We gotta talk about Looper and how it made no sense.

The plot of Looper sounds familiar. Is it a ripoff of another movie or book?

Also, have we had any threads on The Master? I feel like that movie hasn't been discussed here at all since it came out.

Saw Looper Friday night. I wasn't expecting it to be nearly as thought-provoking, layered, or intense as it was. Best sci-fi film of the year for me.

I liked Looper, but I don't get the logic behind the plot.

Spoilers

Why send the old Loopers back the the past to be killed by their younger self? In doing so, you run the risk of the younger self not following through, or something else going wrong. Why not just kill the younger Looper in the past erasing their older self from the future?

Also, I don't get how killing their older self was considered "closing the loop". When the older version of the Looper was sent to the past and killed, the younger Looper would then live his 30 years and then be sent back to the past and killed by his younger self again. What they were doing was creating a loop, not closing one. The movie establishes this circular time line in showing old Joe being sent to the past twice, escaping once and being killed the other. The loop can only be closed if the younger version of the Looper is killed, as Joe does when he commits suicide.

Popcorn Johnny: I liked Looper, but I don't get the logic behind the plot.

Spoilers

Why send the old Loopers back the the past to be killed by their younger self? In doing so, you run the risk of the younger self not following through, or something else going wrong. Why not just kill the younger Looper in the past erasing their older self from the future?

Also, I don't get how killing their older self was considered "closing the loop". When the older version of the Looper was sent to the past and killed, the younger Looper would then live his 30 years and then be sent back to the past and killed by his younger self again. What they were doing was creating a loop, not closing one. The movie establishes this circular time line in showing old Joe being sent to the past twice, escaping once and being killed the other. The loop can only be closed if the younger version of the Looper is killed, as Joe does when he commits suicide.

I REALLY liked Looper but that was one glaring error. You're basically telling the younger loopers pretty much how old they'll be when you get sent back, giving them that long to figure out how to escape. Why they didn't send older loopers to DIFFERENT loopers didn't make much sense. But I let that go as artistic license. You needed to establish that the Rainmaker does this as a matter of course in order to move the plot along.

The only true issues I had was how Abe was perfectly okay w/changing the future timeline by disfiguring Seth. The other issue I had was with younger Abe's whereabouts. If older Joe got crippling headaches whenever younger Joe changed his memories, what was younger Abe doing? Was he in an isolation tank or a drug-induced coma somewhere?

Other than those niggling things, I thought the movie was great. A HUGE part of the plot was never in any of the trailers, so I was pleasantly surprised. Also, I especially liked how JGL mimicked Willis' mannerisms and speech. Nicely done.

Popcorn Johnny: Why send the old Loopers back the the past to be killed by their younger self? In doing so, you run the risk of the younger self not following through, or something else going wrong. Why not just kill the younger Looper in the past erasing their older self from the future?

Rian Johnson answered this question on Slashfilm:

Why is it essential for a looper to close his own loop?

This is another one of those questions Johnson had answered in his head but didn't put in the movie. In fact, he even conceived a scene with Abe addressing it but never shot it.

"People in the future, all they know about time travel is to be afraid of it. So they're trying to keep it as tight as possible. So the initial reason they set it up this way was to keep the causality loop as tight as possible," Johnson said. Because, for example, if someone else kills your older self and you have to exist with your own murderer for 30 years, what's stopping you for murdering them or doing something to screw everything else up? "Every bit of evidence is gone from that loop when you kill yourself," he said.

Scottybobotty: He's entitled to one weather you like it or not.

It's rainy here and I don't like it.

DamnYankees: Rian Johnson answered this question on Slashfilm:

Why is it essential for a looper to close his own loop?

This is another one of those questions Johnson had answered in his head but didn't put in the movie. In fact, he even conceived a scene with Abe addressing it but never shot it.

"People in the future, all they know about time travel is to be afraid of it. So they're trying to keep it as tight as possible. So the initial reason they set it up this way was to keep the causality loop as tight as possible," Johnson said. Because, for example, if someone else kills your older self and you have to exist with your own murderer for 30 years, what's stopping you for murdering them or doing something to screw everything else up? "Every bit of evidence is gone from that loop when you kill yourself," he said.


But that's not how it happens. Killing your older self does not close the loop as you then live the next 30 years, only to be then sent to the past to be killed by a younger version of yourself again. All they've done is created a loop.

Popcorn Johnny: But that's not how it happens. Killing your older self does not close the loop as you then live the next 30 years, only to be then sent to the past to be killed by a younger version of yourself again. All they've done is created a loop.

I think you misunderstood the response. It's about loose ends. If Young Joe kills Old Joe, then for 30 years Young Joe continues to live his life and there's no one else involved in the murder. If Sam kills Old Joe, then for the next 30 years Sam and Young Joe will be living together, and Young Joe will probably try to get revenge on Sam, thus leaving a bigger mess. Also, if Young Joe knows someone else is going to kill Old Joe, he may try to pre-empt it in some way, also leaving a mess. By making Young Joe kill Old Joe, it's all much cleaner.

Popcorn Johnny: But that's not how it happens. Killing your older self does not close the loop as you then live the next 30 years, only to be then sent to the past to be killed by a younger version of yourself again. All they've done is created a loop.

Closing a loop means to create said loop. Until a loop is closed, all you have is a line

brigid_fitch: If older Joe got crippling headaches whenever younger Joe changed his memories, what was younger Abe doing? Was he in an isolation tank or a drug-induced coma somewhere?

Old Abe was sent back from 2074 as a 55ish man. Presumably his 25ish Young Abe self was running around in 2044 somewhere, either not in the organized crime business, or as a low-level enforcer. I'm guessing the mob checked Old Abe's background and made sure he was never in Kansas City, and instructed Old Abe to have no contact with Young Abe, letting Young Abe grow up blissfully unaware that his older self was running around in the past. I wouldn't be surprised if Abe wasn't even his real name, so some thug wouldn't accidentally spill the beans to Young Abe in 2050 or 2060 that he remembers Old Abe running things in Kansas City, back in the 2040s.

.I was wondering if Kid Blue (the guy who shot himself in the foot) was going to turn out to be young Abe for a bit.

Sgt Otter: .I was wondering if Kid Blue (the guy who shot himself in the foot) was going to turn out to be young Abe for a bit.

I thought Abe was going to the Rainmaker for a while, that the little kid was actually Abe, who had go through 2 separate loops. Didn't happen.

Went with the wife to see Looper last night. Thought they did a good job of representing a possible KC skyline 30 years down the road. They actually used existing buildings, not some crazy-made up nonsense.

/loved the joke about taking over KC being no big deal
//um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue
/Cloud Atlas trailer looked like a bigger mess than 'Lana' Wachowski

robohobo: //um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue

Where are you getting this from?

DamnYankees: robohobo: //um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue

Where are you getting this from?

Earlier drafts of the script. There's been a lot of discussion over at AICN.

robohobo: DamnYankees: robohobo: //um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue

Where are you getting this from?

Earlier drafts of the script. There's been a lot of discussion over at AICN.

Makes sense, given Kid Blue's odd attempts to seek validation in Abe's eyes. I figured it was either that or Blue was his son, which wouldn't make much sense in context with the time travel

DamnYankees: robohobo: //um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue

Where are you getting this from?

Also there were a few clues dropped. Similar accents at times, Old Joe called Young Joe a 'stupid kid', next scene Abe said the same of KB. Nothing that would stand up in court, but from a writing perspective, it certainly draws a line.

robohobo: DamnYankees: robohobo: //um, young Abe was in the movie...he was Kid Blue

Where are you getting this from?

Earlier drafts of the script. There's been a lot of discussion over at AICN.

Hm. Doesn't really make much sense to me.

Looper was fantastic.

Smackledorfer: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Saw Looper Friday night. I wasn't expecting it to be nearly as thought-provoking, layered, or intense as it was. Best sci-fi film of the year for me.

Lmao. That is the one about the mob using time travel in the future to handle the impossible task of getting rid of bodies right?

It was a cool flick. It didn't take itself too seriously at all.