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(Columbia Journalism Review)   Forbes says that 70% of Americas richest 400 people did it by being boot-strappy.....and by boot strappy they mean they were born on 3rd base   (cjr.org ) divider line
    More: Obvious, median age, plutocrats, Horatio Alger, United for a Fair Economy, third bases  
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8315 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Sep 2012 at 11:04 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-28 06:22:38 PM  
²
 
2012-09-28 06:24:59 PM  
You mean the super-wealthy generally get that way by inheriting significant wealth already, instead of starting out as commoners working in factories or minimum wage jobs and become super-rich through sheer virtuous hard work and dedication alone?

My GOD. . .what if the entire Republican philosophy is a lie, and not just this one point?
 
2012-09-28 06:54:54 PM  
Bravo.

Born on 3rd yet believe they've hit a triple.
 
2012-09-28 07:03:50 PM  

Silverstaff: You mean the super-wealthy generally get that way by inheriting significant wealth already, instead of starting out as commoners working in factories or minimum wage jobs and become super-rich through sheer virtuous hard work and dedication alone?

My GOD. . .what if the entire Republican philosophy is a lie, and not just this one point?


Jesus will save us all.
 
2012-09-28 07:36:03 PM  

Nadie_AZ: Jesus will save us all.


If I owned a bank, I'd use the slogan "Jesus Saves...Why Not Open Your Account Today?"
 
2012-09-28 08:04:28 PM  
Let's be fair. The article gets onto forbes for being a biased source, then quotes a biased source.
 
2012-09-28 09:00:26 PM  

Silverstaff: My GOD. . .what if the entire Republican philosophy is a lie, and not just this one point?


It's only a lie if you stop believing it.

Clap louder.
 
2012-09-28 09:07:13 PM  
Again, this is one of those things that reminds me that I'm puzzled about the GOP hate for estate taxes. If everyone's supposed to become rich through hard work why do they want people to have wealth handed to them on a silver platter?
 
2012-09-28 09:22:09 PM  

fusillade762: Again, this is one of those things that reminds me that I'm puzzled about the GOP hate for estate taxes. If everyone's supposed to become rich through hard work why do they want people to have wealth handed to them on a silver platter?


They want to inherit it for themselves.

They want everybody else to get rich through hard work.
 
2012-09-28 10:06:10 PM  

fusillade762: Again, this is one of those things that reminds me that I'm puzzled about the GOP hate for estate taxes. If everyone's supposed to become rich through hard work why do they want people to have wealth handed to them on a silver platter?


Because they're full of shiat.

/ta dah!
 
2012-09-28 10:49:33 PM  

Silverstaff: They want everybody else to get rich through hard work.


No they don't. They just want the poors to believe that so they'll keep working harder and harder for nothing. It's really sickening. The less they pay you, the harder they expect you to work. It's quite a system they have.
 
2012-09-28 11:07:56 PM  
Yeah, like Mitt. Self made man.
 
2012-09-28 11:09:12 PM  

fusillade762: Again, this is one of those things that reminds me that I'm puzzled about the GOP hate for estate taxes. If everyone's supposed to become rich through hard work why do they want people to have wealth handed to them on a silver platter?


I wonder the same thing.
 
2012-09-28 11:09:30 PM  
If those 70% were murdered, and all of their heirs were murdered as well, would that money go back to the people from whom it was stolen (all of the rest of us)? Hey, I'm just asking questions here. That would be terrible if that happened and I discourage everyone from doing it.
 
2012-09-28 11:11:04 PM  

Eatin' Queer Fetuses for Jesus: If those 70% were murdered, and all of their heirs were murdered as well, would that money go back to the people from whom it was stolen (all of the rest of us)? Hey, I'm just asking questions here. That would be terrible if that happened and I discourage everyone from doing it.


Usually if there are no legitimate heirs, it reverts to the state.
 
2012-09-28 11:11:48 PM  
So, so much whining jealousy in this thread. The vast majority of the 400 richest got to that point due to their own successes.

But let's say that a rich person had an advantage because they were left a considerable amount of money. Who left it to them? Their parents, who worked for it. Or their grandparents, etc.

Whomever made the money has the farking right to do what they want with it, and if they give it to an heir, so be it. I recommend you whiners stop making excuses for yourselves and blaming your failures on others. Maybe if you can make something you can leave it to your kids, and they won't end up whiny complainers like yourselves.
 
2012-09-28 11:13:37 PM  
Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.

Fark is full of these douchbags.
 
2012-09-28 11:14:37 PM  

Gyrfalcon: Eatin' Queer Fetuses for Jesus: If those 70% were murdered, and all of their heirs were murdered as well, would that money go back to the people from whom it was stolen (all of the rest of us)? Hey, I'm just asking questions here. That would be terrible if that happened and I discourage everyone from doing it.

Usually if there are no legitimate heirs, it reverts to the state.


Well let's hope that doesn't happen then!

/fingers crossed
 
2012-09-28 11:14:51 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: The vast majority of the 400 richest got to that point due to their own successes.


This is a tautology.

Debeo Summa Credo: But let's say that a rich person had an advantage because they were left a considerable amount of money. Who left it to them? Their parents, who worked for it. Or their grandparents, etc.


Isn't this the basis of aristocracy? I mean, every aristocrat at some point in the line had an ancestor who 'earned' that land and title, and so they should deserve it also. Right?
 
2012-09-28 11:14:51 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: So, so much whining jealousy in this thread. The vast majority of the 400 richest got to that point due to their own successes.

But let's say that a rich person had an advantage because they were left a considerable amount of money. Who left it to them? Their parents, who worked for it. Or their grandparents, etc.

Whomever made the money has the farking right to do what they want with it, and if they give it to an heir, so be it. I recommend you whiners stop making excuses for yourselves and blaming your failures on others. Maybe if you can make something you can leave it to your kids, and they won't end up whiny complainers like yourselves.


2/10

Really, you have to make it a little less obvious.
 
2012-09-28 11:15:02 PM  
Did a person earn this money at some point in the past? Do they have the right to do whatever they want with it? Do the people who inherit it have the opportunity to lose this money by being stupid?

Honestly, this class warfare junk is...well, it's junk. The fact that the class of the super wealthy is composed in part of people who inherit their wealth says nothing. Not a damn thing.
 
2012-09-28 11:15:49 PM  
No, see, you want the majority of rich people to be born in to wealth. People who go from rags to riches by working hard hold on to most of their money. People born in to wealth tend to spend more frivolously, putting that money back in to the economy.
 
2012-09-28 11:16:14 PM  

DKinMN: Did a person earn this money at some point in the past? Do they have the right to do whatever they want with it? Do the people who inherit it have the opportunity to lose this money by being stupid?


Maybe. To an extent. Yes.
 
2012-09-28 11:16:47 PM  

Silverstaff: You mean the super-wealthy generally get that way by inheriting significant wealth already people get ahead through contacts and moderate to severe hard work,


FTY.

Also the article glosses over this statement Just 35 percent of the Forbes 400 last year were raised poor or middle class,

You know where that 35% is in every other nation in the world? Still poor and middle class, hate america all you want but at least the poor to middle can move up into that rich bracket, other nations do not have that luxury, there is a reason a lot of people choose to immigrate to the states, the chance to make real money.

What? The people that are born into money have an easier time making more money? The HELL you say?!?!?!

F*cking whiny retards, no farking shiat you can do more with opportunities given to you, take advantage where you can then move up, its not impossible unless you spend all your time whining about the evil rich who did nothing to earn their wealth. I guess they should just be forced to give all their money away when the person that earned it dies and the heirs have to start all over, thats fair, right? Idiots.
 
2012-09-28 11:17:01 PM  
And if they did a study on the least richest 4,000,000 Americans I bet they find that drugs and alcohol were involved.

So what.
 
2012-09-28 11:17:56 PM  

Gyrfalcon: Usually if there are no legitimate heirs, it reverts to the state.


Yes, lets give the state more money to waste......
 
2012-09-28 11:18:40 PM  
the sooner we sterilize the 47% the quicker there will be less non-millionaires.
 
2012-09-28 11:18:42 PM  

DamnYankees: Yeah, like Mitt. Self made man.


As is Obama, Clinton, every other Harvard grad, Dubya, 41, John Kerry, et. al. at Yale, the creepy cat guy from Princeton with the Nobel in Economics....

FTFA: The liberal group United for a Fair Economy has done the heavy lifting on Forbes's bootstrappers, and its report, "Born on Third Base," shows that the vast majority of the country's plutocrats either inherited their money or had significant help from family members. What's surprising is that this is surprising to Forbes.

Columbia Journalism Review won't even consider that there might be other factors at work in many cases....
 
2012-09-28 11:19:45 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: So, so much whining jealousy in this thread.
Whomever made the money has the farking right to do what they want with it, and if they give it to an heir, so be it. I recommend you whiners stop making excuses for yourselves and blaming your failures on others. Maybe if you can make something you can leave it to your kids, and they won't end up whiny complainers like yourselves.


guides.gamepressure.com
Agrees.
 
2012-09-28 11:21:59 PM  

Agent Nick Fury: And if they did a study on the least richest 4,000,000 Americans I bet they find that drugs and alcohol were involved.

So what.


You have to add in laziness, you dont get rich by sleeping until 2pm on saturdays.
 
2012-09-28 11:22:13 PM  

xiaodown: Let's be fair. The article gets onto forbes for being a biased source, then quotes a biased source.


Yeah. It's quite possible to be self-made and yet also have a substantial inheritance. What you need to look at is what percent of their assets the inheritance was at the time they got it.
 
2012-09-28 11:23:46 PM  
Billionaires are kind of a freak show, no (400?)?

Hard to imagine anyone getting up that high without some serious seed capital and/or an existing operation to expand upon.

It'd be more interesting to see the average successful business owners (making say 100K to 500K/yr) backgrounds.

Of course where you come from matters though.

Moms a couch potato who sleeps until noon and dad left her alone to raise the kid while not offering up a thing in the way of money or mentorship.

Yeah... that kid's not going anywhere.
 
2012-09-28 11:24:14 PM  

steamingpile: you dont get rich by sleeping until 2pm on saturdays


Never have met many rich people have you?
 
2012-09-28 11:25:40 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: So, so much whining jealousy in this thread. The vast majority of the 400 richest got to that point due to their own successes.

But let's say that a rich person had an advantage because they were left a considerable amount of money. Who left it to them? Their parents, who worked for it. Or their grandparents, etc.

Whomever made the money has the farking right to do what they want with it, and if they give it to an heir, so be it. I recommend you whiners stop making excuses for yourselves and blaming your failures on others. Maybe if you can make something you can leave it to your kids, and they won't end up whiny complainers like yourselves.


it's sad people equate success with wealth. what a sad existence, when people are exalted because of the amount of money they have instead of character.
The rich can have the money and i will keep seeing them for what they are.
personally i am sick of people defending them like the rich have it so rough. boo fuqin hoo.
 
2012-09-28 11:26:38 PM  

TomD9938: Billionaires are kind of a freak show, no (400?)?


They're extreme statistical outliers in a nation of over 300 million people. In other words, looking at how they did it is as useful as looking at how Ted Williams hit .406 back in the day. Sure he did it, but doesn't mean doing what he did will end in the same result.
 
2012-09-28 11:27:10 PM  

steamingpile: Gyrfalcon: Usually if there are no legitimate heirs, it reverts to the state.

Yes, lets give the state more money to waste......


So what's your alternative? If they die intestate without heirs....they should give it to you?
 
2012-09-28 11:27:14 PM  
www.watongacheesefestival.com

To go with all the whine in this thread...

/class warfare is all the rage
 
2012-09-28 11:28:06 PM  

BGates: Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.

Fark is full of these douchbags.


fark you. Go cock-punch Baller and take over your company again.
 
2012-09-28 11:28:26 PM  

Gyrfalcon: steamingpile: Gyrfalcon: Usually if there are no legitimate heirs, it reverts to the state.

Yes, lets give the state more money to waste......

So what's your alternative? If they die intestate without heirs....they should give it to you?


Of course. He works hard.
 
2012-09-28 11:28:35 PM  

steamingpile: other nations do not have that luxury,


Actually the chances of moving up in America are worse than in just about any other developed nation. In part because it's so easy to concentrate wealth over long periods, and also because of the hurdles in improving oneself that other countries don't have.
 
2012-09-28 11:30:06 PM  

Fuggin Bizzy: BGates: Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.

Fark is full of these douchbags.

fark you. Go cock-punch Baller and take over your company again.


Baller. Indeed. Ballmer. DYAC!!
 
2012-09-28 11:30:48 PM  

steamingpile: Yes, lets give the state more money to waste......


I don't mind when the state "wastes" money by buying things from the people. It's when they line their own pockets that bothers me. And I wouldn't even mind you lining your pockets with tax dollars if you kept spending that money around town.

I'm broke. That means that I have literally given everything I have ever worked for back to society.
 
2012-09-28 11:30:53 PM  

TomD9938: Billionaires are kind of a freak show, no (400?)?

Hard to imagine anyone getting up that high without some serious seed capital and/or an existing operation to expand upon.

It'd be more interesting to see the average successful business owners (making say 100K to 500K/yr) backgrounds.

Of course where you come from matters though.

Moms a couch potato who sleeps until noon and dad left her alone to raise the kid while not offering up a thing in the way of money or mentorship.

Yeah... that kid's not going anywhere.


You, sir, deserve a prize.

This is the question that will answer this election.

Forget the billionaires, what does "fortunate" or even "rich" mean?

If you have food on the table, a job, a car to get there, and a house - are you one of the "fortunate that need to pay their fair share for those that don't have what you have"?

I think it all comes down to how each individual answers that question.
 
2012-09-28 11:30:59 PM  

steamingpile: F*cking whiny retards, no farking shiat you can do more with opportunities given to you, take advantage where you can then move up, its not impossible unless you spend all your time whining about the evil rich who did nothing to earn their wealth.


Yawn. Another liberal pretending to be a conservative.

I mean, look at what you just said! You just claimed it's possible for poor people to become rich, and that you encourage them to do so! Why would any conservative want that? You think I want to associate with the stench just because it's wearing perfume? What a joke you are. The Soviets had income classes, too: It was called "out from the fields and into the gulags". If you want that, give poor people a comfortable living wage. Give poor people a social safety net. Give poor people education. Why don't you go ahead and sign over all your personal income while you're at it?

Ugh. I hope it hurts to be this stupid. Please read On the Genealogy of Morals II: Morality Bites before posting again. Every single talking point you made in your post was destroyed by that book. But then again, you probably haven't even read the combined works of Nietzsche, Beck, Wittgenstein, and Coulter, let alone anything by Taxcutter or Lebenstraum.
 
2012-09-28 11:31:22 PM  
This is a failure of Estate Tax laws that allow a person's wealth accrued over their life to go to a loved one instead of the government where it belongs.
 
2012-09-28 11:31:57 PM  

Pockafrusta: /class warfare is all the rage


Pointing out various flaws in things like estate taxes is not class warfare. Declaring that those who make a lot of money ought pay a small percentage of their income in taxes on the other hand...

BGates: Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.


I don't hate rich people, indeed I expect to be one. I just hope you have the god damn decency to tax my income at some reasonable rate, like a top marginal rate of 38%, or even 40 or 42, cause at that point, I've earned that tax bill. Also, be a sweetie and get rid of tax loopholes for anyone in the top bracket and the carried interest rule, though that one wouldn't be personally relevant.
 
2012-09-28 11:32:17 PM  

BGates: Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.

Fark is full of these douchbags.


You sound temporarily embarrassed.
 
2012-09-28 11:32:25 PM  
Paris Hilton worked hard for that money...
 
2012-09-28 11:35:05 PM  

Saturn5: This is a failure of Estate Tax laws that allow a person's wealth accrued over their life to go to a loved one instead of the government where it belongs.


Also it's the result of certain states doing away with the rule against perpetuities, which are a centuries old legal concept from English common law that greatly restrict who you can pass on your money to. And also gives law students a headache trying to learn.
 
2012-09-28 11:36:15 PM  

WhyteRaven74: Pockafrusta: /class warfare is all the rage

Pointing out various flaws in things like estate taxes is not class warfare. Declaring that those who make a lot of money ought pay a small percentage of their income in taxes on the other hand...

BGates: Oh no. Rich people. Lets hate them because they have money.

I don't hate rich people, indeed I expect to be one. I just hope you have the god damn decency to tax my income at some reasonable rate, like a top marginal rate of 38%, or even 40 or 42, cause at that point, I've earned that tax bill. Also, be a sweetie and get rid of tax loopholes for anyone in the top bracket and the carried interest rule, though that one wouldn't be personally relevant.


Your newsletter. i signed up.
 
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