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(The Daily Dolt)   Hasidic Jewish group hosts a friendly meeting with Holocaust-denier Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to present him with an award for his "exemplary" criticism of Israel and his love for the Jewish people. Yeah, we don't get it either   (thedailydolt.com) divider line 85
    More: Weird, Jewish, criticism of Israel, Neturei Karta, Holocaust, Hasidic Judaism, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad  
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1273 clicks; posted to Politics » on 01 Oct 2012 at 11:51 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-10-01 07:36:27 AM
Wait, even if they're ok with his stance on Israel, why are they cool with him calling them criminals and denying the Holocaust?
 
2012-10-01 08:07:26 AM
Oy vey

/sorry
 
2012-10-01 09:23:34 AM

So much fail. Let me count the ways

Mahmoud Ahmadenijad to present him with an award. Did you mean Ahmadinejad?
• Hasidic Jewish Group Neturei Karta. Not representative. Ths isn't the first time they did this, either.
• Ahmadinejad doesnt control the military.

In practice, however, presidential powers are circumscribed by the clerics and conservatives in Iran's power structure, and by the authority of the Supreme Leader. It is the Supreme Leader, not the president, who controls the armed forces and makes decisions on security, defence and major foreign policy issues.


Our nations level of understanding on this topic, as a whole, is abysmal. The submissions here are just getting worse and worse.
 
2012-10-01 09:39:56 AM

Party Boy: So much fail. Let me count the ways

• Mahmoud Ahmadenijad to present him with an award. Did you mean Ahmadinejad?
• Hasidic Jewish Group Neturei Karta. Not representative. Ths isn't the first time they did this, either.
• Ahmadinejad doesnt control the military. In practice, however, presidential powers are circumscribed by the clerics and conservatives in Iran's power structure, and by the authority of the Supreme Leader. It is the Supreme Leader, not the president, who controls the armed forces and makes decisions on security, defence and major foreign policy issues.

Our nations level of understanding on this topic, as a whole, is abysmal. The submissions here are just getting worse and worse.


1.) Where is it even spelled like that?
2.) Uhhh, you realize this is the Fark Main page, right? It's not real news. It's a novelty. I don't think anyone is reading this and thinking it's representative of the current state of Middle East negotiations.
3.) Who said anything about the military?
 
2012-10-01 09:47:25 AM

LRA61380: 1.) Where is it even spelled like that?


Someone changed it

LRA61380: 2.) Uhhh, you realize this is the Fark Main page, right? It's not real news.


This is a bullshiat excuse, and has been so since the famous "Tatsuma - Iran" thread days.

LRA61380: 3.) Who said anything about the military?


What is Ahmadinejad in charge of? Why is this guy a focus? This is a good one.
 
2012-10-01 09:57:14 AM
This also makes me think of the complaints about the "overt" focus on the Israeli state here. Theres literally been an orgy of news this week on Netanyahu and US-Israeli-Iranian relations. US pundits are breaking with Netanyahu. Netanyahu putting his foot in his mouth. All just this this week. Major foreign policy stuff, global Photoshop jokes, etc.
Fark threads? Nah.

(last 7 days)
You have this dumb thread on a very fringe group.
Iran thread
Follow-up Iran thread
Dumb iran thread on a sniper rifle
Iranian diplomat chased through NYC streets
Iran drone
 
2012-10-01 10:12:46 AM

Party Boy: LRA61380: 1.) Where is it even spelled like that?

Someone changed it


You do realize that that transliteration of Arabic to Latinate letters doesn't necessarily carry identical spellings every time, right?
 
2012-10-01 10:19:28 AM

ArkAngel: You do realize that that transliteration of Arabic to Latinate letters doesn't necessarily carry identical spellings every time, right?


First of all, lets clarify that we are talking about the Perso-Arabic alphabet - where Arabic script was adapted to the Persian language.

That clarified, this particular political figure is in the news with such an amazing frequency, that people have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English.
 
2012-10-01 10:28:37 AM
i0.kym-cdn.com

Unavailable for comment.
 
2012-10-01 10:49:02 AM

Party Boy: ArkAngel: You do realize that that transliteration of Arabic to Latinate letters doesn't necessarily carry identical spellings every time, right?

First of all, lets clarify that we are talking about the Perso-Arabic alphabet - where Arabic script was adapted to the Persian language.

That clarified, this particular political figure is in the news with such an amazing frequency, that people have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English.


In any language with a different script, transliteration is variable, especially with longer names. Simply look at the name Mohammed. There are a dozen spellings. Or the word Muslim/Moslem. Both are equally acceptable, though generally used in different parts of the world.
 
2012-10-01 10:54:26 AM

ArkAngel: Simply look at the name Mohammed.


No analog needed.

Party Boy: First of all, lets clarify that we are talking about the Perso-Arabic alphabet - where Arabic script was adapted to the Persian language.

That clarified, this particular political figure is in the news with such an amazing frequency, that people have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English.


I'm not sure you should be continuing on when you got the name for the alphabet wrong. No, theyre not the same. Theres differences in the alphabet, and in the words they describe.

No need for an analog with their inherent similarities and differences. Look at this exact example. People have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English. Its the standard.
 
2012-10-01 10:56:17 AM
Many in the Orthodox community believe that only when the messiah comes back can there be a 3rd Israeli kingdom and temple, to them the modern state of Israel is an insult. To them to create a state of Israel before messianic redemption is an insult to god and going against his will. Most have at least made peace with the idea or at least found being on welfare in Israel beats hanging out in Iran. The Neturei Karta are an extreme fringe group that find the founding of Israel so insulting they join any group that opposes Israel. There are also those in the Ultra-Orthodox community that to square away their belief that god does everything for a reason have to find a reason behind the holocaust and link it to Zionism or more commonly Jewish secularism in Europe before the holocaust.
 
2012-10-01 11:03:33 AM

zedster: The Neturei Karta are an extreme fringe


I thought everyone knew this. its not even the first time theyve met with his highness, the Iranian in charge of.. erm... what.
 
2012-10-01 11:10:38 AM

Party Boy: ArkAngel: Simply look at the name Mohammed.

No analog needed.

Party Boy: First of all, lets clarify that we are talking about the Perso-Arabic alphabet - where Arabic script was adapted to the Persian language.

That clarified, this particular political figure is in the news with such an amazing frequency, that people have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English.

I'm not sure you should be continuing on when you got the name for the alphabet wrong. No, theyre not the same. Theres differences in the alphabet, and in the words they describe.

No need for an analog with their inherent similarities and differences. Look at this exact example. People have long settled on the spelling "Ahmadinejad" as the standard. The name has taken a life of its own in English. Its the standard.


Yes, I got the alphabet wrong, but it applies across all languages with different scripts. Chinese is also quite bad at it.
 
2012-10-01 11:12:18 AM

ArkAngel: Yes, I got the alphabet wrong,


Now focus on the spelling for "Ahmadinejad." Tell me thats not the overwhelmingly used standard for English.
 
2012-10-01 11:53:57 AM
Now that's some self-hating!!!
 
2012-10-01 11:55:26 AM
But the press told me Israelis are a borg collective and they all think and feel the same way.

That said, these guys are obviously considered fringe. They have their reasons though.
 
2012-10-01 11:55:51 AM
I love propaganda from fascists....it's so Orwellian.
 
2012-10-01 12:00:50 PM
Hey, Herschel, look like we got here some o' them self-hatin' Jews.
 
2012-10-01 12:01:59 PM
So, a fringe group of Judaism met with Armannidinnerjacket? Why is this news? More importantly, does he actually have a job in Iran? I thought he was basically a convenient figurehead.
 
2012-10-01 12:05:06 PM

HotWingConspiracy: That said, these guys are obviously considered fringe. They have their reasons though.


The only really disturbing thing is that as nutty as their beliefs are, they aren't really any nuttier than those of the Republican presidential candidate who will probably draw over 47% of the popular vote.
 
2012-10-01 12:09:33 PM
There are more stories written about the NK every month than there are members of it.

Just so's you know.

// "fringe" is not a strong enough word for how isolated this view is among Jews
// for a worldwide population of 20-30millionish, there's probably a thousand or so NK-types
 
2012-10-01 12:09:49 PM
Neturei Karta

Wasn't this the group that was harassing girls going to elementary school for not dressing conservatively enough? I seem to remember Tats saying that in an old thread. I'm thinking the meeting went something like this:

NK: "Thanks for keeping us in business, Mahmoud!"
AM: "Same to you!"
 
2012-10-01 12:17:14 PM
Figured it was Neturei Karta before clicking.
 
2012-10-01 12:18:13 PM
Hassidic Jews hate Israel? Huh. Learn something new every day.
 
2012-10-01 12:29:01 PM
I'm pretty sure that Zionism and being Hassid are not mutual terms.

It's a patch of desert with little in the way of fertile lands or economicly useful resources. A Jewish promised land would be somewhere more like Appalachia, but alas there was this "take back" movement starting about 130 years ago.

And by shear numbers, I think South Florida is the Jewish homeland these days.
 
2012-10-01 12:32:57 PM

wildcardjack: I'm pretty sure that Zionism and being Hassid are not mutual terms.

It's a patch of desert with little in the way of fertile lands or economicly useful resources. A Jewish promised land would be somewhere more like Appalachia, but alas there was this "take back" movement starting about 130 years ago.

And by shear numbers, I think South Florida is the Jewish homeland these days.


They could vote that in by referendum and solve a lot of problems
 
2012-10-01 12:33:19 PM
Since when was religion expected to have any kind of internally consistent logic?
 
2012-10-01 12:34:21 PM
satire?
 
2012-10-01 12:36:48 PM
The difference is that the Chasids are marginal, extremist kooks while Ahmedinajad is president of a farking country.
 
2012-10-01 12:37:37 PM

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is in the mid-20s in terms of rank in the Iranian power-structure.

It's like Iran treating the Secretary for Education as the leader of the USA.

www.toplessrobot.com


Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
 
2012-10-01 12:41:30 PM

clambam: president of a farking country.


Bungles: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is in the mid-20s in terms of rank in the Iranian power-structure.

It's like Iran treating the Secretary for Education as the leader of the USA.


These two posts together - magnificent.
 
2012-10-01 12:41:34 PM
Couple of years ago I marched in NYC's Salute to Israel parade and we went past a group of Hasidim shouting pro-Palestine rhetoric and burning the Israeli flag. (They were placed on the side of the street opposite from everyone else, no doubt for their own safety.) Those dudes may be more irony-deficient than the Log Cabin Republicans.
 
2012-10-01 12:42:19 PM

Party Boy: ArkAngel: Yes, I got the alphabet wrong,

Now focus on the spelling for "Ahmadinejad." Tell me thats not the overwhelmingly used standard for English.


As one might recall from the case of a recent leader of Libya, there's not always agreement among the AP, the State Department, and the NY Times when it comes to transliterations.

/lighten up, Moammar
 
2012-10-01 12:45:09 PM

Hilarity_N_Sues: Salute to Israel parade


Was that the one celebrating Tel Aviv's 100th anniversary and with Gilad Shalit's parents?
 
2012-10-01 12:46:34 PM

clambam: The difference is that the Chasids are marginal, extremist kooks while Ahmedinajad is president of a farking country.


It's not like he was democratically elected in a fair election. Unless you just blindly believe the Iranian government on everything. So it's not like he has credibility/legitimacy from popular support.
And then in terms of political power wielded because of position regardless of support/legitimacy, Ahmadinejad is a figurehead with hardly any/no significant power.
They're both about as relevant as the other. But we need a villain/Goldstein to focus on for media ratings.
 
2012-10-01 12:46:34 PM

LibertyHiller: As one might recall from the case of a recent leader of Libya


No. no. no. No Analog needed.

Party Boy: Now focus on the spelling for "Ahmadinejad." Tell me thats not the overwhelmingly used standard for English.


Answer that. Specific and direct.
 
2012-10-01 12:50:02 PM

Arkanaut: Neturei Karta

Wasn't this the group that was harassing girls going to elementary school for not dressing conservatively enough? I seem to remember Tats saying that in an old thread. I'm thinking the meeting went something like this:

NK: "Thanks for keeping us in business, Mahmoud!"
AM: "Same to you!"


While the NK isn't opposed to such harassment, they're not likely to be caught dead living in Israel, let alone such a modern place as Beit Shemesh. They'd be throwing rocks at everyone.

// get your batshiat-crazy Hasidic sects right, man!
 
2012-10-01 12:55:09 PM

Party Boy: clambam: president of a farking country.

Bungles: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is in the mid-20s in terms of rank in the Iranian power-structure.

It's like Iran treating the Secretary for Education as the leader of the USA.

These two posts together - magnificent.


They're both magnificently obtuse, yes.

President of Iran is not like president of most other countries; he's basically a talking head. They put him up in front of the U.N. because of that.

And there's no country anywhere that puts their Secretary of Education in that kind of role.
 
2012-10-01 01:00:10 PM

Wooly Bully: Party Boy: clambam: president of a farking country.

Bungles: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is in the mid-20s in terms of rank in the Iranian power-structure.

It's like Iran treating the Secretary for Education as the leader of the USA.

These two posts together - magnificent.

They're both magnificently obtuse, yes.

President of Iran is not like president of most other countries; he's basically a talking head. They put him up in front of the U.N. because of that.

And there's no country anywhere that puts their Secretary of Education in that kind of role.



www.coronacomingattractions.com
 
2012-10-01 01:00:40 PM

Wooly Bully: They're both magnificently obtuse, yes.

President of Iran is not like president of most other countries; he's basically a talking head. They put him up in front of the U.N. because of that.

And there's no country anywhere that puts their Secretary of Education in that kind of role.


This is why everyone should avoid analogs in their argument. It nearly always degenerates into an nargument of the inherent similarities and differences of the analog, and diverts from the original point.
 
2012-10-01 01:05:44 PM

Party Boy: This is why everyone should avoid analogs in their argument.


Meh, they have their rhetorical and didactic uses. Although they're very frequently misleading, they can be well done and useful.
 
2012-10-01 01:09:18 PM

Party Boy: So much fail. Let me count the ways

• Mahmoud Ahmadenijad to present him with an award. Did you mean Ahmadinejad?
• Hasidic Jewish Group Neturei Karta. Not representative. Ths isn't the first time they did this, either.
• Ahmadinejad doesnt control the military. In practice, however, presidential powers are circumscribed by the clerics and conservatives in Iran's power structure, and by the authority of the Supreme Leader. It is the Supreme Leader, not the president, who controls the armed forces and makes decisions on security, defence and major foreign policy issues.

Our nations level of understanding on this topic, as a whole, is abysmal. The submissions here are just getting worse and worse.


I post stuff like that here all the time. Nobody, but nobody, wants to hear that their favorite nuclear-armed jihadi dictator has virtually no power to start a war with Israel (or America,for that matter). They really really are invested in the idea that Ahmadinejad is some kind of evil god-emperor.
 
2012-10-01 01:14:23 PM

Gyrfalcon: Party Boy: So much fail. Let me count the ways

• Mahmoud Ahmadenijad to present him with an award. Did you mean Ahmadinejad?
• Hasidic Jewish Group Neturei Karta. Not representative. Ths isn't the first time they did this, either.
• Ahmadinejad doesnt control the military. In practice, however, presidential powers are circumscribed by the clerics and conservatives in Iran's power structure, and by the authority of the Supreme Leader. It is the Supreme Leader, not the president, who controls the armed forces and makes decisions on security, defence and major foreign policy issues.

Our nations level of understanding on this topic, as a whole, is abysmal. The submissions here are just getting worse and worse.

I post stuff like that here all the time. Nobody, but nobody, wants to hear that their favorite nuclear-armed jihadi dictator has virtually no power to start a war with Israel (or America,for that matter). They really really are invested in the idea that Ahmadinejad is some kind of evil god-emperor.


You've been farkied under "good arguments" for some time
Here's 2007, from According to legend, Iran's President has threatened to destroy Israel, or, to quote the misquote, "Israel must be wiped off the map". Contrary to popular belief, this statement was never made. Ignorance is Strength
Party Boy 2007-01-20 09:07:59 PM

img213.imageshack.us 

Man, that thread had the butthurt.
 
2012-10-01 01:19:20 PM

Politicandy: Wait, even if they're ok with his stance on Israel, why are they cool with him calling them criminals and denying the Holocaust?


Pity for his ignorance?
 
2012-10-01 01:30:13 PM

Party Boy: LibertyHiller: As one might recall from the case of a recent leader of Libya

No. no. no. No Analog needed.


As long as we're being all Peter Pedantic here, the spelling you should have used is "analogue" --that's because you're using the noun rather than the adjective.

Party Boy: Now focus on the spelling for "Ahmadinejad." Tell me thats not the overwhelmingly used standard for English.

Answer that. Specific and direct.


Yes, it does seem to be a generally accepted spelling. Happy?

Nevertheless, the point that I and others make about the lack of standard transliterations from one script to another remains as valid when going from an Arabic script to a Latin script as it does when going between Cyrillic and Latin. (And if you've read as much Russian history as I have, you'll know that there's no consensus on how to render some vowels, but I digress.)

In any event, you're complaining about a transposition of vowels that has since been corrected as well as the quality of reporting on a site that calls itself "The Daily Dolt." No wonder I have you Farkied as "jackass."
 
2012-10-01 01:33:02 PM

LibertyHiller: Yes, it does seem to be a generally accepted spelling. Happy?


Yep. That whole discussion was not necessary.

Theres no need to analogs here.
 
2012-10-01 01:33:40 PM

Party Boy: to


for
 
2012-10-01 01:50:13 PM
Actually, Neturei Karta are not a Hasidic group. They are ultra-Orthodox, but Litvaks, not Hassidim.
 
2012-10-01 01:53:23 PM

Dr Dreidel: While the NK isn't opposed to such harassment, they're not likely to be caught dead living in Israel, let alone such a modern place as Beit Shemesh. They'd be throwing rocks at everyone.


Uh yeah you are wrong, I live right next to Meah Shearim, and not only do plenty of them live in Meah Shearim, they are swarming Bet Shemesh and going crazy over there.


Well, all 50 of them anyway, but any of these self-described 'sikrim' is too many.
 
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