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(The Atlantic Wire)   SAT reading scores are the lowest they've been in 40 years. Thanks, television   (theatlanticwire.com) divider line 145
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3109 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Sep 2012 at 4:41 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-25 05:22:15 PM  
Wait a minute... TV has been around longer than 40 years!

ranier_wolfcastle.jpg
 
2012-09-25 05:22:25 PM  
Clearly the teachers just aren't teaching hard enough CUT ALL FUNDING NOW
 
2012-09-25 05:23:16 PM  

Sticky Hands: simplicimus: super_grass: sprd: So I guess the SAT and ACT are biased towards Asian-Americans since they consistently achieve higher scores than any other demographic. Someday science will be able to use a probe to clock your brain speed through your retinas. When that happens you will finally realize the truth even though most of you will still even deny it.

RAT'S LACISS!

On another note, why are people blaming NCLB? If anything, it encourages schools to teach kids how to take a test.

Because in the real world, some jobs require independent thought and creativity.

how I wish that were true.


The fries are done when the ringer goes off, not before and not after.
 
2012-09-25 05:24:39 PM  
iseeahappyface.com
 
2012-09-25 05:26:06 PM  

apotheosis27: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

So you think there should be an ebonics section or something?

I think that's a pussy excuse. The SAT & ACT were not that difficult.


What white males see.............

elementaryalgebra.pages3d.net

What females see..........

ej.iop.org

What non-Asian minorities see.......

24.media.tumblr.com

What Asian minorities see........

www.billybear4kids.com 

At least, that's what some would have us believe.
 
2012-09-25 05:28:02 PM  
media.northjersey.com 

Successful parents have successful kids, but is it due to inheritance on environmental?
 
2012-09-25 05:33:24 PM  
imageshack.us
 
2012-09-25 05:33:57 PM  
kelevra23.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-09-25 05:34:33 PM  

Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.


Because the test does not correlate to the materials being taught in school. Those students that take SAT/ACT prep classes, take PSATs, and take outside tutoring specifically for the SAT/ACT will do better than those that do not. I never took any SAT/ACT prep classes, yet was #2 in my class (would have been #1 but my GPA was brought down because I also played sports - maximum GPA contribution is 4.0 when my other classes were 5.0 due to AP classes) and graduated magna cum laude from college - yet my SAT scores were only above average. Well-to-do families can and do send their kids to SAT classes and take PSATs. Magnet schools and upper-end schools offer these programs. It is no coincidence that these schools test higher, however, I also do not think that quality of education is any if at all less at lower-income areas than the rich schools.
 
2012-09-25 05:35:16 PM  

smitty04: [media.northjersey.com image 550x385] 

Successful parents have successful kids, but is it due to inheritance on environmental?


Probably their inheritance, can't be the environment in Jersey.
 
2012-09-25 05:43:34 PM  

Sybarite: The chart clearly shows an inverse correlation between SAT scores and poverty. As the poverty rate goes up, as defined by qualification for reduced prices lunches, SAT and ACT scores go down


Thank you for this powerful graphic showing that free lunches destroy education. If only we could appreciate the full impact of public education on education.
 
2012-09-25 05:43:44 PM  
There are more cell phones in Korea than there are people and they do prety well at math.
 
2012-09-25 05:46:04 PM  
Is this where we pipe in with our scores from way back?

SAT: 680 English/590 math= 1270 out of 1600

ACT: 30

/Not great, but not bad. Took both tests cold--no prep.
 
2012-09-25 05:46:21 PM  
My personal reading skills have suffered due to the infestation of my favorite literary genres (sci-fi, fantasy and horror) by an army of simpering bimbos with two letters for a first name.
 
2012-09-25 05:48:49 PM  

apotheosis27: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

So you think there should be an ebonics section or something?

I think that's a pussy excuse. The SAT & ACT were not that difficult.


Where did I say that? I'm just pointing out that this test does not "test" what it purports to test. Like I said, they claim it tests college readiness, but more women than men graduate from college, while men score higher than women on the test. Ipso facto, it does not test what it claims to test.
 
2012-09-25 05:49:01 PM  

fickenchucker: Is this where we pipe in with our scores from way back?

SAT: 680 English/590 math= 1270 out of 1600

ACT: 30

/Not great, but not bad. Took both tests cold--no prep.


Didn't take the ACT. My SAT was 1490, but I was pretty stoned while taking it.
 
2012-09-25 05:49:45 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

Prepare for an onslaught of white guys who couldn't get into the Advanced Mediocrity program and NE State University because of the bias against white guys.


Wow, no kidding.

I don't understand what the problem is with pointing out stats like this. (Well except for the fact that lots of people don't understand how statistics work).
 
2012-09-25 05:53:12 PM  

depmode98: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

that's just bullshiat. granted it's been a decade since I took the SAT, but from what I remember, it's just straight up math, or knowing the specific definition of words. If you want to say white people are biased to just know more stuff, that's fine, but that's racist. If you want to say, it favors mid to upper middle class PEOPLE in general because they can afford tutors, that's fine too, and probably closer to the reality.


I didn't say white people know more. I just pointed out that white males tend to do better on this test than other groups, which is true. What I really should have pointed out was that it's the money - family income that really makes a difference - which probably goes to your point about tutoring (but really, I think it's the education they can afford to buy).

LInky
 
2012-09-25 05:54:35 PM  

simplicimus: Sticky Hands: simplicimus: super_grass: sprd: So I guess the SAT and ACT are biased towards Asian-Americans since they consistently achieve higher scores than any other demographic. Someday science will be able to use a probe to clock your brain speed through your retinas. When that happens you will finally realize the truth even though most of you will still even deny it.

RAT'S LACISS!

On another note, why are people blaming NCLB? If anything, it encourages schools to teach kids how to take a test.

Because in the real world, some jobs require independent thought and creativity.

how I wish that were true.

All my various careers, programmer, DBA, software tester, hardware tester, required those attributes.


Computer Programming is a good example. I only have an Associates degree and make more money than I ever thought I would. College degrees don't write software for you and even big companies can only afford so many unproductive degree collectors. I'm guessing engineering is the same way and that's why companies go overseas for their engineers today.
 
2012-09-25 05:54:57 PM  

sprd: So I guess the SAT and ACT are biased towards Asian-Americans since they consistently achieve higher scores than any other demographic. Someday science will be able to use a probe to clock your brain speed through your retinas. When that happens you will finally realize the truth even though most of you will still even deny it.


Actually, Asian-Americans only score better in the mathematics. Whites beat them in both critical reading and writing.

Link
 
2012-09-25 05:57:54 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

Because the test does not correlate to the materials being taught in school. Those students that take SAT/ACT prep classes, take PSATs, and take outside tutoring specifically for the SAT/ACT will do better than those that do not. I never took any SAT/ACT prep classes, yet was #2 in my class (would have been #1 but my GPA was brought down because I also played sports - maximum GPA contribution is 4.0 when my other classes were 5.0 due to AP classes) and graduated magna cum laude from college - yet my SAT scores were only above average. Well-to-do families can and do send their kids to SAT classes and take PSATs. Magnet schools and upper-end schools offer these programs. It is no coincidence that these schools test higher, however, I also do not think that quality of education is any if at all less at lower-income areas than the rich schools.


Do you have evidence that SAT scores under predict college results of low income students? And if so by how much? What if studies showed SAT scores over predicted the results of low income students, would you reverse your stance?

I think there are variations in the quality of education across schools, but I am guessing a lot of the variation comes from the inputs (rich students are probably more likely to have educated parents who focus on education and/or smart parents who provide smart person genes).
 
2012-09-25 05:59:19 PM  
So guns don't kill people, but televisions make people stupid.



Got it.
 
2012-09-25 06:06:44 PM  
As someone who took the SAT in 1972, I don't know whether to gloat or to be embarrassed.
 
2012-09-25 06:10:22 PM  

hitlersbrain: Computer Programming is a good example. I only have an Associates degree and make more money than I ever thought I would. College degrees don't write software for you and even big companies can only afford so many unproductive degree collectors. I'm guessing engineering is the same way and that's why companies go overseas for their engineers today.


Please, these unproductive degree collectors prefer the term MBA.
 
2012-09-25 06:21:20 PM  

You're the jerk... jerk: the money is in the banana stand: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

Because the test does not correlate to the materials being taught in school. Those students that take SAT/ACT prep classes, take PSATs, and take outside tutoring specifically for the SAT/ACT will do better than those that do not. I never took any SAT/ACT prep classes, yet was #2 in my class (would have been #1 but my GPA was brought down because I also played sports - maximum GPA contribution is 4.0 when my other classes were 5.0 due to AP classes) and graduated magna cum laude from college - yet my SAT scores were only above average. Well-to-do families can and do send their kids to SAT classes and take PSATs. Magnet schools and upper-end schools offer these programs. It is no coincidence that these schools test higher, however, I also do not think that quality of education is any if at all less at lower-income areas than the rich schools.

Do you have evidence that SAT scores under predict college results of low income students? And if so by how much? What if studies showed SAT scores over predicted the results of low income students, would you reverse your stance?

I think there are variations in the quality of education across schools, but I am guessing a lot of the variation comes from the inputs (rich students are probably more likely to have educated parents who focus on education and/or smart parents who provide smart person genes).


I believe that the SATs are a terrible indicator of intelligence. I am not a fan of standardized testing of any sort. There are vast amounts of subjects not even covered by the SATs. You have Math and Reading (I guess there is a Composition portion nowadays too). Never mind the fact that the scope of material for both are "odd" to say the least and not very broad, there are tons of subject matters not even addressed by the test. I have never understood the purpose of the SATs. I agree with you on the topic of inputs, the more affluent schools will have parents that give a damn, or are in a position to help their children succeed which will affect the scores - not necessarily that the quality of education is lower.
 
2012-09-25 06:21:24 PM  

simplicimus: hitlersbrain: Computer Programming is a good example. I only have an Associates degree and make more money than I ever thought I would. College degrees don't write software for you and even big companies can only afford so many unproductive degree collectors. I'm guessing engineering is the same way and that's why companies go overseas for their engineers today.

Please, these unproductive degree collectors prefer the term MBA.


This.

I recall an old commercial on the radio with a woman explaining something to a colleague. As she notices his initial difficulties in grasping whatever she is attempting to explain, he retorts with, "But, I'm an MBA."

After which, she uses slower speech and small words in an effort to better explain the material.
 
2012-09-25 06:23:42 PM  
• American Indian---482/480 (962)
• Asian American-----575/508 (1083)
• African American-----426/431 (857)
• Puerto Rican----457/448 (905)

Other Hispanic----464/457 (921)

• White-----534/529 (1063)
• Other ----513/501 (1014)

Asian Americans are kicking a$$.
 
2012-09-25 06:27:18 PM  

smitty04:  

Successful parents have successful kids, but is it due to inheritance on environmental?


This! Trends follow homes that value education.
 
2012-09-25 06:34:02 PM  
Nothing a bit of appropriate normalization won't cure. Life goes on...
 
2012-09-25 06:45:53 PM  

scottydoesntknow: Unless that kid bought the television and is paying for the cable with his/her own money, I think the blame can rest on the parents.


I grew up with TV and video games.

Everyone I knew grew up with TV and video games.

No Net, no cell phone.

We can all read at least one language and at don't idk my bff Jill or NTTARWT abbreviate.
 
2012-09-25 06:46:59 PM  
Thank the Corportist governements for destraying thi educations systemz so peeps willz be too stupids to rebel againx their bullshait and liez and loves being slave.
 
2012-09-25 06:49:48 PM  
No mention of America's continuing trend of dysgenics.
 
2012-09-25 06:54:21 PM  
I'd argue that a test done in the senior year of H.S. (i.e. SAT) is doing pretty well to explain an entire 40% of the variance in freshman performance. With the sample size they're using that would be a p-value of p
 
2012-09-25 06:56:56 PM  

Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.


Master race FTW
 
2012-09-25 06:59:13 PM  
FTA:
"More than 1.66 million graduating seniors last year took the test, the highest number in history. Nearly half were minorities and about a quarter reported that English was not exclusively their first language. More than a quarter of public school test-takers - 27 percent - had family income low enough to qualify for a fee waiver, and more than a third - 36 percent - reported that their parents had not gone to college."

What does any of this have to do with anything? Working hard and giving a fark has nothing to do with any of that. If you don't know English, learn it or go back to whatever shiathole country you came from

/Am I doing it right?
 
2012-09-25 07:02:24 PM  

Clemkadidlefark: SAT reading scores are the lowest they've been in 40 years. Thanks, television

SAT reading scores are the lowest they've been in 40 years. Thanks, Unions 
Jesus
FTFY


FTFY
 
2012-09-25 07:05:46 PM  

Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.


We're never going to get a test that everyone deems 'fair', so why don't we just hold a lottery for college admissions? If your number gets drawn, you go, if it doesn't, you're SOL. And we can use the same technique for jobs. If you want a particular job, you put your name in. If it gets drawn, presto, you're a brain surgeon or whatever.

If equality and an equal outcome for all is your goal, that's the way to get it.
 
2012-09-25 07:13:01 PM  
Several things to consider:

(1) There's not really some universal standard at play here, as the de facto requirements for literacy have in fact changed since 1973 as well. It's likely that the test failing to keep up with changing culture is as big or bigger a factor than any actual change in student proficiency. This is the reason why most tests actually regarded as competently designed actually have some sort of normalization or standard ingrained in the final score, and why the SAT has to supply the score distribution to institutions to make it meaningful.

(2) Initially, the SAT was almost entirely administered to people that were probably going to college, the top 2% GPA types, etc. That's been expanded significantly, with the lower bound on scholastic interest dropping without a corresponding addition of more of the known top performers participating. It's entirely possible that overall/average ability in this subject has increased, with the average score being simultaneously brought down by the increase in the low-end test takers participating.

(3) The above said, we actually could do a lot to improve the primary/secondary education system. I'm just saying that EVERYBODY PANIC AND BUY MORE KAPLAN PRACTICE GUIDES that the article's trying to shill is not one of those things. I'm a bit annoyed by a scaremongering marketing blitz being treated as real news. Yes, there are issues, but it's not a damned "crisis", already. Calm the fark down.
 
2012-09-25 07:33:04 PM  
On a side note, did anyone else notice the links to other articles below this one?
"How not to sound racist when talking about black studies" is it possible to not sound racist, even if you are black? I got a look at the required books for that course. (Did used books as a sideline for a couple of years.) That stuff is truly racist.
Aggressively point out what dead people did. Accuse contemporaries of same activities. The louder the better. Demand compensation.
 
2012-09-25 07:34:22 PM  

Walker: Don't blame television. Kids hardly watch it these days. They spend most of their time on their cell phones texting....so spelling will be taking a big hit too. k thx bai.


OMFG!!!!!LOL!!!1!
 
2012-09-25 07:36:30 PM  
Now that I think about it...

I wonder if the rise of e-books and the fall of paper books will make a difference.

I grew up in a house with thousands of books, and despite my natural idiocy I can at *least* claim to be slightly literate. There were books there for the taking! A kid could pick them up when they were bored and see what was in them, and maybe even read it.

Kids may not have the same serendipitous ability to reach for a book when they're bored now... Mommy or Daddy's Kindle / Nook / iPad / whatever doesn't have the same availability, yet I'd bet that kids can play Angry Birds on whatever device since they know to ask for it. There's no discovery there.
 
2012-09-25 07:40:30 PM  
Looks like all that yearly standardized testing -and the bastardization of education that is "teaching to the test" which goes along with it- is having the desired effect. Thanks TAAS.
 
2012-09-25 07:41:05 PM  
1210 on SAT. Twice. Math up 10 points, reading down 10. Ran out of time on both, both times. Have a learning disability, but don't like calling attention to it. I could have gotten unlimited time, but that would have meant something else for the kids to tease me about. What I did finish on the tests, I was close to 100% on. Took test prep in between with my twin(who scored below 900), which was a waste, but he couldn't go alone, and he also couldn't finish with a score below 900. So I was signed up to be his support. That was a worthless class. I was the class nerd, all over again, during the summer this time.

/shiatty childhood
//spent reading in my room.
///engineer-in-training(EE & ME)
////I'm not going to be your boss, I'm going to own the whole damn corporation
 
2012-09-25 08:00:28 PM  
Trance354:

1210 on SAT. Twice. Math up 10 points, reading down 10. Ran out of time on both, both times. Have a learning disability, but don't like calling attention to it. I could have gotten unlimited time, but that would have meant something else for the kids to tease me about. What I did finish on the tests, I was close to 100% on. Took test prep in between with my twin(who scored below 900), which was a waste, but he couldn't go alone, and he also couldn't finish with a score below 900. So I was signed up to be his support. That was a worthless class. I was the class nerd, all over again, during the summer this time.

/shiatty childhood
//spent reading in my room.
///engineer-in-training(EE & ME)
////I'm not going to be your boss, I'm going to own the whole damn corporation


I feel for the kids who have to take the new written exam.

I took a number of AP tests in high school that saved me a lot of tuition, and what gave me fits was the writing. I don't have a learning disability, I have a writing disability. I know what I want to put down, but it takes me much longer than most to write it out longhand, my hands betray me. I'd be absolutely farked by the current test.

/ had very, very good, like scholarship-good scores on the PSAT and SAT. Would bomb the current tests.
 
2012-09-25 08:09:13 PM  
ctl+F *subtitles*

I am disappointed.

Dont blame television.

We have a television in our work area. I always turn on the subtitles; mostly because we keep the volume muted. Most colleagues complain about it -reading is hard.
 
2012-09-25 08:10:24 PM  
Meanwhile, teacher salaries have tripled during this time.

We need to cut teacher salaries so we can get higher scores.
 
2012-09-25 08:14:26 PM  

jjorsett: Kimothy: Maybe if the SAT and ACT actually tested what they claim to test, this wouldn't matter.

They claim they test "college readiness" but white males outscore every other group, but white females graduate from college at the highest rate. If this test really tested "college readiness" women would outscore men.

All tests have built in biases - this one definitely favors mid to upper middle class white people.

We're never going to get a test that everyone deems 'fair', so why don't we just hold a lottery for college admissions? If your number gets drawn, you go, if it doesn't, you're SOL. And we can use the same technique for jobs. If you want a particular job, you put your name in. If it gets drawn, presto, you're a brain surgeon or whatever.

If equality and an equal outcome for all is your goal, that's the way to get it.


Once again, I never said that, either. Just pointed out that this test does not measure what the SAT/ACT people say it measures. I also pointed out it has built-in biases that favor mid to upper class white people, which is statistically true (check the links I posted above).

Do I wish there were an alternative that offered more equity or equality? Sure, doesn't everyone? Did I suggest that we needed some radical or ridiculous method, like your above example? Absolutely not. I understand that admittance to college is competitive - there are limited spots for numerous applicants so of course there is competition. I'm just pointing out that SAT/ACT scores aren't necessarily an accurate measure of college readiness - which many colleges are recognizing, as they are reducing the value of those scores in their admittance measurements.
 
2012-09-25 08:17:44 PM  
Any retard can father a child. AND THEY DO.
 
2012-09-25 08:17:51 PM  
deadhomersociety.files.wordpress.com

Unpossible!
 
2012-09-25 08:23:47 PM  

simplicimus: 12349876: jimmyjackfunk: I never took the SAT in school but took the ACT. Has it changed so much since 1989 that you have to pay even for practice tests now?

Yes, and they're expensive. And there's a whole industry of tutors that will spend several hours teaching your precious snowflake the test. If you have the money.

Ah, yes. Teaching to the test is truly the way to gain an education.


yes, its far better to make them feel good about their D than to teach what is going to be on a test.

That's all that happens in the real world, after all. Bosses telling their workers that failing is ok as long as they tried. Being able to produce, that's not wanted.
 
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