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(Sports Illustrated)   NFL: Here's the evidence for suspending you in May. Vilma: You know this affidavit was signed three days ago right??   (sportsillustrated.cnn.com) divider line 147
    More: Stupid, Jonathan Vilma, Brett Favre, NFL, Anthony Hargrove, Scott Fujita, Gregg Williams, Roger Goodell  
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3627 clicks; posted to Sports » on 18 Sep 2012 at 9:10 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-18 08:11:25 AM  
fark Goodell.. and not just because of this. Did you see the play calling last night? These refs are worse than my sons middle-school league.
 
2012-09-18 08:46:57 AM  
I wonder if it ever occurred to Mr. Vilma that Mr. Favre, Mr. Manning, Mr. Rodgers and a few other guys might have their own pool going? How many games can we make Vilma miss?
 
2012-09-18 08:56:42 AM  
I'd explain why that is a stupid retort, but I can already tell you have no interest in understanding.
 
2012-09-18 08:56:55 AM  
This whole thing smells like bullshiat. A player putting up a $10k bounty? That sounds far fetched. That and the ink on the affidavit is barely dry. It seems to me that you'd have needed that affidavit in hand BEFORE suspending Vilma.

And how about those scab refs last night? They sucked ASS. They sucked giant donkey balls. High school refs would've called a better game. They weren't even capable of spotting the damned ball properly.
 
2012-09-18 09:15:15 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: And how about those scab refs last night? They sucked ASS. They sucked giant donkey balls. High school refs would've called a better game. They weren't even capable of spotting the damned ball properly.


I honestly thought Fox was going to take his team into the locker rooms about halfway through the second quarter, after the refs gave the Falcons another first down after they'd been stopped just so they could continue their drive. That would've had to have ended the lockout like, immediately, right? Sure, Denver would've been out a win, which they were anyway, but the NFL would've had sh*t all over its face if a team just said "f*ck it, it's not worth it" on Monday Night Football.

Also, how dumb is Gregg Williams that he's letting the NFL convince him that blaming Vilma is going to get him back in the league? Who the f*ck is going to want to hire/play for this guy even if he does get reinstated?
 
2012-09-18 09:26:45 AM  
Didn't the commissioner say that they had mounds of paper evidence and hours of testimony? And all he produces is a three day old affidavit?

Goodell is holding on way too tightly. He isn't enacting a vision of his own ... he isn't leading. He's trying to enforce someone else's ideals with extreme blinders on. At least with Stern you know that it's his will that he is enacting. Stern is the emperor ... like him or hate him, the man leaves no doubt as to who is in charge. Goodell is like a bad steward ... almost like a priest trying to keep things together for an absent deity that only left empty goals and platitudes as guidance...

/ and pay the damn refs
 
2012-09-18 09:40:51 AM  

kronicfeld: I'd explain why that is a stupid retort, but I can already tell you have no interest in understanding.


Does it have something to do with post hoc justification?

Because that's what it smells like to me.
 
2012-09-18 09:43:45 AM  

IAmRight: Also, how dumb is Gregg Williams that he's letting the NFL convince him that blaming Vilma is going to get him back in the league? Who the f*ck is going to want to hire/play for this guy even if he does get reinstated?


You never know. He could be angling for being just the guy management loves: a tough guy who is also a kiss-up "team player", so long as the team is management.
 
2012-09-18 09:44:19 AM  
Look at the shiat some of these player pull. Murders, arson, drug dealing, dog fighting and the list goes on. Why do people find this so hard to believe?
 
2012-09-18 09:45:41 AM  
I'm getting a bit tired of the constant bounty gate threads, because, as far as I'm concerned, the issue is over and we need to move on to more important issues, like getting the officials back.

But this one is just too ridiculous to pass up. So, if I'm following correctly, the "corroborating evidence" the NFL had back in May was "Gregg Williams' word", but that was never actually recorded/written down/signed/sworn/whatever? And now that actual evidence is required, NOW they have the brilliant idea to get the "evidence" sworn in? And the evidence comes from the guy who received the most severe suspension??

Does Goodell even know how much egg is on his face right now? Does he even have a clue?
 
2012-09-18 09:53:04 AM  

Slow To Return: I'm getting a bit tired of the constant bounty gate threads, because, as far as I'm concerned, the issue is over and we need to move on to more important issues, like getting the officials back.

But this one is just too ridiculous to pass up. So, if I'm following correctly, the "corroborating evidence" the NFL had back in May was "Gregg Williams' word", but that was never actually recorded/written down/signed/sworn/whatever? And now that actual evidence is required, NOW they have the brilliant idea to get the "evidence" sworn in? And the evidence comes from the guy who received the most severe suspension??

Does Goodell even know how much egg is on his face right now? Does he even have a clue?


This.

I have no idea what a standard NFL contract says about the commissioner's right to suspend a player, or what level of evidence is needed. But it would seem that if you are going to take a few million bucks out of somebody's pocket, you should expect to be in court.

And while an affidavit really isn't all that much different than someone's "word", courts tend to have this fascination with paper and signatures.

Between this nonsense and the referee fiasco, the NFL seems determined to knock itself off its pedestal as the most popular American sports league.
 
2012-09-18 09:56:57 AM  
Nine sworn affidavits saying it didn't happen, two saying it did, the two contradict each other, one given by a guy who needs Goodell's approval to get reinstated and the other by an ex-employee who needed a police escort to leave the premises after getting fired. Like I said in the MNF thread, this smells like three day old flounder, but I can't wait to hear from the bootlickers how the same inhuman monster who ordered players to tear Crabtree's ACL is now a decent guy just telling the truth, lol. I'm sure it'll be very enlightening.
 
2012-09-18 09:58:11 AM  
BTW does anyone know what the terms of dispute between the refs and the NFL are? Other than refs want more money and the NFL wants to pay them less.
 
2012-09-18 10:00:15 AM  
$10K to hit Favre? There must be thousands of people who would gladly do it for free.
 
2012-09-18 10:03:51 AM  

robsul82: Nine sworn affidavits saying it didn't happen, two saying it did, the two contradict each other, one given by a guy who needs Goodell's approval to get reinstated and the other by an ex-employee who needed a police escort to leave the premises after getting fired. Like I said in the MNF thread, this smells like three day old flounder, but I can't wait to hear from the bootlickers how the same inhuman monster who ordered players to tear Crabtree's ACL is now a decent guy just telling the truth, lol. I'm sure it'll be very enlightening.


Jose Canseco was a scumbag too, but it doesn't mean he was lying. You don't have to think Gregg Williams is a decent guy to believe that he might know about a bounty.
 
2012-09-18 10:05:51 AM  

Slow To Return: Does Goodell even know how much egg is on his face right now? Does he even have a clue?


Does he even care? What's the worst that can happen to him? People will still watch the games and the money will roll in. Even if he loses the Vilma lawsuit, the owners can just give him a bonus to make up the loss. The NFL as a whole doesn't care about anything except the bucks rolling in. Look at the product they're putting on the field right now! It's a joke, you worry every play about what BS the fake refs are going to pull now, rather than the actual play. This whole thing is pointless. I'm not and have never been a labor guy, but in this case, and in the case of the NHL, I fully support the players. I hope the players use the examples of the flagrant fouls going unpunished under these fake refs as more evidence that the league really doesn't give a damn about player safety except to the extent that it could threaten revenue.
 
2012-09-18 10:06:13 AM  
Normally I'd have little sympathy for the team which martyred Kurt Warner but alas my loathing of Goodell grows steadily greater as I watch these refereeing debacles. The NFL needs to check itself before it wrecks itself.
 
2012-09-18 10:08:17 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: Jose Canseco was a scumbag too, but it doesn't mean he was lying. You don't have to think Gregg Williams is a decent guy to believe that he might know about a bounty.


He's also on perma-ban from the league and knows the only possible way he gets back in is to do whatever they tell him to do. Otherwise it's college ball, if he can land a job. There are excellent reasons to doubt his veracity. Vilma has multiple affidavits, and reportedly can call another 30 witnesses. The only people the league has are those who rely on the goodwill of league management to continue to make a living.
 
2012-09-18 10:08:54 AM  

roflmaonow: BTW does anyone know what the terms of dispute between the refs and the NFL are? Other than refs want more money and the NFL wants to pay them less.


Actually the refs just wanted to keep their pensions that existed. The NFL wanted to cut them 60% basically for the sheer hell of it.

"Hey guys, we just made a lot of money and the league is as strong as its ever been! We're going to need to pay you guys a lot less now."
 
2012-09-18 10:09:23 AM  

abhorrent1: Look at the shiat some of these player pull. Murders, arson, drug dealing, dog fighting and the list goes on. Why do people find this so hard to believe?


Right ... let's stereotype all players because some players are involved in crime.

Secondly, even if the your stereotype is true, why is Goodell being so hard on these guys and not the ones involved in actual crimes?

Personally if there really was a bounty system the players should be punished. To bad Goodell won't actually let us see the evidence. This whole thing is a witch-hunt to make the NFL appear to be tough on player safety issues due to the player safety lawsuits.
 
2012-09-18 10:16:33 AM  

roflmaonow: BTW does anyone know what the terms of dispute between the refs and the NFL are? Other than refs want more money and the NFL wants to pay them less.


The NFL wants to pay them more; the refs want to be paid a lot more.
 
2012-09-18 10:17:09 AM  
I haven't been able to keep track of which crew is officiating games. The one with the school teacher from idaho hasn't been bad, but last night was the worst. Blown calls, no control, and took forever on anything. Does anyone know what games that crew has been on? The Packers-San Fran game was awful and I'm wondering if its the same people.
 
2012-09-18 10:18:25 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: He's also on perma-ban from the league and knows the only possible way he gets back in is to do whatever they tell him to do. Otherwise it's college ball, if he can land a job. There are excellent reasons to doubt his veracity. Vilma has multiple affidavits, and reportedly can call another 30 witnesses. The only people the league has are those who rely on the goodwill of league management to continue to make a living.


Yeah, clearly the players who signed the statements denying the bounty have nothing to gain from that. I don't know who to believe, but surely Vilma has a lot of friends who would go to bat for him. Doesn't mean they're telling the truth, necessarily, does it?
 
2012-09-18 10:18:26 AM  

IAmRight: Actually the refs just wanted to keep their pensions that existed. The NFL wanted to cut them 60% basically for the sheer hell of it.


Well, everybody knows that it's those pensions down the road that will eventually bankrupt the league.
 
2012-09-18 10:19:06 AM  

IAmRight: roflmaonow: BTW does anyone know what the terms of dispute between the refs and the NFL are? Other than refs want more money and the NFL wants to pay them less.

Actually the refs just wanted to keep their pensions that existed. The NFL wanted to cut them 60% basically for the sheer hell of it.

"Hey guys, we just made a lot of money and the league is as strong as its ever been! We're going to need to pay you guys a lot less now."


Good thing having substitutes won't do anything to undermine the integrity of the games, the league, or be a blaring headline of repeated incompetence from week to week, because that would be embarrassing.

Ah, hell.
 
2012-09-18 10:21:02 AM  
BTW does anyone know what the terms of dispute between the refs and the NFL are? Other than refs want more money and the NFL wants to pay them less.

My understanding is that the real issue is that the league wants to have a "Blue Crew" and "Gold Crew" on standby for every game and to be able to pick from who they consider to be the "best" of the bunch. How the NFL is measuring that is anybody's guess. The refs want a single crew for each game and for that crew to be "it".

Also $.
 
2012-09-18 10:22:40 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: Yanks_RSJ: Jose Canseco was a scumbag too, but it doesn't mean he was lying. You don't have to think Gregg Williams is a decent guy to believe that he might know about a bounty.

He's also on perma-ban from the league and knows the only possible way he gets back in is to do whatever they tell him to do. Otherwise it's college ball, if he can land a job. There are excellent reasons to doubt his veracity. Vilma has multiple affidavits, and reportedly can call another 30 witnesses. The only people the league has are those who rely on the goodwill of league management to continue to make a living.


This. Well, someone who wants to get reinstated and an ex-employee who thinks Payton and Loomis blackballed him from the NFL, apparently not considering that disappearing twice during a season (once during SB week) will make you look plenty bad on your own. Furthermore, there are other issues with GW's statement. He continues to insist that the pool was pay-for-performance only, with no pay-for-injury stuff going on at all, so apparently Goodell wants to say the Vilma part is true, but the rest of it isn't - pay attention to THIS part, but not THIS part. He says Vilma went off on his own with the $10K offer and that wasn't his idea, no sir, and when it comes to payments and definitions of terms, he "doesn't recall" quite a bit. Tragic how that memory falters at key stuff. So yeah, GW's statements reeks of backroom deal making and BS overall. Cerullo, for his part, says GW was involved in the Favre bounty, so somebody's lying on that one, one or both. We'll just have to see how it goes after suspensions get reissued.
 
2012-09-18 10:23:43 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: Galloping Galoshes: He's also on perma-ban from the league and knows the only possible way he gets back in is to do whatever they tell him to do. Otherwise it's college ball, if he can land a job. There are excellent reasons to doubt his veracity. Vilma has multiple affidavits, and reportedly can call another 30 witnesses. The only people the league has are those who rely on the goodwill of league management to continue to make a living.

Yeah, clearly the players who signed the statements denying the bounty have nothing to gain from that. I don't know who to believe, but surely Vilma has a lot of friends who would go to bat for him. Doesn't mean they're telling the truth, necessarily, does it?


No, but what do you think if two guys that the league has by the balls follow the league party line, and the rest of the people in the room say they're full of shiat? Yeah, some of them have something to gain, but everybody? Even the ones that have retired, moved to other teams, etc.? Doesn't pass the reasonableness test. No one outside the room can ever know with absolute certainty, but really, at some point you have to wonder when the league has passed from looking into a possible problem to simply covering its ass for fouling up publicly.
 
2012-09-18 10:26:59 AM  

thecpt: I haven't been able to keep track of which crew is officiating games. The one with the school teacher from idaho hasn't been bad, but last night was the worst. Blown calls, no control, and took forever on anything. Does anyone know what games that crew has been on? The Packers-San Fran game was awful and I'm wondering if its the same people.


You know the hilarious thing about this, is that the regular refs are all teachers or lawyers or whatever 349 days a year. Granted they have more experience but it's not like they all go to "Ref School" 5 days a week. It's insane to me that standard practice is for these guys to be sitting in an office looking over expense reports, and then the next day it's "OK, I'm going to go officiate the Super Bowl. Might be late getting in on Monday, can you turn in my time sheet for me?"
 
2012-09-18 10:27:32 AM  

robsul82: We'll just have to see how it goes after suspensions get reissued.


My preference is for Vilma to win his lawsuit, Goodell be held personally liable, the jury excoriate the NFL for its gross misconduct, and the league be nailed for an anti-trust violation for its "gentlemen's agreement" salary cap in a non-salary cap year. At which point the owners look around, see a looming class-action suit, and realize that Goodell got them a great contract but everything else is coming apart at the seams, and fire him.
 
2012-09-18 10:27:39 AM  
Also, remember that GW's buddy Jeff Fisher is HC of the Rams and AFAIK hasn't fired him. So while it's certainly normal to think "what players would want to play for this guy now knowing he'd throw them under the bus to get reinstated," he does seem to have a job waiting for him in St. Louis if and when he does get reinstated. It's not pie in the sky wishing on GW's part that he might have a job again.
 
2012-09-18 10:28:33 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: No, but what do you think if two guys that the league has by the balls follow the league party line, and the rest of the people in the room say they're full of shiat? Yeah, some of them have something to gain, but everybody? Even the ones that have retired, moved to other teams, etc.? Doesn't pass the reasonableness test. No one outside the room can ever know with absolute certainty, but really, at some point you have to wonder when the league has passed from looking into a possible problem to simply covering its ass for fouling up publicly.


Understand, I'm not supporting the league at all in this, anymore. If they have evidence, they need to bring it or drop this whole thing. But the fact that Gregg Williams is a moron and a jerk doesn't mean he's lying. And Vilma can run a hundred of his friends out there saying there was no bounty, but it doesn't mean they're telling the truth either.

Hell, my friend's wife asked us recently if her husband got a lap dance during his bachelor party. We paid for him to get several of them, but we certainly didn't tell her that.
 
2012-09-18 10:30:09 AM  

jayhawk88: It's insane to me that standard practice is for these guys to be sitting in an office looking over expense reports, and then the next day it's "OK, I'm going to go officiate the Super Bowl.


The argument for full-time refs. There might be something to it. However, the regular refs are far superior to the current refs because, besides their rule knowledge their familiarity with applying the rules and interpretations, they are used to the speed of the game, and train at a much higher level than the current crew. They have their own seminars and training camps. They put a lot more into it than just showing up on Sundays.
 
2012-09-18 10:31:47 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: robsul82: Nine sworn affidavits saying it didn't happen, two saying it did, the two contradict each other, one given by a guy who needs Goodell's approval to get reinstated and the other by an ex-employee who needed a police escort to leave the premises after getting fired. Like I said in the MNF thread, this smells like three day old flounder, but I can't wait to hear from the bootlickers how the same inhuman monster who ordered players to tear Crabtree's ACL is now a decent guy just telling the truth, lol. I'm sure it'll be very enlightening.

Jose Canseco was a scumbag too, but it doesn't mean he was lying. You don't have to think Gregg Williams is a decent guy to believe that he might know about a bounty.


TBH, I'm inclined to believe Vilma did say something to the effect of "Knock Favre out 'n I give ya $10k." The problem is where's the evidence? You can't convict without evidence, and I'm not sure Gregg Williams word is anywhere near enough evidence.
 
2012-09-18 10:33:35 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: robsul82: We'll just have to see how it goes after suspensions get reissued.

My preference is for Vilma to win his lawsuit, Goodell be held personally liable, the jury excoriate the NFL for its gross misconduct, and the league be nailed for an anti-trust violation for its "gentlemen's agreement" salary cap in a non-salary cap year. At which point the owners look around, see a looming class-action suit, and realize that Goodell got them a great contract but everything else is coming apart at the seams, and fire him.


All of this, except for the "gentlemen's agreement" portion. I agree with what the league did on that one. I think Goodell has done a decent job up to this point, but two work stoppages in two years have obviously had a negative impact on the game and this bounty scandal is beyond ridiculous. Goodell is a smart guy - he's still the best commisioner of the four major sports by far - but he's gone off the deep end on a power trip and needs to be reigned in.
 
2012-09-18 10:33:36 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: Yeah, some of them have something to gain, but everybody? Even the ones that have retired, moved to other teams, etc.?


I'm pretty sure a majority of players in the league, even on teams that are the Saints rivals, would love to jump in for Vilma's defense; not for Vilma's own sake, but as a F-U to Goodell in order to drag this out and make the commish look weak and vulnerable.

/Goodell can suck it, anyway, so I'm not in his camp on this either.
 
2012-09-18 10:34:01 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: But the fact that Gregg Williams is a moron and a jerk doesn't mean he's lying. And Vilma can run a hundred of his friends out there saying there was no bounty, but it doesn't mean they're telling the truth either


No, but if everybody who was there says he's lying, then surely somewhere you have to say, ya know, he's probably lying. Right now it's Williams and Cerullo against the rest of the room, those two have real reason to lie, and they can't get their stories straight.
 
2012-09-18 10:34:46 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: Galloping Galoshes: No, but what do you think if two guys that the league has by the balls follow the league party line, and the rest of the people in the room say they're full of shiat? Yeah, some of them have something to gain, but everybody? Even the ones that have retired, moved to other teams, etc.? Doesn't pass the reasonableness test. No one outside the room can ever know with absolute certainty, but really, at some point you have to wonder when the league has passed from looking into a possible problem to simply covering its ass for fouling up publicly.

Understand, I'm not supporting the league at all in this, anymore. If they have evidence, they need to bring it or drop this whole thing. But the fact that Gregg Williams is a moron and a jerk doesn't mean he's lying. And Vilma can run a hundred of his friends out there saying there was no bounty, but it doesn't mean they're telling the truth either.

Hell, my friend's wife asked us recently if her husband got a lap dance during his bachelor party. We paid for him to get several of them, but we certainly didn't tell her that.


Certainly understandable, but I'm just looking at the accusers and considering their motives, and how a half-decent attorney would tear into a pissed ex-employee and someone who can get leaned on by the league in a way that's plenty reasonable to an observer.
 
2012-09-18 10:37:12 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: Galloping Galoshes: He's also on perma-ban from the league and knows the only possible way he gets back in is to do whatever they tell him to do. Otherwise it's college ball, if he can land a job. There are excellent reasons to doubt his veracity. Vilma has multiple affidavits, and reportedly can call another 30 witnesses. The only people the league has are those who rely on the goodwill of league management to continue to make a living.

Yeah, clearly the players who signed the statements denying the bounty have nothing to gain from that. I don't know who to believe, but surely Vilma has a lot of friends who would go to bat for him. Doesn't mean they're telling the truth, necessarily, does it?


No, it doesn't, but Williams has said Vilma stood up in front of a room filled with players, assistant coaches, trainers, towel boys and whoever else was in that defensive squad meeting and offered $10k to whomever knocked Favre out of the game. Pretty damning allegation, isn't it? Vilma has filed suit saying its untrue. That means, for him to prevail, that there aren't a number of people in that room who testify that he he actually did it, preferably people who have no interest in it either way (i.e. former players, such as Darren Sharper, who is retired). That's a significant gamble to take if you you're Jonathan Vilma and a handful of players from that meeting could sink the whole thing. (The scuttlebutt this a.m. is that Williams offered the $10k and is claiming Vilma did it. I have no opinion on that, but it's out there.) Williams may be fudging on the narrow hopes of getting back into the league. If Williams' story is right, the what Vilma did was wrong, and some punishment is warranted. It will be interesting to see if anyone else who was in that room has the same recollection as Williams.
 
2012-09-18 10:38:33 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: Yanks_RSJ: But the fact that Gregg Williams is a moron and a jerk doesn't mean he's lying. And Vilma can run a hundred of his friends out there saying there was no bounty, but it doesn't mean they're telling the truth either

No, but if everybody who was there says he's lying, then surely somewhere you have to say, ya know, he's probably lying. Right now it's Williams and Cerullo against the rest of the room, those two have real reason to lie, and they can't get their stories straight.


Yeah...I mean, even if you have the feeling that Vilma did say it, I think you'd have to tell Roger to come with more than the word of these two.
 
2012-09-18 10:42:21 AM  

Nabb1: That means, for him to prevail, that there aren't a number of people in that room who testify that he he actually did it, preferably people who have no interest in it either way (i.e. former players, such as Darren Sharper, who is retired).


Do you think that Darren Sharper would rat out his former teammate simply because he's retired now? You're out of your damn mind. That holds no water in my opinion, because I can't imagine Sharper, or anyone, admitting to the 10K bounty on Favre. He may have nothing to lose on a professional level, but surely there's nothing to gain from that either, and he'd look like a rat to everyone he ever played with.

Not a chance in hell, I'm sorry.
 
2012-09-18 10:43:56 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: jayhawk88: It's insane to me that standard practice is for these guys to be sitting in an office looking over expense reports, and then the next day it's "OK, I'm going to go officiate the Super Bowl.

The argument for full-time refs. There might be something to it. However, the regular refs are far superior to the current refs because, besides their rule knowledge their familiarity with applying the rules and interpretations, they are used to the speed of the game, and train at a much higher level than the current crew. They have their own seminars and training camps. They put a lot more into it than just showing up on Sundays.


Oh absolutely. And I get it from a certain point of view: It's not like basketball or baseball where these guys are travelling all the time, a crew only does one game a week. But still, as much money as the NFL is bringing in, you'd think that taking care of ~200 (or whatever the number is) refs would be a no-brainer.
 
2012-09-18 10:48:15 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: Nabb1: That means, for him to prevail, that there aren't a number of people in that room who testify that he he actually did it, preferably people who have no interest in it either way (i.e. former players, such as Darren Sharper, who is retired).

Do you think that Darren Sharper would rat out his former teammate simply because he's retired now? You're out of your damn mind. That holds no water in my opinion, because I can't imagine Sharper, or anyone, admitting to the 10K bounty on Favre. He may have nothing to lose on a professional level, but surely there's nothing to gain from that either, and he'd look like a rat to everyone he ever played with.

Not a chance in hell, I'm sorry.


Perhaps not on television, but get a guy in a deposition or in court under oath in a federal case and let's see what happens. Vilma has to be betting that no one in that room who is not Greg Williams (or Hargrove, Fujita, or Smith, for that matter) is going to spill the beans if he really did it. I mean, Cerullo, but his account isn't the same and is full of holes. And maybe not even a player, but a low level assistant or a trainer. And, frankly, Greg Williams was known to be a dirt bag around here even when we liked him.
 
2012-09-18 10:49:17 AM  

jayhawk88: you'd think that taking care of ~200 (or whatever the number is) refs would be a no-brainer.


You'd think, but for the past several years it appears that accountants have taken over the league, and are squeezing every dollar of revenue they can find. As if little Danny Snyder has assumed control of the league. You know, I may have something there. He's been around a while now, made baskets of money while his team sucked; he might just be speaking louder in council now. That would explain a lot...
 
2012-09-18 10:49:48 AM  
Goodell belongs in jail.
 
2012-09-18 10:50:33 AM  

Nabb1: Vilma has to be betting that no one in that room who is not Greg Williams (or Hargrove, Fujita, or Smith, for that matter) is going to spill the beans if he really did it.


That's a hell of a bet. Going to court to clear your name when you really did it, and you're betting that nobody will have an attack of conscience?
 
2012-09-18 10:52:09 AM  

jayhawk88: Galloping Galoshes: jayhawk88: It's insane to me that standard practice is for these guys to be sitting in an office looking over expense reports, and then the next day it's "OK, I'm going to go officiate the Super Bowl.

The argument for full-time refs. There might be something to it. However, the regular refs are far superior to the current refs because, besides their rule knowledge their familiarity with applying the rules and interpretations, they are used to the speed of the game, and train at a much higher level than the current crew. They have their own seminars and training camps. They put a lot more into it than just showing up on Sundays.

Oh absolutely. And I get it from a certain point of view: It's not like basketball or baseball where these guys are travelling all the time, a crew only does one game a week. But still, as much money as the NFL is bringing in, you'd think that taking care of ~200 (or whatever the number is) refs would be a no-brainer.


The NFL wants to make them full time employees and have an extra crew to rotate in and out. I thought pension was pending their decision to become full time. These guys have a really sweet deal, and I could kind of side with the NFL on this one but the games are starting to blow and its only week 2.
 
2012-09-18 10:53:01 AM  

jayhawk88: Oh absolutely. And I get it from a certain point of view: It's not like basketball or baseball where these guys are travelling all the time, a crew only does one game a week. But still, as much money as the NFL is bringing in, you'd think that taking care of ~200 (or whatever the number is) refs would be a no-brainer.


Roger Goodell's chief concern is the owners' money - making it, and keeping it. Mr. Player Safety has a bunch of scrubs on the field officiating games, and the longer that goes on, and the more players notice these guys don't know what they are doing, don't think for a second some defensive players won't start taking cheap shots. And make no mistake - this "bountygate" charade is all about looming lawsuits from former players suffering long term brain damage than it is about any current players. Those suits could, and very well may, bleed the League dry. But, Goodell can stand up and say, "I found out the Saints were doing this and dropped the hammer on them because I care deeply about player safety" and then let Larry, Moe and Curly officiate games to save the owners a few bucks. Also, I find it interesting that Williams claims no bounties were paid on hits that were penalized or fined. Only "clean" hits. Because, we all know, football players don't really hit guys as hard as they can unless there's an extra $500 in it.
 
2012-09-18 10:53:14 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: Nabb1: Vilma has to be betting that no one in that room who is not Greg Williams (or Hargrove, Fujita, or Smith, for that matter) is going to spill the beans if he really did it.

That's a hell of a bet. Going to court to clear your name when you really did it, and you're betting that nobody will have an attack of conscience?


Or try to get their 15 minutes, by which I mean the low level guys.
 
2012-09-18 10:54:45 AM  

Galloping Galoshes: Nabb1: Vilma has to be betting that no one in that room who is not Greg Williams (or Hargrove, Fujita, or Smith, for that matter) is going to spill the beans if he really did it.

That's a hell of a bet. Going to court to clear your name when you really did it, and you're betting that nobody will have an attack of conscience?


Exactly. Every one in that room will end up under subpoena at some point, either from Vilma or Goodell. It's on thing to sit and say, "No way, man, that never happened" to Cris Carter in a studio somewhere, and quite another to do it in a federal court house with Judge Berrigan staring at you.
 
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