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(NBC Chicago)   It was Jimmy Carter's grandson who convinced the person who had the Romney Unplugged video to send it to Mother Jones   (nbcchicago.com) divider line 248
    More: Cool, Jimmy Carter, Mother Jones, NBC News, chinese company  
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8603 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Sep 2012 at 3:40 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-18 08:24:52 PM  

reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: WhyteRaven74: reubendaley: The degree to which the truth hurts can sometimes be gauged by the vociferousness of those attacking the messenger.

So children and the retired are lazy bums?

Remember, these are the same assholes that want to repeal child labor laws.

Parlant du diable et le diable apparaît.

So, you're comfortable with child labor? And no, I don't mean 14 year olds with a work permit.

Serious question: can you explain exactly what you are referring to?

/And maybe refrain from name-calling 
//Gotta help my kid with his homework. I'll be back for the explanation

It came up earlier in the election, but the ones talking about it washed out of the election: notably Gingrich.

Political Animal - Gingrich, GOP target child-labor laws

O.K. I read that. And obviously I don't think it says what you think it says.

I don't see how you can attribute that effort to Romney, but is having children work so evil? I don't think these gentlemen were advocating forced labor but rather an opportunity to earn. Is it so awful to think about inspiring a work ethic in our children, or should we let them believe that whatever they need in life will be handed to them? Don't worry - it's a rhetorical question.

How about working up some rage for real child exploitation like that which occurs in the countries where our manufacturers have fled? Who do you think made the rug you wipe your feet on, or picked the coffee beans that made your morning brew? Who went down into the mine and plucked the diamond on your wife's finger? Or assembled your smart phone, or labored to create the clothing you are wearing?

Am I being trolled or do you really believe the extremist position you've taken?


I don't attribute it to Romney, rather some in the party. Also, work is one thing, but I should have clarified to mean things like children working in factories instead of being in school.

I'm not ignorant of the role of child labor and I certainly don't care for it. It is, at this point, almost inescapable and is not something we should be pushing for over here.
 
2012-09-18 08:27:22 PM  

reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: WhyteRaven74: reubendaley: The degree to which the truth hurts can sometimes be gauged by the vociferousness of those attacking the messenger.

So children and the retired are lazy bums?

Remember, these are the same assholes that want to repeal child labor laws.

Parlant du diable et le diable apparaît.

So, you're comfortable with child labor? And no, I don't mean 14 year olds with a work permit.

Serious question: can you explain exactly what you are referring to?

/And maybe refrain from name-calling 
//Gotta help my kid with his homework. I'll be back for the explanation

It came up earlier in the election, but the ones talking about it washed out of the election: notably Gingrich.

Political Animal - Gingrich, GOP target child-labor laws

O.K. I read that. And obviously I don't think it says what you think it says.

I don't see how you can attribute that effort to Romney, but is having children work so evil? I don't think these gentlemen were advocating forced labor but rather an opportunity to earn. Is it so awful to think about inspiring a work ethic in our children, or should we let them believe that whatever they need in life will be handed to them? Don't worry - it's a rhetorical question.

How about working up some rage for real child exploitation like that which occurs in the countries where our manufacturers have fled? Who do you think made the rug you wipe your feet on, or picked the coffee beans that made your morning brew? Who went down into the mine and plucked the diamond on your wife's finger? Or assembled your smart phone, or labored to create the clothing you are wearing?

Am I being trolled or do you really believe the extremist position you've taken?


I failed to clarify my position and you responded to what I wrote. Simply put, instilling a work ethic in our children is vastly different than sticking them on an assembly line at the age of 10 for 12 to 14 hours a day. I worked as a teenager as I imagine you did as well.

Also, I certainly support bringing manufacturing back into the US instead of rewarding companies that seek to drive the American labor market down to wage parity with Southeast Asia.
 
2012-09-18 08:33:58 PM  

dletter: I am just so amused as how jealous the super rich are of people making $20k a year and how they don't have to pay taxes. Of course, cutting their income to $20k a year doesn't sound very appealing to them.


Not a question of jealousy. I'd just prefer it if everyone who votes had some actual skin in the game.
 
2012-09-18 08:53:18 PM  

pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: reubendaley: pxlboy: WhyteRaven74: reubendaley: The degree to which the truth hurts can sometimes be gauged by the vociferousness of those attacking the messenger.

So children and the retired are lazy bums?

Remember, these are the same assholes that want to repeal child labor laws.

Parlant du diable et le diable apparaît.

So, you're comfortable with child labor? And no, I don't mean 14 year olds with a work permit.

Serious question: can you explain exactly what you are referring to?

/And maybe refrain from name-calling 
//Gotta help my kid with his homework. I'll be back for the explanation

It came up earlier in the election, but the ones talking about it washed out of the election: notably Gingrich.

Political Animal - Gingrich, GOP target child-labor laws

O.K. I read that. And obviously I don't think it says what you think it says.

I don't see how you can attribute that effort to Romney, but is having children work so evil? I don't think these gentlemen were advocating forced labor but rather an opportunity to earn. Is it so awful to think about inspiring a work ethic in our children, or should we let them believe that whatever they need in life will be handed to them? Don't worry - it's a rhetorical question.

How about working up some rage for real child exploitation like that which occurs in the countries where our manufacturers have fled? Who do you think made the rug you wipe your feet on, or picked the coffee beans that made your morning brew? Who went down into the mine and plucked the diamond on your wife's finger? Or assembled your smart phone, or labored to create the clothing you are wearing?

Am I being trolled or do you really believe the extremist position you've taken?

I failed to clarify my position and you responded to what I wrote. Simply put, instilling a work ethic in our children is vastly different than sticking them on an assembly line at the age of 10 for 12 to 14 hours a day. I worked as a teenager as I imagine you did as well.

Also, I certainly support bringing manufacturing back into the US instead of rewarding companies that seek to drive the American labor market down to wage parity with Southeast Asia.


Ok. But I don't see the article you linked as standing for the proposition that we should revert to draconian ways of child exploitation, and offering it up as support of your statement "remember, these are the same assholes that want to repeal child labor laws" seem to suggest that it did.
 
2012-09-18 09:11:49 PM  
Sofa King Smart:
I still don't understand the 'conservative' hate for Carter...
if you look at his background he is EVERYTHING they claim to want...
actual military service (didn't have daddy get him a deferment)... devout Christian (even taught sunday school while he was in the white house for christ's sake!)... self-made farmer, still active in habitat for humanity...


But he's not an asshole.
 
2012-09-18 09:27:30 PM  
BunkyBrewman Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Watch the video-esp the waiters moving in front of the lens. The camera's obvs on a wheeled dinner-serving tray, the speech was illicitly taped by spacemonkey waiters i.e. Romney's 47%'ers api.ning.com
 
2012-09-18 09:28:02 PM  

Deucednuisance: reubendaley: The degree to which the truth hurts can sometimes be gauged by the vociferousness of those attacking the messenger.

But you're aware that this isn't one of those times, since it's a demonstrable fact that a good portion of those 47% are groups of people that are predominantly GOP voters?


I would imagine if that 47% actually did vote for Obama, plus the actual % in the other 53% who will also vote for Obama.... Obama would win the popular vote about 75% to 25%. But, the poor generally don't vote for what would be good for them economically... they vote on social/religious and perceived "freedom" issues.

The other problem is, generally, that 47% also has a much lower voter turnout rate than the other 53%.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/07/research_desk_wh at _if_all_inco.html
 
2012-09-18 09:29:17 PM  
Good job, kid.
 
2012-09-18 09:45:38 PM  

Silly Jesus: over 47 percemt of people who are old enough to be in the U.S. workforce --- pay no income taxes at all. Actually, it's worse than that. Not only do they not pay taxes

In America, one-half of the population is living off the other half.


Liar.

growlersoftware.com
 
2012-09-18 10:02:37 PM  
That is the most hilarious thing to come out of this campaign yet. Carter II: Jimmy's Revenge!
 
2012-09-18 11:01:05 PM  

FlyingJ: BunkyBrewman Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Watch the video-esp the waiters moving in front of the lens. The camera's obvs on a wheeled dinner-serving tray, the speech was illicitly taped by spacemonkey waiters i.e. Romney's 47%'ers [api.ning.com image 850x357]


Makes me wonder if he said other, even more offensive things beforehand and they decided to fire up the camera to get the dirt afterwards, and he just kept right on talking and saying things he should probably regret later.

Yeah, the Project Mayhem/"We Watch You While You Sleep" pic is appropriate. Rmoney's campaign was already on the ropes, but he pissed off the waiters. A $50k a plate dinner, with waiters making well less than that per year. They were serving people who could throw away more than their annual salary on one night's expenses. I'd imagine they were pretty bitter, when combined with his plutocratic class-warfare act.

I do wonder if this was held in reserve for a specific moment, like if Mitt was doing better they would have already used it. Yesterday was supposed to be when he started talking about issues and putting some substance into his campaign. . .and that got derailed instantly, like this one was being held back as a political weapon to use at an optimum time.
 
2012-09-18 11:01:51 PM  

Thunderpipes: Romney was spot on. Everything he said is exactly true. He should have campaigned on that. He is never, ever going to get an Obama voter to switch. But there are pissed off independents who have to pay taxes who don't care for welfare bums too.

Obama campaigns by saying rich people are evil and must be punished... Romney should campaign that poor people are lazy and need to get off their asses.


I can't believe this needs to be repeated so continuously, but let me explain this to you one more time.

The group of people who pay no federal income tax (yes, it's probably around 47%) includes:
- students
- stay-at-home parents
- the elderly
- people who earn so little that they're exempt from federal taxes
- people who pay state income taxes, city taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc.
- people who have paid into the system for years and are now retired or unable to work
- the unemployed who are desperately searching for work
- people who are disabled, temporarily or permanently
- people who are having a bad year financially
- people taking legitimate deductions that bring their federal tax rate down to 0

So, how exactly is everything that Romney said true? ALL of these people are lazy and looking for a government handout? ALL of these people support Obama blindly? ALL of these people are freeloaders simply living off of the government?

The fact is that the states that have the highest percentage of people paying zero federal income tax are also the states with the highest percentage of Republican voters. Romney is wrong and is distorting the facts, as usual. And that is the nicest thing I can possibly say about him, his campaign, and these remarks.
 
2012-09-18 11:12:27 PM  

Silly Jesus: Romney is right. We're now at the point where over 47 percent of the people in this county --- over 47 percemt of people who are old enough to be in the U.S. workforce --- pay no income taxes at all. Actually, it's worse than that. Not only do they not pay taxes, they consume a good portion of the taxes paid by the other 52+ percent. These people are on the government teat .. and for all-too-many of them, that's exactly where they want to stay.

In America, one-half of the population is living off the other half. Almost one-half of Americans support and maintain their lifestyles by using the federal government as an instrument of plunder. And why not? Politicians - liberal politicians - make it easy for them. Their president - their hero - their savior - Barack Obama -- says that it is government spending that made America great! Well fine! Then let's make America even greater! Spend more money on ME! These moochers rather like the life of living off of the work of others and they will vote for Obama -- if they vote at all. Voting, after all, requires effort. He's the man who will protect their parasitic lifestyle.


Shut the Fark up.

I am one of that 47% who doesn't pay in on Income Taxes.

Last year I spent most of the year on Active Duty as a National Guardsman, other than that I was at the police academy, or serving as a police officer. After the EITC and other credits/deductions, my wife (who is too ill to work) and myself got a very modest refund.

The year before that, I was on Active Duty almost all year. Again, being an enlisted man in the US Army may pay the bills, but you will never be rich. Combine that with those same credits and deductions, and we got a refund.

The years before that I was working 40 to 60 hour work weeks in a variety of blue collar jobs. My wife worked night-shift staff at a rehab center (before her health went downhill, in part due to extreme stress from her job) on 40 to 50 hour workweeks herself. We didn't make a lot of money, but it paid the bills. Again, due to credits and deductions, we got a refund.

I'm one of those 47% Mitt Romney talks about. I'm no damn moocher. I work my ass off. I don't expect free food, free lodging, or free healthcare from the government. What I DO expect is that if I work hard that I can afford healthy and safe food, comfortable and secure lodging, and have affordable and adequate healthcare. Mitt has openly said he plans to repeal that last one, and has blatantly insulted me when he thought he was confidentially speaking to a dinner of the uber-rich.

I'd have to have extra holes in my head to think that voting for Mitt Romney and his plutocratic class-warfare agenda was a good idea, so you can STFU with the Republican spin talking points..
 
2012-09-18 11:19:27 PM  

Silverstaff: FlyingJ: BunkyBrewman Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Watch the video-esp the waiters moving in front of the lens. The camera's obvs on a wheeled dinner-serving tray, the speech was illicitly taped by spacemonkey waiters i.e. Romney's 47%'ers [api.ning.com image 850x357]

Makes me wonder if he said other, even more offensive things beforehand and they decided to fire up the camera to get the dirt afterwards, and he just kept right on talking and saying things he should probably regret later.

Yeah, the Project Mayhem/"We Watch You While You Sleep" pic is appropriate. Rmoney's campaign was already on the ropes, but he pissed off the waiters. A $50k a plate dinner, with waiters making well less than that per year. They were serving people who could throw away more than their annual salary on one night's expenses. I'd imagine they were pretty bitter, when combined with his plutocratic class-warfare act.

I do wonder if this was held in reserve for a specific moment, like if Mitt was doing better they would have already used it. Yesterday was supposed to be when he started talking about issues and putting some substance into his campaign. . .and that got derailed instantly, like this one was being held back as a political weapon to use at an optimum time.


The video's been on the circut (youtube) for a while now; May, IIRC. It's getting more traction now because of Carter Jr. outing himself as forwarding the clip to news agencies who picked up on it.

Your analysis of the wait staff, 100% on, me thinks. It harkens to a time when Edwards (another born into/and worked through devious methods 1%-er) came into the diner I was working at once and left a 17 cent tip on a $230 bill for him and some staffers late in the nights service. We were even on our very best behavior, knowing how rich he is and expecting a good tip-out; hell, we even turned the death metal off...

/so thrilled I don't work for tips any longer
//thinks everyone everywhere should have to live off of a tip-based-salary for at least 6 months out of their lives to understand better
 
2012-09-18 11:34:22 PM  

BunkyBrewman: Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Take some farking responsibility you assclown. Carter's grandkid didn't record the video, you did.


Being that you see people grazing the other side of the buffet table, the person recording with the camera in the phone could have been a server, "Would you like some prime rib with your whine?"
 
2012-09-18 11:49:16 PM  
GaryPDX - Obama's "base"

growlersoftware.com
 
2012-09-18 11:55:41 PM  

Hobodeluxe: In the newly released full Mojo/Romney tapes, about 4 minutes in on tape one, Romney starts to talk about what he refers to as "the Jimmy Carter election", i.e., 1980. He then goes on to talk about how the hostage crisis and the failed rescue mission Desert One were pervasive issues through the 1980 election. Then at the end he says that "if something of that nature presents itself I will work to find a way to take advantage of the opportunity."
He has a couple stopped and started sentences and at some points it's not entirely clear to me what his meaning is. But on this last point he seems to be saying that if a major international crisis erupted he'd do what he could to turn it to political advantage.

Please take a listen. It's about four minutes in, on the 1st of the two videos here. What do you make of it?


so what he's saying is if some angry muslims somewhere in the world could get their hands on some American hostages in the next month or so... he and/or some of his wealthy donors could make it worth their while... maybe he could hit up HW bush for some pointers on 'negotiating' with these types of people... you know so they don't accidentally release the hostages too soon.
 
2012-09-18 11:58:39 PM  
chiefsfaninkc 2012-09-18 04:11:29 PM

Half the country has already written itself off by allowing themselves to be enslaved by the federal government. Romney did nothing but acknowledge it.

www.onepennysheet.com

crooksandliars.com 

hinessight.blogs.com 
 
2012-09-19 01:43:46 AM  

timujin: Agreed, but again, I don't really think it's for realz, but I'm curious as to what happens. It'd be really funny if on the 28th they say, "Hey, sorry, we can't release them, Romney paid up."


Funnier: "We lied. Romney paid us, but here they are anyway."

Most Funnierest: "My friends! Let me explain. They said they wouldn't release them if I paid."
 
2012-09-19 01:52:03 AM  
keycorner.org
 
2012-09-19 02:25:48 AM  

dletter: I am just so amused as how jealous the super rich are of people making $20k a year and how they don't have to pay taxes. Of course, cutting their income to $20k a year doesn't sound very appealing to them.


upload.wikimedia.org

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_duckies
 
2012-09-19 04:13:38 AM  

rufus-t-firefly: Mr. Right: It's moderately interesting that an informal CNBC poll is running about 76% in agreement with Romney's comments. Link 

Yes, I know it's not scientific and I know that any group could now rally the troops and change it in minutes. But since CNBC isn't typically a bastion of conservative thought, and since I am reliably informed by farklibs that all tea partiers, conservatives, neo-cons, Republicans, and such get all of their news from Fox and never venture outside it, it's kind of amusing that the numbers are running the way they are.

I wonder how many of that 76% are members of the 47% that Romney derides in the video...

And CNBC is a business channel. Are you saying that liberals are involved in capitalist ventures?


It could also be that many people actually want that 47% number to be less. You know, make people pay taxes. Not much, at the low end, and perhaps a lot *more* at the high end, but *some*.
 
2012-09-19 06:07:28 AM  
One more reason to like President Carter and his family!
 
2012-09-19 09:29:12 AM  
The saddest part is that a significant portion of those wastrels that Rom-bot complains about are actually the second half of his base; Americans who vote on Abortion, Jesus, Bigots, and Guns.

What a great deal the Republican party has with them; all they have to do is pay minimal lip-service at zero dollar cost. Poor Democrats actually have to invest real money in Environment, Job Safety and Basic Entitlement programs.
 
2012-09-19 10:40:41 AM  

Thunderpipes: Romney was spot on. Everything he said is exactly true. He should have campaigned on that. He is never, ever going to get an Obama voter to switch. But there are pissed off independents who have to pay taxes who don't care for welfare bums too.

Obama campaigns by saying rich people are evil and must be punished... Romney should campaign that poor people are lazy and need to get off their asses.


Except what he said wasn't true at all, other than that 47 percent of people don't pay federal income taxes. Then he went on to a flat lie (and a popular conservative talking point) that those 47 percent are lazy moochers who won't take reponsibility for their lives. That's not even close to being true. Nearly two thirds of that 47 percent works and pays federal payroll taxes at a higher rate of taxation than Romney pays (when you include the employer contribution). Most of the rest of the 47 percent are retired. Fewer than 15 percent of those who don't pay federal income taxes are actually "dependents," who are either temporarily unemployed because of the bad economy or unemployable (disabled, incarcerated, etc.).

The 47 percent doesn't pay federal income taxes mainly because of tax breaks passed in the Reagan and Bush II administrations. Wealthy people got much bigger tax breaks from those changes in tax law, and now they're complaining that people who don't make a lot of money got tax breaks, too?
 
2012-09-19 11:12:14 AM  

Sofa King Smart: I still don't understand the 'conservative' hate for Carter...
if you look at his background he is EVERYTHING they claim to want...
actual military service (didn't have daddy get him a deferment)... devout Christian (even taught sunday school while he was in the white house for christ's sake!)... self-made farmer, still active in habitat for humanity...


Not really a farmer, not totally self-made (His wiki is wrong on this; sourced to bad journalism). His dad was fairly wealthy. Jimmy took over the family peanut warehouse business after his dad died and expanded it. Great guy, though. Kind of a crummy president (kind of a mean boss, micro-manager, bad at congressional and public relations), but a GREAT ex-president.
 
2012-09-19 11:20:10 AM  
if you lazy moochers still vote Romney in after all of this, you deserve whatever shiat he does to your country.
 
2012-09-19 11:25:13 AM  

Coming on a Bicycle: rufus-t-firefly: Mr. Right: It's moderately interesting that an informal CNBC poll is running about 76% in agreement with Romney's comments. Link 

Yes, I know it's not scientific and I know that any group could now rally the troops and change it in minutes. But since CNBC isn't typically a bastion of conservative thought, and since I am reliably informed by farklibs that all tea partiers, conservatives, neo-cons, Republicans, and such get all of their news from Fox and never venture outside it, it's kind of amusing that the numbers are running the way they are.

I wonder how many of that 76% are members of the 47% that Romney derides in the video...

And CNBC is a business channel. Are you saying that liberals are involved in capitalist ventures?

It could also be that many people actually want that 47% number to be less. You know, make people pay taxes. Not much, at the low end, and perhaps a lot *more* at the high end, but *some*.


Yeah, but all of those people DO pay taxes, just not federal income taxes. If they work, 15 percent of their compensation goes to Medicare and Social Security. Romney's total federal tax bill is under 14 percent (because SS & Medicare are taxed only on the first $110,000 of wage income, it's an insignificant amount for someone with his income). And they pay a much higher percentage of their income in property taxes, sales taxes, federal excise taxes, etc., because when you have a lower income, you tend to spend almost all of it on taxed necessities, rather than plowing a lot of it back into (untaxed) investments.

The problem is that people WANT to believe that their taxes are wasted on moochers, because it allows them to think that their already low taxes could be lowered further without any real sacrifice. Having a message that feeds a common prejudice, however false, is always better than having a factual message that people don't want to believe. That's why RMoney is so close in the polls.
 
2012-09-19 11:42:40 AM  

Mouser: "There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what," Romney said on the recording. "All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it."

How exactly is this a controversial statement?


For many reasons, outside of the fact that the his statement is a generalization of almost half the US population. I think the biggest issue with his comment is that here you have an individual who wants to be President, but has implied that he could care less about half the population.

Any reasonable person who has been following politics lately already knew this. All he's done is confirm it. His damage control didn't help.
 
2012-09-19 12:33:01 PM  

reubendaley: So shout me down, criticize me, belittle me, attribute ridiculous conclusions to my statements, call me names


Right. 'Cause I did exactly none of those things, you know. Just saying.

reubendaley: DO NOT acknowledge that there is any validity to what Mr. Romney said


Oh, there is some.

But it's a tiny fraction of the population. And it does not reliably vote Republican. And getting (and I'm being very generous, here) 10% of a statement right does not equal "correct", or even "partly correct".

It's just "wrong".

Don't let The Narrative get in the way of Facts, son.

Optimus Composite: bitter xenophobes, desperately clinging to their guns and bibles. That could have sunk him


People really should read the first part of the paragraph to see what he was actually describing. Otherwise, it's the typical Lie of Omission.

He never said Word One about Xenophobia, by the way, just misplaced anger.

Man On Pink Corner: I'd just prefer it if everyone who votes had some actual skin in the game.


This twaddle, again?

If I were a stay-home-Dad, and had no income to be taxed, are you saying that I shouldn't have a voice in how Public Funds are spent? Because they would have no effect on me and mine? Are you really that dim?
 
2012-09-19 01:03:24 PM  

FlyingJ: BunkyBrewman Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Watch the video-esp the waiters moving in front of the lens. The camera's obvs on a wheeled dinner-serving tray, the speech was illicitly taped by spacemonkey waiters i.e. Romney's 47%'ers [api.ning.com image 850x357]


Came here for this. Leaving satisfied.
 
2012-09-19 03:26:28 PM  

Deucednuisance: reubendaley: So shout me down, criticize me, belittle me, attribute ridiculous conclusions to my statements, call me names

Right. 'Cause I did exactly none of those things, you know. Just saying.

reubendaley: DO NOT acknowledge that there is any validity to what Mr. Romney said

Oh, there is some.

But it's a tiny fraction of the population. And it does not reliably vote Republican. And getting (and I'm being very generous, here) 10% of a statement right does not equal "correct", or even "partly correct".

It's just "wrong".

Don't let The Narrative get in the way of Facts, son.

Optimus Composite: bitter xenophobes, desperately clinging to their guns and bibles. That could have sunk him

People really should read the first part of the paragraph to see what he was actually describing. Otherwise, it's the typical Lie of Omission.

He never said Word One about Xenophobia, by the way, just misplaced anger.

Man On Pink Corner: I'd just prefer it if everyone who votes had some actual skin in the game.

This twaddle, again?

If I were a stay-home-Dad, and had no income to be taxed, are you saying that I shouldn't have a voice in how Public Funds are spent? Because they would have no effect on me and mine? Are you really that dim?


The more stupid, the broader the brush.
 
2012-09-19 03:27:55 PM  

No Such Agency: Sofa King Smart:
I still don't understand the 'conservative' hate for Carter...
if you look at his background he is EVERYTHING they claim to want...
actual military service (didn't have daddy get him a deferment)... devout Christian (even taught sunday school while he was in the white house for christ's sake!)... self-made farmer, still active in habitat for humanity...

But he's not an asshole.


Automatic DQ.
 
2012-09-19 04:37:13 PM  

Deucednuisance: If I were a stay-home-Dad, and had no income to be taxed, are you saying that I shouldn't have a voice in how Public Funds are spent? Because they would have no effect on me and mine? Are you really that dim?


Yep. You shouldn't have the power to vote your way into my wallet just because you and your wife managed to figure out the whole sex thing.
 
2012-09-19 05:30:41 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Yep. You shouldn't have the power to vote your way into my wallet just because you and your wife managed to figure out the whole sex thing.


Well, I pay taxes. Why should you have any say in how they're spent?

Seriously, you cannot see how stupid this line of "reasoning" is?
 
2012-09-19 07:09:35 PM  

Makh: CAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-ter!


I hope the implication there wasn't that Romney is at all Jim Kirk like. Romney is more like the anti-Kirk: nobody likes him, he doesn't give a damn about the people under his command, and he sucks at everything he does. Even when he cheats he can't own up to it because no one will admire his ingenuity.
 
2012-09-19 08:12:41 PM  

chiefsfaninkc: DROxINxTHExWIND: "I dont like criticism of my family," James Carter IV tells NBC News."

I like this kid. A lot. I always wondered why more politicians kids don't come out like this. Hell, I get irritated when people tell lies about Obama and I don't even know him. Imagining they are talking about my father would send me over the edge.

So do you feel the same outrage when people lie about members of the other party? Or is you outrage one sided?


People like Newt Gingrich? Hard not to have, you know, fair and legit reasons to dislike him.
 
2012-09-19 08:15:18 PM  

Silverstaff: Silly Jesus: Romney is right. We're now at the point where over 47 percent of the people in this county --- over 47 percemt of people who are old enough to be in the U.S. workforce --- pay no income taxes at all. Actually, it's worse than that. Not only do they not pay taxes, they consume a good portion of the taxes paid by the other 52+ percent. These people are on the government teat .. and for all-too-many of them, that's exactly where they want to stay.

In America, one-half of the population is living off the other half. Almost one-half of Americans support and maintain their lifestyles by using the federal government as an instrument of plunder. And why not? Politicians - liberal politicians - make it easy for them. Their president - their hero - their savior - Barack Obama -- says that it is government spending that made America great! Well fine! Then let's make America even greater! Spend more money on ME! These moochers rather like the life of living off of the work of others and they will vote for Obama -- if they vote at all. Voting, after all, requires effort. He's the man who will protect their parasitic lifestyle.

Shut the Fark up.

I am one of that 47% who doesn't pay in on Income Taxes.

Last year I spent most of the year on Active Duty as a National Guardsman, other than that I was at the police academy, or serving as a police officer. After the EITC and other credits/deductions, my wife (who is too ill to work) and myself got a very modest refund.

The year before that, I was on Active Duty almost all year. Again, being an enlisted man in the US Army may pay the bills, but you will never be rich. Combine that with those same credits and deductions, and we got a refund.

The years before that I was working 40 to 60 hour work weeks in a variety of blue collar jobs. My wife worked night-shift staff at a rehab center (before her health went downhill, in part due to extreme stress from her job) on 40 to 50 hour workweeks herself. We ...


I work hard enough to not have to depend on the government taking money from someone else and giving it to me. I'm sorry that this isn't important to you.
 
2012-09-19 08:16:42 PM  

CapeFearCadaver: Silverstaff: FlyingJ: BunkyBrewman Unbelievable. Some person (a Romney backer) takes a video of their candidate and now blames Carter's grandson for convincing them to post it online?

Watch the video-esp the waiters moving in front of the lens. The camera's obvs on a wheeled dinner-serving tray, the speech was illicitly taped by spacemonkey waiters i.e. Romney's 47%'ers [api.ning.com image 850x357]

Makes me wonder if he said other, even more offensive things beforehand and they decided to fire up the camera to get the dirt afterwards, and he just kept right on talking and saying things he should probably regret later.

Yeah, the Project Mayhem/"We Watch You While You Sleep" pic is appropriate. Rmoney's campaign was already on the ropes, but he pissed off the waiters. A $50k a plate dinner, with waiters making well less than that per year. They were serving people who could throw away more than their annual salary on one night's expenses. I'd imagine they were pretty bitter, when combined with his plutocratic class-warfare act.

I do wonder if this was held in reserve for a specific moment, like if Mitt was doing better they would have already used it. Yesterday was supposed to be when he started talking about issues and putting some substance into his campaign. . .and that got derailed instantly, like this one was being held back as a political weapon to use at an optimum time.

The video's been on the circut (youtube) for a while now; May, IIRC. It's getting more traction now because of Carter Jr. outing himself as forwarding the clip to news agencies who picked up on it.

Your analysis of the wait staff, 100% on, me thinks. It harkens to a time when Edwards (another born into/and worked through devious methods 1%-er) came into the diner I was working at once and left a 17 cent tip on a $230 bill for him and some staffers late in the nights service. We were even on our very best behavior, knowing how rich he is and expecting a good tip-out; hell, we even ...


Didn't you choose to work for tips rather than adequate wages? Why should everyone make that same poor choice just to see how bad it is?
 
2012-09-19 08:19:02 PM  

Hickory-smoked: [keycorner.org image 550x749]


biggeek: dletter: I am just so amused as how jealous the super rich are of people making $20k a year and how they don't have to pay taxes. Of course, cutting their income to $20k a year doesn't sound very appealing to them.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 354x167]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_duckies


Being jealous of the poor and not wanting your money confiscated by the government and handed over to the moochers and parasites are two very different things. The first one being a figment of your imagination created to avoid reality.
 
2012-09-19 08:53:49 PM  

Silly Jesus: I work hard enough to not have to depend on the government taking money from someone else and giving it to me. I'm sorry that this isn't important to you.


Oh really?

You're saying I don't work hard just because I'm paid by the Government?

I'm not hard working when I am on active duty? I'm not hard working when I am on duty as a cop?

When is the last time you worked a 90 hour work week? The last time you had to kick down a door at your job? The last time you had to slide down a rope out of a helicopter at your job? The last time that you had to make a decision that might cost good men and women their lives if you got it wrong?

I work plenty hard, probably harder than you. Your tax dollars pay my salary.

That "47%" Mitt Romney talked about includes veterans, soldiers, the elderly, the poor. . .and they aren't moochers.

Just because you don't make enough money to pay income tax doesn't mean your entire life is tax free. I still pay sales tax, gasoline tax, property taxes, payroll taxes & FICA, state income taxes, and more taxes that I am probably not even realizing. About the only tax I can think I DON'T pay is cigarette tax because I don't smoke, and Capitol Gains tax because I'm not rich enough to have big investments.

I know I don't have a lot of money, but the money I do pay in taxes I know goes to provide a school for my son, roads to drive on, the salaries of my fellow servicemembers and officers, as well as other civil servants, as well as a wide variety of services and programs. It's not just throwing money into a government-shaped hole and it's wasted, I'm paying my fair share in, and I get my fair share out.
 
2012-09-19 09:04:18 PM  

Silly Jesus: Being jealous of the poor and not wanting your money confiscated by the government and handed over to the moochers and parasites are two very different things. The first one being a figment of your imagination created to avoid reality.


After seeing what an asshole you made of yourself with Silverstaff, I'm not about to take lectures in reality avoidance from the likes of you.

The central focus of your philosophy seems to be that anyone who isn't rich is just lazy. That's a myth, and a callous, blind one at that.
 
2012-09-19 11:58:11 PM  

Deucednuisance: Well, I pay taxes. Why should you have any say in how they're spent?


What kind of taxes? Payroll taxes don't count, and no amount of sputtering and spinning is going to change that. Your payroll taxes are not supposed to fund anything but your own SS/Medicare coverage.

Local and state sales taxes and property taxes are also irrelevant because the 47% thing specifically calls out Federal income taxation.
 
2012-09-20 05:11:57 AM  

Silverstaff: Silly Jesus: I work hard enough to not have to depend on the government taking money from someone else and giving it to me. I'm sorry that this isn't important to you.

Oh really?

You're saying I don't work hard just because I'm paid by the Government?

I'm not hard working when I am on active duty? I'm not hard working when I am on duty as a cop?

When is the last time you worked a 90 hour work week? The last time you had to kick down a door at your job? The last time you had to slide down a rope out of a helicopter at your job? The last time that you had to make a decision that might cost good men and women their lives if you got it wrong?

I work plenty hard, probably harder than you. Your tax dollars pay my salary.

That "47%" Mitt Romney talked about includes veterans, soldiers, the elderly, the poor. . .and they aren't moochers.

Just because you don't make enough money to pay income tax doesn't mean your entire life is tax free. I still pay sales tax, gasoline tax, property taxes, payroll taxes & FICA, state income taxes, and more taxes that I am probably not even realizing. About the only tax I can think I DON'T pay is cigarette tax because I don't smoke, and Capitol Gains tax because I'm not rich enough to have big investments.

I know I don't have a lot of money, but the money I do pay in taxes I know goes to provide a school for my son, roads to drive on, the salaries of my fellow servicemembers and officers, as well as other civil servants, as well as a wide variety of services and programs. It's not just throwing money into a government-shaped hole and it's wasted, I'm paying my fair share in, and I get my fair share out.


You get more out than you put in. I was simply saying that you shouldn't complain. You made the choices in your life. You got a job where you wouldn't make enough money to survive without a government safety net. Your poor decisions in life do not entitle you to one cent of my money.
 
2012-09-20 05:13:16 AM  

Hickory-smoked: Silly Jesus: Being jealous of the poor and not wanting your money confiscated by the government and handed over to the moochers and parasites are two very different things. The first one being a figment of your imagination created to avoid reality.

After seeing what an asshole you made of yourself with Silverstaff, I'm not about to take lectures in reality avoidance from the likes of you.

The central focus of your philosophy seems to be that anyone who isn't rich is just lazy. That's a myth, and a callous, blind one at that.


No. The central focus of my philosophy is that no one else is entitled to any portion of my life. What right do you have to claim ownership of any portion of my work? Or I yours?
 
2012-09-20 09:34:18 AM  

Silly Jesus: You get more out than you put in. I was simply saying that you shouldn't complain. You made the choices in your life. You got a job where you wouldn't make enough money to survive without a government safety net. Your poor decisions in life do not entitle you to one cent of my money.


What government safety net?

My family and myself are not on TANF, SNAP, Medicaid, SSI or any other "welfare" program. The money I receive from the government is my salary for the job I do. I don't pay in on income tax because my income, when combined with deductions and tax credits, especially the EITC, reduces my income tax liability to zero. I'm still paying in plenty in other taxes, just not to the IRS.

The one time in my life that I needed a "safety net" involved an unpaid furlough from a private sector job due to a lack of work, and that need was met by a food bank at a local church. I have never taken a single dime in "welfare" from the government.

I am a soldier and a police officer, and if you are calling those poor career choices, just come right out and say you hate soldiers and police officers. Both of those jobs pay a helluva lot better than the retail, food service and customer service jobs I had beforehand, and you better bet that this "47%" includes a lot of people who check you out at the store, serve your food, and answer your calls, and they are hardworking people who pay into the system too. . .just not to the IRS.

As for what right does somebody have to what you make, here is how. You didn't make that all by yourself, President Obama was right. You drove to work on roads funded by public dollars. You probably went to a public school. You are breathing clean air and drinking clean water ensured by the EPA. You live under the security provided through the Departments of Defense and Homeland Security, as well as your local and state police forces. You are safe from fire because of your local fire department. You know if a storm is coming because of the National Weather Service.

Even if you are an entrepreneur and "made it yourself", your employees were also taught in public schools, maybe even went to college on student loans. You may well have had a Small Business Administration loan to help you get started.

The American people are entitled to a portion of your work, through taxation, to pay back what you took out just by living in this country. You are entitled to that same portion of everybody elses work. It's called living in a civilized country. Taxes have been levied by every government in history. Unless you were a frontiersman living in the wilderness or some explorer stranded on a distant island, you paid taxes and lived with the benefits of those taxes. In the 21st century, neither one of those is a valid career path.

The Ayn Rand fantasy of a handful of bold entrepreneurs struggling against vast hordes evil moochers and an oppressive government is just that, the childish fantasy of people who don't understand how the world really works, as written by a woman deeply scarred by growing up during the Russian Revolution. You think you're Atlas? Go ahead, shrug, I dare you. Go off an try to make Galt's Gulch, leave society. Be John Galt if you think you can. You'll find that in the real world, we need government to work well, and it's a lot more than a handful of percent of people that really make the world go. Want to know what a world without taxes and government looks like in the real world? Look at Somalia: thieves, pirates, gangs, religious militias, and constant low-grade warfare.

The "system" will crash a lot faster if the waiters, sales clerks, call center workers, janitors, and other working men left than if these Randian entrepreneurs left.
 
2012-09-20 10:09:43 AM  

Man On Pink Corner: What kind of taxes?


Hey, Douche, I'm not in the hypothetical anymore, I'm talking about the real Me, homeowner, so American that I have three jobs. I pay plenty of income tax. Why should *you* have a say (via your vote) in how they are spent?

Man On Pink Corner: Payroll taxes don't count,


Why not? That's not "skin in the game"? (Which was the characterization to which I was objecting, after all. Stay on point, kthx!) That money goes into Social Security, Medicare/aid, etc. Why shouldn't such people have a vote about how those programs are manifested? (Hint: There have been Presidents and Presidential Candidates that thought "privatizing" these programs was a swell idea? Why shouldn't someone who pays into them be denied the right to vote against such idiocy?)
 
2012-09-20 11:42:37 AM  

Silly Jesus: Silverstaff: Silly Jesus: Romney is right. We're now at the point where over 47 percent of the people in this county --- over 47 percemt of people who are old enough to be in the U.S. workforce --- pay no income taxes at all. Actually, it's worse than that. Not only do they not pay taxes, they consume a good portion of the taxes paid by the other 52+ percent. These people are on the government teat .. and for all-too-many of them, that's exactly where they want to stay.

In America, one-half of the population is living off the other half. Almost one-half of Americans support and maintain their lifestyles by using the federal government as an instrument of plunder. And why not? Politicians - liberal politicians - make it easy for them. Their president - their hero - their savior - Barack Obama -- says that it is government spending that made America great! Well fine! Then let's make America even greater! Spend more money on ME! These moochers rather like the life of living off of the work of others and they will vote for Obama -- if they vote at all. Voting, after all, requires effort. He's the man who will protect their parasitic lifestyle.

Shut the Fark up.

I am one of that 47% who doesn't pay in on Income Taxes.

Last year I spent most of the year on Active Duty as a National Guardsman, other than that I was at the police academy, or serving as a police officer. After the EITC and other credits/deductions, my wife (who is too ill to work) and myself got a very modest refund.

The year before that, I was on Active Duty almost all year. Again, being an enlisted man in the US Army may pay the bills, but you will never be rich. Combine that with those same credits and deductions, and we got a refund.

The years before that I was working 40 to 60 hour work weeks in a variety of blue collar jobs. My wife worked night-shift staff at a rehab center (before her health went downhill, in part due to extreme stress from her job) on 40 to 50 hour workweeks ...


So happy for your TEMPORARY happiness.
Be patient, fool, you are not an island.

BTW, that 47% pays taxes, a lot of taxes, just not the income tax (STALKING HORSE) that Romney has buttraped(actual) for the past decade.
 
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