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(NBC News)   Republicans finally find the smoking gun of voter fraud... in their own holster   (firstread.nbcnews.com) divider line 97
    More: Followup, RNC, voter fraud, Attorney General John Ashcroft, Michael Isikoff, Florida counties, University of New Zealand, elections officials, Okaloosa County  
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4250 clicks; posted to Politics » on 28 Sep 2012 at 12:32 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-28 10:52:58 AM
Not an isolated incident with this Sproul person.
 
2012-09-28 11:01:17 AM
The allegations of suspected voter fraud committed by Strategic Allied Consulting of Tempe, Arizona

img.photobucket.com
 
2012-09-28 11:02:03 AM
I should add that Arizona and Florida made babies for this article.
 
2012-09-28 11:14:54 AM

Because People in power are Stupid: I should add that Arizona and Florida made babies for this article.


Now there's a mental image I really didn't need this early in the day
 
2012-09-28 11:16:02 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Because People in power are Stupid: I should add that Arizona and Florida made babies for this article.

Now there's a mental image I really didn't need this early in the day


2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-09-28 11:17:09 AM
I have a conservative friend who defends voter ID laws because people should have IDs and voter fraud is rampant... there's no talking facts with him, he doesn't care for reality.
 
2012-09-28 11:30:04 AM
Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.
 
2012-09-28 11:34:23 AM

tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.


And it's Republican registration fraud, which means it's really not an issue.
 
2012-09-28 11:34:43 AM

tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.


The latter largely requires the former.
 
2012-09-28 11:37:03 AM
Probably the work of an "overzealous staffer" while the organization itself is blameless.

... RTFA... yep...

"Strategic has a zero tolerance policy for breaking the law. Accordingly, once we learned of the irregularities in Palm Beach County, we were able to trace all questionable cards to one individual and immediately terminated our working relationship with the individual in question. Strategic is committed to following the letter of the law and will continue to cooperate with the Palm Beach County Supervisor of Elections to ensure that this issue is resolved."
 
2012-09-28 12:12:46 PM

Diogenes: The latter largely requires the former.


Guess ACORN really was as dangerous as they said, then.
 
2012-09-28 12:30:54 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: The allegations of suspected voter fraud committed by Strategic Allied Consulting of Tempe, Arizona

img.photobucket.com


i.imgur.com

/made for a PS contest
 
2012-09-28 12:35:01 PM

Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.


Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?
 
2012-09-28 12:36:11 PM
funny headline.

that is all.
 
2012-09-28 12:36:16 PM
They hoped it would go unnoticed but they got caught by the "liberal" media.
 
2012-09-28 12:38:28 PM
"A thief always expects everyone else is stealing"
 
2012-09-28 12:39:33 PM

Any Pie Left: "A thief always expects everyone else is stealing"


If it is this easy then everyone must be doing it.
 
2012-09-28 12:40:27 PM
The only voter ID we should need is a GOP registration card. All you Dims and Liberaltarians shouldn't be allowed to destroy this country.
 
2012-09-28 12:41:05 PM

Citrate1007: They hoped it would go unnoticed but they got caught by the "liberal" media.


And their pesky dog!
 
2012-09-28 12:42:28 PM
How about when the reps in state congress run around pushing voting buttons on the desks of other reps who aren't there?

Good times.
 
2012-09-28 12:43:42 PM

Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.


It doesn't if you're Rick Scott, republican Governor of Florida.
He just hired a bunch of people to forge absentee ballots meant for the elderly.
 
2012-09-28 12:44:09 PM

The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?


So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?
 
2012-09-28 12:44:18 PM

Citrate1007: Any Pie Left: "A thief always expects everyone else is stealing"

If it is this easy then everyone must be doing it.



The only people who would bother are in the parties. Nobody else gives a damn that much. Do you think I would make up hundreds of fake names or whatever it takes to actually have an influence? Please.
 
2012-09-28 12:46:32 PM
This should be treated the way ACRON was.
 
2012-09-28 12:47:58 PM

brianbankerus: I have a conservative friend who defends voter ID laws because people should have IDs and voter fraud is rampant... there's no talking facts with him, he doesn't care for reality.


This.

When I debate this with the neanderthals at my work, I try to first distinguish Voter Registration Fraud from In Person Voter Fraud (y'know the kind that actually never occurs and what the voter ID laws are claiming to prevent) and they refuse to even grasp that concept.

And these are educated people, people who figure out how to get themselves dressed and drive to work everyday. The cognitive dissonance is staggering.
 
2012-09-28 12:50:09 PM

Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?


www.gnorb.net

VOTER ID LAWS DO NOT PREVENT FRAUDULENT REGISTRATION!
 
2012-09-28 12:53:41 PM
Look, what's most important is that the repubs win this election. If you won't vote for their candidates, then they have no choice but to commit ballot fraud or suppress votes. Is that so hard to understand?
 
2012-09-28 12:54:29 PM

Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?


Actually, that's not true at all. Nearly all cases of voter fraud haven't happened as a result of voter registration fraud. The most common methods of voter fraud happen after votes are cast by legitimately registered voters, usually by either having those votes changed or tossed out by the people responsible for counting the votes.

While your "logical progression" seems to make sense, where the process of committing voter fraud would be to register fake voters and then use those registrations to cast votes, there are, literally, no known cases of that actually happening. And it makes sense that there aren't, it is an incredibly inefficient way to swing an election, as it would have to happen on a very large scale to make a difference. It's much easier and more effective to take care of it on the back end.
 
2012-09-28 12:54:42 PM

clambam: Look, what's most important is that the repubs win this election. If you won't vote for their candidates, then they have no choice but to commit ballot fraud or suppress votes. Is that so hard to understand?


Exactly! Try to have some compassion here.
 
2012-09-28 12:56:25 PM
Hiring people to vote republican, registering the deceased, tossing registration forms of Democrats. What's the big deal? It's just light-hearted, low level, fraudulent fun at the expense of holding a legitimate election.
Plus, the company has a video! A company cannot be held responsible for the actions of employees they hire after showing them a video. Video!
 
2012-09-28 12:56:48 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.


The problem isn't so much the fraudulent registrations (those don't really do much but enrich the canvasser), but the alteration and destruction of legitimate registrations (those lead to voter suppression).

Of course, there's also the abject hypocrisy on display, considering how they hounded ACORN out of business.
 
2012-09-28 12:57:53 PM

imontheinternet: Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?

[www.gnorb.net image 320x240]

VOTER ID LAWS DO NOT PREVENT FRAUDULENT REGISTRATION!


I never said Voter ID laws prevented fraudulent registration. I said a fraudulent registration is required in most cases (except for stealing votes from elderly mail-in voters such as the link farther up thread) to case a fraudulent vote. I made no mention of Voter ID Laws.
 
2012-09-28 12:58:22 PM
Republican is synonymous with hypocrite.

Seriously, did you read the part about how you "can't prevent a few bad apples?" Cognitive dissnonance, where are you?
 
2012-09-28 12:58:28 PM

Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?


You should go away and learn something about "personation" before casting aspersions on others. There are lots of ways to cast a fraudulent vote in the name of a valid registration, and doing so is a much more cost-effective form of voter fraud than is registration fraud.
 
2012-09-28 12:59:12 PM

timujin: Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?

Actually, that's not true at all. Nearly all cases of voter fraud haven't happened as a result of voter registration fraud. The most common methods of voter fraud happen after votes are cast by legitimately registered voters, usually by either having those votes changed or tossed out by the people responsible for counting the votes.

While your "logical progression" seems to make sense, where the process of committing voter fraud would be to register fake voters and then use those registrations to cast votes, there are, literally, no known cases of that actually happening. And it makes sense that there aren't, it is an incredibly inefficient way to swing an election, as it would have to happen on a very large scale to make a difference. It's much easier and more effective to take care of it on the back end.


Standard Republican lack of imagination / tunnel vision. They can only think of one way that something could happen, so therefore it is the ONLY way that it could happen.

See also: abstinence only sex ed, creationism, the US as a Christian nation, all Muslims are terrorists, all blacks are welfare queens, etc, etc, etc.
 
2012-09-28 01:00:15 PM
Sproul has been previously accused of suppressing Democratic voter turnout, throwing away registration forms, and manipulating ballot initiatives. His firms -- formerly Sproul & Associates, Lincoln Strategy, and Strategic Allied Consultants -- had previously worked for RNC voter registration efforts during the campaigns of George W. Bush and John McCain. In 2004, Democratic Senators Leahy and Kennedy sent a letter to then Attorney General John Ashcroft requesting that he "launch an immediate investigation into the activities of Mr. Sproul and his firm." But the request did not lead to any criminal charges against Sproul.

Nice job there, wandering on and on about the little shiat and burying the most damning evidence at the tail end of the story, where most people won't read it. The other shiat is small potatoes in comparison, and they don't even mention the ex-employees testifying that they were fired for registering Dems, were ordered to throw away Dem registrations, and were specifically told to go out and only register Republicans.

That's some top-notch investigative reporting there, guys. Make sure you throw the name ACORN out there alot, so that... Oh, I see you already did that.

Oh, well, carry on.
 
2012-09-28 01:01:01 PM

Bschott007: I never said Voter ID laws prevented fraudulent registration. I said a fraudulent registration is required in most cases (except for stealing votes from elderly mail-in voters such as the link farther up thread) to case a fraudulent vote.


Then perhaps you should stop making up claims that are unsubstantiated by the facts?
 
2012-09-28 01:01:49 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.


This is a repeat from 2010.
 
2012-09-28 01:02:22 PM
Funny how everyone who uses the phrase "bad apples" doesn't finish the aphorism...

Also, Sproule is a dickbag of the highest order. Not surprised he's a GOP favorite.
 
2012-09-28 01:04:05 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Diogenes: The latter largely requires the former.

Guess ACORN really was as dangerous as they said, then.


Fine. Shut down these guys, too. No more voter registration drives by private enterprises.
 
2012-09-28 01:04:13 PM

Bschott007: I never said Voter ID laws prevented fraudulent registration. I said a fraudulent registration is required in most cases (except for stealing votes from elderly mail-in voters such as the link farther up thread) to case a fraudulent vote. I made no mention of Voter ID Laws.


Fraudulent registration is required in most cases of voter fraud. Well, it is once you throw out every single case of voter fraud that's ever been found out.
 
2012-09-28 01:04:22 PM

czetie: Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?

You should go away and learn something about "personation" before casting aspersions on others. There are lots of ways to cast a fraudulent vote in the name of a valid registration, and doing so is a much more cost-effective form of voter fraud than is registration fraud.


Bizarre, isn't it? For the last year or so, Republicans have been indicating that "voter registration fraud" is practically identical to "voter fraud" just to get voter ID laws into place - despite the fact that we've had "voter registration fraud" for years and virtually no "voter fraud." Republican mouthpieces have actually come out and stated their real reason to push voter ID laws - to disenfranchise a section of the American population with a clear tendency to vote for Democrats.

Now, when an organization is caught perpetrating "voter registration fraud" in the name of the Republican Party, well, what do you do now?
 
2012-09-28 01:06:13 PM
Wrong is wrong. Rather than lefties smirk and ignore the issue, why not agree our voter registration & ID methods are jokes and tighten them up?

The foundation of our nation's stability is the trust in the voting system. Republican or Democrat, there will be a-holes trying to exploit the lack of good oversight.
 
2012-09-28 01:06:49 PM
To be fair this is still only registration fraud not true voter fraud however it is what Republicans called "voter fraud" in the past.
 
2012-09-28 01:06:57 PM

The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?


You're missing my larger point.
 
2012-09-28 01:08:08 PM

fickenchucker: Wrong is wrong. Rather than lefties smirk and ignore the issue, why not agree our voter registration & ID methods are jokes and tighten them up?

The foundation of our nation's stability is the trust in the voting system. Republican or Democrat, there will be a-holes trying to exploit the lack of good oversight.


Because it's not a problem. Voter fraud is actually very rare. This wasn't voter fraud.

Why disenfranchise millions of legal voters when real voter fraud is very rare?


It's not "a problem" like you are pretending it is. You are wrong.
 
2012-09-28 01:08:22 PM

timujin: Bschott007: The Jami Turman Fan Club: Diogenes: tallguywithglasseson: Registration fraud. TFA doesn't mention any fraudulent votes cast.

The latter largely requires the former.

Can you cite even a single case where a person committed voter fraud via registration fraud?

So logical progression eludes you?

I'll take this slow for you: In many states, you need to register to vote. If you are not registered, you can not cast a ballot. So unless a fraudulent registration is made in a state requiring voter registration, the fraudulent vote can not be submitted.

Logic, how does it work?

Actually, that's not true at all. Nearly all cases of voter fraud haven't happened as a result of voter registration fraud. The most common methods of voter fraud happen after votes are cast by legitimately registered voters, usually by either having those votes changed or tossed out by the people responsible for counting the votes.

While your "logical progression" seems to make sense, where the process of committing voter fraud would be to register fake voters and then use those registrations to cast votes, there are, literally, no known cases of that actually happening. And it makes sense that there aren't, it is an incredibly inefficient way to swing an election, as it would have to happen on a very large scale to make a difference. It's much easier and more effective to take care of it on the back end.


Well, the 1960 Nixon/Kennedy election would respectfully like to have a word with you.
 
2012-09-28 01:08:26 PM
First: That is exactly the same thing that ACORN was accused of (correctly) namely that it had employees doing voter registration efforts who were faking registrations in order to get paid. It is fraud on the employer and a minor violation of election laws BUT:

Second: That is NOT "voter fraud". The voter fraud that everyone is so scared of is that votes will be cast that are illegal. That is not what was going on with ACORN or with the RPOF. Just because you submit a fake voter registration to make money does not mean (and in fact almost guarantees it won't happen) that someone will actually show up on election day and cast an illegal fraudulent vote using that fake registration.

So yes, while it is amusing and unsurprising that the Republicans fell prey to the exact kind of loose oversight of voter registration efforts that burned ACORN, I still find it incredible that the news keeps on misreporting this as "voter fraud" when it in fact is nothing of the sort.
 
2012-09-28 01:08:26 PM
Is there anything the GOP doesn't farking project on? They were adamant about voter fraud to use to disenfranchise large swaths of people but couldn't show it happening at any rate that wasn't ludicrously low to base a law on, until they get caught.

I used to believe that they cared about the US. In their weird, twisted way they cared about the US, or at least the US as they saw it in their vision from the cave. Now I can't even believe that. These people are becoming enemies of the nation. They should be treated as such.
 
2012-09-28 01:09:13 PM

Diogenes: Not an isolated incident with this Sproul person.


Much, MUCH better article. Read this one yesterday., This NBC bullshiat is a piece of crap, your link goes into much more detail in the same space.
 
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