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(New Musical Express)   Billy Corgan says the next Smashing Pumpkins album will be a "cruel record." Hasn't that been every album since Gish?   (nme.com) divider line 82
    More: Obvious, Smashing Pumpkins, Billy Corgan, pumpkins, Pumpkins album  
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626 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 21 Sep 2012 at 9:36 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-21 09:26:41 AM  
Fark off, Siamese Dream is a masterpiece. And Machina II wasn't bad either.
 
2012-09-21 09:35:30 AM  
What? They got back together?

/dnrtfa
 
2012-09-21 09:38:42 AM  
I can't believe they're still around. Same for 311 and Red Hot Chili Peppers. All of them should have bowed out like 20 years ago.
 
2012-09-21 09:39:03 AM  
Porcelina just came on the mp3 player.

This is a sign.

Or is it?
 
2012-09-21 09:41:43 AM  
Adore is epic IMHO.
 
2012-09-21 09:51:29 AM  

JPSimonetti: I can't believe they're still around. Same for 311 and Red Hot Chili Peppers. All of them should have bowed out like 20 years ago.


I'm old enough to admit everyone's taste is different. But to me Melon Collie is a major masterpiece of recorded pop music. Gish and Siamese Dream show a lot of promise, but everything clicked and/or jelled with Melon Collie.

Even the packaging art direction is great.

After that...I've really tried, but I just can't go.

You have to realize, however, that I also regard White Zombie's La Sexorcisto as a near masterpiece as well.

Like I say, no accounting for taste.
 
2012-09-21 09:52:27 AM  

Flaming Yawn: You have to realize, however, that I also regard White Zombie's La Sexorcisto as a near masterpiece as well.


AstroCreep: 2000 is a masterpiece IMO.
 
2012-09-21 09:57:27 AM  

NeedlesslyCanadian: Fark off, Siamese Dream is a masterpiece.

Gish

is a fun little record, but most of the lyrics on that album are literally just random words thrown together, and I have no earthly idea why FARK especially keeps throwing out that album as some pinnacle of alternative music. The quality of (most of) the songs on Siamese Dream are so superior I'm not sure it's even worth a discussion.

/Siamese Dream is also way better and certainly more cohesive than Mellon Collie...
 
2012-09-21 09:59:56 AM  

JPSimonetti: I can't believe they're still around. Same for 311 and Red Hot Chili Peppers. All of them should have bowed out like 20 years ago.


311 has some gasoline left in that tank. I agree with everything else.
 
2012-09-21 10:12:10 AM  
I await Corgan clogging up the airwaves yet again while singing thru his nose.
/here's a tissue, Billy.
 
2012-09-21 10:12:27 AM  

Killer Cars: NeedlesslyCanadian: Fark off, Siamese Dream is a masterpiece.

Gish is a fun little record, but most of the lyrics on that album are literally just random words thrown together, and I have no earthly idea why FARK especially keeps throwing out that album as some pinnacle of alternative music. The quality of (most of) the songs on Siamese Dream are so superior I'm not sure it's even worth a discussion.

/Siamese Dream is also way better and certainly more cohesive than Mellon Collie...


It's just the hipster mentality, "A bands early work must obviously be their best".
 
2012-09-21 10:16:25 AM  
We're not going to get a good SP album until we lock Billy Corgan in a dark cellar for 3-5 years. Seriously.

I really need to start a Facebook group to see how many people are on board with this.
 
2012-09-21 10:17:33 AM  
I give em' alot of credit. Whether you like them or not you can pick them out within ten seconds on the radio.

I remember getting Mellon Collie when it came out and I go back and listen to it a few times a year. Not every song is amazing but it's certainly original to their style and none of it is just some random dreck tossed off for filler. I have to respect a band or artist that will do that. It may not be their best song but you know it wasn't slapped on there to fill space.
 
2012-09-21 10:24:05 AM  
I would love to find a person who sold an arm, leg, kidney and a future firstborn to get tickets to that Smashing Pumpkins "farewell concert" at the Metro in Chicago back in 2000, and ask them: "So....was it worth it, even though Corgan changed his mind and reformed Smashing Pumpkins?"
 
2012-09-21 10:27:11 AM  

Killer Cars: NeedlesslyCanadian: Fark off, Siamese Dream is a masterpiece.

Gish is a fun little record, but most of the lyrics on that album are literally just random words thrown together, and I have no earthly idea why FARK especially keeps throwing out that album as some pinnacle of alternative music. The quality of (most of) the songs on Siamese Dream are so superior I'm not sure it's even worth a discussion.

/Siamese Dream is also way better and certainly more cohesive than Mellon Collie...


Agreed. There is a lot of good stuff on Mellon Collie and Aeroplane, but as a double album it left a bit to be desired. All told there was probably enough awesome material to make two kickass albums, but they way they were arranged...too much filler.
 
2012-09-21 10:30:43 AM  
I think Billy Corgan releasing anything is just cruel.
 
2012-09-21 10:39:47 AM  
Gish was a good first effort, subby, but pretending it was their best album just makes you look like you're trying too hard.
 
2012-09-21 10:41:13 AM  

jbuist: We're not going to get a good SP album until we lock Billy Corgan in a dark cellar for 3-5 years. Seriously.


The guy wrote his best songs when he was suicidal and drugged up. So...yeah, it's pretty much over.
 
2012-09-21 10:43:14 AM  

Rann Xerox: I would love to find a person who sold an arm, leg, kidney and a future firstborn to get tickets to that Smashing Pumpkins "farewell concert" at the Metro in Chicago back in 2000, and ask them: "So....was it worth it, even though Corgan changed his mind and reformed Smashing Pumpkins?"


Two things:
1) They'd probably be fine with it, as it was still the last time with the original lineup (or was it...who was their bassist at that point?)
2) I love that era of Pumpkins albums, but even I can admit they were a horrible live act.
 
2012-09-21 10:48:01 AM  
Silversun Pickups > Smashing Pumpkins (nowadays anyway)
 
2012-09-21 10:49:06 AM  

SacriliciousBeerSwiller:
2) I love that era of Pumpkins albums, but even I can admit they were a horrible live act.


One of the worst concerts I ever saw - Smashing Pumpkins on the Siamese Dream tour. Corgan's voice is AWFUL live.
 
2012-09-21 11:01:04 AM  

gopher321: What? They got back together?

/dnrtfa

 
2012-09-21 11:09:36 AM  

jbuist: We're not going to get a good SP album until we lock Billy Corgan in a dark cellar for 3-5 years. Seriously.

I really need to start a Facebook group to see how many people are on board with this.


with multiple pounds of mescalin.
 
2012-09-21 11:13:06 AM  
Probably been said before, but I think the newer SP songs are too much vocals and not enough music. That's why early SP was so great. The music was the focus, not the lyrics. Until Corgan gets back to that, I'm not going to waste my money. If he could sing like Morten Harket it would be a different story.
 
2012-09-21 11:27:12 AM  

theurge14: JPSimonetti: I can't believe they're still around. Same for 311 and Red Hot Chili Peppers. All of them should have bowed out like 20 years ago.

311 has some gasoline left in that tank. I agree with everything else.


I agree, but they really need to bring in a lyricist. Uplifter/I> was painful. They're more of a live performance kind of band anyway though. RHCP sell a lot of albums, nevermind that the songs are indistinguishable. They aren't going anywhere.
 
2012-09-21 11:47:51 AM  
Everything went to shiat after Siamese Dream.
 
2012-09-21 11:57:48 AM  
Was and still am a big fan of Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie. Everything after? Not so much
 
2012-09-21 12:08:32 PM  
I enjoyed Siamese Dream, Mellon collie was shiat, but it had a few good songs.
 
2012-09-21 12:47:08 PM  

HallsOfMandos: Silversun Pickups > Smashing Pumpkins (nowadays anyway)

pretty much most bands.

FTFY and Me

/Loves me some SSP (and SP for that matter)
 
2012-09-21 01:02:33 PM  

HallsOfMandos: SacriliciousBeerSwiller:
2) I love that era of Pumpkins albums, but even I can admit they were a horrible live act.

One of the worst concerts I ever saw - Smashing Pumpkins on the Siamese Dream tour. Corgan's voice is AWFUL live.


One of the worst concerts I ever saw - Smashing Pumpkins on the Mellon Collie tour. I don't know if there were still dabbling in the H after the keyboardist died, but it's the only show I've ever left during the encore. And by encore, I mean 20 minutes of incoherent noise.
 
2012-09-21 01:03:41 PM  

HatMadeOfAss: HallsOfMandos: Silversun Pickups > Smashing Pumpkins (nowadays anyway)pretty much most bands.

FTFY and Me

/Loves me some SSPU (and SP for that matter)


/FTFY
 
2012-09-21 01:23:23 PM  
I agree with you wholeheartedly, submitter. They should have died after Gish.
 
2012-09-21 01:40:39 PM  
The Smashing Pumpkins > all.

/Oceania is the BEST album of 2012
//favorite tracks: The Celestials, Violent Rays, The Chimera, Inkless
 
2012-09-21 01:43:10 PM  

Riotboy: The Smashing Pumpkins > all.

/Oceania is the BEST album of 2012
//favorite tracks: The Celestials, Violent Rays, The Chimera, Inkless


I used to be a huge fan and I didn't even know they came out with new album. Also, I live in Chicago, and 87.7 (the alt station that basically is what Q101 used to be) sure as hell hasn't been playing anything from it. When your home town alt station won't even play your new stuff, something ain't right.
 
2012-09-21 01:51:48 PM  

Flaming Yawn: JPSimonetti: I can't believe they're still around. Same for 311 and Red Hot Chili Peppers. All of them should have bowed out like 20 years ago.

I'm old enough to admit everyone's taste is different. But to me Melon Collie is a major masterpiece of recorded pop music. Gish and Siamese Dream show a lot of promise, but everything clicked and/or jelled with Melon Collie.

Even the packaging art direction is great.

After that...I've really tried, but I just can't go.

You have to realize, however, that I also regard White Zombie's La Sexorcisto as a near masterpiece as well.

Like I say, no accounting for taste.


Wow, get out of my head.

Im a fan of almost anything Smashing Pumpkins, and La Sexorcisto is in my list of faves as well. I remember buying the CD back in like 94, during my high school metal head days.
 
2012-09-21 01:53:19 PM  
Super sexy swinging songs made me crash my car
 
2012-09-21 01:56:36 PM  

Riotboy: The Smashing Pumpkins > all.

/Oceania is the BEST album of 2012
//favorite tracks: The Celestials, Violent Rays, The Chimera, Inkless


Meh. The Pumpkins ca. 1988-2000 were epic, but the 2005- "Billy and the current group of people who haven't quit so they don't murder him in a fit of rage" band is pretty meh. I really wish he'd leave the brilliance of the real SP to posterity and just call his current stuff solo work (particularly since his one and only record under his own name bombed and this would be a great way to redeem his name).

I'm pretty meh on Oceania too. Just offhand, some bands that have released better albums than that this year: Billy Talent, Metric, Monster Truck, Mumford & Sons, Muse, Of Monsters and Men and The Sheepdogs. Plus a number of singles from this year (that were on 2011 albums) have blown most of Oceania away too....Black Keys/Gold on the Ceiling/Little Black Submarine, AWOLNATION/Kill Your Heroes, Japandroids/House That Heaven Built, etc etc.

I hate to rag on Billy so much, since the Pumpkins were such an essential part of my formative/teen years, but the stuff he's done since the faux-reunion has just not been up to snuff with the old days.
 
2012-09-21 02:07:39 PM  

NeedlesslyCanadian: I hate to rag on Billy so much, since the Pumpkins were such an essential part of my formative/teen years, but the stuff he's done since the faux-reunion has just not been up to snuff with the old days.


Part of the problem is he refuses to acknowledge...hell, he seems to actively sh*t on...those things which made his earlier stuff so great: that shoegazer-ish "wall of guitars" sound he made in the studio. THAT was his trademark. He was a rock musician. As others have said, now it's like he tries to hard to be a singer...and he is and always has been terrible at that. It's a testament to his musicianship that his older songs transcended his vocal shortcomings.

I thought he had figured this out with the whole "Zwan" thing...he almost got back on track there...
 
2012-09-21 02:15:10 PM  
Here's a bag of dicks, subby. Bon Appetit.

/billy rules
 
2012-09-21 02:28:31 PM  
I want to like it, but I find Oceania to be prettymuch unlistenable.
 
2012-09-21 02:32:30 PM  
Here is why Gish is a great album. It farking rocks. It has some of the heaviest songs on it. Some of the stuff that has come since then have been less and less heavy. Siamese Dream has some great songs but after that album it was all whiney Billy.
 
2012-09-21 03:09:08 PM  

NeedlesslyCanadian: Fark off, Siamese Dream is a masterpiece. And Machina II wasn't bad either.


Neither is the new one, actually. I'm pleasantly surprised with it. Doesn't have the memorable hooks of years past, but there are some great riffs and some good tunes. It's the best thing they've done since Adore (or, if you don't like Adore -- I do -- since Mellon Collie).

Though unsurprisingly, it is probably three songs too long. Corgan always did succumb to bloat.
 
2012-09-21 03:13:57 PM  

Flaming Yawn: I'm old enough to admit everyone's taste is different. But to me Melon Collie is a major masterpiece of recorded pop music. Gish and Siamese Dream show a lot of promise, but everything clicked and/or jelled with Melon Collie.


I like Mellon Collie fine, but to me its reach exceeded its grasp. There is some stellar stuff on there, but as a whole it lack cohesion. They recorded an IMMENSE amount of material during that time rather than focus on the 10 or 14 best tracks. A load of that stuff was really great, including many of the B-sides, but getting it all at once was overkill. I not only prefer the first two over it, I prefer Adore over it, too.

/Machina II may get an official, non-vinyl release next year. Yay!
 
2012-09-21 03:18:37 PM  

Cymbal: Probably been said before, but I think the newer SP songs are too much vocals and not enough music.


Corgan's vocals are too high in the mix, I agree. His work sounds much better when his voice is mixed in as part of the overall sonic assault rather than as the focal point. I liked the murmurs and purrs of Siamese Dream and later tracks where he is more restrained in his approach.

Though I do sometimes like his pop songs, too.
 
2012-09-21 03:49:40 PM  

shoegaze99: Cymbal: Probably been said before, but I think the newer SP songs are too much vocals and not enough music.

Corgan's vocals are too high in the mix, I agree. His work sounds much better when his voice is mixed in as part of the overall sonic assault rather than as the focal point. I liked the murmurs and purrs of Siamese Dream and later tracks where he is more restrained in his approach.

Though I do sometimes like his pop songs, too.


I was talking more about his songs being all singing without much in the way of musical interludes, but your point is valid as well. I firmly believe if SP had a singer with real talent they would be one of the greatest bands of all time.
 
2012-09-21 03:51:12 PM  
Drown is their best song, by far. It was included on ther soundtrack for Singles, a movie about gen X slackers. That should tell you all you need to know about 2012 Smashing Pumpkins.
 
2012-09-21 04:00:37 PM  

Cymbal: I was talking more about his songs being all singing without much in the way of musical interludes,


Ahhh, I see. Yeah, I can't disagree with that. The musical interludes on songs like Hummer and Drown and Bury Me are some of my favorite aspects of their work.

When Corgan jams, he often jams well. Check out these two fantastic live jams with Zwan, Mary Star of the Sea and Jesus, I. Both top 10 minutes and descend into some really cool triple-guitar work. That live version of Mary Star of the Sea especially reminds me of classic Pumpkins in its meandering musical interlude. Great stuff.
 
2012-09-21 04:04:00 PM  

Owangotang: Drown is their best song, by far.


Might be my favorite from them as well, in part because I'm a huge fan of feedback. At the time Drown was released, I had been home recording 30-minute tapes of layered, droning feedback. I just get oddly wrapped up in the sound. Always have. (To this day, I still record albums of guitar soundscapes. No drums, no songs, just pure sound.)

So needless to say, the end of Drown blew me away. That great, shuffling rhythm locking down all the chaos was super cool. Liked it so much I once sat down with some audio-editing software and mixed myself a 15-minute version of the song with, you guessed it, an extra long feedback outro. Definitely one of my top Pumpkins tracks.
 
2012-09-21 04:05:38 PM  

shoegaze99: Cymbal: I was talking more about his songs being all singing without much in the way of musical interludes,

Ahhh, I see. Yeah, I can't disagree with that. The musical interludes on songs like Hummer and Drown and Bury Me are some of my favorite aspects of their work.

When Corgan jams, he often jams well. Check out these two fantastic live jams with Zwan, Mary Star of the Sea and Jesus, I. Both top 10 minutes and descend into some really cool triple-guitar work. That live version of Mary Star of the Sea especially reminds me of classic Pumpkins in its meandering musical interlude. Great stuff.


Yeah it's frustrating to listen to that and then try to listen to the new stuff. He needs to let the music breathe again.
 
2012-09-21 04:09:17 PM  

shoegaze99: Owangotang: Drown is their best song, by far.

Might be my favorite from them as well, in part because I'm a huge fan of feedback. At the time Drown was released, I had been home recording 30-minute tapes of layered, droning feedback. I just get oddly wrapped up in the sound. Always have. (To this day, I still record albums of guitar soundscapes. No drums, no songs, just pure sound.)

So needless to say, the end of Drown blew me away. That great, shuffling rhythm locking down all the chaos was super cool. Liked it so much I once sat down with some audio-editing software and mixed myself a 15-minute version of the song with, you guessed it, an extra long feedback outro. Definitely one of my top Pumpkins tracks.


Drown is great, but for me I go back and forth between Soma and Geek USA. Can't top two hellacious guitar solos.
 
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