Marcus Aurelius: I know I get disturbed when I'm measured, especially when they put the tape in your crotch to get the inseam.
Tigger: It's really about the relationship between momentum and wavelength.
Tigger: Submitter - you have used the partial classical explanation of the uncertainty principle. The one we use to explain it to children.It's really about the relationship between momentum and wavelength.In short. Don't.
Dafodude: Tigger: Submitter - you have used the partial classical explanation of the uncertainty principle. The one we use to explain it to children.It's really about the relationship between momentum and wavelength.In short. Don't.I'm a layman here, but I'm guessing that the paper just challenges certain assumptions about the principle. No matter (ha!) what, you still have to rely on some kind of interaction to make the measurement, which is always a two-way street, right? And that the precision is still limited to the wavelength involved, and the higher the precision you want, the shorter the wavelength and therefore the more energetic of an interaction. Yeah, this headline is a bad explanation - the measurement doesn't disturb itself, it's just that by measuring part of the state information of a particle you have to disturb the rest of it. Am I getting even close?Wish I had access to the actual paper.
Tigger: Dafodude: Tigger: ...Not very close no! The Heisenberg uncertainly principle doesn't state that you can't measure it because you'll disturb the measurement. It states that there is a limit to what is functionally knowable about the position of a particle in the universe because that particle has a waveform. As a result it is not in any particular place it is merely an uncollapsed probability function before you measure it.If you actually are interested I would recommend "How to Teach Quantum Mechanics to Your Dog" as an excellent book that doesn't require any specialist knowledge.
r1chard3: Are they certain about this?
Olympic Trolling Judge: The only reason Heisenberg's name came up is because, and I did not realize this, Heisenberg himself had initially proposed such a relationship as the reason for the uncertainty that now bears his name.
Olympic Trolling Judge: Click through to TFA linked by TFA. It's not questioning the "true" uncertainty principle, the one bounded by Planck's constant. It's just challenging the limits of the "measurement-disturbance relationship," where uncertainty beyond the physical minimum is introduced by the act of measurement. The only reason Heisenberg's name came up is because, and I did not realize this, Heisenberg himself had initially proposed such a relationship as the reason for the uncertainty that now bears his name.
whatshisname: Heisenberg's Principal
oldfarthenry: I concur with this. I tried to measure the diameter of my penis with a set of calipers and disturbed/pinched the hell out of it!
whatshisname: You can't know both their position and momentum.
t3knomanser: You can know both position and momentum, but only to a point- at some point you have to sacrifice precision.
kevinboehm: [ih2.redbubble.net image 375x360]Wanted for questioning.
whatshisname: Hence you can't know both at once.
whatshisname: t3knomanser: You can know both position and momentum, but only to a point- at some point you have to sacrifice precision.And the more you know about one, the less you know about the other. Hence you can't know both at once.
Sliding Carp: I once attended a lecture by Heisenberg, so I'm getting a kick out of this./It was in 26-100, I was sitting in about the 8th row a little to the right of center in, I don't know, '72 or '73 - something like that.
dramboxf: Say my name.
nobody seems to bother to click through links.From Synopsis: The Certainty of Uncertainty
... If the observer affects the observed, how can one even make such a measurement of the disturbance of a measurement? Rozema et al. use a procedure called "weak" quantum measurement: if one can probe a quantum system by means of a vanishingly small interaction, information about the initial state can be squeezed out with little or no disturbance. The authors use this approach to characterize the precision and disturbance of a measurement of the polarizations of entangled photons. By comparing the initial and final states, they find that the disturbance induced by the measurement is less than Heisenberg's precision-disturbance relation would require. ...
Aye Carumba: Even a weak measurement that has a large error term must sometimes be correct
HairBolus: nobody seems to bother to click through links.
ko_kyi: This seems like the year of "Important principles of physics are WRONG" followed by "never mind" a few months later.
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