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(Wimp)   Light bulb of the future   (wimp.com) divider line 44
    More: Spiffy, light bulbs, future  
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6352 clicks; posted to Video » on 22 Sep 2012 at 4:20 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-22 02:57:55 PM  
So what $150 a bulb?
 
2012-09-22 03:01:16 PM  
Ah, a solution in search of a problem.
 
2012-09-22 03:20:42 PM  
That's kind of cool, but LED lightbulbs are nothing new.
 
2012-09-22 03:32:58 PM  
Those CFLs have a blue color we don't like? Um, he isn't aware they come in all sorts of color temps? Yeah, most of them are the 6000k blue type, but go on Amazon and search for CFL 2700K and you get nice warm yellow ones identical to old-fashioned incandescents. That's what I use.
 
2012-09-22 03:42:15 PM  

vossiewulf: Those CFLs have a blue color we don't like? Um, he isn't aware they come in all sorts of color temps? Yeah, most of them are the 6000k blue type, but go on Amazon and search for CFL 2700K and you get nice warm yellow ones identical to old-fashioned incandescents. That's what I use.


Yea, But do they dance to dubstep?

/ kidding
 
2012-09-22 03:50:24 PM  

EvilEgg: So what $150 a bulb?


Plus a smartphone.
 
2012-09-22 03:51:53 PM  

Jamdug!: That's kind of cool, but LED lightbulbs are nothing new.


They aren't anything new, but this is certainly an innovative way to couple more modern technology with them. It would be fun to mess around with the software too. For instance, assuming you have your phone with you the bulbs could potentially track you as you move through your home, lighting the way as you go and turning off lights as you leave a room. At minimum they could detect you coming and going from your home and act accordingly. Or for those who work night shifts the bulbs could be used to simulate rising light levels similar to the sun rising. Home security systems could also benefit from these.
 
2012-09-22 04:08:51 PM  
meh. You still have to muck about with a phone. What he should have done is develop voice/movement actuated lighting. All the tech is already present. This is what happens when you *give* people money...
 
2012-09-22 04:39:07 PM  
Welcome to the age of smart phones and stupid people
 
2012-09-22 04:45:07 PM  
Yeah, the smart phone aspect makes this a "no" for me. The idea of programmable, color-changing LED bulbs is great. Meanwhile, not everyone has a smartphone. (I do, but still.) That narrows the market. Smartphone tech is continually evolving, and involves more than one OS. That's not going to stop. If the bulbs can last for 25 years, would this company be diligent about tweaking multiple versions of their app to match their customers' phones?

They should have developed a dedicated control device to go with the bulbs, is what I'm saying.
 
2012-09-22 05:02:40 PM  

Sliding Carp: Plus a smartphone.


How am I ever expected to listen to my 8-Track tapes on a CD player, or better yet, digitally?
 
2012-09-22 05:06:13 PM  
yeeeshe - tough crowd. Looks cool.
 
2012-09-22 05:18:14 PM  

Canton: Yeah, the smart phone aspect makes this a "no" for me. The idea of programmable, color-changing LED bulbs is great. Meanwhile, not everyone has a smartphone. (I do, but still.) That narrows the market. Smartphone tech is continually evolving, and involves more than one OS. That's not going to stop. If the bulbs can last for 25 years, would this company be diligent about tweaking multiple versions of their app to match their customers' phones?

They should have developed a dedicated control device to go with the bulbs, is what I'm saying.


This. Lots of add-on and replacement sales.

$69 for a farking light bulb. Rub a lamp, bro.
 
2012-09-22 05:18:14 PM  
aiiee:


meh. You still have to muck about with a phone. What he should have done is develop voice/movement actuated lighting. All the tech is already present. This is what happens when you *give* people money...

i48.tinypic.com

I'd say it's an instance of overengineering... Once you put a microcontroller in something all sorts of things are possible, but some engineers never stop to think if those things are actually *desirable.*
 
2012-09-22 05:26:25 PM  
 
2012-09-22 05:34:34 PM  
Canton:

Yeah, the smart phone aspect makes this a "no" for me. The idea of programmable, color-changing LED bulbs is great. Meanwhile, not everyone has a smartphone. (I do, but still.) That narrows the market. Smartphone tech is continually evolving, and involves more than one OS. That's not going to stop. If the bulbs can last for 25 years, would this company be diligent about tweaking multiple versions of their app to match their customers' phones?

They should have developed a dedicated control device to go with the bulbs, is what I'm saying.


There are ways to "future proof" things like that... An example would be to use dumb, human-readable messages like XML to control the bulbs rather than some weird custom binary format.

I ran into something like that when I was converting a few thousand documents in multiple obsolete word processor documents for a friend. I converted them to both the latest version of MS Word, but also made copies in a stripped-down vanilla form of HTML. That way long after MS Word is gone, any programmer who's gotten past "Hello World" could reconstruct the formatted documents from the HTML. 

By the same token, and decent programmer could build an app for controlling these lights with nothing more than a command reference.

/ that's not to say these guys actually *did* do it that way...
 
2012-09-22 05:36:31 PM  

Canton: Yeah, the smart phone aspect makes this a "no" for me. The idea of programmable, color-changing LED bulbs is great. Meanwhile, not everyone has a smartphone. (I do, but still.) That narrows the market. Smartphone tech is continually evolving, and involves more than one OS. That's not going to stop. If the bulbs can last for 25 years, would this company be diligent about tweaking multiple versions of their app to match their customers' phones?

They should have developed a dedicated control device to go with the bulbs, is what I'm saying.


I suspect there would be a fair bit of overlap between people that would want cool trick LED lights and smart phone users. The $69 a pop might be the larger barrier. Even with a 25 year life, and reduced energy cost, that's an expensive bulb.
 
2012-09-22 06:10:58 PM  
I'd buy a smart bulb @ $20 a bulb, but not $70, and definitely not $150.

Do all of them operate off of Wi-Fi? Why? Better to have one module that plugs into your wall outlet and run the networking over the power lines.

Also not sure how they are supposed to operate if they are physically turned off by your switch.

All-in-all, a very cool idea, but the price point has to be a lot lower, which means better engineering on the control mechanisms.

I currently get good LED bulbs at Microcenter for $8 or $9 (dimmable). I realize these are not RGB LED bulbs... but as quantities manufactured goes up, costs would come down.

Also, there needs to be moe than an iPhone app to control it. I'd propose control software for Android, Windows, Linux and OSX, at the very least.

Oh... and like my old X-10 setup, it would be nice to have "virtual switches" instead of hard switches. One model could replace the old switch, the other could just be stuck to the wall, even using just batteries.

/Would be nice to have random light control when away on vacation
//Even nicer to tie into sensors to provide light in the middle of the night without having to find a switch
 
2012-09-22 06:30:07 PM  
I think you guys are focusing too much on the "smartphone" app. If this product takes off, there will be apps for every platform of phone, tablet and PC.
 
2012-09-22 06:38:01 PM  
SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY
 
2012-09-22 06:45:22 PM  

stonicus: I think you guys are focusing too much on the "smartphone" app. If this product takes off, there will be apps for every platform of phone, tablet and PC.


If my my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.
 
2012-09-22 06:45:59 PM  
LesserEvil:

I'd buy a smart bulb @ $20 a bulb, but not $70, and definitely not $150.

Do all of them operate off of Wi-Fi? Why? Better to have one module that plugs into your wall outlet and run the networking over the power lines.

Also not sure how they are supposed to operate if they are physically turned off by your switch.

All-in-all, a very cool idea, but the price point has to be a lot lower, which means better engineering on the control mechanisms.

I currently get good LED bulbs at Microcenter for $8 or $9 (dimmable). I realize these are not RGB LED bulbs... but as quantities manufactured goes up, costs would come down.

Also, there needs to be moe than an iPhone app to control it. I'd propose control software for Android, Windows, Linux and OSX, at the very least.

Oh... and like my old X-10 setup, it would be nice to have "virtual switches" instead of hard switches. One model could replace the old switch, the other could just be stuck to the wall, even using just batteries.

/Would be nice to have random light control when away on vacation
//Even nicer to tie into sensors to provide light in the middle of the night without having to find a switch


The price is definitely high especially since they're using Kickstarter to pay for the development, but there are a couple of components to this that aren't going to get much cheaper through volume.

Specifically the wireless module (COTS, already in every wireless gadget out there) and the digitally-controlled current regulators to vary the color and brightness. I'm guessing you *might* see this at $50 / bulb, but you're unlikely to see it at $20.

I'm also curious to see how well it handles heat. Dumb power FETs don't mind running hot, but microcontrollers certainly do.

I've never messed around with X10 through-the-wires controllers, but don't they have problems if you have the controller on a different breaker than the devices you're controlling? I know they have issues with surge protectors and other power conditioning.
 
2012-09-22 07:29:11 PM  

maxheck: Once you put a microcontroller in something all sorts of things are possible, but some engineers never stop to think if those things are actually *desirable.*


Ask a biologist about computer-controlled autoclaves. Stupidest over-techologizing EVAR!

A lot of the basics in this presentation really are interesting, and would be great, if they were cheap and if the entire system had an absolutely failsafe and idiot-proof fallback for the controls. Like, I don't know, light switches that just turn the lights on, when you want it bright, and off when you don't.
 
2012-09-22 08:12:22 PM  
i hope thats a really old video ;)

these are just EXAMPLES of replacements, there are hundreds of this type of thing out there in one form or another.

Bulbs:
http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/831e/
http://www.amazon.com/Multi-Color-E27-Light-Bulb-Remote/dp/B001JHZSEG
http://www.target.com/p/multi-color-changing-led-bulb-with-remote-con t roller/-/A-13229752

X10 remote apps for iphone:
http://melloware.com/x10commander/
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/mobilinc-lite-insteon-x10/id306280060? m t=8
 
2012-09-22 08:39:10 PM  

maxheck: LesserEvil:

I'd buy a smart bulb @ $20 a bulb, but not $70, and definitely not $150.

Do all of them operate off of Wi-Fi? Why? Better to have one module that plugs into your wall outlet and run the networking over the power lines.

Also not sure how they are supposed to operate if they are physically turned off by your switch.

All-in-all, a very cool idea, but the price point has to be a lot lower, which means better engineering on the control mechanisms.

I currently get good LED bulbs at Microcenter for $8 or $9 (dimmable). I realize these are not RGB LED bulbs... but as quantities manufactured goes up, costs would come down.

Also, there needs to be moe than an iPhone app to control it. I'd propose control software for Android, Windows, Linux and OSX, at the very least.

Oh... and like my old X-10 setup, it would be nice to have "virtual switches" instead of hard switches. One model could replace the old switch, the other could just be stuck to the wall, even using just batteries.

/Would be nice to have random light control when away on vacation
//Even nicer to tie into sensors to provide light in the middle of the night without having to find a switch

The price is definitely high especially since they're using Kickstarter to pay for the development, but there are a couple of components to this that aren't going to get much cheaper through volume.

Specifically the wireless module (COTS, already in every wireless gadget out there) and the digitally-controlled current regulators to vary the color and brightness. I'm guessing you *might* see this at $50 / bulb, but you're unlikely to see it at $20.

I'm also curious to see how well it handles heat. Dumb power FETs don't mind running hot, but microcontrollers certainly do.

I've never messed around with X10 through-the-wires controllers, but don't they have problems if you have the controller on a different breaker than the devices you're controlling? I know they have issues with surge protectors and other powe ...


Well, that's my basic issue with their approach. You don't need a wireless module, and yes, they make modules for powerline data transmission that would probably be less than $5 on a BoM.

As for powerline data transmission technology, I believe they've worked through most of the issues that plagued things applications X-10. The spotty X-10 powerline stuff is 20 year old technology.

As for heat, I've got an 8 watt LED at my desk right now... the heat sink is pretty decent. I can touch the bulb and it's warm, but not hot.Likewise, it's in a clip/desklamp shroud, and the temp reads out at 94degF with my temp probe at the base of the bulb. Plenty of microelectronics can handle that temperature.
 
2012-09-22 09:17:30 PM  
Vaporware. The kickstarter raised $1.3 million, and I would be surprised if one bulb gets to market
 
2012-09-22 11:03:47 PM  
This is not KISS. I like KISS.

/KISS: Keep it stupid, simple.
//I may have that backwards.
 
2012-09-22 11:36:53 PM  

stealthd: SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY


This.
 
2012-09-23 12:12:48 AM  

evulc: i hope thats a really old video ;)


Kickstarter project was launched on 9/15/12

i49.tinypic.com
 
2012-09-23 12:58:14 AM  
I dont mind getting up from my chair and turning the light off via the switch on the wall...therfore I am better then you lazy ass I can do it from my smartphone idiots.
 
2012-09-23 01:51:13 AM  

Giltric: I dont mind getting up from my chair and turning the light off via the switch on the wall...therfore I am better then you lazy ass I can do it from my smartphone idiots.


I suppose you refuse to use one of them fancy remote controls for your tube TV and Betamax player, and hang onions from your belt, too.
 
2012-09-23 04:06:42 AM  
LEDs are very energy efficient and long lasting, but the screw-in type don't have enough power. The brightest I've found is only as bright as a 75 watt incadescent. The ones he was showing in the video looked pretty bright, but hard to say if they'd be very bright in real life.

I absolutely hate those curly fluorescents. I've tried all types of temperatures, but the quality of light just doesn't look right to me. And I don't like their dimming ability. The regular ones can't be dimmed, and the dimmable ones have a very small range of adjustability. When I tried to make it dimmer, it goes from 100%, down to about 85% and if I slid the dimmer down even further, it would just shut off.

I prefer the light quality of halogens.
 
2012-09-23 06:02:50 AM  
We're greening Kickstarter videos, really?

/disgruntled my home anal polyp adventure game didn't get funded.
 
2012-09-23 06:59:44 AM  

vossiewulf: Those CFLs have a blue color we don't like? Um, he isn't aware they come in all sorts of color temps? Yeah, most of them are the 6000k blue type, but go on Amazon and search for CFL 2700K and you get nice warm yellow ones identical to old-fashioned incandescents. That's what I use.


Seriously. Also, I don't get up to turn on my lights anymore:

i01.i.aliimg.com

The remote is tiny. It sits on our coffee table. Easy control of all the lamps in our living room.
 
2012-09-23 09:43:38 AM  

EvilEgg: So what $150 a bulb?



Don't look at it that way. Just imagine all the money you'll be saving on electricity every month! Plus you'll be "saving the planet" as a free bonus.

Sure, it will probably take decades to break even but think about all the dancing you can do under the colorful flashing lights!  unts unts unts unts unts w00t!
 
2012-09-23 11:08:03 AM  
Original Kickstarter link
 
2012-09-23 11:17:21 AM  
I wouldn't personally back this unless he can warrant that they'll provide a dedicated controller in the absence of a smartphone. That is, that you don't actually need a smartphone in order to make the best use of this, since believe it or not, not everyone has or wants one, and $200+ is a bit much to spend on a lightbulb, no matter how cool it is.

That said, since this will appeal most to the kind of people who already use smartphones, I think it's reasonable to pitch the project this way. Otherwise, I'd say skip the Kickstarter campaign and just hire someone to take you through the traditional venture capital route of pre-launch commercial development.

I also want to hear him say that the platform is open source, so that anyone can write their own app for this, or even develop their own hardware mods. I wouldn't personally be interested in it otherwise.

It's an interesting idea, but I can't help feeling the idea itself could use some more development, especially drawn from community input.
 
2012-09-23 11:18:07 AM  

vossiewulf: Those CFLs have a blue color we don't like? Um, he isn't aware they come in all sorts of color temps? Yeah, most of them are the 6000k blue type, but go on Amazon and search for CFL 2700K and you get nice warm yellow ones identical to old-fashioned incandescents. That's what I use.


Yeah, that struck me as odd, too.
 
2012-09-23 11:25:54 AM  

Sliding Carp: maxheck: Once you put a microcontroller in something all sorts of things are possible, but some engineers never stop to think if those things are actually *desirable.*

Ask a biologist about computer-controlled autoclaves. Stupidest over-techologizing EVAR!

A lot of the basics in this presentation really are interesting, and would be great, if they were cheap and if the entire system had an absolutely failsafe and idiot-proof fallback for the controls. Like, I don't know, light switches that just turn the lights on, when you want it bright, and off when you don't.


Know how I know you didn't watch the whole thing?
 
2012-09-23 05:56:03 PM  
So.. a multi-color LED light that can do a strobe effect, smooth transition, fades and can be controlled from a remote device?

www.thinkgeek.com

Thinkgeek has been selling these for years.
 
2012-09-24 08:43:25 AM  
I thought it was a Dyson parody but the joke never happened.
 
2012-09-24 01:09:22 PM  

Sylvia_Bandersnatch: Know how I know you didn't watch the whole thing?


I tried, honest to God, I tried. But that video was more tedious and mind-numbing than Coldplay opening for Radiohead, and I just couldn't slog through to the end. Light switches involved somewhere, then?
 
2012-09-24 03:03:39 PM  

Sliding Carp: Sylvia_Bandersnatch: Know how I know you didn't watch the whole thing?

I tried, honest to God, I tried. But that video was more tedious and mind-numbing than Coldplay opening for Radiohead, and I just couldn't slog through to the end. Light switches involved somewhere, then?


Grow up.
 
2012-09-25 08:56:19 PM  

RoxtarRyan: So.. a multi-color LED light that can do a strobe effect, smooth transition, fades and can be controlled from a remote device?

[www.thinkgeek.com image 300x300]

Thinkgeek has been selling these for years.


The fact that he made it with an arduino is even funnier. I've had a similar setup controlling the interior lighting in my car for years now; anyone with even a rudimentary knowledge of programming and circuits can build this.
 
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