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(Bloomberg)   AT&T, Verizon and Time Warner are sick of your gaming console   (bloomberg.com) divider line 115
    More: Obvious, Verizon, Time Warner, company, Xbox, Cox Communications, remote servers, social games, big data  
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11491 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 27 Sep 2012 at 5:12 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-27 04:10:15 AM
Makes sense, and could save us a lot of money. And perhaps it will arrive in the UK too. Not that many people have any idea of high speed communications as we are starved of them
 
2012-09-27 05:21:55 AM
Cable Plots

What a cable plotter might look like.

www.toyota-4runner.org
 
2012-09-27 05:47:09 AM

colinspooky: Makes sense, and could save us a lot of money.


You enjoy renting games instead of owning them I presume?

I don't believe it's possible in any real sense currently though. The lag would be horrendous, especially as there'll be lag between your movement and the characters movement on screen. shiat, even that lag would be two-way too.

Not to mention the challenges involved in streaming that much HD content out simultaneously, with each stream having to be rendered independently. (You might get some savings there if you're looking at an MMORPG sort of thing I guess, I don't know...)

I'll say it's technically possible, but will probably always be at least a generation or two behind a console for quality.

/The tubes probably need to be fatter too.
 
2012-09-27 05:52:28 AM

SJKebab: colinspooky: Makes sense, and could save us a lot of money.

You enjoy renting games instead of owning them I presume?

I don't believe it's possible in any real sense currently though. The lag would be horrendous, especially as there'll be lag between your movement and the characters movement on screen. shiat, even that lag would be two-way too.

Not to mention the challenges involved in streaming that much HD content out simultaneously, with each stream having to be rendered independently. (You might get some savings there if you're looking at an MMORPG sort of thing I guess, I don't know...)

I'll say it's technically possible, but will probably always be at least a generation or two behind a console for quality.

/The tubes probably need to be fatter too.


Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.
 
2012-09-27 05:59:02 AM
Sounds good to me. An even more closed platform with no chance of modding or user created content.



i52.photobucket.com
 
2012-09-27 06:01:34 AM
"Everybody has a TV," said Atul Bagga, a video-games analyst at Lazard Capital Markets in San Francisco. Cable and phone companies are "looking for new ways to monetize their users and gaming can be pretty compelling," he said.

Explain how gaming-across-the-cloud is better for me than Steam.
 
2012-09-27 06:01:56 AM

Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.


How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?
 
2012-09-27 06:04:05 AM
[howaboutno.jpg]
 
2012-09-27 06:25:13 AM
Basically, monopolistic telcos hate your constantly running Internet-connected quality of service testers (game machines).
 
2012-09-27 06:25:19 AM
Pfft. Consoles are for minorities and little kids.
 
2012-09-27 06:29:17 AM

Wittenberg Dropout: Pfft. Consoles are for minorities and little kids.


How the hell did I end up with a gaming pc???? Am I going to be in trouble for breaking the rules!!??
 
2012-09-27 06:32:36 AM

untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?


I'm going with "data transfer cap on your DVD drive."
 
2012-09-27 06:35:13 AM

untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?


No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.
 
2012-09-27 06:36:53 AM

Meethos: Wittenberg Dropout: Pfft. Consoles are for minorities and little kids.

How the hell did I end up with a gaming pc???? Am I going to be in trouble for breaking the rules!!??


Muaha, make your time, SEAL Team 6 is bearing down on your signal as we speak! I knew we'd catch one tonight if we were patient!
 
2012-09-27 06:37:36 AM

Clipsy: No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.


Oh no! Let's be afraid of something that already happened!
 
2012-09-27 06:42:06 AM

crab66: Clipsy: No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.

Oh no! Let's be afraid of something that already happened!


Did I miss something? Did I step into a time portal? I'm pretty sure the last time I checked I could still buy console games on physical discs in a brick and mortar store. In fact, the last time I checked that was still very much the main way of purchasing console games.
 
2012-09-27 06:42:58 AM
I hope this doesn't work, I don't want to give more money to Time Warner. Effin crooks.
 
2012-09-27 06:46:28 AM

Clipsy: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.


Those already exist. They're called computers. :) Seriously, though, that's why proxies are so useful...disguise your packets so they don't know you're downloading games to your console.
 
2012-09-27 06:47:47 AM

yukichigai: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

I'm going with "data transfer cap on your DVD drive."


Wouldn't that require the telcos to have hardware access to your console?
 
2012-09-27 07:01:18 AM

untaken_name: Clipsy: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.

Those already exist. They're called computers. :) Seriously, though, that's why proxies are so useful...disguise your packets so they don't know you're downloading games to your console.


Disguise your packets all day long you won't hide the utilization on the port you are connected to. All they have to do is throttle the bandwidth, it isn't hard.
 
2012-09-27 07:07:26 AM

Ausfall: untaken_name: Clipsy: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.

Those already exist. They're called computers. :) Seriously, though, that's why proxies are so useful...disguise your packets so they don't know you're downloading games to your console.

Disguise your packets all day long you won't hide the utilization on the port you are connected to. All they have to do is throttle the bandwidth, it isn't hard.


Yes, but traffic shaping relies on being able to tell what kind of packets are being passed. They COULD just throttle the whole connection, sure, but in practice they just throttle the specific types of traffic they like least. This is already in operation with torrents and streaming video, in some locations. They can't just throttle the whole connection everywhere because they sell plans based on connection speed, not amount of data transferred, at least around here.
 
2012-09-27 07:07:49 AM

untaken_name: yukichigai: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

I'm going with "data transfer cap on your DVD drive."

Wouldn't that require the telcos to have hardware access to your console?


suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com
 
2012-09-27 07:12:21 AM

Ausfall: untaken_name: Clipsy: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

No, they'll just wait for Microsoft and Sony to shoot themselves in their respective feet by releasing consoles that expect games to be downloaded.

Those already exist. They're called computers. :) Seriously, though, that's why proxies are so useful...disguise your packets so they don't know you're downloading games to your console.

Disguise your packets all day long you won't hide the utilization on the port you are connected to. All they have to do is throttle the bandwidth, it isn't hard.


You really don't understand how SOCKS 4/5 proxies work, do you?

/Though yes, a flat bandwidth cap will make a proxy useless
 
2012-09-27 07:17:19 AM

Wittenberg Dropout: Pfft. Consoles are for minorities and little kids.


Consoles XBox Live are is for rednecks who HATE minorities and little kids who hate minorities

/FTFY
 
2012-09-27 07:18:25 AM
And you thought that load times between scenes in Skyrim on your PS3 were annoying. Just wait until all that data has to stream over your shiatty cable connection from some server in India. Baby, you ain't seen nothing yet!
 
2012-09-27 07:18:30 AM
Cable companies tried this before with The Sega Channel
 
2012-09-27 07:20:27 AM

yukichigai: untaken_name: yukichigai: untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?

I'm going with "data transfer cap on your DVD drive."

Wouldn't that require the telcos to have hardware access to your console?

[suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com image 452x339]


Sorry, I don't "get" "jokes". I have the sense of humor of a German.

/the culinary skills of an Englishman
//the organizational skills of an Italian
///and the cultural sensitivity of an American
 
2012-09-27 07:22:45 AM

buntz: Wittenberg Dropout: Pfft. Consoles are for minorities and little kids.

Consoles XBox Live are is for rednecks who HATE minorities and little kids who hate minorities

/FTFY


Ah yes. One of the many reasons why I think there ought to be a law requiring all online games to have a "mute all" command easily available in the main menu.

/I am a Mexican Jew Lizard
 
2012-09-27 07:43:34 AM

untaken_name: Clipsy: Don't worry, technical limitations won't be a problem (for them) at all. They'll just lower your usage cap until you can't play any games other than the ones on their service (which will be exempt, naturally). Can't have fair competition getting in the way of a dying business model, after all.

How are they going to affect my console? Throttle the HDMI connection?


If (packet.destination == Timewarner_server)
. Send_packet(packet,TimeWarner_server);
else
. Wait(1-5 seconds)
. Send_packet(packet,netflix/microsoft/sony server);

Sorry for the psuedo code, but that's what it's going to boil down to if they can get away with it.
 
2012-09-27 07:45:15 AM
I've got to believe the conversation was not "How can we get in on some of that gaming money" but rather "How can we make them use more bandwidth that we can then charge them for..." because you know damn well that while they can send HD video all day long if you leave your TV on - these gaming packets will be "magic" packets that require them to monitor every byte you use....
 
2012-09-27 07:58:04 AM

BumpInTheNight: If (packet.destination == Timewarner_server)
. Send_packet(packet,TimeWarner_server);
else
. Wait(1-5 seconds)
. Send_packet(packet,netflix/microsoft/sony server);

Sorry for the psuedo code, but that's what it's going to boil down to if they can get away with it.


Now, can you say that same idea in English?
 
2012-09-27 08:01:00 AM

doglover: BumpInTheNight: If (packet.destination == Timewarner_server)
. Send_packet(packet,TimeWarner_server);
else
. Wait(1-5 seconds)
. Send_packet(packet,netflix/microsoft/sony server);

Sorry for the psuedo code, but that's what it's going to boil down to if they can get away with it.

Now, can you say that same idea in English?


Sure. If the packet's destination is a server belonging to the ISP you're buying service from, they'll let it right through. If the destination is anywhere else, they will introduce an artificial delay in the process.
 
2012-09-27 08:05:52 AM
These assholes cannot even manage to keep a 1080P stream going reliably, and don't have enough bandwidth for their own modem users. How do they expect to play internet games too?
 
2012-09-27 08:07:49 AM

doglover: BumpInTheNight: If (packet.destination == Timewarner_server)
. Send_packet(packet,TimeWarner_server);
else
. Wait(1-5 seconds)
. Send_packet(packet,netflix/microsoft/sony server);

Sorry for the psuedo code, but that's what it's going to boil down to if they can get away with it.

Now, can you say that same idea in English?


If it's data from time warner it goes through. If it's for netflix, xbox, PSN, it gets delayed 5 seconds before being delivered. such latency would make internet good for text, email, web pages, and thats it.
 
2012-09-27 08:08:18 AM

untaken_name: Sure. If the packet's destination is a server belonging to the ISP you're buying service from, they'll let it right through. If the destination is anywhere else, they will introduce an artificial delay in the process.


Indeed and they're going to do it blatantly like that if they're allowed or through sneakier ways if net neutrality holds its ground. "Oh those packets are for our stuff no problem we trust them so let them through right away, but those other ones? They might be torrent packets so we'd better deep-inspect them and that means holding onto them longer before sending them off. You know, for quality of service. Yah, that's the ticket. Quality of Service."
 
2012-09-27 08:12:16 AM
So they're taking after OnLive? That's been working out so well.

/Given the way that those companies run everything else that they do... yeah, I'll wait for Google Fiber before approaching the idea again.
 
2012-09-27 08:29:30 AM
Well i'm sick of Time Warner, Verizon and AT&T so I guess we're even then.
 
2012-09-27 08:31:52 AM

dustman81: Cable companies tried this before with The Sega Channel


Came here to say this. Looks like the writers didnt do their research. This is not a new concept at all. I had it, dont know how much it cost my folks, but remember it being well executed.
 
2012-09-27 08:33:08 AM

LtDarkstar: Well i'm sick of Time Warner, Verizon and AT&T so I guess we're even then.


I switched to Cox when I moved because Comcast and AT&T wouldn't serve the apt.

It's the first time I've ever gotten upstream and downstreams that actually equal or better whats advertised on the tin.

/I suck cox!
 
2012-09-27 08:40:21 AM
"generic controllers connected to your set top box"

let me know when cable companies start putting gaming quality hardware in their dvr and cable receivers. Until then enjoy your crappy flash type games on your cable box.

this is a load of complete horsecrap. there is just no way for the cable companies to compete in the gaming market in anyway except possibly with facebook type or flash type games. You simply are not going to play Halo 4 or COD Zombies on a cable box. It just ain't gonna happen. Sony, MS and Nintendo will be just fine. Hell, the new Wii U is probably going to demolish sales records.

(Actually, I think the Wii U is not going to do anything CLOSE to what the Wii did, simply because you can't really improve Wii bowling that much, and that is all 70 percent of the people that bought a Wii ever play.)
 
2012-09-27 08:42:18 AM

DemoKnite: dustman81: Cable companies tried this before with The Sega Channel

Came here to say this. Looks like the writers didnt do their research. This is not a new concept at all. I had it, dont know how much it cost my folks, but remember it being well executed.


You guys realize that the Sega Channel still required the Sega Genesis console to work, right? That the games didn't just magically squirt into your cable box and work with some generic controller, right?
 
2012-09-27 08:43:58 AM

frepnog: You simply are not going to play Halo 4 or COD Zombies on a cable box


Why not? Cable boxes have been advancing their hardware constantly. New ones come out every few months.

Xbox 360 is 7 years old.

/Moores law says you should be able to play Xbox 360 on your cell phone by now.
//nobody is trying to do that though.
 
2012-09-27 08:48:57 AM
Oh. is this like how pc gaming is dead? let me feign interest.
 
2012-09-27 08:59:48 AM
I've been saying for two or three years that this would make sense. Especially once SDV started getting significant deployment. Delivering the game video is no different from delivering a PPV purchase. I see talk of "lag" in the comments but we're not talking about delivering the product from Uzbekistan. The hop would be a few miles to a local hub. Under 5ms is not unrealistic. I live out in the sticks and my first telco hop is in the low teens.

Just plug the USB controller into your cable box which contains a cablemodem that gets an optimized connection to the game server. Tuner connects to the video output of the game server. All the processing is done at the cable company. While there would be some lag, I think it would work for most games.
 
2012-09-27 09:04:57 AM

jtown: which contains a cablemodem that gets an optimized connection to the game server.


You do realize this is a violation of network neutrality right?
 
2012-09-27 09:08:12 AM

fluffy2097: frepnog: You simply are not going to play Halo 4 or COD Zombies on a cable box

Why not? Cable boxes have been advancing their hardware constantly. New ones come out every few months.

Xbox 360 is 7 years old.

/Moores law says you should be able to play Xbox 360 on your cell phone by now.
//nobody is trying to do that though.


call me when cable companies put Nvidia chipsets and multiple gigs of ram in the boxes, and THEN call me when they convince every single subscriber to upgrade to the new boxes, and THEN call me when they get an appreciable number of people to subscribe to the service. Also call me when Dish and Direct tv decide to go this route as well, as unfeasible as it is thru satellite connections.

You need a LITTLE more than just DVR hardware to play graphics heavy games like Gears of War and God of War. Just ask Sony, who thought the Cell was the answer to everything, until they figured out that they STILL needed that little Nvidia graphics chip. Hell, the only reason some of the phones can play console quality (lol) games is because *gasp* Nvidia makes chips for them.

Meanwhile, close to 20 million people in North America alone are patiently waiting to give Microsoft money when the Xbox 720 (or whatever they call it) is released.

I am not going to say that the IDEA isn't good. It is just unfeasible.
 
2012-09-27 09:25:17 AM

frepnog: call me when cable companies put Nvidia chipsets and multiple gigs of ram in the boxes,


A graphics chipset of the same power as an Xbox 360 costs like 20 bucks these days. fark, I'm pretty sure that the graphics integrated in a core I7 processor is enough to beat the pants off a 360.

Gigs of ram? In my console? Not bloody likely. You'll take your 512 mb of slow ass ram and like it.
 
2012-09-27 09:30:22 AM
My money is on ps4/xbox 720 replacing your cable faster than your cable replaces the gaming console. We aren't that far from it now.
 
2012-09-27 09:32:35 AM

NickelP: My money is on ps4/xbox 720 replacing your cable faster than your cable replaces the gaming console. We aren't that far from it now.


um. How can a console replace your cable? The console still needs an internet connection unless you want to do nothing but play Mario.
 
2012-09-27 09:33:28 AM

fluffy2097: NickelP: My money is on ps4/xbox 720 replacing your cable faster than your cable replaces the gaming console. We aren't that far from it now.

um. How can a console replace your cable? The console still needs an internet connection unless you want to do nothing but play Mario.


Notice I said cable and not internet connection?
 
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