Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(NBC News)   Commander of Naval Special Warfare Command tells Navy SEALS to shut the hell up. "For an Elite Force that should be humble and disciplined for life, we are certainly not appearing to be so"   (usnews.nbcnews.com) divider line 66
    More: Followup, elite force, NSW, Navy SEALs, Dutton, military base, military officials, Jeh Johnson, commanders  
•       •       •

12605 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Sep 2012 at 6:43 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


Archived thread
2012-09-04 11:59:09 PM  
7 votes:
The Commander of the Naval Special Warfare Department tells the NAVY SEALS to show more discretion and be more humble... also not to brake the law and leak classified information. I don't see the problem with this. You do know every branch of the military has an unwritten rule that you can't wear your uniform if you aren't on base or on active duty, except at special events like parades, weddings and funerals. I think for the Marines this is an actual law they have to follow.

Believe it or not most military people, enlisted men and officers, are quite humble and disciplined and get quite upset when they see another soldier that isn't.
2012-09-05 02:29:49 AM  
6 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: If they wanted to be careful, they'd have joined the Coast Guard.


The Coast Guard does an insane amount of dangerous shiat on a near daily basis.
2012-09-05 07:17:42 AM  
5 votes:
is it not weird that the DOD is complaining about this book at all?
the DOD and the administration have been leaking these details for propaganda purposes since just a few hours after the event.
how long was it before we saw the picture of the situation room full of all the apprehensive political officials?
files.abovetopsecret.com
this account from august is chocked full of administration and DOD personnel leaks.
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/08/08/110808fa_fact_schmidle ?c urrentPage=all
just search for the word official in that article. there are dozens of references to various, administration, coutnerterrorism, and DOD officials who provided the details of the story to the author.
it doesn't seem to me that you should be able to break the rules you are supposed to be enforcing and observing about secrecy for political or organizational gain then claim the guy who actually put his life on the line in the mission is an asshole for talking about what happened.
make up your mind about whether talking about this is bad and then stick with whatever you decide.
2012-09-05 03:51:54 AM  
5 votes:
"We'll hunt down bin Laden wherever he's hiding."
"Well, we're not really that concerned about finding him."
"Of course killing bin Laden was what anyone would've done."
"Obama shouldn't have had bin Laden killed, he should've been brought to the U.S. for a proper trial."
"Oh no, we can't possibly bring suspected terrorists to the U.S. for trial."
"Obama is stupid to try to close Gitmo."
"Why didn't Obama close Gitmo like he promised?"
2012-09-05 03:43:21 AM  
5 votes:

alienated: We could try all of them anywhere in the us. and we should. Are we that weak we cannot handle the trial of what, 500 people ? I think we have murder trials by that count a year in some cites here .at least in a state.


The problem is that we, as a nation, no longer give a fark about the rule of law. Supposedly, this is the foundational concept behind our entire nation, but it has been shoved aside.

It's been obvious for some time that if you are sufficiently rich or sufficiently politically connected, you won't even be charged with your crimes much less convicted.

None of the fraudulent bankers who destroyed our economy have been prosecuted.

None of the people who ordered, carried out, or destroyed videotaped evidence of our torture have been prosecuted.

None of the people or companies who took part in illegally spying on Americans have been prosecuted.

People should take some time to read this:

dl.dropbox.com 

It's an excellent look at the problem.
2012-09-05 02:36:41 AM  
4 votes:

BullBearMS: All you have to do is admit that we never had any intention whatsoever of taking this guy captive.


well, duh. What could we have done ? I mean, besides making a stain on the walls out of him. Could we, even as a nation ruled by law, had a trial ? I am not being facetious here.I see no other solution except his summary execution. armed or not is immaterial at this point. Laden was a cancer and needed to be excised . By any and all means at our disposal. Cold ? yep. I would have done the same to McViegh, given the chance.
2012-09-05 12:22:07 AM  
4 votes:
Follow-Up?

Needs a damned HERO tag.
2012-09-05 06:57:49 AM  
3 votes:

Science_Guy_3.14159: Believe it or not most military people, enlisted men and officers, are quite humble and disciplined and get quite upset when they see another soldier that isn't.


When we were short on manpower in Iraq and using the Marines as middle-east mall cops (I guess the infantry was busy? who knows) the Corps lowered their recruiting standards to the level of... well, rent-a-cops. They may have been an elite force in the past, but nowadays they're not really spec anything, just generic security forces that can be, and regularly are, subbed for by merc organizations like Blackwater.

//Meanwhile, the navy can still blow a mite off a fly's wing with a 400mm cannon from eight miles off without harming the fly, and the air force dominates so hard that they don't even particularly need pilots to blow up your house.

//Not that there's anything wrong with generic security forces, I've met some TSA guys that are quite nice and respectable people.
2012-09-05 04:51:28 AM  
3 votes:

alienated: BullBearMS: Then we either charge the people in Gitmo (and our other political prisons in places like Bagram, Afghanistan) with crimes or we let them go. Just as the rule of law requires.

Agreed. But, to be perfectly honest- i am really dfrunk and also i do not see how they can get a trial if nobody lets them have one.


Well, any public defender could get them freed, and Bush and Cheney would be at the Hague.
2012-09-05 02:08:58 AM  
3 votes:
The major reason for political butthurt over this book seems to be that this guy says the mission was a lot more about kill than about "kill or capture".

"No Easy Day," the new pseudonymous book revealed to be by Navy SEAL Mark Bissonnette, claims that Osama bin Laden was unarmed when shot at his Abbottabad compound last May. That's another key discrepancy in a story that's already changed several times since the initial days after Obama, to much acclaim, announced the killing of the Al Qaeda leader.

If you remember, the initial story was that when Bin Laden was shot, he was firing weapons while hiding behind one of his wives who he used as a human shield.
2012-09-05 01:54:24 AM  
3 votes:

alienated: go ahead, armchair special ops types, tell me i am wrong, but please- include your class number so i can prove you are not, nor have even been a real specop


My Grandfather was enlisted Naval Intelligence in Vietnam, and served on the Camp David security staff. (I have his white house medals and service records to prove it. Along with some really interesting gifts from Eisenhower, Kennedy, and Johnson's staff)

He taught me a really valuable lesson that I still hold onto today when dealing with people who claim to have been in the "Special Forces" of any branch: The ones that actually were don't brag about it for the most part. They either don't want you to know, or don't like to talk about it.
2012-09-05 03:27:15 PM  
2 votes:

ZipSplat: The National Guard was shiat. Worst decision I ever made. Those lazy, fat pieces of shiat - I couldn't believe the stuff that went on there. Contrasted with the Marine Corps I don't even consider them to be part of the military.


Maybe your guard sucked ass, but there are plenty of good ones out there.

So have a big fark you from PA's 28th Division

www.warhats.com

www.hampton.lib.nh.us

farm4.staticflickr.com

PA militia has been in every military engagement this country ever experienced. The 28th has been around formally since WWI and our guard units draw their linage to before we were even a formed nation.

From the Battle of the Bulge where they got their nickname... to both Iraq wars. They were there in Katrina and they will be there anytime anyone needs them.

You only get what you put in as a soldier... don't try to blame your unit because you had a bad experience. As a soldier if your unit was unacceptable you had an obligation to make a difference there. That's what real soldiers do. 

You can try to tell them they aren't part of the military, but they'll be too busy soldiering on to give a shiat what you have to say.
2012-09-05 07:56:03 AM  
2 votes:

ZipSplat: Blackwater does PSD and logistics support. You're really defining down the term "mercenary" if you apply it to them. And no, "merc organizations" - I don't know what shiatty B-movie taught you to refer to them as that - do not carry out the Marine Corps' mission unless you're counting PSD for diplomats.


No, they are a mercenaries.

Blacwater snipers deployed into live combat

Blackwater contractors in rooftop firefight

Blackwater Shootings

They disgusting and it is disgusting that the U.S. government used them.
2012-09-05 06:52:05 AM  
2 votes:
Maybe the guy just wanted to set the record straight. Maybe he just wanted his team to stop being used as a political football.
2012-09-05 04:03:41 AM  
2 votes:

propasaurus: "Why didn't Obama close Gitmo like he promised?"


Obama never even tried to close Gitmo. He tried to move it onto US soil (where we would continue to hold people forever without even filing charges) as if the whole problem with Gitmo was that it was located in the Caribbean. Damned warm tropical breezes!

In ordering the federal government to acquire an Illinois prison to house terrorism suspects who are currently held at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, President Obama on Tuesday took a major step toward shutting down the military detention facility that its detractors say had become a potent recruitment tool for Al Qaeda.

Administration officials acknowledged that the move would require Congressional approval, since Congress now bars Guantánamo detainees from being brought onto American soil unless they face prosecution, and some of the detainees may be indefinitely confined without being tried.


Holding people forever without even charging them with a crime is the problem. Not that it's happening in Cuba. Moving Gitmo onto US soil does not fix the problem.

Here's what the ACLU had to say:

The following can be attributed to Anthony D. Romero, Executive Director of the ACLU:

"The creation of a 'Gitmo North' in Illinois is hardly a meaningful step forward. Shutting down Guantánamo will be nothing more than a symbolic gesture if we continue its lawless policies onshore.

"Alarmingly, all indications are that the administration plans to continue its predecessor's policy of indefinite detention without charge or trial for some detainees, with only a change of location. Such a policy is completely at odds with our democratic commitment to due process and human rights whether it's occurring in Cuba or in Illinois. In fact, while the Obama administration inherited the Guantánamo debacle, this current move is its own affirmative adoption of those policies. It is unimaginable that the Obama administration is using the same justification as the Bush administration used to undercut centuries of legal jurisprudence and the principle of innocent until proven guilty and the right to confront one's accusers.


Despite the frequency with which the "Congress stopped Obama from closing Gitmo" lie is told, what Congress actually did was prevent Obama from moving Gitmo onto US soil.
2012-09-05 03:50:18 AM  
2 votes:

BullBearMS: People should take some time to read this:


thats the problem though- they dont really read anymore. twitter made the gen pop even more add. or adhd . and html somehow, along the way to making pr0n available faster and faster to our desktops, did not make it possible for bookchives read from anywhere, which was the goal of the thing in the first place.
2012-09-05 03:21:59 AM  
2 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: If they wanted to be careful, they'd have joined the Coast Guard.


Way to shat on our servicemen, Republican scum.

www.uscg.mil
Link
2012-09-05 02:53:04 AM  
2 votes:

BullBearMS: However, England, Spain, and India somehow managed to give public trials in a court of law to the people behind their recent terrorist attacks. I'm pretty sure if they can manage it, we can too. We're supposed to be all about the rule of law here in America.


They also didn't contaminate most of their evidence by torturing detainees and holding them for years without trial.

/as far as we know, anyway.
2012-09-05 02:44:27 AM  
2 votes:

BullBearMS: All you have to do is admit that we never had any intention whatsoever of taking this guy captive.


And I'm perfectly ok with this. I doubt we'd have taken Hitler alive either.
2012-09-05 02:10:59 AM  
2 votes:

alienated: What Science_Guy_3.14159 said. Most SF types tend to keep a low, low profile and not, well, brag and crap or write a book until at least 30 years after the fact of an op. UCMJ and all, and stuff 

go ahead, armchair special ops types, tell me i am wrong, but please- include your class number so i can prove you are not, nor have even been a real specop


I think this guy thought someone would be as greedy and a big a douchebag as he is and he needed to cash in before someone could beat him to it. I think the guy broke his oath and his word and the idea that you're not supposed to talk in detail about the things you do. I work in network security and have seen some wild sh*t, but I would never tell anyone details about a customer's network or give any info that could identify a customer, whether I have a contract telling me that or not.

There are things you just don't talk about because it's expected to be private.

This guy wants his millions, and the DoD will likely take his money, but I sense he was also angling for a Fox News job or a role on the Republican speaking circuit.
2012-09-05 01:40:23 AM  
2 votes:
If they wanted to be careful, they'd have joined the Coast Guard.
2012-09-05 12:48:43 AM  
2 votes:
If I were a Navy seal I would do a cute synchronized horn blowing thing and clap my flappers until I had my fill of herring.
2012-09-05 12:04:24 AM  
2 votes:
That swift boat sure ran aground, didn't it?
2012-09-05 01:32:16 PM  
1 votes:

KiplingKat872: Callous: And by "More like" you mean completely different from. Neither Manning or Owen were members of the respective administrations so your comparison doesn't fit.

Well, your statement was nonsensical to begin with since these leaks really did not make Obama look bad and no one is suggesting anyone be court martialed.


And by "did not make Obama look bad", you mean suggesting he ordered an unarmed man executed. And by "no one is suggesting anyone be court martialed", you mean the Pentagon General Council is threatening legal action against the author.



http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/04/politic s/seals-bin-laden-book/index.htm l
2012-09-05 01:18:55 PM  
1 votes:

BronyMedic: alienated: go ahead, armchair special ops types, tell me i am wrong, but please- include your class number so i can prove you are not, nor have even been a real specop

My Grandfather was enlisted Naval Intelligence in Vietnam, and served on the Camp David security staff. (I have his white house medals and service records to prove it. Along with some really interesting gifts from Eisenhower, Kennedy, and Johnson's staff)

He taught me a really valuable lesson that I still hold onto today when dealing with people who claim to have been in the "Special Forces" of any branch: The ones that actually were don't brag about it for the most part. They either don't want you to know, or don't like to talk about it.


My grandpa was an Air Force vet. My biological father was a cable-layer for the Air Force.

Guess which one has the obsession with military and was the only one I felt pressure from, growing up, to consider a 'vet'.

/It's part of why I respect my grandfather so much. He's done a lot, and a lot of people would call him a hero, but I honestly was fuzzy on whether or not he was even in the Air Force until I was maybe fourteen or so. He cares more about living honorably and enjoying life. I hope I grow up to be half of what that guy is.
//...Though maybe without the fart jokes.
2012-09-05 01:01:21 PM  
1 votes:

Callous: So the moral of this story is if George Bush is in office and you release classified information that makes him look bad you're a whistle blowing hero a la Bradley Manning. But if Barak Obama is in office and you release classified information that makes him look bad you're a leak and should go to Leavenworth.

Glad to see the Fark double standard is still in full effect.


More like "if Bush is in office and someone in that administration leaks classified information exposing a CIA agent, they should get off scott free."
2012-09-05 12:58:58 PM  
1 votes:
So the moral of this story is if George Bush is in office and you release classified information that makes him look bad you're a whistle blowing hero a la Bradley Manning. But if Barak Obama is in office and you release classified information that makes him look bad you're a leak and should go to Leavenworth.

Glad to see the Fark double standard is still in full effect.
2012-09-05 12:38:47 PM  
1 votes:
kyrg
SEALS should have a limit of 50 miles or less from an ocean to operate in.

I don't think the SEALS need much help (meaning restrictions) from us on doing their jobs. Thankfully, much of their training covers dry land operations. I look at the SEALS as a great military economizer. They go in and get it done. They save us from much more costly military efforts to reach a military/political goal.
2012-09-05 11:41:15 AM  
1 votes:

HotIgneous Intruder: But back on topic or something, Obama surely hasn't won the admiration of the special ops community.


Has any president in the last 20 years? People freakin' quit special ops rather than deal with the clusterfark of the "Coalition of the Willing."

Hell, you can go back to the Americans Civil War and find soldier at all level complaining about politicians. That's the way of it when one group of people is being ordered to die by people sitting behind safe comfy desks.
2012-09-05 11:34:55 AM  
1 votes:
HotIgneous Intruder
Obama has governed measurably to the right of Richard Nixon.
His geopolitik is effectively no different from Bush II, as the fun continues in southwest Asia, Gitmo parties on, eavesdropping and domestic intelligence collection continues unabated (link here), Homeland security parties on, the war on drugs continues to feed the prison-industrial complex humans.
His social rhetoric is hopeful and sounds very liberal, but he has done nothing differently with respect to the banking system or Wall Street's systematic robbery of American wealth. Hey, it's not illegal, right?
His attorney general has supplied weapons to Mexican drug cartels and clamped down on whistle blowers (see link above) much more aggressively than Bush II ever did.
He walks like a liberal and quacks like a liberal, but he acts like a neoliberal of the Chicago School; therefore nothing has changed here in the states for anyone from the upper middle class on down. Wages are still eroding, inflation has been adjusted so as not to be apparent, and unemployment is down because so many people have just quit looking for work.
The United States is a labor camp of debt service built on a service economy.
And the lame Obamacare health insurance thing? Heh. Don't get sick or stung by a scorpion, is all I can say about that.


It sure will be awesome when Romney gets into office and fixes all those things that Obama screwed up, won't it. I've been reading all Romney's policy plans about how he's going to do this. What? Romney doesn't have any plans about anything..........we're supposed to just trust him? Trust Mitt Romney? Are you shiatting me?
2012-09-05 11:26:20 AM  
1 votes:

dersk: So I don't think it has to do very much with being duped; did you have anything particular in mind?


Obama has governed measurably to the right of Richard Nixon.
His geopolitik is effectively no different from Bush II, as the fun continues in southwest Asia, Gitmo parties on, eavesdropping and domestic intelligence collection continues unabated (link here), Homeland security parties on, the war on drugs continues to feed the prison-industrial complex humans.
His social rhetoric is hopeful and sounds very liberal, but he has done nothing differently with respect to the banking system or Wall Street's systematic robbery of American wealth. Hey, it's not illegal, right?
His attorney general has supplied weapons to Mexican drug cartels and clamped down on whistle blowers (see link above) much more aggressively than Bush II ever did.
He walks like a liberal and quacks like a liberal, but he acts like a neoliberal of the Chicago School; therefore nothing has changed here in the states for anyone from the upper middle class on down. Wages are still eroding, inflation has been adjusted so as not to be apparent, and unemployment is down because so many people have just quit looking for work.
The United States is a labor camp of debt service built on a service economy.
And the lame Obamacare health insurance thing? Heh. Don't get sick or stung by a scorpion, is all I can say about that.

People don't think Rmoney can win, but I think he can, simply because Obama has been such a weak president, probably the weakest in my lifetime, and Citizen's United effectively put a knife in the neck of what credibility the electoral system ever had. You would not believe the density of the negative anti-Obama ads on the airwaves here. And that shiat works and it will work and this is only September.
2012-09-05 11:09:08 AM  
1 votes:

fireclown: dersk: Maybe people are just smarter and more perceptive here.

Nah. I've spent enough time in Europe to know better.


Well, there is a lot less nationalistic derp here, but I think specifically:
- They prefer Obama to Bush because Obama seems like someone you can work with to solve a problem
- They perceive Obama to be more financially responsible than the Republicans
- They wonder why the hell it took us so long to put in place health care, even in its crippled state, and think the conservative response to it is insane
- They don't think Obama is as likely to drag the rest of the Western world into a war as Bush was, and as Romney's perceived to be in the case of Iran
- They're fairly horrified by the Republican attitude towards gays

So I don't think it has to do very much with being duped; did you have anything particular in mind?
2012-09-05 11:03:02 AM  
1 votes:

SkunkWerks: That said, I was pretty disappointed with the lot that was suggesting we not rebuild the WTC because of potential future terrorism. I was totally supportive of not just rebuilding it, but building it taller, and erecting four other bouldings in the immediate vicinity that would have produced what I like to call the "Bird of Freedom" salute to anyone coming in from off the coast.


I wanted them to rebuild it EXACTLY as it was. Ok, make improvements and apply leasons learned. But at the end of the day, when people looked at the NY skyline, I wanted them to see the twin towers, standing defiantly.
2012-09-05 10:50:08 AM  
1 votes:

HotIgneous Intruder: dersk: From where I'm sitting (Western Europe), the US reputation is MUCH better under Obama than it was under Bush.
They don't know all that much about Romney other than 'rich businessman', and at least here the only stuff I've seen about Ryan was about how full of lies his speech was. Just what I've observed here in Holland.

Obiwan duped the pants off Europe.


Maybe people are just smarter and more perceptive here.
2012-09-05 10:36:04 AM  
1 votes:
I'd like to make a point that has been obvious to me for many years but seems to be missed by many fine American citizens. Any and all information released by military sources has been adjusted to meet the needs of the military. It's called propaganda. In this Bin Laden case, it was mostly doctored to make OSB look like an ahole to his constituancy. This was an attempt to prevent OSB from becoming a cause for more terrorism against the United States.

The Pat Tillman friendly fire case was an episode of military propaganda coverup designed to hide a very tragic friendly fire death and, at the same time, produce an American war hero to shore up support from American citizens. Both were useful goals for the military.

If we are going to roast Obama for the misinformation campaign surrounding the death of OSB, perhaps we should retroactively roast W for the Tillman affair. Personally, I'm very happy OSB is no longer with us. Pat Tillman's death was a terrible tragedy but it has led to efforts to reduce friendly fire episodes.
2012-09-05 10:25:17 AM  
1 votes:

Publikwerks: Really, how has Obama done that?

Please, link to a source where Obama said "I did it"

Ever time I have heard Obama talk about it, he ALLWAYS mentions the heorics of the SEALs and the tireless work of the intellegence agents who tracked him down.

Even the author of the book says Obama didn't take all the credit



I concur. The death of Bin Laden probably didn't do a whole lot operationally, but it was a huge symbolic coup. It makes the point that we will hunt you down and kill you, no matter how ridiculous it gets if you piss us off enough. A president would have to be nuts not to crow a little about it.
2012-09-05 10:15:28 AM  
1 votes:
Maybe the SEALS are a little pissed that Obama has been using the killing as a political tool and trying to take all the credit.
2012-09-05 09:28:01 AM  
1 votes:

vartian: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: If they wanted to be careful, they'd have joined the Coast Guard.

The Coast Guard does an insane amount of dangerous shiat on a near daily basis.


No doubt. The Coasties have been at war with the drug cartels for decades. And to put that in perspective: The drug cartels cut off WAY more heads than Al Qaida.
2012-09-05 09:21:59 AM  
1 votes:

maram500: Ivandrago: maram500: Science_Guy_3.14159: The Commander of the Naval Special Warfare Department tells the NAVY SEALS to show more discretion and be more humble... also not to brake the law and leak classified information. I don't see the problem with this. You do know every branch of the military has an unwritten rule that you can't wear your uniform if you aren't on base or on active duty, except at special events like parades, weddings and funerals. I think for the Marines this is an actual law they have to follow.

Believe it or not most military people, enlisted men and officers, are quite humble and disciplined and get quite upset when they see another soldier that isn't.

That's actually a written rule for the Marine Corps and the Navy. And I've tried making sense of the "Order of the Day" and what uniform can be worn when and where and...I had to drink. Too much regulation for a uniform, I think.

/Almost joined the Navy
//Would have gone to OCS
///Probably would be an O-3 by now
////Oh well

In the Army we wore our duty uniform all over town. When I lived with my sister, who was a Marine, she was always very annoyed that she couldn't stop off at the grocery store near her house after work because she wasn't allowed to do things off base in her uniform. She babbled something about respecting the uniform and ensuring civilians didn't see them doing anything improper while wearing it. Seemed silly to me, especially in a military town.

This is [another reason ]why Marines > Army. Marines go in first, kick more ass, and have far more respect for the uniform than to wear it off-base.

/One of my best friends is a Marine
//Lost his knee in Iraq
///A hero to me
////Not every person in uniform is automatically a hero, but thanks to you and your sister for serving


Your thanks are appreciated.
But as someone who is related to Marines, and has worked with Marines, and will admit to a certain amount of inter service rivalry, this business about the Marines kicking more ass gets old.
I'm sorry, but they don't go in first and they are not America's shock troops (damn you Generation Kill). They go in at the same time as all other conventional forces. Marine Infantry are no better at stacking and clearing and movement to contact than Army Infantry. Marines are better marksmen, true, as long as it's a known distance range, and they are in the prone shooting at stationary targets. In my experience (2 deployments to Iraq) I never fired a single shot at 500 yards from the prone at a stationary target. With respect for the uniform, making your Marines' lives harder by not allowing them to perform simple functions does not engender more respect for the uniform, it's annoying. Let's say I go to the commissary to buy food for dinner. I'm having sandwiches. I buy everything but the bread. I realize this on the way home but I can't stop at the grocery store across the street from my house because I'm in uniform. MRE's for dinner! That's a slight exaggeration. My sister mentioned that if you wear your uniform around, people ask you about it, and maybe people will be interested in what you do and maybe they'll join because they see how awesome you look in your uniform. If you want to know what most Marines think about the silly rules they have to abide by read terminallance.com (it's the best military webcomic), some of it might go over your head because you didn't serve in the Infantry (no dig, just a fact) but you'll see all the BS they have to put up with and how it doesn't make their lives any better, nor make them a more elite fighting force.

/end (slight) rant
2012-09-05 09:14:06 AM  
1 votes:

trotsky: I've seen stuff like this all over sites like Facebook and it's sickening that these shiatbags can twist a success into a partisan issue. What pisses me off the most is the use of "SEALS" who try to refute what happened and try to say Obama is taking all the credit. "SEALS" that haven't served in decades. "SEALS" who happen to be GOP shills.


Swift boating. Popular Republican tactic. See also John Kerry, 2004.

Take the military accomplishments of a Democrat. Either in uniform, or as Commander In Chief, have retired/former servicemembers who were in a related unit to the accomplishment insult the accomplishment and cast doubts on the heroism, leadership or achievement involved.

Doesn't matter if the allegations are true or can be substantiated at all, FOX News will trumpet them constantly and create enough of a media stink that the allegations will be reprinted in other media, even if to just cover the controversy. The fact allegations exist alone will make some people think they are true. It creates doubt.

That's what they are looking for, doubt and the specter of impropriety.
2012-09-05 09:03:35 AM  
1 votes:

Cauchy_Riemann_equations: Between General McChrystal's interview in Rolling Stone and the SEALs I think thee is a real sense of betrayal between the Commander in Chief and the military. From their point of view they take all the risk while politicians use them like a centerpiece at thanksgiving and then packed away until the next time they're useful.


I've been in during both the Bush administration and the Obama administration. I don't think they feel "used", I think that the military is just overwhelmingly Republican, and Republicans for some reason are particularly prone to falling for stupid conspiracy theories and inane political rhetoric.

Seriously. Fox News is on every television in the chow hall. SNCOs listen to Michael Savage in the office. I think it has more to do with the sense that liberals are pussies and conservatives are strongmen than it has to do with any particularly organic sense of disenfranchisement. It's astounding how many people fall for it.

I did a stint in the Guard after I left the Marine Corps and people would gather 'round the TV at the end of the day during drill and watch Glenn Beck wax on about communist conspiracies and presidential racism. If I had turned on a TV during the Bush administration in the Marine Corps and watched Keith Olbermann, I don't think it would have been similarly welcomed.
2012-09-05 08:43:40 AM  
1 votes:

CMYK and PMS:
He has at least partially repaired the U.S.'s reputation and standing on the Global Stage Hardly, we are now seen as a country that will murder our own citizens around the world with no trial


From where I'm sitting (Western Europe), the US reputation is MUCH better under Obama than it was under Bush.
They don't know all that much about Romney other than 'rich businessman', and at least here the only stuff I've seen about Ryan was about how full of lies his speech was. Just what I've observed here in Holland.
2012-09-05 08:36:41 AM  
1 votes:
CMYK and PMS: It is Obama's only accomplishment

Sorry, what?

Putting slowly turning the economy around despite constant obstructionism from the GOP,
This is a talking point that just isn't true.

in foriegn policy terms:

He assisted the revolution in Libya without getting us directly involved in a ground war there.
We got involved in a civil war where we don't even know who we were backing. Replacing a government in another country is not our job especially with one that may be worse

He removed most of the troops from Iraq so they could focus on the war in Afghanistan. Pretty much according to the withdrawal plan laid out by Bush

He has kept the tensions with Iran from exploding into war. This is just absurd

He has not kowtowed to Israel. I don't know how this could be viewed as an accomplishment even if it were true

He has took an aggressive military posture toward North Korea when they sank South Korea Navy ship. which has accomplished fark-all

Love it or hate it, he has taken a strong position about eliminating Taliban camps on the Pakistan side. the US has no business going into other countries and blowing things up. If he were a Republican you would view this as a negative

He solidified relations with Japan after the Tsunami by sending the USS Ronald Regan for disaster relief. And no other president ever sent relief to a country in distress. Were our relations with Japan bad? I didn't get that meno

He has at least partially repaired the U.S.'s reputation and standing on the Global Stage Hardly, we are now seen as a country that will murder our own citizens around the world with no trial

To say he has accomplished nothing but the assassination of bin Laden is a lie, simple as that.
2012-09-05 08:34:19 AM  
1 votes:

KiplingKat872: If you look at the links I provided you will see they are engaging in military operations, not just body guard work.


The FOB on which they are located is under attack. That video is from 2003/2004 timeframe, I remember when it came out.

You don't even have the context in which to understand what you are seeing. You just see people with guns running around shooting alongside the military, so you're assuming that must mean that they're performing the same duty across the spectrum. The contractors either live at or are protecting a principle visiting that FOB, and being that it is under attack they are working alongside the military there to repel the attack.
2012-09-05 08:34:10 AM  
1 votes:

SlothB77: "We do NOT advertise the nature of our work, NOR do we seek recognition for our actions,"

that's left for the politicians to do. though, i will say the WH wasn't shy about coming out and releasing all these supposed details of the raid. None of those details ended up being true, but they sure as hell weren't humble.

Obama is just mad he is about to be Swift Boated by these SEALS. Obama: this is your swift boat moment.


Oh, I'd say he's had plenty of moments already when he's been bombarded by lies about his background. I mean, that's what the swiftboating was all about.

I figure he would have gotten all the crap if things had gone bad; he had to make the call to go into Pakistani terrority; he gets to say he killed bin Laden.
2012-09-05 08:31:50 AM  
1 votes:

KiplingKat872: ZipSplat: Yeah, that in no way contradicts my statement, it just provides a blueprint of your ignorance. Yes, in PSD duties, people shoot people to protect their principle (usually a person, cargo, or a vulnerable area). That is not the same thing as the military engaging in offensive operations at the behest of the government to capture territory.

You need to look at those links, they were deployed a combat zones.

I'm sure the British brought in the Hessians "just to protect their supply lines."

Mercenaries are mercenaries. Called them whatever fancy name you want, but in the end they are guns for hire. Get over it.


Their single largest contractor was the State Department, specifically because they wanted their security teams seperate from the military. They didn't want their missions controlled by military brass (historically protecting the State Department fell under the duties of the USMC). They also believed, and still do, that having civillian security teams would be helpful to seperate their image from the more militaristic-looking military (less gear, armor, small trucks instead of humvees, etc).

Unlike most i've worked with PMCs during the height of the "omfg mercenaries!" scare. It's humerous to see these mostly left leaning civil servants, government aid agencies, international NGOs, UN and Nato officials, and hell, even the same journalists printing these mercenary stories, they might disparage blackwater but when they need to drive through a dangerous area they are the first ones to hire them.
2012-09-05 08:21:41 AM  
1 votes:

impaler: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: If they wanted to be careful, they'd have joined the Coast Guard.

Way to shat on our servicemen, Republican scum.

[www.uscg.mil image 560x315]
Link



it's a quote from that terrible Navy Seals movie in the 90s. relax, Francis.
/Coastie
2012-09-05 08:13:04 AM  
1 votes:

CMYK and PMS: It is Obama's only accomplishment


Sorry, what?

Putting slowly turning the economy around despite constant obstructionism from the GOP, in foriegn policy terms:

He assisted the revolution in Libya without getting us directly involved in a ground war there.

He removed most of the troops from Iraq so they could focus on the war in Afghanistan.

He has kept the tensions with Iran from exploding into war.

He has not kowtowed to Israel.

He has took an aggressive military posture toward North Korea when they sank South Korea Navy ship.

Love it or hate it, he has taken a strong position about eliminating Taliban camps on the Pakistan side.

He solidified relations with Japan after the Tsunami by sending the USS Ronald Regan for disaster relief.

He has at least partially repaired the U.S.'s reputation and standing on the Global Stage

To say he has accomplished nothing but the assassination of bin Laden is a lie, simple as that.
2012-09-05 07:39:44 AM  
1 votes:
righttruth.typepad.com

I learned it from watching you.
2012-09-05 07:15:39 AM  
1 votes:

Science_Guy_3.14159: You do know every branch of the military has an unwritten rule-


devcentral.f5.com
2012-09-05 07:06:14 AM  
1 votes:
The Democratic party should continue with the attacks on the SEALs. It shows real backbone and is surely a winning strategy.
2012-09-05 06:55:24 AM  
1 votes:
I don't care if the guy was unarmed, and juggling cats while wearing a traffic cone on his head and getting his balls shaved while singing "Wont you be my neighbor". He was a scumbag terrorist, who killed thousands of people through his orders, and had no regard for human life beyond his derpfest of religious fanaticism. This was a asshole who was happy to send others to die while he lived on, getting pretty much whatever he wanted. We had zero intention of taking him prisoner, as all the islamic fundies would go even more retard than they already do. This was a kill mission, and everyone knows it, and not a shiat was given for this poor excuse for a human life. I'm buying the book as i would like to know more details about how they ganked his sorry ass, and fed him to the sharks. Photos would be nice, but whatever.
2012-09-05 04:54:53 AM  
1 votes:

alienated: BullBearMS: Then we either charge the people in Gitmo (and our other political prisons in places like Bagram, Afghanistan) with crimes or we let them go. Just as the rule of law requires.

Agreed. But, to be perfectly honest- i am really dfrunk and also i do not see how they can get a trial if nobody lets them have one.


Well, as we have seen going way back to Nixon's pardon and all the way up to Obama' refusal to prosecute those guilty of torture (even when the people we tortured freaking died of it), neither of the two parties is interested in the rule of law anymore.

We need another option.
2012-09-05 04:49:57 AM  
1 votes:

BullBearMS: alienated: simplicimus: I think the problem is that any information from the prisoners is compromised by Bush's enhanced interrogation techniques. We're stuck with these prisoners.

yer overthinking it. space them .

How about we do something radical, like follow the rule of law.

Prosecute those guilty of the enhanced interrogation techniques.

We are party to international treaties that make this a requirement that we cannot legally ignore. Obama's "Look forward, not back on torture" is purest illegal bullshiat.

Then we either charge the people in Gitmo (and our other political prisons in places like Bagram, Afghanistan) with crimes or we let them go. Just as the rule of law requires.


It would help if people don't freak the fark out when its announced terrorists like Khalid Sheikh Mohammed are going to be tried in New York.

Both sides are bad, so vote Ron Paul

/I'm not even sure if I'm serious
2012-09-05 04:36:10 AM  
1 votes:

alienated: simplicimus: I think the problem is that any information from the prisoners is compromised by Bush's enhanced interrogation techniques. We're stuck with these prisoners.

yer overthinking it. space them .


How about we do something radical, like follow the rule of law.

Prosecute those guilty of the enhanced interrogation techniques.

We are party to international treaties that make this a requirement that we cannot legally ignore. Obama's "Look forward, not back on torture" is purest illegal bullshiat.

Then we either charge the people in Gitmo (and our other political prisons in places like Bagram, Afghanistan) with crimes or we let them go. Just as the rule of law requires.
2012-09-05 04:14:58 AM  
1 votes:

BullBearMS: propasaurus: "Why didn't Obama close Gitmo like he promised?"

Obama never even tried to close Gitmo. He tried to move it onto US soil (where we would continue to hold people forever without even filing charges) as if the whole problem with Gitmo was that it was located in the Caribbean. Damned warm tropical breezes!

In ordering the federal government to acquire an Illinois prison to house terrorism suspects who are currently held at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, President Obama on Tuesday took a major step toward shutting down the military detention facility that its detractors say had become a potent recruitment tool for Al Qaeda.

Administration officials acknowledged that the move would require Congressional approval, since Congress now bars Guantánamo detainees from being brought onto American soil unless they face prosecution, and some of the detainees may be indefinitely confined without being tried.

Holding people forever without even charging them with a crime is the problem. Not that it's happening in Cuba. Moving Gitmo onto US soil does not fix the problem.

Here's what the ACLU had to say:

The following can be attributed to Anthony D. Romero, Executive Director of the ACLU:

"The creation of a 'Gitmo North' in Illinois is hardly a meaningful step forward. Shutting down Guantánamo will be nothing more than a symbolic gesture if we continue its lawless policies onshore.

"Alarmingly, all indications are that the administration plans to continue its predecessor's policy of indefinite detention without charge or trial for some detainees, with only a change of location. Such a policy is completely at odds with our democratic commitment to due process and human rights whether it's occurring in Cuba or in Illinois. In fact, while the Obama administration inherited the Guantánamo debacle, this current move is its own affirmative adoption of those policies. It is unimaginable that the Obama administration is using the same justification as the Bush administration ...


I think the problem is that any information from the prisoners is compromised by Bush's enhanced interrogation techniques. We're stuck with these prisoners.
2012-09-05 04:03:18 AM  
1 votes:

BronyMedic: BullBearMS: All you have to do is admit that we never had any intention whatsoever of taking this guy captive.

And I'm perfectly ok with this. I doubt we'd have taken Hitler alive either.


Yep. Bastard taunted us more than two times. Resistance or execution, I don't care.
2012-09-05 03:26:10 AM  
1 votes:

BronyMedic: alienated: go ahead, armchair special ops types, tell me i am wrong, but please- include your class number so i can prove you are not, nor have even been a real specop

My Grandfather was enlisted Naval Intelligence in Vietnam, and served on the Camp David security staff. (I have his white house medals and service records to prove it. Along with some really interesting gifts from Eisenhower, Kennedy, and Johnson's staff)

He taught me a really valuable lesson that I still hold onto today when dealing with people who claim to have been in the "Special Forces" of any branch: The ones that actually were don't brag about it for the most part. They either don't want you to know, or don't like to talk about it.


Y'know, my grandfather was on a Presidential security detail, too.
Of course, the president was Batista, but still...
2012-09-05 03:01:23 AM  
1 votes:

themindiswatching: They also didn't contaminate most of their evidence by torturing detainees and holding them for years without trial.


Oh, yeesh. Don't get me started.

I saw just yesterday that Attorney General Holder had recently closed the investigations into the people who actually died while being "totally not tortured at all!" by us.

Thursday, Attorney General Eric Holder announced the closing without charges of the only two cases under investigation relating to the US torture program: one that resulted in the 2002 death of an Afghan detainee at a secret CIA prison near Kabul, and the other the 2003 death of an Iraqi citizen while in CIA custody at Abu Ghraib. This decision, says the New York Times Friday, "eliminat[es] the last possibility that any criminal charges will be brought as a result of the brutal interrogations carried out by the CIA".

Surprise, surprise. Nobody will be charged with anything.
2012-09-05 02:59:22 AM  
1 votes:
And thank the hate the country more than the party party folks or gitmo would be shut. that place is still a place of shame, even after all these years.
We could try all of them anywhere in the us. and we should. Are we that weak we cannot handle the trial of what, 500 people ? I think we have murder trials by that count a year in some cites here .at least in a state.
2012-09-05 02:51:04 AM  
1 votes:

alienated: BullBearMS: All you have to do is admit that we never had any intention whatsoever of taking this guy captive.

well, duh. What could we have done ? I mean, besides making a stain on the walls out of him. Could we, even as a nation ruled by law, had a trial ? I am not being facetious here.I see no other solution except his summary execution. armed or not is immaterial at this point. Laden was a cancer and needed to be excised . By any and all means at our disposal. Cold ? yep. I would have done the same to McViegh, given the chance.


I'm of two minds on this one.

Obviously, the most convenient outcome for us was that he be killed instead of captured.

However, England, Spain, and India somehow managed to give public trials in a court of law to the people behind their recent terrorist attacks. I'm pretty sure if they can manage it, we can too. We're supposed to be all about the rule of law here in America.
2012-09-05 02:31:09 AM  
1 votes:

alienated: Cubansaltyballs: This guy wants his millions, and the DoD will likely take his money, but I sense he was also angling for a Fox News job or a role on the Republican speaking circuit.

Ha. Indeed. I can see it now- Coming to you, live from Fort Leavenworth ....


Pointing out that the people up top have been lying to the public about how things went down right before an election has a tendency to piss those at the top off.

However, they changed the official story of what happened so frequently and so fast that it was already pretty obvious that they were obfuscating the truth.

All you have to do is admit that we never had any intention whatsoever of taking this guy captive.
2012-09-05 02:24:27 AM  
1 votes:

Cubansaltyballs: This guy wants his millions, and the DoD will likely take his money, but I sense he was also angling for a Fox News job or a role on the Republican speaking circuit.


Ha. Indeed. I can see it now- Coming to you, live from Fort Leavenworth ....
2012-09-05 02:07:49 AM  
1 votes:
There is a reason I have you faved Brony. Your Opa taught you well.
2012-09-05 01:30:23 AM  
1 votes:
Mark Owen is just a pseudonym for Barack Obama. Follow me here.

Look at it: MARK OWEN - BARACK OBAMA

Take out the BAC, garbage letters (or bank of america, which funded Obama in 2008) and you get ARK.

Take out BAA (Banro corporation, which is an outfit out of the Congo - Africa! Kenya! Obama!) and you have MO. MARK O.

Obama is not only trying to claim he personally killed Osama Bin Laden, but he's also letting out important national security matters. This must end!
2012-09-05 12:21:35 AM  
1 votes:
Makes sense to me.
 
Displayed 66 of 66 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter





In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report