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(Gizmag)   From the man who brought you the flamethrower glove, the wrist mounted crossbow and the rotary saw blade crossbow, I present the homemade Gauss Rifle   (gizmag.com) divider line 127
    More: Cool, electromagnetic pulses, saw, milliwatts, gloves, coils, Patrick Priebe, gamers, capacitors  
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24329 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Sep 2012 at 4:34 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-04 07:41:29 PM  

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Heinrich von Eckardt: Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Also, cool as it is, it's only about as powerful as a BB gun. Actually with the right pellets, my Crosman Phantom air rifle has about twice as much muzzle energy. Sadly it's not semi-auto, though.

Umm... No.

Your Crosman Phantom is a "1000 fps" .177 cal springer. Even a heavy 10 grain pellet at 1000 fps is only 22 fpe (30 joules) at the muzzle.

This thing claims 500 joules (370 fpe). That's getting into .357 magnum territory.

If you run the numbers, 4 18650 batteries (3.7V x 3000mAh) have enough energy to produce more than fifty 500 joule shots.

He's claiming 500 joules into the capacitor. That's not the same thing as 500 joules at the muzzle. The article says he's getting 100 m/s out of it. A little back-of-the-envelope math puts his 5.7x16mm slugs at about 49 grains, or 3.1 grams.

3.1 grams at 100 m/s is 15.87 joules. Roughly half what the Phantom produces at the muzzle ;)

That's an energy efficiency of just about 3%.


After watching the whole video, I have to agree. That's nothing close to 500 joules at the muzzle. I believe a 1000 fps .177 cal gun might just be twice as powerful.

I saw 500 joules total energy and assumed that was per shot.

My bad.
 
2012-09-04 08:00:02 PM  
Wow..the new Glock with a 15rd clip. Sweet.
 
2012-09-04 08:03:57 PM  

sloppyjoes7: Fortunately, he has no plans on developing it commercially, or on telling other people how to make one of their own.

What? Why is that "fortunate?"


A weapon of this magnitude shouldn't be freely available to anyone that would wish to wield it!
 
2012-09-04 08:09:13 PM  

Heinrich von Eckardt: I saw 500 joules total energy and assumed that was per shot.


Yeah, if it was possible to make a 7lb Gauss rifle with the power of a .357 in your garage, I'd be building one right this minute.

The real problem with coilguns is the energy efficiency. Based on what I've read, the upper limit for efficiency for a basic coilgun with a small number of stages is somewhere in the 3-5% range. Contrast that with 30-40% for today's firearms.

To raise the efficiency to something approaching a practical weapon, you need to start adding lots of coil stages and very fast switching mechanisms with precise timing, in addition to some really big capacitors, high quality magnets, and a power source to match. All of which drastically raise the price of the weapon. I think for the hobbyist market, the best you're going to be able to do is a 20lb rig that's about as powerful as a .22LR.
 
2012-09-04 08:20:33 PM  

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Heinrich von Eckardt: I saw 500 joules total energy and assumed that was per shot.

Yeah, if it was possible to make a 7lb Gauss rifle with the power of a .357 in your garage, I'd be building one right this minute.

The real problem with coilguns is the energy efficiency. Based on what I've read, the upper limit for efficiency for a basic coilgun with a small number of stages is somewhere in the 3-5% range. Contrast that with 30-40% for today's firearms.

To raise the efficiency to something approaching a practical weapon, you need to start adding lots of coil stages and very fast switching mechanisms with precise timing, in addition to some really big capacitors, high quality magnets, and a power source to match. All of which drastically raise the price of the weapon. I think for the hobbyist market, the best you're going to be able to do is a 20lb rig that's about as powerful as a .22LR.


honestly, the biggest drawback to the coil theory is the coils. the pulses start approaching energy levels where inductance rears its ugly head and you start crushing the barrel as the coil deforms. there are ways around this but it's still pretty ugly. carbon fiber's out as it attenuates magnetic fields something fierce(nice to put over the body of the gun tho). even non-magnetic metals will form reactive eddy currents that degrade performance.

the upper limit on coil/gauss guns is really low, sadly.

now, i toyed with plasma conversion once... that was pretty exciting. dump enough energy into 1 gram copper pellet with magnetic induction and it turns into very energetic plasma... my wife never lets me forget taking the roof off the shed with the mark 1.

if you could get the plasma to stay roughly coherent at range, it'd be pretty ugly results on impact, with almost no recoil for the shooter.

granted the gun would be huge because the powerlevels are in the megajoule range...
 
2012-09-04 08:36:35 PM  

buttery_shame_cave: now, i toyed with plasma conversion once... that was pretty exciting. dump enough energy into 1 gram copper pellet with magnetic induction and it turns into very energetic plasma... my wife never lets me forget taking the roof off the shed with the mark 1.

if you could get the plasma to stay roughly coherent at range, it'd be pretty ugly results on impact, with almost no recoil for the shooter.

granted the gun would be huge because the powerlevels are in the megajoule range...


Cool. Since it was a copper pellet, did it make big green fireballs?
 
2012-09-04 08:43:14 PM  

sendtodave: sloppyjoes7: Fortunately, he has no plans on developing it commercially, or on telling other people how to make one of their own.

What? Why is that "fortunate?"

A weapon of this magnitude shouldn't be freely available to anyone that would wish to wield it!


God forbid they wander into a bass pro and buy an equally powerful slingshot...
 
2012-09-04 09:01:21 PM  

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: buttery_shame_cave: now, i toyed with plasma conversion once... that was pretty exciting. dump enough energy into 1 gram copper pellet with magnetic induction and it turns into very energetic plasma... my wife never lets me forget taking the roof off the shed with the mark 1.

if you could get the plasma to stay roughly coherent at range, it'd be pretty ugly results on impact, with almost no recoil for the shooter.

granted the gun would be huge because the powerlevels are in the megajoule range...

Cool. Since it was a copper pellet, did it make big green fireballs?


more like green bolt of lightning and lots of sound and splinters raining down from the approximate 5-6' hole it made in the plywood of the roof. near as i can tell i had some focusing going on from the ring coil that was doing the energy transfer, and inductance in the baseplate squirted it up into the roof rather than letting it vaporize the workbench.

i'm just glad i was standing at the other end of the shop when it fired... from 10 feet away the heat was like standing in front of a blast furnace for a brief instant. had a bit of sunburn on the small patches of skin not covered by my welding gear.

if i could figure out how to efficiently direct and focus it, and keep it focused over distance, it'd be hellacious stuff at range with freakishly high velocity. not light-speed but damn higher than a bullet.

but that's a sidelined project. the current planning is for a LED array laser built out of scrapped optical drives. the fun part is it scales nicely if i can keep the optics properly cooled.
 
2012-09-04 09:27:31 PM  
I would have never survived Quarry Junction without my gauss rifle.
 
2012-09-04 09:31:58 PM  

Ed Finnerty: I would have never survived Quarry Junction without my gauss rifle.



hunting rifle, AP ammo, all upgrades, fitted boon with the same gear. a couple of the bigger ones got close enough to justify switching to the LMG with AP rounds.

hard mode, really. the AMR does a hell of a lot better from way further off. gauss rifle's okay but the faster second-shot of the 50cal really does it for me.
 
2012-09-04 10:03:12 PM  

Kahabut: Now, the military has come up with something even better. They used a linear accelerator (it's a ring) to bring .50cal ball bearings up to a very high velocity inside the ring. Then, when you hit the trigger, it releases 3-5 ball bearings down the barrel. The impact energy is 10x higher than a Barret 50 cal rifle at the same range. They are currently using these as Humvee mounted weapons in Iraq... or at least they were using a few as a test, I'm not certain how that testing went.


Don't you mean 30 weight ball bearings?
29.media.tumblr.com
 
2012-09-04 10:57:45 PM  

grinnel: Kahabut: Now, the military has come up with something even better. They used a linear accelerator (it's a ring) to bring .50cal ball bearings up to a very high velocity inside the ring. Then, when you hit the trigger, it releases 3-5 ball bearings down the barrel. The impact energy is 10x higher than a Barret 50 cal rifle at the same range. They are currently using these as Humvee mounted weapons in Iraq... or at least they were using a few as a test, I'm not certain how that testing went.

Don't you mean 30 weight ball bearings?
[29.media.tumblr.com image 500x281]


"it's all ball bearings, these days."
 
2012-09-04 11:06:17 PM  
Considering NJ laws call a BB gun a "firearm", you'd have fun trying to register it here.

Now, google "9mm pcp"
 
2012-09-04 11:45:33 PM  

Ed Grubermann: Two minutes of jerking off before he gets to actually firing that thing. BREVITY! BREVITY! BREVITY!


FFB
 
2012-09-05 12:06:02 AM  

albuquerquehalsey: toraque: Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: cretinbob: That's not a gauss gun, that's a rail gun.

TFA says it's a multi-stage coilgun.

Also, cool as it is, it's only about as powerful as a BB gun. Actually with the right pellets, my Crosman Phantom air rifle has about twice as much muzzle energy. Sadly it's not semi-auto, though.

From the video, it's actually pretty small, about pistol sized. I don't know the engineering enough to judge whether or not you could expand that design from four stages to N, but I'm thinking a rifle length set of coils with the batteries and capacitors in a backpack might put it past the air rifle stage.

And then it would still be inferior, in every possible way, to this: 

[www.allmilitaria.com image 631x386]


I dunno, it was pretty damn quiet
 
2012-09-05 12:22:56 AM  
Why isn't this guys working for DARPA?
 
2012-09-05 12:39:33 AM  

Publikwerks: albuquerquehalsey: toraque: Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: cretinbob: That's not a gauss gun, that's a rail gun.

TFA says it's a multi-stage coilgun.

Also, cool as it is, it's only about as powerful as a BB gun. Actually with the right pellets, my Crosman Phantom air rifle has about twice as much muzzle energy. Sadly it's not semi-auto, though.

From the video, it's actually pretty small, about pistol sized. I don't know the engineering enough to judge whether or not you could expand that design from four stages to N, but I'm thinking a rifle length set of coils with the batteries and capacitors in a backpack might put it past the air rifle stage.

And then it would still be inferior, in every possible way, to this: 

[www.allmilitaria.com image 631x386]

I dunno, it was pretty damn quiet


If you used a heavy, subsonic projectile there might be a niche for Gauss guns as a silent weapon. The velocity wouldn't have to be all that high if you were tossing a 2 oz steel rod at somebody's skull. Maybe 400, 500 feet per second. That'd give you about the same energy as a .45 Colt but with twice the momentum. It would do Bad Things to a human, and being steel, would be more effective against light armor and obstructions.

That is, as long as charging the caps didn't make an incredibly loud high pitched noise. And you were willing to carry around a huge battery pack. To get 600J with 3% efficiency you'd be burning through about 500 mA-hr a shot from a 12V battery.
 
2012-09-05 12:45:30 AM  

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Publikwerks: albuquerquehalsey: toraque: Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: cretinbob: That's not a gauss gun, that's a rail gun.

TFA says it's a multi-stage coilgun.

Also, cool as it is, it's only about as powerful as a BB gun. Actually with the right pellets, my Crosman Phantom air rifle has about twice as much muzzle energy. Sadly it's not semi-auto, though.

From the video, it's actually pretty small, about pistol sized. I don't know the engineering enough to judge whether or not you could expand that design from four stages to N, but I'm thinking a rifle length set of coils with the batteries and capacitors in a backpack might put it past the air rifle stage.

And then it would still be inferior, in every possible way, to this: 

[www.allmilitaria.com image 631x386]

I dunno, it was pretty damn quiet

If you used a heavy, subsonic projectile there might be a niche for Gauss guns as a silent weapon. The velocity wouldn't have to be all that high if you were tossing a 2 oz steel rod at somebody's skull. Maybe 400, 500 feet per second. That'd give you about the same energy as a .45 Colt but with twice the momentum. It would do Bad Things to a human, and being steel, would be more effective against light armor and obstructions.

That is, as long as charging the caps didn't make an incredibly loud high pitched noise. And you were willing to carry around a huge battery pack. To get 600J with 3% efficiency you'd be burning through about 500 mA-hr a shot from a 12V battery.


supercapacitors charge bloody fast and REALLY quiet. the downside is that their oomph is delivered at low voltage. if you could get them up to a few hundred volts you could more easily deliver the amps neccesary to deliver a shot with a fast quiet charge that's got the juice to do some damage. any supercapacitor array that charges to hundreds of volts is going to be impractically large.

/supercaps... low voltage, tons of storage.

trouble is, you need a flyback generator to charge at hundreds of volts. which makes lots of noise.

sure you could make a one-shot gun that's totally silent and disposable, but given that there's chemical based versions of those out there that are far lighter and cheaper...

EM-powered weapons as personal weapons are, right now and for teh forseeable future, the stuff of fantasy and wishful dreaming. we just can't get the energy densities AND discharge times with materials that can hold up to the load to make man-portable, much less practical EM guns.

which is a right shame.
 
2012-09-05 01:06:22 AM  

MrTuffPaws: That is a coil gun. A gauss gun is different. A coil gun uses coils to pull a projectile via magnetism. A gauss gun puts current through the projectile that causes a magnetic field between the two rails that pull the projectile. Guass guns don't have coils.


According to Wikipedia, the term "Gauss Gun" is used to describe a coil gun. Link

Biv: Cosmoboy: nekulor: Where I'm from, we have traditions and decorum. Those traditions dictate we have the decency to use shells in our railguns, thank you very much.

Why would you ever put a shell in your railgun? That shiat can explode. Just use slugs,man,slugs.

Depleted Uranium slugs with white phosphorus tips.

That's how I roll with my railgun


Uhm, usually in scifi, railguns use a form of flechette round. Basically like driving 20-50 nails through most material at Mach 2-10. DU rounds might have less of an effect at those speeds.
 
2012-09-05 01:32:17 AM  
It looks pretty, but I am not impressed with performance.

And it does NOT NOT NOT NOT get those metal slugs going 328fps!

I have an airsoft rifle that shoots at 415fps - it puts little plastic pellets about the same penetration into a melon, and does even MORE damage to aluminum cans at close range.

In fact, part of me thinks that it isn't a coil/rail/gauss gun at all - just an AEG in a custom package.
 
2012-09-05 01:49:36 AM  
That was embarrassing to watch. Might as well have a gerbil on a wheel inside there. And if he wants to biatch about forward weight, that's what bullpup designs are for.

Sure is a pretty toy though.
 
2012-09-05 01:56:51 AM  

HotWingAgenda: That was embarrassing to watch. Might as well have a gerbil on a wheel inside there. And if he wants to biatch about forward weight, that's what bullpup designs are for.

Sure is a pretty toy though.


would make a wicked nerf gun mod.
 
2012-09-05 02:58:55 AM  
Now if only he could find a way to give the projectile enough of a difference in charge to cause an arc between it and the gun.
 
2012-09-05 07:42:25 AM  

Ed Finnerty: I would have never survived Quarry Junction without my gauss rifle.


I used the unique gauss rifle weapon there, taking deathclaw heads off from across the quarry. For the alpha male and the queen, I actually used a modified sniper rifle with AP ammo. Boone had an anti-material rifle but he didn't get to fire it unless one got too close, which happened a couple of times; only took one of those to bring them down too.
 
2012-09-05 04:38:57 PM  

imagonyx123: Mugato: I bet Homeland Security has a file on this guy bigger than Liam Neeson's cock.

I highly doubt that...nothing's bigger than Liam Neeson's cock.


Not even Steven Seagal's ego?
 
2012-09-05 04:50:21 PM  

Bendal: Ed Finnerty: I would have never survived Quarry Junction without my gauss rifle.

I used the unique gauss rifle weapon there, taking deathclaw heads off from across the quarry. For the alpha male and the queen, I actually used a modified sniper rifle with AP ammo. Boone had an anti-material rifle but he didn't get to fire it unless one got too close, which happened a couple of times; only took one of those to bring them down too.


Step 1. Cheat like hell to get the fat man.
Step 2. Walk to entrance.
Step 3. Quarry junction = fireball.
 
2012-09-05 07:21:24 PM  
Once I got the Sniper Rifle (and eventually the unique one... Christine's?) that was pretty much it. Upgrade it and keep the various ammo types on hand, and combined with a focus on the Guns skill and related perks, it's basically the only gun you need for any situation. Blowing the heads off deathclaws from a mile away.

I did climb up to the mountains ringing quarry junction once and threw in nukes with the Fat Man, just for fun.
 
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