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(The American Interest)   Social Security runs in the red for a second straight year, but no biggy - our government's obligations are 100% backed by government obligations, which are backed by government obligations backed by government obligations   (blogs.the-american-interest.com) divider line 198
    More: Fail, social security, Capitol Hill  
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3336 clicks; posted to Politics » on 04 Oct 2012 at 10:51 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-04 02:20:50 PM  
SOCIAL SECURITY, EXPLAINED

You
: Pantubo, here's $100,000. Please give it back to me, with interest, when I retire.
Me: Sure!

[next day]

You: Nice Ferrari! Wow! Hold on... did you spend my money on a Ferrari?
Me: No, you ignorant slut. I loaned the money to Pantubo Incorporated, and they bought it. Don't worry, they left a signed IOU and everything.


You: I see that's your signature. But, OK. I take it this car will help the business? Maybe impress some clients or something?
Me: Ha! No. We just pick up garbage in the neighborhood.

You: That's alarming. But, OK, as long as the business is profitable.
Me: Are you insane? We are $16 trillion in the hole, and we lose another $1.5 trillion per year.

You: I am officially terrified. How on Earth are you going to get me my $100K plus interest?
Me: Well, hopefully you will die soon. If not, we'll just jack up the garbage collection fees.
You: But I live here. How much more will I have to pay?
Me: Shouldn't be much more than $100K when all is said and done.
 
2012-10-04 02:35:07 PM  

AcneVulgaris: But don't let that stop you wanking off about armageddon fantasies.


I don't think you have any idea what this discussion is about.
 
2012-10-04 02:37:17 PM  
I'm a little confused by TFA. Of course the SS fund is backed by IOUs...why would they keep trillions just sitting around stagnant? What is actually scary here is not that the fund is backed by the government IOU's, it's that it's benefits owed are expected to completely deplete the fund (including all of the interest it's been saving) by 2033.

The combined assets of the Old-Age and Survivors Insurance, and Disability Insurance (OASDI) Trust Funds will be exhausted in 2033, three years sooner than projected last year. The DI Trust Fund will be exhausted in 2016, two years earlier than last year's estimate. The Trustees also project that OASDI program costs will exceed non-interest income in 2012 and will remain higher throughout the remainder of the 75-year period.

In the 2012 Annual Report to Congress, the Trustees announced:

1. The projected point at which the combined Trust Funds will be exhausted comes in 2033 - three years sooner than projected last year. At that time, there will be sufficient non-interest income coming in to pay about 75 percent of scheduled benefits.

2. The projected actuarial deficit over the 75-year long-range period is 2.67 percent of taxable payroll -- 0.44 percentage point larger than in last year's report.

3. Over the 75-year period, the Trust Funds would require additional revenue equivalent to $8.6 trillion in present value dollars to pay all scheduled benefits.

Link

A far more interesting (and frightening) article than TFA. Democrats are completely accurate in saying that it's OK for now because it's backed by the government (because the fund's assets does actually have enough with interest over the years)--however, what's completely inaccurate to say is that it'll forever be OK because it's backed by the government (and no politician would be stupid enough to state this). It's obvious to everyone involved that the SS fund needs to get more money now "somehow" so it can "spread the pain" of paying off the benefits owed in the future. It's the "somehow" that's debated.

/The longer we wait, the more painful it's going to be.
 
2012-10-04 02:38:41 PM  

SuperT: RumsfeldsReplacement: Don't worry. Once 0bummer is out of office, we'll cut taxes and balance the budget then there will be higher employment, higher wages, which mean Social Security will be saved.

He won't lower taxes! he's gonna lower rates! those are totes different words!


Do you not understand agi? Virtually nobody pays the standard rates. There are adjustments made on gross income. Take revenue can be raised by eliminating adjustments. This is not complex tax theory.
 
2012-10-04 02:39:01 PM  
I think we should sell Afghanistan.
 
2012-10-04 02:39:10 PM  

Vegan Meat Popsicle: bunner: So, snotty insulting wanker STILL = intellectual acuity? Oh, internets, as long as we have you, we'll ALWAYS be the smartest kid in 8th grade! *snort* Bye. : )

If you weren't so dumb you'd have actually replied instead of tucking your tail and running.

Why don't you convert your faith-money into gold, smart guy? What's stopping you if it's such a wondrous idea?


Flaming troll is flaming.
 
2012-10-04 02:45:51 PM  

FarkGrudge: A far more interesting (and frightening) article than TFA. Democrats are completely accurate in saying that it's OK for now because it's backed by the government (because the fund's assets does actually have enough with interest over the years)--however, what's completely inaccurate to say is that it'll forever be OK because it's backed by the government (and no politician would be stupid enough to state this). It's obvious to everyone involved that the SS fund needs to get more money now "somehow" so it can "spread the pain" of paying off the benefits owed in the future. It's the "somehow" that's debated.

/The longer we wait, the more painful it's going to be.


I forgot to put my footnote that when I say it's "OK for now" I mean the fund could pay for itself. There are already provisions in place that would automatically cut benefits by 2016 when the DI Trust Fund is exhausted, for example. Meaning, there will be other issues well before it's completely depleted in 2033...just trying to say that the "final doomsday" for this program is already set and expected.
 
2012-10-04 02:46:17 PM  

Alonjar: iheartscotch: I know you guys really don't like bush; but I like his idea for individual accounts; where you put your money and you have control over it after you are retired. If you have to pay into that account over a lifetime; you'd be set. And the government could still use that money for it's own purposes; as long as they paid 3% interest, and they guaranteed the account for the entire amount of money inside.

/ but something that simple and sane will never happen

The problem is that you are relying on private equity investments by doing this. Imagine if you planned to retire in 2008... just when your investments lost 70% of their value.


People dont cash out tgeur 401k in single years. Your scenario is illogical.
 
2012-10-04 02:48:16 PM  

Tax Boy: If only there was some sort of income limit on paying the social security funding tax that could be raised.

If only.


That limit also limits pay outs. Please get educated in how social security works. The cap affects both ends.
 
2012-10-04 02:48:22 PM  

number8: JackieRabbit: Retarded right wing blog bullshiat. SS almost always pays out more than it collects in payroll taxes, especially when unemployment is at 8%. These taxes are invested by the SS Trust.

But it's pretty darn good trollin'!

Just in case you're being serious, the social security "trust fund" contains nothing but government IOUs. There's no actual money there.


Those "government IOUs" are US Treasury bonds. Good luck getting a Treasury bondholder to give you one without you giving them "actual money" for it.
 
2012-10-04 02:50:11 PM  
this thread is depressing and needs more funny images posted
 
2012-10-04 02:51:18 PM  

FeFiFoFark: this thread is depressing and needs more funny images posted


sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2012-10-04 02:51:39 PM  
Sorry but the only solution to this problem is to put a cap on your life of 66.3 years.
Think of the children.
 
2012-10-04 03:02:45 PM  
If the United States were a mom and pop sore, it'd be nailed shut with plywood and they'd be repo-ing the Pepsi coolers and smokes.
 
2012-10-04 03:04:02 PM  

Vectron: Sorry but the only solution to this problem is to put a cap on your life of 66.3 years.
Think of the children.


In Time.
Link

The clock will start ticking at age 25.
 
2012-10-04 03:06:08 PM  

Beerguy: HeadLever: LemSkroob: Thanks Boomers, for not funding your own retirement.

They paid into the system and have accumulated about 2.5 Trillion into the 'Trust Fund'. The boomers did thier part. It was the goverment that spent all of the money and left the Trust Fund as a stack of IOUs.

So much this.....this needs to be shouted from the mountaintops!!!


Yes and who's government was that? It certainly wasn't the current generations.
 
2012-10-04 03:06:16 PM  

Vectron: Sorry but the only solution to this problem is to put a cap on your life of 66.3 years.
Think of the children.


If your society needs to kill off old people to remain economically stable, your society sucks fat walrus cock. : )

du-knallkopf.net
 
2012-10-04 03:07:40 PM  

Thunderpipes: burning_bridge: Well if your boy Bush hadn't raided the fund to hand out OUR money to his rich asshole friends we wouldn't need to worry about this crap now, would we???

Emphasis on OUR money there because it most definitely is. In case you weren't aware SS has a cap on how much it takes out from your wages, ie it's only based on the first $100k or so of your income. So the lion share of it is paid by the average American. And it was from this that we had a surplus and from that surplus we got the biggest hand-out in history to a group of people who paid relatively little into it. 

THERE'S YOUR DISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH, TEATARDS.

Your retardism, it is full.



Nice point you came nowhere close to making there. Care to try again? With substance this time?
 
2012-10-04 03:09:59 PM  

boarch: Flaming troll is flaming.


So you put me on ignore on your original account.... and then come back and try to start shiat on your sockpuppet?

Go away, obvious alt. If you want to be a twat, be a twat on your original account.
 
2012-10-04 03:17:41 PM  
Welcome to the 1980's son.
 
2012-10-04 03:26:15 PM  

Pantubo: Ass Exploder: Does anyone seriously not understand that the federal government PRINTS MONEY and CANNOT POSSIBLY RUN OUT OF MONEY?

That there is not a limited supply of money in the world, it is printed and created out of nothing by the government?

Not sure if this is brilliant sarcasm.

Can a guy named Ass Exploder really come up with such brilliant sarcasm?


Well, jon stewert did do something on the reserve giving 7 trillion to banks, Link, as well as the fractional reserve banking system where for each dollar they have, they create loans out of thin air based on their reserve ratio and target set rate set by the central bank. So it's true to an extent I think.

I don't think what he's saying is that the reserve just creates money to have it lying around, at least as far as I can figure out.
 
2012-10-04 03:35:12 PM  

tonguedepressor: I think we should sell Afghanistan.


And screw the CIA out of all the drug money! What are you thinking?
 
2012-10-04 03:39:26 PM  

links136:
Yes and who's government was that? It certainly wasn't the current generations.


Ask Al Gore. Maybe he has found the lockbox by now.
 
2012-10-04 03:50:22 PM  

bunner: If the United States were a mom and pop sore, it'd be nailed shut with plywood and they'd be repo-ing the Pepsi coolers and smokes.


If the U.S. were a strip club, it'd be all daytime strippers with meth mouth, C-section scars and pancake boobs.

This is fun. I'm gonna see if I can come up with some more ...
 
2012-10-04 03:50:41 PM  

links136: Beerguy: HeadLever: LemSkroob: Thanks Boomers, for not funding your own retirement.

They paid into the system and have accumulated about 2.5 Trillion into the 'Trust Fund'. The boomers did thier part. It was the goverment that spent all of the money and left the Trust Fund as a stack of IOUs.

So much this.....this needs to be shouted from the mountaintops!!!

Yes and who's government was that? It certainly wasn't the current generations.


Try back in 1937 the so called "Greatest Genreration"

Helvering vs. Davis (1937) U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Social Security was not an insurance program: "The proceeds of both taxes [employee and employer ] are to be paid into the Treasury like internal revenue taxes generally, and are not ear-marked in any way."

Helvering v. Davis No. 910 SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES
 
2012-10-04 03:53:49 PM  
If the U.S. was a car, it'd be a 1982 Ford Fiesta with a cracked windshield, a driver's side door that doesn't close completely and an ashtray full of cigarette butts.
 
2012-10-04 03:57:34 PM  
If the U.S. was a hamburger, it'd be a half-eaten one from McDonald's that your kid stuffed under the back seat of your car 5 years ago.
 
2012-10-04 04:16:28 PM  
hall.hdfillms.netdna-cdn.com

That one's a car, 275 thou... might want to hold onto that one.
 
2012-10-04 04:32:13 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: If the U.S. was a hamburger, it'd be a half-eaten one from McDonald's that your kid stuffed under the back seat of your car 5 years ago.


If the U.S. was ya mama, she'd be soooooo fat. : )
 
2012-10-04 04:32:41 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: If the U.S. was a hamburger, it'd be a half-eaten one from McDonald's that your kid stuffed under the back seat of your car 5 years ago.


If the United States was a corperation; it would be Enron.
 
2012-10-04 04:34:13 PM  

LoveRBS: I think it's a damn good thing we know how badly we're being screwed.

We have little to no faith in this system, which leads us to be more self-dependent. Yes there are those of us who are not on the dole and frankly don't expect it to be there when it comes times.

I understand you can defer receiving payments? That'll probably be a bulk of my generations strategy. Save save, work work, until the day when you absolutely cannot anymore. The smart people will realize that their grandparents' retirement will be vastly different from their own and will enjoy their lives earlier

Anyway I'd rather have Medicare than Social Security so as long as that's okay.... : - /


Compared to the projected deficit in Medicare, SS isn't even worth talking about....
 
2012-10-04 04:35:09 PM  
If the United States was an operating system; it would be windows vista.
 
2012-10-04 04:39:34 PM  
If the United States was a television show; it would be "here comes honey boo boo".
 
2012-10-04 04:41:28 PM  

iheartscotch: Smelly Pirate Hooker: If the U.S. was a hamburger, it'd be a half-eaten one from McDonald's that your kid stuffed under the back seat of your car 5 years ago.

If the United States was a corperation; it would be Enron.


The United States *is* a corporation. And they're moving the head office. Away. If you look outside, you can see the ass end of the getaway car.
 
2012-10-04 04:44:12 PM  

bunner: iheartscotch: Smelly Pirate Hooker: If the U.S. was a hamburger, it'd be a half-eaten one from McDonald's that your kid stuffed under the back seat of your car 5 years ago.

If the United States was a corperation; it would be Enron.

The United States *is* a corporation. And they're moving the head office. Away. If you look outside, you can see the ass end of the getaway car.


If the United States was a getaway car driver; it would be Tyrone from Snatch.
 
2012-10-04 04:47:52 PM  
If the United States was a fraud; it would be a Ponzi Scheme.
 
2012-10-04 04:55:07 PM  

RumsfeldsReplacement: ddam: We knew it was going to run in the red 60 years ago when the baby boom happened. Maybe if we actually put all the surpluss we had thus far in a lockbox and not raid that fund for wars, tax cuts and other programs that were not paid for we would not have a problem.

But what idiot would propose such a lockbox?

Better yet, instead of taking people's money, only to return it to them 50 years later (heavily devalued), maybe people could invest in a retirement fund of their choice, that actually appreciates.

 
2012-10-04 05:17:02 PM  
upload.wikimedia.org

Any questions?
 
2012-10-04 05:34:03 PM  

olddinosaur: [upload.wikimedia.org image 600x300]

(on hundred trillion dollar note) Any questions?


You know what's funny about inflation? It proves that money has no intrinsic value, the numbers are arbitrary and the point is to use it to leverage actual wealth or just get by, depending on which end of the sucker you get to lick.

"Your bill is 100,000.00, sir."

*scribbles three zeros on a C- note* "Here ya go, pal."

Ha, ha ha. Our economy is based on poor people needing to bob for rotten apples with nifty bits of magnetic ink on them.
 
2012-10-04 05:36:40 PM  

GranoblasticMan: bunner: "This currency is backed by the full faith and credit of the United States Government."

And nothing else.

At ALL.

Ah, ha ha. Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?

By the entire world? Yeah. I honestly can't think of a single country that doesn't use fractional-reserve banking.


There are still a few small republics that use currency backed by precious metals.
 
2012-10-04 05:57:01 PM  

links136: Pantubo: Ass Exploder: Does anyone seriously not understand that the federal government PRINTS MONEY and CANNOT POSSIBLY RUN OUT OF MONEY?

That there is not a limited supply of money in the world, it is printed and created out of nothing by the government?

Not sure if this is brilliant sarcasm.

Can a guy named Ass Exploder really come up with such brilliant sarcasm?

Well, jon stewert did do something on the reserve giving 7 trillion to banks, Link, as well as the fractional reserve banking system where for each dollar they have, they create loans out of thin air based on their reserve ratio and target set rate set by the central bank. So it's true to an extent I think.

I don't think what he's saying is that the reserve just creates money to have it lying around, at least as far as I can figure out.


It's ironic - if not encouraging - to hear a lib, like Stewart, condemn the central banking system.
 
2012-10-04 08:01:06 PM  
The United States is so poor, achingachingaching said our Chinese overlords.
 
2012-10-04 09:08:39 PM  

Vegan Meat Popsicle: AcneVulgaris: But don't let that stop you wanking off about armageddon fantasies.

I don't think you have any idea what this discussion is about.


That's what happens when I chat with a crazy bum at the library.
 
2012-10-04 09:11:27 PM  
Yeah, right. US Treasury bonds are just this side of toilet paper.
 
2012-10-04 09:13:36 PM  

olddinosaur: [upload.wikimedia.org image 600x300]

Any questions?


You guys have been predicting dire inflation for years. Where is it?
 
2012-10-04 10:03:16 PM  

olddinosaur: [upload.wikimedia.org image 600x300]

Any questions?


Why don't you go fark yourself?
 
2012-10-04 10:51:16 PM  

olddinosaur: [upload.wikimedia.org image 600x300]

Any questions?


Yeah... why the fark are negros building cairns and printing their likeness on cheap toilet paper? That's really offensive to the ancient Europeans who put a lot of religious weight into their cairn building practices.
 
2012-10-06 04:36:02 AM  

Beerguy: HeadLever: LemSkroob: Thanks Boomers, for not funding your own retirement.

They paid into the system and have accumulated about 2.5 Trillion into the 'Trust Fund'. The boomers did thier part. It was the goverment that spent all of the money and left the Trust Fund as a stack of IOUs.

So much this.....this needs to be shouted from the mountaintops!!!


Who was running the government when all this money went away.

/oh right. boomers.
//I knew at the age of 10 or so I'd have no social security when I'm old
///already bought my 12 gauge shotgun shell and labeled it "This way to retirement" in case I can't get bullets then either.
 
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