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(Houston Press)   There's no room for snobs in craft beer   (blogs.houstonpress.com) divider line 59
    More: PSA, sliding scale, Groundhog Day, anvils, blue moons, Sam Adams  
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2283 clicks; posted to Geek » on 18 Sep 2012 at 4:49 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-18 01:54:24 PM
The key is not to steep them in the beer too long or they add too much meatiness to delicate notes of vanilla and cinnamon.
 
2012-09-18 03:47:03 PM
FTA: That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here. 
 
Huh?  No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out.  Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.
 
2012-09-18 04:42:35 PM
This person has obviously never visited a Fark beer thread

/snobs are ALL there's room for
 
2012-09-18 04:51:47 PM
Supporter of
Oregon
Native
Beer

Great minds drink alike.
 
2012-09-18 04:54:33 PM
On the other hand, Golden Valley started making a low-ABV Kolsh to capture the yellow lager crowd's cash and it worked.
 
2012-09-18 04:54:56 PM

downstairs: FTA: That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here. 
 
Huh?  No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out.  Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.


I can tell you that the staff at the bars SHE is speaking of can be downright arseholes.
 
2012-09-18 04:55:46 PM

downstairs: FTA: That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here. 
 
Huh?  No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out.  Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.


Or just do what I do -- order all the beers.
 
2012-09-18 05:05:30 PM
That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here.

When confronted with this kind of craft beer bar, newcomers can be left with a bitter taste in their mouth that has nothing to do with hops. It's especially odd considering the entire craft beer movement is taking place, ostensibly, to wean the American public off adjunct lagers and mega-beers like Miller and Bud.


Author needs to get out more. Hell, I worked at a microbrewery in the mid-90's that only sold our own beer and craft beers, we were actually trained and able to make suggestions for people who wanted Bud and similar brew. Golds, Kolschs they'll work just fine, and you often end up changing someone for good(Whenever they can find what they want, that is). Maybe her article should be about poorly trained staff, instead?
 
2012-09-18 05:06:51 PM
I'm not a beer drinker, but how hard is it to ask a bartender to recommend you a beer?

If you are so intimidated by a bar not having coors on the menu that you have to leave, something is wrong with you...
 
2012-09-18 05:07:24 PM
img.photobucket.com
 
2012-09-18 05:08:16 PM
natazha:
Supporter of
Oregon
Native
Beer

Great minds drink alike.


SONB?
 
2012-09-18 05:13:08 PM

downstairs: Huh? No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out. Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.


Usually, but I've seen them mock people who ask for a Miller Lite too. One of the bars I used to go to in Philly had a section of the menu that said something like "TV T&A Beers - If you're willing to pay $5, we'll sell them to you" for Miller/Bud/etc.
 
2012-09-18 05:14:06 PM
FTA: I don't want to drink my Poperings Hommel next to a girl in a too-short, sparkly dress who keeps my bartender overextended by ordering multiple cocktails at my craft beer bar. I admit that.

Know how I know you're gay?
 
2012-09-18 05:16:00 PM
I like my IPAs.... but sometimes I want something different. I like pilsner and stouts, lagers and ales, trappist style and Bock, Witbier and Hefeweizen.

Do I mind if I'm getting something from Miller-Coors or Inbev? Not really, no. But if I want 'good' beer, I know I'm going to have to hunt for it, do a little research, know my own tastes and preferences first and then choose accordingly.

The moment someone new walks into a craft beer bar should be less of sneering at someone who doesn't know, but one of opportunity. Show them what they're missing.

xkcd

/hot
 
2012-09-18 05:20:57 PM

natazha: Supporter of
Oregon
Native
Beer

Great minds drink alike.


SONB? Is that like SON uva biatch?

/My local watering hole is not listed in the article, but should be. It was listed here, however. 

Houston is experiencing a micro-brew renewal. It's fantastic for those who enjoy good quality brew, locally made, and decent priced. Huzzah!
 
2012-09-18 05:27:28 PM
Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA
 
2012-09-18 05:28:33 PM

Ro_thunder: natazha: Supporter of
Oregon
Native
Beer

Great minds drink alike.

SONB? Is that like SON uva biatch?

/My local watering hole is not listed in the article, but should be. It was listed here, however. 

Houston is experiencing a micro-brew renewal. It's fantastic for those who enjoy good quality brew, locally made, and decent priced. Huzzah!


Went to Karbach last time I was in Houston. Excellent beer. Their double-IPA was killer.
 
2012-09-18 05:37:47 PM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA



Really this can't be said enough. I like beer that tastes like beer not anti-freeze.
 
2012-09-18 05:44:24 PM

you have pee hands: downstairs: Huh? No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out. Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.

Usually, but I've seen them mock people who ask for a Miller Lite too. One of the bars I used to go to in Philly had a section of the menu that said something like "TV T&A Beers - If you're willing to pay $5, we'll sell them to you" for Miller/Bud/etc.


A bar nearby (which is perfectly fine) has a line in their beer menu that says "Beers we do not have: Budweiser, Miller and Coors".

And then they sell Asahi.
 
2012-09-18 05:47:11 PM

wrenchboy: FTA: I don't want to drink my Poperings Hommel next to a girl in a too-short, sparkly dress who keeps my bartender overextended by ordering multiple cocktails at my craft beer bar. I admit that.

Know how I know you're gay?


"By Katharine Shilcutt"

I rather suspect that she's not gay.
 
2012-09-18 05:55:12 PM

you have pee hands: downstairs: Huh? No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out. Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.

Usually, but I've seen them mock people who ask for a Miller Lite too. One of the bars I used to go to in Philly had a section of the menu that said something like "TV T&A Beers - If you're willing to pay $5, we'll sell them to you" for Miller/Bud/etc.


One of the bars in mentioned in the TFA was using old 32oz Budweiser bottles as water pitchers. Silver Eagle Distributors, the biggest Budweiser distributor in the country and pretty much the only game in our town, told them to knock it off or they wouldn't sell them of the craft beers they also distribute.
 
2012-09-18 06:04:01 PM

wrenchboy: SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA


Really this can't be said enough. I like beer that tastes like beer not anti-freeze.


I personally don't mind the taste...but there are already 18 kajillion IPA/APA options out there. And 99% of them aren't as good as plain old Sierra Nevada.
 
2012-09-18 06:05:55 PM
Group leaves in frustration.

See, they were fine up until the last step. The last step is "hell if I know" and then picking something totally at random.
 
2012-09-18 06:07:42 PM

max_pooper: you have pee hands: downstairs: Huh? No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out. Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.

Usually, but I've seen them mock people who ask for a Miller Lite too. One of the bars I used to go to in Philly had a section of the menu that said something like "TV T&A Beers - If you're willing to pay $5, we'll sell them to you" for Miller/Bud/etc.

One of the bars in mentioned in the TFA was using old 32oz Budweiser bottles as water pitchers. Silver Eagle Distributors, the biggest Budweiser distributor in the country and pretty much the only game in our town, told them to knock it off or they wouldn't sell them of the craft beers they also distribute.


That really is pretty childish (what the bar did). The funny thing is that if you get a plain old lager from just about any micro/craft, it really won't taste any less watery Budweiser.
 
2012-09-18 06:36:24 PM
No "snobbery" means there is no such thing as a bad "craft" beer.

I've tried a number of beers from local small breweries and some of them are not very good though generally better than Budweiser. I don't know if the brewers don't know any better or if they are aiming for a market that is just one step up from Budweiser and don't want to challenge their customers. For example, I've had dark beers with little to no dark beer flavor and have wondered what they added to get the color.

Also I would recommend avoiding "craft beer" chains such as Gordon Biersch Brewery Restaurants (run by a restaurant group headquartered in Tennessee). The nice bartender at the Colorado Springs Airport branch let me sample 4 different brews and all were kinda blah and not all that distinguishable from each other.

Here is the list of chain places run by the parent group.
2.1 Old Chicago
2.2 Gordon Biersch Brewery Restaurants
2.3 Rock Bottom Restaurant Breweries
2.4 Big River Grille & Brewing Works
2.5 ChopHouse & Brewery
2.6 Sing Sing Dueling Pianos
2.7 Bluewater Grille
2.8 A1A Aleworks
2.9 Ragtime Tavern Seafood & Grill
2.10 Seven Bridges Grille & Brewery
2.11 Walnut Brewery
 
2012-09-18 06:45:24 PM

Arkanaut: downstairs: FTA: That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here. 
 
Huh?  No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out.  Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.

Or just do what I do -- order all the beers.


All your beers are belong to us.
 
2012-09-18 06:54:37 PM

MontanaDave: Arkanaut: downstairs: FTA: That sword cuts both ways, though: It can also make craft beer unnecessarily daunting and turn the entire thing into a patronizing, cliquish experience for the uninitiated. You don't know how to pronounce Klokke Roeland? You don't know the difference between an English Pale Ale and a Belgian Strong Ale? You don't like hops? We don't need your kind here. 
 
Huh?  No idea about the bar he's talking about, but every craft-beer-only bar I've been to (some with hundreds of selections) are very happy to help you out.  Tell them what characteristics you like, and they'll find something for you.

Or just do what I do -- order all the beers.

All your beers are belong to us.


Drink down every beer!

For great justice!
 
2012-09-18 06:58:06 PM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA

 
2012-09-18 07:01:07 PM
Subby here.

The author of this article is, in my opinion, hitting on one of the most important topics that currently exists in the professional craft beer community. As the owner of a beer store in the distant outskirts of the greater St. Louis area, I can state that essentially 100% of my regular customers are normal, everyday working people who happen to have gotten sick of the same-old and moved on to greener, more flavorful pastures.

These people don't like, and don't deserve, being talked down to. I try to guide every customer who comes through my door. There are a lot of misconceptions out there, but I'm not going to make fun of anyone - I remember when I thought that "dark" was a flavor. It's easy to get hooked on the cool things about beer, and it's only a matter of time before most of what has historically been arcane knowledge is commonly known.

Craft beer is truly a great American phenomenon. It's hard to get more patriotic than what these small businessmen have done. Great flavors at great prices. This is a good thing for everyone.
 
2012-09-18 07:01:49 PM
It's called "no crap on tap". It's a good idea for two reasons:

1) You don't get you place full of people just drinking shiat beer there because they want to pretend they are real beer drinkers so that you craft beer is not rotating. Craft beer drinkers buy different beers. Crap beer drinkers buy the same beer again and again and again.

2) Giving money to the big 2 In-Bev and A-B is self-defeating. They are trying to destroy the craft beer market so why in the hell would you have their beers on tap?
 
2012-09-18 07:03:19 PM
Heh,

The Petrol Station is my neighborhood bar.

Nice.
 
2012-09-18 07:06:07 PM

wrenchboy: SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA


Really this can't be said enough. I like beer that tastes like beer not anti-freeze.


Both of you just stop. Do you go to the movies? Like slasher pics? I hate them. Can't stand the genre. And they seem to just get more gruesome and gruesome. I also hate comic book movies. And now we have to have movies with no fewer than 17 super dudes in the same movie? Yet I'll never scream "stop making them!" Why? Because other people happen to like that. And frankly, the movie world isn't out to cater too only my tastes. So just stop ordering the beers you don't like. And for the record, I'm with you on the overly hopped beers. Some are done well. Others have no regard for supporting their ridiculous hop additions with a sturdy malt backbone.

Anyho
 
2012-09-18 07:07:17 PM

Corvus: 1) You don't get you place full of people just drinking shiat beer there because they want to pretend they are real beer drinkers so that you craft beer is not rotating. Craft beer drinkers buy different beers. Crap beer drinkers buy the same beer again and again and again.


Good example of this is I go to a bar in LV (LV sucks for beer mostly). They have like 100 beers on tap. I can't sit at the bar because they bar is full. Guess what's everyone drinking? bud, Coors, corona. I can't order my beer because these guys are sitting there drinking their beer that they can easily get anywhere else. But they want to be at the "beer bar" to drink their beer.
 
2012-09-18 07:08:50 PM
Cut myself off there.

Anyhow, there are plenty of places to find adjunct lagers. There are not plenty of places to find great craft beer. It's getting much better, but speaking as someone who first started drinking micro / craft well over 20 years ago (an indication of how much change I've seen, not a hipster "been there before you" comment) it's still no where near meeting demand.
 
2012-09-18 07:28:00 PM

UseUrHeadFred: These people don't like, and don't deserve, being talked down to. I try to guide every customer who comes through my door. There are a lot of misconceptions out there, but I'm not going to make fun of anyone


I agree, and perhaps it's just my area of the country, but I haven't seen any "talking down to" since the first craft resurgence in the 90s, so this article surprises me. In fact, it's always worked the opposite for me. I'd go to play pool with my brother and his friends would give me crap for ordering a "fancy beer" (Sam Adams) and not a Bud Light.

My local bar has a selection of great IPAs (not out of balance over-hopped stuff). When someone orders a Harpoon IPA, the bartender jokes that they first have to try free samples of at least two other IPAs before he serves them Harpoon. Half the time the customer orders one of the samples instead.
 
2012-09-18 07:32:17 PM

Moopy Mac: A bar nearby (which is perfectly fine) has a line in their beer menu that says "Beers we do not have: Budweiser, Miller and Coors".

And then they sell Asahi.


That's funny for so many reasons. But I have to admit to being equally hypocritical. I'll drink Corona Light with a lime (I frickin' LOVE it) while brewing, and while I won't drink Budweiser, I will always order a Sapporo when I go to my favorite sushi joint.
 
2012-09-18 07:44:12 PM

UseUrHeadFred: Subby here.

The author of this article is, in my opinion, hitting on one of the most important topics that currently exists in the professional craft beer community. As the owner of a beer store in the distant outskirts of the greater St. Louis area, I can state that essentially 100% of my regular customers are normal, everyday working people who happen to have gotten sick of the same-old and moved on to greener, more flavorful pastures.

These people don't like, and don't deserve, being talked down to. I try to guide every customer who comes through my door. There are a lot of misconceptions out there, but I'm not going to make fun of anyone - I remember when I thought that "dark" was a flavor. It's easy to get hooked on the cool things about beer, and it's only a matter of time before most of what has historically been arcane knowledge is commonly known.

Craft beer is truly a great American phenomenon. It's hard to get more patriotic than what these small businessmen have done. Great flavors at great prices. This is a good thing for everyone.


You, sir, are a true patriot.
 
2012-09-18 07:50:38 PM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: Dear craft/microbrewers,

Constantly striving to make bigger and bigger hop bombs is juvenile, tedious, and hackish. Please stop.

Love,
Me

/did not RTFA


Also this. Drinking something below some imagined IBU line does not somehow disqualify one from enjoying good beer. You like what you like.
 
2012-09-18 07:53:30 PM

Arkanaut: UseUrHeadFred: Subby here.

The author of this article is, in my opinion, hitting on one of the most important topics that currently exists in the professional craft beer community. As the owner of a beer store in the distant outskirts of the greater St. Louis area, I can state that essentially 100% of my regular customers are normal, everyday working people who happen to have gotten sick of the same-old and moved on to greener, more flavorful pastures.

These people don't like, and don't deserve, being talked down to. I try to guide every customer who comes through my door. There are a lot of misconceptions out there, but I'm not going to make fun of anyone - I remember when I thought that "dark" was a flavor. It's easy to get hooked on the cool things about beer, and it's only a matter of time before most of what has historically been arcane knowledge is commonly known.

Craft beer is truly a great American phenomenon. It's hard to get more patriotic than what these small businessmen have done. Great flavors at great prices. This is a good thing for everyone.

You, sir, are a true patriot.


Also this. Getting people excited about craft beer is part of the fun. It's when you see that light go on over their heads when they see what they've been missing.

"No good thing is pleasing without friends to share it." -- Seneca
 
2012-09-18 08:02:15 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: This person has obviously never visited a Fark beer thread

/snobs are ALL there's room for



and label porn. lots of slow-loading label porn.
 
2012-09-18 08:28:39 PM
Putting down people's beer tastes is the whole point of being into craft beer.

...as well as the fact that it tastes good.
 
2012-09-18 08:39:36 PM
WinoRhino:I agree, and perhaps it's just my area of the country, but I haven't seen any "talking down to" since the first craft resurgence in the 90s, so this article surprises me.

It is surprising how many beliefs there are that are from an earlier era of thinking. For example, I have had many customers who believe that bock beer is "what's left over at the bottom of the kettle at the end of the year." I also hear a lot is from those people who believe that dark beer is automatically stronger than bright beer.

There are lots of other beer tropes that I wish were on Mythbusters years ago.
 
2012-09-18 08:40:36 PM
Snobbery is probably essential in the creation of craft beer but not the appreciation of it.
 
Meh, I like the old tried and true stuff Belgians and old Trappist nonsense.  That said I usually end up drinking Tecate or Sierra Nevada or Harpoon and planning my next move.
 
2012-09-18 08:45:38 PM
I must be only one left who loves hops. Puts me to sleep though. I can't imagine going to a bar and drinking multiple pints og anything with an IBU > 90
 
2012-09-18 08:57:04 PM
It's been my experience that people who claim to hate craft beers or hate people who drink craft beers either have never tried them themselves, tried an IPA once and hated it (which is common for first timers - not all craft beers are IPA's nor have a hops flavor but for some reason some people think they are synonymous), or don't even like beer to begin with.

I used to only drink domestics and when I would try a sip of my friends' craft brews I would think they were gross. Well, that's because I was always tasting IPA's, porters, or stouts which I hate. When I started tasting Hefs and Wits, I fell in love and became more and more excited about trying new beers. I'm hit or miss on other kinds, and I don't think I'll ever like IPA's, porters, or stouts since I hate coffee, chocolate, and super bitter flavors. However, I can still enjoy plenty of craft beers. It just takes time to find what you like. Unfortunately (or fortunately) the result is that I don't like most domestics anymore. They just taste like carbonated water with a hint of generic beer flavor. It's not a snobbish thing, it's just a personal preference thing. Of course I'm sure there will be snobs who will snub me for not liking IPA's, porters, and stouts - there's snobs on all sides of this.
 
2012-09-18 09:16:16 PM
There's no room for snobs rice syrup in craft beer
 
2012-09-18 09:39:25 PM

UseUrHeadFred: Subby here.



really? cause miss Shillcut does have a fark account here, kind of surprised she didn't submit it herself
 
2012-09-18 09:54:11 PM
Isn't snob included in the definition of the word craft?

God I hate that word.
 
2012-09-18 10:25:10 PM

assjuice: I must be only one left who loves hops.


I like 'em. But I prefer the fruit-forward / floral varieties more than the piney / spice ones. And what's wrong with overemphasizing the flavor and aroma qualities of hops and not just the bitterness? How about this: a beer that only has 30-40 IBU but uses a huge addition of hops at :10, :5, and post boil? The hops flavor and aroma characteristics would be emphasized while keeping the bitterness completely toned down. In a 5 gallon batch you could throw in an ounce-and-a-half each of Citra and Amarillo from 10 minutes to post boil and probably only hit around 35 IBU, but get great flavor and aroma from them.
 
2012-09-18 10:44:37 PM

Arkanaut: Or just do what I do -- order all the beers.


i291.photobucket.com
 
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