
We've already won this debate because everyone knows Their politicians lie, while ours can be trusted to tell the truth.
 
2012-10-08 11:46:39 AM  

KarmicDisaster: I think that Ryan will use the same debate technique that Romney did, and I'm not sure how it can be countered. The technique is to spout so many lies and half truths that your opponent simply does not have time to refute any of your points, even though you could win a discussion if there was enough time.. Romney did this by talking fast, combines with flopping his positions. Ryan will be good at just plain lying but making it sound like he knows what he is talking about. It may be impossible in the allocated time to counter this. I think that the only possible counter is to ignore what the person using this debate technique is saying, and launch your own attacks. Unfortunately this is going to reduce the debates to a series of zingers and attacks instead of any sort of discussion based on facts.


What is interesting is that this debate technique is very similar to the strategy that was perfected at Libery University, which seems like it has pretty much caused college debate to devolve into almost exactly what you describe:

"O'Donnell calls debate "a game of the mind," but it is also a sport that requires strength and stamina. Contests last 92 minutes, and each debater on each two-person team speaks three times - opening arguments, cross-examination and closing arguments - for a total of 23 minutes. At some tournaments, teams have five matches a day.

Debaters gulp air like competitive swimmers. Melissa Hurter, a senior from Huntsville, Ala., talked at high speed for nine full seconds between breaths (she and her partner Lindsey Hoban, a senior from Lake Ariel, Pa., keep in shape by playing wind instruments). The Trinity debaters sucked air after only five seconds and sounded as if they were drowning. Liberty won handily.

There is a tactical logic to speed-talking. Arguments - even nonsensical or irrelevant arguments - must be rebutted. Those left unanswered count against you. The faster you talk, the more arguments you can make, and the better your chance to rack up points. Debaters carry their ammunition, files of every possible argument and rebuttal, in 14-gallon plastic tubs."
 
2012-10-08 11:50:17 AM  

Car_Ramrod: Citrate1007: Everyone knows that Biden says crazy shiat.....wouldn't be surprised if he does flat out call Ryan a liar. Obama couldn't get away with it against Mitt, but the news results of Bidden calling Ryan a liar would put all of their debate claims under closer scrutiny and get it far enough into the mainstream to reach the Honey Boo Boo voters.

I think that if he did that, the media would be talking about how Biden was mean, testy, and unprofessional, and "Do we really need people with that kind of temper in the White House?"

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


Yeah, but we're all missing the point. You don't have to be mean to win these debates, just emotionally engaging. Conservatives set their cruise control to "mean" because that's all they know. But Biden can totally captivate a TV audience by being sentimental, by sharing stories of his humble upbringing, cracking jokes, using a little bumper-sticker logic, basically being a realistic version of the caricature we all have in our minds.

He can display more emotional extremes than the seven dwarves and win this debate without saying a word about policy or Ryan just by tugging our heartstrings. I don't know about anyone else but I'm not afraid to set my expectations high for Joltin' Joe.
 
2012-10-08 11:51:24 AM  

t3knomanser: bdub77: Politicians who regularly switch positions to suit them and party are a disgrace to humanity

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with a politician switching positions. We would hope that with time and experience, they learn things and change their stance on issues. The world around us also changes, and a stance that makes sense today might not make sense tomorrow.

However, there's a very clear and well marked line between "changing stances" and "saying whatever the rubes will buy". Romney is quite clearly on the latter side.


This is why I said 'regularly switch positions'. I'm OK with politicians changing stances. However if someone doesn't have a clear agenda or clear positions, there's a good bet they are just saying something to get elected.
 
2012-10-08 11:55:47 AM  

Wicked Chinchilla: SithLord: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

All Ryan has to do is show off his abs and the women will vote for him.

Honestly, he just has to wear suits that fit him and it would improve his odds.
/why does he always wear suits that are too big?


So that way when when he hulks out, it doesn't rip the suit.
 
MFL
2012-10-08 11:55:51 AM  
Cuthbert Allgood
I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....

/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...


You can tell when someone is losing because they bring out the whole "pack of lies" defense.
Princeton Economist: Obama Campaign Is Misrepresenting My Study on Romney's Tax Plan

Link

Mitt shattered 6 months and millions of dollars worth of negative campaign adds the Obama administration had been running in one night with a record number of people watching.

Mitt Romney is now not only seen as that dreaded "acceptable alternative"....To anyone who isn't drinking Obama cool-aid He is the superior of the two and the president now has to throw as much shiat at the wall as he can and some of it hope it sticks to slow down the erosion of a lead that was never there to begin with.

Hype will only get you so far without results.
 
2012-10-08 11:56:03 AM  

KarmicDisaster: I think that Ryan will use the same debate technique that Romney did, and I'm not sure how it can be countered. The technique is to spout so many lies and half truths that your opponent simply does not have time to refute any of your points, even though you could win a discussion if there was enough time.. Romney did this by talking fast, combines with flopping his positions. Ryan will be good at just plain lying but making it sound like he knows what he is talking about. It may be impossible in the allocated time to counter this. I think that the only possible counter is to ignore what the person using this debate technique is saying, and launch your own attacks. Unfortunately this is going to reduce the debates to a series of zingers and attacks instead of any sort of discussion based on facts.


"Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."
 
2012-10-08 11:56:34 AM  
I'm looking forward to this debate quite a bit. I used to listen to Biden all the time on C-Span back when he was in congress. Biden was a senator for over 30 years, he has LOTS of experience debating people. Even as a Republican I always liked Biden because even if I didn't agree with him he always challenged my beliefs with his lucid arguments, and made me really think about things.

Can't wait to watch him wipe the floor with that Ryan asshole. Biden keeps getting the easy debates, huh?
 
2012-10-08 11:57:56 AM  
If Biden brings the campaign to where it belongs then Obama will be behind nationally in every poll by about 10-20 points.
 
2012-10-08 11:59:14 AM  

Wyalt Derp: KarmicDisaster: I think that Ryan will use the same debate technique that Romney did, and I'm not sure how it can be countered. The technique is to spout so many lies and half truths that your opponent simply does not have time to refute any of your points, even though you could win a discussion if there was enough time.. Romney did this by talking fast, combines with flopping his positions. Ryan will be good at just plain lying but making it sound like he knows what he is talking about. It may be impossible in the allocated time to counter this. I think that the only possible counter is to ignore what the person using this debate technique is saying, and launch your own attacks. Unfortunately this is going to reduce the debates to a series of zingers and attacks instead of any sort of discussion based on facts.

"Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."


I'm surprised that this foolproof way to win a debate hasn't been discovered in the thousands of years humans have been engaging in formal rhetorical exercises
 
2012-10-08 11:59:54 AM  

FeedTheCollapse: EvilEgg: The problem is that you do not "win" the debate by being correct. I think we learned this lesson the other night in 1960. So Biden will get pwned like a n00b.

I'm inclined to agree,....


/FTFEE
 
2012-10-08 12:01:01 PM  

randomjsa: If Biden brings the campaign to where it belongs then Obama will be behind nationally in every poll by about 10-20 points.


You sound sad like these guys:

Well....crap :(
 
2012-10-08 12:04:35 PM  

NateGrey: randomjsa: If Biden brings the campaign to where it belongs then Obama will be behind nationally in every poll by about 10-20 points.

You sound sad like these guys:

Well....crap :(


I'm not clicking on that. My laptop won't survive another trip through the dishwasher.
 
2012-10-08 12:05:00 PM  

SithLord: Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?

All Ryan has to do is show off his abs and the women will vote for him.


Spoken like a legitimate rape wand proponent.
 
2012-10-08 12:07:25 PM  

Whiskey Pete: I'm not clicking on that. My laptop won't survive another trip through the dishwasher.


Then quit going to salon, think progress, huffington, and TPM as well.
 
2012-10-08 12:07:26 PM  

MFL: Cuthbert Allgood
I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....

/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...

You can tell when someone is losing because they bring out the whole "pack of lies" defense.
Princeton Economist: Obama Campaign Is Misrepresenting My Study on Romney's Tax Plan

Link

Mitt shattered 6 months and millions of dollars worth of negative campaign adds the Obama administration had been running in one night with a record number of people watching.

Mitt Romney is now not only seen as that dreaded "acceptable alternative"....To anyone who isn't drinking Obama cool-aid He is the superior of the two and the president now has to throw as much shiat at the wall as he can and some of it hope it sticks to slow down the erosion of a lead that was never there to begin with.

Hype will only get you so far without results.


Since you seem to work for the Romney campaign what are the loopholes he plans to remove that make a 20% across the board tax cut revenue neutral?
 
MFL
2012-10-08 12:08:14 PM  
Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
t0.gstatic.com
 
2012-10-08 12:08:55 PM  

MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]



I hope they're paying you overtime
 
2012-10-08 12:09:14 PM  

SithLord: octag


I have a feeling Biden would crush Ryan in a cage match. Let's not forget Ryan claims to have athletic prowess that he doesn't have, and I don't think Biden feels pain.

Seriously though I'm not saying Biden will win the debate, but he will not come out like he did in the Palin debate. He was being nice to Palin, you simply do not curb stomp an intellectual retard.

Then again Ryan is kind of an intellectual retard.
 
2012-10-08 12:14:56 PM  

Fart_Machine: MFL: Cuthbert Allgood
I said I was nervous before the presidential debate but I tried to convince myself to relax by saying, "don't worry, Obama's got this!" and look how that worked out....

/I'm concerned for this one too... They both seem like wildcards to me when it comes to the debate. It seems Biden kept it pretty simple when debating Palin, not sure how he's going to handle the streaming lies coming from Ryan...

You can tell when someone is losing because they bring out the whole "pack of lies" defense.
Princeton Economist: Obama Campaign Is Misrepresenting My Study on Romney's Tax Plan

Link

Mitt shattered 6 months and millions of dollars worth of negative campaign adds the Obama administration had been running in one night with a record number of people watching.

Mitt Romney is now not only seen as that dreaded "acceptable alternative"....To anyone who isn't drinking Obama cool-aid He is the superior of the two and the president now has to throw as much shiat at the wall as he can and some of it hope it sticks to slow down the erosion of a lead that was never there to begin with.

Hype will only get you so far without results.

Since you seem to work for the Romney campaign what are the loopholes he plans to remove that make a 20% across the board tax cut revenue neutral?


Oh never mind. The WS makes the assumption that Supply Side actually works. LOL!
 
2012-10-08 12:15:01 PM  

LesterB: Wicked Chinchilla: t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: It really blindsided Obama.

To be fair, Obama prepared to debate the positions Romney had advocated during most of his campaign. He wasn't prepared for Romney to essentially steal Obama's positions, add in a bullet-pointed list, and throw in a layer of, "I can cut taxes better than him."

Oh, I fully realize that. My question is how, in fact, DO you respond to that effectively? I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?" You wouldn't think an adequate response would even be necessary since its so obviously ridiculous. But yet, here we are.

imageshack.us


Yep.
 
2012-10-08 12:17:09 PM  

MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]


He was lying, objectively speaking. shiat he contradicted himself in the same farking debate.

I mean, what do you want, that we pretend he wasn't?
 
2012-10-08 12:17:52 PM  

Mad_Radhu: What is interesting is that this debate technique is very similar to the strategy that was perfected at Libery University, which seems like it has pretty much caused college debate to devolve into almost exactly what you describe:

"O'Donnell calls debate "a game of the mind," but it is also a sport that requires strength and stamina. Contests last 92 minutes, and each debater on each two-person team speaks three times - opening arguments, cross-examination and closing arguments - for a total of 23 minutes. At some tournaments, teams have five matches a day.

Debaters gulp air like competitive swimmers. Melissa Hurter, a senior from Huntsville, Ala., talked at high speed for nine full seconds between breaths (she and her partner Lindsey Hoban, a senior from Lake Ariel, Pa., keep in shape by playing wind instruments). The Trinity debaters sucked air after only five seconds and sounded as if they were drowning. Liberty won handily.

There is a tactical logic to speed-talking. Arguments - even nonsensical or irrelevant arguments - must be rebutted. Those left unanswered count against you. The faster you talk, the more arguments you can make, and the better your chance to rack up points. Debaters carry their ammunition, files of every possible argument and rebuttal, in 14-gallon plastic tubs."


I can see where that tactic would be effective in a competitive setting, but political debates play to the crowd, not to people with clipboards and standardized criteria.

The speed-talking technique could likely be countered by reframing the debate. Grab one flimsy thing they said that would have caught the audience's attention, then shift the entire argument to that point and beat them over the head with it. If you can thoroughly discredit someone on a single, important point, everything else they say loses its bite.
 
2012-10-08 12:21:09 PM  

TheBigJerk: MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]

He was lying, objectively speaking. shiat he contradicted himself in the same farking debate.

I mean, what do you want, that we pretend he wasn't?


He wants Romney to win Obama to lose, even if it means an unpredictable plutocrat inveterate liar in office.
 
2012-10-08 12:21:20 PM  
Could Biden just walk over, grab Ryan, slam Ryan over his knee--breaking Ryan's back, then throw the still warm body into the crowd?

Talk about sending a message.

/this entry is in no way a suggestion, urging, demand or plan to have anyone hurt or killed
 
2012-10-08 12:24:49 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Odds are that the VP debate will simply be a mirror of the Presidential debate. It almost always is. Expect the Romney team to score 2-3 more points


You sound so edgy and cool. Too bad you cant get those 2-3 points as if it were some kind of football game.
 
2012-10-08 12:28:03 PM  

Jiro Dreams Of McRibs: Could Biden just walk over, grab Ryan, slam Ryan over his knee--breaking Ryan's back, then throw the still warm body into the crowd?

Talk about sending a message.

/this entry is in no way a suggestion, urging, demand or plan to have anyone hurt or killed


in a fight I have to go with Ryan over Biden. However, if they race for pink slips, I am pretty sure Joey B has the upper hand

i1.nyt.com
 
2012-10-08 12:34:02 PM  

skullkrusher: Jiro Dreams Of McRibs: Could Biden just walk over, grab Ryan, slam Ryan over his knee--breaking Ryan's back, then throw the still warm body into the crowd?

Talk about sending a message.

/this entry is in no way a suggestion, urging, demand or plan to have anyone hurt or killed

in a fight I have to go with Ryan over Biden. However, if they race for pink slips, I am pretty sure Joey B has the upper hand


... as long as the judges don't take too close a look under the hood. Big Joe's Trans Am ain't exactly street legal, but it soaks the panties like no other.
 
2012-10-08 12:34:41 PM  

The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.


What the hell? No thanks on your advice to Liberals. Obama's problem isn't anger management. Its anger OVERMANAGEMENT. He was sucking it in playing nice guy while Romney lied and aggressived all over him.
 
2012-10-08 12:36:59 PM  
Does it really matter if all Ryan does is lie? If someone other than his opponent calls him on his lies, things will be okay. If not, we're screwed. Ryan will lie and make things up and look personable. If Biden calls him on his lies, it will look unseemly. The moderator has to step in.
 
2012-10-08 12:36:59 PM  

imontheinternet: skullkrusher: Jiro Dreams Of McRibs: Could Biden just walk over, grab Ryan, slam Ryan over his knee--breaking Ryan's back, then throw the still warm body into the crowd?

Talk about sending a message.

/this entry is in no way a suggestion, urging, demand or plan to have anyone hurt or killed

in a fight I have to go with Ryan over Biden. However, if they race for pink slips, I am pretty sure Joey B has the upper hand

... as long as the judges don't take too close a look under the hood. Big Joe's Trans Am ain't exactly street legal, but it soaks the panties like no other.


Joe B - cherry poppin' daddy
 
2012-10-08 12:43:26 PM  

Kevin72: The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.

What the hell? No thanks on your advice to Liberals. Obama's problem isn't anger management. Its anger OVERMANAGEMENT. He was sucking it in playing nice guy while Romney lied and aggressived all over him.


I doubt he's still worried about "Angry Black Man" image, or perhaps, maybe he is still worried about it.

Michelle certainly avoids anything that can be cast as "Angry Black Woman", and she's said as much.
 
2012-10-08 12:44:10 PM  

imontheinternet: Mad_Radhu: What is interesting is that this debate technique is very similar to the strategy that was perfected at Libery University, which seems like it has pretty much caused college debate to devolve into almost exactly what you describe:

"O'Donnell calls debate "a game of the mind," but it is also a sport that requires strength and stamina. Contests last 92 minutes, and each debater on each two-person team speaks three times - opening arguments, cross-examination and closing arguments - for a total of 23 minutes. At some tournaments, teams have five matches a day.

Debaters gulp air like competitive swimmers. Melissa Hurter, a senior from Huntsville, Ala., talked at high speed for nine full seconds between breaths (she and her partner Lindsey Hoban, a senior from Lake Ariel, Pa., keep in shape by playing wind instruments). The Trinity debaters sucked air after only five seconds and sounded as if they were drowning. Liberty won handily.

There is a tactical logic to speed-talking. Arguments - even nonsensical or irrelevant arguments - must be rebutted. Those left unanswered count against you. The faster you talk, the more arguments you can make, and the better your chance to rack up points. Debaters carry their ammunition, files of every possible argument and rebuttal, in 14-gallon plastic tubs."

I can see where that tactic would be effective in a competitive setting, but political debates play to the crowd, not to people with clipboards and standardized criteria.

The speed-talking technique could likely be countered by reframing the debate. Grab one flimsy thing they said that would have caught the audience's attention, then shift the entire argument to that point and beat them over the head with it. If you can thoroughly discredit someone on a single, important point, everything else they say loses its bite.


Are you guys seriously suggesting that this should look like forensic league debates? This one was from a UIL state meet in Texas...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D20PppPIOc
 
2012-10-08 12:45:25 PM  

Kevin72: The Great EZE: Holy shiat, the number of back-handed swipes at the President's performance in TFA would make Free Republic proud.

Liberals really need to get their anger-management in check, and I'm saying this as a 100% sincere left-of-centrist. I know Obama represents the last best hope to keep Conservatives from running roughshod over the country, but if you want him to start acting like a petulant, combative message board user don't hold your breath.

Liberals are supposed to be the ones with facts and reason on their side. Now they want to be the ones who play in the muck of lies and empty bluster against those with far more experience? I expected better.

What the hell? No thanks on your advice to Liberals. Obama's problem isn't anger management. Its anger OVERMANAGEMENT. He was sucking it in playing nice guy while Romney lied and aggressived all over him.


I agree. That's why I didn't direct my post toward Obama but rather toward his frustrated "supporters."

Look, there are at least three good reasons why Obama doesn't act the way garden variety liberals want him to act: 1) That's not in his personality makeup, 2) he's not a garden variety liberal, 3) garden variety liberal aren't running for President! When your only responsibility is to yourself and maybe other message board members who'll see your posts you have tremendous liberty to run as hot with anger as you want. When you're responsible for the entire nation--liberals, conservatives, independents, libertarians, apathetics, and all points in between--you can't just fly off the handle and turn the debate into an episode of Judge Judy.

Like the old meme says: everyone calm the fark down; he's got this.

/Romney's bump is even normalizing now, as bumps are wont to do
 
2012-10-08 12:53:38 PM  

MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]


Both Romney and Ryan have lied. Romney lied through his teeth at the debate. He said the exact opposite of more than one of his previous positions.

Both of them are objectively liars, in that they have repeatedly made statements that they knew or should have known to be totally false.

You cannot escape this fact, regardless of how many pictures you post.
 
2012-10-08 01:08:56 PM  
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-10-08 01:11:21 PM  
Given that Obama was supposed to be the smart one and he's going up against Paul Ryan, I would not be too hopeful for Biden's chances.
 
2012-10-08 01:55:40 PM  

beta_plus: Given that Obama was supposed to be the smart one and he's going up against Paul Ryan, I would not be too hopeful for Biden's chances.


That only means you don't know much about Biden. He's got over 30 years experience in the Senate debating folks. Biden is bright, and you'd have to remove one of the hemispheres of his brain to bring him down to Ryan's level. If the ticket had been reversed (Biden for POTUS and Obama for VP) I'd have voted D for the first time instead of voting for McCain.

Ryan is unscrupulous, so he could make things hard for Biden by pulling a Romney and just spontaneously swapping positions when he's up on stage, but I've heard Biden humiliate smarter than Ryan before so I'm not sure that would work quite as well against Biden. Obama is too polite and measured for his own good.
 
2012-10-08 02:17:31 PM  

Aarontology: xanadian: Anyway, I do suspect that Biden will mop the floor with Ryan, but then again, Ryan isn't a complete tard like Palin. Even Bowles says Ryan's good at math-ing things and stuff...

Ryan's problem is that when he starts talking about the maths and such, he goes on and on at length. if it were a free form discussion format or something similar where he had time to explain, he'd do better. As it is, he's had to use the "I don't have time to explain" big when pressed about the Romney/Ryan tax and spending plans.


Well that and unlike Obama, Biden might call Ryan out on some of the more far fetched parts of their policy.
 
2012-10-08 02:20:44 PM  

mongbiohazard: beta_plus: Given that Obama was supposed to be the smart one and he's going up against Paul Ryan, I would not be too hopeful for Biden's chances.

That only means you don't know much about Biden. He's got over 30 years experience in the Senate debating folks. Biden is bright, and you'd have to remove one of the hemispheres of his brain to bring him down to Ryan's level. If the ticket had been reversed (Biden for POTUS and Obama for VP) I'd have voted D for the first time instead of voting for McCain.

Ryan is unscrupulous, so he could make things hard for Biden by pulling a Romney and just spontaneously swapping positions when he's up on stage, but I've heard Biden humiliate smarter than Ryan before so I'm not sure that would work quite as well against Biden. Obama is too polite and measured for his own good.


I always get the impression that Ryan is one of those types who gets upset and takes their ball home when things don't go their way.

Just look at that Fox News interview with Mike Wallace's son. Wallace kept asking him about the details of the policy and Ryan kept trying to dodge it and change the question.

He really seems to be the kind of person that doesn't know what to do when he's not in control of the conversation.

/But then again, maybe I'm wrong.
 
2012-10-08 02:24:17 PM  

randomjsa: If Biden brings the campaign to where it belongs then Obama will be behind nationally in every poll by about 10-20 points.


With as much hate coursing through your veins, I honestly am surprised we haven't seen you on the national news.

"Internet recluse and reputed groin-flogger accused of murdering 13 children who got the reduced-cost lunch at their elementary school."
 
2012-10-08 02:26:32 PM  

MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]


Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt. Also I personally hate America and I'm fat.


But why do you hate America?
 
2012-10-08 02:32:25 PM  

KrispyKritter: enjoy your smoke & mirrors, folks. election 2012 debate theatre is merely the most expensive pay-per-view event in history and the pugilists are making sure those ringside are getting plenty of entertainment for their dollar.

those cocksuckers don't fool me for one damn minute.


Except it's completely free to watch.

/throw in a "sheeple" next time
//I mean come ON
 
2012-10-08 02:55:25 PM  

Brick-House: [2.bp.blogspot.com image 640x309]


That might be the very first conservative cartoon ever posted on this site that wasn't cataclysmically unfunny. It's not funny, mind, but there are elements of actual humor in it, which is fairly shocking.
 
Bf+
2012-10-08 03:16:20 PM  

cptrios: Brick-House: [2.bp.blogspot.com image 640x309]

That might be the very first conservative cartoon ever posted on this site that wasn't cataclysmically unfunny. It's not funny, mind, but there are elements of actual humor in it, which is fairly shocking.


It's almost funny, but not on purpose. When I first read it I was thinking Joe's "God love 'em they suck at debating" was directed at Ryan with the implication that, not only had he practiced with a boxing kangaroo, but he's thinking "Yeah, damn straight I boxed a kangaroo. Duh. How do you pussies practice?" If you remove the unnessesary middle panel it's funnier.
 
2012-10-08 03:55:21 PM  

Bf+: It's almost funny, but not on purpose. When I first read it I was thinking Joe's "God love 'em they suck at debating" was directed at Ryan with the implication that, not only had he practiced with a boxing kangaroo, but he's thinking "Yeah, damn straight I boxed a kangaroo. Duh. How do you pussies practice?" If you remove the unnessesary middle panel it's funnier.


Yeah, shiat, I'd vote for Biden if he boxed a kangaroo. That's like Teddy Roosevelt level of badassery.
 
2012-10-08 04:15:34 PM  
A caricature of Biden as everyone's crazy uncle has taken hold the last few years...He has a chance this week to change his image a bit with millions of voters - and his own party.

Why would he want to?
 
2012-10-08 04:23:04 PM  

impaler: Politically apathetic people generally don't watch VP debates.


Not sure about that. A lot of people seem to watch the debates like they would watch a boxing match or a rap battle.

And Biden is entertaining.
 
2012-10-08 04:28:12 PM  

ghare: BIden has actually boxed,


Boxing seems to be good training for politics. Biden, Reid, also Jerry Brown were boxers.

Acting also seems to be an applicable skill.

CEO, not so much.
 
2012-10-08 04:31:29 PM  

TheBigJerk: I mean, its such a lie people who actually know the policy positions were all saying "who the fark is this guy and where did you put Mitt Romney?"


I think "who are you, and what did you do with Mitt Romney?" could be a reasonable retort when faced with a wall of bullshiat.
 
2012-10-08 04:31:36 PM  

Karne: MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt. Also I personally hate America and I'm fat.

But why do you hate America?


Don't you mean Amerika?
 
2012-10-08 04:32:42 PM  

Cletus C.: Karne: MFL: [assets.nydailynews.com image 635x569]

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt. Also I personally hate America and I'm fat.

But why do you hate America?

Don't you mean Amerika?


Don't you mean Real America™?
 
2012-10-08 04:35:06 PM  

JerseyTim: Make sure you watch this debate on C-SPAN, which does the whole thing in close-up split screen. Biden's reactions to Ryan will be worth it.


I already bought my tickets to watch it on the big screen at the Alamo Drafthouse.
 
2012-10-08 04:35:19 PM  

MFL: When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout.


BUT HE DID LIE ON A NUMBER OF ISSUES.

We're calling him a liar BECAUSE HE IS ONE.
 
2012-10-08 04:49:32 PM  

The Great EZE: TheBigJerk: MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]

He was lying, objectively speaking. shiat he contradicted himself in the same farking debate.

I mean, what do you want, that we pretend he wasn't?

He wants Romney to win Obama to lose, even if it means an unpredictable plutocrat inveterate liar in office.


Then he will have shown us. Then he will have shown us ALL!!!!

Muahhahahahaha...

MUAHAHAHAHAH....
 
2012-10-08 04:51:03 PM  

skullkrusher: I'm surprised that this foolproof way to win a debate hasn't been discovered in the thousands of years humans have been engaging in formal rhetorical exercises


Have you thought about offering your services as a debate coach?
 
2012-10-08 06:01:00 PM  

Cletus C.: The fact is, Ryan is much younger, a fitness freak and the macho animal killer guy. Biden likes to come across as the tough guy but Ryan should kick his butt.

The debate will be in an octagon, won't it?


I think doing P90x betrays one as a fitness know-nothing more than anything else.
 
2012-10-08 06:50:37 PM  

t3knomanser: Wicked Chinchilla: why does he always wear suits that are too big?

I'm gonna go out a limb and think that his opinion of how bulked P90x made him and how bulked he actually is aren't close. He just strikes me as the kind of guy that is a walking mid-life crisis looking for a 20 year old stripper to bang.


20 year old college boy to bang.
 
2012-10-08 06:52:22 PM  
You know....part of me wants the pre debate shows on tv to show a trans-am with Foreigner blasting pulling up to the auditorium and out comes Biden. It would seriously shut down the internet. The only thing better would be Jim Ross doing the announcing of him pulling up.


BY GAWD!!! BIDEN IS HERE!!! BIDEN IS HERE!! WE'RE GONNA HAVE A SLOBBERKNOCKER NOW!!
 
2012-10-08 07:11:51 PM  
In lieu of a debate I propose Biden just tells us stories about hot nights cruising around in the Trans Am.
 
2012-10-08 07:18:31 PM  

mongbiohazard: That only means you don't know much about Biden. He's got over 30 years experience in the Senate debating folks. Biden is bright, and you'd have to remove one of the hemispheres of his brain to bring him down to Ryan's level. If the ticket had been reversed (Biden for POTUS and Obama for VP) I'd have voted D for the first time instead of voting for McCain.


If you like Biden that much, why did you vote for his polar opposite?
 
2012-10-08 08:15:52 PM  

TheBigJerk: MFL: Wyalt Derp "Mr Moderator, please could I get some more paper? I'm trying to keep a count of all Mr Ryan's lies, and I've run out of space."

When all else fails.....call you opponent a liar and pout. 
[t0.gstatic.com image 209x241]

He was lying, objectively speaking. shiat he contradicted himself in the same farking debate.

I mean, what do you want, that we pretend he wasn't?


He knows Ryan is a liar. FFS, Ryan couldn't even tell the truth when asked a softball question about his hobbies (Incidentally, I ran the Chicago marathon in 38 minutes, and that included a 6 minute stop for a slice of pizza). But you're asking for logic from someone who's had a steady glut of AM radio and bloggers telling him its all the libs fault that he's overweight, unemployed, bald, and still lives with his parents. He'd be a captain of industry if it wasn't for their sneaky tricks.

At this point, MFing Idiot would live at the bottom of a Peruvian outhouse if he thought it would "stick it to the libs."
 
2012-10-08 08:57:33 PM  
I'm expecting Biden to show up in black face.
 
2012-10-08 10:07:08 PM  
One of Biden's best debate lines EVER! Link
 
2012-10-08 11:44:31 PM  

EnviroDude: When you have to put your hope in a plagiarizing gaffe prone fool like Biden, give it up man....cause you are done.


Yes, raise expectations for Ryan. Good, very good.
 
2012-10-09 12:59:01 AM  

Tyrone Slothrop: Because Lloyd Benson wiping the floor with Quayle really changed the election outcome.


The consensus afterwards among Democrats I knew was they had the wrong guy at the top of the ticket, should have been Bentsen for president, not that clueless twit from Massachusetts
 
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